# Elstonville Sportsman's Association cited for torture.



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

I am ashamed to say, that the Elstonville Sportman's Association has placed the town of Manheim, Pa. on the map. Unfortunately, they did it by demonstrating how inhuman people can sometimes be. Their Officer's and members thought it would be good amusement and sport to tie up some live domesticated turkeys and let people take shots at them with their bows and arrows. 

I would imagine that this sport must be enjoyed after large quantities of beer have been consumed ? Do they slap their buddies on the back when a young son or daughter "wings" one of the poor birds on the first shot ? What kind of example or impression do they imagine this has on the young people who were present ? 

I said ashamed, because I have friends and relatives in the area. I know there are good people in the area, but I guess some good people felt it was easier to look the other way, while grown men amused themselves with senseless torture. I guess we shouldn't be surprised, since the pigeon shoots brought too much heat, they must have figured that a turkey tied to a hay bale, was fair game ? 

Fortunately, this will be the last year they will enjoy this amusement, as someone called in the police to break up this blood feast. They will get a fine, but I suppose they will make that up at their next bunny stump and supper.

Hey they do have a web site : http://www.elstonville.com/ and even a phone number, (717) 665-6354.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> I am ashamed to say, that the Elstonville Sportman's Association has placed the town of Manheim, Pa. on the map. Unfortunately, they did it by demonstrating how inhuman people can sometimes be. Their Officer's and members thought it would be good amusement and sport to tie up some live domesticated turkeys and let people take shots at them with their bows and arrows.
> 
> I would imagine that this sport must be enjoyed after large quantities of beer have been consumed ? Do they slap their buddies on the back when a young son or daughter "wings" one of the poor birds on the first shot ? What kind of example or impression do they imagine this has on the young people who were present ?
> 
> ...


There sure are some sick SOB's in this world. I'll be sending them a note telling them how disgusting they are, but I doubt they give a rat's a** one way or the other. Personally, $4000 isn't near enough money.........think they should be lined up and let us take pot shots at them with a bow and arrow. Never used one, but I could learn real quick........


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Law Enforcement :..most gutless act of cruelty I've seen.*

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/200701..._sportsmen_s_club_arrested_for_animal_cruelty

The above link takes the reader to another article. Here a revealing quote from the article, by law enforcement. 

Officer Mohler stated: "This case is about preventing wanton and unnecessary cruelty and upholding a basic humane ethic. This matter involves certain individuals seeking amusement from the senseless torture of animals. It was unnecessary, unsportsmanlike, and perhaps the most gutless act of cruelty I've seen."


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Elstonville Sportman's Association*

This is after all a pigeon site, but these "Sportsmen" clubs have been known for their past animal cruelty citations. Here as the story unfolds : 

http://www.abc27.com/news/stories/0107/391611.html

Local TV 27 reports the torture of animals story. Calls to the club locally, apparently get a response of... "We don't have to talk to you "

Apparently they remain defiant, that it is their right to shoot live animals tied by their feet, while people take practice shots with arrows.

I personally have called and left emails, but no public explaination or apology appears to be forthcoming. They are a tax free association, and are able to maintain their tax free status by giving small amounts to a large number of local charities. Apparently they are confident that this good will, is going to shield them from any real public outcry, and unfortnately, they may be correct. It is a favorite of many locals as a watering hole of sorts. Their non-taxable status allows them to undercut the local competition I suppose. 

At any rate, the relatively small fine, is simply a cost of doing business.  Just no sense of any wrong doing, no shame, no regret.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> They are a tax free association, and are able to maintain their tax free status by giving small amounts to a large number of local charities. Apparently they are confident that this good will, is going to shield them from any real public outcry, and unfortnately, they may be correct. It is a favorite of many locals as a watering hole of sorts. Their non-taxable status allows them to undercut the local competition I suppose.



