# Now I've seen it all!



## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

On my drive to work the other day I saw something I've never seen before! On the exit I take on the NJ TPK there is a large flock that roosts on the street lights. As I approched from a distance I saw the usual sight except for one exceptionally large pigeon in the center of a group on one light. As I got closer I had to slow down and almost cause an accident. The large "pidgie" turned out to be a hawk snuggled in with the flock! That was definately a strange bed fellow. There must have been some agreement like "I won't eat you if you keep me warm." 
Just when ya think you saw it all!


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hmmm....very interesting Pete!!! I wonder if it was a hawk? Are you familiar with the different species?....do you know what kind it was? Some hawks will in fact pay no attention to pigeons, and in return, the pigeons know they are safe as well. I wonder *IF* it could have been a large RUNT pigeon I have one that looks like a hawk in colouration and is much larger than a normal pigeon because it's a different breed.


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

This was a Red Tail and was easily twice the size of his "friends". I have one that visits my area every now and then but is driven off by my flock, they don't take any crap! I guess living so close to NYC their tough city pidgie cousins tought them a thing or two about taking care of business.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

WOW!!! you MUST be kidding...I've heard stories of pigeons "mobbing" birds of prey but all unsubstantiated......Red tails usually don't bother pigeons, it's true though, but roosting side by side!!!! WOW!!!!!!!!!!! LOL. That is SO facinating Pete!!!!


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

If I didn't see it with my own eyes I wouldn't belive it! The local hawk doesn't show itself that often due to the welcome it gets, but the next time this happens I'll get some pics! it's pretty impressive watching about 30+ pigeons on the hawks tail chasing it in circles until it fade into the distance. They're the feathered Rockys of the sky.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

YES!!! you *HAVE* to get pictures of this. This would be worth noting and not just for me but many other aviculturists around the world because this behaviour is rare in pigeons that I know of and seeing is *ALWAYS * believing


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

I'll keep my eye out for the next meeting and will be sure to document it for posterity!


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

That was indeed an amazing sight, Pete. 

I guess the likelihood of a red-tail killing a pigeon must be quite low, then? 

Here in the UK we get only two _buteo_ hawks: what we call the 'Common Buzzard' and, in winter only, the 'Rough-legged Buzzard' which you call the Rough-legged Hawk. These eat mostly rabbits and small rodents, occasionally small birds.

John


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## Lee (Jul 28, 2001)

*Red tails*

Lee here, 
Red tail hawks are not a big danger to pigeons as they normaly feed on 4 legged critters (mice rats rabbits and so on ) my birds often see a red tail and pay no attention to it just last week one flew by and my pigeons didnt even fly up it was just like Hay i see ya but not a problem >>>> I have never seen them close before i mean like roosting together..........


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

That's an amazing thing to see Pete, but unlike your flock and Lee's, mine fly around like crazy if they see any type of hawk and that includes red tails escpecailly when one HUGE one flew down onto my balcony and scared all the pigeons away. He was so big and scary that I was very frightened myself, can't imagine how the pigeons must have felt: (
Anyway, I have seen them catch pigeons in my area... but I guess they do prefer critters as mentioned and would most likely go after a pigeon if they were starving because pigeons are pretty quick in the air.


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## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Pete Jasinski said:


> On my drive to work the other day I saw something I've never seen before! On the exit I take on the NJ TPK there is a large flock that roosts on the street lights. As I approched from a distance I saw the usual sight except for one exceptionally large pigeon in the center of a group on one light. As I got closer I had to slow down and almost cause an accident. The large "pidgie" turned out to be a hawk snuggled in with the flock! That was definately a strange bed fellow. There must have been some agreement like "I won't eat you if you keep me warm."
> Just when ya think you saw it all!


  Now that is what I call an "equal opportunity "moment! Too bad some of us humans can't _just get along_!!!!! Peace to you! ~Victor


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## PapaPigeon (Dec 22, 2004)

*Crazy*

That's crazy!  I saw a hawk today, but not with a flock of pijies!


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## phyll (Mar 15, 2004)

Our resident red tail hawk, Pale Male, does indeed eat pigeons. I do not know if he prefers them to rats (plenty of those in Central Park), but I have seen his picture splashed in the newspaper with a poor dead pigeon. BTW, I do not want him to eat the rats either.

Phyll


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

Looks like our local hawks are pidgie friendly! PHEWWWW


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

*Poor Jay*

It is a shame about the Jay Arty! I watched as a cat pounced into our flock and came out with a sparrow and there was nothing I could do! I know it's the natural order but it's a darn shame!


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## pigeon george (Aug 7, 2003)

*hawk bait*

I have once in a while a red tail will take a swipe at the flock but never really tries kinda like im a hawk you guys are pigeons so ill make a pass at you guys
however as i live next to the bay i have what i think is a marsh hawk that while i think was looking for food flew in the path of my flock at that time was about seventy pigeons and they almost bowled him over as he had to take avasive action not to be hit. to me a hawk is a hawk was amazed the birds payed him no mind


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## KIPPY (Dec 18, 2003)

I wouldnt know a Red Tail Hawk if it smacked me in the head.


