# found pigeon



## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Hey, so less than an hour ago I pulled into the parking lot of McDonalds and saw a pigeon sitting on the table, he then flew into the brick wall (not with significant force) just to fall back down. I immediately parked my car and ran out, hoping to find that the pigeon was fine and had already flown away. Unfortunately he was still aimlessly flying into the wall and then falling back down. It seems as though he could not fly away as I was able to pick him up with little effort. I decided to run into McDonalds and grab a box where the pigeon is now situated in my laundry room. I work at a vet clinic and will be bringing him in on Saturday when I go home (I'm living with my bf up north for school and go home every weekend). We were able to save a baby pigeon at the clinic last year that we tube fed until he was able to eat seed and come home with me where i thought i could let him go in my backyard and he would leave. That is not the case though, he is still at the window waiting to say hello every morning and is actually quite tame (with me), but hates the rest of my family. In other words, he thinks I am still his mother and is very territorial with everyone else. I am hoping to rescue this pigeon and bring him home but because I know that the pigeon i have at home is a very territorial male, and i think the one i just found is also male, i am not sure if they will get along. Is it possible to keep this new one as a caged pet, or is that cruel. I do not know what is better, and am not sure what his injuries are yet. I am trying to give him a couple hours to come down before i start poking and prodding at him. I am also scared that if i do let him go at my house he will fly away and not be able to survive as he will be lost and unprepaired for winter. He is used to living in town and i live in the country. PLEASE let me know what you think i should do. Thanks so much!


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*Thank you for helping this bird.

First things first, let's try to save him. 

Follow these guidelines to get the bird stabilized and then we will try to help figure out what is wrong with him:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f108/basic-steps-to-saving-the-life-of-a-pigeon-or-dove-8822.html 

Here is alink to caring for a sick or/and injured pigeon:

http://www.pigeonrescue.co.uk/sickinjuredpigeons.htm *


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Thanks for the quick reply! I don't think he is a youngster, he is definately full grown but not sure of his age other than that. He is inside a big box, with a smaller box for him to hide in because i know they are comforted by that, and he will not come out. Should i take him out and guide him to the water or just leave him for a few hours, he is definately alert and does not seem dehydrated after reading that link.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

How about posting a picture? Most people think young pigeons are adults because they are then size of an adult.
Young pigeons have dark eyes and their beaks look too big. If you do have a young pigeon, the pigeon may not have learned to eat on his/her own and you will need to hand feed. It's really easy to do.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Gahh, I think you are right. It all kinda dawned on me when you said that, because he does not coo yet, my pigeon that i have at home did not start making "pigeon noises" until later on, he also went from dark eyes to orange, whereas the pigeon i found today has dark almost black eyes. I cannot get close enough to hand feed him, he is petrified, i am familiar with syringe feeding but not with hand feeding seeds. I will post a picture when i figure this out, new to this site.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=25546&stc=1&d=1350514970


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

sorry picture is bigger than what i thought!


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Pretty baby. Here are some hand feeding instructions for a youngster this size.


You can hand feed defrosted peas. Run some hot water over them until they are defrosted and slightly warmed. Put the bird on your lap and hold it next to your body. I f it helps, you can wrap a towel around it or put it in the sleeve of a tee shirt, with the head out the wrist. That confines them without hurting them and makes it easier to handle. With babies that have been hand raised, this won't be necessary. Gently open the beak and pop the piece peas at the back of the mouth and over the throat. You will need to feed 30-50 per feeding and *every time the bird’s crop empties* until you know it is eating on their own. 
This is a wonderful method for teaching babies to eat because they feel the whole food in their mouth and it’s soft and easy to pick up and hang on to. The next step… seeds. 
The crop is located right below the throat and with food it fills up like a little balloon. The peas make it lumpy and squishy.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Your box will last longer if you add newspaper to the bottom and maybe a towel on one side, I cover my towels with paper towels, and change the paper towel when soiled.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

That was just the first box, He is now in a giant box filled with newspaper and a little hut for him. I havnt felt his crop yet because i have just been to scared to handle him to much for fear of terrifying him. He seems extremely tired too. I am actually quite familiar with pigeons as i raised one who was only a few weeks old. He amazingly started eating seeds on his own. Do i have to worry about where i put the pea though, can i choke him..i know when we were tube feeding the last pigeon the "mush" we had to actually insert the tube down his throat because with syringes there was always the fear of choking.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

how many feedings of peas per day, 2 or 3?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Feed every time the pigeon's crop empties. The crop is located at the bottom of the throat and above the keel bone which is the bone in the front, center of the pigeon. When it's full, it will fill up like a little balloon and feel lumpy with the peas. After it has processed the peas, it will feel flat.
It could be 3 -5 feedings a day. They usually catch on quickly and so you probably won't need to feed for long.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

What a beautiful pigeon. I am glad you found him/her. It's a young one, wide beak and no cere. As Charis said, paper towel it's better than newspaper. At this age from lack of Calcium they can easly splay their legs.

