# need advice for setup of "hospital"



## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

i just thought since some of you have been running your "hospitals" for so long you might have better ideas or setups than i have.
right now i have old towels or rags, and when the get too poopy and have been turned to every clean side, i put it in a box, and every few days i have to go clean the poop off, mind you, inside (basement,) because i am afraid of doing it outside and having the seedy poop eaten by outside birds and getting sick.
so, i take them to the basement ( the towels) and have to pick off the poop, becAUSE i cant wash them with poop all over.
maybe there is a better solution? any other good hospital setup ideas, time saving ones?? anything?
the whole poop cleaning thing takes forever!!


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## KIPPY (Dec 18, 2003)

I think a lot use newspaper instead of towels, easier to dispose.

Not a hospital but I do have occasional incoming. Maybe some of these ideas can help. 

I have no room in the house so these guys stay outside. I have 4 med. dog carriers with there own heating pad. We have a patio set that I guess we bought for the pigeons. I couldn't tell you the last time we used it for ourselves, and I can't remember the last time the patio set has seen sun (there covered).

I don't get the paper I use towels and shake and scrape the towels off in a rubbermade garbage container then transfer to a garbage bag and throw it away. It's a process, it sucks but that's how I do it. I change the towels everyday because they do have a tendency of getting damp from the droppings and the water bowl. Old beach towels to cover the cages at night.

They have cheap bath towels at Walmart, not too thick and fit in the carriers nicely. Beach towels should be going on clearance soon.


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## Becca199212 (May 10, 2007)

I dont have a 'hospital' either and I don't know if this is any good but we do have a sick cage that gets a old hand towel that gets quite dirty, we just blast it with the hose then leave it out to dry and put it back in for the night.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Moxie, we do like Becca - accumulate 5-6 towels, take outside and hose down with strong water pressure and then bring them inside to wash in hot water with clorox. Becca, I don't think it is a great idea to hose yours down, let dry and reuse. You're just compounding the germ problem.

Also, Moxie, we use plastic containers (like from Wal-mart) that have sides about 12-15 inches high and the bottom is just large enough for a folded newspaper page. We drill many holes in the lid for air. The sicker birds use these cages to help keep contained and warm. We place hand towels on top of the newspaper and then usually roll up a larger towel like a donut and place the pigeon inside. We keep two always ready. After the bird is better they're moved to a regular cage and we clean the plastic container with a clorox solution, let air dry and then prepare it for the next one.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

One thing I do, is use Viva paper towels over the regular towels. Viva brand is softer than regular paper towels, having an almost Cotton feel to them.
When I was first starting out and before I had an incubator, I picked up old 5 gal. aquariums at the Goodwill to use as make shift incubators. I would put the heating pad underneath and a light over it too. I put a thermometer inside so I could check the temp..


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

I use dog carriers and keep a heating pad at the bottom of the carrier
then cover that w/enuf newspaper to take out a section every morning
and toss. If I use a whole section, it's dry at the next section underneath
and if not, I take that section too. Some folks get good at tea leaf readings,
I've gotten pretty good at newspaper/poo readings. I used to use papertowels,
but that is very pricey and decided to try the newspaper thing and it worked 
fine. I vaccuum the cages and disinfect weekly or as needed.

I use paper towels for cleaning and toss, that way I avoid putting it through
the washing machine. I bag everything that I toss, and the hand towels/bath
towels are used to put over the cages at night or to "burrito" or to just have
on my lap when feeding.

fp


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

feralpigeon said:


> I use dog carriers and keep a heating pad at the bottom of the carrier
> then cover that w/enuf newspaper to take out a section every morning
> and toss. If I use a whole section, it's dry at the next section underneath
> and if not, I take that section too.* Some folks get good at tea leaf readings,
> ...


LOL!  I use newspapers and paper towels with occasional old towels. The towels worth washing, I shake off dried poop into a garbage bag and then bleach the towels.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi X, 



When I know or once I find out, that the poops of a Caged new arrival are going to be leaky or messy, I use soft Paper Towells on top of the regular Towell, and I change those twice-a-day.


For 'normal' poopers, I use regular Towells merely.


This makes the subsequent clean-up of the Towells much easier, pending their being Laundered.

