# Help!! 2 baby doves abandonned.



## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

A dove made its nest right next to my window a couple of weeks ago, so close that if i opened the window i could reach out and touch it (but since i didnt want to interfere or scare it away, i kept the curtain closed too). in curiosity and excitement though, i still did take the occasional peeks to see how it was doing... i did take a picture of the bird that i am uploading so that someone can tell me what kind it actually is. 

around 3 or 4 days ago, the eggs it had laid had hatched. today, in the evening (before sunset... around 5:30pm) i peeked behind the curtain to see how it was doing to find the dove wasnt there and two chicks were huddled up against each other. i took the opportunity to take a picture of theirs as well. i assumed the mother would be back soon. 

an hour ago (10pm) i took another look to see that the mother still hasnt returned. ive been quite worried and i fear she may be dead cuz its just not possible for her to be gone that long. 

I dont want the chicks to die and i have absolutely no experience in handling birds as well. I really dont know what to do but i dont want to leave them out there on their own either. can someone please help me out??


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

It's very unlikely the babies have been abandoned. At this age, the mom and dad go off and start another nest but come back to feed the young in the first nest. The new nest is usually near by and they do keep an eye on their babies.
You can keep an eye on them too although you may miss dad coming to feed them. If the babies are pooping...they are getting fed.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

Ever since i have been observing them, the mother was always there.... today she was missing since 5pm. the babies were all alone. i know (or the best that i have heard, dont know how true it is) that birds usually return at sunset and settle in for the night...

ive been looking at their nest since around 10pm (sun goes down around 7pm) and till past midnight they were still all alone. i am pretty sure that she has been killed. there are a lot of stray animals around....

i was so worried that i brought the little ones inside, dissolved some sugar in water and fed them through a straw and keeping them warm...if the parents are indeed still around then i have done the worst thing ever by interfering and i should return them immediately. but if i do put them back in the nest, and the parents still dont return and they die, i'll feel horrible. i dont know what i should do....should i put them back and let nature take its course?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I think the parent birds are probably coming back to feed them, and as Charis has said, you probably just missed it. Is their anything in their crop? That is a section on the front of their chest that fills up with food when they are fed. If they are being fed by the parents, then you are interferring with that, and can't raise them near as good as the parents can.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

they do seem fine to me. its only today that i didnt see them. i just got really worried when they didnt appear till half past 12. i was constantly keeping an eye for the past 2 or so hours. is that normal that they dont appear all night?


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

i am going to put them back in their nest. i hope i have not messed up or ruined the course of nature and the parents do return to feed them now.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> i just got really worried when they didnt appear till half past 12.


Does that mean the parents have returned?

If these babies only hatched 3 to 4 days ago, then IMO it is a bit early for the parents to leave them unbrooded, particularly overnight, it would worry me.

If you look at the photo, the squabs are still rump to tail which means they haven't achieved endothermy yet.

Are their eyes open yet?



> i hope i have not messed up or ruined the course of nature and the parents do return to feed them now.


It's OK, the parents won't reject them just because you handled them.

If you van keep an eye on their crops, that is at the front of the breast. If the parents feed them the crop looks nice and cushiony..if they don;t then it will be flat. Also if the parents are not feeding the babies they will quickly become dehydrated.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Maybe you spooked them by checking on them?


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

the larger of the two did open its eyes slightly when we fed it. the smaller one's eyes are still closed.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> Maybe you spooked them by checking on them?


the parents? we keep the curtains drawn so that they are not disturbed. the window by which they made their nest is next to the staircase...The most that they have been spooked is when someone stands there and stares at them. Thats when they run off. They do return after a while though...

But even if they were spooked, wouldnt they return? especially after nightfall?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Unlikely that both parents were killed by something.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

Feefo said:


> Does that mean the parents have returned?


no they havent returned. half past 12 is when i picked them up from the nest. they were being fed till last night...their crop does seem fine to me...

the sun will be up in another hour, im going to put them back in their nest right now and hope that the parents return


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Nest abandonment is very common with these birds. If they feel any threat from predators whether human or animal, they may go elsewhere to nest abandoning both eggs and nestlings. Bird watchers need to exercise caution. 

http://www.wild-bird-watching.com/Doves.html


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

i really do hope the parents show up...i put the two back in the nest. they did look fine and healthy to me, but im a complete novice and i have no idea.
here are two pictures i took of them right after i fed them. 
please tell me if they seem healthy and what i should do if the parents dont return. 
thats my hand in the first image, just to show how small they are...