Looks like a breed pigeon. Does it have a ring on the leg?


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

What is a cere? Sorry i've raised one pigeon but he pretty much came with an instruction manual from my vet lol. I'm also not sure what splay means. 

And no he is definately wild, since i moved up north last month i've been in awe with all the beautiful pigeons up here. And then low and behold, one finds me. I'm thinking he fell of the roof of mcdonalds, and his continuous flying into the wall was his attempt to get back up. He can fly about two feet, and then he falls back down.

Very timid though, do you think he'll warm up to me?


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Cere is the white stuff growing and covering the base of the upper beak.
Splayed leg is when the pigeon slips ( because the floor is slippery) and spreads the legs and the joints usually at the hip do not function so the pigeon won't be able to stand up and walk ( just like when you are skating); this can be corrected if it's caught on time.

His family may be roosting at McDonalds. You can go and check; if that's his home then that's where you want to release him. If he stays with you longer than you will need to do soft release, otherwise he won't be able to survive on his own. If he stays with you, of course he will not be shy anymore. Each pigeon has it's own personality and pigeon has to be allowed in his own terms when and how he wants to be friendly with you. Some pigeons slap you.LOL that means they trust you enough to dare to fight with a giant and also means that they are comfortable with their place and that it's their territory. If you feed his deforested peas most likely your pigeon will eat from your hands and come on your shoulder in a few month. They are great pets..But once he becomes a pet you cannot release him..he doesn't know to be wild: how to protect himself from predators, how to find food or that he has to be part of a flock.

When he land after flying, is he falling as a rock, is he doing some landing. Make sure he doesn't land on slippery floor ( remember splaying legs) since he is young without skills to land or good muscle developed yet. 

I like your pigeon. Looks like one of mines so i feel attached somehow to yours.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Thank you! I absolutely love him too, he's beautiful and would love to keep him as a pet but I am worried it will be cruel. I was quite surprised with his lack of landing skills, i let him land on the bed and he lands like a rock as you described, no soft landing at all. The last pigeon i saved was very good at learning how to fly and this one does not seem as good.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

It would not be cruel to keep him as a companion.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

even if he's stuck in a cage, do i have to get his wings clipped then? The last one i saved is free in my backyard, and i go outside and call his name and he comes to see me. I dont think this one would do the same, and i dont think they would get along.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

dtwitch said:


> even if he's stuck in a cage, do i have to get his wings clipped then? The last one i saved is free in my backyard, and i go outside and call his name and he comes to see me. I dont think this one would do the same, and i dont think they would get along.


IMO you should never clip a birds wings. they are its only means of defense against predators, if they cant escape they are lunch.
He is a youngster who obviously hasnt mastered flight yet, possibly left the nest too early and cant get back (as do a lot of birds in high places where the nest has no safety barrier).


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

i realize birds need to have the ability to fly if they are outside, i was only asking about clipping his wings if i kept him as an INDOOR bird. The other pigeon i have lives outside, and i would never, nor have any reason to clip them.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

even indoors a bird has dangers - you.
I dont mean that nastilly, but a bird needs outtime from a cage, if its out (and wings clipped) it cant fly, as they are explorative birds and love to get into any nooks & crannies its surprisingly easy for them to get under your feet, if they cant get away by flying, they are more liable to be seruiously injured.
I have 4 indoor feral rescues (one cannot fly) and even being aware of them theres been several near misses.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

ahhh, i see. That makes sense, i have never had a pet bird (other than my outdoor pigeon). I am still trying to decide what is best for him but i think only time will tell. Do they poop a lot in the house when you let them out of their cages?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Many buy these.

http://www.birdwearonline.com/


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

OMG that is awesome! thanks sooo much!


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

dtwitch said:


> OMG that is awesome! thanks sooo much!


