# New TO pigeon racing



## Ed (Sep 18, 2008)

If I plan on racing pigeons what Union do I need to be a member of?
The IF or the AU
or should I just be a member of both?


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## Matt D. (May 12, 2007)

StoN3d said:


> If I plan on racing pigeons what Union do I need to be a member of?
> The IF or the AU
> or should I just be a member of both?


Both is cool because you get publications, info, and yearbooks from both. If you can only join ONE you need to find out what your local club is and Do that.  If you live in IF territory and you're a member of the AU... Won't be good.  Those IF guys can get vicious.


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## Ed (Sep 18, 2008)

thanx for the reply.I had filled out both apps and wrote checks.
I just wanted to ask before I mailed out the checks 
Ill join both


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Matt D. said:


> Both is cool because you get publications, info, and yearbooks from both. If you can only join ONE you need to find out what your local club is and Do that.  If you live in IF territory and you're a member of the AU... Won't be good.  *Those IF guys can get vicious*.


What are you talking about?  
We used to be members of both. We have clubs in our combine that are members of the AU and some that are IF members.


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## Pegasus (Feb 6, 2007)

Matt D. said:


> If you live in IF territory and you're a member of the AU... Won't be good.  Those IF guys can get vicious.



I didn't know that in other area have this silly regualtions and make a big fuss about the organization initials on the band...

I was told from my local club which I don't have plan to join them for now...The club I was talking about is ONLY allowing the (new) member that has IF or AU bird bands to race their birds one time...In other words if I join that club and have my birds with IF or AU bands, I can only use each of my birds once in any race... Which I don't understand why is it matter if the bands came from IF or AU...Also they said that I have to buy their club band if I want to join every race...The only difference that I see from my band and their bands is the club initials...


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Pegasus said:


> I didn't know that in other area have this silly regualtions and make a big fuss about the organization initials on the band...
> 
> I was told from my local club which I don't have plan to join them for now...The club I was talking about is ONLY allowing the (new) member that has IF or AU bird bands to race their birds one time...In other words if I join that club and have my birds with IF or AU bands, I can only use each of my birds once in any race... Which I don't understand why is it matter if the bands came from IF or AU...Also they said that I have to buy their club band if I want to join every race...The only difference that I see from my band and their bands is the club initials...


That's crazy! I don't think they can do that? Unless there's a special race for certain banded birds............then they can tell you that you can't ship certain banded birds,......... for regular club races every week??? I don't think so.......but I COULD be wrong.


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## Pegasus (Feb 6, 2007)

I do hear a lot of things that this club are doing...I know what Matt D. is talking about when he say they are vicious (in a good way) not biting new members but they discourage me rather than building a good example to compete with them...I'm not going to mention any name now but when I called AU before and they recommended me to the closest pigeon club around me and I made some phone calls to someone if he can help me or spare me 2 hens to build my own flock, I was told that " are you out-of-your freaking mind" then he added "my birds are not free" then slam the phone down, that's when I search for more local clubs and find a good motivator (John Wroblewski)...Since then I never talked to these so called fanciers that's closer to me...Full of NY attitudes...I mean from someone who is starting (2005) and needing their help they shud show me some good examples to expand the pigeon hobby and motivate a lot of people and understand that pigeons are not just street birds but there are some great things that pigeons do...


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## Matt D. (May 12, 2007)

Pegasus said:


> I do hear a lot of things that this club are doing...I know what Matt D. is talking about when he say they are vicious (in a good way) not biting new members but they discourage me rather than building a good example to compete with them...I'm not going to mention any name now but when I called AU before and they recommended me to the closest pigeon club around me and I made some phone calls to someone if he can help me or spare me 2 hens to build my own flock, I was told that " are you out-of-your freaking mind" then he added "my birds are not free" then slam the phone down, that's when I search for more local clubs and find a good motivator (John Wroblewski)...Since then I never talked to these so called fanciers that's closer to me...Full of NY attitudes...I mean from someone who is starting (2005) and needing their help they shud show me some good examples to expand the pigeon hobby and motivate a lot of people and understand that pigeons are not just street birds but there are some great things that pigeons do...


First off, I'd like to just point out, as Renee did, that your local club has NO right to refuse seamless metal banded birds. If you are in the AU, You can register your bands with the AU if not from the AU but from the IF CU OR Mexican Organizations. Once you've paid for them with the AU those birds may be raced the same as AU banded birds. 

Second, On that man that was going to give you those birds. Those are the kinds of people that aren't true pigeon racers, I think anyone that has a good foot hold in the sport maybe they don't have to give away a round of babies off their base pair (i did this year) but at least offer some advice and a good round of youngsters to the person. I know Renee gives away a lot of birds and personally I've given away quite a bit of good squeakers. I've never sold my birds for money, ever. Not implying anyone would pay money for them but. 

