# Rescued Racer - Release or Not?



## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

i found there to be conflicting opinions here & on other forums as to whether or not a rescued "homer" can be safely released - that is to say only 1 or 2 people have replied so i can't really get a reasonable concensus of opinion on what to do.

i have him over 5 weeks - he had a bad neck wound & a serious limp such that he stood mostly on one leg - the wound has healed but he still has a limp but to a much lesser extent than before.

i contacted the owner - he's not interested & give me no help whatsoever when requested.

he is presently housed indoors in a very large guinea pig cage but i'm now concerned about his confinement.

there are 3 possible outcomes if i release him - he either flies home, returns to me or gets lost & starves.

as the owner is not interested i would be worried about him returning home in case he disposes of him.

i don't mind him returning to me but i'm thinking that may not be the case
& the other 2 situations are more lightly.

there are no bird sancturies here in n ireland interested in taking a pigeon.

i know it's a "crystal ball" type situation but any input from you experienced guys would be appreciated.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*Thank you for all you have done for this poor bird, and going the extra mile. This bird is lucky to have found you.

I am so sorry that the responsibility of this bird has fallen on you, and that the owner will not take any responsibility for the bird, nor offer any help. (pigeon fanciers are not all that way) 

If you release him, it is a gamble whether he goes home, and if he does, what would the owner do with this poor bird with limp, since he hasn't even been interested in the welfare of his bird???

If you worry about the confinement, are you able to let the bird out in a safe enclosed room or a patio for an hour or two per day? Of course, he will get restless confined to a small cage, and he does need some time out of cage, but it does not have to be all day. Is there any way you can provide the bird a home, or put the bird up for adoption?

*


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Please put the bird up for adoption rather than releasing him. His previous owner won't want him should he make it home and not be picked off by predators. You did a great service rescuing him. I hope you will keep him a little longer until he can be adopted. Can you post a photo? Where do you live? Thanks.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Please put the bird up for adoption rather than releasing him. His previous owner won't want him should he make it home and not be picked off by predators. You did a great service rescuing him. I hope you will keep him a little longer until he can be adopted. Can you post a photo? Where do you live? Thanks.


thanks - i live in n ireland - the chances of him getting adopted are very remote.

if i don't want to take the chance of releasing him would a 6'x4'x4' cage be enough to do him?

also if i keep him there for say 3 months do you think that would increase the chances of him returning to me if released? - also what about company? - he/she is very aggressive & attempts to attack me at every available opportunity (lol)

will post pic later.

cheers.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Skyeking said:


> *Thank you for all you have done for this poor bird, and going the extra mile. This bird is lucky to have found you.
> 
> I am so sorry that the responsibility of this bird has fallen on you, and that the owner will not take any responsibility for the bird, nor offer any help. (pigeon fanciers are not all that way)
> 
> ...


thanks - no chance of adoption here in n. ireland & i've no suitable space for him to exercise in.
house being refurbished & i have a large w/shop that i use for my 3d printing business but obviously a bird flying about there would not be advisable due to the delicate nature of my equipment.

we rescue huskies (presently 5) & no matter what i won't give up on my new feathered friend.


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## Chuck K (Jan 12, 2013)

closter said:


> thanks - i live in n ireland - the chances of him getting adopted are very remote.
> 
> if i don't want to take the chance of releasing him would a 6'x4'x4' cage be enough to do him?
> 
> ...


A 6X4X4 pen would do fine for a couple of birds. He / she would be happier and more likely to return if it had a mate. The question for you is do you really want a pigeon. You have been very good to the bird so far, but pigeons can get to be a drag. They will curtail your ability to travel, and they are always in need of attention. I'm not trying to discourage you from keeping it. Just be aware that it just like the dogs comes with a price.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Chuck K said:


> ........The question for you is do you really want a pigeon. You have been very good to the bird so far, but pigeons can get to be a drag....... .


to be honest a pigeon is the last thing i need or want - i thought it was just a simple matter of getting him better & then releasing but now the whole thing has become complicated.

if i get a mate for him/her in the hope he would return if released & he doesn't then i would probably be left with his mate to look after lol.

i was told it was female but now i'm not sure - how can you tell?

also are they likely to fight if same sex - that is i wouldn't want them to breed.

huskies i know about, pigeons i don't, so please excuse my glaring ignorance


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## Jr Brown (May 22, 2012)

Why are you so sure no one would adopt him/her? Obviously there are many pigeon fanciers in your part of the world. Many of us on this forum have a loft full of rescued birds. Many of them are retired racing homers. I'm confident that there are people in your area that would adopt the pigeon, you just have to find a way to let pigeon people there know that you have a bird that needs a new home.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Do you have online pigeon clubs, or Craigslist, or? Perhaps someone here may be interested too on the adoption forum.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

again thanks all for your help - i have been asking around & have approached several fanciers but they're not interested.

a poster here told me that guys are afraid to take in strange birds for fear of disease.

also i can't find any actual online clubs here in northern ireland.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Hard to believe that no one would be interested in taking him. I have a rescue loft, and you quarantine any new birds for a month to monitor them and make sure they are healthy. You have done a good job with him/her.

You had said in the beginning that pigeon people wouldn't take the bird, and it was me who explained that they were probably afraid of taking in a sick bird. But you have had him for a while now, and if sick, it should have shown by now, unless just a carrier of something.