Yes, OMG..but personally i am not for leash. If it's a healthy pigeon and you spend time for soft release, then he should belong the his flock. There's ways that you can really help disabled pigeons, broken wing, PMV etc..which you can adopt or even rescue in the future; these ones cannot be released.

Pigeons make great pets, don't get me wrong. I have one who follows me everywhere and calls me constantly until i give her my fingers ( she puts her beak between my fingers and she " eats" air). I really feel sorry for her, she woundn't mate with any other male...She's my puppy; i can take her in my arms and pet her just as you would pet a dog.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Well i think it will depend on how comfortable he gets with me in the time that it takes him to learn to fly. If he is too comfortable with humans than i have to keep him, if not i will try and release him though i will be terribly attached. What is soft release and how would i do it?


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Here's my post today on another thread today about soft release:

_You cannot release a pigeon who cannot fully fly. You will have to make sure is exercising his flying ( if he's in the cage, i hope you allow him out of cage 1 hr a day).
When you decide to release him you don't just release him in the flock..as you said you want to make sure he survives. For that he has to join the flock. So raising his interest into being part of a flock is to bring him to the flock for 30 min ( the longer the better ) everyday if possible for at least 2 weeks. you do not tie him, You just get a small wire cage and put the cage on the floor where the flock is and so you feed the pigeons. He will notice their behavior when feeding; he will take interest to want to be with them ( he may get agitated in the cage wanting to come out)...that way after 2 weeks or so he is ready to want to be part of the flock and stay with the flock._
_Chances of him surviving if he's part of the flock are very high. A single bird will die of starvation, sickness which come with stress or most likely attacked by a predator_


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

i dont know where his flock is, there are pigeons everywhere in this town and i dont think i could go to the busy mcdonalds parking lot everyday for an hour with a caged pigeon without getting sent to the psyc hosp. no offense, its just sounds a little impossible with where i found him


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

dtwitch said:


> i dont know where his flock is, there are pigeons everywhere in this town and i dont think i could go to the busy mcdonalds parking lot everyday for an hour with a caged pigeon without getting sent to the psyc hosp. no offense, its just sounds a little impossible with where i found him


i bet you that's where his flock is: McDonalds, because that's where the food is. I heard people that put a sign on the cage " soft release"...you can also enjoy a Mc Donalds sandwich every day. LOL i am joking. Wherever makes you comfortable as long theer is a flock. 
If you live in a house you can always attract ferals by putting seeds everyday since you say theer are pigeons everywhere.
I had a flock of 7 pigeons coming every day at the same time once they discovered my big plate with corn seeds.First was one then 2 and then more.

I know it's always a problem with what we think people may perceive of us ( the crazy pigeon people)


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

I think i should let him go, does he have a chance if i dont do the soft release, i have only had him for 5 days. He is not eating, nor is he showing any signs of warming up to me. I do not have the time to do the slow release and am afraid he is going to die of stress if i keep him.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

If he is not eating and you release him, he will die for sure. At least you should hget him going with eating. What a sad story that you haven't been able to feed him. Are you just watching him dying. He could have died anyway at McDonalds. What is the purpose of taking him , if not helping him. I am sorry i may sound harsh, but thi sis the truth.
You don't need to do any soft release for now. Why is this a problem to you when the pigeon is not eating? Eating should be the first concern:

_Here are some prewritten feeding instruction...

You can hand feed defrosted peas. Run some hot water over them until they are defrosted and slightly warmed. Put the bird on your lap and hold it next to your body. If it helps because you are having a hard time handling the pigeon, you can wrap a towel around it or put it in the sleeve of a tee shirt, with the head out the wrist. This method confines the pigeon without hurting him and makes it easier to handle. Gently open the beak and pop a pea at the back of the mouth and over the throat. It gets easier and faster, with practice, for both you and the bird.
You will need to feed 30-50 per feeding [depending on the size of the pigeon] and every time the crop empties until you know the baby is eating on his own. After a couple of feedings, most squeakers get the hang of it, pick up the peas on their own and naturally transition into a seed diet.
This is a wonderful method for teaching babies to eat because they feel the whole food in their mouth and it’s soft and easy to pick up and hang on to. 
The crop is located right below the throat and with food it fills up like a little balloon. The peas make the crop feel lumpy and squishy_

Thank you. We are here not only to help you, but the poor squab also. His life is in your hands.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

