# Structural Basics for a Loft



## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

First off I preface this by saying that I have spent most of my professional life working as an Architect.

I do NOT know as much about interior loft layout as probably most folks here...nest boxes,perching areas, feeding areas, door traps, all of that.

BUT...I DO know how to properly design an enclosure with structural integrity, and also how to maximize the efficiency of materials used.

Attached is a basic sketch of a proper loft structure. For the sake of whatever, this one is dimensioned at 4x8 floor plan....it can actually be extended to 8x8 without changing any of the structural sizes/elements.

The idea here is you want proper-sized framing members, and proper framing connections and details so once built, she won't be blowing back and forth in the wind. 

A few tips:

1) Find a carpenter/handyman on Craigslist if you don't know anyone who can do it.

Using these sketches, you can alter the floor dimension to your need and they can give you a pretty accurate bid on the construction based upon the specifications in these drawings.

2) building materials are usually produced in 4' and 8' increments, at least here in the u.s. Plywood sheets, gypsum sheetrock sheets, prefab siding sheets...are 4x8. Most dimensional lumber is sold in 8', 9' and 16' increments. 

So, you can therefore use 4x8 as your "unit". An 8x8 loft is 2 units....a 12x8 loft is 3 units...etc...Sticking with the 4x8 'unit' maximizes the material usage and minimizes labor (cutting).

3) If you go with a wood frame floor, have it built _sloping 1/4" per foot _towards an open side of the loft. This makes drainage better when you are cleaning and avoids still water/puddles.

3) For a plywood floor, I recommend finishing off with either a lightweight concrete topping or something known as an _'elastomeric'_ paint/coating over the plywood. Makes cleanup much easier and is a more durable surface than plywood or painted plywood.

4) Have your builder throw in a _diagonal cross-brace_ here or there...it aids to the lateral stability of the Loft...so you don't end up with a leaning tower 2 years down the road.

5) In areas with cold winters, say 40 degrees or below....the prefabricated concrete post footings will not cut it. They will need to be wet-set into a poured 16x16x12" deep post footing in order to get the bottom of the footing below the frost heave line. 
If you just use the prefab footing all by itself, sitting on level ground.....in an area with regular winter frosts..after a while the footing will start going unlevel....

This is a sketch of a very simple Loft Structural Frame with a raised wood floor, using 8' posts and 8' framing members and plywood. 

Any carpenter or builder can read this (or geez, they should be able to )...even if it isn't as readily apparent to a layman. 

Use it as a departure point.... or for a bid estimate....Remember this is just the structure. 
Doors, windows, walls, atriums, nestboxes, etc.....all else is up to you  

(Actually, I'd even recommend having the carpenter start by building THIS structure, then you can go stand in it and decide how you want it finished off as far as all of those fun Pigeon-loft things...)


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## Rafael/PR (Sep 8, 2008)

thank you for all that nice info


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

theres a couple of words on diagram 2 I dont like the look of.......
CHICKEN WIRE !!!!!!


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

I have edited that, thanks that.....*heavy-duty wire grid*....


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

That doesn't look like the normal building construction for a building that size, maybe for something smaller like a 4'x4' or an aviary.


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Thanks for the comment...granted, you for sure have something much more complex and as I noted...this is just a basic structural skeletal design.

I have been an architect for 25 years, and spent 6 of those years as an in-house architect for a structural engineer. If it were to house something of the live load/weight of humans.... 24/7, the joists and ledgers would be upped in size; the footings would be wider and deeper. But it's a Pigeon enclosure. 

This is what is known as a basic *Trabeated *structural design. Commonly called "post and beam". 

Posts at the corners with horizontal floor and roof members plus a few diagonal braces thrown in is all you need for a safe enclosure with integrity against the elements (and occasional tremor, for that matter).

Reminder...the intent of this being to erect a safe structure relatively quickly, with minimal materials and labor. Have been sending sketches to folks off & on for a few years, and really they all basically boil down to something like this.

I see so many posts here from people saying "I have decided to build a separate loft/coop for my Pigeons because the garage/house/rabbit hutch/wife's study/etc. just isn't working out...but I have no idea how to start, how much it costs, or where to find someone !"

This gets the ball rolling on all fronts. A toolbelt carpenter generally hates to have to come up with a design themselves (and when they do, it is seldom a good one); while they rather love it when a potential client hands them something to work off of, because they can do a materials count and estimate labor time right there, almost on the spot.

In most places in the 'states....hiring someone to build this plus an added interior wall and some nestboxes, will end up running LESS than purchasing a prefab unit.
The added advantage here being, the owner gets to determine the size and shape...and they and the builder can add whatever flourishes they like.


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Updated the sketches to something a bit clearer.....


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## BansheeX9 (Feb 24, 2012)

Thank you so much this will help me emensely in building my first loft.


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

In our area that type structure is built to be sided with metal and not very well suited for a loft design. Normal building contruction should be used when building a loft. Your design is not a typical loft structure and not very well done for someone with that much experiance.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> In our area that type structure is built to be sided with metal and not very well suited for a loft design. Normal building contruction should be used when building a loft. Your design is not a typical loft structure and not very well done for someone with that much experiance.


Not everyone has your expertise of building & craftmanship, or indeed needs it.
There are numerous people who visit this site looking for simple ideas to get started as they do not have a clue. 
They do not need to be full building quality drawings up to design standard. As jaye has said, they are just rouigh sketches to give folks something to start from.
For anyone that doesnt have a clue where to begin, they can show the drawings to someone with basic carpentry skills, who will be able to make alterations, give costings etc.


