# Ohio laws???



## Muskrat24

Is it legal in ohio to trap and raise feral pigeons? If you do, do you need a propergation permit? Thank you for your time.


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## Grim

No they are not protected, they are only protected against cruelty. As long as you use a humane trap I don't see any red flags. Passers by may make a stir though seeing you do it. 

You just want ferals as pets? Or are you using them to hunt with?


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## JGregg

Trapping wild animals for any purpose isn't an ethical practice as far as I'm concerned. If you wanted to keep pigeons as a hobby it seems like you would want to purchase birds from someone, or take their culls. However, your first thought is to trap the poor birds so I find it likely that you plan to use the pigeons for a cruel purpose.


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## Muskrat24

*Pigeons*

Cage trap them. I wanted to try training them to fly messeges back home. I found it interesting that the way they were used during war times.


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## JGregg

It's very easy to obtain birds from other hobbyists, and they're acclimated to living in a loft. Heck, you could get homers let them raise babies and the birds raised in your loft would be homed there. Ferals just plain don't home like homers.


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## Grim

I hate to say it but I do not think you want wild pigeons to actually train them to fly messages. There not even for that and during the war trained homing pigeons were used. They are very different from your wild pigeons.

Whatever your true purpose is (Maybe I am wrong), but I do think you want them for training dogs/hunting. It's not much of my business though, but I would advise against it.


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## JGregg

Gotta agree with your call Grim.


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## flitsnowzoom

HI Muskrat and welcome to Pigeon-talk. 

If you want to have birds trained to fly messages home, you'll be better off (as will the birds) getting some homing pigeons and training them. Ferals have the homing instinct but it is not nearly as great as pigeons that are bred to home. There's loads of great advice on this site and several pigeon organizations that will be happy to help you get started in the hobby. There's probably some pigeon fanciers in your area that can help you get started. 

Even though many homers look like ferals from a distance but they have been bred for hundreds and hundreds of years to "home". Those homing instincts have been honed to a fine degree through this breeding. The fancier then trains the birds to home to a certain location. It looks cool and sounds like a lot of fun to attach those little message carriers to pigeon feet, but a lot of hard work and care goes into training these birds so they perform well and come home safe and sound. 

Enjoy the ferals, feed them and watch them, and help protect them.


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## Charis

Ferals would be inclined to returned to the location from where they were trapped.


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## naturegirl

Muskrat I think you are barking up the wrong tree here. Your name on here unfortunately gives you away. Try clay pigeons they work better andthere is no harm in that. Please leave the ferals alone as they are GODs creatures

Cindy


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## Muskrat24

*Wow*

Wow none of you know me. I am a furbearer trapper yes, but that is mostly because I've had them take my birds. In peticular about 37 of my chickens in a night. These pigeons I was talking about were about to be exterminated by a farmer who doesn't want them to be in his barn. He had a few kids lined up with bb/pellet guns to get rid of as many as the could. Then he was going to get rid of the rest of them. He asked me if I wanted them because I mentioned something about it to his grandson. I wanted to see if it was legal for me to capture them and raise them. I know that in ohio pigeons are not protected

"common pigeons, other than homing pigeons, may be killed at any time, except Sunday, and their nests or eggs may be destroyed at any time"


If I was going to train dogs I wouldn't of come to a site that cares for pigeons and such and ask questions here. I guess I'll just tell him I don't want them.



MR24


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## Skyeking

You have to know that we do get some characters here who really do mean the birds harm, and will try to disguise themselves.

By all means, RESCUE THEM if their other option is death. We would not ordinarily recommend anyone capture a feral pigeon who has lived its life wild and free, but in this case it is a rescue situation. 

Please check our resource section for information on care and feeding.