*Manheim Borough Police Department* ...I see the police department on their list of charities........while I'm sure, or at least hope, the man who you quoted meant what he said, I bet the next time this club hands them a check, they don't turn it down.......
I posted a message on the "sound off" board........for all the good it will do. There's only about 4 or 5 posts.....there should be a hundred. That's what wrong with our society........just turn your head and don't look. It's not your concern.......... attitude.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Elstonville Sportman's Association*

The subject matter, according to my local sources, is being taken up by various sportsmen clubs in the area. Many are flooding the local Internet news sources with comments designed to seperate themselves as the real "sportsmen" and away from the members caught by undercover police. 

Behind closed doors, the members are more upset over the members getting caught, then the actual dirty deeds. After all, many of these same sportsmen kill wild turkeys as part of the sport, and don't really understand what the big deal is all about. 

http://local.lancasteronline.com/4/29722

Notice comments from local sportsmen defending sportsmenship and trying to sound like reasonable people. I don't hear too many demanding some real hard jail time.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Lovebirds said:


> *There sure are some sick SOB's in this world.* I'll be sending them a note telling them how disgusting they are, but I doubt they give a rat's a** one way or the other. Personally, $4000 isn't near enough money.........
> 
> *think they should be lined up and let us take pot shots at them with a bow and arrow. Never used one, but I could learn real quick*........


It's a sad state of affairs this old world is coming to, that's for sure.  

That could be an advantage for you, Renee  & a disadvantage for the one who is facing the arrow.  

Cindy


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## pigeonmama (Jan 9, 2005)

Why do they call hunting "sporting" when the poor critter getting shot at can't shoot back? Now, that, to me would be sporting. Can't you see those turkeys(who have extermely keen eyesight) just a-shooting back.
Daryl


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

*Shooting tied turkeys with arrows*

To influence public opinion on matters of this sort, I think it may be helpful to emphasize the cowardice of the individuals involved. 

Something as vague as "morals" and "ethics" is easier to avoid, to wiggle away from, since some of the "sportsmen" demonstrate an ignorance of these concepts. 

Accusing and usbsequently branding the members of a certain "sportsmen's club" as being *cowards* is much more specific.

To demonstrate lack of cowardice, a member should show that he can take what he dishes out. In other words, be at the other end of the archery field. With the same persons ("sportsmen") shooting the arrows at the designated (volunteer) target.

Failure to publicly do so, with videos available to the general public, is proof of the allegation of cowardice.

Forget the petty fines and the measly self-serving donations to charities. 

I have the good sense to not want to be shot at with arrows, and do not have to prove a lack of cowardice, because I know the results of such actions. I am unwilling to shoot at turkes or birds with arrows, for "fun," or otherwise. I am willing to take what I dish out, and therefore set my borders and boundaries, and limit my actions, accordingly. 

Larry


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

To put it bluntly - they suck!


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

I have always felt that the best "punishment" would be for the "criminal" to suffer what their "victum" suffers.

Can't think of a better payback...IF the "criminal" doesn't die from his "wounds" and changes his ways, so much the better.

Mmmmm, sounds familiar...something about "do unto others....."


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Little response from arrests -*

ABC Channel 27, posted my comments on their web site. When I last looked, they had a whole 6 comments....WOW !! With only 6 responses, the members of this sportsmen's club, are most likely correct. It's not going to be any Big Deal....now if they would have gotten hundreds of irate posts, letters to the local newspaper editor, etc. Maybe, just maybe, these poor souls would have seen the errors of their way. Now, it looks like only a handful of people have any clue.

http://www.abc27.com/news/allposts.hrb?s=391611


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

It looks like you need to create an account in order to post a comment. I'm awaiting my e-mail verification, so I can post.

Terry


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Well, Warren, I've tried for hours now .. I did register .. did get my validation, and I still can't post about this .. here's my thoughts for you and others .. I must say when the crows became controversial, it became difficult to post also .. If anybody else can post, please let me know. I've done all that seemed to be required and still cannot reply to this article.

Terry
--------------------------------------
Well, Lancaster PA, you have yet again done yourself very NOT proud. First you poison crows and now you allow this travesty of "sportsmanship" .. what a joke.

