# Just Hatched Baby Pigeon NOT in Nest HELP



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

*Just Hatched Baby Pigeon NOT in Nest HELP A*S*A*P*

I was out doing yard work over near my pigeon coop. Looked in (not quite feeding time yet) and saw a baby about 6" +/- away from the nest. Mom was still sitting on the other egg. I am concerned about the new baby getting cold.

Is it normal for her to not sit on it while the other is still in the egg?

Should I take the baby and put it under a heat lamp? 

HELP!?

This is my second set of egg(s) that have ever hatched for us. The mom of this newly hatched baby is the only baby that hatched last year and survived! So this is still VERY new to me!


----------



## rackerman (Jul 29, 2009)

*I don't know what to tell you, just keep checking back here often and you will get an answer from someone with experiance real soon. Sorry I don't know what else to say.*


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

I had hubby pick up the mom (shes super protective and was pecking at my hand while I was trying to put the baby back in the nest). So hubby picked her up and I put the baby back in the nest. She did not attack it or anything. After a few minutes (she was a little upset that we moved her), she went and is now currently sitting on the baby and the egg.

Heres a question:

This is my single female pigeon. Obviously she mated as she has a baby, but I think one of the males from my other pair was sneaking out to her nest at night! p) But I have never seen either of my 2 males sitting on the eggs only my lone female (I have 2 other females that are paired with the two males. This lone female was hatched last year and unfortunately the mom was attacked and died and the dad took off with wild pigeons a couple months ago).

I thought the male and female took turns sitting the eggs AND the squabs to keep them warm. If its just her... then what?? Also, is it normal for both babies to live? The lone female who hatched this baby had a sibling that hatched and lived for a few days but eventually died. Is that normal?


----------



## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

ixitellyixi said:


> I had hubby pick up the mom (shes super protective and was pecking at my hand while I was trying to put the baby back in the nest). So hubby picked her up and I put the baby back in the nest. She did not attack it or anything. After a few minutes (she was a little upset that we moved her), she went and is now currently sitting on the baby and the egg.
> 
> *You did the right thing. Always replace it in the nest unless it is injured. She should accept it back right away with no problems.  *
> 
> ...



*They do take turns sitting on and raising the eggs. Is there any way in the future you can get another male for her? While it is difficult for a single pigeon to raise two squabs, it can and has been done. You will need to keep a close eye on them and their development, and make sure their crops (the area under the beak) are full. You want to look for one being smaller than the other or not getting as much food as often the older/larger one is grabby. If this is the case, you can supplement the littler baby (or both, if the mom is struggling to feed them) with hand-feeding formula a few times a day. It's easy to do and we can direct you on how to do so.*

As for your other question, it is not normal for the babies to die at all. Usually this can be a sign that their parents are carrying something. Are your birds vaccinated? This is not as scary a question as you may think, so don't worry immediately. It is fairly easy to vaccinate against diseases and they work SO well!! A vet can do it for you, or you can order the vaccines online, or you can contact a local pigeon club and ask if anyone has a few extras you can have/buy. They aren't expensive. As they come in large quantities online, the last option is often easiest, if you don't want to take them to the vet.

In the meantime, if you do have a vet that you use, you can take in a sample of the mom's poop without having to bring in the actual bird and stress her out. The vet can easily (and usually, cheaply) test the poop for any diseases. And don't worry, they don't carry any diseases you can catch. But most often they are carriers of Paratyphoid or another disease and while the parents remains healthy, the babies die or are sickly. Again, very easy to remedy. 

Make sure the male who is visiting for romance in the middle of the night doesn't bother the babies. Male pigeons can get very aggressive with babies that they don't think are theirs. Please keep an eye on them and let us know if you have any other questions. Oh and make sure there is something in the next box such as an old towel or paper towels; it is crucial that the babies have enough traction as they grow or can develop splay leg. Good luck!!