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## Chuck K (Jan 12, 2013)

A lot of feed stores have a bulletin board that they let folks post items for sale or trade. See if you can find a store that will allow you to put a message. Free to good home can draw attention.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Hard to believe that no one would be interested in taking him. I have a rescue loft, and you quarantine any new birds for a month to monitor them and make sure they are healthy. You have done a good job with him/her.
> 
> You had said in the beginning that pigeon people wouldn't take the bird, and it was me who explained that they were probably afraid of taking in a sick bird. But you have had him for a while now, and if sick, it should have shown by now, unless just a carrier of something.


hello jay - unfortunately i'm still running around in circles.

i just posted on the adoption part of the forum that my brother is trying to get me a suitable space so that i can 100% confirm she can fly or not.

i was just assuming due to the power in her wings when holding her that she could.

if you have the time perhaps you would be kind enough advise me on the question i've ask on the adoption forum regarding testing her for flight - that is if she just sits there do i gently persuade her?

if she can't fly then my dilemma is over & i'd be happy just build to her a suitable little loft with a mate as stated way back however if she can fly i'll do my absolute utmost to get her properly looked after.

i've asked dozens of pigeon guys but none were interested.

finally, i've been told the bird is female - she's very aggressive so would that possibly imply that she's a male - how can you tell?

cheers


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

No one can tell for definite unless the bird lays an egg. People like to think they can, not really not reliable. Keepers have been surprised to find that they have the opposite than what they are sure they have. 

Just because she can flap strongly doesn't mean she can fly well. And a domestic pigeon will not last outside on its own. She probably is lost and can't go home, but even if she did, her previous owner doesn't want her, which makes him a jerk, so he may even kill her. So you really don't have many options. If a domestic pigeon is out flying alone, without a flock, they are in great danger of being killed by hawks or the like. They are only safe in a flock. I really wish for your sake, that you could find her a home with someone who would want her, but if that isn't possible, then maybe building her an enclosure with a little aviary to live in, with another pigeon for company if possible would best the best thing. You have done a great job with her, and I'm sorry there doesn't seem to be an adopter for her. Maybe eventually someone will want to take her.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Sounds like you are getting attached. That is how we got our first feral, Phoebe, who was severely injured and became our beloved girl for eight wonderful years. Pigeons grow on you! Hope you will decide to keep her. The only definite way to tell the sex is when a female lays an egg although I understand there are also DNA tests a vet can do, or you can put a mirror in with the pigeon and see how he/she reacts. Hope you will keep her because pigeons are just such wonderful pets.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Sounds like you are getting attached. That is how we got our first feral, Phoebe, who was severely injured and became our beloved girl for eight wonderful years. Pigeons grow on you! Hope you will decide to keep her. The only definite way to tell the sex is when a female lays an egg although I understand there are also DNA tests a vet can do, or you can put a mirror in with the pigeon and see how he/she reacts. Hope you will keep her because pigeons are just such wonderful pets.


as the chances of finding him a good home within a flock appear to be very slim i've finally decided to keep him & ok i'm becoming attached 

as i mentioned she's very aggressive so i'm wondering will that tendency pass as she gets used?


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> No one can tell for definite unless the bird lays an egg. People like to think they can, not really not reliable. Keepers have been surprised to find that they have the opposite than what they are sure they have.
> 
> Just because she can flap strongly doesn't mean she can fly well. And a domestic pigeon will not last outside on its own. She probably is lost and can't go home, but even if she did, her previous owner doesn't want her, which makes him a jerk, so he may even kill her. So you really don't have many options. If a domestic pigeon is out flying alone, without a flock, they are in great danger of being killed by hawks or the like. They are only safe in a flock. I really wish for your sake, that you could find her a home with someone who would want her, but if that isn't possible, then maybe building her an enclosure with a little aviary to live in, with another pigeon for company if possible would best the best thing. You have done a great job with her, and I'm sorry there doesn't seem to be an adopter for her. Maybe eventually someone will want to take her.


ok jay as i've said to cwebster i've decided to keep the bird.

i mentioned before about an outdoor housing.- i'm now considering a little 6'x4'x4' wooden shed fully 1/2" meshed at the front & a door to close at night or in bad weather.
inside i'd have a few perches & an elevated box for sleeping.

does all that sound ok?

now regarding a mate can you please advise me on that? - i do feel bad about confining another bird but perhaps i'm just thinking too deeply on that?

cheers


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## JennyM (Sep 21, 2015)

It's so nice of you to rescue this bird and even better that you have decided to keep him!! I also have 2 pigeons that I found injured on the street and to my luck one is a male and the other a female! they have now mated and they are happy together  If you want a mate for yours, maybe try looking in shelters or from rescuers? I'm sure there's an unreleasable pigeon out there looking for a home.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

JennyM said:


> It's so nice of you to rescue this bird and even better that you have decided to keep him!! I also have 2 pigeons that I found injured on the street and to my luck one is a male and the other a female! they have now mated and they are happy together  If you want a mate for yours, maybe try looking in shelters or from rescuers? I'm sure there's an unreleasable pigeon out there looking for a home.


jennym - i've now 7 huskies (3 fostered), 4 orphaned robo hamsters & 2 syrian guinea pigs in the family so what's another couple of pigeons 

unfortunately here in n ireland there are no shelters or rescuers for pigeons & the guys that race them are not interested in injured or poor performing birds.


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## JennyM (Sep 21, 2015)

closter said:


> jennym - i've now 7 huskies (3 fostered), 4 orphaned robo hamsters & 2 syrian guinea pigs in the family so what's another couple of pigeons
> 
> unfortunately here in n ireland there are no shelters or rescuers for pigeons & the guys that race them are not interested in injured or poor performing birds.


I know what you mean, one of my pigeons was also a racer. I found her with a broken wing and when I called the owner to inform him and ask him if he wanted her back he said no because she was too far from him and that I could keep her if I wanted! Of course I didn't want to give her back to him because I know he probably would have killed her because she would never be able to fly again. 

wow you have a big family of rescued animals! I wish I could have as many too, but I live in a tiny apartment and I don't have room for more. You're so nice to help them all


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

closter said:


> ok jay as i've said to cwebster i've decided to keep the bird.
> 
> i mentioned before about an outdoor housing.- i'm now considering a little 6'x4'x4' wooden shed fully 1/2" meshed at the front & a door to close at night or in bad weather.
> inside i'd have a few perches & an elevated box for sleeping.
> ...


