# The battle between PREDATOR and PREY



## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

A youtube clip that starts out alarming for a few pigeon lovers but shows a fantastic ending if your willing to see the whole thing? This clip is well made with music from "TOP GUN" and shows a falcon against a wild pigeon (POOR THING) and again VERSES a trained RACING PIGEON (YIPPE THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!) Hope you enjoyed it! P.S. That little girl looks like an actress I've seen in the movie "dreamer" about a race horse!? Maybe it's her?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Love the ending, but not so keen on a poor feral being caught

John


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

Yea that's life in the fast lane! I'm sure this video was just put together with clipbits however I really love it when seeing our homer come in safe and sound to the safety of his loft home and his mate gives you that all over warm feeling!


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

That was a pretty neat video, except for the poor bird at the beginning. 
A hawk may not catch a race bird flying level one on one......I've seen them go after my birds a few times across the back yard and although they disappear and I don't know what's happened, the bird being chased always shows up back home later in the day. 
However, if the hawk is coming in to attack from above in a dive and the pigeon doesn't see it coming, the pigeon don't stand much of a chance. 
Anyway..........glad to see one survive and get back home to some lovin'....


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## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

*Well great vido I took the time to look at two others vidio's one where a red tail was eating a falcon,the other of a red tail hawk killing a rattle snake which I thought was great .GEORGE *


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

I've got to agree if the falcon was way above and was diving down most all birds don't have a chance, but seeing how smart our pigeons can be when everything is on an even keel is really impressive!


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## Guest (May 14, 2008)

to be honest with you if you have seen a perigrine flying with your flock out and about you would realize that your birds have no chance of out flying a falcon ..my guess is thats a young falcon in training..


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

george simon said:


> *Well great vido
> 
> I took the time to look at two others vidio's one where a red tail was eating a falcon,the other of a red tail hawk killing a rattle snake which I thought was great
> .GEORGE *


I can't understand how anyone could enjoy watching stuff like that?  

Yes, I realize it happens, but to sit & watch videos of it just seems a bit morbid. JMO

Cindy


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## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

AZWhitefeather said:


> I can't undestand how anyone could enjoy watching stuff like that?
> 
> Yes, I realize it happens, but to sit & watch videos of it just seems a bit morbid. JMO
> 
> Cindy


 *HI CINDY, Have you ever watch a falcon eat one of your birds and you could not do any thing to stop it, I HAVE, and have you had young defenseless squarbs eaten by a snake, I HAVE. So seeing the predator get his turn as the victim MADE MY DAY. I only watch these vidios ONCE had I played them over 5 or 6 times that in my book is MORBID* .GEORGE


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

george simon said:


> *
> HI CINDY,
> * Have you ever watch a falcon eat one of your birds and you could not do any thing to stop it*,
> ** *have you had young defenseless squarbs eaten by a snake,* .GEORGE


Howdy GEORGE,
* No, I haven't. 
** Again, no, I haven't & doubt I ever will on either account. 
My birds are not subjected to the possibility of being confronted by a predator, whether it flies or slithers. 

Cindy


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

Cindy---NEVER SAY NEVER, cause it will happen no matter what you do, no matter all the precautions you take, at some point bad things just happen!

Cindy, I think you missed the whole point of that video, it should have been uplifting to see that homing pigeon out fly, out think, out maneuver that predator, it was amazing to say the least (something we rarely get a chance to see) and the way it ended was really great IMHO!


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Appreciate your input DEEJAY. 



DEEJAY7950 said:


> * *Cindy---NEVER SAY NEVER*, cause it will happen no matter what you do, no matter all the precautions you take, at some point bad things just happen!
> 
> ** *I think you missed the whole point of that video*,


* I didn't say never. 

The reason I said I doubt the scenario George presented would happen to me is because I don't free fly my birds, nor do they live outside. They reside in our AZ room within an aviary. Therefore the probability of them coming into contact with a hawk or snake are *extremely* slim.