Third, When I said that the IF guys were vicious. That was one of my dry jokes. I'll tell you this. The IF has some fantastic flyers and Great pigeonmen (and women  ) and the AU has its share of rotten ones too. (if anyone replies to that don't point out anyone.... like me.  ) It does depend on the person. Its not fair to say, All the good pigeon flyers are in the AU and the horrible ones in the IF. Sometimes I begin to think about the flip side to that actually. The IF is smaller and draws a different crowd which, in my opinion, has led its 'quality' up as the AU (which is what i belong to and Really enjoy being part of) has become much more 'quantity' driven. Since I can remember every year when the year book came out in the first couple pages was a pie chart and a write up on the number of members we gained or lost that year. I'd much rather read about what they had 'done' that year to make the sport better. Numbers don't help. Simply put, Both organizations have their good and bad eggs. No pun intended on that one.  You just need to see what you need to be in to race locally. Stay as far away from the politics of the club house, and keep your nose in the pigeon loft. And it'll all work out.


EDIT: This just happened to be my 1000th post on pt.


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

When you join a club,the club supplies bands with it`s lettering on them etc...If it`s an IF club,that`s what you will get..You can also join the AU,if you wish also...When it comes to AWARDS etc,your loft & birds will be elligible to both unions...Your just starting out,so I wouldn`t worry about awards yet...But it`s OK to be a member of both..Your supporting both,and if need be,you can get support from both unions...I see your from the Bronx...I used to live there also many years ago..I didn`t race birds then..I only had fancy birds..But there is a club called the "Bronx Pigeon Club"..A fine man Joe Musto is one of the club officers...If your going to race pigeons,he can help you out...IHe might be able to put you in contact with someone who has a couple of extra birds..PLEASE NOTE WHAT I SAY NEXT: Alot of guys spend BIG BUCKS on birds..You can`t expect someone to GIVE you birds worth BIG BUCKS for nothing...What you should do is offer what you can afford to pay per bird...This would be more gracious to the men there who might have birds for sale...The most I have ever paid is $550.00 for one bird..And by NEW YORK pigeon racing dollars,that`s not much at all...So don`t condem someone from putting you off an FREE BIRDS....If you send me $50.00,I`ll send you 2 hens from my 2008 young bird race team that have scored well in the Combine results for me...The $50.00 pays for the Box & shipping to New York City......The birds are FREE !!! Alamo


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Alamo said:


> When it comes to AWARDS etc,your loft & birds will be elligible to both unions...Your just starting out,so I wouldn`t worry about awards yet...




Not true. A bird with an AU band can be awarded an IF award, but a bird with an IF band can not be awarded an AU award, unless you PAY to list that bird with the AU. That's ONE of the things I don't agree with as far as the AU is concerned. 
http://www.pigeon.org/racerules.htm
_7.09 A member may fly alien banded birds as young birds without paying a registration fee. However, if a flyer opts to fly alien banded birds (IF, CU or FMC) as old birds, they must be registered as follows. (7/08) (To become effective 2009 Old Birds.)

Birds banded only with AU, I.F., CU, FMC may be entered or released in an AU race and be eligible for AU national awards and diplomas, providing: (11/04) (7/05)

The handler must be an active AU member; 

All non-AU bands recognized by the AU: IF, CU, & FMC, must be registered with the AU office, prior to competition to be eligible for AU awards. (11/04)

I.F., CU, and FMC bands must be registered by the flyer prior to January 15, with the AU National Office. (7/07)

Only those bands registered by the above date, and prior to competition shall be eligible for any AU award. (7/07)

The cost of registration is $1.00 (one dollar-U.S.) for each registered bird. This is a permanent registration for the alien banded bird. (Note: The Initials FMC cited above are the initials used by the Federacion Mexicana De Colombofilia.) (11/04) (7/05) (7/08). (To become effective 2009 Old Birds.)_

So, not only do they want you to pay to get an award for a bird that doesn't have an AU band on it's leg.........I just saw where their bands for 2010 have doubled in price. $.75 each!!  Pretty soon the seamless band are going to cost as much as a chip ring. 
Now, granted, the price for the IF bands and NPA bands for 2010 aren't out yet that I know of........so theirs may go up in price too. This is really getting rediculous. 
As far as "not worrying about awards"........always keep track of what your birds do and apply for any awards that you are eligible for. We got our first award in our 3rd year flying. The bird started getting points for that award as a 2 year old.
I hear people say that they didn't get a 500 mile day bird for years.........I got one the first year I flew OB's. Got 2 to be exact. Not that I've got SUPER DUPER birds, but you just never know what your birds will and can do. ESPECIALLY when you're first starting out and haven't learned about your particular birds yet.


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

*Just a joke*

" are you out-of-your freaking mind" 

(Translation=Of course you are out-of your-freaking mine. Why are you asking me for help when I can't win a damn race!)

"my birds are not free"
(Translation=
My birds are cull so is not free. They are not even worth it.)

You should be glad!


