# my pigeon is obese



## top_bird (Feb 21, 2003)

My pigeon is extremely obese. He is not healthy and i am afraid that he will get medical complications....i need help from an expert!


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## Pigeons R loved (Dec 20, 2001)

Wow! lol An obease pigeon? Sure it's not a Gaint Homer, Gaint House Pigeon, ect. Someone else will be along with better advice.
Nick Tull


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello and welcome








Nice to see another Canadian member!

Is he a feral, Or Perhaps a runt pigeon? Where did you get him from? He could be eating too much, I notice if my pigeons are thin and they eat corn and fatty seeds they gain weight but not to be over-weight. 
What do you feed him?

Mary


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## top_bird (Feb 21, 2003)

I don't appreciate your lack of respect for my dear pigeon (his name is jem)... he is a normal pigeon and i want to help him lose weight and live a good life.

------------------
Karen


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## top_bird (Feb 21, 2003)

thank u for welcoming me! i feed him the occasional piece of bacon but mostly corn.. i am new at this raising pigeons thing


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## Wild Dove (Apr 9, 2002)

Hi and Welcome!
I think the corn might be part of your problem...it is very high in carbohydrates that is easily converted to sugars.
You might want to vary your pigeon's diet a bit more by adding a variety of seeds...for example: millets, oats, pigeon peas, safflower, buckwheat, etc.
There are some really good pigeon seed mixes that are available at bulk feed stores...they do include corn, but not as much as he is eating right now.
He may pick out all of the corn first, but I would tough it out with him, and not add fresh seed until he has eaten some of the other seeds as well.
Until he loses some weight, I would not add any sunflower seeds, peanuts, or fresh corn to his diet...but fresh or frozen/thawed peas are fine for a treat.
Once he is used to eating a variety of seeds, and is receiving a variety of nutrients, check his weight...if he is still overweight, reduce the amount you put in his dish each day slowly.
How about exercise? Does he have enough room in his cage to flap or hop from perch to perch? If not, does he get some "out time" daily?
Hope this helps you out a bit...I'm sure others will have more suggestions!
Wild Dove


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Karen and Jem and Welcome to pigeons.com!

I see you have already gotten some great advice from Mary and WildDove. Please keep us posted as to how you and Jem are doing.

I don't think Nick meant any disrespect .. there are several breeds of pigeons that are exceptionally large, and Nick named a couple of them. Until you have seen one of these breeds with you own eyes, you really can't imagine how much larger they are than most pigeons.

Again welcome!

Terry Whatley


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good evening Karen & Jem, glad to have you aborad.
Terry do you remember the obese pigeon that I believe it was crackedcorn had? He posted a picture of him? That was the largest 'common' pigeon I had ever seen.

Karen do you have a picture of Jem you could post? Does he get much exercise? Other then being 'obese' does he appear healthy? It may be he is just large pigeon or another possibility, he might have a thyroid condition.
Please keep us posted.
Cindy 



[This message has been edited by AZWhitefeather (edited February 21, 2003).]


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## crackedcorn (Mar 26, 2002)

That picture, and more are here: obese pigeon

I don't see that bird anymore


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## Abby (Feb 21, 2003)

Thats one of the problems, bacon isn't the best for him. I would give him seed and only a little bit of corn. If you have a room or poorch I would have him fly/walk around a bit too. If you can get hime to do that. Need anything else [email protected]


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Thanks so much crackedcorn,
I thought that was one you might have adopted. I still think he is adorable. Sorry to hear he doesn't come around anymore. 
Do you think he might have been attacked as he wasn't fast enough to take flight because of his size. I sure hope not.
The pictures are wonderful, thanks again.
Cindy


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Looked at your bird. First it looks like a hen to me. And it looks healthy. Noticed the cracked corn. I prefure to never feed cracked corn to a pigeon. It can lead to a canker problem some times. A standard piegeon mix and set feeding amounts will keep the wait down. Lack of exersise and over eating makes for a over weight bird. Feed just what the bird can cleanup on in say ten minutes. do this two times a day.


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## top_bird (Feb 21, 2003)

ok i'll cut back on the bacon and the corn... thank u for all your support. it's hard when your pet suffers and it could be your fault. i'm sorry i do not have any pics to post of jem.


