# Paramyxovirus spreads to Australia



## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/animals/rare-pigeon-virus-can-spread-to-humans-20110906-1juqa.html

Finally the dreaded PMV is here in Oz This is a sad day for pigeons in Australia 

But perhaps the worst thing about it is the way its being reported. All the news articles are predictably slanted towards presenting pigeons as killer-disease spreading pests who need to be eradicated, and yet even those same articles go onto refute this if you read the fine print. 

Why do they have to that? For example, the article above, which was reported in Australia's biggest newspaper, the Sydney Morning Herald, was titled :

`Rare Killer pigeon virus can spread to humans'.

If you read the fine print, the article does finally admit that although PMV is deadly for pigeons, the most severe symptoms in humans is a mild case of conjunctivitis and only in very rare and specific cases. 

Another thing that pisses me off about the reporting is that all the pictures in the news articles are of feral pigeons, but if you read the actual facts, no feral pigeons have been affected - the pigeons affected were a couple of flocks of fancy pigeons. 

And the reporting gets only worse and more deceptive from there. 

Anyway, I'm kind of pissed off and had to get it off my chest.


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## RoderickGI (Jun 6, 2010)

You have to love Australian media...not. They don't care about the facts on any story. Just that they get a story. The SMH used the most agressive photo I have ever seen of a pigeon as well.

Anyway, it's a shame that the disease is here now. I'll be keeping an eye on my pet. Although he is a rescued feral, so maybe he is immune.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

RoderickGI said:


> You have to love Australian media...not. They don't care about the facts on any story. Just that they get a story. The SMH used the most agressive photo I have ever seen of a pigeon as well.
> 
> Anyway, it's a shame that the disease is here now. I'll be keeping an eye on my pet. Although he is a rescued feral, so maybe he is immune.


Hi Roderick, nice to meet you!

I guess we can only wait and see if PMV gets into the feral and racing flocks The news articles didn't specify what type of fancy pigeons had it, so we're left wondering.

Its such a shame to see it here, but I am grateful that pigeon biz has documented so much about caring for birds with it. There is hope for birds with PMV. Also, there is a vacination, which I hope will be available for us. I heard Australians can't get it, but then I read another article that said its available for chickens and used widely in AUstralia. I wonder what the situation is really?


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

I just caught a bit of it now on the news ........apparently it was discovered in a backyard loft that had a Hi Flying breed and was apparently diagnosed by Dr. Colin walker and apparently it is a new strain of the virus

It is very much a concern .........I hope it can be contained , but I am guessing probably not


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

A new strain? Oh thats bad news, whytwings; thanks for saying so though.


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

That is bad news! It started to spread widely in Europe from birds at a pigeon show and, inevitably, infected feral and racing pigeons over time. I assume the birds at that show had come from someplace like Turkey or Middle East, where I believe Pigeon PMV was first identified as separate from Newcastle Disease.

I hope Colin Walker's business will start making PMV vaccine available pretty sharpish.

Here, PMV vaccination is mandatory before pigeons can be raced, and it's a notifiable illness, not because of any risk to people but due to its ability to spread - not only between birds, but on footwear etc. which can carry the virus from an infected loft.

BTW, contact with the vaccine, even though the usual one is a killed virus, can also give conjunctivitis (due warnings about it are on the packaging).


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## Bird Crazy (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi John, That is exactly why people attending bird shows when they leave and go home need to remove their shoes before entering the home and then go straight to the shower to clean up and then change clothes, depositing the ones they wore at the show into the washer, BEFORE coming into contact with their own birds. You just never know what will hitch a ride home on you or your clothing at those things. I often go to parrot/small bird shows and doing this is my #1 rule upon returning home for disease prevention and control. Sometimes, I even leave a change of clothes in the car and at least change upon leaving the show if I can't go straight home to shower, etc. I try to minimize any risk for my birds that I can in bringing home dangerous and definitely unwanted communicable bird diseases. It's advice I took to heart from a breeder over 20 years ago and still follow it today. 

Very sorry to hear about the PMV spreading to Australia. I also hope they make the vaccination widely available to all who own pigeons.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi John & Bird crazy,

Thanks heaps for the info.

Regarding the vaccine, is it normally a one-off vaccine or do birds need PMV shots at intervals throughout their lives? Would it be normal to vaccinate every pigeon you rescue?


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Bella_F said:


> Hi John & Bird crazy,
> 
> Thanks heaps for the info.
> 
> Regarding the vaccine, is it normally a one-off vaccine or do birds need PMV shots at intervals throughout their lives? Would it be normal to vaccinate every pigeon you rescue?


Pigeons are vaccinated annually (also, usually, for avian pox virus).

As for rescues, you would need to be sure the pigeon did not actually have PMV, otherwise they could be vaccinated. Drawback is that vaccine has to be used once opened, and the minimum size currently available is for 50 birds.


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

Supposidly originated at the shop where I buy my feed.
I'm taking big precautions. Birds are out very hungry so they won't fly for long. Loft is now cleaned everyday with water and feed changed completely.
On the weekend I'm going to Aussie disposels to get a Camo tank net to cover the whole loft as many strays fly over and stop for the night coz they hear and see my birds during the day in the loft so hopefully it will curb the visitors and also the sparrows from interfering!