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

Lovebirds,good job with the info on the AU/IF.....I fly in a IF combine,but we also fly with/against a AU combine on the 400 & 500 mile races in old birds..For our combine,the races are really 500 & 600 miles,since we are long enders..There are 7 or 8 combines that fly these "Federation Races"...The overall winner gets a BIG beautifull trophy...But as I understand it,you have to be a AU member to receive the trophy..I was going to join the AU for 2009,just in case I won one of the races...But it looks like accroding to you,it makes no difference..I still would not get the trophy,even if I join the AU..Is this correct ???...Did not fly oB`s in 2008,because I moved my loft..But in 2007,I was 86th & 119th in the 600 miler..with 104 lofts shipping 1208 birds from 4 states...Ohio,Pa,WVa,Md !!!!!!! There were only 14 day birds,allmost all for the short end guys in Ohio...Alamo


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Alamo said:


> Lovebirds,good job with the info on the AU/IF.....I fly in a IF combine,but we also fly with/against a AU combine on the 400 & 500 mile races in old birds..For our combine,the races are really 500 & 600 miles,since we are long enders..There are 7 or 8 combines that fly these "Federation Races"...The overall winner gets a BIG beautifull trophy...But as I understand it,you have to be a AU member to receive the trophy..I was going to join the AU for 2009,just in case I won one of the races...But it looks like accroding to you,it makes no difference..I still would not get the trophy,even if I join the AU..Is this correct ???...Did not fly oB`s in 2008,because I moved my loft..But in 2007,I was 86th & 119th in the 600 miler..with 104 lofts shipping 1208 birds from 4 states...Ohio,Pa,WVa,Md !!!!!!! There were only 14 day birds,allmost all for the short end guys in Ohio...Alamo



Actually, I don't know the answer to your question. I think it depends on who's running the race and what they say about the rules in place. What I posted above just goes for the AU national awards that the AU gives out. Supposedly, AU diplomas aren't supposed to be given out to a bird that has an IF band, if it's not registered. But I know for a fact that it happens all the time. 
I would think that this trophy is purchased by someone local and unless the rules state that only AU banded birds can win it, then you shouldn't have to join the AU just for that reason. And if they won't give the trophy to any bird with anything other than an AU band, then, seems to me, the race would have to an AU sanctioned race. 
We have AU and IF clubs in our combine and it depends on who the race secretary is as to what kind of diplomas are passed out each year. I won't even get started on that one.
Don't know if this helped or confused you. It almost confuses me!!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

RodSD said:


> " are you out-of-your freaking mind"
> 
> (Translation=Of course you are out-of your-freaking mine. Why are you asking me for help when I can't win a damn race!)
> 
> ...


I don't get it.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

spirit wings said:


> I don't get it.


He didn't get his quote quite right, but it came from post # 7


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## fastpitch dad (Nov 21, 2007)

Lets see if I've got this right. This year I flew with a AU club next year I may fly with a IF club. So it seems to me that if I fly with the IF club and get bands from the AU club then I could apply for awards with both the IF and AU. So the birds I flew this year in YB's that have IF bands on them I would have to pay the $1.00 to register them with Au before the old bird season starts. 
And if I join the new club (IF) I will still pay the AU dues.


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

Lovebirds,It is a AU sponsored race...I don`t know if the AU pays for the trophy or not etc...I thought if I joined the AU,that would make it OK for me the get the award...I`m going to check to see if an IF banded bird has won the race...Looking right now for my results that I have...Yes,an IF bird in 2007 won the race...Checking my RPD for the Issue with the results...March 15th,2007 issue has the results...Lee Kohli won the 400 mile race...There is a picture of him holding TWO overall trophy`s on page 8...Lee flys with the Akron-Buckeye combine in Ohio...I beleive it`s an AU combine...On page 13 of the RPD,there is a picture of the winners of the 500..Lee is holding the BIG trophy...The RESULTS I have SHOW Lee Kohli in THIRD PLACE OVERALL in the RACE...The first TWO birds were from two OTHER lofts...The first bird is a IF banded bird,the 2nd bird is a AU banded bird..Well,I guess I answered my question...You must have to be in a club/combine that is an AU club/combine to get the trophy...The band being an AU or IF has nothing to do with it...Boy,that`s not nice !!! All combine winners/section winners as they call it DO get a nice plaque...But the overall trophy is a beauty !!!....Alamo


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Ed, are you sure you want to race?....lol....just kiddin


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## Young Bird (May 2, 2007)

I just pay my dues at the club and that covers AU dues, CSRPO dues, and club dues. They take care of sending it out to the different organizations. I usually pay them the first of the year to get our bands because our club is a no dues no bands club.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Young Bird said:


> I just pay my dues at the club and that covers AU dues, CSRPO dues, and club dues. They take care of sending it out to the different organizations. I usually pay them the first of the year to get our bands because our club is a no dues no bands club.


That's what most clubs do. Individuals don't usually pay their own dues, unless the club is an AU club and you want to join the IF too, or vice versa.


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