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## beebiz

Muskrat24 said:


> Wow none of you know me. I am a furbearer trapper yes, but that is mostly because I've had them take my birds. In peticular about 37 of my chickens in a night. These pigeons I was talking about were about to be exterminated by a farmer who doesn't want them to be in his barn. He had a few kids lined up with bb/pellet guns to get rid of as many as the could. Then he was going to get rid of the rest of them. He asked me if I wanted them because I mentioned something about it to his grandson. I wanted to see if it was legal for me to capture them and raise them. I know that in ohio pigeons are not protected
> 
> "common pigeons, other than homing pigeons, may be killed at any time, except Sunday, and their nests or eggs may be destroyed at any time"
> 
> 
> If I was going to train dogs I wouldn't of come to a site that cares for pigeons and such and ask questions here. I guess I'll just tell him I don't want them.
> 
> 
> 
> MR24


I understand why it was done.... I think. But, this is also a good example of what *can* happen if we jump to conclusions and ass-u-me things!

JMO,
Robert


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## JGregg

Sorry about that, but your posts looked really strange. By all means you should trap the ferals as they're in danger where they are located. Don't hesitate to just state why you want to do something next time!


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## naturegirl

Have you all noticed that Muskrat has slipped out of the conversation and hasn't been around? Guess he somehow got the info he wanted.  

Cindy


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## beebiz

naturegirl said:


> Have you all noticed that Muskrat has slipped out of the conversation and hasn't been around? Guess he somehow got the info he wanted.
> 
> Cindy


Or, he may have decided (thanks to the way he was treated here) that it wasn't worth the effort to mess with them. After all, that's what he said. But, I suppose that could be a lie too.

Cindy, do you not think that there is the slightest chance that his intentions were exactly as he stated in his last post and he has simply had his feelings hurt? I have no doubt that there are devious people out there who would use this site for ill intended purposes. But, I am also sure that there are people out there with good intentions who (for lack of knowledge and experience of and with pigeons) will ask questions that throw up red flags to such highly experienced and knowledgeable individuals as yourself. And, when attacked and virtually called a liar, they simply decide that the effort isn't worth the trouble. Thus, a pigeon or group of pigeons who might otherwise have been rescued is/are doomed!! Again, it is an example of what can happen when we jump to conclusions and *ass-u-me* things!!!

As some of you may know, I purchased 20 pigeons at a livestock auction for the purpose of using them as hawk bait to keep hawks away from my chickens. Not exactly the most humane of intentions, huh?? But, after I got them home (thanks to the pigeons themselves) I learned two things. First, they were far too wonderful creatures to use them simply as bait.... for anything!! Second, though I am a good hearted and very soft hearted individual, I was about to do something with these pigeons that was very, very cruel and *wrong*!! It was because of my lack of knowledge and experience that I had not realized this to begin with.

I've gone back and re-read all the posts in this thread. Admittedly, I am still a newbie to this site and to pigeons. But, I am a veteran at dealing with people. When I first began asking questions about pigeons, had I been treated as Muskrat was, I can assure you that my 20 pigeons would have ended up as hawk bait! Because, even if I didn't offer them up to the hawks, the other guy who was bidding on them would have... I know for a fact that he uses them for that purpose.

I had initially thought that the members of this site were wonderful, caring, kind hearted people. It is my sincere hope that most of you are. But, there are some of you who seriously need to check yourselves!! To ass-u-me that a person has ill intentions simply because the questions that they ask just don't seem fall in the catagory of what you consider "normal" and to further suspect them simply because their user name doesn't fit in the "I worship pigeons or other animals" catagory...... it *ain't* right!!! I understand that you want to protect pigeons, but that's an overreaction that goes clear to the other end of the spectrum!!

It has made me seriously consider disassociating myself from this forum!! I don't like mean animals. And, I like mean humans even less!! Shall you now call *me* a liar and ill intended????? We'll see!

Robert


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## Whitefeather

naturegirl said:


> *Have you all noticed that Muskrat has slipped out of the conversation* *and hasn't been around*? Guess he somehow got the info he wanted.
> 
> Cindy


He posted yesterday at 2:39 PM (Post #11), to explain the situation.

