# Help With Pigeon Chick



## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Hi, I posted this elsewhere on this forum but didn't get any assistance, if you could help me, i would be extremely grateful.

I'm pretty new to this website and I have no idea where to post this so I posted this here, because i need help with a baby pigeon. We actually have many breeding pigeons and one pair haven't been feeding their chicks. I have watched them for hours and all they seem to do is sit and incubate the poor thing. I don't have formula on hand and have gone to all the pet shops around me to find formula, but have not found any. I was wondering if crushed up parrot pellets could be a suitable formula for the little guy as that is the only thing I have right now. i really want these chicks to survive, as i can't stand for the poor thing to not have a good chance at life.

Thank you


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

How old is the baby now? What type of handrearing formula were you looking for? The one we use, is a handrearing formula for parrots and parakeets. I don't think you get one specific for baby pigeons. If you can't find the above, you can try a baby cereal that contains no milk products and very little sugar. I've used Pronutro porridge before (don't know if you get it over there). It does contain sugar, but then you can add a drop of apple cider vinegar to it.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You can feel the crops to see if they have been fed. Most pet shops do sell baby bird formula, but if not, then ask Marina has said, a dry baby cereal that doesn't contain milk products will work. Maybe you can feed them and put them back with the parents. Have they hatched babies before?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

The baby is about 1-2 days old. I felt the crop like you suggested and it felt flat.
As for the parents, this is their 3rd pair. The formula I was looking for was one for hand rearing parrots, not pigeons and would the dry cereal work for babies this young? 

I put a picture down below of the Pronutro i found, is it the one you used? I also found this other cereal called Nestle Cerelac with probiotics, I'll post the ingredients of that as well to see which one you guys think is better.


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

Do you have shell grit available to the pair


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Yes I did. I have grit for all of the pigeons in my loft.


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

Do you race?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

No. Why are you asking?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The cerelac is the one I'm familiar with, but I have gotten it without milk products. And they have one with multiple grains in it which would be better than just wheat. Of course the baby bird formula they make for parrots and such would be better as it is balanced for baby birds. What is in the Pro Nutro?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

let me see if i can find a Cerelac that doesn't have milk. Do you think it'll be suitable for a chick this young?

These are the ingredients that are in the Pronutro:


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

I only asked to determine the level of knowledge you have in regards to raising pigeons as you said you had other pairs mated.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Are you sure the parents are healthy? Odd that they wouldn't feed them when they have raised babies before.
I hope you control their breeding. You don't want them over breeding and getting worn out. That's where fake eggs come in handy.


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

do you seperate hens and cocks when you have finished breeding?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

When i say they've had 3 pairs i mean these are the pairs that i've had allowed them to have. What I do is let them have a pair and the next pair of eggs i replace with fake eggs. It goes in a pattern.
This is the only other cerelac that they sold, which was a rice version.
here are the ingredients to that:


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I would probably go with that one. If it contained milk, they would say so. When they say _may_ contain milk or soy, I think that is just because they make the other cereals that do contain those things in the same place.
I would probably go with that one as it doesn't contain sugar. But if you can find one that has more grains, even better.

Don't know what racing has to do with knowledge on raising babies.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

The rice one or the Pronutro?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The ProNutro is the one with sugar. I would use the rice one. As they grow, you can add baby food peas to the formula. I would also add some yogurt, just a bit for a while, to give the probiotics they need. Would also add a bit of bird vitamins. Make it thin at first.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Since the babies are being kept warm by the parents, I would keep them together. Just feed and put them back. Maybe the parents will start feeding them.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Can I use frozen peas that i defrost? Would greek style, natural yogurt work?
I'll definitely keep them together. 

thank you so, so much for helping me


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, but try to get yogurt without the sugar, as long as it has the live bacteria in it. The peas would be better without the skins for now. If they are pureed, they would be better.
Let us know how you are doing.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Ok thanks.

I'll try to update in a few days so you guys know how they're doing. Right now, they're not hungry anymore, as i feed them and seems to be better then before, i put them back with their parents and will be feeding them again in a couple hours. 

One last question, what brand of yogurt do you use, maybe I could find that in a store.

Thank you for all those who helped me, 
I am extremely grateful.

Here is the yogurt I found, with ingredients, let me know if this is suitable:


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

I wouldnt feed it as milk is a no no for pigeons


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Which yogurt would you suggest then? All of the yogurts without a sugar I have looked at has some kind of milk as that is the main ingredient in yogurt. Which one would you recommend?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That's right. Milk is a no no for pigeons. But when they make yogurt, by the time it is through, most of those milk products are gone from it. Don't worry...............it's fine. Besides, you only use very little in the mix.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

When you can, just buy some probiotics and add just a little.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

When do you guys think I should start adding the peas and yogurt to the formula?