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## Tiplets (Aug 24, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> http://www.smh.com.au/environment/animals/rare-pigeon-virus-can-spread-to-humans-20110906-1juqa.html
> 
> Finally the dreaded PMV is here in Oz This is a sad day for pigeons in Australia
> 
> ...


“It’s really Scary” I Guess it’s just time for anyone in that area to refrain from introducing new birds in their Loft or your birds participating in Shows & Racing if you can! And to also watch out that wild birds cant gain access to your pigeons feeders & water containers. Well this should be a normal practice for everyone with pigeons in all areas of the world.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Thanks for the info about the vaccine, John. Is the vaccine generally expensive where you live? I wonder if its something I will be able to afford in the future.

Today the news is being reported a little more accurately, but the sad thing is there are people out there with a huge agenda to eradicate feral pigeons completely in Melbourne, and they are really jumping on this and making misleading/alarmist statements in the media.

As an example, I just finished reading a news article that compared PMV to Newcastle disease: http://www.news.com.au/breaking-new...o-risk-to-people/story-e6frfku0-1226130838131

The author admitted that newcastle disease and PMV are related, but different. And yet he still went on and on about how newcastle disease supposedly killed a man once (who had a seriously compromised immune system due to lymphoma) , and that feral pigeons would all have to be destroyed if they had Newcastle disease. 

But the pigeons didn't have newcastle disease, so why mention culling?. And the ferals didn't have it at all so far. So why go on and on about Newcastle disease, as if PMV was the same illness?

I'm really getting sick of (some) Australians and their psychopathic attitudes towards other living beings, especially the ones we are responsible for bringing here in the first place to `remind us of England'.


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## kamz (Jan 23, 2010)

*H*

Hi Jerry I know you can't say which shop it originated from - but would that shop be a shop which also sells pigeons for breeders? in the northern suburbs of Melbourne?

If so, I also got my feed there - 

This whole situation is a bit scary - I'm glad I only have the two birds to worry about - and they both seem fine

Hoping everyone's birds aust. wide stay safe,

Susie


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## zoolisa (Aug 31, 2011)

I'm really getting sick of (some) Australians and their psychopathic attitudes towards other living beings, especially the ones we are responsible for bringing here in the first place to `remind us of England'.[/QUOTE]

I hear you! I lived in Brisbane for 4 years, and raised two orphaned flying foxes- the attitude to these amazing animals was the same- even though they are native! A couple of people died of hendra virus, and scientists set out to 'prove that flying foxes were the cause' and completely underplayed the role that any other animals had. Same with Lyssavirus, only 2 deaths (still 2 too many, but still extremely rare). More people are killed by their own pet dogs, horses, snakes etc and by eating their own food than bats!


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Bella_F said:


> Thanks for the info about the vaccine, John. Is the vaccine generally expensive where you live? I wonder if its something I will be able to afford in the future.


A 50 bird quantity of Colombovac costs about 23 - 24 pounds sterling. As I say, the problem is that it must be used once opened, like within a few hours. That's the preferred vaccine here.


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

Try owning a PitBull/Staffy atm
mines locked down to keep prying psycho 'shes a killer" people away.
Idiots she curls up with our baby all the time - supervised of course you never take ur eyes away from children and any animal at all, even pigeons!


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

zoolisa said:


> I hear you! I lived in Brisbane for 4 years, and raised two orphaned flying foxes- the attitude to these amazing animals was the same- even though they are native! A couple of people died of hendra virus, and scientists set out to 'prove that flying foxes were the cause' and completely underplayed the role that any other animals had. Same with Lyssavirus, only 2 deaths (still 2 too many, but still extremely rare). More people are killed by their own pet dogs, horses, snakes etc and by eating their own food than bats!


That must have been an amazing experience, raising the flying foxes! Good on you for doing it. I adore flying foxes

I agree with you that the attitudes up here in Brisbane towards our native bats is so depressing. The poor bats are having such a tough time already finding food, and I believe the grey headed flying foxes are already endangered.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Jerryx4 said:


> Try owning a PitBull/Staffy atm
> mines locked down to keep prying psycho 'shes a killer" people away.
> Idiots she curls up with our baby all the time - supervised of course you never take ur eyes away from children and any animal at all, even pigeons!


Staffy's re just beautiful


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## macka (Oct 26, 2008)

It is very unlikely the Government,will let the vaccine,into Australia.
As Pigeons are not seen as a money spinner for the Government.
They are hoping that they have stopped the Virus from spreading.
There is 19 lofts being watched at the moment,if there is no more out breaks,
The Pigeons will be back to normal in 2 weeks.All racing has been stopped
& no training of Pigeons, till further notice.


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## RoderickGI (Jun 6, 2010)

Unfortunately those tatics won't stop a virus. It will just sit tight in a couple of birds, or eslewhere, and wait for a new opportunity to break out.

Also a vaccine will only stop the vaccinated bird from getting sick. It could just get a low level infection and still be a non-symptomatic carrier, even if only until its immune system gets up to speed.

