# SFL "test kit" updates here



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

Let me start by saying I picked up my team on Sat. 2-3-07. The photo attched is the birds in Warren's loft (avery photo bottom). The bird photos are the team trying to keep warm, are in my loft. Did you count them? I received 10. What a nice surprise. The kit was 8 +1 for pick up AND a bonus. All I can say is THANK YOU, I will help make SFL-USA birds winners.

It was great to meet Warren and learned a few things also during the pick up. For example stick there head in the waterer so they know what it looks like and how to use it. The birds are very easy to handle. I can tell they are definetly pampered. I will do the same. 

 My first update will be this. It is VERY cold so loft time is shorter than normal. So I don't know if team was in my large avery that is also the landing board and trap, within the last 2 days The birds can exit loft through a bob (behing the green closed door in photo) enter by trap. Self training to use trap. And still not leave the avery. At feeding time tonight I poked a birds head out (it was dark) no I don't want to go to cold and dark, the next went out. The question is will s/he find way back in. A few seconds later (probaly aming for lights and food) In the trap s/he comes.  SFL-USA 104 trapped.


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Very handsome birds you got there! Thank you for the photos and please do keep us posted on how it all goes. I think this "test kit" idea is going to turn out to be a very good thing for Smith Family Loft and all the recipients of the kits!

Terry


----------



## AZfiddler_1996 (Jul 13, 2005)

A_Smith said:


> It was great to meet Warren...


 You lucky pup!


----------



## AZfiddler_1996 (Jul 13, 2005)

I've never met a soul on Pigeon Talk (in person, of course) and I sure wish I could meet some of my friends! 

Licha


----------



## Feather (Dec 8, 2005)

Oh Geesh Licha,

I feel as though I have known you forever.

Feather


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

The babies are beautiful and I'm sure they will do well thru the adjustment period.

I think this is a WIN..WIN situation for all.

Please keep us updated on coming events.


----------



## AZfiddler_1996 (Jul 13, 2005)

Feather said:


> I feel as though I have known you forever.


 ...and I've still never seen you! Hey- you never sent me your picture! What's up with that?! I'm not going to let you get off the hook that easy! 

Licha


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Good that the birds are what you liked and that you are working with them I noticed the other day looking at young bird picture on Warren s web site he has some good looking young birds That should do the people getting a kit from him some good results Keep us posted on your training through the year.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 2*

I was so surprised to see 104 trap yesterday on his own. So today when I came home from work all my future racers went into avery with help. I then started to change the water. ( Or should I say ice to cold for heater to stop from freezing above drinkable level. ) When I came out side to place water in loft, all the team was in the loft. All of the SFL-USA birds have trapped.


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

That is good to hear...


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Congratulations, A. Smith!! 

We Will Be Seeing Many Updates, I Hope!

Mighty Fine Lookin' Pijies!


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

re lee said:


> Good that the birds are what you liked and that you are working with them I noticed the other day looking at young bird picture on Warren s web site he has some good looking young birds That should do the people getting a kit from him some good results Keep us posted on your training through the year.


Hello Robert,

Well, this ought to prove interesting to say the least. Right here for everybody to see, SFL USA birds in the care and management of a new racing fancier, trying his hand at the sport of Racing Pigeons ! 

The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly !  

The birds on the web site : http://www.smithfamilyloft.com/YBKit.htm and shown on another post, are the same birds that Allen here now owns !! 

So now we all know, that the birds are pretty, but now can Allen here, teach them how to fly and win a race ?! Maybe I shall go through my order book, and see who might be willing to provide him with some competition. Wouldn't that be funny, if it turns out that there is more then a single team going out to friends and readers of these posts at pigeon talk ?


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Hello Robert,
> 
> Well, this ought to prove interesting to say the least. Right here for everybody to see, SFL USA birds in the care and management of a new racing fancier, trying his hand at the sport of Racing Pigeons !
> 
> ...


 Warren when I say good looking birds I say that to mean Quality birds. Its a habit I have had for many years . Any time I see birds that I think are good birds I call them good looking birds. Yes the rest is in the training and racing. But from what I looked at You have been raising some decent birds And I do not say this to just be saying it I saw something good in your young birds. Keep up the work you are doing on your program I think you will see forward steps the way you are breeding


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

Yes Robert, 

I knew....that you knew that, and meant that. I just felt a little playful as I recalled a scene from the movie, "The Dirty Dozen" when this crazy private, played by Donald Sutherland ? ...said " sure they are pretty captain...but can they fight !!" 

I assure you Robert, theses birds are also down right pretty ! Pretty the kind that can win a race, and then win the Best in Show. I am sorry, I can't help myself. But I don't know if there is anything more beautiful, then a well bred, well balanced, aerodynamically perfect, racing pigeon. Well...maybe...but this is the #2 for sure !!

And for me, the faster they become, the prettier they get !!


----------



## WFLlofts (Jan 2, 2007)

Wow Im scared to let my birds out this time of year to many hawks for me Ive seen hawks grab em thru the trap I used to use the sputnick kind but have changed it.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 3*

The team has settled well, All are traping very well and know the sound of dinner arriving.  . It has been VERY cold and windy. I will be opening the avery soon. I just want the wind to calm down a little for there first try at free flight. Hopefully my next update is that all the birds were on the wing and came home for dinner.


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I'm glad to hear the birds are trapping well, please keep us updated on your little champions.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 4*

Yes they can fly.  The avery was opened and off the board they went very cautiously. First to the lifted avery top, then the roof, and down to the snow in the driveway. Some short flights. Then back into the trap. They were able to be free for about 4 hrs. I was watching them the whole time. The weather got worse as the day went on. First sunny, then snow and wind. I got cold but birds were very happy to streach there wings. The birds didn't trap till almost dark. (feeding time) Today was as scary for me as it was for them. All went well.


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Glad all went well today. I can appreciate that you were just a tad nervous yourself .. I know I would be! Enjoyed the update and the picture .. please keep 'em coming!

Terry


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

A_Smith said:


> Yes they can fly.  The avery was opened and off the board they went very cautiously. First to the lifted avery top, then the roof, and down to the snow in the driveway. Some short flights. Then back into the trap. They were able to be free for about 4 hrs. I was watching them the whole time. The weather got worse as the day went on. First sunny, then snow and wind. I got cold but birds were very happy to streach there wings. The birds didn't trap till almost dark. (feeding time) Today was as scary for me as it was for them. All went well.


All I can say is you've got more guts than I do....... Our birds are in the settling cage but that's it. It's been to cold for me to stand out for 4 hours watching them and just about every other day the wind is blowing 10 to 20 mph with gusts up to 30 and 40. No way would I put my birds out in that, so they've just stayed in the loft. I know I'm asking for trouble the first time out as they will be much stronger than they should be. But, what can you do when mother nature doesn't cooperate?


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> Yes they can fly.  The avery was opened and off the board they went very cautiously. First to the lifted avery top, then the roof, and down to the snow in the driveway. Some short flights. Then back into the trap. They were able to be free for about 4 hrs. I was watching them the whole time. The weather got worse as the day went on. First sunny, then snow and wind. I got cold but birds were very happy to streach there wings. The birds didn't trap till almost dark. (feeding time) Today was as scary for me as it was for them. All went well.


 Nice pictures.....and I feel like some of the others...when I say you must have nerves of steel. Right now on your roof they look like Hawk Bait !!  

But, as mine sit inside growing stronger on the wing by the day....I know that trying to settle YB's strong on the wing can cause even larger losses should a hawk attack and a "fly off" should occur.

Good Luck !!!


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Nice pictures.....and I feel like some of the others...when I say you must have nerves of steel. Right now on your roof they look like Hawk Bait !!
> 
> But, as mine sit inside growing stronger on the wing by the day....I know that trying to settle YB's strong on the wing can cause even larger losses should a hawk attack and a "fly off" should occur.
> 
> Good Luck !!!


Boy..........you said a mouth full.............


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

What a dilemna  , Keep them in and let them get heavy on the wing, or let them fly in very windy weather, and have them sitting on the roof, like sitting ducks.  Tough decision allright.


----------



## Guest (Feb 19, 2007)

this time of year I am hard pressed to let out even the experianced flyers so I take my hat off to you my good man  one of these days I would like to start breeding some Rambo Pigeons that will kick hawk butt anytime one is around lol


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Trees Gray said:


> What a dilemna  , Keep them in and let them get heavy on the wing, or let them fly in very windy weather, and have them sitting on the roof, like sitting ducks.  Tough decision allright.