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

There are enough of them here that it might happen!  I saw the same flock and hawk today but they were a safe distance apart. The hawk seemed to watching the roadside brush and paying no mind to the resting pidgies.


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

*for kippy*

http://wildlife.wisc.edu/coop/CWD/images/red-tail.jpg

I spotted 2 redtails in my area, one young one who seemed quite small and the other huge one that I mentioned in one of my posts who flew right onto my balcony!

They are pretty birds I think and quite rugged looking.. I have seen a cooper too and they look smaller with a longer tail and rounded wings, very quick birds and excellent at manouvering!!!


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

When I was a kid. The local zoo sold me a red tail hawk and a chicken hawk for a dollar a piece. Offerd a golden eagle for 5 dollars But a 5th grader did not have the 5. I made pets out of both hawks. And would hunt for ther food. The chicken hawk it got away. The red tail was killed by my neighbors. They thought it was a bad sign. when it landed on there fence. They were fullbloods. Native american. So I lost it. But I respect them for there beliefs. Im mixed blood and do not believe in some of the old ways. But I wont stand in the ways.


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## KIPPY (Dec 18, 2003)

Mary
Cool looking bird but doesnt look like the snuggling type.


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

They are not snuggley but they can be affectionate! We had one when I was young, it kept landning in my mothers beehive hair. The bird loverd her and her hair even more, she didn't share the feeling. I didn't know that the hawk was a bad omen in the Native American culture. It could be the eagle that I'm thinking of as a good omen and not the hawk


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Perhaps the pigeons were comfortable close to the hawk because it had fed recently and therefore wasn't in a hunting mode.


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

TerriB said:


> Perhaps the pigeons were comfortable close to the hawk because it had fed recently and therefore wasn't in a hunting mode.


I think they have become so used to each others presence just forget they both exist  They're always at least within 50 yards of eact other, I'm still baffled at their strange co-existence, if the hawk regularly killed them for food I think they would have left the area buy now. Go figure.


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## phantom (Dec 10, 2004)

*red tailed hawks*

Kippy, I have to say this. If one hit you in the head, you would know it!

Red tails are dangerous to pigeons as well as most small birds and mammals. They will kill and eat birds as big as mallards. Normally when a hawk comes around, birds like pigeons will fly in very tight formation to confuse the hawk, and the hawk will leave them alone. Some red tails are so focused on a mouse or something, it can be hard to distract them. I attempted to capture one with a broken leg using a live baited trap and he completely ignored me and the bait. Some red tails will prey on either mammals or birds mostly. Must be a preference or opportunity thing.

Mayco, The red tails you saw were probably male and female. The female can be significantly larger than the male.

Pigeon George, Marsh hawks are kind of built like a hawk and owl cross. They have a facial disc like owls which they use to find small rodents by the sound of them in the grass as they fly low over the field. They do not normally prey on birds.

Attached (I hope) is a picture of a vicious red tailed hawk.


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

phantom said:


> Attached (I hope) is a picture of a vicious red tailed hawk.


What a cutie!!!


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

He is adorable!!!!

Yes, I read that about the red tails, this bird was so large and right ON my balcony. I have never seen such a bird so close but it was quite an experience.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Thank you Phantom and let us all see and learn.

Terry


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

I must say he/she is a lil adorable ball of fluff! I wonder if you could rasie it as a vegitarian  Even at that young age that beak looks like it do serious damage.


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## phantom (Dec 10, 2004)

*Baby hawk*

This is a 3 day old female that was nearly dead when I found her after she hatched and fell from the nest. The beak was not the dangerous part, but those little talons can do some damage when they get big. She was fostered out when she was three weeks old.


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

I hope she thrives and is able to rejoin her family again if possible! I forget those talons are down there because the beak is front and center.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hey Pete, still waiting on those pics of the redtail with the pigeons Get that camera SNAPPIN' Or maybe the pigeons have chased him away for good!


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## Pete Jasinski (Jan 2, 2005)

He hasn't showed up yet! Looks like they might have chased him off, at least for now. The last time this happened the hawk didn't return for two weeks. The camera's always ready to go


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## pigeon george (Aug 7, 2003)

*give me more marsh hawks*

PHANTOM thanks for the marsh info have never got a good look at this ones face have tried to get a photo at times have to give it a couple of tries glad to have learned he dosent feed on birds, but who told the pigeons??


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## phantom (Dec 10, 2004)

Pigeon George,
Seems like many animals can tell the difference between when a predator is hunting and when they are not. It may explain why the red tail was sitting with the pigeons. I can't wait to see the pictures. 

The thing with animals is there is so much we don't understand. How do they know, when we don't? The most recent mystery is how did the animals know that the tsunami was coming and how did they know where to go to escape it?


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## rosey_love (Mar 21, 2004)

Awe that little red tailed hawk is such a little cutie lol.


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## rosey_love (Mar 21, 2004)

Wow ummmm i never though of anyone to be snuggling up to their dinner.....


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