# found small pigeon NEED HELP



## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

We were said we need to take care of it for a couple of weeks, and then let it go.. It lives with us for a day. We have seeds for parakeets and water.. We have no idea what to do, but want to help. 

Here are the pictures of the bird 

http://homepages.nyu.edu/~vya201/golub1.JPG

http://homepages.nyu.edu/~vya201/golub2.JPG


Here is the cage

http://homepages.nyu.edu/~vya201/golub3.JPG


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi victor2006,

And welcome to Pigeon Talk, thanks for helping this baby pigeon out.
Looks like you have a young one there who is not yet 'fledged'. The pigeon may also not be eating on its own yet. Has it eaten any of the seed that you offered it, and have you attempted giving it formula? Could be the easiest thing for all concerned would be to feed it soaked and strained puppy chow pushed gently to the back of the mouth.

It will also need to have some free flight time to develop it's flight muscles. 
The cage is a bit small for it, but will do for now. It really should be able to stretch its wings fully, however, this one may not yet be a flyer.
Perhaps when you are ready to release it you could return it to the area you found it at and likely there will be other pigeons in that area for the bird to join a flock for its' own protection and survival.
Maybe checking the area for signs of others and when they tend to hang out. Usually earlier in the day is better for the bird being release as it will have time to get re-acquainted w/the flock and find it's "place' w/them.
fp


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Victor,

You have a real cutie there!

Baby pigeons are relatively easy to care for.

He needs to be kept dry and free from draughts. Don't leave the cage in direct sunlight.

Offer him the smaller seeds of the mix, he will toy with them but might not immediately start to feed himself or not take enough food to meet his needs.

You can feed him yourself by soaking puppy biscuits until they are light and fluffy, then gently opening his beak and pushing the biscuit to the back of the throat.

Feed until his crop (which lies below the throat, at the front of the chest) is soft and cushiony.)

Show him where his water is by dipping his beak in it...that might stimulate him to drink.

Watch his poops...the colour, consistency and quantity will tell you a lot about his health. Ideally he should pass 20 to 30 raisin sized poops of the consistency og oil paint. They should be brown topped with a little white cap...but I find that it takes a couple of days for them to get that good.

One chek that we allways do when we find a pigeon is to check the inside of the mouth. It should be pink and clean. Please alert us if you see any cheesy substance, that is not catching but will need to be treated.

Cynthia


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=9682

Is a thread on various ways of feeding young pigeons/squabs

You may find this useful

John


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Victor,

Hello and welcome.

You have a real cute baby there, I have one that age myself, and he is a real cutie.

He is not at the age where he is going to fly or flap, but he will be in a few weeks.

He is still to young to be interested in picking up seeds on his own. You can generate an interest, but he needs to be fed, as his parents regurgitate food to them. 

You can also give the baby thawed out peas or corn, that have been drained. You will have to gently rub the beak and the baby may open his beak or not, Try gently prying open beak with thumb and forefinger, once he knows he is getting food he will be more willing to help. 

Would you like help. Perhaps we can direct you to a rehabber in your area, where do you live?


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Victor2006,


Yes, this is a Juvenile, maybe three weeks old or so...and, in Nature, would not yet have come to eat on his own yet, but would continue to be fed by his Parents for another couple weeks or so, when, having gained enough muscle and other developements, he then would fly with them some short ways, to learn to peck and graze and forrage with them...

So, at this age, when we get them, we need to feed them, more or less as their parents would have. And at this age also, once we are feeding them nicely for a few days, we can gently bring them around to eating on their own.

e-mail me if you like, and I can run you through some of this...it gets too wordy for these threads otherwise...

[email protected]


I just got one in, a little one named 'Jet'...who is a little younger than yours, and who I am feeding, but who shall soon be brought around to self feeding once he has had some chance to enjoy being cared for and looked after in terms he understands, for his weaning transition to have a happy footing...and for him to feel welcome and easy with it all generally.


Otherwise, how are the poops from yours?

Can you describe them? How many so far in what time period?

...and, their appearance?


Best wishes...!

Phil
Las Vegas


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

Thank you all very much for helping me !!! 

He seems to be eating those seeds and drinking water from time to time. I do not know whether it is enought for him. I can not feed him more: he is afraid of me. He lies still but when I try to move my hand closer he stands up and squeecks. (the picture attached) And I have no idea how to open his beak and feed him at the same time.. I counted I need at least 4 hands. 

