# is it true that shaking birds should be culled?



## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

what's your thought about this belief?


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

If you are referring to killing birds, *this discussion stops right here*. Otherwise, please explain what you mean about 'shaking' birds


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

What do you actually mean by shaking ?

Shaking of the whole body or parts of body (neck, shoulders). Is it intermittent or continous ? Is the bird drinking and eating normal ? 

If by culling you mean killing the bird, I think you will be better off without pigeons


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## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

John_D said:


> If you are referring to killing birds, *this discussion stops right here*. Otherwise, please explain what you mean about 'shaking' birds


i love pigeons, i will never ever kill them even some of them are not good, i'll just give them for free if i'm going to cull them


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## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

sreeshs said:


> What do you actually mean by shaking ?
> 
> Shaking of the whole body or parts of body (neck, shoulders). Is it intermittent or continous ? Is the bird drinking and eating normal ?
> 
> If by culling you mean killing the bird, I think you will be better off without pigeons


when you come near them, you can see that they are scared and notice that their whole body is shaking / trembling,


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Might be under stress, reasons can range from new loft, over crowding and even diseases. Some pigeons are scared of their handlers. I have some 4 pigeons which always keep distance from me despite they hatched in my loft along with many other.

Offering food from hand and not banging on the pigeon while trying to catch it may improve the confidence. Whether the bird will be motivated to home even if it is afraid of the handler (if thats the case), I leave that to the experts 

Hope the pigeon is not worm infested and not sneezing or coughing while shaking.


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

toilco said:


> i love pigeons, i will never ever kill them even some of them are not good, i'll just give them for free if i'm going to cull them


Thanks Toilco 

Sometimes birds tremble from excitement rather than any particularly negative cause, though as Sreesh says it _can_ be stress. In fact, I have a 'pet' hen who is (silly though it sounds) nervous of strangers and other pigeons, who trembles until I reassure her.


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## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

*tip from one of the best pigeon fanciers in the philippines*

this is from the legend of Philippine Racing Pigeon sports

he said that a scared/shaking pigeon might give up from a tough race, the muscle in the armpit is hard, it should be soft when you touch it. A scared pigeon will snap it back its feathers when you spread them. Many thoughts the pigeon is strong, the truth is, its a sign that the pigeon is nervous, scared, and tense. if a pigeon is tense, the nutrients that flows in the body is not good, that's why the pigeon is not good mentally and physically.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

When their wings are trembling, it usually means they are in shape, eager to fly. Excitement will do it, like mentioned before. I know they shake their wings a lot when flirting and nest calling. Shaking (mainly in the head) can also be a bad thing, such as PMV/paratyphoid nervous fits.
If a bird is shaking because it is scared, then I can see why it wouldn't do well in the race. They should be made comfortable in the crates prior to shipping.


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## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

MaryOfExeter said:


> *When their wings are trembling, it usually means they are in shape, eager to fly*. Excitement will do it, like mentioned before. I know they shake their wings a lot when flirting and nest calling. Shaking (mainly in the head) can also be a bad thing, such as PMV/paratyphoid nervous fits.
> If a bird is shaking because it is scared, then I can see why it wouldn't do well in the race. They should be made comfortable in the crates prior to shipping.


i dont think so, whenever i come near them they start trembling, it means if they are trembling they are scared and they should be culled.


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## drifter (Oct 7, 2009)

It seems to me that being scared and trembling is a mental thing. It doesn't mean they don't have physical ability. If fact they might be so scared that in a race they might take off and fly like a bat out of hell back to their loft.


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## toilco (Aug 1, 2008)

grifter said:


> It seems to me that being scared and trembling is a mental thing. It doesn't mean they don't have physical ability. If fact they might be so scared that in a race they might take off and fly like a bat out of hell back to their loft.


yes, maybe you are right but when it comes to tough race, they will fail, im sure of that


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

I think you should put those birds in thier own pen and only hand feed them. You should try to make them understand that seeing you is a good thing. I have a hen that was a head banger when I would enter the loft she would bounce off the walls to get away. Last year I cliped her wings and she lived with me for over 6 weeks. I took that bird every place, the wife wanted to kill me and the bird. Now even when out side she comes to me.
Dave


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Crazy Pete said:


> I think you should put those birds in thier own pen and only hand feed them. You should try to make them understand that seeing you is a good thing. I have a hen that was a head banger when I would enter the loft she would bounce off the walls to get away. Last year I cliped her wings and she lived with me for over 6 weeks. I took that bird every place, the wife wanted to kill me and the bird. Now even when out side she comes to me.
> Dave


I like that


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

IT IS NORMAL... why would someone want to kill normal.. it makes me sick!!!!!...


now that I got that out of my system.. if you cull as in finding a good home..fine if that is what you want to believe.. you seem resistant to answers that are not the same as your "legend"... keep an open mind and glad you asked here to get a different perspective..