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I hope everything works out okay. If she is a single female then I wouldn't have let her hatch the eggs. I would have replaced them with wooden eggs. Often raising babies is too much for a single parent, and they will abandon them partway through. Better not to let them raise babies unless they are a mated pair. The player who visits her won't sit on the eggs, as she isn't his mate. Usually, a couple of weeks after the babies hatch the pair will start another nest and have more eggs. At this point, the male is the one who takes over the feeding of the young while she sits on the new eggs. That is what a mated pair will do. He won't feed these and care for them as if they were his from his mate, and as was mentioned, he could hurt them. If she abandons them you will have to finish raising them yourself. Think it might be a good idea to try to mate her up with a single male.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Whew. Thank you SO much. When I went back to check, she was sitting on the egg and the baby. When she puffed up a little at me, I could see the babys hinny barely under her breast feathers. 

I have only had 2 babies ever (this mom being one of them) and the one that died didnt look normal when it hatched. 

I was going to get a mate for her, but at the time, I thought she was a HE. I saw him/her doing the prancing and cooing like a male and found it difficult to tell if it was a male or female. Then I came outside, and voila, eggs. So def knew he was a she. 

No they are no vaccinated. Well in the last year they have not been. They are wormed through the water but thats it. I wasnt aware that they needed anything. I can get some poo samples and take it to my vet... Im pretty sure she sees bird. If not, I can find one.

Can I just vaccinate anyways to be safe? Or if I do and they have something, will it cause a problem?

The nest boxes are wood with coastal hay for nesting material (I have horses so this is readily available and I get hay from up north that is from the amish and no fertilizers, etc). I can put down a towel or paper towels though.

Im pretty sure the male who mated with her was "Tito". He has been sitting in the vacant nest box that is above LW's (the mom) and just hanging out. But Ill keep an eye on him and Mr Boo. 

I think I am going to go buy some bird formula tomorrow to have on hand just in case. LW was a very dedicated mom and I rarely saw her off the nest. Just to eat quickly and to take her morning flight. But I want to help out if she needs it. I honestly didnt think the eggs would hatch as I have two other females who ARE mated and they lay eggs and they never hatch and when I candle them, they are clear, but I let them stay in the nest until they push them out. I didnt even *think* to candle LW's because I knew she didnt have a mate and thought she was just going through the "motion". My fault! 

Ill keep this updated. Thanks for the help. I was really stressed out!


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

As long as you have enough nesting material in the nest for the babies, they don't really need a towel. It's just that they do need traction, as maryjane stated. Or their legs can splay out to the side. Make sure they have a lot of those grasses in their nest. Good luck, this could get interesting. I would do as you said, and have the bird formula on hand..................just in cast. Please keep us updated. I just have to know how this works out.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Trust me, you guys will probably get sick of me. I will def keep this updated! I will have to get pics... maybe tomorrow??

BTW, just an off thought... I have 2 other mated pairs... just traditional "grey" homing pigeons with the purple/green haze to the neck feathers. Anyways, Ive had them for 1.5 yrs approx and they mate and make nests and lay eggs and NEVER do they hatch. Birds are AT LEAST 2 yrs old if not slightly older.

At the same time we got the 2 above mentioned pairs, we also got a pair of white pigeons. Well the female was white with some little dark grey splotches and the male was all white. On their 2nd clutch, they hatched their eggs (mom in this post is a baby of them). And now, here we are again, and the grey pigeons are still not hatching their eggs and the white pigeon, who is a single mom, hatches a baby! Whats going on???


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Here is an older pic when we were updating the loft.

On the top left, the smaller white pigeon is LW, the single female in this post.
The bigger white pigeon below her is her dad, Big ******. He unfortunately flew off with 3 feral pigeons that came around one day because his mate got killed by dogs (). Then Mr Boo is the dark grey in this middle and his mate is the female on the nest to the right, Roxanna. Madonna and Tito are off to the right, you cant see them in this pic.


----------



## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

ixitellyixi said:


> Trust me, you guys will probably get sick of me. I will def keep this updated! I will have to get pics... maybe tomorrow??
> 
> BTW, just an off thought... I have 2 other mated pairs... just traditional "grey" homing pigeons with the purple/green haze to the neck feathers. Anyways, Ive had them for 1.5 yrs approx and they mate and make nests and lay eggs and NEVER do they hatch. Birds are AT LEAST 2 yrs old if not slightly older.
> 
> At the same time we got the 2 above mentioned pairs, we also got a pair of white pigeons. Well the female was white with some little dark grey splotches and the male was all white. On their 2nd clutch, they hatched their eggs (mom in this post is a baby of them). And now, here we are again, and the grey pigeons are still not hatching their eggs and the white pigeon, who is a single mom, hatches a baby! Whats going on???


