# Feeding a 14 day old baby dove



## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, found a baby dove - do frozen garden peas really fit down their little throats?! Or should I use the petit pois? - and if so, how many please. Thanks so much


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

Can you post a photo plse? I would split the peas in half. You can also try the syringe method, plenty of video's on youtube. Just google "how to feed baby pigeons". This will be much easier, a baby dove's beak is just so much smaller than that of a baby pigeon and this will make feeding peas a bit more difficult. If you can feed the peas, go for about 10 (20 halves).


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Great - thanks so much for responding.... I've raised pigeons before on peas, but the dove's throat just looked much smaller! I'll try and get a pic after work this eve. My husband will be on feeding duty today! How often would you feed? Just when the crop empties? Roughly how many hours? Thanks again for your time and reply! 😀


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

I suppose every 5 or 6 hours between feedings will do. I've raised a baby dove that was about the same age as yours. Struggled to get food into him, the peas did not work and he did not want to eat from the syringe. Eventually after him being without food like for a day and a half, I took the beak between my fingers and tilted it upwards, opened it and threw some small seed into the mouth. Then it started begging for food, was starving and I was able to syringe feed him.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks again! You really put my mind at rest! This one actually did the same for this evenings feed and started gaping, so I blended sweet corn and peas and held it in my hand like a first and the bird put it's head through the gap by my thumb and gobbled it down and now has a nice fat crop! (and I'm feeling very relieved!) Think it's a collared dove... It has one foot all curled up and it's not opening those toes on that side... I read that some liquid calcium could help, so put a drop of that in too... Thanks again for all your help... I'm still going to try for that pic later!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Calcium/D3 may help, but does need the D3 to absorb the calcium. He could need B vitamins, as that can also make the toes curl. Can you get some bird vitamins?


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, thanks for that info.... I can get some... Do you recommend any that contain everything? I saw the Johnson bird vitamins that have Ingredients per 100ml:Vitamins A 300,000i.u., D3 11,000 i.u., E 490 i.u., CC (Ascorbic Acid) 480mg, B1 0.3mg, K3 30mg, Niacin 200mg, Floic Acid 4mg, Choline 101mg, Sodium Benzoate and Polysorbate 80. Any good? Thanks again!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That should be fine, but also needs calcium.


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

Try to get a 10 ml syringe, then cut off the tip and put a piece of rubber glove over it fastened with a rubber band. Cut a small X into the rubber, that's where he will stick his beak inside to eat. Will be much less messier than feeding from your fist and you will be able to monitor how much he eats.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Great! Thanks, Jay.... I'll get ordering!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Marina, great advice..... I'll give a go! Such a great site with loads of helpful people! Nothing beats experience!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He will be weaning soon, so getting some seed and having it on hand would be a good idea.


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

Hi, could you post a photo of the foot please? A young bird with curled toes or feet could suffer of a perosis caused by a vitamins deficiency (originated by a poor nutrition): a deficiency of manganese, biotin, folic acid and pantothenic acid (vit. B5 if I'm not wrong). 
It would be helpful to find a vitamins complement having between its constituents also the ones mentioned. 

I know that in some similar situation it could be possible to put a "shoe" on the foot but, of course, I don't know if this is the case of your dove. A photo would be helpful: maybe a member with more experience can give an opinion.

The baby dove I rescued some years ago didn't want to be hand feeded...she was a real rebel 🙂 I prepared small balls (having the size of small peas) not too soft not too hard with baby bird formula and water. I offered them to her from my hands and I put them too in a coffee saucer. She ate them by herself easily and then she learned, step by step, to eat seed. In the next days, as she grows up, you could try the same method.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks again for all the great advice! I'm going to try and upload some pics... Hope it works! When the dove (currently called Chip, Chipster or Chippy!) is dry (before feeding and cleaning!) you can see a black collar around it's neck, although you can't really see it in the photo. I've ordered Calciform and Johnson's bird vitamins (the ones I mentioned earlier) I'll certainly try the shoe thing if people think it's a good idea in this situation - any thoughts welcome! It's feeding well now - thankfully.... I have budgie seed at home that I can add to the pea/corn mix to get it used to that. Thanks again for all help and advice!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He needs vitamins. Lack of vitamin B can paralyze legs and cause toes to curl. He needs complete vitamins in his water. Easy thing to do in case it is vitamin deficiency.