That sounds wonderful, except that they should have a small aviary attached so that they can get outside into the sunshine and fresh air. Also is a good place to let them bathe in a container like maybe a clean kitty litter box or something like that. They need sunshine for vitamin D3.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> That sounds wonderful, except that they should have a small aviary attached so that they can get outside into the sunshine and fresh air. Also is a good place to let them bathe in a container like maybe a clean kitty litter box or something like that. They need sunshine for vitamin D3.


thanks again jay but what size of aviary should i build? - as the shed is 6x4x4' should i build the same again for the attached aviary?

also can you advise regarding a mate considering there are no adoption or rescue centres where i live?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Doesn't have to be that large, but the larger you give them, they would appreciate it. 
Any of those pigeon people you asked about taking the bird, often they are looking to get rid of extra birds at one time or another. Sometimes you can get them to give you one.

I would give you one of mine if you were closer.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Am so glad you are keeping the bird! We have a lot of pets too but our pigeons are very special. They are really cute love able creatures and birds are so different from mammals that they are really interesting. A little like small flying dinosaurs!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

cwebster said:


> Am so glad you are keeping the bird! We have a lot of pets too but our pigeons are very special. They are really cute love able creatures and birds are so different from mammals that they are really interesting. *A little like small flying dinosaurs! *


.....................................................


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## jak2002003 (Jan 10, 2012)

That sounds more than a perfect set up. Lucky pigeon!

You can get another pigeon and is will not matter about the gender. In fact you may be better having same sex couple so you will not have to worry about getting overpopulated with baby pigeons in the future.

Once you racer has paired up and is nesting in the shed he or she will probably stay with you and its mate if you let them out... but I would keep them in for at least 4 months. You could clip off the flight feathers from one wing and allow the pigeon to walk around you yard and get used to the surroundings (supervised of course). By the time the feathers re grow it should have accepted your place as its new home. 

You can pair it up with any breed of pigeon. I like Fantails, and if they have young you will get some pretty cross breeds. Also a fantail is a poor flyer and won't try to fly off back to the racing pigeons old home... so your racing pigeon will not want to leave its mate and be more likely to stay with you.

I have rescued and re homes many pigeons, even adult racing pigeons, and I have rarely had one return to they old home. But a lot depends on the temperament of the individual bird.

The other option is to never let if free fly outside. In that size shed (and with a small aviary attached) the bird will be very happy and have plenty of space to live a happy life.

Well done for rescuing it...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Closter, you were asking your questions in another persons thread. We don't want to take over their thread, so I copied it and brought it over here. Hope you don't mind.


closter closter is online now
Young Bird

Join Date: Jul 2016
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay3 View Post
Hi closter. You just put it in the cage and leave it there. A female will either ignore it, or just sit near it, and a male will usually bow to it and show off, or be aggressive toward it. Of course, if the bird is constantly fighting with it, and it is upsetting him, then you would have to remove it.
Where you are planning on getting a mate, then the morror isn't really needed, unless you want to use it to see what the reaction would be to it. You could be surprised.

Often 2 males will fight. Usually 2 females will get along. And of course, one of each should end up pairing up. But any new birds need to be introduced slowly, in 2 different cages, ntil they act as though they want to be together. Then you let them spend time together to see how it goes, but putting one into the others space isn't a great idea, as the one who views it as their territory will resent a new bird coming into what they perceive to be their space. In your case closter, you could build the enclosure/aviary, and wait till you have both birds. Introduce them in 2 different cages, then when you let them into a neutral space to see how it goes, you could put them into the enclosure. That, or give your bird the space, and introduce them by putting a new bird in a cage in that space.

______________________________
jay thanks again but it looks like i've solved one problem but gained another regarding the question of a mate lol.

as the introduction of a mate seems to suggest potential issues regarding compatibility & could render the situation worst than before what is your opinion on the following?

as mentioned i feed the wild birds, - starlings, sparrows, thrushes, black birds, wood pigeons & ring neck doves etc twice every day on the flat 6x4' concrete roof of my coal bunker just outside the kitchen window - there can be 30 or so feeding at one time.

so if i build part of the aviary say an extra 2' of it projecting & resting on top of the feeding table/coal bunker roof so that she could be in close proximity to the feeding birds do you think that might be a better option instead of taking the chance of a bad mate & having 2 unhappy birds?

i'll try the "mirror test" tomorrow anyway & see what happens.

cheers


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Watching other birds a couple of times a day doesn't give your bird companionship. 
If you can find a female, that you are sure of it being a female, it should get along with whatever your bird is.

That would be like a lonely person who needs companionship, sitting down to eat dinner alone, and turning on the t.v. set.


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## jak2002003 (Jan 10, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> Watching other birds a couple of times a day doesn't give your bird companionship.
> If you can find a female, that you are sure of it being a female, it should get along with whatever your bird is.
> 
> That would be like a lonely person who needs companionship, sitting down to eat dinner alone, and turning on the t.v. set.


That's what I do ever evening


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm really sorry. But not quite the same as having someone there is it?


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Watching other birds a couple of times a day doesn't give your bird companionship.
> If you can find a female, that you are sure of it being a female, it should get along with whatever your bird is.
> 
> That would be like a lonely person who needs companionship, sitting down to eat dinner alone, and turning on the t.v. set.


hi jay - sorry about the question in another thread. & thanks for transferring.

it saddens me to look at the bird in it's present solitary confinement & i appreciate what you're saying however at least she has nearly recovered from her injuries.

all my spare time is devoted to my dogs - i have 4 huskies of my own & presently fostering 3 that were saved from the needle - 7 huskies require considerable input in all respects. 

i would love to give her/him a mate but the situation has become complicated by the fact that the sex of bird is unduly difficult to determine.

i don't want a breeding situation but there is a possibility that could happen. - also i don't want 2 birds that will continually fight & need to be kept separate something that frequently happens with dogs.

adoption to a good flock is the perfect answer but i can't find anyone hence i'm stuck between a rock & a hard place trying my best, within my state of ignorance, to cater for the birds welfare.

however with regard to her present condition.
i mentioned she had a severe limp such that she was mostly standing on on leg - i have her some 5 weeks & she's started stand on it now but still walks with a limp - she is able to scratch her head with it but when she scratches with the good leg (while standing on the bad one) she topples - any ideas on that?

cheers.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

i mentioned she had a severe limp such that she was mostly standing on on leg - i have her some 5 weeks & **** she's started stand on it now but still walks with a limp - she is able to scratch her head with it but when she scratches with the good leg (while standing on the bad one) she topples -***** *any ideas on that?
cheers.

