# intoducing baby to seeds and grit



## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hiii now the baby is 20 day old and i m still feeding him soaked peas.... so when and how should i introduce him to seeds, i have no experience...
baby is pecking and eating small seeds from day 17 but i dont let him eat too much bcoz i was worried about grit. he pecks and eats whatever he thinks he can swallow, so i try my best to keep his nesting area clean, he even peck at his own dry small droppings....
so is this the time to introduce him seeds and grit?? will he know how much seeds and grit he should eat?? if yes then how should i do it??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If he is eating seed on his own, then let him eat. Just leave a small amount of grit out for him to pick at. Many hand raised babies aren't even given grit at the beginning, and they are fine. It helps them to grind the feed, but they can live without it for a while. I would just put a small amount in a small cover or something and see how he does. I doubt that he will even take it for a while. Eventually he will learn to. If he seems to take too much of it, then don't give him any more for a while. The amount he took would work for him for a while. Don't worry, the grit is not an immediate need for him right now.


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

You can put the soaked peas in a little bowl and mix some seeds in. If you wet the seeds a bit, it will be easier for the bird to pick up. He will know how much to eat, if he picks at his droppings, then he's still hungry. Put the grit in a seperate bowl. Don't be alarmed if he does not eat the grit, he will eventually figure it out.

Glad to know he's doing fine, how is the mum?


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## Doig (May 18, 2013)

Well that shows that your young bird is doing well,

My young bird at 2 weeks of age had to end up eating on its own bc its parents stopped feeding it... What I did was I just left him in the loft and for the first couple days I gave him the mixed grains in a flat wooden bowl... and when it got hungry it ate the seeds very nicely. The more it sees the grains the more it will notice that the grains are food.

Mine hasn't touched grit yet, walks right pass it to the big trough of grains. Make sure you dip his/her beak into the bowl where water is, and he/she drinks a little from it. 

Mine doesn't dare to touch anything soaked...only dry. IDKY.

Goodluck Nare J.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He will do fine without soaking them. The more he pecks at the seed, the better he will get at it.


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## Ananth_Tvli (Jun 26, 2014)

Nare, good to know that the youngster has made it safe. It should be relatively easy from here. You did well. 

Hows the momma bird doing? 

And the cat.... hope it didn't return?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

thanks all of u 
even momma bird is going good.....she is getting better day by day but still she is not able to eat on her ....own. she is preening fine ....and her injury on her neck is almost cured but she is not able to move her neck properly......hope so she gets well soon
and the cat returned only on the day of incident but was not able to come in our terrace, from the neighbour's terrace bcoz i already covered the area with net.... then after that he never tried to come into our terrace. i watch him many times roaming on the roofs below
and i dont think baby is hungry, i feed him 35-40 peas in morning and 45 peas in evening....is that enough??
and now i m keeping seeds in the cap of candy jar with him all the time alvailable during mid day, he pecks at them for a while ,eats some small seeds and then leave it......so if its okay then i will not provide him grit untill his 25 days old.....
and when everthing settles down properly i will bring 1 pair of pigeons


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hiii everyone
i m not able to manage the feeding of baby
at morning around 8am i feed the baby 40 soaked peas without skin [bcoz i read it will be easier to digest for baby and its true]
then leave half tablespoon feed mix with baby, he eats almost 60% of that but in evening i could still feel some grains and peas in his crop but then too i fed him 20 peas and in morning its always empty....
but should i leave grains with him after feeding ??and how should i manage feeding so that his crop would be whole empty till evening and i could feed him 40 peas in evening too.... and he drinks water only once a day mostly
can anyone advice me please??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If he eats well enough, then let him feed himself. If he eats well and is eating enough, then you don't have to feed him. Let him have the feed in the am and all day so that he can eat it. Leave him enough for the day. If he hasn't eaten much, then hand feed at the end of the day. Being hungry in the morning will get him to eat the seed on his own. Of course, always leave the water with him also. You said he drinks. Does he know how to drink on his own? If he does, then he should be okay. If he doesn't know how to drink from a crock of water, then you can't leave him with seed as he has to have access to water if eating seed.