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

She is really lovely!!!

Johnson's bird vitamins don't contain what she needs; something similar to Muta-Vit Oropharma would be better because it contains what I mentioned (manganese, biotin and folic acid) except of pantothenic acid (vit B5): 


Analytical constituents



Nutritional additives 

Vitamin A 3.000.000 IU/kg 

Vitamin D3 220.000 IU/kg 

Vitamin E 20.000 mg/kg 

Vitamin C 13.000 mg/kg 

Vitamin K3 650 mg/kg 

D-pantothenate calcium 2.400 mg/kg 

Vitamin B1 900 mg/kg 

Vitamin B2 3.500 mg/kg 

Vitamin B6 1.300 mg/kg 

Vitamin B12 6 mg/kg 

Niacin 17.500 mg/kg 

Biotin 225 mg/kg 

Folic acid 330 mg/kg 

L-lysine 20.000 mg/kg 

DL-methionine 30.000 mg/kg 

E1 - Iron (iron sulphate monohydrate) 2.500 mg/kg 

E2 - Iodine (calcium iodate, anhydrous) 100 mg/kg 

E4 - Copper (copper (II) sulphate pentahydrate) 500 mg/kg 

E5 - Manganese (manganese sulphate monohydrate) 5.000 mg/kg 

E6 - Zinc (zinc sulphate monohydrate)

Here you can read everything about it:

www.oropharma.com/NUTRI/Nutrition/P...kt=15662&fam=15670&ani=-1&ran=16138&pro=18948 

Legumes like peas and lentils contain vit B5.

I'm glad to hear that she is feeding well.


EDIT: I just learned that D calcium pantothenate is a synthetic substance made from pantothenic acid and sold as vitamin B-5 supplements. So I want to correct what I wrote in the post: the Muta-Vit Oropharma supplement CONTAINS also vit B5. Sorry for the mistake.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Jay and Columbina - really appreciate the time you've taken to help! I'll check out the link! Chip is fed and bedded down for the night! Heard a first little "cheep" this evening when I was feeding her! Really too cute!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

We are all here to help each other 🙂

Yes, baby's "cheep" are so lovely and sweet!

My pigeon Bruna has too a curled foot; I talked about that with my vet but of course, as she is an adult (I think about 2 years old. We rescued her last October: the poor girl had canker and was poisoned by an anticoagulant rat poison. Now she is fine), there's nothing to do. Anyway, walking on it, she has a sort of callus.
If you would like to hear any opinion about a shoe, you could start a specific thread.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Columbina! 😀 Your poor bird!! That's terrible that he was poisoned! I have a rescue mouse that survived poisoning... He's called 'Blue' - awful stuff! So glad yours is OK now and living a life of luxury, I'm sure! 😉 - Good idea about the shoe and starting a new thread. Thanks again for all the support! Chip is eating well and slowly putting on weight!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

Poor Blue, I'm so glad to hear that he survived poisoning 😊 

I agree, poison is really terrible...the poor animals who eat it die in a horrible way...to save Bruna (you can see her in the picture) I had to do two courses of vit K1, put a cream for hematoma, etc...

Anyway, I'm so happy to hear that Chip is eating well and slowly putting on weight 😊 !!! It's a great news!

I hope that someone can give you an opinion about the shoe and some help. 

Have you found a complete vitamin supplement containing what I mentioned earlier? 
For curled toes/feet here, as alternative to Muta-Vit, is suggested Océmue Virbac (it's a french product). It's not a complete vitamins supplement like Muta-Vit but it contains acétyl méthonine, lysine, arginine, vitamin B, choline, bétaïne, iodure de potassium, biotin, folic acid, vitamins B12, B2, B3, B5, B6 (so also vit B5 pantothenic acid).

I guess that also all your animals are living a luxury life 😀!!!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, Yes, they certainly do... Their food bill is higher than mine! Bruna is so sweet! He seems to manage ok on his foot... Lucky that he was picked up by folk who care!!

The vitamins that I ordered have arrived, so I'll use those until pay day!! 

I had to give Chip a little wash today as he was getting a bit 'pea caked' despite washing after feeds - think he quite liked it! I mixed budgie seed in with his food too, so hope that helps to get him used to it!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

You could put a large mix of seed in a bowl and leave it always available. 
To encourage her to look inside the bowl and gradually start pecking at seed you could tap your finger inside it imitating the sound of a bird who is picking up seed.

