# CD's worked to prevent hawk attacks, for awhile :(



## conditionfreak (Jan 11, 2008)

Many of you may remember another thread awhile back. Whereupon I told how I had taken a friends advice and attached CDs to the front of my lofts. To ward off hawk attacks. I said that it was somehow working. I used to have several hawk attacks a week and that there had been none for several weeks.

I could not explain it, but it was working.

In that previous thread, someone said that "yes it works, but only for awhile". Well, they were right.

I had my first hawk attack two days ago, in about six weeks. My YB's were out and then all of a sudden they scattered to the four winds. I knew instantly that a hawk had struck and started looking for it. I saw it with one of my blue bars on the ground, on the other side of my garage. I ran towards it, yelling and clapping my hands. Suddenly the pigeon escaped and attempted to fly away. But the hawk caught up to it in the span of about fifteen or twenty feet and had it on the ground again. All of this time I was running towards them. As I got close, the pigeon either escaped again or the hawk let it go to flee from me.

The hawk went south and the pigeon went east. The pigeon was in a panic and disappeared over the tree tops.

As soon as my flock calmed down (they were either hiding or flying), I called them in to their loft and did a head count. I was missing two birds. I then did an inventory of which two birds I was missing and sure as rain, the one blue bar I was missing was the bird I had the highest hopes for being a future breeder. It was an offspring of last years Classic Race (our Combines biggest race of the year, and the money race of the year), mated with my mentors best hen, that is probably going to not be fertile next year. She is very old. The other bird missing was a blue check that had a ten dollar band on it for this years money race.

I was pizzed. I went into the house and told my wife that I had had enough and I am going to kill me a hawk or two (I have a pair of Red Tails that live here and a pair of Coopers that live here).. This attack, as are almost all of the attacks here, was a Coopers.

I know the potential penalties for doing such a thing. But I was really really mad at the time. I have calmed down now. Good thing I didn't have a gun in my hand at that moment (a good reason for a waiting period for those who buy guns. But I digress).

A full day passed and no sign of the two birds. I assumed that the hawk continued on after I scared it, and most likely got one of the missing birds, and the other got lost in the panic.

Today, both birds came back. I went out just after dark and they were both sitting on the aviary screen to their loft. They had been gone for a day and a half. I caught up both with a fishing net and checked them. The blue bar had a hole in its back, just a quarter inch to the side of direct middle. It is walking with a limp now. The blue check was untouched and I put it into the loft.

I treated the blue bar with disinfectant and put it into a hospital cage. I have to get some antibiotic tomorrow. I believe it is going to be alright, although I am apprehensive it will have back muscle problems in regard to flying. We'll see in time.

I have decided to put the blue bar into the breeding loft after it heals. I am not a fan of "bred for stock" birds. I want to see a bird perform before I use it for breeding. But I am going to make an exception for this bird. 

The blue check is back on the race team.

I am proud of both of these birds. The blue bar escaped from the hawk twice. Both birds have never routed and I am sure they went far away in their panic.

But both came back home. I am very happy right now.

Oh, and I ain't gonna kill them darn hawks.

But they better stop. Or I am going to get me a ..................... remote controlled airplane and play me some aerial dog fighting.


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

Consider goose decoys. Geese hate hawks as the eat the goslings. If you ever see a goose get tied up with a hawk, the hawk looses. Around these parts (just south of Lake Ontario) hawks are very common. So are geese. Some hints I have been told to stick too:

1. Move the decoys around every 30 minutes or so.
2. Get the better plastic ones. 
3. The the heavier ones if they are all high quality.
4. Make sure the decay actually looks like a goose!


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

I'm glad there is a happy ending here. It's always difficult not to "hate" those that don't "love" our pigeons. 

I had a hawk come swooping through my backyard on Tuesday .. came within 6 inches of me and landed on one of the aviaries .. it was my regular big Mama Coopers .. she stared at me .. I stared at her .. I headed for the garden hose and as soon as I had it in my hands .. she left. She knows that I will spray her, and she doesn't like that.

Terry


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## cotdt (Apr 26, 2010)

But Terry, you need a permit to spray them don't you? Couldn't you just get a permit to trap the hawks, and release them far away?


