# how to ring muffed breeds ?



## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

hi guys,
i have a indian fantail that is coming up to a week old, i am going to ring him at a week old ,


now to ring a muffed breed i have been told i need to push the ring right up to the top of the leg, above the knee ?

can anyone please let me know if this is right thanks ?

and is a week old the right time to ring chick ?



regards jason


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## Pip Logan (Oct 6, 2009)

Do you mean band? I think it should happen sooner rather than later as there legs grow super fast!


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

5-7 days should be ok but do not know about the bands being pushed up above the knees. Aren't leg bands supposed to be below the knee, what size are you banding them ?


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

yes sorry , i mean band them ,

i not shore how to band as they have long leg muffs ,

and someone was telling me they need to be banded above the knee right up against the body ?


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## Keith C. (Jan 25, 2005)

The band needs to be right above the muff.
Do not push the band above the knee. If you push it above the knee, unless it is a huge band, it will cut off circulation and cause the bird to lose the leg below it.


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## JRNY (Nov 17, 2009)

Here's a good video. If its to tight try putting some a&d ointment. Hope its not to late.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eBR5Snaazs&feature=related


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

Problem with banding the muffed squabs at ages beyond 7 - 10 is that the muffs have started to emerge and stay as very fragile thorn like protutions opposite to the banding direction. They break and it will create a bloody mess. So better band them before those tiny heads of feathers start from the small quills. The Indian Fantails are to be banded with 11mm size bands.


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

above the knee ?, or not above knee ,? i have 11 mm rings , but need advice on banding them asap, as i am doing it today ,


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## hasseian_313 (Oct 31, 2009)

will the same as anybird just make sure the bands are not to tight and is lose to move freely i use the old feather trick


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## JRNY (Nov 17, 2009)

pigeon jase said:


> above the knee ?, or not above knee ,? i have 11 mm rings , but need advice on banding them asap, as i am doing it today ,


Look at the video.


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## romanallover (Jan 31, 2010)

also after you band them dont just forget about it, they might fall off it its too soon....so keep your eye on it.


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

hi guys,
i had ago at banding her today , she is a week old today , ring went on to easy, it was way to loose ,








i then put chick back in nest , band wouldnt stay on so i thought i will wait a few days before trying again ,









how long should i wait thanks guys ,?

regards jason


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

I would try every day until it starts staying on. And keep it below the knee. That's how I band my indians and satinettes.


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

You banded too high on the leg. Keep it below the knee joint. After 7 days usually you will have difficulty putting it in. Also there are different sizes for each breed. For homing pigeons they are 8mm. Apparently for Indian Fantail it is about 11mm (http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/catalog/2010bands.html). I would try MaryOfExeter techniques.


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## Knoc (Jul 10, 2010)

Keep them on the "ankle". Why such huge bands? I understand the feathers on the feet but geez, that looks like it would fit a small dog.


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

hi guys,
the bands are 11mm the size they use for indians here in australia ,

they are that size because indian breeders here band above the knee , this is what i have been told ,?


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

pigeon jase said:


> hi guys,
> the bands are 11mm the size they use for indians here in australia ,
> 
> they are that size because indian breeders here band above the knee , this is what i have been told ,?


I do not think the size is 11mm because it is to be above the knee, last week I tried a 12mm custom band on of my squab (not a fantail), believe me if I had used 11 or 10, then it would have been tight. I believe Tony (Big_T) bands his white fantails with 10mm or so, just drop a note to him, he might be able to confirm on the band size and location on the leg.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

these breed take the 11 mm bands...American Giant Homers, Giant Crests, Indian Fantails, Lahores, Mondains: French, Indian, Swiss and Show Carneau... you band them just the same as any other pigeon muffs or not... the bigger band allows for the feathers on the legs when they grow..sometimes I have to wait longer to band my frillbacks as they have the bigger band to allow for the muffs..so just try every day till it stays on... and not above the elbow joint..it sits right above their foot..


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

spirit wings said:


> these breed take the 11 mm bands...American Giant Homers, Giant Crests, Indian Fantails, Lahores, Mondains: French, Indian, Swiss and Show Carneau... you band them just the same as any other pigeon muffs or not... the bigger band allows for the feathers on the legs when they grow..sometimes I have to wait longer to band my frillbacks as they have the bigger band to allow for the muffs..so just try every day till it stays on... and not above the elbow joint..it sits right above their foot..




thanks for the help , a aussie breeder of indians told me last night she places the band above the knee ?

maybe it a australian thing to place the band above the knee ?


