# Starting out



## elsiebird (Jul 19, 2009)

I have re posted this as I think I posted in the wrong place.
Hi all.
I have resently moved to s.France from the uk, and I am in the possision to forfill a life long dream and taking on some pigeons .
I live in a house over looking the most southerly part of the alpes and day dream of watching pigeons in flight . 
Before I get any,I want to make sure, I've got things right,so I would like some help from you.
Can they live in a homemade dove cot , with pigeon sized nesting boxes.
Totally open so they are free 24hrs a day?
How will they breed? Like rabbits or will they keep their numbers down according to the roost. We are in a wide open space,but we have a neibouring veggie patch and we don't want to upset its owner.
Will I have to cull the eggs. We have very cold winters poss a month of snow and very hot summer
The cold winters will reduce the breeding, right?
We have to get white pigeons as,and I will whisper this here, but they hunt everything here including pigeons. So white pigeons are seen as domestic and safe,I'm told.
If I just get two to start with they can slowly fill up the cot/loft. Will their babies remain white? Prodomrntly white is fine I just don't want them being shot.
So in a nut shell . i'd like to build them an open loft be sure I we would not get over run by them frantically reproducing.
Also would they eat the neighbors veggies?
Can anyone tell me ideal dimensions for each pigeon box . I have a nice cabinet I wan to convert.
Many many thanks everyone x


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

elsiebird said:


> I have re posted this as I think I posted in the wrong place.
> Hi all.
> I have resently moved to s.France from the uk, and I am in the possision to forfill a life long dream and taking on some pigeons .
> I live in a house over looking the most southerly part of the alpes and day dream of watching pigeons in flight .
> ...


That sounds nice, but...an open dovecote would be visited by birds of pray, so your two would be none at some point, what you can do to help them out is have a loft they can be closed in when hawks are in bigger numbers, I don't know how the hawks migrate where you live, which sounds dreamy to me, but here where I live in Virginia, the hawks are worse in fall and winter, so I keep the birds up allot more, in the late spring and summer I get few hawk visits, so the birds are let out more. Also I work during the week so they are secure during the day and let out in the afternoon/ evening, which IMO, helps, because a hawk probably has found a meal by then, we are also outside allot with them and have saved a number of birds from being killed just by going after the hawk after he strikes, the birds recovered. So if I were you I would make a secure loft and let out the birds in times of low hawk population in your area. You will want to get more than two young white homing pigeons as there will be losses even when careful. They will pair up and breed, you can let them hatch more or use fake eggs in place of the real ones for hatch control, that is another reason to have a secure loft, more control over the happenings with the birds, otherwise in a cote they are more like feral birds. They would not mess with the garden, they like grass seeds and peas though, but if you keep them fed they won't forage much, and you can give your neighbor the droppings to compost for his garden!...lol..if the birds are white most of the young will be also, once in a blue moon I get one with some specks, but when flying the look solid white.


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## elsiebird (Jul 19, 2009)

Ah Thankyou!
I'm going to have a re think as I'm not sure how a closed loft would work for us, due to our work commitments.
In the uk people have dove cots with the birds coming and going all day I kinda wanted that set up. They have buzzards but I've no idea if they are a problem to the birds.thankyou so much for your time and info.
Xx


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

elsiebird said:


> Ah Thankyou!
> I'm going to have a re think as I'm not sure how a closed loft would work for us, due to our work commitments.
> In the uk people have dove cots with the birds coming and going all day I kinda wanted that set up. They have buzzards but I've no idea if they are a problem to the birds.thankyou so much for your time and info.
> Xx


The main problem in the UK is an abundance of Sparrowhawks. The female, being larger, is quite capable of taking even a Wood Pigeon, particularly in Spring and Summer in the hawk breeding season. White birds are very noticeable to the hawks, and 'garden doves' are vulnerable in hawk areas. Peregrines are a problem in some areas, particularly for fanciers. Buzzards (not to be confused with the American Buzzards) are not commonly a problem for pigeons.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

elsiebird said:


> Ah Thankyou!
> I'm going to have a re think as I'm not sure how a closed loft would work for us, due to our work commitments.
> In the uk people have dove cots with the birds coming and going all day I kinda wanted that set up. They have buzzards but I've no idea if they are a problem to the birds.thankyou so much for your time and info.
> Xx


you are welcome. I know I wanted a dovecote too, before reality set in and knew it would of been just feeding the birds of prey and any other animal that could climb a pole and eat the birds. two birds in a dovecote in the alps is a waste Of two birds and time settling them to it..which takes time and feeding.. they still need to be fed in a dovecote so Im not sure if having white pigeons at all is going to work for you if you have work commitments.. the birds need commitment as well.


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

Is it in south France? Do they even have birds of prey which can catch pigeons? Some countries don't have pigeon preditors other than cats but they can be removed just like mice. Dove cotes are great. People have used them for years in many countries. The smart birds will hack it.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

"Falconidae is a family of diurnal birds of prey. They differ from hawks, eagles, and kites in that they kill with their beaks instead of their feet. There are 62 species worldwide of which 10 species have been recorded in France."

"Hawks, Kites & EaglesAccipitridae is a family of birds of prey and include hawks, eagles, kites, harriers and Old World vultures. These birds have powerful hooked beaks for tearing flesh from their prey, strong legs, powerful talons, and keen eyesight. There are 233 species worldwide of which 28 species have been recorded in France."


so yes they do have birds of prey there. I did not even question it..lol.. raptors are all over the world and in most countries.


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## elsiebird (Jul 19, 2009)

Well, it's all food for thought and thank you all . Forums like these are such a valuable resource .
I'm going to track down some local pigeon owners and ask them,as the terrain is so variable here. I really need some local knowledge.
There is a man at the bottom of the mountain who's birds are free , it's not so wild down there.
There is a massive flock of wild pigeons where my horse lived, about 3k up the road, a good sign.
Thanks for your time I had no idea birds of prey were such a problem.
I wondering how my colligues would take me, or my hubby,leaving work at 4pm so i could lock my pigeons in before it got dark. 
Not sure if I'd be on everyone's Christmas card list.
Thanks pigeonkey having looked at the dove cotes the French seem to love them, building beautiful extravagant castle like ones . Made my plan look a bit pathetic. I hope,I hope it will work here. I do so want them to be free, part of the attractin to pigeons they don't have to be caged.
One of the hunters told me,that I may not have to get white ones as they don't shoot pigeons in this area, apparently they are a tricky shot. With all the deer and bore,they're not interested in pigeon. So John perhaps I will avoid the white varity.
Fingers crossed. I will find a way of making it work .
Many thanks folks


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## elsiebird (Jul 19, 2009)

John_D , I think somehow I have swiped the picture of your pigeon!!! I am so sorry!!! I'm not sure how I managed it, it's very nice. it's now in the bottom right of my post. When my clever fella get home I'll ask him to remove it. Sorry and thanks for your post . I'm gonna find out what birds we have here .


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