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## Roller mike (Aug 5, 2009)

I have said it before and i will say it again, HAWKS SUCK, and there is pretty much nothing we can do about it seems like if you even look at a hawk wrong you can get in trouble, I got lucky and had some crows nest close to my loft, any hawks come around and the guard crows are all over them!!!! HA HA hawks!!! how do you like being chased around!!!! I hope the crows stick around into YB season


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## conditionfreak (Jan 11, 2008)

Hawks "home" as well as homing pigeons. Just not as fast. If they are relocated, they will most likely come back.

Even if they do not, another hawk or pair will take over the empty territory. That is the way of nature. One leaves and one moves in.

It is all about survival, food, and reproduction. Sadly (depending on your perspective), the hawks are here to stay. What we really need is to create a breed of pigeon that is as tough as a goose or crow. Maybe a breed known as the "Kung Fu Piji". 

hmmm....I just had a thought. What if hawks were the premiere racing homing bird. Would "hawk racing fanciers" be collecting or buying feral pigeons to feed our racers? If the military had used hawks to deliver messages, would they have been going through thousands of pigeons for food for the hawks? I am not sure what falconers use to feed their birds. But I believe the answer is obvious.

Something to think about.


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

That is an interesting idea. Get a hawk team and train it to chase your pigeons home. the hawk pushes the pigeons, the pigeons pull the hawk. Stragglers are ... no longer nuisance birds.

Seems evil. Genius evil, but evil.


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## cotdt (Apr 26, 2010)

Getting your own hawk would keep the other hawks away wouldn't it?


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

It might also help with cat, squirrel, starling and chipmunk problems.


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## atvracinjason (Mar 4, 2010)

I'm bummed to hear it didn't work 
on a lighter note not one person has suggested sharks w friggen laser beams, just saying


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## garacari (Apr 26, 2010)

Anything with a mirrored surface is a good deterent (nothing is foolproof). Hawks are extremely territorial. If they catch their own reflection they will fly off, thinking they have entered another feeding territory. I've considered putting a mirror on my loft roof and seeing how it works.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

a crazy lady (me) running, with her arms flapping around and screaming get the H out a hear!!! seems to detour some I have had around here.. FYI....lol.... neighbors think Im a bit bent....lol...


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## conditionfreak (Jan 11, 2008)

Changing the subject a little. There is a new flyer getting ready to join our club. He is in his early twenties. I offered him five pair of breeders to start his new hobby. He gladly accepted them and had his loft built in two days. He was very enthusiastic.

I just found out that he sold four of the birds I had given him, at a local flea market. For three dollars each. I asked him why he did that and he said that he only sold them because the ones he kept were tame but the ones he sold were hard to catch and would fly around the loft excitedly when he entered it. He didn't like that, so he sold them. These birds were given to me by a man in West Virginia, whose loft I dismantled and brought back to my home in Ohio. Some of you may remember the thread here "Take my loft, please". I did and he also had a lot of pigeon paraphernalia and two dozen birds that he gave me. Some I did not want and gave to this new flyer. They seemed like decent birds and the previous owner said they were of good quality, but I had my own breeders. I did keep one pair of his breeders and 12 of his young birds though.

I will not be giving this new guy any more birds. Ever. The ungratefulness and lack of thought by many humans, never ceases to amaze me. You would think that he would ask me if I wanted them back, or at least tell me about the wildness problem and ask me what he could do about it.

I'm pizzed. I had offered him some young birds next year, but they will not be forthcoming.


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## garacari (Apr 26, 2010)

spirit wings said:


> a crazy lady (me) running, with her arms flapping around and screaming get the H out a hear!!! seems to detour some I have had around here.. FYI....lol.... neighbors think Im a bit bent....lol...


LOL! I'll have to try that one. Sounds like me yelling at the feral cats!