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## pigeonpal (Jan 30, 2003)

> Originally posted by top_bird:
> *My pigeon is extremely obese. He is not healthy and i am afraid that he will get medical complications....i need help from an expert!*


Hi top bird,I'm not an expert but have exprienced some pretty plump pigeons on occation.There are many different varieties(breeds)of pigeons.Some as Nick mentioned are in fact Giants by breed. They can be as heavy as 2 lbs. in weight or larger,that's the size of a small to medium chicken.When I was a young boy in grammer school I had a pair of Giant Whites.Wonderful pets.Couldn't fly any farther than their perch and sometimes they had to make several attempts at it,all though it was only a 4 foot journey. I would observe them and if they had to much trouble I would lend them a helping hand. When I would handle thoughs 2 birds I would also think they were fat or over weight also. But upon futher inspection I would notice how perfectly perportioned there bodies were,broad backs,wide under side (keel),big boned and huge wing span.Granted they were packing a few extra pounds but that was to be expected because they couldn't fly much at all. When other birds were out for an evening flight they would hop to the ground and follow me around the yard while I fed and watered the birds in hope that I would drop their favorite grain.They followed much like a puppy would.
If I new how to feed then as I have learned to through the years I would have cut back on all oil seeds such as millet,safflower,sunflower,flax,peanuts and the like. Instead I would have fed them a 50-50 mix of recleaned barley and a low protein mix such as 11 to 13% with whole corn. Your local feed stores should have this. I would only feed Jem about 1 1/2 ounces once a day if he's not flying around the loft or raising young for starters. It's healthier for pigeons to be a little on the hungry side than to over feed them. Jem probably won't take to the barley to well at first therefore if there is any feed left it'll be the barley,and actually telling you that I've had enough, but if the bird is hungry and under fed he will eat the barley letting you know also that you are getting to a point where the amount of feed is now sufficient and we have reached a balance.
Barley is a depurative which cleans the pigeons system of any toxins or digestive track disorders,not to be confused as a cure if there is a medical problem but simply a preventive measure. Maintains health. Also there are 0 oils,fats or cholesterols in barley so Jem should get back that leaner look soon if he is indeed over weight. Feeds with high oil and cabohydrates ar exellent for birds that are feeding young or flying regularly and sometimes that's the only way to keep the weight on them are with these grains. 
Many pigeon people feed their birds
a mixture of small grains such as parakeet mix,extra safflower,hemp seeds and it works great for them and there birds and I certainly don't want for anyone to think I'm suggesting that there feeding wrong because they do. I have seen quite the opposite. Their birds are in perfect health and are happy and so is the fancier. It's in perfect harmony with what they are doing. But when I feed my homers this high protien mix they are wound up tight. The cocks are always fighting and on edge and the hens are laying heavy. By the end of the week it looks like the Easter Bunny walked through my hens loft and that's all year long. Winter or summer on this mixture. So it doesn't work well for me and perhaps you may need to cut back a little also and Jem will love you for it. And it's also important to keep clean grit available.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good morning Pigeonpal,
Very nice post. 
A lot of what you mentioned is happening to here & I believe I will change Frank & Jessie diet a bit. You stated 'year round Easter' at your loft. Well, I think Jesse thinks she IS a rabbit. 
Living in AZ we have a fairly mild climate year round so that probably doesn't help the situation either.
Thanks for the insight regarding the seeds.
Cindy


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

I have a problem with grit and my pigeons, I'm not sure if anyone has the same problem, if so please tell me about it..

I used to leave a little dish of pigeon grit out in alittle dish beside the food and water BUT when I do I notice my pigeon Dotty go nuts over it and eat so much..







(He has vitamins/mineral powder in his water and gets crushed oyster shells)
The next few days Dotty will feel very sick and try to vomit as much out as possible.. I even see the grit rocks in the poop.
So from now on I stop putting grit out, This problem also happened with my previous pet Tooty, (Who sadly passed away in Oct)..and the overload on grit was a factor in his death.

I'm wondering if anyone else has these problems ?

Mary

p.s I've stopped giving grit by the way.

[This message has been edited by maryco (edited February 23, 2003).]