Ideally, a light hand brush off and a few smart 'snaps' or 'flaps' out side, and that's it.


Phil
l v


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Okay. LOL, Here's a commercial for VIVA.[ Wish I could sing the jingle.]
If you have a baby, for example that needs to be on a towel, VIVA paper towel on top saves the towel at least for a while.
I also wrap a paper towel around donut towel and change the paper towel as needed. Saves on laundry. I hate doing laundry.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

I remembered Treesa has a thread in the Resources section where she talks about this product. 

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpost.php?p=94343&postcount=1


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Lady Tarheel said:


> I remembered Treesa has a thread in the Resources section where she talks about this product.
> 
> http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpost.php?p=94343&postcount=1


I've used them for larger birds such as ducks and chickens. They are great.
I always have a package on hand. They are nice because they can be used whole or cut to size.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I use the Chux for those birds with very watery poops, they are absolutely a must have, especially with a heating pad (wrapped under a towel)underneath. With birds that don't have the watery poops, I use paper towels over the towel the heating pad is under.

For all other birds that have no need for heating pads, a thick lining of newspaper works, so you can take off a layer when necessary.

I bought a few plastic picknick baskets from the dollar store that are just big enough to use for hospital cage, and they have a locking lid and lots of air flow. You can hook/clip feeder and water cups in them, and they are roomy enough for a heating pad. I wish I had bought more now, they are wonderful.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Treesa, when you get a free moment, would you share a picture of the baskets? I am always on the lookout for better ways and they sound GOOD.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

I have also found that useing two still-connected Paper Towells for wrapping a Pigeon into a 'Burrito' for Seed-Pop or Tube-Feeding, works very very well and is simpler than cloths...and is best for those who may make some messy poops while in the 'Burrito'...or who may have some contageous illness.

One merely discards the Paper Towells once they are fed, and that's it.

Phil
l v


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Chux sound JUST GREAT, Treesa! I remember that posting! 

You sound like I do about VIVA! I remember my friend telling me about VIVA years ago, except they were called something else at that time. They are STRONG and SOFT and I wouldn't be without them! I think they may even come in "thirds." which saves paper. Someone had a better idea with THAT one! 

I would buy cheap paper towels for cleaning up occasional messes with Squeaks and would cut the sheets in half to save money. Now, many brands of paper towels come in "thirds," with the option of tearing off more if needed.

I, too, keep old towels for pet "emergencies." 

Also, for covering Squeaks' home, I use a light table cloth...however, one side of his home is against a wall. For the front part of his door, I use 2 clothes pins to attach a small towel. Keeps the A/C from causing a draft. 

Clothes pins (the "pincher" kind) can be another item in one's supplies.

Shi


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## Margarret (May 3, 2007)

If you can't find Chux, just get puppy training pads. They are essentially the same thing and can be found in any grocery store. The top stays dry with the fluid traped in the layers beneath.
I have several cotton drop cloths for covering cages. They can be washed and bleached.
I use a lot of towels, big ones and small ones. Just scrape the poop off and wash in hot water with bleach. I also use old tee shirts or sweat shirts with the neck and sleeves cut off for padding, doughnuts, whatever. Tee shirt jersey is sometimes easier to make doughnuts for little squeakers and is very soft for them. When these all get holes and too raggedy for cage use, they turn into cleaning rags and when they are too worn out for that...LOL, my family sez I would braid rugs or use them for stuffing something. Sez I, you can't just throw away a perfectly useful rag!

Margaret


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## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

do you think i should be worried about cleaning towels off outside where the seed encrusted poop is going to be eaten by other birds? when i used to clean off outside, the birds would be out in that spot the next mornng, pecking at the sicky poo!
well, i HATE paper towels, but it is probably easier, and i guess i cant recycle the newspaper after pijjie pooped all over it!  
thanks you guys, i just see that with all these sickies here, i am spending a lot of time cleaning after them! and the corrosive pigeon poop is eating through the metal cages, right through my floor!!


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Well, you won't be able to recylcle the paper towels or Chux either  ...