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Did the other two that flew away ever come back? Do you see them nearby?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

no the other 2 birds not returned back.....
i saw 1 of the female bird with feral pigeons somedays ago... but she not returned..she flew very far away....i think she got a mate...
yah i m feeding 30 peas in morning and leaving 2 tablespoon with him he eats almost 1 tablespoon till evening but then too i feed him 20 peas in evening so that she should not get hungry at night... and he drinks on his own and i even put a pinch of small pebbles in his feed
and there's a good news female is eating grit and feed on her own....


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hiii......... is it normal for a baby pigeon to peck at anything she sees.....this baby pecks at anything he sees...he eats his own dry poop small piecies, dust...... and when theres nothing to peck he pecks at the towel under him........
i gave a pinch of grit[ small pebbles] and he ate all of them..... do i need to give him more....???
and even he is eating too much feed if i provide him??
morning i fed him 30 peas and kept 2 tablespoon... he ate about 1 and a half tablespoon till evening .....is that normal?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If he is eating so well, then you should stop feeding him and let him eat on his own. 
No, don't give him any more grit. Why are you still feeding him?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

i thought he is too young to eat on his own....
i m only feeding him in morning and leaving only seeds and water with him....
should i give him as many as feed he want???


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

Nare you are sweet, but you worry to much, let the bird eat all it wants. do not forget to offer it grit all the time.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I always keep feed and water in with my birds who have babies so that they learn to eat early. If he learns early then that's a good thing. Soon his parents would have been cutting back anyway to get him to eat more on his own. I wouldn't really worry about the grit for right now. Just leave him a bit so he doesn't fill up on that. It can wait.


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Im with Lucky, if he is eating on his own, you should supply various types of grit in either pots or sprinkle a pinch on his food daily. I use red brick, oyster shell, granite and a mixed and charcoal grit, I let the birds decide what they want to pick up. Also, if still a baby nothing wrong with you feeding him at night before bed a few peas or whatever you want to feed, the baby will wean himself. There are no cut and dried rules, most racers dont have the rescue mentality but the "hurry up and grow up and eat on your own mentality" so they can get to training and flying. If your not a racer and time is not of the essence then you can spoil the bird all you want and have a nice pet. I hand fed a few racers, (I dont race) but like to fly the breed, I fed her twice a day until she decided she wanted no more. Do what you want and enjoy.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

okay thanks evryone....
i feed him 20 peas in morning and leave half tablespoon feed with him[which is finished within 5 minutes] and again same in evening. okay so as everyone said i will give him about a pinch of grit daily. my grit consists only small pebbles and hammered bricks[millet size].....
but i m only worried that he pecks[even swallows it] at everything he sees and which is small, he dont cares what he is eating..... is that normal for a baby pigeon??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes it is normal for them to peck at everything. They are very curious little guys. 
As far as had feeding, the longer you do that, the more they will want you to. Many have had a hard time getting their birds to wean because they let it go so long. Giving him a few peas at night if you feel better about it is fine, but if he is eating on his own and drinking now, then there really is no reason to. You hand feed to give a baby bird nourishment until he weans. Once weaned, it really isn't needed any longer. That may be something you need, not the bird.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

yah even he is not much interested when i m trying to handfeed him...so i will provide him 2 tablespoon of feed with a pinch of grit and water ......thanks everyone for ur help


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

NEVER ration grit!............... It is their teeth.and of source of Minerals that are a pigeons most important need. A well fed pigeon, unless super hungry, will go for good grit as much as food. Geez this is a Pigeon Forum, and it seems very few here understand how important grit is to them, it is a nutritional need, a stress reducer, Their G.D.Teeth! 
By God, it is desired by them almost as much or more than feed.
The only reason to back off on grit is due to some meds. BUT the Grit most likely would help more then the Meds!
GEE, maybe the fact I give my Birds all the Proper Grit/Minerals they need is why my pigeons stay so healthy! 
Soluble, and insoluble grit is with out a doubt the most important diet ingredient you can give your pigeons.... WAY more important than Probiotics, with out a DOUBT! 
Again, GEE ,they are by evolution a Coastal Bird, which is a habitat high in mineral content.
I learned this when I was in grade school....
They need it for digestion, bones are made of minerals, feathers contain 
minerals,
To restrict a Pigeon of a well balanced grit/ mineral source is pure stupidity, and CRUEL.. maybe that is why meds seem the normal thing with some pigeon/Bird keepers.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

No one is talking about restricting grit from a pigeon. This one is just still a baby, and will have grit for the rest of his life. He doesn't need a lot of grit right at first. And a small amount will do him just fine. Just beginning to peck at everything, he could fill up on it, and that would cause problems. A small amount is really all he needs at this point.
Make sure he is getting calcium and D3.