*** That is a good sign. Are you still giving the bird calcium/D3?

**** she cannot put full weight on that leg, her muscles in that leg have lost their strength due to less use, and maybe that is why the bird topples. This is SO hard to try to determine, without a vet visit, and an actual ex ray would greatly help and answer your questions. I think I might have asked this before, but does the leg feel and look different from the good leg? Is it swollen does it feel hot? *


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Skyeking said:


> i mentioned she had a severe limp such that she was mostly standing on on leg - i have her some 5 weeks & **** she's started stand on it now but still walks with a limp - she is able to scratch her head with it but when she scratches with the good leg (while standing on the bad one) she topples -***** *any ideas on that?
> cheers.
> 
> *** That is a good sign. Are you still giving the bird calcium/D3?
> ...


thanks for your reply - her leg looks no different from the other - unfortunately my vet won't look at her - says he knows nothing about them - i've emailed a local club again to see if i can get some hands on input but i won't how my breathe on the expectation of a reply.

unfortunately my brother was unable to obtain the safe place to see if she could fly - as a last resort i'm going to try her in the bathroom (in defiance of my wife) however i may hold on that until her leg has improves further.

cheers


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*Are you still giving the bird calcium/D3? I mentioned this back on July 3rd. It is extremely important with mending bones and any type of limp can suggest calcium deficiencies. First thing we give sheep, birds and dogs or other creatures that seem to be limping and it usually does the trick.

Does the leg feel warm?*


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

closter said:


> hi jay - sorry about the question in another thread. & thanks for transferring.
> 
> it saddens me to look at the bird in it's present solitary confinement & i appreciate what you're saying however at least she has nearly recovered from her injuries.
> Yes, you have done a good job with that.
> ...


..................................................................................................


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

jak2002003 said:


> That sounds more than a perfect set up. Lucky pigeon!
> 
> You can get another pigeon and is will not matter about the gender. In fact you may be better having same sex couple so you will not have to worry about getting overpopulated with baby pigeons in the future.
> 
> ...


many thanks for your reply - i would be very happy to get a same sex mate as i definitely don't want to end up with a flock lol.

_if you would kindly read my last post to jay3 you will perhaps appreciate my position._ - i would also be grateful for any comments regarding.

with respect to your comment "The other option is to never let if free fly outside. " - would that be due mainly to fear of predators (ie not being in a flock for protection) as stated by other posters? - you appear to have let your rescue birds fly free but perhaps they were in a flock?

i would have loved for them to fly free however if they're safe & happy in the shed/aviary i'm building then that's great.

i really only want 2 birds however i would be happy taking other rescues.

many thanks for your help.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Skyeking said:


> ** Are you still giving the bird calcium/D3? I told you she would benefit from calcium/d3 because of the limp back on July 3rd
> 
> It is extremely important with muscles/bones mending and any type of limp can suggest calcium deficiencies.
> 
> * Does the leg feel warm?*


* *I would kindly appreciate answers to above questions, thank you.

If you haven't been giving her calcium/D3 then that may be why she is still limping. *


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> ..................................................................................................


hi jay - i hope i didn't give the impression other than in a particular sense i didn't want the bird? - irrespective of the dogs i'm committed to looking after her - if she could have been homed within a flock then i would, for the birds sake, been very happy - i've grown very fond of her even though she pecks the heck out of me 

i apologize for throwing in all the negative numbers but i trying from the help i gratefully receive to give the bird the best chance for a happy life within our pack.
however what concerns me is if i end up with a breeding pair? - my wife says just take the eggs away but to me that would be cruel - perhaps i'm wrong?.

one of my own dogs had all her pups drowned just before i rescued her - that was 3 years ago & she still protects 5 old fluffy toys that she's had since we got her - strange only 5 as there were others about - she washes them & takes them to bed every night lifting them as they do by the back of the neck lol

so could you please advise me on the breeding issue as it appears to be just a matter of pot luck regarding a mate?

btw no real reaction to the mirror.- she just stands about 12" away & doesn't really look at it.

appreciating your invaluable help in the matter.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*If you refuse to answer my questions, that is fine, and I will no longer waste my time on your thread. 

But if you truly care about this bird, please provide her with necessary minerals she so desperately needs. Calcium/D3 is necessary for every living being and is usually in short supply when they are limping (muscles/bones)-if no other reason can be found....*


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Closter, can you answer whether the bird is still getting calcium and vit. D3. That would be important, not only for the mending of bones, but also for the nerves and muscles. Sky has asked a few times, and she is really trying to help you.
When looking at the legs, does one seem more swolen than the other.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Skyeking said:


> *If you refuse to answer my questions, that is fine, and I will no longer waste my time on your thread.
> 
> But if you truly care about this bird, please provide her with necessary minerals she so desperately needs. Calcium/D3 is necessary for every living being and is usually in short supply when they are limping (muscles/bones)-if no other reason can be found....*


Skyeking - i apologize if i appeared rude by not answering you - if you look at my posts it should be plainly obvious that i know absolutely nothing about pigeons - i've even said so myself - so considering that, it would be unlikely to me that a deficiency in calcium/d3 could be the possible cause of the problem. - that's why i asked the question in the first instance however now i have the information that you kindly provided i will proceed accordingly & sincerely thank you for your advice.

also just one point that i'm slightly annoyed about - you said - "But if you truly care about the bird" - if i didn't truly care about the bird i wouldn't be asking so many questions on this forum & elsewhere for the benefit of her welfare.

again if i have offended you i apologize - i can assure you it was unintentional..