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

They are tiny. It is hard to tell how well they are at that age, and the crop of the one nearest the camera looks OK, but you had fed them...

Can I ask what you fed them?


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

i just gave them some water mixed with a bit of sugar which i fed them through a straw...i dont know if that was enough or not,i only stopped when i felt they were refusing...
i dont know whats the proper food that they should have, i dont think any of the feeds mentioned in the sticky posts are available here in pakistan...so is there anything around the house that i could temporarily give if sugar solution isnt enough?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well judging by that crop, it looks like they are being fed. But if you keep moving the curtain or taking pictures of them on the nest, they may abandon.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

It is hard to guess what is available to you, I have messaged someone in India as I guess the brands and foods avilable will be similar.

At that age they will need their food very liquid and warmed to their body temperature that is a bit higher than hours.

I think Zupreme Embrace is available in Pakistan...otherwise Polenta? Nestum 5 (Nestle) ? Porridge oats? Or you could soak some puppy biscuits in warm water,liquidise and sieve so it is thin and runny?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Towards the top of this page you will find a Search key, use that to search "Pakistan". That will bring up posts with the word Pakistan in them and will help you identify other members in Pakistan that you can send a private message to. Some of them are breeders and will know what hand raising foods are available.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> Well judging by that crop, it looks like they are being fed.


Jay3, khan89 had just filled their crops when the photo was taken.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

That's so sad,if the babies are abandoned. They should be put back, they will not die one day without food.Then the crop can be checked after one day.Most likely the dove parents are feeding them when they are not watched. Water and sugar does not give proper nutrition. Will boost them up for a while. Lol they become diabetic.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Feefo said:


> Jay3, khan89 had just filled their crops when the photo was taken.


They were given a small bit of water. You don't know that Khan filled them. I agree with Dima. Put them back and leave them alone for a day and then check their crops. Often when someone who doesn't know how interfers, it doesn't end well for the babies.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

thank you everyone for responding  

I did put them back last night and left them there. around 8 or so hours later one of the parents did show up. someone told me that the father dove sits there during the day and leaves around 4pm (which is what happened). thats when the mother is supposed to take over. she didnt come last night. i hope she does today...

but yeah they are being fed by one of the parents at least during the day. Will they be ok if the mommy doesnt show up again? I really hope they will be because i dont want to ruin anything by interfering. 

Thank you all so much for responding and helping me...GOd knows what i would have done otherwise in my ignorance.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

It sounds as if the mother was killed or that something else is keeping her from the nest. It is good to know that they have had a feed.

I don't know whether the father will be able to raise them on their own, keep a close eye on them and on him, if he is not there at his allotted time you might have to act.. 

I have asked the advice of the owners of wildlife rescue centres here in the UK, so I will update them and see what they suggest. Once the babies are older it will be easier for you to raise them if they father abandons them because they are not viable.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

This is from Samantha Bedford (Bedford Wildlife Rescue):

_That's a tough call. 

The father may well carry on if he has easy access to food but I've often found that they do abandon them, or at least one of them, when it becomes too much for them. 

He may well stay with them tonight if he's realised that the female isn't going to return but equally he may just leave :S 

If the finder is sure that they've been fed now then there is at least more time to monitor._

So for the time being it is "watch, wait and see", but providing food and water on the spot for the father might help him. 

What sort of doves are they?


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

i actually have no idea what breed they are...i will try and find out.

how long can they stay without food? as in, how long should i wait and see what happens before intervening assuming that the mother wont return?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If you check them at the end of the day, and their crops are full, then they're probably fine. You could easily have missed other feedings throughout the day. If I knew he was there to feed them at all, I would have to figure that he comes at other times as well.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

If the mother was able to come back, she would be there to relieve the father when he is due to leave the nest. I doubt that she will be coming back, but keep hoping. The question at the moment is whether the father will continue to raise both babies, whether he will concentrate on the strongest only or whether he will just give up.

When he nest leaves the nest, please put some small seed and water close enough to the nest for him to be able to find food and water easily. 