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## Abby (Feb 21, 2003)

Feed him nothing but seed and have him fly and/or walk around a bit. If this dosen't work it may be a tyiroid disease. If you need anything [email protected]


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## Navigator (Jan 2, 2003)

Mary, if the mineral grit is not there at all times, they do tend to overeat it when it is provided unless you control how much you place in the dish. This normally is a sign of something (mineral) missing in the diet. That's why a good mix of seeds is better than say 3 or 4. The problem that most are seeing with your house pets is that you over feed and they eat what tastes good and not what is best for them. The barley is a good example since they don't care for the taste, but it is a good grain in most situations.
Some fanciers like to feed from hoppers and find that only certain seeds are eaten if the hopper is always topped off daily. However, when the amount of exercise increases, they must eat the other seeds from the mix or they can not maintain condition. Over feeding is very easy to do, but can be controlled and should be. The damage to the internal organs shortens the lifespan considerably. At some point the bird will develop persistent watery droppings and if taken to the vet, the diagnosis will be "kidney damage" and it's too late to to correct the damage. 
I am the first to admit that I over eat and it shows, but I allow my birds to get a little bit heavy for short periods of time only during the coldest periods in winter and when feeding youngsters up to 14 days old. Then I cut back so there is no problems when the hens lay their next set of eggs.
Most birds will maintain the proper weight if allowed to fly for 2 or 3 hours each day and when in top condition, they eat the least amount. Caged birds must be the most difficult of all to feed properly and don't mean to sound like I could do a better job than anyone else, but controlling the hand that feeds is the only way to do it. Good luck.
Harry...


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## fred2344 (Jan 9, 2002)

top_bird
Where are you? You're getting terrific advice about your pigeon.
Abby may be right. Your bird could have an underactive thryoid and an avian vet could test for it. There is medication available to correct the condition.
Everyone else is also right. The diet needs to be changed a bit and your bird definitely could use more excercising.


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Thank you Harry









Yes, I'm changing their diet right now (Infact I started today!







) 

I put in the pearl barley, wheat, peas, milo and some other seeds.. A tiny bit of corn but not much.

My white homer (Pearl) Likes peas very much and her mouth is big enough for them BUT her husband (Dotty, who is a feral with a smaller mouth) can't eat the peas and only pecks at the milos









I put in 2 tablespoons of seed today and that's all Dotty will get, And I hope that will teach him to eat it all. Also I mixed my seeds with a probiotic powder.

As for the grit I'm not sure but this makes him very sick when I leave them out. I will try picking out the oyster shells for him.
I have a vitamin/mineral powder that goes in their water every day, what could he be lacking?


Also I try to let them exercise as much as possible.. They have my whole room for themselves and are never caged up, Plus they like to walk around the apt when given the chance (At this time I don't allow it because I have 3 free flighted squeakers in the living room and 1 thin squeaker with canker near the front door)

Thanks for the info though







I'm trying my best to keep them as healhty as possible.

Mary


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## pigeonpal (Jan 30, 2003)

Hi Cindy,
Wow, you read all that? When I submitted the reply I couldn't believe how long that was. I appoligize to all of you who don't care for long posts.I just wanted to help out top bird if I could and....well look what happened.
Sorry pigeonpals. Not always that windy.
Kind of going through some withdraws. I have to give up flying pigeons because the clubs in my area are combinding and are getting to far away for me (with my work load) to participate anymore. Very sad indeed for me anyways. Getting rid of the birds & lofts and other paraphinailia, except the awards I've collected.
Anyway, have been visiting you site now for about 1 1/2 years now, never interfering just observing cause my spelling is so terrible. Ha Ha 
Love the pigeons so and enjoy browsing through here when I have time.

Thanks, Steve


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## Navigator (Jan 2, 2003)

Mary, I have read your last post 3 times and still can't put a finger on any one particular thing that stands out that would cause him to over eat the grit.
I am still thinking it is diet related (something missing)but the grains you are using now are a good mix. The amount is just a bit much but not too bad. My race birds get 1 tablespoon per meal (two per day) when they are flying 2 hours per day, just to give you an idea of how little they really need if it is the correct grains.
The one thing I do not see is some greens. They love chickweed and it is really good for them, as is collard greens chopped. The salt block is an excellent idea as it surely would be an indicator to you that there is not enough in the diet and they are seeking a supplement.
How much water is consumed daily (on average) and does it change very much when the grit is eaten ? If the grit has salt (mine does)and too much is eaten at once without more water intake than normal, this could explain why it is coming back up since it would irritate the crop. 
I truly believe he will not gorge on the grit if the missing ingredient is determined. I'd try some greens and eliminate the corn entirely for a couple weeks. Good luck.
Harry...