No, once the virus is here, it is here. It will just become part of the background sickness that comes and goes as it finds susceptible birds. That is why we have strong customs rules and (used to) try to limit imports of carrier animals, plants, and material. Quarantine in Australia isn't as good as it used to be though, since "market competition" and a "level playing field" have become the approach adopted by our governments.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hey thanks, I just read the information about stopping pigeon racing for 14 days too; apparently that's because it takes 14 days for the virus to incubate. 

They are watching 8 lofts in Melbourne, 7 of which contain Persian High flying Tumblers. Incidently Persian tumblers look nothing like the feral pigeons they put in the news articles associated with the PMV virus outbreak - Persian tumblers are white with crests and grizzle coloured heads (stunning little things!). But, hey, why waste an opportunity to persecute the feral pigeons, who have nothing to do with any of this?


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Vaccination should kick the immune system into producing antibodies so that birds do not get infected and do not become carriers. Of course, it depends on the vaccine used. There is a 'live virus vaccine' which is not recommended, as it is exactly that - very low levels of virus. Some birds can become sick, or suffer side effects. The vaccine preferred is 'killed virus' vaccine.

One problem with PPMV is that birds may not necessarily display the neurological symptoms which are generally how the illness is recognized. They may show only the 'PMV poops' and that can easily go unnoticed, assuming they appear at all. The virus will still run its course (up to 6 weeks from infection) but it may not be evident that a bird has the virus. But, we can say the same for other illnesses so we can only work with what we can see.

The main thing, probably, is to stop movement of 'domestic' pigeons from the area where infections have been found, to other parts of Australia, unless birds have been vaccinated and have a veterinary certificate to say so. Australia is, after all, a vast nation and free living ferals are not going to be flying thousands of miles to spread PPMV. I recall a member in the US north-west stating that they did not have PMV there, so one must assume that there had been no opportunity for the virus to spread there from other parts.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi John,

I really appreciate hearing your insights. I suppose the unfortunate thing is that the racing pigeon community are most likely to spread it, which is perhaps unavoidable. On example I am thinking of is there is a really big ` one loft race' going to happen this month from Melbourne, and I've been following the trainers blog. He's a nice guy, very intelliegent and good to learn from, but the entrants paid almost $1000 for each bird, and the losses during training this season have been huge already. So there is a lot of pressure for him to go ahead with the race, which I am sure he will do, and no birds will be vaccinated. He will lose most of the birds; he has lost over half of them already in short tosses, for no reason he can explain, and the birds are also going into the race without the full training (because he's had to stop flyign them for two weeks).

ANyway its just one example, but its easy to see how a virus like this spreads.


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## Miss-Sassypants (Sep 25, 2010)

May God bless the pigeons in Australia! I hope they will be safe from danger.

Perhaps the only morons who will get the disease are those who have no kindness in their hearts for other living creatures who have every right to live on earth as we do.

Bella, I agree with you. The media and the government can be so heartless. Poor feral pigeons being blamed for everything


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## macka (Oct 26, 2008)

If it gets into the feral pigeons,it will spread like wild fire,
as there are a lot of Feral mobs+ of pigeon around the place
here,there is a mob of at least 200 I see feeding in the 
paddocks around here.
PS its not in the Feral,s at the moment,


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

*paramyxovirus*



Jerryx4 said:


> Supposidly originated at the shop where I buy my feed.
> I'm taking big precautions. Birds are out very hungry so they won't fly for long. Loft is now cleaned everyday with water and feed changed completely.
> On the weekend I'm going to Aussie disposels to get a Camo tank net to cover the whole loft as many strays fly over and stop for the night coz they hear and see my birds during the day in the loft so hopefully it will curb the visitors and also the sparrows from interfering!


i got the same from the shop i by my feed from to but its not through the seed, it only if one bird gets it,or you put a bird thats ifected with it in you loft say good night to them all. it spreads like wild fire. i lost about 20 birds so far but hopefully i have manged to stop it now, havent had anymore in last week x fingenrs, i have got frinoyends who have lost all there birds. its really bad with in one day there dead if they catch it. i also have been talking to dpi about it. not in the feed


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

I'm really sorry to hear it got into your loft. Any ideas how? ANd are these Persian Tumblers?


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

Went to the shop for feed today, spoke to the owner he gave me good tips to keep it away. Seems they took action fast there so good to see him helping out


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> I'm really sorry to hear it got into your loft. Any ideas how? ANd are these Persian Tumblers?


through infected birds that were in a pet shop, no wernt persian tumblers.


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

just be very carefull


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

*birds*



macka said:


> It is very unlikely the Government,will let the vaccine,into Australia.
> As Pigeons are not seen as a money spinner for the Government.
> They are hoping that they have stopped the Virus from spreading.
> There is 19 lofts being watched at the moment,if there is no more out breaks,
> ...


try 23 now and you wish 2 weeks till every thing is better. it is a deadly desease i no i had it, killed all my stock hens and just started on males but just caught it now, hopefully. worst disease i have seen in 30 years


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

It will be very interesting to see just what strain of the virus this will turn out to be. 