Thanks guys I'll be back in a couple days to update on the chicks


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

The Pronutro in the photo is the one I've used before, but only for babies 7 days and older. Never for babies that young. I hope they survive.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

I guess not many people raise chicks this young


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I have, but I used the KayTee Exact. But if you can't get it, then you need to use the cereal. Remember to get the vitamins. Don't over do with them. But they do need some. It's really easier if you can find a baby bird formula. Everything is in it that they need.
Add the yogurt right away, as they need the probiotics in their gut. Just a small amount.
Some people give the first feeding just greek yogurt.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Marina B said:


> The Pronutro in the photo is the one I've used before, but only for babies 7 days and older. Never for babies that young. I hope they survive.


The ProNutro would probably be just as good. It's just that I am more familiar with the other. Either would work.


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

I only wish to be honest , i think if they survive at this age it will be 100 /1 also remember if the young have something seriously wrong with their health the parents will know and may let them go naturally. I do wish you the best of luck with this one.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I raised 2 from a day old and 2 days old. They are still fine today. There is a very good chance they will make it.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I should have added that we have a member that raised 6 babies from hatch.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

That's nice knowing that they have a chance at a good life, I'll be sure to get bird vitamins for sure.
What type of vitamins should I get?

Thanks guys!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Just something liquid for birds. Make sure they get calcium/D3 also. And this is the easiest and most natural way to feed. It is most like how they are fed by the parents.

http://urbanwildlifesociety.org/WLR/BabyPij&DuvFeedg.htm


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Some videos to show you how

Hand-feeding 11-day old baby dove video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1aPHzKZaQE&t=4s

feeding a baby mourning dove
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1s5ZY3U2lKU&t=22s


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Hi,

I went around to different pet shops to find the bird vitamins and there wasn't any vitamins for baby bird growth, with calcium or D3. All there was Aviary cleaning products, worming products, Insect products, water cleansers, and moulting aid, what should I do?

P.S thanks for the videos on how to feed them


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

Have you searched online for baby bird formula or even for breeders of parakeets and parrots? Breeders will be able to tell you where you can get hold of formula.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Yes i have searched online for bird formula and there is some but they dont come through shipping until a week later and i cant afford to wait a week. I have also just then searched for breeders and there isnt one close. I think the closest one is around 1 hour away


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't matter how far they are away. They can tell you what they use and where they get it.
As far as the vitamins, they aren't for baby bird growth. Just bird vitamins. I'm sure it is around there somewhere. Also, calcium/D3 that you put in the water is out there too. You can, if you have to, either grind up into powder, boiled egg shells or cuddle bone and mix some powder into the food.
Edit: although they would still need the D3, or sunshine.


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

Not sure where you are in Australia, if you call Inca Flight 0298331728 they are at 22/23 Forthorn Place, Nth St. Marys this is where racing pigeon flyers get medication for their birds. They will advise where the outlets near you to get the products you need. This is why i asked whether you raced.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Hi Jen, how's it going?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

So they are doing fine, just need the vitamins. I have found a bird multivitamin, but it's powder, but i guess i can mix it in. I'll list the vitamins in it in a picture down below:


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Do the directions tell you how to mix it and how much?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Have you fed them and put them back with the parents? How are the parent birds responding?
The adult birds you have should all be getting bird vitamins and an extra calcium/D3 supplement if you want healthy birds and babies.. They pass this on to the babies when they feed. 
Do they have a flight pen where they can get outside for fresh air and sunshine? Parent birds should not be let out to fly. If you lose one to a hawk or something else, the babies will suffer.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

I have fed them and put them back, the parents don't seem to be too affected by this, they just continue to keep them warm no matter what. I do have vitamins for the adult birds, but they aren't liquid, they are kinda seed shaped and the birds seem to finish all of them in their feed when i come to replace it the next feeding. As for the parent birds, I don't let them fly out, There is a place where the can get sunshine and fresh air, as well as a bath. The vitamins just tell me how to mix it, not how much, I think it just depends on the age of the bird, in this case i think only a little bit would be good. What do you think?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't depend on the age of the bird. There is usually directions on how much, in how much water.

