# Long Overdue Greetings & Feather Question



## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

Folks,

Apologies that I have been absent from the forum for a long time. Life has been hectic during the past year, leaving me only the occasional moment to peek in at the site and see some posts. I enjoy contributing as much as reading the posts, and I've not been able to contribute anything lately. Hope that will change soon.

As some of you may recall, I have two wonderful rescues -- Pete (hen) and George (male). George has a paralyzed leg, and mild PMV that shows up once in a blue moon. They are mates, and Pete is wonderful about taking care of her mate and spending time on the ground with him (George can only fly to short heights, about 2-3 feet in the air, for short periods of time). Both birds remain indoors, splitting time between a good-sized cage and a room in my house that I have given them free reign over. 

Recently, George suffered an injury to his good leg. He is recovering slowly, and I am treating his leg twice daily with anti-inflammatory gel.

The main question I have is about George's tail feathers and inner right wing feathers. George's tail feathers never seem to come in fully. Right now, the tail feathers all appear to be chopped off, with ragged edges. Also, when I spread his right wing, he long feathers in the inner third of the wing are missing (his left wing is perfectly fine). I catch George preening hard from time to time -- I assume it's his nerves, but he calms down if I say his name softly. 

As I said, they are kept indoors in a safe environment. Any thoughts as to what could be going on with George's tail and right wing feathers? I can try to post a couple pictures tomorrow morning.

As always, thanks to anyone with thoughts.

Derrick


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

*Pics of George's Feathers*

Here is a pic of George's right wing (top view).


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

Lets hope some one comes along with answers. How much protien do you give?
Dave


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

Dave -- Thanks, look forward to hearing from folks. In terms of protein, I give George a seed mix that is approx. 11% protein, and sunflower seeds. I also give him and his mate some Vitamin D on their seeds once a week.


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

*More Pics*

Here is an underside pic of George's wing, and a pic of his tail feathers.


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

*Additional Info/Thought*

As I mentioned above, George has mild PMV, which was determined through a blood test. The symptoms only show up occasionally, infrequently. His tail feathers have been broken for awhile. I think I read somewhere that new tail feathers cannot grow until the old broken feathers are gone. Could this be the reason for the state of George's tail feathers?


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hey Derrick, it is possible.

I don't think you want to pull out his tail feathers as the stress may induce a PMV attack.

Be sure to give him calcium, B complex and other anti stress vitamins, during times of stress, like molting. I'd give him garlic caps too, it will help with his plumage.

I have a helmet who was a rescue and we had no idea he had PMV, until he had a weird episode where he walked in circles and he fell on his tail constantly. I just re-inforced his nutritional uptake and he was fine in a day.


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

Treesa -- Great to hear from you, and thanks. George recently injured his good leg, which has been stressful on him. He is exhibiting a little of his PMV -- head twisting, loss of balance at times (even beyond his loss of balance from his injury).

I think you may be right that some additional nutrients may help George. What amounts of calcium and B complex do you use? Do the calcium and B complex come from tablets? For anti-stress vitamins, are you talking about supplements like theanine or inositol?

Thanks again Treesa, really appreciate it.


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

Another thought, Treesa, on the tail feathers. George had a rough PMV attack in late 2009. Like your helmet, I think George fell, rolled around and damaged his tail feathers.

In terms of B vitamins, I am starting to give George some Brewer's Yeast on his seeds.


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## Woodnative (Jul 4, 2010)

Does George stand funny, where his tailfeathers would rub, or is his pearch or sleeping area in an area where his tailfeathers rub against a wall or cage? Also, pigeons normally molt once per year, starting very soon. If inside, the schedule may vary but he still should replace them once per year.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Can't add anything. Was thinking all that Woodnative said.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

dekebrent said:


> I think you may be right that some additional nutrients may help George. What amounts of calcium and B complex do you use? Do the calcium and B complex come from tablets? For anti-stress vitamins, are you talking about supplements like theanine or inositol?


*Does he stress when you give him medicine down his throat? I gave the helmet a capsule of coral calcium and garlic cap (one at a time) and you can give him a little brewers yeast over the seed-for B vitamins. I slick the capsule down with a drop of Neem oil and slide it down the throat gently, above and behind the tongue and then gently push it as far back as you can and allow the bird to swallow. If George does not have access to sunlight he will need vitamin D for calcium absorption*



dekebrent said:


> Another thought, Treesa, on the tail feathers. George had a rough PMV attack in late 2009. Like your helmet, I think George fell, rolled around and damaged his tail feathers.
> In terms of B vitamins, I am starting to give George some Brewer's Yeast on his seeds.


*The brewers yeast will do him good, follow up with some probiotics. He should be molting soon and then he will get a new tail! But the molt itslef, may stress him so extra nutrients will definitely be beneficial during his molt.*


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Good point about the vitamin D. Just make sure it is Vitamin D3.


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## dekebrent (Jun 17, 2005)

Treesa, Woodnative & Jay3 -- Thanks again for the follow up. I don't think George would take a pill down the throat too well. I give him Pedialyte, mixed w/ water, in order give him a electrolytes (and he likes it as a cool liquid treat). Maybe I can slip a couple garlic drops along w/ Pedialyte in a medicine dropper.

I give him Vitamin D3 once a week - I put D3 oil on some seeds along w/ probiotic (break open a capsule and spread the contents on the seeds). Should I give him D3 more often?

As for his standing funny or perching in a way that might rough up his tail feathers. George has a paralyzed left leg -- vet thinks its a carryover from PMV when he was a baby pij (he's about 6-7 years old now). So he generally hops around on his right leg to get around. About three weeks ago, he injured his right leg (good leg) in an accident. He's not able to get around too easily while he heals -- the leg is getting better bit by bit, and the vet has me rubbing an anti-inflammatory on his leg twice a day. I'm sure the leg has him a little stressed.

In the summer of 2009, George had a fairly strong PMV attack. During this time, he had to spend a bunch of time in the cage, for calming and to minimize the chances he would injure himself during fits (he would turn his head upside-down, lose balance, and roll around until he regained balance). Sometimes in the cage during a bad fit he would hit his tail feathers on the sides of the cage. Also, during some moments out of the cage, he would attempt to fly and tumble to the ground, landing on his tail. 

I'm in hopes that he will lose the tail feathers in the coming molt, and grow new ones.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Poor George......

Just be sure he gets calcium and vitamin D3, and B-complex as those are the nerve vitamins and will help him well. Garlic will bring his immune system up.


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