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

It doesn't make sense to me to band above the knee. Maybe you mistook it for the ankle instead. This person banded it at the right spot to me:http://www.dovesdivine.co.uk/images/indian01.jpg


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

RodSD said:


> It doesn't make sense to me to band above the knee. Maybe you mistook it for the ankle instead. This person banded it at the right spot to me:http://www.dovesdivine.co.uk/images/indian01.jpg





she said above the knee,


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## hasseian_313 (Oct 31, 2009)

many look at my birds they all muffed and i put homer pigeon bands normal


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

In their defense, I have heard of people banding above the knee, with big bands. I wouldn't do it. It has to be uncomfortable for the bird, and it isn't like it's going to fall off if its below the knee. The muffs on my birds just grow over and under the band.


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

I suppose it is an Australian thing then. I suppose if it would be above the knee, then they need a bigger band. My guess is that it is related to aesthetics.

Images I have seen for Indian Fantails seemed to have been banded below the knee muffed or not unless I am not seeing it right.


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

so would a 11 mm ring work on the lower leg ? or would t be too loose ?


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

pigeon jase said:


> so would a 11 mm ring work on the lower leg ? or would t be too loose ?


Yes it will.


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## pigeon jase (Aug 22, 2010)

sreeshs said:


> Yes it will.




thanks for the help ,
i like the idea of keeping the ring on the lower part of the leg , i was worried it wouldnt stay on ,


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

perhaps a "knee" to her or him was the ankle.. where it is supposed to be, at least for an 11mm band..


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## wcooper (Aug 4, 2009)

The band on any heavily muffed bird, Indian Fantail, West, Ice Pigeon, etc. is actually supposed to go above the knee joint. The bands for these birds are big enough to go above the knee without being harmful to the bird's leg. This is for showing purposes only. It keeps the band out of the muffs and doesn't create a break in the muff/hock. Thats the most desireable way to band, even though it seems a bit out of the ordinary. Again this WILL NOT harm the bird. All my Wests are banded above the knee. It is the reason for the large bands. However, the band will stay on the leg below the knee, you'll just have to band at or around 10-12 days old, sometimes older. Thanks and hope this is helpful.


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## avian (Sep 6, 2010)

when they are young I guess
i dont have any muffed ones


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

wcooper,
Thanks for the insight! As I had guess it banding above the knee has something to do with aesthetics. I have seen some muff birds with the band below the knee and the muff looks compressed.


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## wcooper (Aug 4, 2009)

Yeah basically it's just a preference thing. In my opinion it makes the bird look better if the band is hidden. Also, some judges prefer the band above the knee. I've had some experiences where a really nice bird didn't win a show because of that reason alone.


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

wcooper said:


> Yeah basically it's just a preference thing. In my opinion it makes the bird look better if the band is hidden. Also, some judges prefer the band above the knee. I've had some experiences where a really nice bird didn't win a show because of that reason alone.


Interesting, I never knew it before, now how does that band hold up there ? A band with space for free movement can slip down from the knee, right ? Or the feathers will hold it up above the knees ?


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## billgarb (Aug 26, 2011)

*11 mm bands*

Does anyone have a few 11 mm bands for sale. I picked up a few Indians about 3 mos ago and they have settled in and hatched a squeaker. I did not realize it would be difficult getting 2011 bands this late in the year. Thank you.


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## AZCorbin (Feb 28, 2011)

billgarb said:


> Does anyone have a few 11 mm bands for sale. I picked up a few Indians about 3 mos ago and they have settled in and hatched a squeaker. I did not realize it would be difficult getting 2011 bands this late in the year. Thank you.


Jedds site does not list them as out of stock so maybe they have some.
I would post a new thread here as I'm sure some members have some extra 11's they could sell you.
You will get more views in a new thread ya know!


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## billgarb (Aug 26, 2011)

*Bands*



AZCorbin said:


> Jedds site does not list them as out of stock so maybe they have some.
> I would post a new thread here as I'm sure some members have some extra 11's they could sell you.
> You will get more views in a new thread ya know!


Thanks a lot. I ordered some from Jedds just a few minutes ago. I will find out shortly if they have them.


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## AZCorbin (Feb 28, 2011)

billgarb said:


> Thanks a lot. I ordered some from Jedds just a few minutes ago. I will find out shortly if they have them.


No problem, something tells me they are out since everyone was out of EVERY band.. Hope it works out for ya! If not check back here as I know several people work with large birds.


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## DannysDoos (Mar 14, 2011)

I would band/ring above the hock, as here the feathers are much softer. When banded below the hock it can interfere with growth, and I imagine it could be a little uncomfortable. I have Indian fantails from the "Doves Divine" website (www.dovesdivine.co.uk) and they are closely banded under the hock. It has rubbed the skin a little, so I would band/ring above the hock.


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