Pigeon PMV as encountered elsewhere is highly infectious, but generally has quite a low mortality rate. At least, the virus itself is not widely fatal but birds will die from starvation or dehydration if they are unable to feed and water themselves and do not get supportive care. Maybe this strain brings on acute kidney failure? Ferals with PMV, of course, become easy prey for predators. A bird could die from an untreated concurrent non-viral infection, though in my own experience with a lot of PMV this has never occurred.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

pidgeonloft said:


> try 23 now and you wish 2 weeks till every thing is better. it is a deadly desease i no i had it, killed all my stock hens and just started on males but just caught it now, hopefully. worst disease i have seen in 30 years


Oh Wow, thats really awful, I am sorry you lost so many birds.

What kind of pigeons are the ones that you got from the pet store that were infected? And what kind of pigeons do you have that all died?


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Oh Wow, thats really awful, I am sorry you lost so many birds.
> 
> What kind of pigeons are the ones that you got from the pet store that were infected? And what kind of pigeons do you have that all died?


mostly racing pidgeons all my stock birds i went to sydney and bought 3 months ago, ive lost a lot of moneys worth and top birds


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

pidgeonloft said:


> mostly racing pidgeons all my stock birds i went to sydney and bought 3 months ago, ive lost a lot of moneys worth and top birds


Oh, that's so awful You must be gutted.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

The latest news regarding the PMV virus outbreak in Australia is that the Virus is not yet contained, and unfortunately there has proven to be a huge amount of resistance in the racing pigeon community against locking down their birds for few more weeks while the extent of the outbreak is assessed and contained.

Races are still going ahead, and unfortunately some flyers are still tossing their birds whilst infected with the live virus vaccine, which means they can shed PMV to other birds, including wild birds, for some weeks. 

The origin of the virus is less sketchy now. It was brought into the country via 3 arab-owned pet shops that the government knows about, and because of the illegal activities involved, it has proven difficult to trace birds with the virus. Also, the community involved are non-English speaking migrants from Iran and getting the news out to them is difficult.

The PMV Virus spread from the illegally imported birds to Racing pigeons via Dr Colin Walkers office. This is confirmed by the owner of the birds as well as sources in the government that I have spoken to personally. Dr Colin Walker had some infected fancy pigeons which spread to an injured Racing pigeon, which became infected in the office during treatment. You've got to wonder how that happens in an acclaimed avian vets office, but anyway... He then returned the PMV infected racing pigeon to its owner, and it proceeded to spread to over 20 more lofts that the government knows about so far.

After causing this debacle, Dr Colin Walker immediately jumped on the opportunity to make some money selling an untested live-virus vaccine for PMV to the pigeon racing community, who were in a panic. The government tried to warn pigeon flyers not to go ahead with vaccinations of the live virus, but this advice was ignored by many. Unfortunately now those vaccinated birds are shedding the virus during training and racing. The virus is shed for up to 4 weeks after vaccination.

Finally, The Victorian Homing Association is in chaos, with the leaders of the club wanting to shut down racing until the virus is contained, and other members threatening legal action and mass sackings so that racing goes ahead.

Overall, it is very disappointing to see this biological disaster unfold, and to witness first hand the actual human greed, self-deception, arrogance, and stubbornness behind the decisions that could potentially wipe out all of Australia's bird life.

Anyway fingers crossed that we will be spared the worst case scenario.


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## kamz (Jan 23, 2010)

Jet wanted to add a little more information regarding the outbreak of pmv 1 in Victoria. Here is a copy of a legitimate press release given out by the owner of a pet store in thomastown (I was right! Lol) where the outbreak originated. I do not know how it has spread since and would not like to further speculate. 


Quote from: cinvala on September 11, 2011, 09:40:53 AM
Do you have a link to the media release letter?


*


> Quote from: cinvala on September 11, 2011, 09:40:53 AM
> Do you have a link to the media release letter?
> 
> Press release from the Thomastown Produce and Pet Supplies.
> ...


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

I went to the shop on Tuesday, he was very helpful and told me all of this personally. He seems a nice bloke pitty it all came about this way.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Thanks for the updates Kamz and Jerry!


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Hey thanks, I just read the information about stopping pigeon racing for 14 days too; apparently that's because it takes 14 days for the virus to incubate.
> 
> They are watching 8 lofts in Melbourne, 7 of which contain Persian High flying Tumblers. Incidently Persian tumblers look nothing like the feral pigeons they put in the news articles associated with the PMV virus outbreak - Persian tumblers are white with crests and grizzle coloured heads (stunning little things!). But, hey, why waste an opportunity to persecute the feral pigeons, who have nothing to do with any of this?


hi bella its not just the persian ive got racers and greek donecks they all got it. but good now after loosing my best, i hope


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

*james*



Bella_F said:


> http://www.smh.com.au/environment/animals/rare-pigeon-virus-can-spread-to-humans-20110906-1juqa.html
> 
> Finally the dreaded PMV is here in Oz This is a sad day for pigeons in Australia
> 
> ...


i agree ive lost 30+ birds its a crap disease they say its going to take 12 months + for a cure


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

i even have my birds on utube under rmac1267, see how they spin


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

John_D said:


> It will be very interesting to see just what strain of the virus this will turn out to be.
> 
> Pigeon PMV as encountered elsewhere is highly infectious, but generally has quite a low mortality rate. At least, the virus itself is not widely fatal but birds will die from starvation or dehydration if they are unable to feed and water themselves and do not get supportive care. Maybe this strain brings on acute kidney failure? Ferals with PMV, of course, become easy prey for predators. A bird could die from an untreated concurrent non-viral infection, though in my own experience with a lot of PMV this has never occurred.


so you think


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

John_D said:


> It will be very interesting to see just what strain of the virus this will turn out to be.
> 
> Pigeon PMV as encountered elsewhere is highly infectious, but generally has quite a low mortality rate. At least, the virus itself is not widely fatal but birds will die from starvation or dehydration if they are unable to feed and water themselves and do not get supportive care. Maybe this strain brings on acute kidney failure? Ferals with PMV, of course, become easy prey for predators. A bird could die from an untreated concurrent non-viral infection, though in my own experience with a lot of PMV this has never occurred.


this is a bad 

t strain, all birds deaed in 24 hours


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

i wish there was a cure, ive had birds for over 30 years now i lost my best


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> The latest news regarding the PMV virus outbreak in Australia is that the Virus is not yet contained, and unfortunately there has proven to be a huge amount of resistance in the racing pigeon community against locking down their birds for few more weeks while the extent of the outbreak is assessed and contained.
> 
> Races are still going ahead, and unfortunately some flyers are still tossing their birds whilst infected with the live virus vaccine, which means they can shed PMV to other birds, including wild birds, for some weeks.
> 
> ...


what collin jumped on it i had dpi 1 week before collin and then took him 2 weeks to get it out


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

we have lost heaps of top birds


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

pidgeonloft said:


> i even have my birds on utube under rmac1267, see how they spin


This spinning is nothing to do with the PMV 



pidgeonloft said:


> this is a bad
> t strain, all birds deaed in 24 hours


Are you sre youre not getting confused with your PMV's ?????

We are talking of PARAMYXOVIRUS notPAPAYA MOSAIC VIRUS, of which there is a "T" strain, and is a BOTANICAL virus related to PLANTS in Australia.

As John says, Most strains of PMV - PARAMYXOVIRUS - are only fatal in such that the birds die of starvation or dehydration - that does not kill a bird in 24 hrs without previously spotting other symptoms.


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Jerryx4 said:


> Try owning a PitBull/Staffy atm
> mines locked down to keep prying psycho 'shes a killer" people away.
> Idiots she curls up with our baby all the time - supervised of course you never take ur eyes away from children and any animal at all, even pigeons!


i had pitty crossed staffy and mother was rotty, but best dog


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

pidgeonloft said:


> i agree ive lost 30+ birds its a crap disease they say its going to take 12 months + for a cure


So how did you find out that your birds had Paramyxovirus?

Where did you have necropsies done?

How do you believe the infection got into your loft?


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

John_D said:


> So how did you find out that your birds had Paramyxovirus?
> 
> Where did you have necropsies done?
> 
> How do you believe the infection got into your loft?


I'd appreciate more information too, Pigdeonloft. I've been speaking to the DPI directly and they've been very transparent about sharing the details about the spread of the virus and what caused it. Its very much appreciated.

Anyway, you mentioned that you had sick Doneks, and I was wondering if they were the Doneks in Colin Walkers office that spread to the sick racer he had in there at the same time?


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## gazzman58 (Mar 12, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> The latest news regarding the PMV virus outbreak in Australia is that the Virus is not yet contained, and unfortunately there has proven to be a huge amount of resistance in the racing pigeon community against locking down their birds for few more weeks while the extent of the outbreak is assessed and contained.
> 
> Races are still going ahead, and unfortunately some flyers are still tossing their birds whilst infected with the live virus vaccine, which means they can shed PMV to other birds, including wild birds, for some weeks.
> 
> ...


This post was removed from Fancy Pigeons Australia this morning after someone cut and pasted it from here. The reason it was removed was because the information concerning Dr Colin Walker is incorrect and therefore libelous.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Gazzman,

I understand your concern, but to the very best of my knowledge all of the information is correct . Some of the information is originally from Australian Pigeon racing forums such as pigeonid, however I confirmed all of it with the Government taskforce at the Victorian DPI before I posted it. I am personally satisfied that what they told me is true, as they have no vested interests in commercial pigeon activities or in any veterinary practices; they seem genuinely concerned with stopping the virus in its tracks. You're certainly entitled to disagree though.


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Quazar said:


> This spinning is nothing to do with the PMV
> 
> 
> 
> ...


waite and see dont say i didnt warn you


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> I'd appreciate more information too, Pigdeonloft. I've been speaking to the DPI directly and they've been very transparent about sharing the details about the spread of the virus and what caused it. Its very much appreciated.
> 
> Anyway, you mentioned that you had sick Doneks, and I was wondering if they were the Doneks in Colin Walkers office that spread to the sick racer he had in there at the same time?


no they wernt my donecks only got it after a bird was brought back from collins shop


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> I'd appreciate more information too, Pigdeonloft. I've been speaking to the DPI directly and they've been very transparent about sharing the details about the spread of the virus and what caused it. Its very much appreciated.
> 
> Anyway, you mentioned that you had sick Doneks, and I was wondering if they were the Doneks in Colin Walkers office that spread to the sick racer he had in there at the same time?


he had the racers in there oready, dpi is testing all dead birds that i gave them.