You've got a 50/50 shot either way.........I always raise early babies, and I NEVER get them out for the first time before March 1st. I say every year I'm going to do better, but so far I haven't..... Last year we did loose some off of the loft first time out.......something spooked them and in no time they were specks in the sky....... Luckily.....that was the first time that it happened to us, but it sure makes me wary for this year.


----------



## kalapati (Aug 29, 2006)

LokotaLoft said:


> this time of year I am hard pressed to let out even the experianced flyers so I take my hat off to you my good man  one of these days I would like to start breeding some Rambo Pigeons that will kick hawk butt anytime one is around lol



here's my 4 mos. old Rambo. he's always able to evade mr. cooper's short chase.

last saturday i have him out at about 6:30 AM and as usual mr cooper gave a chase. my Rambo or Pacman as my wife calls him was out for about 3 hours. when he returned he pulled out some Gs on a vertical stoop and landed straight on the trap board instead of landing on his favorite roof spot for he knows mr cooper is somewhere around the corner. very smart.


----------



## Guest (Feb 20, 2007)

I have this one pigeon that has eluded mr cooper hawk 3 times in one year and each time he would dive straight for the closest bushes he could find ,I call him woody, but his brother Buzz wasnt as talented or lucky may he rest in pigeon peace


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 5*

The weather was warmer today. Well it made it past freezing anyway. When I came home from work, had to do it. The avery went open and birds came out . Photo is of some of them just before ALL went inside for dinner. Second day out and they know the sound of flying. First day all went on avery with help, then opened screen and off they went slowly. Today opened screen and out they came when one left board. They heard the wings and said I can do that too.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 5*



SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Nice pictures.....and I feel like some of the others...when I say you must have nerves of steel. Right now on your roof they look like Hawk Bait !!
> 
> But, as mine sit inside growing stronger on the wing by the day....I know that trying to settle YB's strong on the wing can cause even larger losses should a hawk attack and a "fly off" should occur.
> 
> Good Luck !!!


The birds were on the wing again Feb. 28th. Everybody came home.  Yesterday 3-3 All birds were out. I leave all my birds out at the same time. My OB are late hatches and still learning to fly also. The day was nice sunny most of the time and not windy. Then a hawk came to visit (small pigeon size hawk)  Went to center of loft roof MISSED birds. Then all the birds were flying. Some grouped together and flew, and some were sitting in trees. I just called them home ( hey come back, here's home) A few came back in a few minutes, some waited till dark. BUT some wanted to try sitting in snow flurries on a tree branch in the dark for the night. I did see one trap in the morning. Hopefully more to come home today. My head count is still low. Here is a question: Yesterday was a moon eclipse. When it started to get dark it was dark (no full moon). If the birds aim for the moon (from the west) they will be aiming for my trap. Do you think this may be why some still missing? OR just the scarey hawk.


----------



## Guest (Mar 5, 2007)

Hi there A smith, plez do let us know if anymore come home, would hate to see you lose your team already ,looking forward to a happy ending hopefully  keeping my fingers crossed for you and your birds .


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

Hello Allen,

One of the things that I try not to do, is have my birds out all day in trees, on the roof, etc. I view this as teaching them bad habits, because on race day, don't be surprized when the birds decide to chill out for awhile on the roof or in the trees, before trapping. 

The other issue, is with all those hours out there, they will tend to get themselves in trouble. I would allow them out to fly and then when they are done flying then call them in to eat. If they don't respond to your calls, then you have no control over your birds, and they are training you, instead of the other way around. 

Here at SFL the birds are expected to be flying or sitting inside the secure loft, house sitting and tree sitting is a habit that will come back to haunt you....but that is just my thoughts on the subject.


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I agree here with Warren
If you let the birds sit in trees and hang around on the loft you are looking for trouble. Hawk problems, neighbor problems, bad habbit problems, etc. A well trained flock will fly, land on the loft, and come in at your call - whistle, shake of a can etc. I keep my birds just a little hungry. I also have a rule at my loft, I feed twice a day. When training, I fly feed, fly feed. This way they they have to trap to eat. I give them a few minutes to trap and if they sit on the loft, I remove the feed. They have to wait for the next fly feed cycle. This cures them of the "sitting around" habbit very quickly. I also have a time limit. If I have to leave and it is about dark, I close the trap and leave the bird out over night. I do not want to jepordize the flocks safety for one deliquent bird. He will come in next fly cycle. I watched a guys birds come home from a 200 mile race and sit on the loft for about 15 minutes before trapping. They need to know who is boss. Watch a movie from one of the best fliers in the world and watch their birds trap. Most trap within second of landing. I hand feed about half of the time, so the birds do not have problems trapping while I am in the loft. I have found some that do not trap right away are waiting until I go in before they trap. I shake, I whistle and they come. Don't get me wrong, I do have birds down from "De Zitter". This bird from the Janssen Brothers was know for sitting and gazing at the sites when comming home from races. He still won his fair share. There is good days and bad days. They good are usually related to feeding and consistency.
Randy


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

3 more birds home today for dinner.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*Update 6*

Well I'm very happy today. Today when I let my future winners out to fly, Not only did they fly, But did fly in small groups. I kept them on the wing by keeping them off the loft roof. Also some took of and went sight seeing and remembered home.  The birds all trapped into loft about 1/2 hr. earlyer than normal. (BUT 1) I think this is because of a reduction of food and tired wings. As Warren said on pigeonradio "lean and mean". Mine are not mean but are leaning out nicely. The one that came home late about 1 hr later than rest I thought was gone, BUT s/he just likes to come home late. (did this last time too). One thing for sure I can tell SFL-USA birds in the air and in the loft hiding the band standing on one leg. The birds just look like winners. Gracefull on the fly, always in a nice grouping, and even perch near eachother. All my birds are special but SFL birds can be noticed without much difficulity. They look like winners and are a team. I will be putting them to the test against my other racers. I guess we will need to wait to see who earns the top perchs.


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Thank you for the update, and I'm glad your SFL USA birds are training so well....any chance we can get a picture of them now that they are growing up and "working out"?


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

Yea I am with Treesa,

Let's see some photo's of those Champs ! I had some of my SFL USA banded birds out for the first time this past week, and within an hour, there was a Cooper Hawk pinning one of the birds to the ground !   

I was able to rescue that one, but another one was a bit strong on the wing, and by my guess, he didn't stop till he crossed the state line. Now that was three days ago, and I have yet to see that bird again. With that "excitement" out of the way, the rest seem to be settling just fine. That is, until our resident Cooper gets hungrey again.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

Today four birds from my SFL USA YB team were placed into a USPS shipping container and shipped to the Flamingo International Challenge at 

http://www.flamingoic.com/index.php?...055c4b954787ea

there they will be weaned and trained for several races including 150,200,250 and 350 mile races. There they will not only compete in four difference races, but also the average speed from these four different races. I mean here we are talking about the best of the best, in the USA !!


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Warren,

So... it's off to school for the"best of the best" youngsters. 

I pray they will be safe and enjoy their new lives.

Please keep us updated on the little champs.


----------



## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Today four birds from my SFL USA YB team were placed into a USPS shipping container and shipped to the Flamingo International Challenge at
> 
> http://www.flamingoic.com/index.php?...055c4b954787ea
> 
> there they will be weaned and trained for several races including 150,200,250 and 350 mile races. There they will not only compete in four difference races, but also the average speed from these four different races. I mean here we are talking about the best of the best, in the USA !!


Mr Warren, How have you been???? Looks like we will be flying against each other this year Are you going to make it to Detroit? Whats the chance of getting a batch of them there SFL USA birds? Mix me up a real good batch when you do.  Talk with ya later and keep em flyin'.
Ken
kanddlofts.com


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

whitesnmore said:


> Mr Warren, How have you been???? Looks like we will be flying against each other this year Are you going to make it to Detroit? Whats the chance of getting a batch of them there SFL USA birds? Mix me up a real good batch when you do.  Talk with ya later and keep em flyin'.
> Ken
> kanddlofts.com


Hello Ken !

Now please don't tell me that you are going to have to fly againest SFL USA banded birds in the AU Convention Race, and not out of the same loft !! 
I had a friend of mine do that once, the SFL USA banded birds waited for his birds to come home late one day from a training toss and then they ganged up on them and beat them up...he got so mad at me...that we haven't spoken since ! I tried to explain that they were not bred to be well mannered, they will often beat up on the local boys, take their lunch money and the high perches. 

If you are sending birds to Lynn...maybe they can find a safe spot on the floor somewhere for your sweet birds to hide out ?