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## Airbaby (Aug 9, 2008)

conditionfreak said:


> Changing the subject a little. There is a new flyer getting ready to join our club. He is in his early twenties. I offered him five pair of breeders to start his new hobby. He gladly accepted them and had his loft built in two days. He was very enthusiastic.
> 
> I just found out that he sold four of the birds I had given him, at a local flea market. For three dollars each. I asked him why he did that and he said that he only sold them because the ones he kept were tame but the ones he sold were hard to catch and would fly around the loft excitedly when he entered it. He didn't like that, so he sold them. These birds were given to me by a man in West Virginia, whose loft I dismantled and brought back to my home in Ohio. Some of you may remember the thread here "Take my loft, please". I did and he also had a lot of pigeon paraphernalia and two dozen birds that he gave me. Some I did not want and gave to this new flyer. They seemed like decent birds and the previous owner said they were of good quality, but I had my own breeders. I did keep one pair of his breeders and 12 of his young birds though.
> 
> ...


WOW! $3 a piece??? the nerve of some people...good gesture on you for sure on getting him started...to bad he probably wasted it for a few pack of cigerettes...okay back to the hawk attacks....shortely after you posted sometime back about CD's and hawk attacks I had 2 smaller hawks over my birds in the air manuvering back in forth working togather trying to catch my birds... i ran in the house and grabbed a little 1 ft x 2ft mirror off my daughters wall and went outside and used the glare of the sun to ward off the hawks...it worked almost immediatlely after i started doing it...i need to get a few more mirrors but i now place this mirror angled up towards the sky in my yard where ever the sun will be when i let the birds out now...i know nothing is for sure but so far i think it has helped...maybe moving things around a bit here and there will confuse the hawks?? Atleast with small mirrors you can move them around the yard to make the hawks maybe think there is actually something going on...just my 3 cents.

Roy


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

conditionfreak said:


> Changing the subject a little. There is a new flyer getting ready to join our club. He is in his early twenties. I offered him five pair of breeders to start his new hobby. He gladly accepted them and had his loft built in two days. He was very enthusiastic.
> 
> I just found out that he sold four of the birds I had given him, at a local flea market. For three dollars each. I asked him why he did that and he said that he only sold them because the ones he kept were tame but the ones he sold were hard to catch and would fly around the loft excitedly when he entered it. He didn't like that, so he sold them. These birds were given to me by a man in West Virginia, whose loft I dismantled and brought back to my home in Ohio. Some of you may remember the thread here "Take my loft, please". I did and he also had a lot of pigeon paraphernalia and two dozen birds that he gave me. Some I did not want and gave to this new flyer. They seemed like decent birds and the previous owner said they were of good quality, but I had my own breeders. I did keep one pair of his breeders and 12 of his young birds though.
> 
> ...


Well...it is way OT. But, you should be a wee bit....well this is a family site.

Some people simply do not understand good pigeon manners. Of course, the one who must take the responsiblity and educate the new fancier, is the person giving or lending the birds. I had a similar experience, except that I provided the pedigrees as well. They were driven to New York and sold. In addition to insulting me, he lied, because he said they had died.

It cost him his job, because he worked with our firm. We don't keep liar's on here...and then there was another instance where the breeders were simply left go. That was pretty stupid and insulting also, as some had been locked up for years as prisoners and were orginally from out of state. 

One possible solution, is don't give any birds away. My brother belongs to country clubs and the like, and gets people involved in golf all the time. But, he does not go out and give them a set of golf clubs. That's the part I don't always understand. The guy might have a $40,000 boat, a $10,000 motocycle, a $350,000 home...and a fancier is afraid to ask for some money for the birds. In many cases, the "free" birds are never quite appreciated as much as the birds that a guy has spent some bucks on. IMHO.

And I guess I should say...I have also had guys who were people of their word....and when they were finished with some birds I had "given" them....they asked if I wanted them back...and when I said yes, they shipped them to my front door. Those guys know who they are. Some guys you can lend a $2000 bird, and they will return in good health and order...and then there are those who will always "forget" the promises they made even on a worn out pigeon clock.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

conditionfreak said:


> Many of you may remember another thread awhile back. Whereupon I told how I had taken a friends advice and attached CDs to the front of my lofts. To ward off hawk attacks. I said that it was somehow working. I used to have several hawk attacks a week and that there had been none for several weeks.
> 
> I could not explain it, but it was working.
> 
> ...


Would have been swell if something as simple as CD's would keep the Coopers etc away...but those of us, who have been there and done that....know that such things will not work. If it was that easy, then hawks would not really be a problem. 