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good evening Steve,
I'm so sorry to hear about your unfortunate situation. Please do continue to join in on the discussions though. 
Your input is most informative.
I hope some day you will be able to resume flying pigeons. I love watching my feral friends circle my yard a few times then come in for a most graceful landing. I can only imagine how it feels watching your flyers come in from a race.
Hope to see you around often.
Cindy


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good morning top_bird,
How is Jem coming along? 
When you have a minute, we would love to hear how things are going.
Cindy


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

I really appreciate your help, Harry










Ok, I will take all the corn away, So far I got pearl barley, milo, wheat, a tiny bit of millet, white peas, a tiny bit of sunflower (That I couldn't pick out but any way they don't like 'em) .. I got those wheats that are in a hard shell sort of thing.. and some safflower (That I also couldn't pick out)
I'll try to take a trip to the bulk store to pick my own seeds and mix them up








Anything else I should get?

Hmm.. Greens! I'm working on that right now too.
They won't eat broccoli or lettuce when I offer it so now I'm trying something else, I'm growing lentil sprouts and see if they like it, I found a website with instructions on how to make it for birds.
Yes, Veggies could be the thing that is missing, My homer is perfectly alright (Probably because she was in a loft and ate the grains) BUT my feral is SO PICKY! 
He did not touch that new mix yet ..
I see ferals eating greens outside so since he is a feral maybe he needs greens









Thanks you very much..

Mary


p.s My homing hen "Pearl" weighs 450 grams and my feral male "Dotty" weighs 400 grams 



> Originally posted by Navigator:
> *Mary, I have read your last post 3 times and still can't put a finger on any one particular thing that stands out that would cause him to over eat the grit.
> I am still thinking it is diet related (something missing)but the grains you are using now are a good mix. The amount is just a bit much but not too bad. My race birds get 1 tablespoon per meal (two per day) when they are flying 2 hours per day, just to give you an idea of how little they really need if it is the correct grains.
> The one thing I do not see is some greens. They love chickweed and it is really good for them, as is collard greens chopped. The salt block is an excellent idea as it surely would be an indicator to you that there is not enough in the diet and they are seeking a supplement.
> ...


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## Kimmy (Feb 19, 2003)

I just wanted to say that i have a pigeon and he is so cute! He is very dominating and goes coo-rooctoocooo all the time. i was just wondering, we have had him 4 about 7 months and he doesnt even have a mate. when do they usually find partners? and if he does will he bring the female to his roost? this is the hedge that he always sits on and makes that funny sound. He is very protective over this area. so what do you think? 

------------------
KSM


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## pigeonpal (Jan 30, 2003)

Hi Kimmy,
I' not sure if your pigeon is in a loft or flying free. The hedge part through me. But in captivity if the male already has a nest he'll try to persuade the hen to join him, if she has the nest it can be the other way around.
And I have seem that if the male can't coax the hen to his nest then he'll just follow her to wherever she decides to nest even in a corner on the floor. Once they have a round then she'll usually follow him where he want to nest.
They usually start to pair up when the weather starts to warm up and the days are getting longer (spring).
You know Kimmy , this sounds like a real neat new topic to post and you'll probably get a lot more pigeonpals that know more than I on this subject to come back and give advise. That's where you can get alot of expossure. 
People generally look there first when they log on and think, that's what I want too know about or I can probably help them with that problem, it's a great place to get lots of attention.
Look in the upper right hand portion of this page where it says "Post New Topic"
put your questions in there and watch the results. It'll amaze you 
Good luck.
Steve


[This message has been edited by pigeonpal (edited February 26, 2003).]


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Kimmy and welcome to pigeons.com! Steve is right .. start a new topic with your question. It will get lost here in this long thread and we'd love to hear more about your pigeon and try to answer your question(s).

Terry Whatley


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