# Loft Lift Project



## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

When I first built my pigeon loft three years ago, it was built as a playhouse for my kids. It is 8' by 10' with a 3' "front porch". As my kids grew older, they rarely used the playhouse, so when I needed a loft it was the logical conversion. I divided it into four sections, with a corridor down the middle. Then, I added aviaries on the front porch. In the ten months since I converted it, it has worked very well as a loft.

The only problem I have had, is with mice. When I built the playhouse, I put in four corner posts, added 2" x 6" sills around the outside of the posts, and then added 2" x 6" floor joists 16" on center. As I was building what was expected to be a temporary building, I rested the sills and floor joists directly on the ground. There was no problem with that when it was a playhouse, but I found that a pigeon loft attracts mice. Since the loft was sitting on the ground, the mice burrowed underneath it and did what mice do best - reproduced. 

Often, I would come into the loft, and surprise one or more mice on the floor of the loft. They were the fattest mice you ever saw in your life...why not? They had a constant supply of grain and water. Sometimes I would see them sitting on the drinker platform sipping away at the birds' water. In the winter, there would usually be a few (or a lot!) huddled under the drinker platforms around the bulbs I used to keep the water from freezing. It was starting to remind me of the old children's story _*The King, The Mice, and The Cheese*_ (http://www.amazon.com/King-Mice-Cheese-Beginner-Books/dp/0394800397).

Knowing that mice can carry nasty stuff into the loft, I decided that I had to do more than set the live traps. Despite trapping and releasing (400 feet away in the woods) an average of a dozen mice a week, the numbers kept increasing. Not wanting to resort to poison, I decided the only solution was to get rid of their hiding place.

Two weekends ago, my wife and I lifted the loft. Remembering that Archimedes' work on levers caused him to remark: "Give me a place to stand, and I will move the Earth," I decided that the best way to lift the loft was with a lever and fulcrum. My daughter, who is in third grade, was very excited about this project, as she had learned about levers being one of the "simple machines" in school. I figured that unlike Archimedes, I had a place to stand...the earth.

I used an eight foot 4"x4" timber as a lever, and a couple short lengths of 4"x4" as a fulcrum. Although I estimate the total weight of the loft at over 2,000 pounds, my puny 164 pounds was sufficient to lift each corner one at a time using the lever and fulcrum. As I lifted each corner, my wife slid a concrete block under the corner to act as a "foundation." It is now 8" off the ground. When we lifted the loft and let the light in, you could see dozens of mice scurrying around in there. Some made a dash across the lawn to the nearest wooded area about 25 feet away. Most of them just continued to scurry around in all their little tunnels under the loft.

I figured that once it got dark, and over the next few nights, the mice would all leave for a more sheltered environment. Well, I was wrong. They didn't get a chance. There is a feral cat (actually, someone's abandoned pet cat...a beautiful, all-white cat with a very small black mark on its chest. ) that has taken up residence in our shed about 100 feet behind the loft. My wife has been feeding it, and is actually planning on taking it to the vet for a checkup and to have it neutered if necessary. Over the past few months, I have frequently seen the cat lying in the shade of the loft watching the birds in the aviaries.

Anyway, we have no more mice under the loft, and we have the fattest stray cat you ever saw. Although I'm pretty sure the cat didn't eat *all *of the mice, I saw it eating at least one. I assume that the rest of the mice, upon witnessing the spectacle of one of their family becoming cat food, took off for points unknown. They may have just left because they were grossed out by watching the cat eat the mouse, the way I was!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

all that work because of a little furry critter..lol.. the cat is a keeper..


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

spirit wings said:


> all that work because of a little furry critter..lol.. the cat is a keeper..


It's a beautiful cat, and has approached my wife and let her pet it a few times. You can tell by looking at it that it is someone's throw-away. Pisses me off that someone would do that.

