# ID my black tumblers (iraqi?)



## Print Tippler

So i got these tumblers from a guy who was from iraq who got these south iraqi tumblers. He told me he paid 1200 for a pair. He told me this before he had any intentions on giving them to me. He goes out of town, had a bird die from lack of water and gave us all his pigeons for free to find homes. He told us to keep the black ones. Talk to his friend today who looked at them and called them Zengy or Zengi tumblers? He said if we were to sell them to do 50 dollars atleast. He didn't believe he paid 1200 for a pair. I met another iraqi acouple days ago who said he paid like 1500 for an iraqi bird. He totally believe them costing 1200. So i dont know. I've heard they are great tumblers and just need some more info on them. Im most likely going to keep them. They are all black with purple florescent necks. One of their offspings has a crest. Ill take more pictures tonight or tomorrow. So iraqi coop/crack zengy tumblers? Heres what i got right now.


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## Pigeonmumbler

When I seen the photos, the first thing that came to my mind is the Broder Tumbler, WOW but $1200.00 bucks...

here is a website that you can look at… The Broder tumbler comes in all colors... 
I hope this helps... Louie

http://broderpurzler.blogspot.com/


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## Print Tippler

Thanks, Yeah, i sure looks like the black ones in that second picture. Don't know to believe the 1200 or not. His friend didn't but he said if we didn't want them he would take them and this guy does not like tumblers... He said if you were to sell them 50 each at the least.


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## Print Tippler

So do you know anything else about these Broders? Couldn't find anything else on them. Are they good tumblers? What are there origins? Iraqi? Do they go by any other names? Just tell me what you know haha because id have been trying to get to the bottom of all this with these birds.


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## Birdman79

These birds are originated in southern iraq(basrah).They're not coop tumblers,even tho they do tumble.The good ones ride the winds and roll sideways.They're not worth $1200(maybe when they were imported over 10 years ago).They go anywhere from $50 to a couple of hundred of dollars a pair.Here's a video from overseas about these birds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjxyBN3q12w&feature=related


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## Pigeonmumbler

Did you go to the link I gave you???... Remember just because they had them in Iraqi, does mean that they are from Iraqi,, they may have been Imported to Iraqi some along time ago,,, maybe thats why they cost so much when he purchased them????

I think Birdman79 knows a whole lot about your Tumblers,,, I thing he hit the nail on the head...!!!... I was just guessing


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## Birdman79

The birds were originated in southern iraq,but were sold to the neighboring countries such as Kuwait,saudia arabia,and such.Some of these birds fetch tens of thousands of dollars in some of those countries(i kidd you not !!!!).

But the quality of that type of bird there cannot be compared to the ones here.As they have more to work with.


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## Print Tippler

Yeah i went to the link you gave me but it wasn't in English... So i looked at all the pictures but that was it. So, Birdman, They are Broder? Is that the only name they go by? The guy did say when you get heavy winds 20-30 mph to watch them cause thats when they preform crazy. These black ones are the only ones i think are pure. He didn't have a good system and a lot of his birds were all mixes. A lot mixed of this black broder. Ill take more pictures and will post them here. I had them out today to see what they would do.

EDIT: i got it translated, thanks


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## Print Tippler

The person i got them from was an Iraqi, who lived over there. Said he got them from South Iraqi. So i don't think the adult pair was bred here in the US. might have been. So is Border the only name? My other Iraqi friend was just over today calling them zengy or something. He said all the others were mixes. He said the guy had pure white ones but mixed them so i have some white ones with some black specs in them.


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## Birdman79

No sir they're not Broder.These birds don't come in that color.

Zengi is an iraqi word for a black pigeon.Iraqis call those birds basrawis since they're originated in basrah(southern iraq).

There's no english name for them per say.Some also call them Lout pigeon(lout is an arabic word for the style of a bird that plays or flies sideways riding the wind).

Here's another link for the website for those lout pigeons,but it's in arabic,and i don't know if google translate will do a good job translating it.It has pics of other colors of the breed.

http://www.mtyrchi.com/


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## Pigeonmumbler

They look like Broder Tumblers,,, But I really dont know if they fly the same???? I think they do, but not sure!!! Plus Broder tumblers come from Croatia


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## Print Tippler

Wait, i don't doubt you but the broder page had these pictures





























So are these in the picture different from what i have? *The guy did say they do fly sideways in the wind, and in strong winds is when they do good*


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## Pigeonmumbler

The broder page has over 30+ photos & info of the birds, you need to get google translator to translate the page...!!!

Who knows maybe they are related in some way????


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## Print Tippler

i googled translated it.


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## Pigeonmumbler

Well “Paki Tipplers” I don’t know if I helped you ID the bird or not???… I think “Birdman79” is correct, But they sure look and fly just like Broder Tumblers …!!!… I wish you luck trying to find more information… Louie


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## Print Tippler

Do either one of you know about them having a crest gene? There offspring has it.


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## Print Tippler

I saw that the crest gene can be in there. We called the guy we got them from today but his wife told us he was in the hospital and were going to be calling back in a week. He said he got these from south iraq, So i don't think they are the american crosses i heard about. Im going to breed them and see how they are. I will post a video in 3 or so months after i have more. Like i said only a mated pair and one offsping. Maybe before that ill just show one of two when i get a windy day and my tipplers are not out. I will not be crossing them. Will just have to inbreed.

EDIT: Good things i kept these birds. He told me i should keep these ones but i went to an Indian friend of mine and showed them all the birds but he didn't think any of the birds were iraqi haha. All the other ones are north iraqi tumblers i believe. I was pretty much just go to give him the birds for acouple high flyers. Then i was going to give all the birds including the basrawis to a member on the forum intill he fell through and couldn't take them.


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## Birdman79

North iraqi tumblers have muffs on their feet,just like turkish tumblers.I do believe those birds in the pics are mixed,but i could be wrong.


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## Print Tippler

Idk, He said he got it from south Iraq and paid 1200 for the pair. I do not think he got them from anyone in America. He only had a mated pair of them and one offspring. All his other pigeons were north Iraqi tumblers. Wouldnt it more than likely be pure if they came straight out of Iraq. The feathers stop at the feet


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## hasseian_313

i see bird go for $100,000 usd in kuwait and up to between 1,000 -$30.000 in iraq but the were based on flight hear in the usa most ppl sell ecpensive iraqi rollers and the birds are on the floor one thing to make sure birds should have light beack coller and pearl eyes i got birds back home but the ones i see hear too much in breeing and most birds dont handle high winds not enogh genetic diversity to get good birds you got to cross lines alot to priduce a constint line its hard work
the can have crests and their are lines know as sorpians know to have muffs in iraq


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## Kurdishtumbler

They look nearly identical to my black mirrored tumblers


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## hasseian_313

wll my famliy in iraq breeds these typs they are called loot the spin like donkes but dont dive or spin that fast the do it side to side in high winds ive heard of birds in kuwait that was sold for over 100k these birds in iraqk can go up to 25k all depends in the style of their prefromence and the spped of the wind if thes birds are pure in the usas i dont see birds worth more than 200 gentics are old style and birds dont preform well as the ones over seas hear is a you tube vedio from my friends over seas come in all colors 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWSN_0d4qRY&feature=related


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## Vova

Beautiful birds, Print Tippler


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## dragoons.izzy

these are basrawi rollers not tumblers. these birds do a semi roll and ride strong winds


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## LUCKYT

Is this the same type? picked these up the other day. I was told they sort of
tumble. they are pearl eyed. they are not oriential rollers. http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/picture.php?albumid=581&pictureid=26083


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## LUCKYT

Bump! any Opinions?


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