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

First off.. In 50 years I have never had a pigeon" fill up" on grit. as Youngsters they need it much more than Adults......
Any good breeding pair will eat their grain, and eat a TON of grit, then feed their youngsters...
LATER is to late. This is Not a discussion I will get into, it has been proven over, and over. Some learn, some keep following. 
A Pigeon, Young or old with access to, or given plenty of grit will RARELY have health issues. I have proven this to most people that will listen for the last 40 years. Feed is not utilized by pigeons, young or Old, without availability of the right amount of the right amount of grit...... PERIOD.
Never to young or to sick for grit....


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Lucky you would laugh if you saw the size of my grit tray, I took a full size 24 inch feedtrough and filled them up one for each loft lol. My birds will be in sparkling health then


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

even i have noticed that my breeding pair used to eat lots of grit while feeding babies... that was the reason i was worried about grit....
so should i keep feed,grit and water all time available for baby??
and about calcium and vitamin d...
i have calcium carbonate with vitamin d powder[feed grade], which i got from pet shop. should i give this to him now in water??


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

Just stick to a well balanced Pigeon grit.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

we dont get grit in pet shop so i make homemade grit, which consist construction grade sand with small size pebbles, and hammered bricks.
i m giving baby 2 pinch of grit, i feed him 2 tablespoon seeds everyday but if i let him he can eat more...
and what about my calcium supplement??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, use the calcium supplement on his food.
And Lucky, when hand fed youngsters are first eating seed, they have even filled up on that too much and blocked their crop. So yes, they could do the same with grit. Don't worry, he will be fine with a small amount for now. Not like they need tons.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

okay then i will sprinkle 1 pinch on 1 tablespoon...
yes my baby will eat too much seeds and grit if i let him...
is 2 tablespoon feed and 2 pinch grit[tiny pebbeles] per day enough??


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

This pigeon is eating on its own, leave him feed and grit/mineral block so he can get it himself.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

but i m sure he will overfed at it....
so is 2 tablespoon and 2 pinch grit enough for him??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

A growing young one needs extra nutrition, Why not leave extra for him and see what he does? eventually you will just have to leave more and let him take what he wants.
I have had little ones over eat and have trouble passing it in the beginning, but they learn.
Just keep an eye on him to see what he does.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

i kept feed for him but he kept on eating and not stoped.....but when i saw is crop was full , i removed the feed....i think i should wait for him to be 30 days old so that he would get the knowlege of how much to eat....till that i will continue with 2 tablespoons feed and 2 pinch grit per day.....
and about the female, she is not at all interested in teaching baby anything. she is now a healthy bird and has started flying. is she searching for her mate and other birds....
bcoz she roosts for hours on my roof or neighbouring terrace and fly frequently....will she run away??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

She wouldn't be interested in teaching him anything, as she no longer recognizes him as hers. She may be wondering where everyone is, or just doesn't feel safe on your terrace anymore. She may find a mate and leave, or not. Hard to say. When you give him the feed, does he eat the whole 2 Tablespoons at one time? Growing babies do need a lot of nutrition.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

no i give him 1 tablespoon with grit in morning and one in evening.....and yah i think it is not enough for him ,his crop gets empty soon so i have increase each feed time with more half tablespoon.......


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He needs more than that. I think you believe he is over eating, but that he is only eating what he should be for his age. Give him a small dish of feed and let him eat what he wants. Only if his crop stops emptying and blocks up, do you need to worry. A bird that young should not be fed only morning and evening. They eat more often than an adult. You aren't giving him enough, and he will not grow healthy. He needs much more as he is growing a lot at this age. Stop worrying if he is eating too much. Let him take what he wants.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

okay i done the same in evening and he at about 1 and a half tablespoon feed with about 10 peas[pigeon peas] seperate and drank water....
and as it is winter now here, i was thinking to intoduce him to corn, i got some unpoped popcorn which is small and expensive...but in some threads i read that corn is not good, its like double edge sward.... is it true??