Today I finished running electricity to the loft and hooking it up. I had to do that, as my wife was getting upset every time she mowed and had to pull up the 100 foot extension cord I have had for the past ten months. 130 feet of trench, fourteen pieces of PVC electrical direct-bury conduit, 140 feet of 12-3 wire, and way too much PVC cement. My hands have a permanent coating of dried PVC cement and dirt.

Tomorrow I will be hooking up water. Since I had a trench open anyway for the electrical, I went to Lowes and bought a roll of irrigation tubing. I laid it in the same trench, and wire-tied it to the conduit. The water is only going to the end of the pool fence about twenty-five feet from the loft. In the winter, I'll still need to carry water down from the house.


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## Wingsonfire (Dec 22, 2009)

ptras said:


> It's a beautiful cat, and has approached my wife and let her pet it a few times. You can tell by looking at it that it is someone's throw-away. Pisses me off that someone would do that.
> 
> Today I finished running electricity to the loft and hooking it up. I had to do that, as my wife was getting upset every time she mowed and had to pull up the 100 foot extension cord I have had for the past ten months. 130 feet of trench, fourteen pieces of PVC electrical direct-bury conduit, 140 feet of 12-3 wire, and way too much PVC cement. My hands have a permanent coating of dried PVC cement and dirt.
> 
> Tomorrow I will be hooking up water. Since I had a trench open anyway for the electrical, I went to Lowes and bought a roll of irrigation tubing. I laid it in the same trench, and wire-tied it to the conduit. The water is only going to the end of the pool fence about twenty-five feet from the loft. In the winter, I'll still need to carry water down from the house.


sounds nice pictures?


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

I would atleast try to have a wide trench, it is actually not a good idea to have electricity and water in the same ditch. Just think if you do need to dig one up, or if something breaks one it will likely break the other at the same time. As bad as I hate to dig ditches it would be safer with two seperate ones.


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## cubanlofts (Sep 3, 2010)

lock ur feed pretty good, and put up extra feed after they eat, and keep thy cat, which will scare the furry ones, LOL


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

newtopidgeons said:


> I would atleast try to have a wide trench, it is actually not a good idea to have electricity and water in the same ditch. Just think if you do need to dig one up, or if something breaks one it will likely break the other at the same time. As bad as I hate to dig ditches it would be safer with two seperate ones.


According to the regulations in the area, I cannot run water and electricity in the same trench. But, according to those regulations, I also must bury the electrical lines two feet below the surface. My electrical lines are not two feet below the surface, and my water isn't in a separate trench. I am not concerned about the safety of the situation. What's to break? The water is (like an irrigation system) for summer use only. I will shut it off and drain the line around November. The wire is in 1" PVC direct-bury conduit, and all joints were securely glued. Even if I had a freak frost that burst the water line, I'm confident that nothing is getting into that conduit. Even if it did, the wire is jacketed with unbroken PVC insulation, and the two ends of the wire are three to four feet higher than the ground level. You would really need to work hard to get water to bare wire. To top it off, I tapped off of the power in the pool shed. There are three circuits running to the pool shed. Two 20 Amp circuits, and one 15 Amp circuit. All three of them have GFCI breakers both at my main panel, and at the sub panel in the pool shed. I tapped into the second 20A circuit for the loft, as the first 20A circuit is dedicated to the pump, and the 15A circuit is dedicated to a massive 12 volt transformer that runs the underwater pool light.


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

cubanlofts said:


> lock ur feed pretty good, and put up extra feed after they eat, and keep thy cat, which will scare the furry ones, LOL


I keep feed in a galvanized steel can. I pick up the feeder after the homers have eaten, but I leave food down all the time in the breeding pens. I think with the hiding space gone, along with the cat, I shouldn't see too many more mice. I actually trapped three more mice in the loft in the days after the lift, but haven't seen any in over a week now.


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## PigeonVilla (Dec 8, 2010)

What ever makes it easier is all I have to say and as long as it works for you too in the long run of things .


