# Feral Flock Loft?



## pigeon_guy (May 26, 2008)

I've been feeding and looking out for a flock of about 40 to 50 feral pigeons here in downtown Tucson. About half of them roost on the ledges and wires at the back of the four-story building where I work. Some people who work here like the birds and also feed them. A vocal minority complain about the droppings and propose various methods to "exterminate" the birds.

I'm worried that the building managers are eventually going to poison or otherwise try to kill the pigeons, and I'm trying to come up with a way to prevent this. If I build a loft on the (flat) roof of the building, would that solve the problem with the droppings, to the extent that the birds would all hang out at the loft? Or doesn't it work that way? And would feral birds actually use a loft?

Any advice on this situation would be most welcome.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

I don't think it would work. About the only way to make it work would be to trap the birds and lock them in a building so they didn't have a choice as to where to poop. 
No pigeon, if given the choice, is going to spend it's day and nights locked up in a coop of any kind. 
You MIGHT convince them to go in to eat and MAYBE roost inside at night, but even that is doubtful, since they're already become accustomed to sleeping/roosting where ever they sleep/roost now. 
Forgive me, but it don't make a lot of sense to me to continue feeding the birds and having people complain about them being there. I know, LOTS of people do feed the ferals and if you could find somewhere else to feed, then maybe that would be ok, but to continue to feed and make them want to stay where they are, knowing that potential harm may come their way isn't the best idea. 
My suggestion would be to stop feeding them or try to move the feeding area, OR, you and your group that DO like the birds, get armed for battle when the exterminators are called in.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

The other thing you could do, is to start hosing the area down every couple of days. I don't know how your boss would feel about using the extra water though but you might ask.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

You need to get the negative attention away from the birds, focus on cleaning up and perhaps moving their feeding area to a "pigeon friendly" area where few people can see them, a vacant lot or park area.

It's a nice idea that you would like to build them a loft, but that won't guarantee they will do all their pooping, as well as eating and sleeping there.


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## pigeon_guy (May 26, 2008)

Lovebirds said:


> I don't think it would work. About the only way to make it work would be to trap the birds and lock them in a building so they didn't have a choice as to where to poop.
> No pigeon, if given the choice, is going to spend it's day and nights locked up in a coop of any kind.
> You MIGHT convince them to go in to eat and MAYBE roost inside at night, but even that is doubtful, since they're already become accustomed to sleeping/roosting where ever they sleep/roost now.
> Forgive me, but it don't make a lot of sense to me to continue feeding the birds and having people complain about them being there. I know, LOTS of people do feed the ferals and if you could find somewhere else to feed, then maybe that would be ok, but to continue to feed and make them want to stay where they are, knowing that potential harm may come there way isn't the best idea.
> My suggestion would be to stop feeding them or try to move the feeding area, OR, you and your group that DO like the birds, get armed for battle when the exterminators are called in.


The place where I was proposing to build the loft is on the roof about 10 feet directly above the area where they are all roosting on the side of the building now. A few of the birds hang around during the day, but most are off doing whatever pigeons do. I think that most of the mess gets made at night when they're roosting on the pipes and wires. I uploaded some pictures of the area here:

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm164/pigeon_guy/?action=view&current=1.jpg

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm164/pigeon_guy/?action=view&current=2.jpg

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm164/pigeon_guy/?action=view&current=3.jpg

I took the three pictures by walking to the left (relative to picture 1) and turning to my right, to give you an idea of the layout of the buildings. Pretty much all of the pipes. ledges and wires that you see here end up populated with one or two pigeons at night. I thought that, if I put the loft on the roof of the building you see in the center of the first picture, the birds might migrate up there and start living in it - especially if that's the easiest place for them to find food. 

As far as stopping feeding them, I tried that a year or so ago, but there are lots of other folks who feed the birds in this area. All that happened when I stopped feeding them, was that the birds got thinner and hungrier and the population dropped by about 20%. 