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

and yah jay3 i m sure he is not getting enough nutrition.... i know that hand raise pigeons grow slowly but he is not very active.... he dont stand on his legs for long time.... i have still not given calcium supplement....i will see tommorrow....and so for more nutrition i will add more seeds to his feed......
now his feed include shorgam, millets, wheat, rice[very small amount], rape seeds, mung beans, pigeon peas, chickpeas, little amount of barley..... do i need to add anything more?? and do i need to give him any excersize..... and popcorn still not added till i m sure its good for him
and when i gave him unlimited feed i m sure he was eating more than it could fit in his crop so i have to remove it....
but do anyone know how much a baby of this age should eat?? i assume 3 tablespoon per day in 3 feedings.... what u say?


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Can you post a picture of him?, I'm thinking all this is over reacting and making things complicated when it don't have to be so.
I don't think it's the bird who has a "problem" so to speak.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I agree that I think you are making this harder then it has to be. Occasionally, when a baby first starts eating, he may gorge and fill himself up too much, but they soon learn not to do that. You need to let him learn. Just leave a small dish of seed, and small amount of grit, a dish of water, and trust that he knows what to do. I don't understand why you have not given the calcium and vitamin D3 yet. That is important if you want him to grow strong bones and muscles. If his parents were feeding him, he would be getting it from them. If you don't include that in his diet, he will have problems with growing strong bones and such. You aren't giving him enough. You don't have to hold back food. You said he hardly stands. His legs are probably weak from not getting enough to eat and not getting the calcium. You aren't letting him grow up. You are holding him back. 
Yes, a picture would be good.


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Nare, keep it simple as they are saying. Give a bowl of seed like a good cup full and leave it out. Same with water and a small dish with mixed grit, he will be fine in the short term. 
VERY simple, just keep an eye that he is eating well and refill top up with fresh seed daily, its that simple. Since Im not a racer I never restrict my birds feed. I let them self regulate. I make sure the feed is gone by end of day and put out fresh each day. Thats all.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

thanks everyone.....yah i think i m overacting....i will keep seeds, grit and water 24/7 for him. and just now i gave him 1 pinch calcium carbonate with vitamin d in his feed.....


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

and about picture i will see... i dont have a carmera or a mobile, but i will try to borrow and send a picture


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## Ananth_Tvli (Jun 26, 2014)

you have an excellent seed mix, its just a matter of time, you will soon have a cheerful youngster 

i had a similar incident occur to me a couple of days back. i had shifted my loft and my birds from my house to another place around 13 kms away. one cock managed to escape from there and returned to my house. it refused to go away and used to spend the nights sitting in my bedroom window. i brought back its mate and released it. soon they started to build a nest in the place where the loft was located. i should have discouraged them at this stage but i didn't. they had 2 eggs and were sitting on them but two nights back a cat killed the hen. such a heartbreak and i feel guilty


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

yah its really a heartbreaking situation....
some days ago i saw the cctv footage of the cat attact night.......it was really terrible.....now i wish i would have locked them properly that night


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hii my pigeons never ate corn.... and as its winter here i thought corn will be good for baby. so i got some unpoped popcorn and baby ate it, he usually eats everything i serve him. is popcorn good or should i try hybrid corn??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Popcorn is smaller than the larger corn, but have heard it is actually harder. There is always cracked corn too. If he eats it, and has no problems with it, then it's okay.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

jay3 read this message and reply please its urgent...
yesterday morning i fed the baby 1 tablespoon of feed and about 2 pm, there was only little feed in his crop and as u all said that i should keep feed all time for baby, so i did and when i returned in evening his crop was very hard. water is also always available, when i took water near him he took a small sip and today morning i saw his crop not empty. only 1/4 of the hard feed felt in evening was digested .i gave him some warm water but he was not interested in drinking, he was just splasing it. and then i masaged his crop and gently pressed the hard thing in his crop.i felt all seeds. 
what should i do now... please reply.....