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Student Loans*



Trees Gray said:


> Hi Warren,
> 
> So... it's off to school for the"best of the best" youngsters.
> 
> ...


Yes...thank you, here is the "Harvard" of the racing pigeon schools....If ya think your pigeon kids are smart, then pony up the $400 entry fee, and let them demonstrate their mettle !  I was lucky, in that mine qualified for student loans and grants !!


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Sounds exciting, Warren! 

Really looking forward to updates!!

Best of everything!!


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Warren,

That is exciting, and I will be looking forward to hear about their Harvard Racing Pigeon school diplomas, PHD's...that is...


----------



## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Hello Ken !
> 
> Now please don't tell me that you are going to have to fly againest SFL USA banded birds in the AU Convention Race, and not out of the same loft !!
> I tried to explain that they were not bred to be well mannered, they will often beat up on the local boys, take their lunch money and the high perches.
> ...


----------



## learning (May 19, 2006)

*Careful Now!*

Hey Whitesnmore,

I wouldn't be trying to ruffle any feathers just yet. Until proven otherwise, those "chickens" have a pretty solid history. Seems to me to be a quick way to embarass yourself in a hurry if things don't turn out the way you hope.

Dan


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

mr squeaks said:


> Sounds exciting, Warren!
> 
> Really looking forward to updates!!
> 
> Best of everything!!


Thank You Mr. Squeaks ! 

For me personally, the heart skips a beat, and my mouth get's very dry, as the bird arrives at the home loft !! Now, if it is a local race in York, Pa. that has been a problem, because try to whistle when you are nervous like that !!

Now that is when you are really doing it for the bragging rights...you know fun. When you are watching it on the Flamingo Web Cam...and many thousands of dollars in winnings and breeding rights !!! Well we are talking heart attack material !! Not exactly the same as being there, but I can watch the birds when every thing is up and running at : 

http://www.flamingoic.com/index.php...am&PHPSESSID=9f08399d89adc901bc4ca859476ce965

Now if you are there in person, a party is going on, and that makes it more fun, and they have an ambulance there on stand by...you know with oxygen and stuff !


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

learning said:


> Hey Whitesnmore,
> 
> I wouldn't be trying to ruffle any feathers just yet. Until proven otherwise, those "chickens" have a pretty solid history. Seems to me to be a quick way to embarass yourself in a hurry if things don't turn out the way you hope.
> 
> Dan


Now Dan,

Pay the little whipper snapper no mind. Ken has been an official tester since way back when ? Somehow I agree to ship him something now and then, and he put's it through a Chicago Land evaluation or "Consumer Reports" if you will. This is where he throws the best of everything that the Greater Chicago Land Universe has to throw !! Now, I am suspecting that he is now going beyond his club, since he has pretty much wiped them up, and is reaching throughout his Combine, and maybe even beyond, in a bid to make me look bad ! 

He somehow got a bunch of guys to hand over a who's who list of racing pigeon dignitaries and then he gives these birds the royal treatment. This year he is bringing in some fancy Royal Golden Matten bloodlines...these are the bloodlines that Mike Ganus asks $8500+ for a direct son or daughter !!!  

See: http://ganusfamilyloft.com/goldenmattens2.htm

Then these poor SFL USA banded birds are thrown in a smaller section where his young children manage the SFL birds, and are asked to give a good accounting of themselves !!  I mean, if he sounds just a bit "Cocky" it may be because the big guns in Chicago Land are looking to set up an ambush and are gunning for us ! And "Us" in this case is Dylan, Jenna, and I. And so the Big Boys with the Big Guns are backing up Ken...and Smith Family Lofts USA have chosen instead to have Dylan and Jenna manage the SFL USA team. We want poor Ken to have every possible advantage, so that no one can say it wasn't a fair test. 

Then again.....you check out the K & D web site, and tell me if you think Kens stands a chance with Dylan and Jenna managing things and making sure the water is clean and that the perches sparkle, I don't think so ?  

http://www.kanddlofts.com/AboutUs.html

I think Dylan and Jenna are going to be the BIG WINNERS is this contest !! You just wait and see !!


----------



## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

*Feather Ruffling*

Dan, Warren and I go way back and that is just a inside Joke between he and I when we like to tease each other. I would in no way mean he has Lower Class Pigeons. Quite the opposite. I am a repeat visitor to his loft and have always got nothing but quality from him. I call them "Chickens" cause they are HAWK BAIT for Mr. Cooper 
Ken


----------



## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Then again.....you check out the K & D web site, and tell me if you think Kens stands a chance with Dylan and Jenna managing things and making sure the water is clean and that the perches sparkle, I don't think so ?
> 
> http://www.kanddlofts.com/AboutUs.html
> 
> I think Dylan and Jenna are going to be the BIG WINNERS is this contest !! You just wait and see !!



Sounds to me like you have some insight to the breeding ability of SFL919 & SFL903  You taught me better than to send unproven breeders to the money races!!! I assure you you will be flying against protege from SFL USA bred birds. The line breeding is complete and ready for the cross out and that is why the "Big Guns" birds were brought in. I cant breed lower class birds to SFL USA birds and say I honestly tried to improve on the strain. Dont blame me you are the one who taught me this. Just trying to be a good student  I just feel sorry for the other JR members flyin against J and D.


----------



## learning (May 19, 2006)

Sorry Ken,

I think you misunderstand. I knew you weren't talking about his pigeons, I thought you were calling Warren a chicken!  Just kidding!'

Actually, I am somewhat familiar with your setup from Warren's testimonial page. Wish you all the very best.

Dan


----------



## whitesnmore (Sep 9, 2004)

*sfl test kits*

Dan, No problem it is all in fun. Did you get a chance to aquire any SFL USA birds yet? Do you fly in a club? This is by far the best sport in the world and has some of the best people in the world also!!!!!!  
Ken


----------



## learning (May 19, 2006)

Ken,

Unfortunately I am about a year and a half into a two year project. For various reasons I am having to take the building of my loft slowly. I am finishing the roof this weekend and am planning on having everything ready for some full time tennants sometime in late fall or early winter. We'll see.

I am a member of the North Atlanta Racing Pigeon Club. We are a brand new club that is starting up as an offshoot of the Greater Atlanta Racing Pigeon Club that has been active in this area for many years. If you would like to visit our web page go to:

www.northatlantarpc.com

Go to the members page and click on my name and you will see how things are going with my construction. I am actually a little further along than those photos show. 

I look forward to watching the developments over the next several months. Best of luck to you and your kids!

Dan


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 7*

It's been a while since my last update. Here is a photo of SFL USA birds after a 1/2 mile release. Sofar my YB's have been released in my yard and, twice at a half mile. My local hawk is now getting confused his dinner is getting faster. I'm sorry to say I only have 7 of the ten I picked up from SFL. Those birds were lost when still earning there wings. NONE lost from training. I think it is intresting that the first out of the crate and the ones to beat me home are SFL birds. I think they may be showing my babies the way home too. I'm pondering on just how far my next toss will be.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> It's been a while since my last update. Here is a photo of SFL USA birds after a 1/2 mile release. Sofar my YB's have been released in my yard and, twice at a half mile. My local hawk is now getting confused his dinner is getting faster. I'm sorry to say I only have 7 of the ten I picked up from SFL. Those birds were lost when still earning there wings. NONE lost from training. I think it is intresting that the first out of the crate and the ones to beat me home are SFL birds. I think they may be showing my babies the way home too. I'm pondering on just how far my next toss will be.


Hello Allen,

My concern would be that your birds may not have been routing, or they may not have been doing it for very long. Although there may be some advantages to early training, I am just wondering out loud...if you might not be pushing the envelope a bit ?

When I was first settling my YB's, I had to watch the hawks pick some off, or chase them. When they get scared off the loft at a young age, they sometimes fly off too far, never to be seen again.  

My two cents here, for what it is worth. I would baby them, and take them down the road very slowly. The idea is to build up their confidence. And to have them learn to fly home, and then trap very quickly. There is no point, for example, in taking them to far down the road, or in bad weather, and losing all of them in one bad toss. Take your time....the races for you are till September ? Some of my racers, are still in the nest, or still inside an egg !