** Actually, I opted not to watch the video that you posted the link to. 
I was just commenting on George's post. 

Cindy


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## Guest (May 15, 2008)

I agree it was amazing that that one made its getaway , I have even seen it with my own birds a time or two first hand, but they dont always zing zang away those birds of prey  I have this one bird that was chased three times and he alueded a cooper each time but his method was not to out fly but to fly then dive for the nearest bush and thats when I would interveine cuz those coopers will go to any length to get your birds ... my poor Woody his brother Buzz was eaten by that same cooper rest in peace my poor little buddy  
Now as for talking about it being morbid , all you have to do is look out your window and see things like that, so its not fair to say that looking at those videos is morbid in my opinion ,cant stop life from happening you know


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

DEEJAY7950 said:


> A youtube clip that starts out alarming for a few pigeon lovers but shows a fantastic ending if your willing to see the whole thing? This clip is well made with music from "TOP GUN" and shows a falcon against a wild pigeon (POOR THING) and again VERSES a trained RACING PIGEON (YIPPE THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!) Hope you enjoyed it! P.S. That little girl looks like an actress I've seen in the movie "dreamer" about a race horse!? Maybe it's her?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


Well I needed something to uplift my spirits! So I played it once, twice, and thrice! LOL Oh I'm so BAD!


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## ohiogsp (Feb 24, 2006)

DEEJAY7950 said:


> Well I needed something to uplift my spirits! So I played it once, twice, and thrice! LOL Oh I'm so BAD!



Me too a hawk got one of mine the other day and it sucked.


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

Sorry to hear about your loss, may your birds be swift and full of vigor and never be caught again AMEN!


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## vouteman (May 17, 2008)

ohiogsp said:


> Me too a hawk got one of mine the other day and it sucked.


I live in Lou. KY. The city fathers decided many years ago to propagate Peregrine Falcons. They put boxes up on the bridges, Smoke stacks at one of the power plants. They will visit a flock of flying birds and kill for fun. I had performing rollers and the falcons would dive trough them and slice and dice them and let them drop to the ground without even trying to catch them. They were showing their young how to hunt. I got rid of the rollers. I spent two thousand dollars traveling and buying some Greek nose divers. (Voute/Wuta) These birds can out dive the falcons. The problem is that they are slow fliers. They have 16-18 tail feathers, when you toss them they spread their tail until it is getting slapped by the secondary feathers as they pump their wings. I tried them for 15 years and just disposed of the last of my fun Voute a few weeks ago. I also tried Donek, (Greek, Macedonian and Yugoslavian) At first they were able to avoid the hawks and falcons with their fantastic aerial maneuvers. Then the hawks learned how to catch those also. Now I am down to four pair of white Jansens and four cocks and two hens that are yellow Beakarts. The haven't hatched and raised a successful nest and have had the birds mated up since mid January. I haven't flown a bird for five months. The hawks are here every day hanging on the wire windows and wire doors. When they do this all the birds gang up in one or two nest and naturally the birds want to nest in the top boxes. The babies when this happen get smashed or eggs get broke in their frenzied attempt to stay away from the hawks. I really don't get much enjoyment of looking at caged birds. I raise parrots, cockatiels, and parakeets for looking at. I have had pigeons continuously for 48 years this July. I have come to the conclusion that I will no longer get to keep and fly my loved pigeons. I come from a family of old German immigrants that love pigeons. Over the years there have been several members of my family have raced pigeons. The story is my grandfather hit Ellis Island with $2.65 in his pocket and a cage with four pigeons in it. He passed the pigeon keeping down to my three uncles and my dad. It is a shame that the government will do nothing to help the pigeon fancier in this matter. I have a pair of nesting falcons less than a mile away and a nesting pair of Coopers hawks about six blocks from my house. Well thanks, I needed to vent about those dastardly rascals.


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## ohiogsp (Feb 24, 2006)

Yes, it is really sad the hawks are out of control and nothing will be done about it.


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

Don't worry too much cause nature tends to balance things out, when there's too much of anything nature will correct it given enough time to do so!


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

DEEJAY7950 said:


> A youtube clip that starts out alarming for a few pigeon lovers but shows a fantastic ending if your willing to see the whole thing? This clip is well made with music from "TOP GUN" and shows a falcon against a wild pigeon (POOR THING) and again VERSES a trained RACING PIGEON (YIPPE THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!) Hope you enjoyed it! P.S. That little girl looks like an actress I've seen in the movie "dreamer" about a race horse!? Maybe it's her?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


Oh I'm so BAD cause I played it again and again! Good lovin, gimmy, gimmy, some Good lovin!