As a first step you can try candling the eggs to know whether they are fertile to hatch


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

I normally DO candle them but I didnt even bother b/c I thought she was a he and when I found her sitting on eggs I didnt candle them b/c I knew she didnt have mate. Lesson learned. 


Update:

Husband went and checked on them for me this AM. He said the other egg hatched and she is sitting on both of them and all looks well. I am going to DEF stop and get baby bird formula. eek!


----------



## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

ixitellyixi said:


> I normally DO candle them but I didnt even bother b/c I thought she was a he and when I found her sitting on eggs I didnt candle them b/c I knew she didnt have mate. Lesson learned.
> 
> 
> Update:
> ...


Thats a good sign  Please keep checking once in a while to make sure both are getting fed and have the crop full but don't disturb them much.

About the candling of the eggs, I was referring to the eggs of the two grey mated pairs


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Oh. Well they pushed them out of the nest, AGAIN. They always do that and never hatch them. Only the white ones. What gives??

I checked them last night, against the wishes of momma LW. She was pecking and wing slapping me so I had to hold her just to check them. One I could def tell had a full crop but the other felt like it had some but I wouldnt say FULL. I just touched my finger to that area and felt around. Are there any tricks?


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

No one fights over nest boxes. That picture was in the middle of the revamp on the coop. The nest boxes are all closed with the bars now except for doors. The 2 grey females and males all sit on their eggs and then about 2-3 wks later, they are rolled out of the nest and a few days after that, there are new eggs. Ive candled quite a few in the last year and 90% of them are not fertilized, just clear. 

I allow my pigeons to free range (I know a lot of people dont agree with that but it is my decision and I know what is on my property and the risks, thanks) and when I came home from work, LW had just came back in from pecking around on the ground. I checked on the babies, felt their crops... couldnt really tell, possibly not full. I stood there and watched to see if she was going to feed them but if I was around, she was not comfortable doing anything with them so I left. Looked over ther about 15 mins later and she was sitting on both of them.

Most people dont believe it, but we do not have predators (possums, raccons, neighborhood cats) because we have 2 large dogs that roam the property and ANYTHING that enters is found immediately by them (including snakes). My property is a little circle of 3 acres encompassed by over 10 acres of cleared land. We actually have our first squirrel in over 4 years finally venture over. Anyways, thank you for the concern.

How often will the mother feed them? When I get home (around 530pm), should I expect full crops? She was feeding (I feed them with the horses around 6pm) and all but again, shy to feed the babies in front of me.

Here is a quick pic I snapped before LW came back into the coop. They both wake up and search for food and all seems well.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Oh no - I really do appreciate the advice. I agree with you in that you still should provide the info. I do the same when it comes to my horses and posting about them online as well.

Should I lock the mom in the nest box with food and water??? Or just not let any of the birds fly for now? They go out every morning and fly around the property. 

I watched and watched and watched and never saw her FEED them, just lay on them.

Since she is just 1 yr old (approx), could she just not KNOW to feed them? Or was she just being super protective and not trying to show me that she had babies?

They have one of those long feeding troughs thats full of seed and 2 water basins. Now that its warm again, Im going to get like a cat litter bottom and put it out for bathing as they enjoyed that last year.


----------



## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Well I am not being a pessimist here but with that single mother caring for the two squabs and seeing the size of the second squab, there is much size difference going to happen if you don't intervene. If the difference really starts to show in a couple of days, you could keep the bigger one warm aside for some time so that the second squab can have a crop full, it would be better.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes. I believe this is the hen who is having an affair with a mated cock.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