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*8*

I'm taking your advise and waiting and not training yet. I see they are starting to route now. Not for long, but are NOT just not sitting on the loft now. I do have great news SFL 112 that went missing about 3 weeks ago, is now back home. Was sitting on my avery in the am. I opened the screen and in the trap s/he went. BUT my invantory sheet shows only 4 SFL's in loft


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*9*

More great news. I came home from work today and another SFL on the out side of the avery. Now 125 is home also. Back up to 5 SFL bands. Maybe 125 and 112 were routing for 3 weeks  I'm glad there home. And also went into trap as soon as they could get to it.  My trap is in the avery, wich is also the landing board. Currently being used as a settling area also.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> It's been a while since my last update. Here is a photo of SFL USA birds after a 1/2 mile release. Sofar my YB's have been released in my yard and, twice at a half mile. My local hawk is now getting confused his dinner is getting faster. I'm sorry to say I only have 7 of the ten I picked up from SFL. Those birds were lost when still earning there wings. NONE lost from training. I think it is intresting that the first out of the crate and the ones to beat me home are SFL birds. I think they may be showing my babies the way home too. I'm pondering on just how far my next toss will be.


 Allen,

Did you happen to do an inventory at some point after these releases ? Just wondering if some of your MIA's are from some of these early tosses or from around the loft area ? Also, are there other birds that you own that have turned up MIA that you raised or purchased or otherwise obtained ? It's possible that a hawk could have scared a bunch to the four winds and now some are finding their way back. The birds you recieved in Feb however should look and act quite mature by now and should have been routing some time ago. Have you added March and April birds to your team ? Most fanciers that I discuss such things with, generally like at least six to eight weeks of good loft flying before taking any on road work.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

I do a count every night when I finish feeding. I do an invantory when the count is off. I know when somebody is missing, who and when. I keep records of everything. And yes I know when mr.Hawk comes to visit too.  So-far I have had no strays at my loft, the strays seam to always be at the loft down the street. None of mine have been there.  I loft fly every night now, when weather permits. And yes I have a nice size team to start with this year. 52 as of today flying, and my last set of young growing in the nest now. I was going to stop with the last round but made an exception when a pair finaly laid fertle. This is a OLD pair I purchased at auctin and told it is an old disapearing local bloodline. So I let the eggs laid that week hatch. I will be seporating by breeders not on babys probaly tomorrow.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> Yes they can fly.  The avery was opened and off the board they went very cautiously. First to the lifted avery top, then the roof, and down to the snow in the driveway. Some short flights. Then back into the trap. They were able to be free for about 4 hrs. I was watching them the whole time. The weather got worse as the day went on. First sunny, then snow and wind. I got cold but birds were very happy to streach there wings. The birds didn't trap till almost dark. (feeding time) Today was as scary for me as it was for them. All went well.



Good, Bad or Indifferent...maybe another Update is in order, since the last one here was in June...


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*update 10*



SmithFamilyLoft said:


> Good, Bad or Indifferent...maybe another Update is in order, since the last one here was in June...


Ok It has been a while. The birds are doing very well. My flock is circleing and routing now. My YB flock is 70 strong now. I loft fly as much as my work scedual and mother nature alows. All my birds know where the trap is and use it VERY quickly when I rattle my food mug or slide the chain on my clicker when I'm wathcing from under landing board. The chain sounds like food rattleing. The clicker I got at a pet store it is for training dogs. It can be heard from a long ways away. My SFL birds are looking very strong and fly the longest of my flock, probaly because they are the oldest. I still have 5 of the 10 I started with. And I know 2 are COCKS of sure. # 105 and 112  Next I will be starting road training.  I took your advice Warren and waited untill routing better. I know they are ready now.


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

It easyer to start there road training about 4 to 5 weeks befor the race season. As they all are nearing the right age no starting over for the later birds raised. AND you notice less lost birds. As they are much more mature and have routed out for a time.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

re lee said:


> It easyer to start there road training about 4 to 5 weeks befor the race season. As they all are nearing the right age no starting over for the later birds raised. AND you notice less lost birds. As they are much more mature and have routed out for a time.


Sounds like a good idea. My first shipping night is on 8-25-07 Today when I let the birds out most circled for over 1/2 hr. It was in between 2 thunderstorms. It was beautyfull and calm. First sound of thunder I shook the feed mug and in they came before the rain.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*11*

Time for another update. I had a friend from another combine come by my loft to look through my loft and give his opinion on my birds. When he got to one bird he said I like this bird alot. NICE sfl where is this from? I told him. He had said he was going to test but didn't call in time for babys. He got to another bird and said I garentee if this bird stays in this condition it will be a clock bird and often.  Looked at the band SFL again #112. I hope he is correct. He also commented on there eyes also. I was told Warren sure did not sell me any "barn pigeons". He loved the feel of the sfl birds and commented on all of them without looking at bands first. It was nice to get an opinion from another racer, (30 years racing) He is not from my combine. I just know him from my food supplyer. No need to lie to me I just wanted honest opinion. And I got it. I am getting anxious for the first race. Also there was another one of MY babys that had a great eye and good feel to him also, so MY baby is going to give SFL a strong flight to the finish. This person handles many birds and vaconates for many lofts, so i think he knows what he is talking about. I hope so, his opinion in general is: I have many good birds but also have a few GREAT birds to be looking for comming home early.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*12*

Time for an update it has been a while. I am busy training my yb race seaon starts soon. All my birds are doing well and comming home. This will be my first seaon and I am amaised how diffrent the birds feel from the time I seen them hatch and now. They became much stronger and there eyes have much more color. I love releasing them and comming home and seeing them already there. One of my favorite releases so far was when the grandkids came to visit. They got there bird to watch now. I place 1 special bird in each crate so I know what crate is home. grizzle,saddle,black I only have one of each.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> Time for another update. I had a friend from another combine come by my loft to look through my loft and give his opinion on my birds. When he got to one bird he said I like this bird alot. NICE sfl where is this from? I told him. He had said he was going to test but didn't call in time for babys. He got to another bird and said I garentee if this bird stays in this condition it will be a clock bird and often.  Looked at the band SFL again #112. I hope he is correct. He also commented on there eyes also. I was told Warren sure did not sell me any "barn pigeons". He loved the feel of the sfl birds and commented on all of them without looking at bands first. It was nice to get an opinion from another racer, (30 years racing) He is not from my combine. I just know him from my food supplyer. No need to lie to me I just wanted honest opinion. And I got it. I am getting anxious for the first race. Also there was another one of MY babys that had a great eye and good feel to him also, so MY baby is going to give SFL a strong flight to the finish. This person handles many birds and vaconates for many lofts, so i think he knows what he is talking about. I hope so, his opinion in general is: I have many good birds but also have a few GREAT birds to be looking for comming home early.



I am really happy to hear of your early success, I must confess, that I to have been taken in by some of the exceptional YB's which were produced this year. I have a Mark Bustin in Hawaii who reported that he is still 8 for 8 after their first major over water release. Here we are talking about a race course where they have to go around volcanic mountains and cross hundreds of miles over water. Your report and others, indicates that this year's crop shows a lot of potential, now we need to get the best from our management systems !


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Hawaiian Islands sends race report*

I thought the following email from Mark Bustin who is flying his SFL USA YB team from one of the Islands in Hawaii, would be of interest. What I find most facinating is that most of this 100+ mile race was over open ocean !!  


*Warren, Sent 59 birds to the race. 6 of which were SFL birds. All 6 are back. 5 in the clock. Came in 2nd club.11 lofts 391 birds. 1st SFL was 29th... out by 4 min. 3 min behind my first bird back. I had 48 clocked in 20 mins. I'm not worried though, race was a fast one. The person who beat me was the short ender in the club. I'm the second to the last long ender. Any way pretty pleased. Just waiting for the longer races. Mark*


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*SFL USA takes 1st Place at 137 miles....*

9/1/07 was our first local 100 mile race flying with the York Racing Pigeon Club. There is a 3 bird clocking limit in order to "spread" the fun around. I placed 1st, 3rd and 5th.....SFL banded birds also placed 7th, 8th and 10th with another flier. The results will be much less impressive compared to our three state Combine with a total of 8 clubs but those complete results will not be out for perhaps a week. 

In the mean time, I am going to try to savour the moment and not take the final results to seriously...good or bad....after all we are just flying for fun and "Diploma's". But it does feel good knowing that the birds were able to pull this off...in spite of my management.............


----------



## windyflat (Jul 19, 2007)

Congrats Warren on the great start to the season
Tom


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*my first race*

I had 3 SFL birds in my first race last week. All 3 came home.  They we not first to my loft but the SFL birds were in the top 10 back home to my loft. This was my FIRST race , I was just glad to see the birds come home. We had a tough race. Hot, humid. The same birds should be flying home as I'm typing this post. Maybe out front today.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

My SFL birds are home again. Still in my top 10. But not in my clock YET. I only clock 2 birds in my combine. Maybe next week. The SFL birds are returning quicker, I think they just need to learn the shipping system, like finding the water on truck.