Cindy


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## naturegirl

Well Robert I will be the first to apologize for my apparently ill intentions here. The people on this site are extremely wonderful people and will go to the end to help save a bird that others will sometimes go out of their way to harm or kill. The cost of rehabbing a bird can go anywheres from $20.00 to $1000.00 + for which comes out of our own pockets. As for the name he goes by well it doesn't look good when he goes by Muskrat and then is talking about trapping feral pigeons, alot of people may jump to the wrong conclusion here. There are people that have come on here and ask questions as they want pigeons for training hunting dogs and to use as bait. So you can't really blame us for being on the look out for people like that. I am very happy you decided against using your newly bought pigeons as hawk food. These are truly wonderful birds. If you disassociate yourself from this site for some people voicing their opinions which we are all entitled to then it would be ashame for you to leave because this is a wonderful site with terrific people on here. I am not highly experienced and knowledgeable that is why I come on this site to learn from others and to help others for which I know just like everyone else on here that is what makes this site unique. I will leave now with my deepest apologies for my big mouth and voicing my opinion on this matter I hope you stay a member but if you don't then all I can say is it is your loss. 

CINDY


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## Muskrat24

*Pigeons*

No I didn't get the info I wanted. I went back to talk to the farmer and after a little bit I found out the real reason he didn't want the pigeons in their. They make a mess but they where making a mess of his tractor. He said he'd wait until feburary to see if it was legal to capture them. In return I would clean his tractor, before it snows. If I am not legally aloud then I will have to figure something else out.


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## Muskrat24

*Pigeons*

Thank you Beebiz for sticking up for me.


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## beebiz

Muskrat24 said:


> Thank you Beebiz for sticking up for me.


No problem Muskrat! When we love and care about something/someone, we tend to misjudge other's intentions when a situation doesn't seem to be quite "right" to us. And, it doesn't help when there really are individuals out there who are cruel and try to disguise themselves as innocent, well meaning individuals. For the overreaction, please forgive us.

Good luck with getting to collect and rescue the pigeons. If you are willing to not only do that but to also clean the man's tractor, you *must* care about them!! I wish you the best with them.

If you don't mind, send me an email directly by clicking here. I'd really like to talk to you further.

Robert


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## Muskrat24

*Pigeons*

I've always found birds fasinating. With the property my mom and dad bought I wasn't really able to have any farm animals, except poultry. And I have always enjoyed listening and watching how they work, and act. As of the farmer he was a nice man but really cared for his tractor. The barn is normally closed so if it is illegal for me I'll seal up any entrances, and check back every now and then, to make sure they havn't found their way back in. There is an old run down shack/barn that is on my friends property. It would be perfect for the pigeons but for some reason none live there. If it does turn out illegal I will capture a few and set them in the shack for a few days with food and water then release them and keep a feeder with some bird seed or such for a week or two to try and get them acclimated to the new place. I figured a few days in there and food available they might move in.


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## naturegirl

Could there be hawks or owls on the old shack/barn property? That may be why they aren't going there as they have seen preditors hanging there. Pigeons love safflower seed it is like candy for them try some of that as well and something shallow for water that they can get a drink and bath, maybe they will sortof tell the rest of them that there is a better spot over there and lets go there instead of here. 

Cindy


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## Whitefeather

Muskrat24 said:


> I went back to talk to the farmer and after a little bit I found out the real reason he didn't want the pigeons in their. They make a mess but they where making a mess of his tractor. He said he'd wait until feburary to see if it was legal to capture them.
> *In return I would clean his tractor, before it snows*.


What a wonderful gesture Muskrat.  

Cindy


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## Grim

If you want them to stay in the new place I would keep them locked in for a month. Keep them well fed and they should stay. Seal up the farmers barn and if they do return to his barn and see they can't get in they should return to you.

good luck


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