I use to buy a mixture for canaries containing dehydrated fruits (you can see it in the picture with Aurora and Hastings when were babies): all my pigeons and my doves really love it 😍. 
As birds are attracted by colors (at least, I can say that about mine 😊 ) this mixture could pick Chip's curiosity and stimulate her to start pecking!

Thanks from Bruna! Yes, she is really sweet and friendly 😊.
Even if disabled she has a good life. Of course, she has some difficulties (she can't perch; sometimes she falls over; she limps; she has some problems in flying and landing; she can't scratch; etc.) but she has learned to live with her disability. Unfortunately, as she is an adult, there's nothing to do, it's too late.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, Chip's certainly been keeping me busy! I tried the pecking thing and she just looked at me as though I was daft! 😁 Then a little while later when she was sitting on me, she started to peck at my jumper so I sprinkled a few seeds on it and she picked them up and ate them. I've since left some in her cage, but haven't spotted her pecking yet! The colourful dried fruit sounds like a good plan!

Your birds are SO sweet! How many do you have? Nothing better than chilling out on a shelf! 

I got some critical care for Chip to give her a boost. She's not very heavy at all and seems to get a build up of gas in her crop and neck... Guess it could be a ruptured air sac or something... I followed advice from another thread and gently massaged it and it goes away if I do that. 

This is a great forum for putting your mind at ease and offering good practical advice! - great support!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

A good dove mix would be a good choice to feed her. You can add lentils and a small amount of safflower seed to it to make it better. It will have more of what doves need.
Can you post some pics of her now?


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Jay, I'll do that... I have lentils, but not safflower seeds, so will try and source some! I'll get some more pics as soon as I clear my phone (internal storage full.... Again!)


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

I'm sorry to hear about the air in Chip's crop and neck.
I don't have any personal experience in it but, about what I read, it could be, as you said, a ruptured air sac.
I read that in this situation the skin is stretched to the point of being slightly transparent: did it look like that? 
Massaging it the air goes away: has it appeared again after that?
Could you please give more details and when you clear your phone post a photo? Maybe we can understand what is wrong (there are other situations like air in the crop just for example) and give some help.

To offer a larger variety of seed I use to buy pigeon/dove mixtures from different brands and mix them each other. I add mung beans, peas and small lentils (as I wrote earlier peas and lentils contain vit B5 which is helpful for her curled foot). I buy also a mix enriched with vitamins and minerals.

Thanks from Aurora and Hastings! Yes, they are both really really sweet, especially Aurora. She follows me everywhere, she flies on my head and shoulders, she sits on my legs or knees when I'm watching tv or reading, etc 😊

Well, I have some birds 😀, all disabled/rescued or "babies" looking for a family.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, thanks for the comments... Still pictureless at the mo!...😐 Big improvement in Chip though after the Critical Care! Could do with a scoop or two myself!! After a couple of hours of having some, she was gaping for food! She ate lots of peas very happily (all with me feeding them to her) - I left seed out for her in her cage too and yesterday she started to pick at a bit... Came to feed her this morning and she scorned my peas and had a crop full of seed!! And has been going strong all day! I gave her some grit and she's got water and doesn't need me in her life anymore!! She looked at me as though to say, "I'm independent now, thanks!" 😂 I'm going to work on her foot now though! She's gaining weight too which is really good. Her crop doesn't seem to have filled with air so much since she's been eating the seed, but I'm keeping an eye on it!

There's nothing like chilling out with birds!! (even when they poop on your head too!) 😁 what's not to like?!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Glad she is doing better. I think the air in the crop was from being fed. Shouldn't have to worry about it now. Just keep an eye to be sure she is eating enough. When they first wean, they often need to be fed, maybe just one feeding at the end of the day.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks Jay! Really hope so! She does seem to get out of breath a bit after exertion... Not that she did a lot, but has been moving about more since the critical care! I did give her some more peas to top up this evening... Just 15 petit pois. She has since refilled on seed! - she's really going for it! 😁


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hmmm, changed her mind this morning and decided that seed was too much like hard work! Had to pea feed again... She's been pecking at the seeds a bit since the peas.... Just when I was ready to breath a sigh of relief... (knowing that she was filling up pretty much on her own!) hey ho!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Latest pic!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

She is really really beautiful and lovely! Thanks for the photo!

I'm glad to hear she is gaining weight 😊. 