There is no legal solution in the USA.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

I have some black birds that nest in my neighbors tree and eat my dogs food...I've watched them chase hawks with a fury..they are relentless. I'm wondering if anyone knows how to attract crows to stay in your basic area? I've seen crows all around my neighborhood...but they seem to just rest for a bit and then move on. I've tried throwing uneaten pigeon feed in my yard to attract them..but the crows don't seem to even notice. Any ideas anyone on how to get crows to stick around in my backyard?


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## cotdt (Apr 26, 2010)

jAxTecH said:


> I have some black birds that nest in my neighbors tree and eat my dogs food...I've watched them chase hawks with a fury..they are relentless. I'm wondering if anyone knows how to attract crows to stay in your basic area? I've seen crows all around my neighborhood...but they seem to just rest for a bit and then move on. I've tried throwing uneaten pigeon feed in my yard to attract them..but the crows don't seem to even notice. Any ideas anyone on how to get crows to stick around in my backyard?


You can buy some crows yourself, so long as they are not a native species. They chase the hawks around and poop on its wings.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

*Really?*



cotdt said:


> You can buy some crows yourself, so long as they are not a native species. They chase the hawks around and poop on its wings.


Where can crows or ravens be purchased? If I could settle them with my pigeons that would be too cool...Those would be on every training toss for sure


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## cotdt (Apr 26, 2010)

jAxTecH said:


> Where can crows or ravens be purchased? If I could settle them with my pigeons that would be too cool...Those would be on every training toss for sure


Here's one of many places that breed crows/ravens as pets: http://www.corvitude.com/corvidranch.html

though you could also catch a local crow from a nest, paint its chest white, and claim it's a Pied Crow if anyone asks


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

*Haha*



cotdt said:


> Here's one of many places that breed crows/ravens as pets: http://www.corvitude.com/corvidranch.html
> 
> though you could also catch a local crow from a nest, paint its chest white, and claim it's a Pied Crow if anyone asks


Thank you for the link...sorry to side track thread everyone


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

cotdt said:


> You can buy some crows yourself, so long as they are not a native species. They chase the hawks around and poop on its wings.


Crows chase hawks, yes, but I don't think you can buy two crows and they will start chasing the hawks away 

Crows, in nature, live close as packs, the alarm cry attracts many crows in the surrounding are they chase hawks away, in the effort to protect their territory. Crows chase away pigeons too.

We have abundant crows here every where and they do chase off hawks but at the same time flyers still have lost pigeons to hawks.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

sreeshs said:


> Crows chase hawks, yes, but I don't think you can buy two crows and they will start chasing the hawks away
> 
> Crows, in nature, live close as packs, the alarm cry attracts many crows in the surrounding are they chase hawks away, in the effort to protect their territory. Crows chase away pigeons too.
> 
> We have abundant crows here every where and they do chase off hawks but at the same time flyers still have lost pigeons to hawks.


I believe you. Those birds do not like competion..except in Walmart parking lots...I've seen feral pigeons and crows roosting on top of the parking lot lights, next to each other, side by side...like partners in crime. At the end of the day though our racing pigeons just have to get smarter and be faster...survival of the fittest. But if I catch a hawk hurting my babies..I'll shoot it with a paintball gun Bright PiNK..well see if he comes back after that.


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

Blue jays, red wing black birds, robins, and grackles (common and boat tailed) will call other birds across territory lines to chase hawks away. Our pairs of pileated woodpeckers have done it as well, but not as reliably. Keep in mind I don't have any birds flying out of my loft yet so the hawks may not be motivated enough…

To attract the common bids all you need is a few 5' garden hangers, a squirrel proof feeder (the kind with the spring loaded cage that slides down) and a 50lb back of black oil sunflower seed, a 50lb back of corn, and some time. Fill the feeder with the black oil seed and put it in a grassy spot that you mow under the crown of a tree. Take a cup of corn and spread it around on the ground under the feeder. Wait. In a day or two you should start seeing birds. In a year you will have nesting blue jays if you provide consistent food supply. 

You milage may very though.


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## conditionfreak (Jan 11, 2008)

"Those guys know who they are. Some guys you can lend a $2000 bird, and they will return in good health and order...and then there are those who will always "forget" the promises they made even on a worn out pigeon clock."

hmmm.... There is a story behind that clock statement, I am sure.