It's not a good idea to clean the towels in an area out of doors where
the droppings of birds, known to be sick, will scatter in the environment
and be attractive to other birds to eat/peck at. This is precisely why I use newspaper and bag everything as though it were bio-hazardous. I do this w/the paper towels as well. If I had a way to burn them, I would. In terms of worm eggs, I have not yet read that a bird w/worms that is discharging eggs in the droppings, can have these eggs
destroyed through the use of bleach.

fp


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

xxmoxiexx said:


> do you think i should be worried about cleaning towels off outside where the seed encrusted poop is going to be eaten by other birds? when i used to clean off outside, the birds would be out in that spot the next mornng, pecking at the sicky poo!
> well, i HATE paper towels, but it is probably easier, and i guess i cant recycle the newspaper after pijjie pooped all over it!
> thanks you guys, i just see that with all these sickies here, i am spending a lot of time cleaning after them! and the corrosive pigeon poop is eating through the metal cages, right through my floor!!




Hi X,


One cleans off such things first, inside, where they are merely brushed off by hand or pried off with finger tips, gently into the trash bag...and then, if one wants, one takes the Towell outside to 'flap' it a few times prior to laundering.

If anything is still sticking to it, then one can pry or brush it off then.

Or, if the Seeds are on a Cage Towell, along with healthy poops, from a healthy, pro-tem Bird being caged, then who cares if the Seeds are in fact scattered out doors...it is far FAR better than when you feed the ferals and sick ones among them make leaky disease carrying poops right on to the Seeds you just put out, or, you put out Seeds right onto leaky disease carrying poops already 'there' outside, yes?



Sick or penetrating/leaky poos are best accomidated with a two or three layers of Paper Towells be-cause one merely, gently, fold them into their center IN the Cage, and, discards them into the trash, along with whatever Seeds are on them.


Healthy poops, whether 'Seed encrusted' or not, can be brushed off easily into a Garbage Bag.


This need not present complicated impasses...


Whatever Seeds are on a Towell I am about to change out...I just brush or pour them off into a Trash Bag, brush off with the edge of my hand, or pry off with my finger tips, whatever poops I can, either over the Garbage Bag or outside, and that is it.


I try and use Towells which are only a little larger than the Cage bottom, and sometimes I cut large Towells into smaller pieces for this, folding their edged underneath when I set them up.

For many reasons, 'Newspapers' are a poor choice.

But if one insists TO use them, they should for sure be changed every day.


Best wishes!

Phil
l v


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## flitsnowzoom (Mar 20, 2007)

Well, if worm eggs are impervious to pigeon poo, then maybe we need to get collecting the worms and sell them as bridge coatings.  


Disposable stuff makes more sense to me than trying to clean old rags, towels, etc especially if you share a common laundry facility. Last thing somebody that isn't that fond of pigeons needs is to see you doing pidgie poopy stuff in a common washing machine. (and that brings back the very bad memories of grad school and having to use a local laundrymat. Talk about biohazards in the machines  ).


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

*To begin with ... and end up with ....*

Well Moxie

SINCE YOU ASKED FOR ADVICE, I CAN ONLY ASSURE THAT

YOU ASKED FOR IT!!!!!

My advice, then, runs as follows...

paperwork, forms, insurance forms, more forms, release forms, more forms, throw in a few telephone books to bulk out the paperwork, more paper, blank tablets for noting which forms and paperwork you still might need, and of course, state and municipal and federal forms of any imaginable sort, maybe some income tax IRS forms for the pigeons to fill out, living will forms

have I left anything out? Of course. But it will come to me.

What hospital or clinic is worth its band-aids without forms and paperwork? 

And don't forget a bushel of pens for filling out those forms.

Larry

(Monitors can delete this post. Probably causes unpleasant reminders to too many PT members).


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

*Paper linings*

We get large rolls of paper, perforated for tearing off sheets, such as is used as an undersheet on hospital trolleys, gurneys or whatever you'd call them. They come from a company which supplies all kinds of hospital equipment and disposables in boxes of maybe a dozen rolls. Cynthia has large chipmunk or chinchilla cages for non-critical patients, and a few sheets are just right for those, and quick to change. Cynthia just despaired at the number of poopy towels! She uses towels for birds which need a do-nut arrangement, like our Crystal who had a broken leg when we first got him, or others who need something extra-soft.

Of course, in a cage without a shelf, a brick to perch on is mandatory for any pigeon able to do so.