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

TAKE THE BIRD TO A VET, it seems you are need hands on help. No one can give you advice with out examining the bird. could you AT LEAST give us a current picture? It is futile continuing they way this is going. 
This pigeon has had more advice thrown at it than any 10 others.
IF you care about the bird it is WAY past the time to be asking questions on a website... Could it be you just want to talk? take the Bird to a vet or a local pigeon keeper, this is Silly. Sorry. but it is the truth.


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## Ananth_Tvli (Jun 26, 2014)

Luckyt, what you have mentioned is true but in India there are no qualified vets (or simpler vets) who would have the patience or the intention to treat a pigeon (or any other bird). There might be few exceptions. The best thing for Nare to do would be to take the effort and meet some pigeon fancier (as Lucky has mentioned) and set things straight.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well, I wouldn't have fed one that young the popcorn, as it is hard, and therefore harder to digest. He is just getting used to seeds. I would do the same thing I told you before that you wouldn't do, and that is to mix a bit of applesauce with a small bit of warm water and give him that, then very gently message the crop. Not so hard that it brings the food back up, as he can aspirate. Then don't feed him any more till his crop empties. When it empties, start him again on seed. Easier to digest. Make sure you leave water with him also. Let us know how he does.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I would treat for canker. Doesn't always show in his mouth. Have you looked way down his throat with a flashlight? The lack of feathering around the throat can be from canker. Won't hurt to treat. 30 mg once daily for 10 days.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hiii my present flagyl has gotten old..... i m rushing to medical shop now to see what i will get...
after his crop was empty in morning i fed him 1 tablespoon soaked seeds and his crop is only half empty now after almost 7-8 hours.
there's surly some problem.
according to my calculation 30mg =0.03 ml right?
should i give to him now or when??


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hiii i got 4 tablets of different power
two of 400 mg and 2 of 200mg
i gave assuming 30mg part of 400 mg tablet to the baby now and its night here....and his crop was much full still
i m not a expert but i think there's something yellow substances very down the throat of the baby....


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It would be easier to divide up the 200 mg tablet. You need to give the right amount. To little won't work, and too much can harm the bird. Divide the 200 mg tablet into 4ths, then cut each of those in half, which will give you 25 mg. That would be enough.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

OKAY he is doing good today...his crop is whole empty now in morning... and thank u everone for help
i will feed him 1 tablespoon soaked seeds after about 1/2 hour.... and continue medicine for 7 days...
i have read that while treatment we should not give the bird grit and calcium...right?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Grit doesn't matter with Metronidazole. Won't interfere with it.
One tablespoon still isn't enough. 
Feed him before giving the Metro, as it can upset their stomach on an empty crop.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

yah i will give him enough but i m just checking whether he is now able to digest them properly. its just half an hour now after i fed him. i will give him medicine every evening after feeding him....


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

How are you giving him the meds?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

its very hard to cut the tablets, but i m asumming its the right amount. i cut the tablets with the blade. and i open his open and put the medicine inside.
i fed him only 1/2 tablespoon 2 hours ago and he is digesting slow but digesting.....he has digested about 2/3 of it.hope so he get cured soon.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Hi I m noticing that baby is not growing as the babies of his age. He is 30 days old now and still has too many yellow hair on his head. He don't walk, when I leave him on the ground , he will stand up for sometime and sit again, and even he flaps his wings in a dull manner. I think he is very weak. His crop is emptying properly overnight . He used to almost eat 3 tablespoons everyday. But yesterday morning he ate 1 and a half tablespoon and in evening only half tablespoon. Baby is showing signs of weakness . He is not even flapping his wings and squeaks when I touch him. He was showing most of the signs canker, like too much thirst, feathers loss around mouth, weakness. I m still treating him for canker with flagyl tablets. Is there anything I could do??help!!


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

You could try giving him probiotics and an electrolyte such as gatorade or pedialyte from drug store or sugar water. Maybe the seed is not enough for so young, try feeding it again with the frozen peas and corn. I would dip its beak into the electrolyte water 4 times a day at least and wait until it drinks this will give it energy.


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## Ananth_Tvli (Jun 26, 2014)

the birds HAS to be viewed by someone knowledgeable and experienced in this. the chances of it surviving are 50%. i hope both for the bird's as well as your sake it would overcome this ordeal.