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

pidgeonloft said:


> no they wernt my donecks only got it after a bird was brought back from collins shop


its all from the pet shop in thomastown thats were it started in my yard, all vaccinated now and in lock down hope i can keep some for breeding


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Pigeonloft,

Thats really sad, I really feel bad for your losses 

I must admit I'm having a little trouble understanding your posts. 

When you said:



> my donecks only got it after a bird was brought back from collins shop


Do you mean Collin Walker, or are you referring to the man who owns the Pet shop? I am confused because the name of the pet shop owner is someone called Sam, not Collin. 

Did your Doneks go to Collin Walkers vet surgery, or straight to the DPI?


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Hi Pigeonloft,
> 
> Thats really sad, I really feel bad for your losses
> 
> ...


sam is a good guy but had some bad birds in shop


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

pidgeonloft said:


> sam is a good guy but had some bad birds in shop


not his fault either


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## pidgeonloft (Sep 11, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> I'd appreciate more information too, Pigdeonloft. I've been speaking to the DPI directly and they've been very transparent about sharing the details about the spread of the virus and what caused it. Its very much appreciated.
> 
> Anyway, you mentioned that you had sick Doneks, and I was wondering if they were the Doneks in Colin Walkers office that spread to the sick racer he had in there at the same time?


who knows now im just waiting now


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## gazzman58 (Mar 12, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Hi Gazzman,
> 
> I understand your concern, but to the very best of my knowledge all of the information is correct . Some of the information is originally from Australian Pigeon racing forums such as pigeonid, however I confirmed all of it with the Government taskforce at the Victorian DPI before I posted it. I am personally satisfied that what they told me is true, as they have no vested interests in commercial pigeon activities or in any veterinary practices; they seem genuinely concerned with stopping the virus in its tracks. You're certainly entitled to disagree though.


How can you say that Colin Walker caused this problem. Surely the people responsible are those that smuggled in the pigeons in the first place. If you are a vet and are unaware that a virus that was unknown in Australia has arrived in your clinic then you would not test for it. ( How many people catch the flu by sitting alongside someone infected in a doctors surgery waiting room. ) As soon as Colin realised there was a problem he dealt with it as was neccessary. As for saying he then profited in it by selling the vaccine, I have a copy of the original directive to fanciers wishing to use the Newcastles Disease vaccine and it came from DPI, not Colin Walker, and only after fanciers pushed for a vaccine to be made available. You are also incorrect where you say that it was bought in by 3 Arab pet shops. It was reported at Apex Court petshop in Thomastown but was found in birds that are bought in there by fanciers to sell. Sam has had this service to fanciers for a while. As soon as some of the birds started dying Sam reported it. The authorities took over from that point. If you are going to tell people you have information directly from DPI make sure it is from Iain or Malcolm at DPI, Attwood otherwise it will possibly be incorrect.


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## kamz (Jan 23, 2010)

Got to say I agree with you gazzman. I work in a hospital, and sometimes despite the best infection control practices being put into place, diseases spread. All we can do when disease outbreaks occur is ensure we are. Being hypervigilant in ensuring our own best practice; in this case putting biosecurity measures in place as suggested by the dpi. 

I am also not sure if you are aware Bella but dr Colin walker actively encouraged fanciers with birds to bring them in for testing. If one solitary racing pigeon got sick from others at the clinic (and that's an if), and this disease was not then further spread but identified, then I think infection control measures at his clinic must be pretty darned good. 

This disease is a scary, scary disease, and the quicker that everyone gets on the same page re: biosecurity the better for the birds. 

Love and peace, 

Kamz


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Gazzman & Kamz,

Sorry to upset you both, I totally understand. I agree that the smugglers are fully to blame , what a terrible thing to have happened. I just would have liked to see more cooperation/competence across the board to prevent the PMV virus from spreading though. Its seems like its still spreading daily and its basically on the verge now of getting totally into the feral flocks via racing pigeons. I find that so disappointing.

It would have been great to see pigeon races like the pigeon punt stopped, and it would have been great if vaccinated birds were not flying around shedding the virus. Also, I kind of resent that some organisations involved, such as the VHA, have been telling the press that pigeon racing has stopped, but behind the scenes, Pigeon racing and tossing has been continuing anyway, with the VHA's and DPI's full knowledge. I'm specifically referring to the pigeon punt, but there are other more minor races going on as well.

Regarding Dr Collin walker, the only known source where infected fancy pigeons and racing pigeons crossed paths was in his office, and now we have over 13 racing lofts infected and the number is growing. I think its still being investigated how this happened so we'll leave it at that. 