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

OH MY GOODNESS!! SFL 112 looks just like SQUEAKS!!  

I often wonder what type of racer Squeaks would have made! A WINNER, I'm SURE!

He may not fly, but he can sure move on the ground! 

Shi

BEST of EVERYTHING in YOUR UPCOMING RACES! I'm rootin' for 112!!!


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> My SFL birds are home again. Still in my top 10. But not in my clock YET. I only clock 2 birds in my combine. Maybe next week. The SFL birds are returning quicker, I think they just need to learn the shipping system, like finding the water on truck.


Allen,

Thanks for the photo. Looks like the typical SFL prototype. This particular family line has produced a very sleek and well balanced classic pear shape look. Very uniform and similar in appearence. Could take pictures of ten different birds and you might swear the were all the same bird. 

Thanks for sharing.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

mr squeaks said:


> OH MY GOODNESS!! SFL 112 looks just like SQUEAKS!!
> 
> I often wonder what type of racer Squeaks would have made! A WINNER, I'm SURE!
> 
> ...


Last weekend SFL 112 was 5th back to my loft. This week I am in 2 races.  Sunday my club race 150 mile, and Saturday a special 300 mi. futurity race. I have 3 birds in the 300. TWO of them are banded SFL.  So I hope to get lucky and and have something to brag about next update here. The wind is going to be in my favor for this race. So lets keep our fingers crossed.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

A_Smith said:


> Last weekend SFL 112 was 5th back to my loft. This week I am in 2 races.  Sunday my club race 150 mile, and Saturday a special 300 mi. futurity race. I have 3 birds in the 300. TWO of them are banded SFL.  So I hope to get lucky and and have something to brag about next update here. The wind is going to be in my favor for this race. So lets keep our fingers crossed.


Good luck this week end. We've got a pretty good headwind for our race. Haven't decided how many or which ones to ship.............


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

A_Smith said:


> Last weekend SFL 112 was 5th back to my loft. This week I am in 2 races.  Sunday my club race 150 mile, and Saturday a special 300 mi. futurity race. I have 3 birds in the 300. TWO of them are banded SFL.  So I hope to get lucky and and have something to brag about next update here. The wind is going to be in my favor for this race. So lets keep our fingers crossed.



Squeaks and I are ROOTING for you!!! 

Always had the feeling that Squeaks would have made a fine long distance racer...don't know why...just a feelin'...same feeling I had that Squeaks was a male bird!  

SFL 112 is such a beautiful bird...at least in MY eyes!

Please keep us updated on results!

Shi & Squeaks


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

No bragging rights tonight. Todays race is over. I'm still waiting to see my birds come home. Today was a tuff race day. Small flock, and very windy. Hopefully the missing birds see tomorrows flock and fallow them home, My combine will be flying the same course just half as far.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

A_Smith said:


> No bragging rights tonight. Todays race is over. I'm still waiting to see my birds come home. Today was a tuff race day. Small flock, and very windy. Hopefully the missing birds see tomorrows flock and fallow them home, My combine will be flying the same course just half as far.


Sorry to hear this news......... 
We just got home from shipping our first combine race. I'm VERY nervous about tomorrow, but that's nothing new. My birds put on quite a show last week..........but that was last week. It's a whole new ballgame now.........just have to wait and see what happens. I'm sure your birds will turn up in the morning. I know I worry about mine when they pull this, then after a few extra grey hairs and a night of tossing and turning, they land on the loft the next morning like nothing happened..... 
Good luck........hope to hear good news tomorrow.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

A_Smith said:


> No bragging rights tonight. Todays race is over. I'm still waiting to see my birds come home. Today was a tuff race day. Small flock, and very windy. Hopefully the missing birds see tomorrows flock and fallow them home, My combine will be flying the same course just half as far.


Last Sundays race went OK all my birds came home. The Saturday birds were still missing. :-( .......***** GOOD NEWS*****, TODAY SFL 112 came home with my race team (from last Saturday). 

 AND today SFL 125 was second in my clock.


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

A_Smith said:


> Last Sundays race went OK all my birds came home. The Saturday birds were still missing. :-( .......***** GOOD NEWS*****, *TODAY SFL 112 came home *with my race team (from last Saturday).
> 
> AND today SFL 125 was second in my clock.


 YEAAAA, *SFL 112*! YOU DA BIRD!!

SHI


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Your Doing A Great Job !!*



A_Smith said:


> Last Sundays race went OK all my birds came home. The Saturday birds were still missing. :-( .......***** GOOD NEWS*****, TODAY SFL 112 came home with my race team (from last Saturday).
> 
> AND today SFL 125 was second in my clock.


Hello Allen,

With all the troubles that have been reported across the USA this year in terms of lost pigeons, and the fact that you are brand new to this sport, I would say that you are doing exceptionally well !!

There are many men in our combine, who are twice your age, with many decades of experience who either never made it to the 1st race, or are already wiped out !! 

The fact that you are clocking birds and not simply turning in a "No Report" is in my opinion, a very good start for your racing career ! So very good job to you and your birds !

Keep in mind that a bird which has been out for over a week should be given a good period of rest and good food to rebuild their strength. This may need to be several weeks or more, and depending on your races, you may need to hold him back for old birds. A mistake that should not be made, is to jerk him down the road another 100 miles further, after a long difficult journey home. 

Anyway, thank you for fulfilling your promise to keep us updated on your progress. It has been a very tough year even for the "Pros" and you should feel good about your progress to date !!


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*A great race day*

SFL 125 was second in clock 1303.442 yds. And WAS third in club  I got 2nd and third this week. SFL 112 was 6th in my loft today 1250yds (could of been 7 in club we only clock 2) 

second 200mi race.
1-6 posted here

ERP 7 lofts 98 birds


1316.077 Taj Mah
1306.702 Quiet Time
1303.442 Quiet Time  SFL 125
1301.291 Maranatha
1281.608 Maranatha
1278.752 Taj Mah
We are within 1/2 mile of eachother, Great race today. USALY they call me to tell me to look for birds (and im 1/2mi shorter  ). I made the FIRST call this week with a loaded clock.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

A_Smith said:


> SFL 125 was second in clock 1303.442 yds. And WAS third in club  I got 2nd and third this week. SFL 112 was 6th in my loft today 1250yds (could of been 7 in club we only clock 2)
> 
> second 200mi race.
> 1-6 posted here
> ...


GOOD JOB!!!!


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Congratulations, Allen! I hope your success will continue through the race season.

Terry


----------



## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

HI A SMITH, Nice going, your first bird home what is that out of? GEORGE


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

george simon said:


> HI A SMITH, Nice going, your first bird home what is that out of? GEORGE


Well it started with a hen and a cock doing a fan dance.  LOL


I know the parrents but no peds. The parrents were given to me by Tom "Taj Mah" (the neighbor who took first) to start my loft. The Hen is from the Top OB flyer in my combine "Steiner" and hen is a "Dworek". (think I spelled wrong)  As of this morning, from the results I know, both birds are in the deplomas for combine this week. 8th and ??


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

A_Smith said:


> SFL 125 was second in clock 1303.442 yds. And WAS third in club  I got 2nd and third this week. SFL 112 was 6th in my loft today 1250yds (could of been 7 in club we only clock 2)
> 
> second 200mi race.
> 1-6 posted here
> ...


update: I got the race results today. 
46 lofts............843 birds........................NORTH section 442 birds

my first clocked.......14th combine = ..................7th north
second ..SFL125......20th combine = .................10th north

combine first speed 1327.437


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Congrats, Allen! Good going for you and your birds!

Terry


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

The SFL 2 birds I have left went to the 300 last week. Both home now.  It was a tuff race. Only 4 day birds in club. I had 2. First and 3rd. SFL 125 was first bird next day about 1/2 hr before anyone in club clocked for that day. SFL 112 came home friday. He was at 300 before and came home next Sunday. Warren had told me I should stock the birds but I want to give them the full seaon of testing. This is the last weekend of my combine races. 150 + 300 this weekend. Both SFL birds are on the 150 this week. Should be an easy fast race. Tail wind is in the forcast.

On last weeks 300 *I WON COMBINE* and 24th combine (41 lofts 608 birds). Not bad for a rookie.  I am expecting 1 or 2 SFL birds in my clock on the 150. I only clock 2 birds each race.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Allen Smith Takes Combine By Storm !!!*

Allen,

Congratulations !!!!