I am feeding him soft peas, i have been doing it daily. I wouldnt just let something starve to death, if i was that cruel why would i have saved him in the first place. He pecks at the floor but wont eat the seeds i put down. I feel like he just doesnt trust the food i give him. I have been told he will not get used to me if i have to continue to hand feed him with the peas. I would love to keep him but am scared he will just never get used to me. He is in the front entrance today as i thought the sun would be good for him and dont feel like cleaning all the bedding in the bedroom again as thats where i let him be free yesterday. He has sat on the window ledge staring out the window ALL day, has not even looked at the seeds on the ground though he saw me put them there. I am just afraid he will never trust me, or the food i give him.


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## tjc1 (Aug 22, 2012)

It sounds like you have really been taking care of this pigeon. Maybe he is just full and that is why he is not eating the seed. I mean if you are stuffing peas into him maybe he is not hungry enough to fight through his being scared when you put the seeds down. Have you tried not hand feeding the peas for a day and see if he eats the seeds then. Is he drinking?


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

dtwitch said:


> I am feeding him soft peas, i have been doing it daily. I wouldnt just let something starve to death, if i was that cruel why would i have saved him in the first place. He pecks at the floor but wont eat the seeds i put down. I feel like he just doesnt trust the food i give him. I have been told he will not get used to me if i have to continue to hand feed him with the peas. I would love to keep him but am scared he will just never get used to me. He is in the front entrance today as i thought the sun would be good for him and dont feel like cleaning all the bedding in the bedroom again as thats where i let him be free yesterday. He has sat on the window ledge staring out the window ALL day, has not even looked at the seeds on the ground though he saw me put them there. I am just afraid he will never trust me, or the food i give him.


See, now i love you; you are doing a good job with him. As long as he eats defrosted peas he will not die. I think you can drop in between peas some seeds too. Sprinkle some Oystershells grit, it's about $3, over the peas when you pop in him mouth the seeds. He is probably too young to learn to eat on its own. They watch their parents pecking at the seeds to learn how. No wyou are his parent. When you are around him, make slow motions and talk to him from before you get close. You can teach him to peck at the seeds by tapping with your finger in the bowl of seeds and drinking water; i tought my squabs by using a teaspoon of water and dipping his beak ( don't allow water go over the nostrils). It takes time..if you try a couple of times he will try it, not necessarily the same day. 
You know i have a pigeon that i didn't handraised as you are doing ..i was just fooling around with her by cooing and tapping my fingers on the floor. Now she is more than a pigeon, a puppy...follows me everywhere and crying hours if i am around and do not pay her attention and do not give her my fingers so she can pretend she eats from my hand.
Pigeons have their own timing when they grow attached to you. You have also to trust him and be relaxed. They feel you.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

tjc1 said:


> It sounds like you have really been taking care of this pigeon. Maybe he is just full and that is why he is not eating the seed. I mean if you are stuffing peas into him maybe he is not hungry enough to fight through his being scared when you put the seeds down. Have you tried not hand feeding the peas for a day and see if he eats the seeds then. Is he drinking?


You do not need to hunger him for the whole day. You feed him when his crop is empty anyway. Just entice him to eat seeds when his crop is empty.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

today and yesterday i only did one feed with peas, he is pecking at the seeds i put down and then spitting them out. His crop is completely empty so he is not eating on his own at all. I give him the same seed mix i feed my other pigeon so i dont think its the fact that he doesnt like them. I just dont klnow what to do. Like i said i would LOVE to keep him, but only if he will get used to me, i dont want him to be afraid of me for the rest of his life, that is no way for him to live. I just dont have the time to do a soft release, i am trying so hard to finish my high school so i can go on to university to become a vet and cannot put my studies aside by any means right now. It is too important that i put in my best effort this time. I just want whats best for him, and no longer know what that is.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

