# Young Rescued Pigeon - Need Advice



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

*Young Rescued Pigeon - Need Help*

Hello folks! I'm new here, and I am posting because you folks seem to be the internet experts at pigeon care! Your forums have been invaluable so far.

I have a little rescue, and I have some questions, which* I'll bold* while describing the situation. I'm going to try and rehash the questions in a list at the bottom, just so I don't miss any! If you need any more details just shout--and I appreciate any help anyone can give!

The Details:

I found a young pigeon in the alleyway between my building & the next (it's more of a driveway, high-traffic & asphalt). The bird was running about on the asphalt. Judging by the pictures-list I found linked here, the bird is 20-21 days old. His primaries are extremely worn/ragged & matted with dirt or fecal matter at the tips, as if he was tumbled by a car or beating his wings against concrete. He is extremely thin & light, at least with my limited experience (I used to work in a wildlife rescue/rehab center, but I hadn't handled many young pigeons), and his keel is quite prominent and sharp.

I immediately picked him up and brought him inside, and set him up in a high-walled box lined with paper towels and covered with a thin towel (to let SOME light in, but not too much)--there are cats in the area, and it gets quite cold here at night. The only pigeon nesting areas around are at the tops of the buildings, which are 3-4 stories high, so there's no chance of replacing him; I assume that at this age, he should *not yet be out of his nest?*

His crop was empty, but his droppings were well-formed and dark. Tonight, they are now quite runny and white to clear. I own two pet rats, so I separated some of the seed out from their bag of food and tried to get him to eat by scattering it about; he pecked at it but didn't eat any. I force-fed (via dropping into the throat, not tube-feeding) him, first today with corn kernels and late tonight (after an emergency grocery-store visit) with peas--*both fresh/soaked with water. Should they be dry instead?* Please note that I only did this a couple hours after giving him water, and then water with a small amount of honey & salt in to ensure hydration, and after heating him up--so he should be digesting okay. I hope. He seemed perky enough when I picked him up.

I can't find my old heating pad, so I've been changing a hot water bottle & wrapping it in a fluffy sock--he cuddles up to this, and I partially cover him with a thick towel.

I wouldn't be concerned with him--I'm feeding him peas, and he IS drinking water now and then (although he seems to just dunk his entire face in for about 5 seconds, then pull out and shake his head all around--*is this normal behavior? Or does he not know how to drink?*)

I AM concerned, though. He won't eat on his own, and he seems lethargic--maybe just tired, as it's night now? But his droppings going clear & runny worry me. I'm also concerned that I assumed he was starving, as he's very light and with the prominent keel, BUT, would his droppings have been solid? *I'm fretting about whether I should have moved him*, since I don't know his chances against a cat/night cold versus not getting food from a mother who may be flying about, if I misjudged his feeding condition!! *So, in a bird that is 20-21 days old, should his breastbone be muscled/covered in flesh, or very bony?* Should I leave him outside and chance the cat/cold/passersby, or were his parents not feeding him? His crop is fuller now that I've given him the peas, and I'm hoping that by tomorrow, with the heat of the water bottle & a crop massage, he'll have digested it and have some energy.


The Questions:

* *So I guess my main concern is in trying to judge the condition of a young pigeon via the keel--is it a good indicator of emaciation before they fledge, or are the muscles just not there yet? If the keel is NOT a good indicator, should I put him back outside, or does he have a better chance being hand-fed than risking cats & pedestrians?

* His droppings... If they went from solid to loose & watery within ~8 hours, does this mean that it's because of what I'm feeding him? Or is it that his crop was already empty, and this was the last of the food in his digestive tract leaving? If he was still pooping normally, when is the last time he ate proper food?

* Should I be feeding *wet* or at least soft peas & corn, or does it need to be hard? I've been warming it to about skin-temperature (human, although it cools some by the time he eats it) and force-feeding it--is this right? How many should I be giving him per session, and how many sessions per day?

* Should a 20-21 day old pigeon be out of the nest yet?

* Should a 20-21 day old pigeon know how to drink?

* I do not have a syringe/tube. Will peas & corn be okay until he fledges, or will I need to get proper food--and if so, should that be hard, or replacement crop milk? If proper food, do I need grit?

* Ahh--I forgot. He's also sitting with his feathers fluffed out a lot of the time. Is this just for warmth, or? Could he have been booted from the nest due to illness (he wasn't looking or acting sick otherwise, just beat up & underweight), or could it be down to lack of body fat or? Also, I've noticed some wing trembling, and one wing droops, but when lifted into the air he will flap his wings and stretch them without any apparent injury; any idea why he might be having the transient wing tremors & one-winged droop?*

Again, thanks so much for any help. Here's hoping he survives the night & morning!!