Basically, my own report from the other day was a summary of the fiollowing threads, which have since been updated. I double checked some of the important info with the Incident management team at the DPI . Before posting it. I'm totally open to these sources being wrong.


http://pigeon.id.au/pigeon/index.php?topic=9700.0 

http://pigeon.id.au/pigeon/index.php?topic=9687.0

The information about Collin walker spreading the virus was first posted here:

http://pigeon.id.au/pigeon/index.php?topic=9687.105


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## gazzman58 (Mar 12, 2011)

Bella I do agree 100% that some of the Victorian Racing Pigeon Clubs are not doing the right thing by allowing members to loft fly. I am lead to believe that the Pigeon Punt was a one loft race and totally out of the control of the VHA but I could be wrong. Unfortunately DPI do not have the authority to tell anyone if they can fly their birds or not. If they did they would have banned all flying by now. All the Vic Government can do ( as the other states have done ) is control the movement of pigeons across state borders but not internally. Changes to legislation would be required to do that. The main spread of the virus has been between ethnic flyers who fly various middle eastern and eastern European breeds but are not members of clubs so they haven't been getting the information. Also English is not the first language among some of these people so communication is also a problem. It wasn't until I bought up this point with ANPA that they organised to get the information translated to Arabic as well but that is not enough as there are also a lot of Greek and Macedonian flyers along with the Lebonese and Turkish etc so there is a lot more to do, and yes it has been organised very pourly. The racing guys see it as someone elses problem and that is why they are reacting the way they have but that is a stupid line to take and wont help. I don't even live in Melbourne, I live in Western Victoria and fly Thief Pouters but my birds are locked down and will stay that way until DPI gives the all clear or I have access to the dead PMV1 vaccine from overseas.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Dear gazzman, Thank you, and good on you for the measures you are taking personally to stop the virus.

I suppose we're all scared for the birds we love so much. I guess what really gets to me is the politics involved. Its not a time for politics; its a time to stop a really horrible strain of an already horrible virus in its tracks, and to do what it takes no matter what inconveniences us in the short term. 

I really appreciate hearing the information you have to share too. I am doing my best to get my head around what's really happening, and your input really helps.

Cheers,'bella


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## Goodger (Sep 21, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Hi Gazzman & Kamz,
> 
> and now we have over 13 racing lofts infected and the number is growing.


i thought the 13 racing lofts was just a rumour? as far as i know it hasn't been confirmed


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

Paramyxovirus infection in pigeons: Victoria situation report
Date: 21 September 2011 Time: 1800 hrs
Issued by the Victorian Department of Primary Industries for the pigeon and related industries.
Situation Analysis
? Spread of infection is through the moving of hobby pigeons between properties and the
mixing of pigeons at sales, races, shows and other events; to stop the spread of the
disease, these activities have to cease.
? There is no safety and efficacy data available for the vaccine in pigeons; vaccination is
not the silver bullet - stopping the mixing of pigeons will be what contains this outbreak.
? There are now 36 infected properties in Victoria, where the virus has been confirmed in
pigeons that are sick or have died.
? Over the past 24 hours no new infected properties have been confirmed, however new
reports of sickness and death in both racing pigeons and fancy pigeons have been
received by DPI and are being investigated.
? No poultry or wild birds have tested positive to paramyxovirus.
Background
? Since late August 2011, a paramyxovirus not previously reported in Australia has been
detected in hobby pigeons on a number of properties in Victoria.
? Affected pigeon flocks have experienced high mortalities, associated with lethargy,
gastrointestinal and neurological signs.
? The virus was confirmed as avian paramyxovirus type 1 by the Australian Animal Health
Laboratory (AAHL).
Actions taken in Victoria
? The Incident Management Team (IMT) established at Attwood by the Department of
Primary Industries (DPI) has been operating now for 16 days and continues with its
primary objective of identifying the extent of the disease and limiting its spread where
possible.
? Confirmed cases are located in Shepparton/Tatura area and outer suburbs of Melbourne,
extending to the south west as far as Hoppers crossing, to the south east as far as
Cranbourne and to the north as far as Epping.
? Investigations are being ongoing by DPI to determine possible links between known
infected properties and to detect other affected properties.
? Reports of sick or dead birds from industry, veterinarians and the public are also being
investigated by DPI.
? Movements of birds to and from known infected properties are being investigated to
determine possible sources of infection and the extent of disease spread. Further
movements of birds from these properties are being prevented by quarantine to limit the
chances of further spread.
? Movement of infected birds is the principal method by which the disease is spreading.
Investigations to date suggest that other forms of spread, for example by feed, are not
significant. Irresponsible movement of pigeons risks introducing the disease to new
properties where it will kill the majority or all of the pigeons.
? DPI has reviewed the evidence available regarding vaccination. There is no registered
vaccine for use in pigeons in Victoria, nor is there any safety or efficacy data for the use
of Newcastle Disease vaccine off-label by veterinarians. These and other issues are
For more information about DPI visit the website at www.dpi.vic.gov.au or call the Customer Service Centre on 136 186
considered in information available on the DPI website. It is of paramount importance
that should veterinary advice dictate that pigeons be vaccinated that they are healthy and
live within healthy flocks, that the vaccine is used in close consultation with a
veterinarian, and that pigeon owners ensure high standards of biosecurity to limit the
chance of introduction of infection into their flocks. Remember, flocks not introducing
pigeons nor allowing contact with other pigeons would have no need for vaccination.
? An extensive media and communications effort has been undertaken to inform
veterinarians, industry and the public about the incident, to increase awareness and
provide information about what to look out for, who to contact and measures that can be
undertaken to limit the risk to their birds. Information is being provided by media release,
direct contact, the DPI website and email.
? Suspected cases of paramyxovirus infection should be reported to the DPI by
phoning 136 186 during business hours or 1800 675 888 after hours and on
weekends.
Please note the next industry sitrep will be provided on Friday 23rd September at or around
1800h.
Dr Iain McLaren
Acting Chief Veterinary Officer, Victoria


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## Jerryx4 (Jun 9, 2011)

There are now 36 infected properties in Victoria, where the virus has been confirmed in
pigeons that are sick or have died.