I think you have two different eggs from two different females and the timing is off by a few days over the amount allowed and thats why one is smaller than the other..I would leave things be and don't disturb too much but I would definitely get a nest bowl to keep the babies from rolling off the shelf and quickly transfer to the nest bowl for it would sure be more secure for the babies and put a brick in front so that the bowl doesn't get off the shelf---but have baby pigeon formula on hand and be ready to feed these babies if anything strange happens like abandonement and thats a daunting task for a few weeks until they feed themselves--also you would need this pigeon-baby mix to feed or supplement that small one if necessary a few times a day--I think they are different ages and different female eggs that were deposited there on the shelf hay. I had that happen one time and the male went back his first wife Virginia when she laid a egg about 6 days into this baby hatching. Inky the father sat on his wifes egg and never paid attention to his girlfriend snow flake on the two babies she was sitting on but at night I would catch him (two times) giving the babies pigeon milk because it must have bothered him (fullness of crop) and he watched the two females on a perch overhead. He did pigeon milk in a sporatic way but there
came a time when the babies were ready for seed and he never went back to the girlfriends babies to feed seed and she handled it all by herself and the babies did fine but they cried a lot more than a normal family. She also found her boyfriend at this time (first flight) and he would come and visit with her as she fed the seeds to the babies. I did pull Inky and virginia"s egg and even with that he never helped snowflake with the seed for the babies and Snowflake fed them by herself. He only tended to those babies for about 7 days then went to his wifes eggs and forgot about snowflake and the seed giving job but snowflake did well as a single mom and everyone survived but it was real hard on my nerves I can tell you early in my pigeon days. The two babies one looked like snowflake (smudge white) and Sparkles (white with dots) and Inky(total black) fooled around with her and fed the babies for the first 7 days and then forgot about them...
This has been a complicated story to tell but it might open up your horizons on some of the stuff that can happen...You do need a nest bowl so the babies won't roll off the shelf with something to secure the bowl as well...You do need baby pigeon formula just in case you have to supplement one or more or more of them until they are old enough for seed but I would leave them alone but keep a extra careful eye on the situation and make sure the mama is sitting on them to keep them warm--let her leave sporically but not too long as to chill the babies (use your judgement here) and be ready to take both babies inside and hand feed them if necessary ( a daunting job but can be done) but this should be a last resort--leave things be for now --as long as things stay within a life quality stage for these babies (judgement needed and a careful eye with environmental changes weather taken in consideration as well and her sitting ability..
I hope this complicated story helps a little bit but stuff happens-wierd stuff--sometimes...c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Unfortunately, this morning, the smallest one was dead. 

It was lively last night but it was the one that didnt feel like it had a full crop but mom was sitting on them both and since I had just watched the mom feed, I was hoping she was going to feed the babies. 

The smallest one was the one that hatched last. I feel so bad because I should have checked the eggs but just didnt think to because she wasnt mated. And she was cooing and strutting around like a male.

The surviving baby is getting SO big every day. Like almost double the size in 2 days. Shes very protective of the remaining baby and it had a full crop when I got home from work.

When can I get her a mate? I know a new male would attack the baby but I dont want her to go off and lay more eggs. 

Like I said, that pic is almost a year old and was in the middle of us fixing up the loft for nest boxes. Each box has a tall edge and the dowel bars and a door for the parents to come in. I had a nest bowl for my first squabs last year and the babies were out and the parents ignoring it and never used it even when I moved the nest into it.

With the trap door, I can leave it down and catch the other pigeons and let them go out (they are pretty easy to catch at the coop is 6.5-7' tall) and they are used to being handled. They dont CARE to be handled but they are fine. Then they can come INTO the loft but no one can leave if the trap doors prongs are down. 

Luckily for me, after tomorrow, I am off work until 4/19/10 so I will be here 24/7 and can keep a better eye on them.

Anyone have any thoughts as to why my dark grey couples NEVER hatch eggs and only my white ones have? What gives?


Oh - here is the current mom - LW - as a baby! A couple days old!


----------



## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Sorry about the second squab, lets just take it as nature's way of action. Now with a single squab and the single mother, things should get a little more easier. 

Regarding the eggs of the grey pair are they fertile eggs, I suppose they were yet to be candled.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> when you do not have a true mated pair, do not let them hatch eggs, use your fake ones. If you do not have any, you can get them here. link:
> 
> http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/catalog/155.html


That's good advice. A lone female would probably not raise them by herself, and even if she did, it isn't fair to her. The male who is mated to another doesn't care about helping with the babies. Why put her through this? Either find her a mate, or switch out her eggs.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Like I said, I was in the process of getting her a mate but I thought she was a HE so yeh it kind of negates the point. I am obviously going to get a male for her but no one answered when I can introduce a mate to her since she has a squab.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

ixitellyixi said:


> Like I said, I was in the process of getting her a mate but I thought she was a HE so yeh it kind of negates the point. I am obviously going to get a male for her but no one answered when I can introduce a mate to her since she has a squab.