Heatpads, low wattage infra-red light bulbs or heat lamps (used for reptiles), plastic or glass tanks - we have these for ICU patients.

We use one of those steam thingummies for sterilising babies' bottles to sterilise syringes and feeding tubes, and pump-action gel stuff for sterilising hands (as well as good ol' soap and water) to avoid passing anything from a sick bird to others when handling several patients. 

Face masks good enough to keep out feather dust, dried poop dust or 'animal proteins'.

Oh dear, it all gets so complicated 

John


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Well, there you have it, whether you use newspapers, paper towels, exam paper, construction paper, 
cloth towels, etc., they should be changed daily
as viral, bacterial, mold and other unfriendly organisms for a bird's health 
can multiply when left unchanged on a daily basis. I think the real issues are 
changing daily, keeping the living area clean and dry, and providing a surface
that is easy to view the droppings on.

I googled the topic and found some interesting links on cage liners:

http://www.starlingcentral.net/cages.htm

http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww12eiii.htm

http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww12eiii.htm

I really liked the idea of the cage that was made to hold a roll 
of paper on one side at the bottom. From the opposite side of the cage
that the roll is on you just pull the soiled paper out and voila! As you pull
the soiled one out you simulaneously pull a new clean piece in. Pretty
cool 

fp


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## nabisho (Nov 18, 2004)

*We use a lot of chux pads here's a link*

http://www.northshorecare.com/chux1.html

These guys are OK but sometimes you can find them even cheaper on eBay. We have about 6 heating pads of various sizes. We have about 12 portable small incubators for eggs that can be powered from a car cigarette lighter. We have two large incubators and one surplus human baby incubator with battery backup etc. Then we have a dedicated refrigerator, dedicated freezer, washing machine & dryer, and a dedicated industrial duty dish washer/sterlizer unit for all the feeding plates & dishes etc. We have 12 36" X 36" X 36" stainless steel infirmary pens and a dedicated air conditioner and heaters for the infirmary room. We also keep a stand alone kerosene heater ready during the winter months in case we lose power. We also keep a stock of anti-biotics and suplements and all the implements. We got a couple full operating room surgery table set ups donanted from surplus hospital stuff. A lot of times you can get stuff that the hospital has to just throw away but is still perfectly good, some of it never used. We also keep a lot of velcro and slings and bandages etc on hand. Right now we have 6 pelicans, 1 eagle, 5 red tail hawks and several barn owls and kestrals. Been a busy year for the pelicans they seem to be having a lot of accidents this year, we think it might be the drought, we have had very little rain.

NAB 

NAB


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Nab, just have to say....you rock!

fp


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

feralpigeon said:


> Nab, just have to say....you rock!
> 
> fp



Do I ever SECOND that, fp!!!

Your updates are ALWAYS anticipated, Nab! WHAT A GREAT JOB YOU and YOUR GF DO!!

WISHING ALL THE BEST TO YOU AND YOUR PATIENTS!!

LOVE, HUGS, SCRITCHES

Shi & Squeaks


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi X, 


...a plastic 5 Gallon Bucket ( clearly labeled ) with good fitting lid in which to have 'Bleach Water' for overnight soaking of whatever already scrubbed clean Seed Bowls, Water Bowls and the likes.

Similarly, a Spray Bottle with Bleach or 'Oxine' Water, for heavily misting Cages once they are scrubbed, pending a day or two in the out door Sunshine for them to thoroughly dry and enjoy a good UV exposure and fresh Airing. Good for disinfecting other surfaces also.


Thrift Stores or their managers can be appealed to for bulk Towells.

In fact, they will get many donated to them which have small holes or tears which they merely discard, and, in theory, one could work something out for them to save those for one, and, allow a huge discount on one's buying them.


Similarly, a small Refridgerator can usually be had cheaply second hand, or for free on one's local "Freecycle", to be one which is used only for Bird related things - medicines, foods, Olive Oil, Nutrical, whatever else.


Thrift Stores are also an excellent source of small wide bottom Bowls ( Baking Cups and Custard Cups and so on ) for Seeds and Water.


They also will tend to have soft cuddley all Cotton 'Baby Cloths' or light Baby Blankets very inexpensively, and these are handy also...


Phil
l v


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