With all the reports of lost birds and even old timers getting wiped out before the races even started, I would say that you have done very, very well for yourself. For a brand new guy just getting his feet wet for the first time, this is really impressive. I don't know what else to say...I must be repeating myself...normally a very green new guy will get mostly "No Reports" or end up on the bottom 1/3 of the race sheet...but you are placing birds into diploma type positions. I am very impressed and very happy for you.


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Congratulations again, Allen! I hope your successes continue!

Terry


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I think with your SFL birds and your TAI Ma????? birds you have a good foundation for breeding. Now do you breed SFL to SFL and T to T or cross them and then back cross the next generation? I would use those four and those four only to stock my loft. Use a few pairs of pumpers and get you 20 youngbirds for next year. Throw in a few test kits and you have a good team of 30 or so. I bet next years lossess will be low. Keep the best of the 30 and there are your 10 pairs for the next year. This is too easy. Should have a good old bird team by the start of year three. Man I wish I could have flown my first 12 young birds. Would have saved me a year. I think the local birds crossed with the performance birds from Warren would make a good family. Like crossing a Toyota with a Farrari.

Randy


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

Warren I also commend your and your birds on going into a combine like theirs and posting results on the first page. It bodes well for the quality of your birds. We were talking about losses in the other post and having a few of your birds left at the end shows their quality. I would also like to know what those TAj Mah birds are. That seems to be the best local family in the combine. Need to cross those fast with those SFL birds for that course. 

Randy


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

hillfamilyloft said:


> Warren I also commend your and your birds on going into a combine like theirs and posting results on the first page. It bodes well for the quality of your birds. We were talking about losses in the other post and having a few of your birds left at the end shows their quality. I would also like to know what those TAj Mah birds are. That seems to be the best local family in the combine. Need to cross those fast with those SFL birds for that course.
> 
> Randy


The birds I received from Taj Mah loft, I was told are Dworek bloodlines. The photo on this post is SFL 112 and my 2 youngest members of my 2007 young bird team. (In a few hrs 2008 old bird team). Today is the first time they trapped.  They are the squab from SFL and QTL.( Quiet Time Loft (ME) ) SFL112 is sitting on 2 eggs in the photo. 2008 YB winners maybe........... ??? I sure would like to know the bloodlines from my SFL racers.???


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I thought Warren's deal was to give you the pedigrees when you gave him results of the birds. Those are nice looking youngsters. 

Randy


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> The birds I received from Taj Mah loft, I was told are Dworek bloodlines. The photo on this post is SFL 112 and my 2 youngest members of my 2007 young bird team. (In a few hrs 2008 old bird team). Today is the first time they trapped.  They are the squab from SFL and QTL.( Quiet Time Loft (ME) ) SFL112 is sitting on 2 eggs in the photo. 2008 YB winners maybe........... ??? I sure would like to know the bloodlines from my SFL racers.???


Allen and Randy,

Thank you for all of your kind words. 

Allen, I have send you by email, the background of the particular birds which you were so successful with in 2007. I have provided the particular backgrounds on very few of the SFL USA banded birds which I made part of our 2007 testing program. Part of the reason is that I feel pedigrees are in large part over rated. The other reason may be related to ego. I don't know the particulars of the birds you recieved from the Taj Mah Loft, but perhaps he worked with his birds for a number of generations and as such, I personally believe that he and not Dworek should recieve the credit for his breeding efforts. The same should be said for the birds that I breed.

The birds you did so well with AU 07 SFL USA 112 & 125...are Smith Family Loft bloodlines. If you care to share your observations from their back grounds that is fine, but when you can trace my bands back four generations of either SFL USA or my older bands which simply say YORK or UPC, then I think it is fair to say, that you are holding a pure 100% SFL birds in your hand when you hold 112 or 125........at least that is my story and I am sticking with it ! 

Likewise your offspring in 2008 are no longer Taj Mah Loft or SFL USA birds...they are Allen Smith or Quiet Time Loft bloodlines.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

I did just receive an email on the information on the SFL birds. THANK YOU Warren.  The base of my particular winners I received from Smith Family Loft, contains a Who's Who list of great Champions including Joep Koch, Ad Schaerlaeckens, Fred Smeltzer and pigeons without strain names which were winners or breeders of One Loft and Futurity winners, with names like "DUKE OF EARL", "THE VEGAS COCK", "THE PRODUCER", "MISTER COOPER" etc.  I agree with Warren the birds ARE SFL bloodlines, no matter who's name is on the papers. Warren did the breeding. As for the other birds from TAJ loft, They were given to him also, So I am going by what he was told. The birds I breed are QTL (Quiet Time Loft) and always will be no matter what the birds name or there parrents names on there papers are(if any). I just find it intresting to see who parrents are. Just like looking back on your own family tree.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Stock or Fly ?*

Now Allen,

 The $300+ question...is whether you should attempt to win some more races with these birds, and perhaps get a diploma or two....or should you now secure this bird in your loft and focus on breeding perhaps some winning YB's ? A later round of sisters to SFL USA 112 did very well for me during the 2007 YB season, and were selected to become breeders for the 2008 season. Parents to my 2007 Flamingo 350 mile winner are represented on both sides of SFL 112's family tree, in the case of the sire...several times. A sister to the dam of SFL 112, was my #2 YB and made the Bird of the Year list. Another sister to the dam of SFL 112 was on the American Ace list in 2006. There are also several other very closely related birds to SFL 112, which were entry's in the Flamingo and local races which made a good showing of themselves. 

My point is, in a race and during training anything can happen....a hawk, hit a wire, or simply for some unknown reason, become MIA. I don't know the numbers of yearlings you will have for races, or how many breeders you may have, and that will weigh in on the situation. But, taking what the other very experienced fancier said in a previous post....SFL 112 sounds like he is also a very good specimen in the hand. He *could* turn out to be an exceptional breeder for you, only time will tell....but I would value a possible exceptional breeder over the possibility of a few more diploma's in my file cabinet.

I am not saying...you should not race this bird in 2008, but I just want you to consider what a smash OB race could cost QTL in the future, since this particular blood line is very small in numbers, and proved to be very valuable to me the last two years. Simply food for thought....perhaps other's may have some feed back to offer as well.


----------



## k-will (Dec 15, 2007)

i would stock the bird if it was me.as warren said,anything could happen if you fly it.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

k-will said:


> i would stock the bird if it was me.as warren said,anything could happen if you fly it.


Me too!! Stock it.........I had a young bird this past year. He went to 4 races and did very well. I sent him to ONE more race and then was going to move him to the OB team. I never saw him again.


----------



## k-will (Dec 15, 2007)

my point is-warren helped you with good birds.you flew the birds and they did well.you are trying to build a loft of good flying birds.you need to stock the very best birds.in a few years you will be glad you did.you lose the birds and youre back to square one.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Read Between The Lines ! Please !*



A_Smith said:


> Time for another update. I had a friend from another combine come by my loft to look through my loft and give his opinion on my birds. When he got to one bird he said I like this bird alot. NICE sfl where is this from? I told him. He had said he was going to test but didn't call in time for babys. He got to another bird and said I garentee if this bird stays in this condition it will be a clock bird and often.  Looked at the band SFL again #112. I hope he is correct. He also commented on there eyes also. I was told Warren sure did not sell me any "barn pigeons". He loved the feel of the sfl birds and commented on all of them without looking at bands first. It was nice to get an opinion from another racer, (30 years racing) He is not from my combine. I just know him from my food supplyer. No need to lie to me I just wanted honest opinion. And I got it...... This person handles many birds and vaconates for many lofts, so i think he knows what he is talking about. I hope so, his opinion in general is: I have many good birds but also have a few GREAT birds to be looking for comming home early.


 With an experienced flyer on site who has handled 112....and who took the time to comment....and your posted picture....I suspect that AU 07 SFL USA 112 BBC is what they call "A Keeper"....many birds were sold or otherwise given new homes this year in order to make room for pairs such as the Sire and Dam to 112, and their offspring...and some other closely related pigeons which preformed well this year.....So....hint...hint.......read between the lines...the 2007 National Testing Program was a sucess....now the best test for 2008...is not if you can win some OB races with this bird...it's to breed from him, and my educated guess is, you will produce some very good birds if he is paired correctly. If I give you any more advice in this regard, it would be like I am telling you what to do.....