He is squeeking sometimes, but seems OK otherwise. I took the top of the cage off, he seems to be adquate.. Walked a bit, tried to get out then decided to stay for a while  

When I can watch him shall the top of the cage be off, or its better if I do not change whats around him too often? (I do not have a cat or a dog, only 2 more parakeets)

Poops are black and not hard.. 

I live in 11210, Brooklyn, NY. Anyone knows some organizations around?


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## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Hi victor 2006~

Welcome to Pigeon Life and thanks for your concern with this little one. Do not change too much of its surroundings. best, the less change the better. As far as a rehabber in your area, Trees Gray had asked that question earlier,and I am sure she will supply you with your requested information.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

To feed him spaked biscits you would use your left hand to hold him down,, Circling his head with your thumb and forefinger, then use your thumb and forefinger to prise his mouth open. He really needs to eat.

Hope the New Yorkers in this group can help with a rehabber.

I am sending you a private message with the telephone number of a lovely man who found a rehabber for his three rescue squabs in NYC a couple of days ago, . Maybe he can give you some info on who helped him!

Cynthia.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

If you cannot find someone to hold the youngster so you can feed it, you can wrap him in a small towel, not too tight or too loose, just snug enough so he can't squirm loose. then try to feed him.

Here is a list of resources:

http://www.pigeon-life.net/prd.htm

http://www.tc.umn.edu?~devo0028/contactA.htm#il


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

Always squeeking.. I see him trying to eat that seed, but seems he can not feed enought.. 

I can hold him with left hand, and can try to do something with his mounth at the same time, but how exactely I make him open his mouth?


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

victor2006 said:


> but how exactely I make him open his mouth?



I would suggest carefully inserting a tiny tongue depressor into his beak and make him say, "ahhhh"....LOL.......JUST KIDDING!!!!!


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

victor2006 said:


> Always squeeking.. I see him trying to eat that seed, but seems he can not feed enought..
> 
> I can hold him with left hand, and can try to do something with his mounth at the same time, but how exactely I make him open his mouth?



You can wrap a hand/dish towel or pillow case folded lengthwise and then the wrap around. No need to do it too tightly, just enough to keep the wings at the side and free up both hands. Then w/one hand reaching over the head from the back, hold the beak between thumb and fore fingers. With the other hand, use one of your fingers to gently push up on the upper beak at the tip and this will get the beak open. With the other hand, use the fingers to adjust the grasp so that the beak remains open.

Now you can push the food gently towards the back of the mouth and allow the bird to swallow him/herself.

Good luck,

fp


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

victor2006 said:


> Always squeeking.. I see him trying to eat that seed, but seems he can not feed enought..
> 
> I can hold him with left hand, and can try to do something with his mounth at the same time, but how exactely I make him open his mouth?


If he is wrapped in a towel, I would either 

(at first) use right thumb and index or middle finger to hold bottom beak, open top part with left thumb and finger and then use the left hand to keep the beak open whilst popping food into the mouth with the right.

or, open beak just using thumb and finger of left hand, and feed with right

John

(Aha, didn't see your post, fp  )


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Victor,

It really is ery easy to open the pigeon's mouth, but if you can't get food into him that way then you could soak dog biscuits in warm water, liquidise or sieve them and feed them using one of the methods described in the link that John posted earlier.

I must stress how important it is to get some food into him now.

Cynthia


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## FlyByNight (Apr 25, 2005)

*Feeding etc.*

I looked at the pictures. He's a beautiful pigeon. He may be old enough to start eating seed on his own about now. You can buy a bag of Hagan's "Pigeon and Doved Mix" at most pet stores that carry bird food. It's vitimin and calcium enriched. Wild bird seed mixes are ok but I'd keep it to smaller seeds at first and not give him sunflower seeds.

In case no one has mentioned it, be careful if pushing soft foods such as wet puppy chow to the back of his throat because that little hole near the back of his tongue is what he breaths through and it's important that he not inhale food or liquid by accident. Puppy chow is high protein and probably fine at this age, but don't get it too soft and soggy, just wet enough to be good and slippery to go down easily. But mixed seed bird food is the natural and best food for pigeons.