The vet that i work for gave him seed when i brought him in. You have to hold him down though and i hate doing it to him. I am because i know i have to but i also know he will never get used to me this way. I came home from school with a big knot in my stomach today as i do not know what to do. I have already found a large parrot cage for him and am going to pick it up this weekend. I am also going to buy a diaper thing for him so i can let him free in the house, but like i said...i would hate to do all this just to find out i am stressing the crap out of this little guy. I am not gonna keep him as a pet for my enjoyment if it is just going to cause a lifetime of stress for him. That is far to selfish. As long as i can be reassured that with time he will warm up to me i will be happy. The other pigeon i have knows nothing other than me, and he is great, he does the same thing Dima's bird does and i absolutely love him. I never used to like birds, but he opened my mind and showed me how great these guys are. For the final time, I would absolutely LOVE to keep him as an indoor bird but am soo scared that i will cause him too much stress.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

dtwitch, all birds are different, have different characters & different ways of interpretating things, a bit like humans lol
This guy is young, and has obviously had some training from his parents so is very wary of you.
with seeds, i suggest just sprinkle a few around in front of him & try pretend pecking with your finger. It will take time, but he will get curious & try, maybe he'll just play with them at first, but eventually he will eat them.
The more you try to force him to do someting he doesnt want, the more he will fear you & stress.
Does he eat peas from the ground ?, try leaving a few peas with the seed, he knows what peas are so may quickly associate the same with seeds if left together.


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## tjc1 (Aug 22, 2012)

We would hold the pigeon instead of holding him down. Its tricky at first but we would grasp the pigeon with one hand and put the food in the other then gently pry his beak open and pop it in. Takes some practice trying to open the beak with your ring finger or middle finger and balance a pea into a open beak. But we found cuddling the pigeon in one hand hand did not show a predator type holding down. The pigeon relaxed after a couple of days of this type of holding. After a couple of weeks of feeding him this way he started to take seeds right out of our hands. Also try not to grasp from above as this is another type of predator grasp. Many animals are afraid of something coming at them from above. Also Dima I didn't say starve him for a day. I said don't feed him peas for a day. Then he might want his seeds instead of the peas. Sounds great that you got a cage for him.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

LOL i didnt mean i literally held him down, i did exactly what you just said. Hold him in one hand and with the holding hand you are still able to "pinch" his beak open with your fingers, then use the other hand to feed the seeds/peas.


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## tjc1 (Aug 22, 2012)

I bet all of a sudden he will fall in love with you. Maybe a treat might work every once in a while to get him on your side. I have not tried peanuts with my guys but I have read the love unsalted peanuts. I was thinking and I have no knowledge on this but maybe somebody with more experience might be able to chime in, All natural peanut butter with some seeds like a little pea size ball would this work if the don't want there seeds like in this case? I figure since they like peanuts so much maybe....... but I wont try if this might be bad for them.


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## dtwitch (Oct 17, 2012)

Thank you soo much for the reassurance, i really am trying to do whats best for him and terribly hope he learns to like me. I will try the peanuts i never knew they like them. Thanks a lot!


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

First he has to lean to eat seeds inorder to eat peanuts; make sure peanuts are unsalty and small size. This is just a treat, not the regular feed since there's lot a fat in penuts. Some pigeons like lettuce, cut it in small pieces, same like kale..you will find out with time what he likes or no. I have a rescued pigeon since 3 weeks ago which was attacked by seagul; i am trying not to have her get used to me, since i want to release her in the springtime untill the the wounds and feathers come up. She knows i am not there to hurt her; now she slaps me when i put my hand in her cage; you know what slapping means? she is comfortable enough to dare to fight with a 50 times bigger " bird" (me); she knows that's her space and that she likes it and it protects it. I gave her bread so in case i release her she could eat anything else but seeds. She love it. She is about 3-4 months old.
As Quazar said pigeons have different caracters. Your might be a stubborn one. That means strong personality. But once he trusts you, he will put all his faith in you.


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## tjc1 (Aug 22, 2012)

This might be a good idea to get your pigeon to eat seed. I saw this earlier and it may work with your pidgey.....................

"Quick Hollywood & Berry update..... we've had a breakthrough! I think this tip might help anyone hand-rearing squabs.....
My feeding tool is a plastic tube about the diameter of my thumb with the tip of a bright pink latex glove stretched over the end and sucked inside to form an open 'bladder'. The bright pink was chosen to simulate the inside of a parents mouth and worked well.
My tip is to take advantage of their colour vision by cutting the wrist part off the same colour gloves and putting it around a food dish - basically creating a much larger version of the feeding 'bladder'. They got the idea straightaway and have gone from totally dependant to feeding themselves in 2 days.... hurrah! And to think I said wood pigeons were a bit thick!!! Cx
PS - both have put on 25g in the last 4 days so I'm very happy."

Check the food dish part it make get yours to be more trust worthy of seed. You never know.


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