# Cruel Or No?



## budgie14 (Sep 6, 2011)

Hello Again,

Some of you may recall that I rescued 2 baby mixed Pigeons/Doves about 6 Months ago. One, being Rocky is doing great, he has been with his new flock at my building for a few Months now and the great part about it is, I get to see him every day since I also feed him..

Now, I still have Shelby, she is in a room all day with a pretty good size double pane window, but she mostly stays on top of the bedroom door. I don't spend much time with her, but we have a great bond! I would say that its a total of about 3-4 hours a day that I see her and play kind of tag with her..I will tap her gently and she kind of fake bites me, pretty cute to see..That said, I feel almost guilty that I'm keeping her here although she is well loved & cared for..She also enjoys seeing my flock of budgies and Love Birds. I know she is 100% healthy now, everything is great! so I also allow her to perch on the windows in my living room which is the same room as the rest of my birds. So again, she really enjoys hanging around them and she also gets to see the other Pigeons/Doves outside, especially when they come to my balcony..

The only other concern I have is the lack of sunlight..The only time she can get some good sun is via the double sliders from the balcony area, but I feel its not enough. All that said, am I being selfish keeping her? What do you guys do with your pet Pigeons? Am I doing okay with her or would it be best to let her go? If letting her go, I would worry like crazy because I have been the only source of her food, shelter, and I guess she must feel like I'm her Mommy so to speak...

So, what do you think? This is my first pet pigeon, what else can you do with a Pigeon? I treat her just like my other birds which I've had for Years now and they are all happy, so is there any difference in having a Pigeon? 

Thanks

Anthony


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

You can give her a supplement that contains calcium and vitamin d3. The d3 replaces the same a pigeon would get from direct contact from the sun. Glass filters UV rays and so the bird must be supplemented.


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## Miss-Sassypants (Sep 25, 2010)

Hi Anthony,
Thank you for caring for these pigeons. If you feel that Shelby is happier with you, let her stay. I know how hard it is to let a pigeon go, especially one that is bonded to you. Perhaps, you can let the pigeon makes its own decision?

Mine stays with me, in an apartment, with the windows and doors all open. If she decides to take off, we will respect that, but of course, since adulthood, we've not taken her outside to deliberate ask her to fly... You can tell if the pigeon prefers to stay. Mine will never go near the windows or open door, and she flies straight into my room, or the middle of the house, if she is frightened by any outside noise.

So there! If Shelby wants to stay, she will. Also, as Charis has advised, please provide her with the calcium and vit D supplement if sunlight is rare in your area. Also, if she is alone, please interact with her regularly so she doesn't feel lonely or abandoned. Pigeons are just as social as humans. They need companions!

Good luck, keep us updated. Photos will be nice too!


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Charis said:


> You can give her a supplement that contains calcium and vitamin d3. The d3 replaces the same a pigeon would get from direct contact from the sun. Glass filters UV rays and so the bird must be supplemented.


Charis, i heard this on PT a lot and i thought it's true. Then i start thinking that i always get red skin sitting by the window in the summer time. Then how come Glass filters UVs. You mean it's blocking completely UV rays from passing through it?

Then why in the store are sunglases that have a certain level of protection from UV rays? I would think that regular glass/window allows UV rays to go through. 

I need a feed back please on this issue, as my BF is building a pigeon shed and we have windows on each wall and he disagrees in regards to UV not going through the glass. 

I talked to a contarctor who build fishtanks. He said that indeed glass stops some of UV, then plexiglass less and plain fibreglass ( not coated with paints) is the best to allow UV to go through ( but this last one is not durable on weather exposure)

How may types of UV are besides UVA & UVB...and which one is better for pigeons?


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## budgie14 (Sep 6, 2011)

Thanks a bunch!!!

Yes, Shelby is the same way, she is terrified to go near the sliders although I will hold her there as much as possible for sun..And like you said Sas, Shelby is pretty much the same way!! When I take her from her room its right to the curtains!! I think she is worried that I will open the door and make her go..LOL 

She is really so cute! and I wish that I had more time to provide her, but that's my fault because I can...Its my other birds that keep me very busy and then keeping up with the cleaning in Shelby's room, miss poopy head!!! Thank God her droppings are perfect! easy to clean...

Okay, so we need some Vit...I use A-Z with electrolytes for my Budgies and I have been giving that to Shelby as well..Is that good enough? Also, what about cuttle bone, things like that? I could make shift a holder for a cuttle bone, but I'm not sure if Pigeons use them or not...I know She like Millet Spray, its like candy to her but I only give so much anyways.