You might want to open that curtain on the window near his cage so that he becomes aware of the world outside. If you can put his cage where he has a good view it will help him get a feel for the Outside World.

Also in case you haven't read this anywhere else yet, he'll need at least about an inch deep of water to be able to drink. If he starts eating dry food he'll need to have water available that deep pretty much all the time.

I have 2 here that are just under 2 weeks old, and releasing them into the world is a whole 'nuther story. If you have local flock that you feed on a regular schedule that would help a lot. He will need to learn from other pigeons how to survive outside. A human can't teach him.

Or you could keep him for a pet.

You did a good think and he looks like a real love.

- FlyByNight


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

Guys, thank you all !!! Do not now what I did without you. I managed to feed him with something for baby birds that I mix with water. And he eats seeds on his own.. a little bit.. 

But he always squeeking!! Walking around and squeeking! Somethimes flaps his wings. What can be a reason for such a behaviour? I can videorecord him and show if that helps.. 

Victor


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

That's absolutely normal behavior for a young, hungry squeaker that's not scared to death of you. They will even start levitating when their wing feathers grow enough.

Pidgey


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> he always squeeking!! Walking around and squeeking! Somethimes flaps his wings. What can be a reason for such a behaviour?


This is his way of begging you for food. They tend to do it whether they have had enough or not, so it is not a reliable guide for determining whether or not he has had enough to eat.

How much are you managing to feed him, and how often?

Cynthia


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi victor2006,

Baby pigeons get their nickname, 'sqeakers' from the behavior that you describe, their 'voices' do change w/maturation, and they do like to pump their shoulders and flap their wings when feeding or wanting to be fed, sometimes it
seems to just overflow into their mode of being as well.

Check out this link for the videos on "Happy Dancer" and see if you see a 
probably distinct similarity:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpost.php?p=123043&postcount=1

fp


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

I tried to fed him yesturday and twice today. I have Syringe on 1/2 OZ, at one procedure he "eats" about half (or third) of it, but more than half of the food remains on his face and floor  

After today's feeding I got the impression that he does not want any more (was hard to open his mounth), so I stopped. But I saw him eating himself quite fast! 

Guys, can you have a look at this video? Do you think I still need to feed him or he can do on his own? (I will make sure there is enought seeds of every type for him, I saw him picking largest only for some reason..)

Here is the video (20Mb)

http://homepages.nyu.edu/~vya201/pigeon_eats.MOV

And he started squeeking after finishing  

I have another question. Do I need to take him to vet? What is the probability that he might be ill and is dangerous for two parakeets living in the same room? 

THANK YOU ALL !!!!!!!


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

He sure looks very capable of self feeding. Pigeons will often go for the biggest, as they seem to be 'programmed' to grab as much nourishment as they can while they can. A natural thing, as they have to be wary and ready to do a flit at no notice if they see a predator.

If he is definitely swallowing the food - and it looks that way - then he's weaned.

He's a cute little fella, anyway.

John


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Victor2006,


I e-maild you some detailed info on feeding, so, you should have it now in your inbox.

With the 'Nippple', there is no need for any but the lightest constraint for his wishing to "push" forward into the Nipple, and your free hand can gently support him from his Keel or shoulders/armpits ( not his Crop...where one does not want to make any pressure, ) for this to work very nicely.

After a few rounds, he will simply dive his Beak into the Nipple with no guidance needed.

Crop can be filled ( by HIS eating the formula) to where it looks like it has the volume ( at his age) of say, two Golf Ball halves almost...or, for a 'good' meal, this may mean quite a few Nipple's full. I usually do not do this, but instead, do more smaller meals of the kind of formula I described.

Usually at this age I would feed say six Nipples full or seven to-a-meal, and then again whenever he has room again for more, which would be a few hours or more later...but not to where he gets too full.

It is normal for them to be all wound up and flapping and Peeping any time you look at them, for which reason, their natural Parents have as little to do with them as possible once the youngsters are able to make their own Body Heat.

Lol...

Make sure the formula I outlined is 'soupy' ...AND make sure to check his Crop between meals to see if it feels mushy or somewhat firm...if somewhat firm, guide his Beak into a Nipple full of tepid Water, or several rounds of that in a row even, for him to drink...soon, you can use a shot glass or something or a Tea Cup even, of "tepid" Water when you offer him a drink....you want his Crop to be mushy-soft, and the Water in the formula will tend to be absorbed faster than the solids. 