For you grownups who thought this turkey shoot was a good idea, you must be mentally challenged and certainly ethically and humanely so. For you to allow your young people to participate in this very cruel "contest", you must all be certifiable.

Certainly I do not address my disgust and disdain to all the populous of Lancaster PA, but I must say your community is becoming quite well known for the truly barbaric things that are allowed. 

This "sportsman's" club should be ashamed and the community should be ashamed for them and should be taking criminal action against them.

Terry Whatley
Lake Forest CA

PS: Your "little" crow incident went international and ALL of you should be really ashamed of what happened there .. I suspect the "turkey shoot" will go international too. You all will be real hard pressed to represent yourselves as a "decent" community.


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

*Registered account holder can't post on ABC27*

I also tried for more than half an hour. Registered, received registration click-to-confirm email, clicked, went to story response page, typed my response 3 times, the last two shorter than the first, tried posting, failed, got the "not a registerd user?" run-around.

Posts on a story that no longer show up on the home-page story listings may not get read by many.

As Winnie-the-Pooh says, "Oh, bother."

Larry


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Mmmm, something is beginning to "smell" in that corner of PA, USA!!


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

*Attempted posting as a registered user still fails repeatedly*

Still cannot post on ABC27.

Went to stories of the past week, re-located story. Tried several times to post. 

Again, "No record of person as registered user" or something to that effect. 

Password from eMail URL works just fine. Just can't leave a comment.

Perhaps some members of that "sporting association" are still confused about all the fuss over the killing of the Amish children in their local schoolhouse.


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## stephie (May 17, 2006)

Maybe it's too late now as it's not on the main page any more, but I think the secret to posting may be to change your default password first, it seems to be a step in the confirmation process. After I logged in the first time I couldn't post, but once I went to http://www2.abc27.com/login.hrb and logged in, it opened a profile page where you can change the password, and it let me post comments after that.

It may be worth trying still, since the home page has a section called "Today's Most Requested Stories." If they get a ton of hits on that article from our members, maybe it could appear on the home page again.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

stephie said:


> Maybe it's too late now as it's not on the main page any more, but I think the secret to posting may be to change your default password first, it seems to be a step in the confirmation process. After I logged in the first time I couldn't post, but once I went to http://www2.abc27.com/login.hrb and logged in, it opened a profile page where you can change the password, and it let me post comments after that.
> 
> It may be worth trying still, since the home page has a section called "Today's Most Requested Stories." If they get a ton of hits on that article from our members, maybe it could appear on the home page again.


 As I recall, I think you are correct concerning the pass word. Try that, in the mean time, I guess I should go back to the Lancaster on line http://local.lancasteronline.com/4/29722 and attempt to post there also, but the locals apparently are filling it up with fan mail aready. 

There are local rumors going around in Manheim that the place might get shut down. It's seems there has been other issues and related incidents to the drinking at the place. I guess when the place opens at 9AM they are already pouring a lot of drinks already. I guess having a few beers and then going to the shooting range, is part of having a good time. But between the disorderly conduct and the drunk drivers, some in the community may have had about enough.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> As I recall, I think you are correct concerning the pass word. Try that, in the mean time, I guess I should go back to the Lancaster on line http://local.lancasteronline.com/4/29722 and attempt to post there also, but the locals apparently are filling it up with fan mail aready.
> 
> There are local rumors going around in Manheim that the place might get shut down. It's seems there has been other issues and related incidents to the drinking at the place. I guess when the place opens at 9AM they are already pouring a lot of drinks already. I guess having a few beers and then going to the shooting range, is part of having a good time. But between the disorderly conduct and the drunk drivers, some in the community may have had about enough.


I've had enough and I don't even live there!!! That's great.
SHUT EM' DOWN!!! That'll show em............


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

Here is what may be close to the last two cents I have on the subject. What is left of my letter to the editor. After they cleaned it up, and made it politically correct, and didn't offend anyone. If you want to know what all I said, then just look at the start of this thread. I did a cut and paste to the editor, and now this is what is left.


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