Also, is there anything I can do toy wise for her? What about a mirror? I would like to add a few things to keep her busy if possible, so what about toys? Maybe some rope from one wall to another so she can have another place to perch?

Thanks again!!

Anthony


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## Miss-Sassypants (Sep 25, 2010)

Hi Anthony,
I can't say much about toys... my Krikky kills all the toys I bought for her. She's very territorial, or just plain gangster. 

I don't think cuttlebone works. Although Krikky has proper pigeon grit in her cage all the time, I still handfeed some parrot grit (it's tiny and easily digestible). But only because Krikky is a brat and eating out of my hands makes her feel loved and cared for, lol. Also, that way, I can monitor her calcium intake as she is laying every 3 weeks!

Having a pigeon is the BEST thing that has ever happened to me (Quite sad my life is boring right? lol)... but if you are serious about pampering your little darling, you can check out my pigeon's cabinet in here.

Since that list, I've gotten more stuff for her (Foys Ultimate Vitamins, and also Foys Vitamins and Mineral Supplements). I'm sure you don't have to, but I'm just the extreme case, I'm kinda anal and meticulous when it comes to caring about something, and I go all out, lol.

I'm sure just ONE vitamin and mineral supplement is enough... so there, take your pick!

Good luck! Do post photos of Shelby so we can all melt with her cuteness!


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## Siobhan (Dec 21, 2010)

My Maggie has been an indoor bird for almost 7 years. I buy her oyster shell grit that is enriched with calcium and she munches on it a little every few days. She has the run of the house except overnight and she likes to sit on top of doors when she's not on my lap. She wouldn't know what to do if I did let her go outside and would probably just land on the first human she saw in hopes they'd take her back IN. Your pigeon will be fine indoors.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Dima said:


> Charis, *i heard this on PT a lot and i thought it's true. Then i start thinking that i always get red skin sitting by the window in the summer time. Then how come Glass filters UVs. You mean it's blocking completely UV rays from passing through it?
> *
> Then why in the store are sunglases that have a certain level of protection from UV rays? I would think that regular glass/window allows UV rays to go through.
> 
> ...


Dima...I hope this link will clarify it for you.

http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/can...n-glass-block-sun-rays-that-cause-skin-cancer


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Charis said:


> Dima...I hope this link will clarify it for you.
> 
> http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/can...n-glass-block-sun-rays-that-cause-skin-cancer


So i would think that pigeons need both UVA & UVB to synthesize vitamin D. If windows block UVA , then it's not enough...


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Dima said:


> So i would think that pigeons need both UVA & UVB to synthesize vitamin D. If windows block UVA , then it's not enough...


Birds need UVB, which most window glass blocks (not UVA as you have misread).
You can get glass that allows all UV rays through (after all, UV lamps are made from glass) but it is very thin and not practical to use in a largish expanse for obvious reasons.
As far as sunglasses go, the glass in them (where true glass is used) is relatively thin so UVB & UVA protection is limited. They can be coated with different chemicals to further protect from UVA and UVB, much the same way we use sun cream to protect our skin.
Incidently, if sunglasses with added uv protection get scratched, they should not be used as the scratched area acts like a "hot spot" for the UV, much the same way as a magnifying lens can ignite paper from focussing the suns rays.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Bob, i know you are very good with science. What can you find about fiberglass in regards to UVB & UVA. i know it's better than glass as far as keeping the temp.. couldn't find much about UVs.

Thanks.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Fiberglass is a commonly misused name for a lot of Glass Reinforced Plastic products, but Glass Fiber, as it should be called is actually glass that has been heated and stretched so thin that it becomes a bendable thread.
With that in mind, it will have more or less the same properties as glass although being so thin, singly on their own would probably allow a significant amount of UV through. 
These threads however have virtually no strength but can be woven into sheets or panels and immersed in liquid plastic resin which then sets to make it more durable. (This is what most people call Fiberglass) 
While you can colour the resin pigment if required, a clear resin does not make a clear panel as the glass threads actually make it opaque. 
While this lets a certain amount of ordinary light through I would argue that none of them actually let a significant amount of UV light through as UV light is at the low end of the light spectrum and most of it is reflected or refracted by the least thing, hence the reason a simple application of cream can help protect your skin.


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