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## gazzman58 (Mar 12, 2011)

Goodger said:


> i thought the 13 racing lofts was just a rumour? as far as i know it hasn't been confirmed


I thought it was still only the one and he managed to isolate the sick bird from the rest of his birds so they should be fine but the latest updates aren't distinguising between fancy and racing so hard to tell?????


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## macka (Oct 26, 2008)

As of today there is only one report of a sick 
bird.In the case of the race birds, it is still only 
the one bird, from a race loft.But there has been 
race type birds reported but not in race lofts.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

You guys are right, there area lot of rumours flying about and its hard to get to the truth.

Macka, what about Heritage lofts, John Shore's birds?


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## macka (Oct 26, 2008)

Bella, the one bird I spoke of is the John Shore bird,
Heritage Lofts.Macka.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

macka said:


> Bella, the one bird I spoke of is the John Shore bird,
> Heritage Lofts.Macka.


Hey Macka, latest info from DPI is that 38 lofts are now infected and racing pigeons are still being infected. The DPI are saying racing pigeons continue to be infected (see below), hut they aren't saying outright the total numbers of racing pigeon lofts affected. You have to rely on other reports for that info.

Date: 23 September 2011 Time: 1800 hrs
Issued by the Victorian Department of Primary Industries for the pigeon and related industries.
Situation Analysis
? Spread of infection is through the moving of hobby pigeons between properties and the
mixing of pigeons at sales, races, shows and other events; to stop the spread of the
disease, these activities have to cease.
? There is no safety and efficacy data available for the vaccine in pigeons; vaccination is
not the silver bullet - stopping the mixing of pigeons will be what contains this outbreak.
? There are now 38 infected properties in Victoria, where the virus has been confirmed in
pigeons that are sick or have died.
? Over the past 48 hours two new infected properties have been confirmed. New reports of
sickness and death in both racing pigeons and fancy pigeons received by DPI and are
still being investigated.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Another update regarding the PMV outbreak:

This one regards the 2011 `Australian Pigeon punt race' that went ahead on September 22 in spite of strong urging from the DPI to lock down the birds. For some reason the outrage expressed about this race keeps getting deleted on other forums. I think a lot of people in the Australian pigeon racing community are touchy about it because of the amount of money involved, and spent, in supporting this race.

As a bit of background, this is Australia's most prestigious/expensive one loft race (that I know of). Its strongly backed by Victoria's wealthy and the Australian pigeon racing community in general. So there was a lot of coyness and a huge amount of cover up regarding this race going ahead in the middle of a PMV outbreak.

Long story short, the race went ahead even though the trainer was heavily cautioned against it by the government. His attitude was that if its not illegal, its not his responsiblity to care. The really horrible thing about it is *the trainer was told by the DPI on the day before the race that one of his birds tested positive for PMV, and he decided to go ahead with the race anyway*. The information is from the trainers report that he wrote himself. Lots of justifications in there:

http://www.australianpigeonpunt.com.au/APPFinalrpt2011.pdf

He says that he was told over a week later that the positive result for PMV was a false positive, but still....was ita false positive or a false negative ? I just can't get my head around that kind of selfishness, running race after he was told that he would be spreading the PMV virus.

Anyway, 200 birds were lost during this race. Where are they? Dead? hopping from one infected loft to another, and into the feral flocks?Who knows.


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## vutarboy (Sep 23, 2011)

Bella_F said:


> Another update regarding the PMV outbreak:
> 
> This one regards the 2011 `Australian Pigeon punt race' that went ahead on September 22 in spite of strong urging from the DPI to lock down the birds. For some reason the outrage expressed about this race keeps getting deleted on other forums. I think a lot of people in the Australian pigeon racing community are touchy about it because of the amount of money involved, and spent, in supporting this race.
> 
> ...


i think he should be band for any future events, how can you guys trust people like that where money is more importent than the future of our hobbie and raceing.


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## gazzman58 (Mar 12, 2011)

RoderickGI said:


> Unfortunately those tatics won't stop a virus. It will just sit tight in a couple of birds, or eslewhere, and wait for a new opportunity to break out.
> 
> Also a vaccine will only stop the vaccinated bird from getting sick. It could just get a low level infection and still be a non-symptomatic carrier, even if only until its immune system gets up to speed.
> 
> No, once the virus is here, it is here. It will just become part of the background sickness that comes and goes as it finds susceptible birds. That is why we have strong customs rules and (used to) try to limit imports of carrier animals, plants, and material. Quarantine in Australia isn't as good as it used to be though, since "market competition" and a "level playing field" have become the approach adopted by our governments.


Our quarentine rules haven't change. This virus arrived with birds that were smuggled in, not legally imported birds.


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