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## bigislerollers (Jan 20, 2008)

vouteman said:


> I live in Lou. KY. The city fathers decided many years ago to propagate Peregrine Falcons. They put boxes up on the bridges, Smoke stacks at one of the power plants. They will visit a flock of flying birds and kill for fun. I had performing rollers and the falcons would dive trough them and slice and dice them and let them drop to the ground without even trying to catch them. They were showing their young how to hunt. I got rid of the rollers. I spent two thousand dollars traveling and buying some Greek nose divers. (Voute/Wuta) These birds can out dive the falcons. The problem is that they are slow fliers. They have 16-18 tail feathers, when you toss them they spread their tail until it is getting slapped by the secondary feathers as they pump their wings. I tried them for 15 years and just disposed of the last of my fun Voute a few weeks ago. I also tried Donek, (Greek, Macedonian and Yugoslavian) At first they were able to avoid the hawks and falcons with their fantastic aerial maneuvers. Then the hawks learned how to catch those also. Now I am down to four pair of white Jansens and four cocks and two hens that are yellow Beakarts. The haven't hatched and raised a successful nest and have had the birds mated up since mid January. I haven't flown a bird for five months. The hawks are here every day hanging on the wire windows and wire doors. When they do this all the birds gang up in one or two nest and naturally the birds want to nest in the top boxes. The babies when this happen get smashed or eggs get broke in their frenzied attempt to stay away from the hawks. I really don't get much enjoyment of looking at caged birds. I raise parrots, cockatiels, and parakeets for looking at. I have had pigeons continuously for 48 years this July. I have come to the conclusion that I will no longer get to keep and fly my loved pigeons. I come from a family of old German immigrants that love pigeons. Over the years there have been several members of my family have raced pigeons. The story is my grandfather hit Ellis Island with $2.65 in his pocket and a cage with four pigeons in it. He passed the pigeon keeping down to my three uncles and my dad. It is a shame that the government will do nothing to help the pigeon fancier in this matter. I have a pair of nesting falcons less than a mile away and a nesting pair of Coopers hawks about six blocks from my house. Well thanks, I needed to vent about those dastardly rascals.




Aloha Vouteman,

Don't give up on the pigeons. You might just want to try FOR'S (Flying Oriental Rollers). Not to be mistaken with the show oriental rollers. There is a gentleman in Florida that purposely flys his kits against the hawks and he even mentioned that the falcons have given up on his pigeons and have looked for dinner somewhere else. Something to think about.

Here is the link to the other forum where he posts info on the FOR's. Lots of info on flying orientals and other performing rollers. He goes by the handle SIPPI.


http://www.performingrollers.com/


Good Luck.


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## ohiogsp (Feb 24, 2006)

Isn't this the organizaion that the people from california were in, that got in trouble for shooting over 50 hawks? I have always heard rollers attract hawks cause they act like a injured bird.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

YOU CAN INTERVENE:

IF you have hawks around, I would not release my birds, first of all, and second of all, IF you do release your birds and see a hawk actually get one of your birds and take the bird down, you need to chase it down and find where he has dropped the bird. He will leave the bird upon your finding him.

You can usually save their lives at that point, if the tallon hasn't compromised any major organs, and even then they can be saved. I have had this happen several times, before I stopped flying and have saved my birds. I have a bird that lost an eye, and her back was picked bare, but she was fine otherwise. Another one had a gash on his belly and he got stitches and was fine. This happened the first time a hawk appeared, as these birds were not homing pigeons-that was the last time they went out.

Also, it is your duty to continue to chase any hawk that drops your birds close by, even if the bird is dead-go bury it-don't let him have the meal, because it discourages them from trying again. You have to make it hard for the hawk, so they go elsewhere.

Usually the birds can outfly and/or outsmart a hawk, if they are well trained and healthy, but on the occasion that one of your birds does get caught, go after it from now on. The pigeons are usually in shock and are not always dead, GO AFTER THEM- SAVE YOUR BIRDS IF POSSIBLE, BUT CHASE THE HAWKS AWAY FROM THE BIRD, DON'T ALLOW THEM TO HAVE AN EASY KILL, AND MAKE THEM GO ELSWHERE.


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## bigislerollers (Jan 20, 2008)

ohiogsp said:


> Isn't this the organizaion that the people from california were in, that got in trouble for shooting over 50 hawks? I have always heard rollers attract hawks cause they act like a injured bird.


1. NO!  2. Then why do hawks go after commies, homers and other breeds of pigeons????? BH!


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

DEEJAY7950 said:


> Oh I'm so BAD cause I played it again and again! Good lovin, gimmy, gimmy, some Good lovin!