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Closter, can you answer whether the bird is still getting calcium and vit. D3. That would be important, not only for the mending of bones, but also for the nerves and muscles. Sky has asked a few times, and she is really trying to help you.
> When looking at the legs, does one seem more swolen than the other.


jay i have replied to sky & offered my apology with regards to my apparent rudeness - i can assure you it was not my intention.

considering the extent of my contact with you & thereby knowing by it the extent of my knowledge i'm surprised that you should think that i would know about a calcium deficiency - i described the birds condition before & no one mentioned calcium until now.

her leg is not swollen or deformed & as i mentioned she can now scratch her head & is standing on it most of the time now - something she couldn't do before.

regarding the calcium i'll look into that tomorrow as all the pet stores are now closed.

this forum has been invaluable to me in my quest to learn more about the bird that is now in my charge & i thank all for their time & advice kindly given - it is not in my nature to offer or intend any offence to anyone.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

closter said:


> jay i have replied to sky & offered my apology with regards to my apparent rudeness - i can assure you it was not my intention.
> 
> *i dconsidering the extent of my contact with you & thereby knowing by it the extent of my knowledge i'm surprised that you should think that i would know about a calcium deficiency -escribed the birds condition before & no one mentioned calcium until now.*
> 
> ...




..............................................


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

closter said:


> hi jay - i hope i didn't give the impression other than in a particular sense i didn't want the bird? - irrespective of the dogs i'm committed to looking after her - if she could have been homed within a flock then i would, for the birds sake, been very happy - i've grown very fond of her even though she pecks the heck out of me
> 
> i apologize for throwing in all the negative numbers but i trying from the help i gratefully receive to give the bird the best chance for a happy life within our pack.
> 
> ...




...........................................................................................


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

jay i stand to be corrected as you have already done regarding sky informing me about the limp & possible connection with calcium - i checked back & simply just missed that part of the post - ive posted so many questions i've sort of lost track in some instances.

cheers & i hope that sky speaks to me again


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You can't just take the eggs, unless you replace them with fake eggs. If you just take the eggs, she will lay right away again, then you will take those, and she will lay again. She will be laying too many eggs, and will deplete her body of her calcium stores. Then she will really have problems. Like getting egg bound, which can kill her. So she does need a calcium and vit. D3 supplement, and most of us have solid plastic fake pigeon eggs that can be bought online at any pigeon supply, or some even look for eggs at craft places and such. So when they lay eggs, you simply trade them with the fake eggs. That way, she won't lay right away again. They should sit on the fake eggs for the 18 days or so that it would normally take to hatch eggs. When they don't hatch, then they will start all over again. Again, why they need the calcium and D3. Yes, it does seem mean. But if you were to allow them to breed, you would have your own flock in no time. I hate pulling eggs, and I always feel bad doing it. I just tell myself that if they are allowed to breed, that I wouldn't have enough room for the ones I already have. When pigeons are over crowded, they are stressed and stress leads to health problems. So I just remind myself that I am doing it for their own good, whether they think so or not. Every now and then we miss one, and end up with an oops baby. We can't let that happen very often or we will not have enough room, which leads to an unhealthy loft.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Am going to be replacing Fionas eggs with fake eggs now. Fake eggs are cheap and easily obtained online.


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## jak2002003 (Jan 10, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> I'm really sorry. But not quite the same as having someone there is it?


 lol. At least I have my pigeons and dogs for company... some people would find them better company that some humans.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

jak2002003 said:


> lol. At least I have my pigeons and dogs for company... some people would find them better company that some humans.


Yes................you do have a good point there.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

closter said:


> jay i stand to be corrected as you have already done regarding sky informing me about the limp & possible connection with calcium
> 
> *Good morning closter! The connection between calcium/D3 and limp is pretty much probable, since everything else was ruled out. I have seen the connection in birds and dogs and other critters. If she is a hen and she is short of calcium/D3 now, she definitely will need the calcium boost when and if she ever lays eggs too. The upsurge of calcium/D3 will really benefit her her whole life, appreciate your time getting it for her. Thank you for the reply.
> *


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Skyeking said:


> closter said:
> 
> 
> > jay i stand to be corrected as you have already done regarding sky informing me about the limp & possible connection with calcium
> ...


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> You can't just take the eggs, unless you replace them with fake eggs. If you just take the eggs, she will lay right away again, then you will take those, and she will lay again. She will be laying too many eggs, and will deplete her body of her calcium stores. Then she will really have problems. Like getting egg bound, which can kill her. So she does need a calcium and vit. D3 supplement, and most of us have solid plastic fake pigeon eggs that can be bought online at any pigeon supply, or some even look for eggs at craft places and such. So when they lay eggs, you simply trade them with the fake eggs. That way, she won't lay right away again. They should sit on the fake eggs for the 18 days or so that it would normally take to hatch eggs. When they don't hatch, then they will start all over again. Again, why they need the calcium and D3. Yes, it does seem mean. But if you were to allow them to breed, you would have your own flock in no time. I hate pulling eggs, and I always feel bad doing it. I just tell myself that if they are allowed to breed, that I wouldn't have enough room for the ones I already have. When pigeons are over crowded, they are stressed and stress leads to health problems. So I just remind myself that I am doing it for their own good, whether they think so or not. Every now and then we miss one, and end up with an oops baby. We can't let that happen very often or we will not have enough room, which leads to an unhealthy loft.


jay i really appreciate all that information.

i've emailed the owner again in the hope he might know the sex & therefore reduce the chances of a breeding pair but i'll not hold my breath on receiving a reply.

however today i found this site for dna testing so i was wondering if you could please give me your opinion?

thanks again for your time & patience.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Hi Closter, I have heard of these tests, and I believe they are accurate. Not sure but I think they cost around $25 .