(P.S. I just realized I called the bird a "he" all the way through. I don't know the gender... I guess I just don't like calling him "it!")

--Oh, and one last thing... From what I can tell, SOP in this country is to euthanize pigeons brought to rehabbers, I assume because they're feral. If anyone knows better (I'm in Germany) let me know, but I'd rather take my chances with raising him than get him euthanized!!


----------



## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Hi.

Quick answers:

1) Of course you have done the right thing by picking him up and getting him outta there...he (she) would have been a goner by now. Probably fell from an adjacent nest..so if no possibility existed for getting to the enst and placing her/him back...then you did the best thing for sure !

2) Good that you can get him to eat peas and corn...very good. That will provide enough nutrition and hydration for her/him. You wanna do 15-20 per feeding, at least 4 or 5 times/day. If you can up that to 20-30 per feeding, that would help. Thing is...with an emaciated baby you don't wanna force the issue initially which is why you build up the amount over 4 or 5 feedings.

3) The lethargy is a red flag...could be an infection or also just exhaustion due to emaciation.

So...quickly...have you any antibiotic in the house ? Penicillin, augmentin, Ceclor, Cefalexin, Amoxycillin ?

Also...how does the inside of his/her mouth look ? Any signs of canker (this would be small cheesy looking dots or growths of yellow or white, lining the inside of the mouth and/or throat.

And...any sign of external injury ? Gashes, cuts, scrapes, abrasions, blood, scabs or the like ?

4) You gotta really keep her/him in a space with an ambient air temperature of 80 degrees F in order for the heat to help kick in the immune system. Any way you can do that ? This is hecka important because the bird can be fed and even medicated, but if she is emaciated and cold...they will succumb to lack of warmth, particularly in a situation where they already have no body fat.

5) Most rehabbers will kill a Pigeon brought to them. Some will not.
You can call around and get their policy, and be aware they may well try to evade the question and make you feel as if you are doing the wrong thing by not bringing him in immediately. A recent tactic I have heard many a time is something like "let's just get the Pigeon into us and we can discuss that once you bring him here". Don't fall for that.

Thanks for helping. Please post a pic as well.


----------



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

Hey, thanks for the info! I'll address what I can, and here's an update.

He still won't eat on his own, neither seeds nor peas/corn, but he's survived the first night, which to me is always the hardest part!! He's taken the morning's feeding of peas + crop massage well, although he's fighting pretty powerfully, which is good. He's also drinking deeply when I offer him water, sticking his beak in for a few seconds. It's still sloppy, but he's swallowing it!

I have no camera/cell to take a picture with  

As for heat... I'm going CRAZY looking for a heating pad. I can't find mine *anywhere*, and none of the stores nearby seem to stock them at all :O I'm comprimising by covering him and replacing his hot water bottle every few hours (it stays at about 105 degrees, but insulated by a thick, wooly, soft sock, so it's about hand-temperature around the bottle). Will this be enough, or do I need to go invest? I'm not rolling in money, so I'd prefer to spend only if it's really necessary. If it is, I will do so though.

Do you know if your rehab policy is German as well, or just universal?

I have no antibiotics whatsoever, but that being said, he has 0 in the way of lacerations/skin breaks. His mouth is perfectly clean. The only physical thing visibly wrong with him was the heavy wear on the flight feathers--still haven't figured this out, but I think maybe he landed wings-first when he hit the pavement, and probably tried flying/fluttering against the buildings to get back up.

I'm still looking for answers on the other questions, by the way, and anything will help. Some of it is curiosity, some is concern. I've added another important one to the list, too.

* If he was still pooping normally when found, when is the last time he ate proper food?

* Should a 20-21 day old pigeon be out of the nest yet? (Knowing that Jaye agrees with getting him out of there makes this more of a moot point, but I'm still curious! I see lists about when birds should "fledge," but the things I've seen say 30-35 days for a pigeon, so I'm guessing this little guy had some sort of a mishap?)

* Should a 20-21 day old pigeon know how to drink?

* Will peas & corn be okay until he fledges, or will I need to get proper food--and if so, should that be hard, or replacement crop milk?

* I'd like to get him eating on his own as quickly as possible, mainly to minimize the stress of prying/holding his beak open to pop in the food (he does fight!). Are there any foods that will usually tempt a pigeon to eat on his own, even if it's not an optimal meal-food? If there's something that I can use to get him to eat in a certain fashion (either pecking at the ground or eating out of a hand-tube or the covered jar-mouths I've seen linked here), then transfer that behavior to proper food, he might eat on his own.