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

Thanks for the sugestions on what to do with my SFL banded birds. SFL 125 laid her first egg yesterday, and SFL 112 is on eggs too as seen in post #93. Both are hens. They picked there own mate as they are still in the racing side of the loft. Both have picked a good mate.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

A_Smith said:


> Last Sundays race went OK all my birds came home. The Saturday birds were still missing. :-( .......***** GOOD NEWS*****, TODAY SFL 112 came home with my race team (from last Saturday).
> 
> AND today SFL 125 was second in my clock.


This was one of my favorite posts


----------



## zimmzimm3 (Aug 17, 2007)

I am really confused could anybody explain to me what the "Test Kit" was i have been trying to understand by reading the post because it sounds interesting but i am really confused. Thank You


----------



## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

I believe they are birds that came from Smith family loft as young birds, which are doing really great!


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

zimmzimm3 said:


> I am really confused could anybody explain to me what the "Test Kit" was i have been trying to understand by reading the post because it sounds interesting but i am really confused. Thank You


If you will read this thread: http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=18127 it may help ease the confusion. I don't think the "kit" page is up on Warren's site anymore, but if I remember correctly, Warren was offering 8 of his SFL birds for $300 or $350 plus shipping with the idea being to find out how well his family of birds would perform in various areas of the country with (obviously) different training and handling. I'm sure Warren or other members will be along to explain more accurately.

Terry


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

zimmzimm3 said:


> I am really confused could anybody explain to me what the "Test Kit" was i have been trying to understand by reading the post because it sounds interesting but i am really confused. Thank You


 http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=18127 Here (is) was the announcement link.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

I shiped my 2 SFL birds I have left from the test program last year, (4-20-08) on my first OB 100. SFL 125 was the first and only in my clock. (843.588ypm) When I got home 112 was in loft also.  It was a very long 100. I had 1 of my birds trap 8:20 PM in the dark when I was cleaning water jugs. 1 of my birds still mia. Average race speed was 800-900 ypm. Jim higgins 1056ypm took my club. He didn't have another home for 45 minutes after he clocked the winner. 230+ birds shipped in my club. Everybody had slow returns.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=18127 Here (is) was the announcement link.



Thank you Allen.

Yes, Allen was one of the volunteers who stepped forward in 2007 and took the challenge to put a "kit" of SFL USA birds "To The Test". In return for a nominal fee, Allen was provided a number of YB's from our various breeding pairs. My idea was to place these YB's under the care of various fanciers from around the USA. We shipped some birds as far away as Hawaii, where a SFL bird placed equal first over more then a hundred miles of open ocean !! 

There is this old saying "Horses for the Course's" or in other words, some pigeons have to be bred a certain way in different area's of the country. The purpose of this "Test" was to see if that was true. What I found was that well bred pigeons can compete anywhere in the country. For the last two years, SFL birds have won 1st or equal 1st in steamy hot and humid Florida. They have won over open oceans, or over the Blue Ridge Mountains. 

The down side of our little experiment, was that many fanciers did not live up to their end of the bargain, and did not keep us abreast of how or what the birds were doing. Perhaps because of the wins in Florida, we sold out very early this year. 

Because of our efforts to promote our club locally, and because of a smaller breeding colony, we will suspend all of our YB sales going forward. We figured out that entering birds in various events such as the Winners Cup, Convention and Auction races, will accomblish our "testing" goals with better and more reliable feed back. A prime example was 08 AU SFL USA 181, who was literally in a crate ready to be placed in a shipping container as part of a YB kit, when my wife realized that we had one too many. I asked her to write down the band numbers as I simply pulled one at a time from the crate and placed them in a shipping container. He just happened to be the one left in the crate. So I went out to the loft and secured another YB and the two of them went into a two bird box and went to the Flamingo. I never did get more then two emails from the guy who got the eight bird kit. I have no idea how well the "kit" did that he got, and he will never know what he has the nest mate to.... 

Allen here, proved to be a man of his word, and kept me informed, sent pictures, and gave me regular progress reports. I consented to him posting his progress, or lack thereof, for the whole world to see...the good, the bad, and the ugly ! Unfortnately, there are fanciers out there, that don't mean what they say, or do what they promise. So Allen, if you read this, and are interested, and willing to take a little drive, I will hold a pair of later hatches for your breeding loft, if you are interested.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

Thanks for the nice post Warren. Sure I read this post. I love Pigeon-Talk. I learned so much here. I'd be glad to take the drive and I could also bring 112 and 125 with me for you to see how they grew up also. By the way I'd like to thank Warren for trusting a rookie with his quality birds and the chance to be part of the test group. Keeping records and reporting progress taught me a great deal also.


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

Good to know your story Warren. Once someone buys the bird, it is theirs. Too bad the contract you made with the fliers did not hold up on their part. I have become more selective with the birds I send out to test. I am only flying with two clubs this year. Both have web pages where I can check up on results. I learned from my friend in Durango who flies with a club in Phoenix. I think a partnership is always better than a sale when it comes to testing birds. I agree that money races are the best way to truely test. I do also like them to be tested against a large club or combine. 

This year I am flying 16 birds in Michigan, and about 30 in ABQ. I am not sending to futurities because I am testing different breedings. Next year, I plan on hitting the races again. 

Now for partnerships, this is how mine work. I send the birds to fly. The birds are gifts to the fliers. They agree to fly the race series with the birds unless the birds are not fit. After the season, they keep the birds. Most in ABQ have been flying some as old birds. This also gives me feedback. All I ask from them is that if they have a key bird, that I get offspring off of them to breed back to my family. I have also been asked if I want some of my birds back. This is how I will get crosses back into my families. I also have the luxury of studying the race sheets and spotting birds that beat mine. I am sure that I can get siblings off of these birds to cross into mine. My birds do well for them and they are all anxious to fly them. 

What do I get out of this. Well I get a good section of birds flying in two clubs with internet results. They are flown by numerous fliers with different loft locations. They also allow me to bond birds in their auction races and share in winnings. One flier builds nest boxes and crates which he as given me. The best thing I get out of this is the testing of my birds. This has saved me years of trial and error, flying from one loft with no competition. This year will also test the crosses of the birds that I have sent down that they have bred. Yes, I will be flying against my own bloodline, but I will also see if my birds beat the crosses. 

Randy


----------



## ace in the hole (Nov 27, 2007)

*Hillfamilyloft"s test birds*

Hi everyone.

I will be starting a new thread with the same title as this post. 

Yes, I am the one in Michigan that will be flying Randy Hills stock this year. Not only did Randy send me 16 - 08 young birds, he also sent me 5 pair of breeders about the first of the year. From these breeders I have raised 12 - 08 young birds for the team.

Of the 12 birds I raised, 6 of them are Club Auction Birds! This will be the B race of the last race of the year (325 mile race).

Of the 16 birds Randy sent me, 12 of them are Combine Band Auction Birds. This will be the A race of the last race of the year (325 mile race).

Randy knows these 18 birds are going all the way!!! The other 10 young birds are from Randy's speed bird stock and will be held at 250 miles.

I am starting this season with 70 young birds. Some of these birds have brothers and sisters as well parents, aunts and uncles that are AU & IF Hall of Fame birds and/or Ace pigeons. This season will also be treated as a One Loft Race. 28 of these 70 birds are from Randy's stock.

Well, does that sound like a good test to you? I hope you will watch for the new thread (Hillfamilyloft's test birds) and keep up with their progress.

Ace


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

ace in the hole said:


> Hi everyone.
> 
> I will be starting a new thread with the same title as this post.
> 
> ...


 Sounds like a great idea Ace ! Allen's thread was, and continue's to be, a very sucessful thread in terms of views and posts. Would seem to me the first order of business, would be to get some interesting pictures of your pigeons up on your thread, along with some updates as to your settling. Allen gave us some great pictures during this process, and then later he treated us to pictures of him releasing birds on their training tosses.

Do you have them out and about the loft ? How and what are you feeding them at this time ? What is the weather like where you are at ? Looking forward to all of the details, this to me is one of the most exciting times, this is when you turn young and akward YB's into a race team !

Good Luck !!


----------



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

Having a post would be good for all of us. Many of the newbees can learn a lot from post like this one. When Ace gets the post up I will add coments to the post. I think as,did some that flew Warren's birds, that Ace will give me great feedback on my birds. I should have about 60 of my bloodlines flying both in ABQ and in MI. Ace was a great choice due to his enthusiasm for this partnership. I also like the fact that he is also flying quality birds from around the country with mine. Like Warren, I am in search of the Middle distance young bird crown. The way to find it is test, test, test, take the data and make descisions that help your bird family grow stronger. When the post gets up I will tell you my goals, about my birds and about where I am now. I started about 4 years ago back in pigeons and testing has helped me greatly. I can also compare notes with Warren on strategies best to test your stock. 