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> In our area that type structure is built to be sided with metal and not very well suited for a loft design. Normal building contruction should be used when building a loft. Your design is not a typical loft structure and not very well done for someone with that much experiance.


You know, while I appreciate apt comments...do you suppose that I would come here & post a non-structurally sound edifice? 
While I certainly value your own loft expertise and your examples are top-notch (and have previously noted this quite courteously)...*you seem to be implying there is one "correct" method of building a loft.* 
Please keep in mind: "it ain't the way we do it around these parts"...is not synonymous with your implication that this is somehow "incorrect". 

I find it puzzling that a conventional post-and-beam design for a 4x8 pod, would be deemed by anybody to be abnormal or somehow inappropriate....(?)

I dunno if you feel I am stepping on your toes in this section of the forum. If so, not my intent. 

But casting aspersions upon another member (who happens to be able to stand on professional experience in posting the suggestion to begin with)...is really just going to digress this whole topic.

I simply noticed a pattern in these threads, and decided to chime in: like many things, people tend to focus and jump on all of the bells and whistles of a project...and sometimes as a result, neglect the bare bones. But you gotta start with the bare bones being done right. 

I also see folks going out and buying prefab sheds and enclosures, for relatively exhorbitant amounts of money if my online surfing is any indication...which are also neither structurally sound nor particularly appropriate for their needs. Oftentimes, once at the property, these prefabs need to be modified on-site anyway, so there's added labor and expense to that as well. Wouldn't it be better to spend less of that money, and end up with something of sounder build and of a size and configuration that you want and need, and that YOU can specify...instead of letting Home Depot specify it ?
Once more, the intent:
*
The impetus for posting this structure is because the question comes up often. And...rather than just addressing it all over again, each time it comes up...and rather than having each subsequent thread just be full of replies containing photos of a variety completed lofts....all of which,while very interesting and well-meaning, may not give anyone the pertinent info they need to actually get started on their own.*

*This is the most basic and stripped-down skeletal structure one can build, in the most inexpensive a fashion, using the least amount of common available material...and end up with a good, solid enclosure. It can be constructed by a layman who bones up a bit on carpentry...or it can be constructed by a $15-30/hour toolbelt Craigslist carpenter.
*



Quazar said:


> *There are numerous people who visit this site looking for simple ideas to get started* as they do not have a clue.
> They do not need to be full building quality drawings up to design standard. As Jaye has said, they are just rough sketches to give folks something to start from. For anyone that doesn't have a clue where to begin, they can *show the drawings to someone with basic carpentry skills, who will be able to make alterations, give costings etc.*


Quazar can say it in 40% of the words I used....

I have indicated it can be *multiplied*, and as I have indicated it can be *embellished* as one likes.

Is it as fancy as some others here ? No. 

Is it more sound than some others here ? Yes.... it certainly is.

Can it be beefed up even more ? Yes, it can...but again, that will raise the expense; and it would not be necessary unless it was subject to human loading most of the time.


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

Jaye, Your not stepping on my toes. You have you opinions and I have mine, That's whats nice about this forum, everyone has there opinions and the readers can choose which way they want to go. I'm simply saying that if you are going to build a loft of that size. You should use conventional floor, wall and roof construction. I didn't say you had to. If I can ask what kind of construction did you use on your loft?


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Hi.First off there's nothing 'unconventional' about the roof or floor...they are both standard joist/rater construction, spanning between ledger/beam members with a subfloor and subroof.

Completely conventional. The only thing which differs for what you all 'conventional' is the fact that post and beams are substituted for stud walls.

No need to construct bearing walls...the beams and posts provide the structural integrity instead. Then you can choose to infill between the posts and beams with whatever you want, or don't.

Again, quick to erect, less labor than framing stud walls.

My loft is a converted deck....a typical post and beam deck, actually...(!)


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

If you use post hole diggers and set those post in the ground you make it even more stable. Standard pole barn construction except you put it on blocks and added a floor. I put floors in the feed/tack room of barns and have the same thing you got just on a larger scale. In the south we have no need to insulate so no need to have a 4 inch thick wall.


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## orock (Mar 28, 2011)

Jaye Thanks for sharing your sketches, I'm sure they'll guide a Newbie in the right direction.


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## bhymer (Jan 8, 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ox9IgnyHtCQ

Build your loft and enjoy your pigeons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## billyr70 (Jun 11, 2009)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> In our area that type structure is built to be sided with metal and not very well suited for a loft design. Normal building contruction should be used when building a loft. Your design is not a typical loft structure and not very well done for someone with that much experiance.


Jaye, your design looks good to me, dont take what ShadyBug says to heart, hes only 10 years old and likes to build doll houses.


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

honeyrobber said:


> If you use post hole diggers and set those post in the ground you make it even more stable. Standard pole barn construction except you put it on blocks and added a floor.


Yup......tried-and-true woodframe method for centuries, really. Oftentimes simplicity is the best solution.

Funny you mention the post-hole diggers; there's another thread here where the question came up regarding post footings, and one's variety of options there...



bhymer said:


> Build your loft and enjoy your pigeons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Amen, brooother.....

...and there you go...the basic structural system is....post & beam ! 

Yours with a lotta NICE details (*love* the tile roof !)

Matter o' fact....jeez....that's nicer than most places I ever lived in !!!!


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