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

PigeonVilla said:


> What ever makes it easier is all I have to say and as long as it works for you too in the long run of things .


Easy works for me! 

The deeds all done now anyway, with the exception of putting in the fittings for the water (and two post holes for the posts the faucets will be mounted on).


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## Pip Logan (Oct 6, 2009)

I would like to see you loft pic now that its lifted. You got any pics?


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## swagg (Feb 13, 2011)

I think you will be fine with the way you ran it all. I wouldn't imagine that someone would be randomly digging in your back yard and hit both of them  I'm actually a High voltage lineman for a living and for the most part underground wire is not even run in conduit.


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

swagg said:


> I think you will be fine with the way you ran it all. I wouldn't imagine that someone would be randomly digging in your back yard and hit both of them  I'm actually a High voltage lineman for a living and for the most part underground wire is not even run in conduit.


I realize that, but the wire I had was not UF. I figured better safe than sorry.


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

Well to be honest there will be condensation in your 1'' electrical conduit anyway. And if your running one gfci breaker to another then your are cancelling out the ground fault interuption anyway, if it works at all. I was just making a suggestion, thinking you may not know. Since you know and your fine with it, good. Honestly your setup would work underneath a pond, as long as like you say the taps are above water level, and an accident never happened.
And I have ran probably over a few hundred miles of all types of conduit in my life,, so far. We never glue PVC without duct tapping the joints as well, and some always seem to break in the slab of a big job anyway. Rules and regulations are just to protect the job. I work with a guy that cuts corners, he will just say, "you cant see it from my house". But in this case you can, so only you have to live with it.


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

I would think anything you did would be better than a cord on top the ground, even though i do it for my first loft . My conduit to my new loft is open in my basement so any water leaking into it will run into my basement and i will see it. If you do run something underground you should have marking tape above it about 6" deep so if someone digs they will hit the ribbon first and know what's below. I was a water and sewer line inspector for 25 years and it was required.


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> I would think anything you did would be better than a cord on top the ground, even though i do it for my first loft . My conduit to my new loft is open in my basement so any water leaking into it will run into my basement and i will see it. If you do run something underground you should have marking tape above it about 6" deep so if someone digs they will hit the ribbon first and know what's below. I was a water and sewer line inspector for 25 years and it was required.


No room for marking tape. My conduit is only eight inches down. Of the 130 foot length that is buried, 110 feet of that runs right along the base of the chain link fence that surrounds my pool. As we just had that fence installed two years ago at the cost of $5,000.00, I don't expect to be digging that up any time soon.


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

newtopidgeons said:


> Well to be honest there will be condensation in your 1'' electrical conduit anyway. *And if your running one gfci breaker to another then your are canceling out the ground fault interruption anyway, if it works at all.* I was just making a suggestion, thinking you may not know. Since you know and your fine with it, good. Honestly your setup would work underneath a pond, as long as like you say the taps are above water level, and an accident never happened.
> And I have ran probably over a few hundred miles of all types of conduit in my life,, so far. We never glue PVC without duct tapping the joints as well, and some always seem to break in the slab of a big job anyway. Rules and regulations are just to protect the job. I work with a guy that cuts corners, he will just say, "you cant see it from my house". But in this case you can, so only you have to live with it.


The two GFCI breakers were put in at the time the pool was installed in 1976. I replaced the one in the pool shed about two years ago, because I was concerned about how often it tripped. I don't understand why the two breakers in line with each other would cancel each other out. Mine certainly haven't. In the past ten months, I have had to reset the breaker at least a half-dozen times when it was tripped by rain getting into the extension cord. After the sixth or so time, I wrapped the connection in plastic to keep from having to continually reset it. I have also had the breaker trip a number of times for "legitimate" reasons. These include a submerged water pump seal leaking in my Koi pond, An underwater light shorting out (also in the Koi pond), and a banana daiquiri being spilled into an electrical box (not by me...I swear!)


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