So it's still too early to become independent 😂, better being feeded by mum 😜. Seriously, don't worry, she will gradually become totally independent.

As her crop doesn't seem to have filled with air so much since she's been eating seed, I think too that probably it was a situation of air in the crop (aerophagia if I'm not wrong): air entering in crop while feeding. Anyway, just to be safe keep an eye on it (especially because you still have to feed her) and keep us updated!

Probably she gets out of breath a bit after exertion because she is not accustomed to exercise/movement as she is still so young.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Very cute bird!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Columbina, - really appreciate your comments! I Googled the aerophagia, and it makes sense, especially as she was gaping so much for the peas! She's hardly eating any seed herself now after her initial spurt and I'm having to feed her lots again...she's not eager for the peas either... Thanks for the reassurance though that she'll get there in the end! I think it's that awkward stage where 'mums are embarrassing, but you still need them!' 

She loves listening to the birds outside! Clearly more meaningful than me attempting bird noises! I'm still offering her the critical care and she has a few sips throughout the day.

I'm leaving seed out for her but she preferred to sleep in it than eat it at the mo! 

I'll keep you posted as to how she's doing! Thanks again!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, cwebster! She's a little sweetheart!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

How is she doing?

Each baby learns to eat and becomes independent at a different moment (Hastings learned to eat seed earlier than his sister Aurora and even when self-sufficient he continued to ask for baby bird formula and to look for it between my fingers for a period...) but, as she has this air issue, I understand your concern about feeding her a lots again. 

Have you noticed if she has a favorite kind of seed? If so, you could increase the amount of it or leave her available a bowl filled with it: maybe that could stimulate her to restart pecking successfully at it and then - hopefully - to other seed. 

Have you tried the mixture enriched with fruits?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

By this age he should be weaned. If you clean up the seeds in his area there, as he shouldn't be eating that anyway as it gets dirty. Put the seed in a small crock. That way you can actually see what he is eating. And don't feed him in the morning. Let him be hungry. That is the only way he is going to learn to feed himself. If he hasn't tried by later in the day, then feed him some. He won't let himself starve, as he knows how to eat the seed on his own. But if you keep feeding him and he isn't hungry, then he has no reason to do it himself.


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

In my previous posts I forgot to say that you could give to Chip probiotics.
Just to get you an idea: Oropharma Proby-Zime.
It contains probiotics (the good bacteria which are present in intestine and crop) and digestive enzymes. Here is the link:

http://www.oropharma.com/NUTRI/Nutr...kt=15664&fam=15670&ani=-1&ran=16138&pro=18972

Twice a week I use to give to all my birds water with apple cider vinegar (I follow the dosage suggested by an Italian vet: 10 ml to 1 litre of water). ACV acidifies the contents in crop and discourages the multiplication of some bad bacteria; helps with digestion; etc. You could give it too.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, Columbina and Jay , thanks for your posts! Chip is doing ok still! She likes hemp seeds which I've been adding to her budgie seed mix and tried not feeding her for a day as suggested (that was hard!) I ended up feeding her once mid morning as she really hadn't tried anything, but by evening her weight was 126g which was 1 gram up from before. I tried again today and by mid morning she hadn't eaten again and had dropped to 124g, so I fed her one lot of peas and will see how she goes from there! I think I worry more as she's not very heavy at all and don't want to compromise on her weight, however, you're right in that if I don't give the the opportunity to feed, then she'll not bother trying!

Thanks for the probiotics link... I'll have a look at that. She doesn't seem to have the air issue any more, even when I feed her peas... I think it's because she isn't gaping at all!

Ill try and get some more pics for you! She's very sweet and is very happy to make a fluttery dash from my hands into the room now! 😁


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Feeding peas would not cause air in the crop. Can you peck at the seed with your finger, like a bird, to encourage her? You need to wait longer to feed her to give her time to be hungry and eat on her own. But you need to show her and encourage her. She also needs to be encouraged to drink on her own. Gently dip beak in water, but not over nostrils.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, Jay, she used to gape like mad for peas, but not any more. What's a good weight for a dove of her age? Yes, I do encourage the pecking and she will peck at seed and will also drink by herself (I used to dip her beak in the water) I tried her with bigger seed (no mess) today and she's eaten some of that... I'll weigh her again in a couple of hours.... 😀


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Chip - having a change of scenery! 😀


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You just need to not feed him till the end of the day. Let him be hungry and he will start eating on his own.
He's adorable.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thank you! 😁 I'll have to give it a try tomorrow (and try not to feel bad about it!) He actually ate quite a bit of the no mess and just weighed in at 130g! ☺


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Weighing in the morning before he eats is more accurate. Even the parents will stop feeding them to make them eat on their own.