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

I have a question... why feed thawed frozen peas and corn? 
very unnatural for a pigeon. The feed I give any Squeeks in my care is human instant , or regular OATMEAL. I add a good Vit., Min. powder If one is available.
I have raised healthy Squeeks with oatmeal for over 40 years... NEVER
a Problem. 
This bird was fed NOTHING but Oatmeal with Vit/Min. powder sup.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

hii...now i dont have 2 birds, i have only the baby.... female went to take a flight yesterday like everyday... but she not returned....
okay i will see what can i do and what can i get.....


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

and which vitamin and mineral supplements can i get?? and whats the dosage??


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## Ananth_Tvli (Jun 26, 2014)

the female never returned??? so many things seem to be going wrong at your end  probably it will in a day or two, lets hope it does. 

but are you sure it flew well, if it was not fit enough it could soon become the cat's next meal. keep a watchful eye over the surroundings


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

no it became very healthy...... it started eating on its own and after she fully recovered, she seemed like nothing was happened..... but she was searching for mate....she became very lonly.....i wanted to bring a mate for her...... but due to some construction work going in our house....i thought i will bring it after some days but she ran away.....
and now my only hope is this baby.... so i m trying my best to make him healthy.....
please suggest me some medicines that i can get in medical shops......


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

LUCKYT said:


> I have a question... why feed thawed frozen peas and corn?
> very unnatural for a pigeon. The feed I give any Squeeks in my care is human instant , or regular OATMEAL. I add a good Vit., Min. powder If one is available.
> I have raised healthy Squeeks with oatmeal for over 40 years... NEVER
> a Problem.
> This bird was fed NOTHING but Oatmeal with Vit/Min. powder sup.




First of all, peas and corn are not unnatural for a pigeon. They are very natural. What do you think is in their feed? Peas and corn. The fact that they have been frozen, they are soft. They are also warm when you feed them to the bird, and very easy to feed. Much easier to feed to a bird who won't eat then it would be to feed seeds, and much easier to digest. This bird is old enough for solid food and doesn't need oatmeal. Although I fail to see how oatmeal is more natural than peas and corn. It is also a good way to get food into a pigeon for someone who isn't used to hand feeding. 

Just because you do something different, does not mean that those that do it another way are doing it wrong. Defrosted peas work well.


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

First off..... Frozen peas and corn are NOT mature seeds, which is WHAT Pigeon grains are. Nutritional, NOT the same thing. It is totally different.
A MATURE SEED, is a LIVING thing, Perfect in its freshness, and nutritional value. WHERE AS Oatmeal.... is processed from MATURE SEED.
BY THE WAY, I can Guarantee you, Since i have been doing it since i was 8 years old or so, I have hand fed WAY more Pigeons than you have or ever will.
ALSO, Pigeons are about the easiest Birds on earth to hand feed successfully.
Frozen peas and corn, are about as nutritious for a squeek, as, lets say Immature seed.... EASY never is best.
H ELL soaked Wheat Bread hand feed is BETTER than peas and corn,
I have raised DOZENS if not more squeeks with wheat bread soaked in water supplemented with the old 8in1 brand Vit/Min powder NEVER a problem.
OH, by the way whole grain Bread is made from MATURE seed.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

LUCKYT said:


> First off..... Frozen peas and corn are NOT mature seeds, which is WHAT Pigeon grains are. Nutritional, NOT the same thing. It is totally different.
> A MATURE SEED, is a LIVING thing, Perfect in its freshness, and nutritional value. WHERE AS Oatmeal.... is processed from MATURE SEED.
> BY THE WAY, I can Guarantee you, Since i have been doing it since i was 8 years old or so, I have hand fed WAY more Pigeons than you have or ever will.
> ALSO, Pigeons are about the easiest Birds on earth to hand feed successfully.
> ...




You don't know everything Lucky, The frozen peas work fine for them, are nutritious, and easy to digest. Stop finding fault with something you know nothing about. Your oatmeal doesn't contain all that they need either. It isn't forever, just for a while that you would be feeding them to a bird. Stop trying to find fault with everything that you do differently. Yours is not the only way. Nice for you to share what you do, but others have the right to share what has worked for them also. Read more and you might learn something.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Baby is now not even taking much interest in eating.......From the time i started medicating him he is showing this all symtoms sso should I stop drugging him??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The poor thing is sick with something, or maybe just not getting enough nutrition all along weakened him. Without being able to see him, it's hard to know what is wrong. 
What are you feeding him and how are you giving it? 
And exactly how much of which medication?