Sorry. I'd wait til he was weaned and on his own. No need to do that right now. The male she's been messing with may give the new guy a hassle, and unless you separate her from the others, she may not be interested in the new guy either, as she is mating with the mated male. Pull her out and try introducing her to the new male. Don't put them in the same cage though or they may fight.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Where do I put her and the new male when all that happens? Do I have to get a seperate cage for them??? I just have the coop (8x8x7) with 6 nest boxes and some perches.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well, I forgot how many birds you have. Maybe they will just mate up and you won't have a problem. I have a female that I want to mate up with another male, but I'm going to pull her out of the loft and cage her, as she isn't interested in anyone but the mated male she is mating with.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

If you have a nesting bird on that baby and you know that it is getting pigeon milk I would leave them be because now it is easier on her since she had only one to feed if she is feeding it leave thing be if you know it is being fed with pigeon milk and just mark the days until seed feed time thats what I would do--watch things make sure that baby is getting fed (thats the important thing right now) If she is nesting on it and shes the mother she will feed it if she has not abandoned it and right now you need to know that that baby is getting fed and post about that : Is the baby getting fed by the lone mother and is she keeping it warm by sitting on it...Please come back and post us the answers---don't worry about a new mate right now the question is: Is that baby getting fed by the mother??? c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Yes every time I check the baby, it has a full crop (squishy area under the beak - I can tell theres stuff in there) and the baby is getting bigger every day! She is very motherly to it, sitting on it, feeding it, protecting it. 

I have 5 pigeons excluding the baby. 2 males and 3 females. The 2 males and the other 2 females have been mated together for over a year. The lone female was the offspring of a pair I unfortunately no longer have.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Yea I have read your story in detail and I wrote back in detail with my story about how strange stuff happens sometimes in lofts...As long as that baby is being cared for and it is warm you have no problem right now for you need to keep a sharp eye on its living conditions (food and Mama sitting on it and feeding it and getting stonger each day) and pretty soon if she has not already she will starting laying down seed for it and feeding it seed) and keep an eyed on those other nesting birds and I really wish you could enclose them in for awhile especially the males but I don't know if they are nesting or if you put plastic eggs down for them--I don't know how that situation is--but anyway do not disturb her nest--do not move it--just leave things be and keep a watchful eye on this whole situation and most of all make sure that baby is being fed...even with one parent it can make it ---its hard on that parent but it can make it as long as she does not abandone it. It that happens we have much more difficult problems--don't worry about a male for her now--time will come--and they would not have pigeon milk anyway and they would not feed the baby...just make sure she taking care of the baby and nothing is bothering the two of them the mom and baby and keep us informed ...We will worry about other things later.....c.hert


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You could introduce the new male, and they would probably be fine.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Ixitellyixi: Please give us a update on the Hen and the baby she is sitting on and I could care less at this point whether she has a mate or not for it is not going to make a difference right now and just confuses the point...Please update us on the baby and Mother bird---how are they doing---Is the baby eating and is the baby warm and is the baby growing---don't be too intrusion for she could abandone that baby and then in that case there would be real problems...Please update and read my other post #33.
Give everyone here an update so they can tell you how to help the mama and baby.--Forget about a mate for her at this time--this is not the issue--the life of a baby is what is important here......c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

spirit wings said:


> well that only confuses me further, which happens often.. LOL.. a strange cock bird is not going to feed babies of a hen he just met.., the eggs take 18 or so days to hatch, where did you think the hen was during all that? did you think a male was sitting the eggs alone?
> I think the point I made is valid, unlike you say. because a inoccent died because of your choice. live and learn I guess. Good luck with the rest.




What is so hard to understand? She was acting like a male. I was in the process of getting a rescued female from a board member. Then I saw eggs. I knew she wasnt mated so didnt think to candle the eggs and just let her sit on them because if I took them, she would lay more. Plus the other 2 couples never hatch their eggs anyways. My two males were sitting on their own nest with their own mates the whole time. The lone female had no help. So again, I didnt think they would actually hatch. 