Thanks again!


----------



## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Hello. Good that he is eating when you hand feed the peas and corn. No, he will not be eating by himself yet at 21 days...so this is why you must continue handfeeding the peas and corn.

Do not worry that he is not eating by himself.

Of more concern is the: 

1) fluffing feathers ~ this is always a sign of illness. I am glad to hear his mouth is clear. And he eats, and poops, and struggles when you hold him. These are good things but I still suspect he has some sort of illness going on.

2) heat....if your house or apartment is cool, this is not a good thing for the baby. I cannot demand you go spend your money, but...a heating pad under a layer of blanket set on low is really a much better solution that a hot water bottle. Or if it is possible to put on the heat in your place ? Or even heat just one room where you keep your Pigeon friend ?

~ Are there any pet supply stores in your area ? Are there any Pigeon supply places online in Germany ? You should investigate this. If I were in your shoes (and you are doing pretty well, by the way) I would start this baby on some meds...either Amoxycillin or Trimethoprim Sulpha (also called Triple-Sulpha). Both can be found in pet-grade formulas which do not require a prescription here in the u.s. Get some as soon as you can, express mail if not available locally.

Other than that...the heat.

~ You can call the wildcare rescue places in Deutschland and ask their policy. Just please heed my warnings in 5) of my previous post.

~ The surest option to save your friend would be an avian veterinarian, but I understand your money situation and this would be an expensive vet visit, probably. But, only a vet can treat for sure.

~ Ferals fledge between 5-7 weeks when raised by their parents all the way up to fledging. Your friend was nowhere near fledging....he/she either fell, or was pushed out.

~ Is his breastbone (also called keelbone, it runs down the center of the chest beneath the crop all the way to the legs) very prominent and sharp ? Or is there some good flesh and breast on each side of it ? This is how you tell a starving/underweight Pigeon from a healthy-weight one.

Lastly....YES...there is a method to get your friend to eat on his own and not rely on handfeeding. BUT...you are getting ahead of yourself. That will come later. Right now, you are trying to keep him alive and get him/her to gain weight and strength, and the best way is by handfeeding peas and corn and keeping him/her warm.


----------



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

I wanted to put him in the bathroom, which is dry & quiet & fairly dark, and put the heat on, and move the rats into the bedroom until he's fledged. Unfortunately, heat in German apartments, at least here in BW, is *inoperable* until late fall / early winter (if you put the heater on, nothing will happen). I think I have a space heater somewhere that I could use, think that would be okay? Edit: I found a pair of USB handwarmers near my computer, which is already warm, so I laid him in a little "nest" (soft toilet-paper-lined cleaned thin plastic salad box) on top of them, on top of the computer. It should get pretty warm up there, and here, I can keep a close eye on him too.

I'll probably go looking for a heating pad on Monday. As far as the drugs I'll look into it, will find out the legality here, but once he warmed up today (I fell asleep with him bundled up under my blanket; he crawled up into the crook of my elbow and laid his head on my arm, adorable little guy!!) his feathers weren't fluffed anymore. It won't hurt him to feed antibiotics if he's NOT sick though, right? I'm not sure how birds react, I don't want to kill off any good intestinal bacteria, but...

His poop is normal again--or approaching it, more solid, formed & brown with white around it. That is normal for a pigeon, yes? He's been fed twice today, about 20 warmed peas six hours apart (it was meant to be sooner but I fell asleep with him  ), and he's drinking. His crop is also emptying within a few hours after feeding (not sure if the gentle massage is helping or not, but it can't hurt I guess!).

His keel is very prominent. His crop is unfeathered (is this normal? It's warm and pink, and soft when fed, so I assume it's healthy, but it's got no feathers) so his keel is pretty visible. It sticks out from his chest by about a (petite) finger's breadth before sweeping down the abdomen. I can't feel anything on either side. I know how to judge it in adults, but as I'd mentioned, I wasn't sure if younger pigeons yet had muscle or fat around it!

Another question, by the way. *Do young pigeons of around his age have any noticeable activity level while in the "nest?"* Should I expect him to lie fairly quietly most of the time? He takes an interest in what I'm doing (he tried to eat the period off the text on my t-shirt  ) and will become alert, raising his head and looking around, if I'm active nearby. But most of the time he's just asleep in the little nest I made for him, snugged up against the water bottle. Is this normal, or should he be noisy, rambunctious or trying to escape? I'd have assumed that a little one would stay in the nest, but I'm not sure.

Incidentally, a small fly of some kind flew down into his box. Although he won't eat anything I feed him, he saw that fly wandering across the paper towel, snapped it right up and ate it. I guess that's a good thing?  (I know bugs can harbor parasites, and have no intention of feeding this guy insects, but at least he ate something on his own...)