 Needed this to get rid of all the negativity I'm hearing here of late!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


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## Guest (May 30, 2008)

Im with you on the negativity scene, it causes to much unrest in the spirit world  its madness, madness I tell you


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## Guest (May 30, 2008)

oh this is a response to Dexters comment.. I have to agree with him that rollers arent anymore attractive to a hawk then any other bird in the sky ...they will take any opportunity they can get wether they roll ,tumble or fly in a straight line.


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## Grim (Jul 28, 2007)

In the video the bird has white flights. The bird coming in to trap doesn't seem to have any. I think it is a hoax the falcon won


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## Feather (Dec 8, 2005)

AZWhitefeather said:


> I can't understand how anyone could enjoy watching stuff like that?
> 
> Yes, I realize it happens, but to sit & watch videos of it just seems a bit morbid. JMO
> 
> Cindy


Hi Cindy,

I know how you feel. It is heartbreaking, but sometimes knowing the habits and advantages of the perp. is the only defense we have. I have made myself watch everything I can...especially having to do with the Peregrine Falcon. 

I need to know what kind of force my birds are up against. Eight years ago I watched a Peregrine dive at my flock, and knock many out of the sky. Now I know what time of year that bird migrates through my area. I lost one bird after that to a Peregrine. 

Coopers will drop your birds if you make enough noise, but Peregrines don't scare. Now when I see a Peregrine, I go looking for downed birds.


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## Guest (May 31, 2008)

you do have to realize there was no way for them to follow that same bird all the way back to the loft with their camera lol  I like the happy dance at the end myself


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## Guest (May 31, 2008)

feather I agree peregrines fear nothing be it in front of your face or a mile in the air ..I too have had a migrating pair hit my flock once and they bounced my birds all over the sky , there was no escaping them and all I could do was watch it unfold before my eye  Luckily for me I only lost one bird to them that day because the way the pound birds outtah the air they dont just stop at one


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## Feather (Dec 8, 2005)

This year when my birds were free flying there were two large hawks that appeared in the sky. Then from nowhere the Peregrine appeared, but instead of going after my birds it attacked the large hawk. The smaller of the hawks then flew into the mix, which gave my birds enough time to trap in. All safe!!

I have a picture of my birds flying in, zooming by my head. They really do have fear on their faces.


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## Grim (Jul 28, 2007)

It must have a nest nearby.


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

DEEJAY7950 said:


> Well I needed something to uplift my spirits! So I played it once, twice, and thrice! LOL Oh I'm so BAD!


 I just love that ending!


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

Play it again Sam!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

play it again SAM!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

play it again Sam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Gosh! The ending is great, but I wasn't too thrilled with the feral part of it. Interesting video, no less. 

Terry


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## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

A healthy racing pigeon can outfly even an adult falcon on level flight or climbing flight every day. The advantage the falcon has is when he gets above the pigeon and dives at 200 + MPH The pigeon will lose that competition more often than not. My birds will immediately climb above a hawk or falcon when loft flying to take away the advantage and then they harrass them by flying around them in a circle. It is fun to watch. My area has a high population of blue Jays and they alert everyone when a bird of prey is in the sky or trees.


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## santhosh_pigeons (May 29, 2002)

Talking about hawks and pigeons ....... some of my tumblers are so good now they dont give a damn bout the hawks ..... its like they dont care ..... i have three birds that are absolutely fearless ....two are over three years old and the other twelve year old...... they dodge peregrines in a dive with a tumble 

i cant say the same about the others though
i have hears turkish tumblers(doneks) are pretty fearless also..... 
I hate to lose anything to the hawks but its really hard to keep the birds on the ground coz some of them fly for long hours (upto 12 hrs)


and that youtube video..... i think i should make one with my birds ...... i would need a really expensive camera for that......


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

As my birds flew over a waiting hawk in a dead tree , I thought of this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jg4x9_pDH-I

and the hawk never left his perch!


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## Guest (Dec 5, 2008)

woooooooooo I had a hit tonight as my birds dropped in for their feeding , the cooper blew right thru and across the landing board missing every single bird on the way ...it was like an explosion of wings as they took to the air all within 2 feet of myself ,i could have reached out and grabbed him right out of the air if I had seen him coming


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## dapplepigeon (Mar 24, 2010)

I hear of racing pigeons creaming hawks...but what about youngish pigeons that have been flying around the area as they pleased, and not being used for racing? What chances do they have?


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