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

FreidaH pointed out that Animal Genetics which you can Google will do tests for about $25 on egg shells, feathers, or blood. Am considering getting the surprise babies tested. Thank you for considering the birds welfare. I know this was more than you bargained for. Same thing happened to us. We rescued a feral injured pigeon and now they are family.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> FreidaH pointed out that Animal Genetics which you can Google will do tests for about $25 on egg shells, feathers, or blood. Am considering getting the surprise babies tested. Thank you for considering the birds welfare. I know this was more than you bargained for. Same thing happened to us. We rescued a feral injured pigeon and now they are family.


i emailed the place regarding dna testing yesterday evening & got a reply this morning.

it's £13 over here for a feather test - i expected far more so i'm sending off one of the cage feathers today - i'll let you all know the results.

however i'm not sure how to handle the gender issue of its potential mate - i'll approach some of the pigeon guys for a mate once i know the sex of the other & take it from there.

as i said to jay "pecker" (felt i had to name him/her) hasn't reacted much to the mirror - just sits in front of it & sometimes flaps the wings.

also the noise pecker makes is not like a coo/warble type noise that i've normally heard from a pigeon - it's more like the tiny wimper of a dog - just a single low pitch pulse with no variation repeated every second - it has coo'd a few times but generally just makes the other noise - just worried in case it was a sign of distress?

cheers.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Hi Closter, I have heard of these tests, and I believe they are accurate. Not sure but I think they cost around $25 .


hi jay the dna place came back to me again - they say 5 or 6 fresh feathers with skin roots are required (??) - i thought 1 day old cage feathers would have been ok but no.

every time i think the problem is kind of sorted some other issue appears - now it's plucking the birds feathers - i haven't a clue & anyway would be afraid of hurting the little guy.

i was speaking to someone this afternoon & he says his friend could lend me a male bird & if my bird laid eggs then he would exchange the other bird for a female - does that make sense?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, they need the skin cells that come out with the feather when you pull them out. Lots of people will do that. Sure it doesn't feel great, but won't hurt all that much.

Well I understand what he is saying. If they pair up and she lays eggs then you know she is a female. The thing is that pigeons normally pair up for life if given the choice, so you are introducing her to a potential mate, letting them pair up, then separating them. I know racers and breeders do that all the time, but I don't. So it's up to you how you solve it.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Yes, they need the skin cells that come out with the feather when you pull them out. Lots of people will do that. Sure it doesn't feel great, but won't hurt all that much.
> 
> Well I understand what he is saying. If they pair up and she lays eggs then you know she is a female. The thing is that pigeons normally pair up for life if given the choice, so you are introducing her to a potential mate, letting them pair up, then separating them. I know racers and breeders do that all the time, but I don't. So it's up to you how you solve it.


jay - i had a slight suspicion you were going to say that (ie regarding pairing)

either my tail is getting shorter or the circle i'm chasing it around is getting bigger?

will let you know later what has transpired regarding the overall situation.

all the best & many thanks.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

closter, I realize you are in a tough place here. I can't tell you what to do. I know others change mates around like underwear. And I know that often a mate is lost to illness or predator attacks. And usually they will find another mate. I had a female who lost her mate, and she was so upset that she was fighting with everyone. Finally I introduced her to another male, and they did pair up. But she was never the same happy hen again. She was like a different bird. She was never the same with the new mate as she had been with the first one. Just not the same. I always felt bad for her. But then I know there are some that mate up quickly again and don't seem to ever look back. You are doing a lot for this bird, you really are being great and doing the best you can. Do whatever you are comfortable with to determine the gender. That's really up to you.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

hi guys - had pecker outside in his small cage to get some fresh air & sunshine.

he throws his seed everywhere & is such a messy bird lol.

just thought i''d send you all a pic.

(btw jay thanks for your last reply).

will get back to you all when i get him sorted (i hope).

cheers for now.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Thanks for the picture, and yes, they are usually very messy. I hope if it turns out to be a girl, that you will change her name. She's a cutie. Will be looking forward to the results.
What if it turns out to be a male? If you get another male in order to not have eggs that have to be switched out, then lots of times 2 males will not get along. What will you do then? By just getting a female, it should get along with either. Of course, if your bird is a male, then that would mean switching out eggs.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*What a lovely bird and... yes, pigeons are messy eaters. They flick seed everywhere. Thank you for sharing.*


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Love the photo of Pecker.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Skyeking said:


> *What a lovely bird and... yes, pigeons are messy eaters. They flick seed everywhere. Thank you for sharing.*


thanks for your help - i ordered a calcium supplement online - will let you know how she's progressed.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Love the photo of Pecker.


thanks - will keep in touch.


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## JennyM (Sep 21, 2015)

Pecker is a cutie!! thanks for sharing the pic


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

just an update on pecker.

i've be building a little aviary for her - as mentioned she is presently housed indoors in a 4x2x2' guinea pig cage.

i take her outdoors every other day to get some sunlight & fresh air - also to clean the cages.

i place the cage on top of the large 6x5' flat roofed coal bunker where i feed the other birds.

today i lifted the door to refresh the fresh water & she jumped out of the cage & onto the coal bunker roof - i immediately thought - she's gone.

however when i tried to catch her she made several spirited attempts to lift off but could only manage a height of about 6".

she is really very eager to get out of the cage she's been confined to for the past 6 weeks.

should i be worried in one sense, if you know what i mean, at her poor attempts to fly? - any input appreciated.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You need to be more careful in opening the cage when outside. If she could have flown enough to get to a high place where you couldn't have gotten her, but still couldn't fly well enough to be safe, then she would be a goner. No way of knowing how well she will be able to fly. She hasn't used the wings in 6 weeks. That will make them weak. So without being able to practice fly, and exercise the wings inside a safe environment, then there is no way to know what she would be able to do. Without use, they will get weaker in time.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Am glad you are going to build an aviary and keep the bird. That is how we got into pigeons, rescuing a feral, Phoebe, who became the love of our lives. They steal your heart and are wonderful pets.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Am glad you are going to build an aviary and keep the bird. That is how we got into pigeons, rescuing a feral, Phoebe, who became the love of our lives. They steal your heart and are wonderful pets.