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

toilco said:


> i dont think so, whenever i come near them they start trembling, it means if they are trembling they are scared and they should be culled.


That's what Dr. Colin Walker noted in his book on pigeon medicine and maintenance. If they are scared of you, perhaps you should spend time working with them to make them comfortable with you.


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## Black.Pied (Jun 27, 2010)

never heard as much nonsence in my life


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## drifter (Oct 7, 2009)

toilco said:


> yes, maybe you are right but when it comes to tough race, they will fail, im sure of that


So, are you saying that you've flown these types of birds in races and they have failed? Not all birds do well in competition, evens those who do not tremble.


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

If you are certain that the birds will fail, why are you asking? Do what you think is right. Only you can decide if you want to keep the birds.


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

Black.Pied said:


> never heard as much nonsence in my life


You have a better idea, we're all ears.
Dave


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## Big T (Mar 25, 2008)

OK, first off we are talking about racing. To us it is a race, to the bird it is getting back home. So part of our training is to motivate the bird into coming home as quickly as it can. So if a bird is scared of it own loft or handler this is something that can slow a bird's motivation, and therefore slow its race time. With all the effort in feeding, training, breeding, lighting, what is wrong with making sure the loft is a home worth homing to. I will say some of my best birds are the ones I worked more with. 

Just a thought,
Tony


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## PigeonX (Oct 17, 2010)

I thought all birds shake like that...lol, but yes have observed many of my birds tremble. Sometimes when you observe them very carefully you will see some birds tremble, but if you don't really look at them that carefully all of them just look normal. I believe it's normal for pigeons to do that.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

PigeonX said:


> I thought all birds shake like that...lol, but yes have observed many of my birds tremble. Sometimes when you observe them very carefully you will see some birds tremble, but if you don't really look at them that carefully all of them just look normal. I believe it's normal for pigeons to do that.


It is  My birds that were scared of me, didn't shake, they just flew as fast as they could to get away from me, resulting in a panting, tired, paranoid bird. Those are the ones I work with to try to calm down. Some are just naturally flighty.


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

This reference is from a very old book so may not be reflecting recent studies about pigeons

_Shivering - Occasionally a fancier finds a bird standing around shivering *all the time*. This indicates a weakness from some cause, or from a liver affection where the circulation is interfered with. If it is caused by an insufficiency of blood, add Iron to the drinking water; if the result of a cold, add Quinine; or if the excrement is black and tarry caused by liver difficulty, use the Phosphate of Soda in the drinking water. The tonic should be used for all cases where there is shivering. Hemp seed may be given ad libitum where the droppings are not black or tarry._
*Diseases of Pigeons - J. A. Summers. 1899*


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

I went out and looked a bird that we have on loan that has a pretty large winning record for our parts. That bird seems to like us (although he is not confident with us yet) as evidenced that we can pick him up from a perch or ground in daylight without chasing him yet he shakes in the following conditions:
1. Just before feeding time. 
2. Just before going out time.
3. Just after coming in.
4. Just prior to and after getting picked up.
5. When he sees his mate (this is distinctly exaggerated compared to the other times).

Per the owner "He has always done that, I'm glad I didn't listen to others and cull him!" 

The only way to tell if a bird is any good really seems to be "ship it to the races and see how it does".


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## Big T (Mar 25, 2008)

Jaysen said:


> I went out and looked a bird that we have on loan that has a pretty large winning record for our parts. That bird seems to like us (although he is not confident with us yet) as evidenced that we can pick him up from a perch or ground in daylight without chasing him yet he shakes in the following conditions:
> 1. Just before feeding time.
> 2. Just before going out time.
> 3. Just after coming in.
> ...


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