The point you made was the same point made like 6 times. Like I said AGAIN, I thought she was a he and almost adopted a female for her. I stopped the process when I saw the eggs. And it wasnt a CHOICE I made. I didnt CHOOSE for her to get fertilized eggs from a male that was already mated and I didnt CHOOSE for the baby to die. You can act all high and mighty and try to make me feel bad or look bad, but unfortunately mistakes happen, which I mentioned above. There is no need to come onto my thread, which is asking for help, and continue to try to shame me. Reitterating the same thing over and over is not helping. If you have no further advice, you can quit replying. Seriously. Im sure you have never had a squab die. Good for you. Newbies in any hobby make mistakes. Way to make you and this forum really welcoming by chastizing people for their mistakes and asking for help.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

ixitellyixi said:


> Yes every time I check the baby, it has a full crop (squishy area under the beak - I can tell theres stuff in there) and the baby is getting bigger every day! She is very motherly to it, sitting on it, feeding it, protecting it.




I check them every morning and evening. Both are doing fine. The baby gets bigger every day it seems. It crop is full when I check on it though mom isnt happy that I check.

I was mentioned the mate situation to the other posters who inquired about that situation.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Thats wonderful news Ixitellyixi and keep us posted on the two of them--the MaMa and baby and how old is that baby now---if she continues to feed it pigeon milk right now--this is great news and in a little while she will be giving it seed and we will go from there and this made my day--thank you ...Bless you....This is just a suggestion....when you talk to someone else about a mate or something like that then just put their name in the beginning of your note to them then it would not be too mixed up for the rest of us..Right at this time I am only interested in this baby and mama situation and so far so good---great news Ixitellyixi ......c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

This baby hatched on Sunday morning. So it is 6 days old.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

You are completely missing the point -

Others, including yourself, posted what you JUST said, I also said the same thing and that I know now, and yet, you keep beating the dead horse (bird?). What gives? Your post comes across as if you are trying to shame me because of mistakes that I already came to terms with and you keep repeating and repeating and making statements like "an innocent bird died because of your choice!" I mean come on, mellow dramatic??? Me getting advice has nothing to do with me being defensive. My being denfensive has to do with your tone and constantly repeating the same things that have already been taken to point. If you need to toot your horn and make others feel stupid for their honest mistakes, then please take it elsewhere. I obviously did NOT want the baby to die and certainly did not want LW to take on the task of raising even one baby alone. But continuely bringing up the same thing over and over after it has gone over is totally pointless. I obviously understand all the advice given and have commented to that. You obviously cannot grasp the idea that your choice of words has a very demeaning tone to them (which is all we have to go by on the internet) and it is certainly not appreciated when the person asking for help (IE: me) already knows they made a mistake and admited it. It has NOTHING to do with me not understanding.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

You post are coming through very confusing at least to me. I sincerely apologize and did not mean to demean you in any way and just leave it go for now I know that you are watching the bird really good instead of trying to confuse the situation about finding another mate and things of that nature--thats for later---demeaning to you sometimes I do get anxious when there is a little bird at stake and the first little bird died and if people understood the problem better maybe that bird could have been saved. I apologize and now other people know that there is a baby very young involved and they can help you a lot better than me and I am sure they will drop right in and move forward with you on this...Sorry for the misunderstanding and sorry because you felt that I demeaned you for I surely did not want too...Bless C.hert


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

The baby is about 6 or 7 days old and this is really good because in a few days the MaMa bird will switch to feeding the baby seed and this is where the real story of the babies survival begins and if she has been fed pigeon milk all along as one baby she has a real good footing to begin with the seed. People might disagree with my approach on this but if the mother stops feeding seed ( I doubt this) you have to be ready to find this baby seed by hand (small seed) a few pieces at a time but enough about 4 or 5 times a day but don't overfed and also you need to give the bird liquid as well without the baby aspirating it in and there are threads on this pigeon talk that tell you how to do this and I would wet the seed down first and this should get some water to the bird. The professional rehabbers are very experienced in doing this because they have feed lots of baby birds and this is where help will really be needed but right now everything is fine and I am sure people are keeping an eye on your thread to see how the baby is doing. Thats all that matters right now and my advice and Spirit Wings advice we were just trying to be helpful to you in regard to the little bird and when seed starts it will be a whole other story please keep us posted and we might wind up being your very best helpers because we both truely care....c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

c.hert - my posts were not directed at you. Sorry if you thought so. I was directing them at spirit wings. I appreciate your help, truly.