do you have other pets?

also could i ask where you keep Phoebe & does she have a mate?

if i asked before i apologize as i am presently awash with info.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

We lost Phoebe sadly last summer after eight years to internal xanthomatosis but we kept her in a large double flight cage in a spare bedroom next to our desktop computer. It nearly destroyed us losing Phoebe as she was the most wonderful pigeon in the world and a member of the family. We now have four pigeons in a shed outdoors, in two large double flight cages, two girls (Tracy and Lucy) and a pair who we THOUGHT were girls (Fiona and Blue) but who are male and female, and two babies which is how we know one is a male. Now we are going to swap out all eggs for fake eggs!  We also have a scrub Jay we are rehabbing in a cage in the shed. We only got into pigeons because poor Phoebe was going to be euthanized so we got her fixed up and adopted her. She had a broken wing and was nearly decapitated by a fan. She was the love of our lives. Pigeons are loving, beautiful creatures who really are easy to care for and love. Yes, we have a whole zoo of pets...cats, guinea pigs, lizards, frogs, fish, and scorpions. All are rescues. Would not take Pecker out as she might take off and become hawk chow which would be really tragic. We only let our birds out inside the house, before, or now in the shed because there is a pair of large red tailed Hawks who live in our trees and many other predators such as red shouldered Hawks, Cooper's hawks, feral cats, raccoons etc. if you put her in an aviary she will be able to get enough exercise. After that would only let her out somewhere inside where she is safe because a lone pigeon is not safe from predators.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> We lost Phoebe sadly last summer after eight years to internal xanthomatosis but we kept her in a large double flight cage in a spare bedroom next to our desktop computer. It nearly destroyed us losing Phoebe as she was the most wonderful pigeon in the world and a member of the family. We now have four pigeons in a shed outdoors, in two large double flight cages, two girls (Tracy and Lucy) and a pair who we THOUGHT were girls (Fiona and Blue) but who are male and female, and two babies which is how we know one is a male. Now we are going to swap out all eggs for fake eggs!  We also have a scrub Jay we are rehabbing in a cage in the shed. We only got into pigeons because poor Phoebe was going to be euthanized so we got her fixed up and adopted her. She had a broken wing and was nearly decapitated by a fan. She was the love of our lives. Pigeons are loving, beautiful creatures who really are easy to care for and love. Yes, we have a whole zoo of pets...cats, guinea pigs, lizards, frogs, fish, and scorpions. All are rescues. Would not take Pecker out as she might take off and become hawk chow which would be really tragic. We only let our birds out inside the house, before, or now in the shed because there is a pair of large red tailed Hawks who live in our trees and many other predators such as red shouldered Hawks, Cooper's hawks, feral cats, raccoons etc. if you put her in an aviary she will be able to get enough exercise. After that would only let her out somewhere inside where she is safe because a lone pigeon is not safe from predators.


very sorry about phoebe - losing a beloved pet is always heartbreaking - before i got married i had 2 dogs that lived to 15 & 17 & when they died i said no more - that was over 30 years ago & i still think about them.

however when i got married my wife & son wanted a dog - we now have 5 huskies including 2 fosters + guinea pigs & hamsters.

with regard to my present attempt to build pecker a facility i will have to modify the construction considerably.

a neighbour in the next bungalow who is not too user friendly on the best of days approached me this morning & objected to the aviary leaning to & protruding above the dividing fence about 10" - that's without the small shed yet added so obviously that would compound the issue further

i'll send you guy's a sketch of what i intend to do so please bare with me if i ask some daft questions.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Sorry to hear your neighbor is giving you trouble about your shed plans. Am looking forward to seeing your shed plans...take your time until you get something that will work out well for you in the long run. We have a psycho neighbor so know how that goes. There is always one in every neighborhood unfortunately. Sorry for your loss of your beloved dogs in the past...am still grieving the loss of various cats we had for nearly 14 years. It is very good if you to take in foster dogs. We sort of volunteer at the local animal shelter every weekend, taking toys and treats to the cats and then also to the dogs at holidays...there are so many great animals needing homes. We're it not for the fosters many would stand no chance at adoption and love. When we had our shed built we just made it the size our local city allowed so nobody could object and got cages online that we put together. Pecker is very lucky to have found you! I think pigeons can tell who to seek out for help.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, people like that are a pain. We had the neighborhood pain right next door. She was awful, but she died, so now things are better that way. We planted a lot of trees and bushes to try to block off her yard. Worked somewhat. Be nice to live out in the woods somewhere.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

here's my revised aviary plan - hope it makes sense.

i need to get pecker sorted asap - there's such a difference when she's outside. 

my main concern is the fact she can't properly fly yet so would i need to build an extra slightly roost box at the bottom of the aviary?

also, would i need perches in the aviary or just keep it clear in case of injury?

cheers

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=40657&stc=1&d=1471219059


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Am not an aviary expert but hopefully people with experience will weigh in soon. If you use perches would use flat ones as pigeons like those much better than parakeet type perches...or use rolled towels. Pecker is such a lucky bird! Can't wait to see how she does in her new home.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The pigeon needs more than a roost box to go into. In the bad weather that is where it spends its time. Also if closed up at night, it still needs windows, (covered in hardware cloth) or something for air. In the cold weather, it will mostly stay in. If it only has a roost box that you need to open up for air and light, then the cold winds will blow in.
A small shed, with a roost box inside for the bird, and an aviary would be great.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

The setup is good in the sense that she will have a place to get out into sunshine, the aviary, and a roost box for protection. Seems like this would be better than the protection she would have in the wild where pigeons often get minimal shelter under an overpass or whatever. Are people saying it would be better if the 4 ft area where the aviary is were more enclosed or the roost box bigger?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm honestly not trying to find fault. But they usually spend more time in the enclosure than the aviary. In cold weather or bad weather, the enclosure is all they have.