What is it that you give the adult birds?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Something called multivit, it can come in a powder or the seed like shape
It says it Can be used during growing moulting and breeding


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

So i contacted a breeder and they suggested a vitamin that could be found at a pet shop around 40min - 45 min away from me, I'm gonna go pick it up now, I'll show you a pic of the vitamin I'm getting, it's something called Vetafarm Probotic Bird Microbs, it says " Aids in the establishment of gastrointestinal microflora in hand reared baby birds and day old chicks."


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That is a probiotic. That will be used instead of the yogurt. It puts good bacteria in their gut that they need. But it still isn't bird vitamins.
It helps with digestion and keeping the bad bacterias away. Very important.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

ok so the place had loads of vitamins, i don't think there's the one we need though, I'll show you all of the vitamins they stock. I also bought the calcium supplement.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Here are more of them:


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

as i said in a previous post INCA FLIGHT make all suppliments for pigeons specific hope this helps


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

I live in WA


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

That doesn't matter they are Australia wide and as i said they make pigeon only tonics and all associated medication. Also glad to hear they are doing better,good luck


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Ok thanks I'll give them a call


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The Vetafarm essential vitamins would be okay I think. Must have all the vitamins in it. I do like a calcium/D3 supplement too. Make sure that the vitamin you get has the different vitamins including D3 and also calcium. Or also get the calcium/D3 supplement.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Here is the description for the one you picked:


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't list the vitamins?
I would get that and a calcium/D3.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Ok I'll be sure to do that, I've searched all over the internet, even the official vetafarm website and it doesn't list the vitamins


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

Active Ingredients: Vitamin A, D3, E, K, B12, Biotin, Nicotinamide, Potassium Iodine, Thiamine, Riboflavin, Panothenic Acid, Lysine, Pyridoxine, Methionine, Choline Bitartrate, Folic Acid, Zinc, Manganese, Copper, Cobalt.




Vetafarm Multivet Liquid with Moulting Aid for Birds for Bird : Buy ...



https://www.vetsupply.com.au/dietary-and-nutrition/vetafarm-multivet.../p2089.aspx


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Wow thanks, you're obviously a better researcher than me


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## Sydneylofts1* (Dec 11, 2017)

Jen, this is probably not exactly what i would use, however it will certainly help as it does have a good aray of vitamins.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

What would you recommend then?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If you are feeding them, then you just need to get a bird vitamin. It's important that they get the vitamins now. Would actually be better if you order the baby bird formula now and used the cereal and vitamins till you get the formula.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

I already have the vitamins and have been using it for the past few days. I'm just asking if there is better vitamins which I could purchase and use, but I have already have the vitamins in the formula. I also have ordered the hand rearing formula, it's coming in about a week/week and a half's time


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Good job. How are they doing?


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

They're both great, they've grown a little and both seem to be getting the hang of the feeding process, which is always a plus. The older chick kinda, squeaks when he's hungry, but very quietly, it's adorable. Also I don't put their whole beak into the syringe as I am scared that it'll go into their nostrils, but they still eat. Is this ok or do I have to put their whole beak in. If i do put their whole beak in and the formula does go in their nose is this dangerous? Also how much to feed them, right now i feed them till their crops are kinda full, I would just like correct amounts of food I have to feed them.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Just let them put their own beak in and stop occasionally to let them take a breath. Here is some info on amounts.

Cut off syringe method

From another thread:

HOW MUCH TO FEED
Cynthia Roberts


Cut the tip off a feeding syringe.
The syringe size varies with the age of the pigeon.
Start with a 5ml syringe.
Feed 1cc of very thin formula (eg Kaytee Exact) using 1 part formula to 5 parts water.
Feed 1cc every 2 hours at days 1 - 2
3cc every 3 hours for days 3-4
10-11cc every 5 hours days 5-7, thickening the formula every time.
By day 20 they should be taking 30-40 ml 3 times a day from a 60ml syringe.
Quantities are guidelines only. Crop sizes vary so feed carefully stopping to let the pigeon breathe and to check how [full the crop is.]

Cushiony crop
After feeding, the crop should feel soft and cushiony.
Do not overfeed or crop will stretch and sag forming a fold that traps food in it.
__________________


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

Thanks for the amounts and advice.

Are there any photos of full chicks, empty chicks and overfed chicks?


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

You can check this website: www.pigeonrescue.co.uk Scroll down to "Caring for baby pigeon". Lots of helpful advice.


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## jenlikespigeons (Jan 8, 2018)

I just found out today that the parents are now feeding the chicks! I came out this morning to give them their breakfast and to my surprise the chicks were already full. I sat and watched close-by just to make sure that it wasn't sour crop and saw the parents feeding them!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That is wonderful news. Now just keep an eye on them to make sure the parents continue.


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