Will LW feed the baby seed from her mouth like the pigeon milk? I just remember when LW was a baby and watching her mom and dad feed her, and it all looked like the same way they fed the milk. Eventually, LW was able to go down the ladder (coop was a previous chicken coop so there was a ladder) and would eat seed herself and then hop back up the ladder.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Yea ixitellyixi LW will feed the baby seed from her mouth just like pigeon milk only it will be less often and sometimes she will lay some seed down for her baby in its area after it gets off its hock -meaning standing up instead of just the whole bottom of the baby sitting flat on the ground and sometimes this can cause problems with the other birds coming over to eat this seed especially since she is a long female and what I did was block off the area with bricks or something to let her jump out not the baby--but every loft is different and that might not be a problem for you--she is just putting seed down near the baby so that it can peck and fool around with it but she has no male to help her so its a matter of good observation and making judgement calls to keep the baby safe --if you had a dog carrier (large) or something like that that would confine her and the baby in there own area and shut it up and keep seed or water in there for her and her baby---this would be the best situation for awhile until the baby gets strong enough to fly and jump on its own--that' s what I would do confine the two of them in a large dog carrier and supply fresh seed and water each day then you would not have to worry about the baby getting hurt by one of the other pigeons because other males if agressive can hurt them especially when there is no father around helping her being on guard duty so to speak...Make it comfortable for them and keep the dog carrier in the loft somewhere on a table to make it convenient for you...thats what I would do at that time and then the baby can experiment with the seed and water all its wants..c.hert


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Thanks for that info. I remember as LW was growing, I would see the parents starting to feed her but making her stand up to get it. Then she would start standing up and squaking to get them to feed her (very persistant). I didnt know they were giving her seed though. Very cool.

Thanks for that tip. I have 3 dogs & 5 cats so I def have a few carriers on hand.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Yea you have your hands full and they do that for exercise for the baby---they stretch them so to speak outside their normal lazy baby birds and it is fun to watch...Keep a good eye on the MaMa"s heath too----keep us updated on your family---we will worry about the other birds strange behavior later for had a friend who had white owls presented as a birthday gift to her and they would lay eggs fine but would never sit on them and she waited years for a baby but never happened and I told her to switch the eggs to one of her racer mama" about the same time laying and it turned out they were half racer father and half white owl mother and she gave me those babies because she had a very strict racing loft with just racers and her two white owls..These babies grew up to be two gorgous large birds and they are about 4 years old now and I named them Owly and Race and she banded them as a racer.. A sad story here : I wanted her loft birds because she and her husband had them many years in excellent condition and they were fine birds these racers but this person was 84 and got alzheimer disease and her niece came from california and released them all and they were never trained out of the loft and I waited for days in their loft to come back but they never did and what I think happened to them was they tied up with other racing birds as a flock and went to their loft--never saw a dead bird and never saw any of them again and they were all banded so someone has some really good racing stock--maybe its not too sad but I really wanted her stock but now I have one to start with and his name is Pedigree and parents are from Belguim and he is a happy bird with a feral female by the name of Jackie...c.hert


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

ixitellyixi, I wouldn't move them around right now. I'd just leave them where they are. I think locking them up will only stress her. I always put a dish of seed in the box of parents with babies. Makes it easier for the parents to feed the young, and also as the babies get older, they will see the parents picking up the seed, and try to mimic them. If your birds have food down for them, then I don't see any reason for them to be attracted to the seed in the nest box. JMO.