The babies should have opened their eyes now. The eyes are a good indication of health, they should look bright and alert. If they don't then something is wrong and you may have to help the father along a bit. If the father fails to return for a shift, then you may have to help...but the older they are if and when you reach that stage the better chance there is of success.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

At this stage the parents would take shifts to brood the babies constantly. 

The fact that the father sits on the nest during his shift but the mother doesn't take over when it is her turn means that something has happened to the mother and she is unable to return to the nest.

Later on in the development of the babies the parents would leave them during the day and return to feed at intervals. With feral pigeons this happens when they are around 8 - 10 days old.


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## drlain (May 26, 2012)

We found a baby dove on the sidewalk with a broken leg last summer. We bought the forumula you mix with water that you feed baby parrots and other seed eaters. He did great! We would either feed with dropper or put some formula in the hollow of our closed fist and let him stick his head in and eat, he preferred that method. Probably closer to eating out of parents crop. The leg ended up healing well.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> We would either feed with dropper or put some formula in the hollow of our closed fist and let him stick his head in and eat, he preferred that method. Probably closer to eating out of parents crop.


I only found out about that way of feeding a couple of days ago, IMO it is an easy and safe way to feed babies. *this video *demonstrates it (it is in Spanish, but watching is sufficient explanation)

The food she is using is Nestum by Nestle and puppy chow with warm water. Feed a bit at a time so that the baby comes up for air and wipe his nostrils. When he has finished wipe any food on his feathers with warm water or sterile saline (the saline helps for food that has hardened)


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## Priya (Jul 20, 2009)

What a relief atleast the father is around. I really hope nothing has happened to the mother and she returns  Please keep us updated if you spot her.

As per the current situation i presume it would mean you wouldn't be hand feeding them. Incase you have to, you could look out for baby cereals such as Nestum or Cerelac (stage 1). Please get the ones that don't have milk solids in them. I see that the method and quantity have been mentioned by Feefo in the thread. The plastic bag method (video link in the post above) is a splendid idea! Otherwise the common way would be with a syringe.

I do hope the mother comes back and both parents look after the babies. They are adorable  Let us know about the developments. Good luck and God bless for keeping an eye out for them.


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## Priya (Jul 20, 2009)

you could see if this product is available. It has no milk solids and would be ideal:

http://www.nestlebaby.com/sg/baby_nutrition/products/product_detail.htm?pci=0&stage=1&r=293


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

thanks. i currently have porridge oats that i got for them. i dont know whether i should check on them now or not. the mother is not here tonight either and its been 8 hours since the father left. he may have been returning to feed them occasionally, i do not know.

should i try and feed them or just wait and leave it to the father to handle things?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He is probably feeding them. You can't be there constantly watching. She may even be on another nest, as she may have been frightened there. At the very end of the day, check their crops and see if there is any food in them. If so, he is feeding.


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## DeeDee's Mom (Dec 17, 2011)

drlain said:


> We would either feed with dropper or put some formula in the hollow of our closed fist and let him stick his head in and eat, he preferred that method. Probably closer to eating out of parents crop.


He preferred that method, and you were also MUCH less likely to kill him that way. Using a syringe, eyedropper, or anything to put food in there creates a risk that you'll get it in the windpipe, causing them to aspirate, and die within a minute or two. 

It's easy to do, because the windpipe is at one side of the back of the mouth and the esophagus on the other. 

If you put food directly into the windpipe, he's dead, and even down the center of his beak may kill him if he breathes any of it in. 

There are various handfeeding videos on Youtube, and at Kaytee.com (http://www.kaytee.com/pet-birds/general-care/hand-feeding.htm)

Some people get a syringe, cut the end off of it then fasten a stretched finger-cot or balloon over the end.

They cut a small slit in it, and let the bird stick his beak through to get food on his own. Much safer.


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## khan89 (May 26, 2012)

update - i have not given them anything because the two chicks are being fed by one of the parents at least and they are growing bigger day by day. they are outgrowing their nest. i guess everything is fine now  

Thank you everyone who advised and helped us out


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Thank you for the update. It is appreciated as we all wonder what happened when someone comes on with a problem. Thank you for caring enough to want to help them out and do what was best for them. Nice if more people took that kind of interest. Again, thanks.


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