As for the crows. I have plenty that live and nest nearby. They do chase the hawks a lot. I seriously doubt they are pooping on the hawks wings intentionally though. 

But even with the crows harassing the hawks, the hawks still eat my birds on occasion. They are good at what they do and what they do is eat pigeons and other such things.

They are like most of us. They eat what they can catch.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

conditionfreak said:


> "Those guys know who they are. Some guys you can lend a $2000 bird, and they will return in good health and order...and then there are those who will always "forget" the promises they made even on a worn out pigeon clock."
> 
> hmmm.... There is a story behind that clock statement, I am sure.
> 
> ...


Yeah....I guess I digressed....actually it was only a training basket.....I was changing some details to protect the guilty...but nobody will know who I am talking about anyway.....

Crows will eat very young pigeons. They are not really the "good guys" they are just trying to get that hawk to drop something so they can eat it. It only appears that they are attempting to chase them out of the neighborhood. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Crow

Diet
The American Crow is omnivorous. It will feed on invertebrates of all types, *carrion*, scraps of human food, seeds, *eggs and nestlings*, stranded fish on the shore and various grains. *American Crows are active hunters* and will prey on mice, frogs, *and other small animals*. In winter and autumn, the diet of American Crows is more dependent on nuts and acorns. Occasionally, they will visit bird feeders.[11] The American Crow is one of only a few species of bird that has been observed modifying and using tools to obtain food.[12]

Like most crows, they will scavenge at landfills, scattering garbage in the process. Where available, corn, wheat and other crops are a favorite food. These habits have historically caused the American Crow to be considered a nuisance. However, it is suspected that the harm to crops is offset by the service the American Crow provides by eating insect pests.[11]


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

I had posted a idea that I HAVE NOT needed to implement. I am removing it because it could cause a bad public image for this great sport.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

jAxTecH said:


> I won't lie...if hawks decide my yard is easy pickings...I will XXXXxxxxxxxxxxx......... I know you XxXxxxx are going to cry about it...but your all hypocrites because I have'nt heard of one ever that has not XxXXXXxxxx.......chicken.


You can't say stuff like that on here. Violation of forum rules.

See : http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f9/forum-rules-of-conduct-7006.html

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## conditionfreak (Jan 11, 2008)

jAxTecH said:


> I had posted a idea that I HAVE NOT needed to implement. I am removing it because it could cause a bad public image for this great sport.


Just for your info, There are many that do not XXXXYYYY chicken. I for one do not eat meat. I also do not hunt nor fish, nor kill anything intentionally (except in self defense). I do mow the lawn and occasionally something dies during that process. But I try not to let it happen. Additonally I think the two pink Dogwood trees I planted last month, are not going to make it. Don't know what I did wrong though. That's a hundred bucks down the drain. 

But I get your point.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

conditionfreak said:


> Just for your info, There are many that do not XXXXYYYY chicken. I for one do not eat meat. I also do not hunt nor fish, nor kill anything intentionally (except in self defense). I do mow the lawn and occasionally something dies during that process. But I try not to let it happen. Additonally I think the two pink Dogwood trees I planted last month, are not going to make it. Don't know what I did wrong though. That's a hundred bucks down the drain.
> 
> But I get your point.


What I said before it was edited and xxxxx out is basically if its a problem that can't be fixed get rid of it. But my suggested approach is in violation of the forums policy...so you could always try and see if the state wildlife will relocate any raptors that are using your loft as a buffet.


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## jpsnapdy (Apr 4, 2010)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> One possible solution, is don't give any birds away. My brother belongs to country clubs and the like, and gets people involved in golf all the time. But, he does not go out and give them a set of golf clubs. That's the part I don't always understand. The guy might have a $40,000 boat, a $10,000 motocycle, a $350,000 home...and a fancier is afraid to ask for some money for the birds. In many cases, the "free" birds are never quite appreciated as much as the birds that a guy has spent some bucks on. IMHO.


Hear, hear ! I 100% agree with you !
JPS


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Have anybody tried these ?

Listed in Jedds Pigeon Supplies http://www.jedds.com/-strse-Equipment-%3E%3E-Loft-Utilities-cln-Predator-Deterrents/Categories.bok


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