----------



## c.hert (Jan 15, 2010)

Jay3: No I would not lock them in either but just in case strange things start to happen with her other birds in regard to this single mom and baby and this is just a recourse for her to take if the other birds are bothering the mom and babies for any reason and she knows to just leave things be as long as there is no problem--just for something for her to think about if the babies get bothered for ixitellyixi does have some strange things happening in her loft and if and only if bad things begin she could either lock up the other birds so that mom and baby are safe or lock up the mom and babies to let them start to experiment and eat seed and drink water---this is just a last recourse if trouble starts down the road for her family...Stuff happens especially in her loft....later we can all figure out for her to get a normal type of loft environment...Just a last recourse for her to know about so that she won't worry too much ...c.hert


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes. Nice to have the option if she needs it.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

Havent been on here but thought I would update:

All is well at the coop. The baby is getting HUGE! Its got mostly white feathers with a few dark ones towards the tail and its head still has some yellow feathers. Its crop is like insanely huge when I check and Momma LW is doing a great job. 

Ill have to get some pics.


----------



## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Thanks for the good news


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

My husband sent me a text this AM and informed me the young pigeon died! 

When I let my horses out last night, I went into the coop just to double check the water (its insanely hot all of a sudden here, like 95 degrees and lots of humidity) and all was well. Baby was now on the floor, eating seed, flapping its wings. Crop was full, baby was bright and noisy. I picked it up and held it, checked it all over... it only had like 3 tiny whispy yellow feathers on its head, the rest was all adult feathers. It was 11pm last night. 

In less than 12 hours, it was dead. I dont know what happened. Hubby thinks it may be the dramatic change in the weather. Im depressed and Im to the point where I need to adopt the pigeons out to new homes. I dont know what we are doing wrong, but its not working. I dont feel like its fair to them and Im so depressed with the baby dying, one male leaving the coop for wild birds, my dogs killing one of my hens last year. This is obviously just not working out.

Other than here, are there any other places to advertise them for free? I do NOT want to go onto craigslist because who knows what those people would do with them. I dont want them to be killed or used for hunting, etc. Id like them to go to a person who loves pigeons and is better at this whole thing than I apparently am.

Im very upset right now. This is why I didnt become a vet... I cant deal with death esp when it comes to animals.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Weather changes every where. The birds don't generally just drop dead. Something had to have happened to her. She could have had something. Do you have any pictures of her that are recent? Instead of just giving up, maybe you just need to come on more often and read the different posts and learn more about them and their care. Most things that happen are preventable. I think you just need time to learn. It is impossible to have any kind of animal and not have to eventually deal with death. Or to care about anything or anyone and not have to deal with it. It is part of living. Any where that you offer your birds for free, there could be unscrupulous people who want them for all the wrong reasons.


----------



## drifter (Oct 7, 2009)

I cannot say or know why your bird died but on a hot day birds need plenty of air circulation. If it's a closed loft all windows need to be open.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

The only recent pic I have is from like over 2 weeks ago. I just dont get it. I know that with life comes death. But obviously birds are a lot more sensitive to things than say a dog or horse. Dogs, cats, horses, fish - I *know* these things and the dos and donts. My husband got the pigeons for training his bird dogs. I took over and got attached and wouldnt let him use the birds for anything. I didnt get them for myself but didnt want to see them shot or used for training purposes. Obviously theres a lot more to birds than just feeding, water, cleaning, worming. With 3 horses, 5 cats, 3 dogs, fish, and 10 hr work days, I just dont have the time to devote to the pigeons that it is obvious that they deserve. Its not fair to them. 

This pic is when it was like a little over a week old. It would be 1 month exactly tomorrow.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I can't tell in the pic, but did he have feathers missing around his face or throat? Also, did he always hold his leg that way? Looks like splayed leg. He doesn't have near enough nesting material. He shouldn't be on the hard wooden surface. He should have had more nesting material under him. The hard surface causes the leg to splay out, and without help, he could have ended up crippled. Just for future info.


----------



## ixitellyixi (May 2, 2009)

No, he had lots more nesting material (I added hay like every 3 days or so). When I went in the day that I took that pic, I saw that the hay had been pushed away and built it up. It was very cushy. He would run around after mom, no problems standing/walking and the legs were straight. No missing feathers. There were like maybe 5 tiny little whispy yellow baby feathers sticking out of the white adult feathers. His whole body was covered in white feathers with splotchy black feathers down the back with a black tail. I even held him the night before he passed and he was flapping the wings, learning how to move them, running around for the seed I was bringing, even sat on my shoulder.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm so sorry he died. I really am. Just thought he must had had canker or something that you didn't know about. I know how hard that must have been.


----------