I've been trying to find someplace to move them, but they're right in the center of the city, and the only grassy areas within a reasonable distance already have flocks occupying the territory. I think I could teach my flock to go there for food eventually, but I don't think they would roost there, since there are already quite a few pigeons at those spots. I'm just guessing of course -- please correct me if I'm wrong on that. 

Anyway, having seen the pictures of the building in question, what do you think about the loft idea now?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I had the same problem when I stopped feeding the ferals. They got thin, sick and many died. I understand how hard this is for you. You would be better off just cleaning up after them. A loft on the roof will create other issues for the pigeons, building owner and you.
I really understand where your heart is, though...really.


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## Grim (Jul 28, 2007)

You have to keep in mind that pigeon populations are based upon availability of food. The more you feed the more they breed, the more they poop, the more people complain, and you eventually see them on the ground struggling because they are dieing a slow death from poisoning by pest control companies.

The funniest part is it is illegal to dispatch a pigeon with means that involve cruelty. Yet a bird on the ground struggling and having seizures due to poisoning is considered a humane way of pigeon control? It is so backwards. Pest control companies look at pigeons as a source of never ending income so keep this in mind. I know you mean well but I would hate to hear it happen.

Sometimes when people do good it can backfire because pigeon loving people are always going to be a minority. As far as the loft if you can actually get approval it can be used as a nesting site for the flock and you can actually replace their eggs with dummies which would keep the population from growing.


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

You've gotten lots of good advice so far. I suppose you could always try it, a very simple loft that's open all the time, mostly just a bunch of nest boxes in it. And start feeding them up there. Some of them would undoubtedly nest there. Thanks for looking out for them and I wish you luck.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

pigeon_guy said:


> IAnyway, having seen the pictures of the building in question, what do you think about the loft idea now?


I don't think it would solve anything to be honest. Let's say half of the flock decided, "yeah, this loft is a really nice place"........and decided to move in. Where ever they were roosting before would now be partially unoccupied, so more than likely, others would move to those empty spots. 
If you fed the birds inside this loft, you can bet your last dollar that ferals would come from far and wide. Good news travels fast. 
I guess, if your boss or whoever owns the building is willing to let you try..........I'm just afraid that if it doesn't work, then whoever is wanting to get rid of the birds to begin with would have even more ammunition to use in their reasoning. 
The one GOOD thing that was brought up is that any pairs that DID decide to put a loft to use, could be kept from breeding more and more babies, by removing/replacing thier eggs. 
I think I have to agree that just cleaning up after them is your best bet. Sorry there's no easy solution. The SMART thing to do would be to get rid of the stupid humans who think they're so much better than any other living thing on earth.


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## TheSnipes (Apr 9, 2007)

The "vocal minority" will win..because they are vocal. 

What about the cotes in Paris? Why not? Those work! Yes, it has been done in a highly populated urban area, it could work for you, too.? I am sorry that I dn't have the link handy to share..anyone else? I will search for it and post it here later..


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## Noisy_minor (Jun 20, 2008)

http://pigeonpolitics.blogspot.com/2008/01/paris-installs-pigeon-lofts-to-control.html

i think this is what TheSnipes is talking about. i think its a great idea, the pigeons get a safe place to breed, and there numbers can be humainly controled. and the birds still get to grace our parks without worring about eating posion, being shot, netted etc.


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## Grim (Jul 28, 2007)

Check this out it has really good info on whats being done on a large scale to control pigeons in a humane way. Also shows the effects of pest control companies. Regardless it is a great video if you have not seen it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JtTZqX2kLc


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## Noisy_minor (Jun 20, 2008)

i really liked that link thanks Grim. Just wondring if it can be added to the "The Misconceptions about Pigeons and Disease" sticky. its good to actually see the effects of poison, and and hear the statistics rather than reading them.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Mods, can you have a look and do this if it makes sense? I've got a new incoming on my front step right now ..

Terry


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