Different in the wild, where they are flying free and in search of food for most of the day.
In captivity, the enclosure should be bigger, and if the aviary has to be smaller for that to happen, then that is fine. It will be hard on the bird as it is, because in nature they will roost on the highest perch they can. Instinct tells them to go up high to be safe from predators. Your bird will be on the ground,in its box, I think you said. She won't feel safe near to the ground. So in just a small box, rather than an enclosure, I would think it would be worse for her. If one end of the aviary were closed in like a small loft area, and less of it were the open aviary, it would be so much better.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> The setup is good in the sense that she will have a place to get out into sunshine, the aviary, and a roost box for protection. Seems like this would be better than the protection she would have in the wild where pigeons often get minimal shelter under an overpass or whatever. Are people saying it would be better if the 4 ft area where the aviary is were more enclosed or the roost box bigger?


thanks - i think jay is telling me that - the aviary will be 5x4x4' - i don't mind building an enclosure onto it but don't know what size.

edit 
sorry jay has told me a small shed would be ok.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Would it be possible to put the shed just outside the aviary, cut a hole (window) in the side
of the shed, for them to go in and out of the aviary? A hole or window that you can close up at night, to keep them safe. Or does it need to go inside the aviary?

cwebster, you don't seem to be understanding that it isn't summer all year round. When rainy or cold, which is often the case in Ireland, all the bird would have is the roost box. would you want to live in a small roost box 24/7? Where the bird mainly lives is in the enclosure. Wild birds, that isn't the case. They can go where ever they want. A captive bird is stuck in whatever you give them. That would be like you living in a small closet all day and night.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> I'm honestly not trying to find fault. But they usually spend more time in the enclosure than the aviary. In cold weather or bad weather, the enclosure is all they have.
> 
> Different in the wild, where they are flying free and in search of food for most of the day.
> In captivity, the enclosure should be bigger, and if the aviary has to be smaller for that to happen, then that is fine. It will be hard on the bird as it is, because in nature they will roost on the highest perch they can. Instinct tells them to go up high to be safe from predators. Your bird will be on the ground,in its box, I think you said. She won't feel safe near to the ground. So in just a small box, rather than an enclosure, I would think it would be worse for her. If one end of the aviary were closed in like a small loft area, and less of it were the open aviary, it would be so much better.


i don't mind you finding any faults  - just want to get it right asap & very grateful for everyone's help.

so the 5x3x3' shed with the 5x4x4' aviary attached will do the job with regard to size.

problem is she can't fly very well at the minute (only about 6" or so liftoff) so it's rather an unknown quantity whether she'll be able to fly or not in the future.

if she can't then i assume the above setup will still be needed anyway for her mate - so in other words, i can go ahead with the build?

cheers.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Would it be possible to put the shed just outside the aviary, cut a hole (window) in the side
> of the shed, for them to go in and out of the aviary? A hole or window that you can close up at night, to keep them safe. Or does it need to go inside the aviary?
> 
> cwebster, you don't seem to be understanding that it isn't summer all year round. When rainy or cold, which is often the case in Ireland, all the bird would have is the roost box. would you want to live in a small roost box 24/7? Where the bird mainly lives is in the enclosure. Wild birds, that isn't the case. They can go where ever they want. A captive bird is stuck in whatever you give them. That would be like you living in a small closet all day and night.


i sent you another message just before i received this.

the aviary will be attached outside the shed with door/perch access.

only problem is i'll have to place her roost box & access hole pretty low due to her present flying problem.

i'm thinking about 12" just to see what happens?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

So are you saying you will put an access hole about 12" up on the shed for them to get in and out? And you will put the nest box somewhere in the shed where they can easily get to it.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> So are you saying you will put an access hole about 12" up on the shed for them to get in and out? And you will put the nest box somewhere in the shed where they can easily get to it.


until i find out whether or not she can properly fly i intend to "temporarily" cut the access hole to the aviary & also place the nest box about 12" up from the floor of the shed.

as i mentioned in a previous post she escaped from her cage when i put her outside for some sunshine etc & could only liftoff about 6".

therefore in her present state, placing those mentioned facilities near the floor rather than high up in the shed would mean she would have both access to the nest box & aviary until i see if she can properly fly or not.

if she can fly then i would then raise them higher as you advised because they prefer that.

however if she can't fly what are the options considering she will also be getting a mate?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't matter if you have the access to the aviary low. Whether they fly or not, they will use them. If she ends up being able to fly, the nest box inside the shed can be put up higher. Or just add another one higher up. Also a few perches in the shed for perching.


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> It doesn't matter if you have the access to the aviary low. Whether they fly or not, they will use them. If she ends up being able to fly, the nest box inside the shed can be put up higher. Or just add another one higher up. Also a few perches in the shed for perching.


great - now i can finally get it sorted - will send an update & some pics.

she's still extremely pecky but perhaps that will subdue s little when she finally settles.

cheers & thanks again


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> It doesn't matter if you have the access to the aviary low. Whether they fly or not, they will use them. If she ends up being able to fly, the nest box inside the shed can be put up higher. Or just add another one higher up. Also a few perches in the shed for perching.


great - now i can finally get it sorted - will send an update & some pics.

she's still extremely pecky but perhaps that will subdue s little when she finally settles.

cheers & thanks again


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## closter (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Am not an aviary expert but hopefully people with experience will weigh in soon. If you use perches would use flat ones as pigeons like those much better than parakeet type perches...or use rolled towels. Pecker is such a lucky bird! Can't wait to see how she does in her new home.


thanks for your help.

would not have considered using flat perches - will post pics when i get her housing & mate sorted.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, pigeons use flat perches and prefer them. They even like to lay down and rest on them. Even a shelf will work for them. Both inside the enclosure, and even out in the aviary, they like perches to sit on.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

If she is pecking a lot that is actually a good sign, of feeling better and more comfortable. Phoebe never was able to fly much after her wing injury but had a happy life I think with us, although she loved to bite my significant other. And our girl bird Tracy has become quite good at trying to tear me a new one now that she is hormonal ly obsessed and comfortable in her new home. Then the biting vanishes, between eggs!


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