Thanks so much again for helping me out with this. The answers & the other forum posts in general have really helped steer me in the right direction!


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

HI there! If you are keeping him in a plastic box, then can you make a cover of some sort with screening or something. The box will have to be high enough for this guy to stand while the box is covered. He will jump out and maybe get hurt. If he is so quiet, it is very likely because he is ill and as Jaye has mentioned, needs medication. He is also old enough to wean, as long as you continue to supplement him with the peas and corn. As Jaye has mentioned, you are trying to get weight back on him. Try giving him the defrosted peas and corn maybe 3 times a day, when his crop empties. Give him maybe 30 at each feeding. Just to fill his crop maybe 2/3 full, so that it feels like a soft little pillow. Once he starts eating on his own, you can cut back on how many you give him, as he will be getting food on his own. If you can leave some of the peas and corn with him in his box, or maybe some seed, he will eventually learn how to eat on his own. Also, can you leave a small crock of water in with him? Something he cannot spill. 

As far as the feathers being missing on his crop area, this could be a sign of canker. If so, then he would need to be treated with canker meds. Without pictures, it's hard to tell. But at three weeks, he should be feathered there. Please be sure to keep the rats away from him, as rats will kill birds. And thorough hand washing after handling them, or feeding them, as they do carry salmonella which will make your bird very sick. Just wanted to mention that.


----------



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

Just a quick update--and for now, a farewell--after calling around awhile, we found a "bird man" (their description) who works with the Ulm animal shelter/clubs. The animal shelter unlocked for us an hour after closing in order to take in the little pigeon, who was looking a little sluggish and still extremely underweight.

I'm busy now doing the whole standard hygeine DISINFECT EVERYTHING routine back at home, washing all the bedding, towels and so forth, but I'm hoping that with "the bird man," little pigeon is doing well. I can't see the guy having come down to the shelter an hour after closing just to euthanize the little guy, and I'll call in a couple days to check up on him and update you back here.

Thanks so much again for the help; the bird wouldn't have lived this long, regardless of whether he survives the long run, without all the wealth of info and replies I got here!


----------



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

Jay3 said:


> HI there! If you are keeping him in a plastic box, then can you make a cover of some sort with screening or something. The box will have to be high enough for this guy to stand while the box is covered. He will jump out and maybe get hurt. If he is so quiet, it is very likely because he is ill and as Jaye has mentioned, needs medication. He is also old enough to wean, as long as you continue to supplement him with the peas and corn. As Jaye has mentioned, you are trying to get weight back on him. Try giving him the defrosted peas and corn maybe 3 times a day, when his crop empties. Give him maybe 30 at each feeding. Just to fill his crop maybe 2/3 full, so that it feels like a soft little pillow. Once he starts eating on his own, you can cut back on how many you give him, as he will be getting food on his own. If you can leave some of the peas and corn with him in his box, or maybe some seed, he will eventually learn how to eat on his own. Also, can you leave a small crock of water in with him? Something he cannot spill.
> 
> As far as the feathers being missing on his crop area, this could be a sign of canker. If so, then he would need to be treated with canker meds. Without pictures, it's hard to tell. But at three weeks, he should be feathered there. Please be sure to keep the rats away from him, as rats will kill birds. And thorough hand washing after handling them, or feeding them, as they do carry salmonella which will make your bird very sick. Just wanted to mention that.


The box he was in was cardboard, with very high walls (was a biggish appliance box, taller than wide though), and had a towel over the top. He had water in with him in a shallow dish, and yes, I definitely kept him away from the rats. I love my rats but I assume that the bird may well go for their eyes, and they will try to kill him, plus the whole ectoparasite-transmission from one to the other... not even going there!! But good of you to mention it! 

As far as the feathered crop--or unfeathered, anyway--I mentioned to the guy that the bird was ruffled and that I'd been told he was likely ill, and needed antibiotics, and also that he was starting to show mites around his head. Hopefully he'll have some standard heat/antibiotic treatment for the birds--he seemed to be confident enough, saying he was going to rehab & release it. Fingers crossed!


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If you should find another, keeping him in a box with a towel over it won't encourage him to eat on his own, as they won't eat in the dark. A screen or something that emits more light would be better. I hope he does well with this guy who took him. Please let us know.


----------



## Feral (Sep 23, 2011)

I kept it halfway off during the day, so he was getting indirect sunlight, but I will bear that in mind (just in case!) for the future


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You did good in rescuing him. Probably saved his life. Thanks for all you did.


----------