Too, you can gently massage his Crop down low, with your finger tips, so it gets mushy again fast, if it has been sorta firm and you have just given him Water to drink...

Food and Water should come from you and not be left in the cage or other accomidation.

That, can come later in a couple weeks or something. Or sooner, but leave only small amounts of Seeds for him for the time being anyway if you want to leave some for him ot be experimenting with.

Mix the formula by letting the Water just get poured onto it and for it to sit this way for a little while so the Water gently soaks into all of it, then stirr very thoroughly and add more Water if necessary to get the right consistancy...you do not want any lumps or thick spots to exist, as these can make troubles by sticking to the indide sides of their Crop.

Feed him this way for another three weeks and feed him often.

During this time, you can also begin to gently guide his Beak into a shot glass or other small diameter deep container, of small whole Seeds. Finch Seed or the likes. Keep your finger tips on the sides of his Beak as you do this, and he will 'gobble' the Seeds. Do not let him eat too much this way, as he can over stuff himself quickly if he has a talent for it, and many do.

But, do this a couple times a day, just for a few moments at a time, and, soon, in a couple daays even, he will be a Pecking-Bird...and then, if you like, you can put a small low container of Seeds in there, but only as many as you want him to eat and not more, or he will overstuff himself.

Too, it is important to their emotional well being, for them to be fed 'Like a Baby' ( and, think I, in their own manner of this, as near as we can get to it anyway with useing the hollow side of a Baby Nipple, ) untill they are about 30 days old thereabouts, or longer even....and they will tend to leave it off when offered after that, even if they still initially get all wound up and pushy about it. 

I just taper the Baby Feed down to about once a day once they are pushing three and a half weeks or four weeks or so, then once every other day, and by then, I have been letting them peck and self feed anyway of course, but initially, for a couple weeks or so, I try and watch out they do not over do it (say, when they are 16 to 26 days old or so, in that range) , which the reliably will do, too, if one let them, and it can hurt them. The Seeds swell as they absorb Water, and a Crop full of dry Seeds can swell something aweful once the Seed absorb the Water they need to move on down the pipe...so...

In Nature, they would not be pecking Seeds untill they are decent enough fliers to follow mom and day to go forrage...


Anyway, hope all goes well...

Let us know what the poops are looking like, too...


Best wishes..!

Phil
Las Vegas


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## Al & Bobby (Oct 18, 2004)

*Finding a home in NYC*

Victor

I think that the baby pigeon isn't getting enough food. Please keep trying to feed the baby dog food. The advice here is all good, but also try leaving the dog food a little solid, and put a very tiny piece in front of the beak and waiting to see if it swallows. They have to catch on what you're doing.

And call me. Leave your phone number, and i'll call you with people who can take the bird from you today. My number is 212-873-6030.

Al 
Pigeon People
NYC


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

Here is how this cutie looks right now.


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

hi victor2006,

What a sweetheart you have there. Just love that age  

fp


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Thank you so much for helping the youngster.

What a cutie! I have one just a week older then this one.

Please allow the baby to have a deep dish with seed in it also. this will help him gain the skill of picking up seed one after the other moving it back with the tongue and actually swallowing it.

It is okay if he refuses to eat formula, but make sure you are hand feeding some seed, so that he is getting enough.

Is he drinking yet? Be sure he is drinking good clean water, nothing else, and a little probiotics would be good for him at this time.

You should also call Al of the NY rescue group, he can asses if the bird is not eating enough and can take over care if you would like.


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## relofts (Apr 8, 2004)

victor2006,

Hello my name is Ellen and I am one of the Owner/Moderators for the 911 Pigeon Alert Group, I have been receiving messages from pigeon flyers asking me to assist you with your little charge, I in turn incorporated the assistance of Al from the New York City pigeon rescue group, Al and all of us take this very seriously and are always concerned for the well being of the pigeons found, you really need to contact Al at the number he provided to you and go over the care of this little one with him so that we all know that everything possible is being done in the best interest of this little one.

I want to thank you for the care you are providing to this little one but I would trully appreciate your taking it a step further and contact Al so that he can oversee the care that is being provided and possibly arrange for a adoptive home if that is what is needed for you as stated in the messages that I had received concerning your situation.