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

I never find fault, just look for the truth. AND what is right for the creature involved. 
And no, it is not forever, just during one of the most important developmental Periods of a a Young Birds Growth. 
Read what you wrote about learning something. 
I was Hand feeding pigeons before I could Read, TRUE I learned to read late, it was Levi's Book that helped me learn to read.
Hand feeding a proper Diet, at that age... REDUCES STRESS.
I never really thought about this, BUT, It was Virginia Moe, from Trailside Museum in River Forest Illinois, who taught me how to hand feed Pigeons.
She wrote a Book Titled "Animal Inn" (about rehabbing) SHE was one of the first Rehabbers of any kind.
She was NOT pleasant or nice to People, not that I heard any one say, or from my experience. In fact, in my opinion she disliked people.
I volunteered there when i was in 6th,7th and 8th Grades.(in the summer)
I asked her about hand feeding pigeons, and she replied, Oatmeal, and dark Bread.
She made me figure out the rest.
OATMEAL is ideal, thin it out when they are small, thicken it as they grow, always add enough water so they do not dehydrate. Add Vit/Min Powder.
When ever you give plain water to young pigeons you are asking for problems, the uninitiated will get it in their Lungs, then want to medicate them not knowing what happened.
LOL, It seems i am the only one on this sight that needs to learn... I was WEANED on raising Squeeks/Squabs, they ARE not Chicks........


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

I got the thing what was wrong with baby....grit!! I gave him grit and he ate half teaspoon grit then I took away the grit. Then in my front he ate whole 2 tablespoon feed.... Today I understood how important grit is for pigeons... And about feed I have added lots of lentils and other stuffs which are high in protein and is dry field peas and corn good?? And I m giving him flagyl tablets 200mg made into 8 parts 25mg each Should I continue giving this..today is 5 day of treatment


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

but the only problem is, his weak legs, and his dull behaviour.....what are the name of vitamin and mineral supplements i can get in medical stores??.....and what can i do to make him more active??.....he is not at all same as the pigeons of his age... 31 days babies would take short flight by now, but he is not even able to walk properly. he used to walk properly at 3 weeks but i dont know why he is not able to walk properly now... he is a bit overweight can that be the reason?? the only reason i think is, i not gave him sufficient food from the time he was 25 but still he doesnt look underweight..... i used to only give him 2 tablespoon per day...bcoz i thought he would over fed at feed and grit.... can i keep feed 24/7 now... even though i still thing he will overfed at them.....??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Nare J said:


> but the only problem is, his weak legs, and his dull behaviour.....what are the name of vitamin and mineral supplements i can get in medical stores??.....and what can i do to make him more active??.....he is not at all same as the pigeons of his age... 31 days babies would take short flight by now, but he is not even able to walk properly. he used to walk properly at 3 weeks but i dont know why he is not able to walk properly now... he is a bit overweight can that be the reason?? the only reason i think is, i not gave him sufficient food from the time he was 25 but still he doesnt look underweight..... i used to only give him 2 tablespoon per day...bcoz i thought he would over fed at feed and grit.... can i keep feed 24/7 now... even though i still thing he will overfed at them.....??


Are his legs splayed out at all? He also needs calcium and vitamin D3 as I mentioned before. Don't know what you have there. Can you get a bird vitamin there?
If he is eating enough then leave food 24/7. If not, then he needs to be hand fed. Yes, you need to finsh the time for the med. I would give it for 10 days.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

LUCKYT said:


> I never find fault, just look for the truth. AND what is right for the creature involved.
> And no, it is not forever, just during one of the most important developmental Periods of a a Young Birds Growth.
> Read what you wrote about learning something.
> I was Hand feeding pigeons before I could Read, TRUE I learned to read late, it was Levi's Book that helped me learn to read.
> ...



Yours is not the only way. There are many other things that work. A baby bird formula would be better than what you use. Have you ever considered using that?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Jay3 said:


> Are his legs splayed out at all? He also needs calcium and vitamin D3 as I mentioned before. Don't know what you have there. Can you get a bird vitamin there?
> If he is eating enough then leave food 24/7. If not, then he needs to be hand fed. Yes, you need to finsh the time for the med. I would give it for 10 days.