For all those inquiring about test birds, all mine are spoken for as of now and my birds will be separated this month. I only raised two rounds this year. But keep in touch. I am always looking for future partnerships for mutual gain. 

Randy


----------



## ace in the hole (Nov 27, 2007)

I will start the new thread (Hillfamilyloft's Test Birds) around the 8th - 10th of May. I am in Florida right now. 

To answer your questions Warren,

At this point 37 of these birds have been in the air and well trap trained. These birds have been out eight times and I only lost one bird their first day out. The birds from my loft and Randy's loft have not yet been out. They will be out for their first time after I get back to Michigan on the 5th of May.

As for the feed, how and what. 

THE HOW
They are fed in three four foot long feeders that I have built. At this time they are being fed once a day, just enough that if there is anything left at the end of the day (3:30 pm.) it is only a touch of barley. This will change when I get back on the 5th of May. I will let you know then how this will change. What I will tell you is that the first 37 birds trapped well on their last trip out. They were all back in the loft feeding four minutes after I rang the cow bell I use to call them to feed.

THE WHAT 
Because 30 of these young birds went into the racing loft only days before I left for Florida they are all being fed a 50/50 mix of my special breeding mix and my flying mix. They will be switched to 100% racing mix tomorrow. This is my own mix and would go something like this,

3 parts Breeder Small Corn
3 parts Purifyer
2 parts Barley
1 part Small Corn
1 part Popcorn
1 part Safflower
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
1 part ? 
1 part ?
1 part ?
I will keep the rest to myself for now! It is a mix containing a total of 19 grains. Making a lighter feed higher in carbs and lower in protein. This is what they will be fed all season. The only change will be to up the carbs for the longer races.

The weather in Michigan has been warm and dry while I have been gone. It is going to cool down but I hope the rain holds off till I get back.

ACE


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*SFL 07 yearlings race report*

If you been watching this thread you know I still have 2 SFL birds in my loft at end of YB season. ( started with 9 OB's and still have 8) And I am proud to say I still do after my OB season. I did fly them. I know my birds love to fly and think they should.  Both 112 and 125 went to the races. 5 races for 112 and 6 for 125 . 112 didn't go the last race because of her wing feather just molted.
My combine clocks 2 birds each loft. 
Here are my results for my loft with the SFL yearlings.
First 100 -----125 first in the clock 112 missed the clock but home third
Second 100  125 first in the clock again
300 miles 125 second in clock
The next race day I was on the combine truck so I only sent as trainers. BUT from 100 miles 112 was first home and 125 was second.
200 mile Bad, HOT race. both came home ALL my racers came home next day
150 miles 112 first in the clock 125 missed second by 8 minutes
200 miles (yesterday **and last race for me** 600 was today) 125 came home 4th to my loft 112 didn't go to the race.

As you can see the SFL birds sure did make my rookie YB 07 season more fun ( I also won IF rookie of the year last year) . Also my OB (yearlings) season intresting too. I can see the SFL children are flying nicely too., Training will be starting soon. I hope the SFL and QTL blood make a great mixture.


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

A_Smith said:


> If you been watching this thread you know I still have 2 SFL birds in my loft at end of YB season. ( started with 9 OB's and still have 8) And I am proud to say I still do after my OB season. I did fly them. I know my birds love to fly and think they should.  Both 112 and 125 went to the races. 5 races for 112 and 6 for 125 . 112 didn't go the last race because of her wing feather just molted.
> My combine clocks 2 birds each loft.
> Here are my results for my loft with the SFL yearlings.
> First 100 -----125 first in the clock 112 missed the clock but home third
> ...


What can I say QTL ? The only other real test you could do right now, is to breed those two birds together, and see what kind of breeding results you can produce. Their real value now, may be as breeding stock. The real test now comes, as they produce you additional race winners and breeders. 

As promised in earlier post, I have reserved a pair for you, to augment the pair you currently have. You were voted the Number #1 test facility for 2007, because of timely reports and updates, both here and by private email. 

Will select something nice. Myself, SFL USA, Friends, family, staff, affiliates and readers here, are grateful for all of your feed back, and progress reports. We were all kept informed, and this helps to build even greater racing pigeons in the future.

As of 2008 we discontinued outside the area, loft "Testing", in favor of more local sport promotion and increased representation in the Premiere One Loft events around the USA. We made this move because from a genetic point of view, we wanted to maintain the integrity of the family tree. As a major move in this direction, we are reserving the majority of the 2007 & 2008 premiere racers for private breeding programs set up for our Affilate Lofts, and will not be available to the public.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

*My SFL birds are still flying*

 After my 2009 OB season my 2 test birds are still here at the loft. They flew 8 OB races each. 

I am reopening this thread (I hope someone still remembers it) . Just for a quick update.

If you re-read the last post Warren said he reserved a pair for me to compliment my birds from his test program. My wife and I visited the SFL "mother Loft" yesterday. And also went to a restaurant with a "killer sauce"  I came home with TWO cocks, with VERY inpressive pedigress. (my 2 still flying are hens) And alot more knowlage than I arrived with. THANK YOU !!!!!


----------



## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Quiet Time Loft voted #1 in 2007 Test Program, now Affilate Loft !*



A_Smith said:


> Let me start by saying I picked up my team on Sat. 2-3-07. The photo attched is the birds in Warren's loft (avery photo bottom). The bird photos are the team trying to keep warm, are in my loft. Did you count them? I received 10. What a nice surprise. The kit was 8 +1 for pick up AND a bonus. All I can say is THANK YOU, I will help make SFL-USA birds winners.
> 
> It was great to meet Warren and learned a few things also during the pick up. For example stick there head in the waterer so they know what it looks like and how to use it. The birds are very easy to handle. I can tell they are definetly pampered. I will do the same.
> 
> My first update will be this. It is VERY cold so loft time is shorter than normal. So I don't know if team was in my large avery that is also the landing board and trap, within the last 2 days The birds can exit loft through a bob (behing the green closed door in photo) enter by trap. Self training to use trap. And still not leave the avery. At feeding time tonight I poked a birds head out (it was dark) no I don't want to go to cold and dark, the next went out. The question is will s/he find way back in. A few seconds later (probaly aming for lights and food) In the trap s/he comes.  SFL-USA 104 trapped.




All I can say Allen, is that you have come a very long way since the above post ! 

First you went and won your Combine's "Rookie of the Year" award, and put some Combine Diploma's under your belt. 

Then you took your SFL birds on an OB tour of 8 races ! I would say that was an excellent test case. We both understand and appreciate the value of consistency. A bird which can compete in a string of racing events, and be consistently home and in the clock. As racers, they are consistent performers, throughout the season.

Now, you have taken the next step, and produced a number of offspring from these racers, and have entered them into various Special Combine Money Races. It will be very interesting to what success you will have with them as breeders ! When you produce race winners from these SFL racers, then you will have gone full circle, and will have a solid foundation upon which to build your colony. 

I also would like to congratulate you on the steps you have taken to become part of our SFL Affiliate Breeding Program. For those who may not know, SFL has a number of breeding partners around the country, we call Affiliates, who are working on a private SFL breeding program, designed to produce a whole new Premiere American Strain. Allen has demonstrated his abilities, and has invested a considerable amount of time, money and effort, into making this mission a success.

I have no doubt, that with the effort and diligence you have shown so far, that you will have continuous and growing racing success ! Thanks for sharing your journey with us. I am sure with this YB season, you will have some more good news to share, as you race those YB's you produced from SFL 112 and SFL 125 !



Below picture is some of Allen's 2009 YB's, some produced from his SFL OB team.


----------



## A_Smith (Aug 8, 2006)

From the last post "First you went and won your Combine's "Rookie of the Year" award, and put some Combine Diploma's under your belt."

Yes I did win combine deplomas AND the rookie of the year award. BUT The award was from the IF not the combine.











I am looking forward to testing my YB team. I did raise a QTL/SFL cross last year. I had a special band on him for a special race. He placed 7th. with 640 birds entered. At 300 miles. That bird now has younger brothers and sisters in 2009. 
If ALL the 09 babies fly as well as that one cross. The LMC is going to see Quiet Time on the top of the race results often.

With the help of Warren's experience and knowlage and birds, my record keeping and patience. I (we) will try to build a better race team.


----------