Ellen - Owner/Moderator 911 Pigeon Alert Group


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## stach_n_flash (Mar 15, 2006)

he looks cute can he fly yet? 

good job raising him


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

stach_n_flash said:


> he looks cute can he fly yet?


Nope. Althought trying 

I wonder what might happen when he actually will be able to fly. He is still afraid of me.. Wil he fly around the room whenever I try to approach him?


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## relofts (Apr 8, 2004)

victor,

Chances are he will become a companion pigeon and will grow to be very fond of you and will choose to be a part of everthing you do and it is very likely that s/he will follow you around.

Now I know that you will be talking to Al very soon, but I wanted to say that by the looks of the pictures you have shown of this youngster it looks to be almost at weaning age or will be within a week I would say and trying to feed it will not work as this little one is beyond that stage if it is at the age I suspect, the best way to know for sure is by checking under the wing, if you see only feathers then s/he is ready to be weaned, if you see skin at all then you are not quite there, now the other thing I want to mention is the feed that appears you are feeding is an exotic cockatiel feed, it would be best if you got it on regular pigeon feed, also I didn't notice any grit available so that will be something that you need to keep in mind.

Now let's talk about the bird is trying to fly, this is yet another sign of a pigeon getting close to weaning stage, I am getting the impression that this little one is not eating from you because he is trying to wean himself, please take a look under the wing and let us know what you see there.

Now for another question for you, I am a little lost due to the fact the email I received from one of the fanciers had said that you were not able to keep this yongster and that you needed help, I am getting the impression that you are considering keeping this little pigeon, have you decided to give this little one a long term home, as it will bond with you if you continue to care for it rather then move it to a rescuer that would teach it to be back with it's flock possibly.

Ellen


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

victor2006 said:


> Nope. Althought trying
> 
> I wonder what might happen when he actually will be able to fly. He is still afraid of me.. Wil he fly around the room whenever I try to approach him?



Hi victor2006,


If he is afraid of you, then things have not gone well in terms of the quality of communication and gestures with him, so far.

This will create more problems, and serious ones for him, as time goes on.

He will start flying in a few more weeks...for now, he needs to romp and play and gambol and climb and so on, and ideally, to feel safe, loved, and communicated with in his terms...to be shown things, and to learn things, and to eat well, and to develope his flight muscles and develop in many ways toward an autonomous adulthood...

Please think of his future, and, if possible, get him to someone who has other Pigeons, and or who can socialize him to both their presences and ways, and as well, if possible, to introduce and socialize him to the wild feral Pigeon's modes of being and communication and politics, which he may need to survive.

He is of an age now, where this is critical for his developement, his well being, and his future.

It is not easy to hit the ground running, with this...

Find someone who knows the drill...

Or, at least start feeding the wild/feral Pigeons somewhere near you, and take him in-a-cage and set him there with them while they graze and peck...set food for him in his cage for him to peck also...do this often...later, when he is about 40 days old or so, let him go 'there' ...

That can work just fine...


Phil
Las Vegas


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

I had some problems with my comp and limited access to the internet. When Al called me with the phone number of a person who can take him I was very hesitant at calling him. I do not want to give him away  

He eats very well. He eats himself, and I always can feed him more with those seeds. He is eating pigeon seeds now and he is flying a little  Althought yet mostly down. I conject he is not afraid of me - he just does not want his "cage" to be cleaned in his presence.. (Who would?). This is not a problem now because he almost always leaves his box at his will, and I can easily clean it. 

In a while, when he can fly better I will put his box outside (close to our kitchen window, no access for cats there), so he can decide himself when he wants to fly away and whether he wants to get back from time to time. There will be always food and water for him. 

Thats basically a story. Probably I am wrong about not giving him to a person with several more pigeons. Ellen, Al, taking all this into account do you think I should give him to somebody, or I can wean him himself the way I described?

Stil some problems with computer but I will put pictures/videos of him in the very nearest future. 

BTW, by pictures I have already shown, you cant yet understand whether he is a boy or a girl?


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## victor2006 (May 8, 2006)

*Baby Weaned !!!!!*

Left him in Marine Park (Brooklyn) with other pigeions. Full story with pictures will be today later. 

Thank you all for help !!!!!!!!


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