I gave him enough calcium before starting medication ... 
Pet store don't have vitamin supplements so I have buy it from human medical stores..so do what can be used??


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

Yep tried most, all really formulated for Parrots/ Hook Bills. most people, 
like you, do not get it. Pigeons are rather unique. 
Oatmeal is about as close an imitation of "Pigeon Milk" there is. 
It is easy to adjust liquid content, and is "soupy" AND is processed from mature seed (ALIVE). 
Is it just a coincidence, there are SO many secondary problems with Squeeks fed raw immature vegetables? I think not. 
I can honestly say MOST People do not understand Pigeons at all.
Pigeon milk pretty much contains MOSTLY Hard seed(Mature) semi digested, or however you want to describe it.
But I do not blame you for not understanding. I have met very few people that do. 
AND Grit is so important, that depriving even a very young pigeon of it, is like asking you to eat whole walnuts with out you having teeth. that would be Kind of stressful, would it not?
I will give my Pigeons the cheapest wild bird mix if I cannot get to the feed store, BUT, I make sure they get a good grit mix, changed or refreshed just about every day.
LOOK at the Pictures of the squeeks I have posted, They did not just survive, They THRIVED. 
Properly cared for Pigeons are rarely sick.(Racers in competition being the exception) 
In colder climates Wild/feral Pigeons are RARELY sick
Do it your way, no one ever listens to me anyway. 
YOUR and the Birds loss.


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

LUCKYT said:


> First off..... Frozen peas and corn are NOT mature seeds, which is WHAT Pigeon grains are. Nutritional, NOT the same thing. It is totally different.
> A MATURE SEED, is a LIVING thing, Perfect in its freshness, and nutritional value. WHERE AS Oatmeal.... is processed from MATURE SEED.
> BY THE WAY, I can Guarantee you, Since i have been doing it since i was 8 years old or so, I have hand fed WAY more Pigeons than you have or ever will.
> ALSO, Pigeons are about the easiest Birds on earth to hand feed successfully.
> ...


Lucky be NICE, you are sounding pretty aggressive again and condescending.


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

CBL, Aggressive? sorry you are of base with that statement.


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

LUCKYT said:


> I never find fault, just look for the truth. AND what is right for the creature involved.
> And no, it is not forever, just during one of the most important developmental Periods of a a Young Birds Growth.
> Read what you wrote about learning something.
> I was Hand feeding pigeons before I could Read, TRUE I learned to read late, it was Levi's Book that helped me learn to read.
> ...


Lucky I dont know why we rub you the wrong way or WHY you get SO angry so quick, Jay is right, there is more than one way to skin a cat and you MUST respect all ways. What works for you is great, and what works for others works GREAT, I BUY the proper SQUAB formula from supplier but have used parrot feed as well, poured soaked seed down throat, crop needed feed. So there is ALWAYS more than one way. Give us your opinion and respect ours as well, you are always quick to temper and looking for a fight and we just dont know why. You cannot control everybody or everything, so stop trying, just partake and lets enjoy EACHothers knowledge. As I said before, Old blood, young blood ALL good. ok!?


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

This particular sentence IS condescending and you are constantly braggin about how much you know and how little we know like we are idiots. I just dont think you get it. Can you not see it? Your quote....

'I have hand fed WAY more Pigeons than you have or ever will'. (you cant possibly know this) 

You come across as very insulting thats all Im saying man. Please just give your 'humble' opinion and help the best you can WITHOUT trashing anyone else, can you do that? Not a difficult thing to ask, just being reasonable, lets be friends, friends are NICE to eachother. You said your wife is the love of your life, do you speak down to her? Would she take it? Dont treat people with disrepsect, treat them like your loving wife. Honeslty.

By the way Nare, if you dont get that bird to a vet, its not going to make it, something is wrong, you are missing something, it needs to be accessed. Poor bird. As someone else said, call a pigeon breeder or club near you, google it and take the bird to them for assesment and maybe they can help you. You are playing russian roulette with its life.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

thanks for replies... and the only vet in our area, dont treat birds.......i will see what can i do....i m searching for a exerienced breeder in our town
and now i have started hand feeding him soaked raw peas again.....


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