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

Thanks for the photo! She is so lovely and cute 😊!

I'm really glad to know that the air issue is solved. Great news!

Does she still look at you as thinking you are daft when you peck at seed with your finger 😂? 
Seriously, some birds just need more time than others to become totally independent.

Each bird has its own taste so offering a large choice of seed could be helpful.

Try to don't feed her 😁 and keep us updated!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi! Ha ha, yes, Columbina, she really does! - worse still, she just ignores me and I'm left on my own, pecking away! 😂 Well, I've been really good (Thank you both, Jay and Columbina for your advice and encouragement!) and I've not fed any peas... I was just doing a night feed, but Chip has really taken to the no mess seed and so was eating it throughout the day and resented my night peas! I've been weighing her in the morning and this mornings weight was 132g, so she seems to be doing well! She's fluttering all over when she's out of her cage! 😄


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

What is in the no mess seed?
How much is she eating?


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, I tried the deeper dish, but she preferred a flat surface, so I used an old plastic lid (about 5 inches) I refill it a couple of times a day... (some spills out, of course!) I put a mixture of budgie seed, grit and the 'no mess' (which has no husks) it has Red Dari, Naked Oats, White Dari, Chopped Sunflower Hearts, Red Millet, Yellow Millet, Canary Seed, Chopped Peanuts, Pinhead Oatmeal, Nyjer Seed, Hempstead, Suet Pellets and Vegetable Oil.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Please don't mix the grit in with the seed. It should be offered in a separate dish and he will take it as he needs it. He doesn't need the suet pellets or vegetable oil either. Not part of their normal diet, and so much fat. He gets enough fat just in the sunflower and chopped peanuts that you are giving.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Ah, great.... Thanks for the advice - much appreciated!! 😁


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

She really does look like she's on her way to become independent 😊!

Legumes like peas, lentils (my birds just eat the small lentils not the large ones) and mung beans are really important in a balanced diet. You can easily find them at supermarket.

Monitor her poop (in add to weight her, etc) could help you to understand how much she is eating by herself.

Ah ah, I guess that she enjoys herself a lot leaving you on your own, pecking at seed 😂.


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

I forgot to say...as she prefers a flat surface you could try a plastic plant/flower pot saucer. I use the rectangular ones (in add to common cat bowls): I find them practical and my birds like them.


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, Columbina, thanks for that... I got some of the small lentils like you said and the mung beans too. The flower pot saucer idea is brilliant! It really cuts down on the waste as she can't chuck it about as far!! 😁 Thanks for that!!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

I'm glad that I could help 😊.

How is she doing?


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Hi, Chip is doing really well, thanks... Weighing in at 145g at the mo.. 😁


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

So glad to see Chip is doing well!


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

Thanks for the update and for the photo!!

I'm so happy to hear she is doing really well 😊!!!

She is really beautiful 😊!!!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, cwebster and Columbina! 😁 She's really sweet! Doesn't make much noise... Don't know if that's usual for collared doves? I'm really grateful for everyone's support and advice that has got us this far!! 🕊


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

We are all here to help each other 😊.

Well, I can tell you about my personal experience with doves. 
Yes, babies are really sweet, friendly and don't make much noise. 
When become adults, they are still very sweet and friendly (my doves fly on my head, shoulders, etc; sit on my legs; etc. They are also jealous and protective of me! Sometimes Merlino chases away my pigeon Aurora from my shoulders 😀!) but - especially males - love singing (sometimes too much 😂 ) ; call each other; sometimes chat with doves living outdoor...


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thank you! 😀 Yours sound very attached to you! And I love the sound that they make.... Sweet that they chat to the outdoor birds too! Chip is fine out of the cage, but doesn't like me invading her space when she's in it! Both wings go up! But outside, she's happy to hang out with me! Attitude already!! 😂


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Gorgeous bird!


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## Smidge (Sep 14, 2014)

Thanks, cwebster! 😀


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## Colombina (Jan 22, 2017)

Thanks for the photos, she is wonderful!


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