# Questions from possible future dove owner



## vanja (Dec 27, 2010)

I having serious thoughts about getting a dove/pigeon and I have some question. And here they are:

How much does your pigeon/dove cost you per month?
What is the ideal size cage? (I have find minimum requirements but I want to know what's best for the bird) 
What are the difference in males and females?
Less cooing, more health problems?
Can good food be bought at petco or would I have to purchase online?
DO they need to go in for regular check ups at the vet?
If the pigeon has homing instances and I move will it fly back to where I lived before?
Is there a benefit to 1 vs 2?
Would they both have to be the same sex?
How much mess to they leave?
Do they leave feather dust?
Do they require toys in their cages?


I know they are a lot and I'll probably have more once I hit post but if anyone could answer even a few it would really be helpful. Thanks in advance.


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## amoonswirl (Nov 14, 2006)

Hello Vanja and welcome!

I'll try to answer some of your questions based on my experience with keeping doves and pigeons as house pets. (I have since moved my birds to outdoor aviaries for a variety of reasons, but I used to keep a few inside.)

The ideal cage size obviously should meet the minimum requirements, but do buy a larger one if possible. The largest one you can afford is best. If you are able to, you should also allow the bird at least an hour of freedom to exercise in a bird safe room every day. 

With ringneck doves, the main difference between male and female birds is volume. Male doves coo and laugh quite loudly, while females are generally quieter. There's not so much of a difference between male & female pigeons though. 

Females of both species are likely to lay eggs, and will need a good source of calcium. Usually, grit for birds contains calcuim - check the label.

Some pet stores carry a pigeon and dove mix, others do not. You may also want to look for an Agway or other feed store where the selection of pigeon feed would be better. You will also need to provide clean water and grit. Grit (not gravel) is essential to the bird's health, as it helps to grind seeds in the crop and also provides minerals.

For the most part, doves and pigeons are very hardy and should not need veterinary attention. But you should try to find an avian vet who knows about doves & pigeons in case you ever need one. (not all vets see birds, and not all avian vets will see pigeons...it may be a difficult search...)

You should never let your dove or pigeon fly out of doors if you intend to keep it as a house pet. Homing pigeons are specially trained birds. Doves have no homing abilities, and many pigeon breeds also have none. Safest bet is to only let your birds fly indoors, in a bird safe room.

If you have lots of time to give your single bird attention, then one bird is fine. But a pair of birds will keep each other company. Two males may not get along - I'd recommend 1 male/1 female or 2 females. 

Pigeons and doves leave feather dust, and they also like to 'toss' their seeds. They can create quite a mess. During a moult they also shed many feathers. I used to vacuum around my indoor bird cages more than 1x per day, and dust the room regularly. I also cleaned the cage several times a week. (If you don't like messy pets you may want to reconsider getting a bird.)

Pigeons and doves are not usually interested in toys, but sometimes they are. I found that they love to 'play' with small twigs, long pieces of straw, long feathers, or long pine needles. But they don't seem interested in fancier toys. A single pigeon might like a small stuffed toy as a companion though. 

Regarding the egg production and male/female pairs...there are a few things to note but maybe we should cross that bridge later, if you decide to get a male/female pair. 

I hope these answers are helpful!


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

amoonswirl said:


> Hello Vanja and welcome!
> 
> I'll try to answer some of your questions based on my experience with keeping doves and pigeons as house pets. (I have since moved my birds to outdoor aviaries for a variety of reasons, but I used to keep a few inside.)
> 
> ...


Excellent advice...and from a fellow Mass resident.


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## vanja (Dec 27, 2010)

Thank you. For the cage part I meant I have found what the min requirements are but was looking for a more ideal size. Sorry, not clear.
I have heard that with some female birds that egging can give them problems such as the egg being 'stuck' and they then have to go to the vet. 
I have been thinking about a female but worried about the birthing accept. Would she miss the eggs?

If I were gone about the time as a regular job is that too much? I wont be going on overnight conferences of anything but I do have to a pretty regular schedule.


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## Libis (Oct 8, 2010)

vanja said:


> I having serious thoughts about getting a dove/pigeon and I have some question. And here they are:
> 
> How much does your pigeon/dove cost you per month?


I'm not sure, I spoil them too much (one ringneck dove--soon to be two--and two diamond doves. I buy him millet sprays which are probably $4 for a big bag and that lasts a few months, plus this kind of dove food:
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=18947
which I think lasts about 2-4 months (can't remember--I always buy more than one bag at a time.) I always supplement the diamond doves' food and remove the larger bits. I mix in seed from a finch mix for them too. 


vanja said:


> What is the ideal size cage? (I have find minimum requirements but I want to know what's best for the bird)


Edmund is happy in a cage that is roughly 31 x 20 x 53" high with 1/2" wire spacing. He's a ringneck dove. If you got a pigeon it would need more room. 


vanja said:


> What are the difference in males and females?
> Less cooing, more health problems?


Males coo more and display for females by bowing and cooing and shaking their wings. Less to none (depending on bird) of this bowing and wing-shaking behavior is seen in females. The female (ringneck doves) I have met were much quieter than my boy. 
In diamond doves of natural color like my girls, the females are more chocolate colored while the males are more silver. 


vanja said:


> Can good food be bought at petco or would I have to purchase online?


I've never really trusted petco (because of their staff's seeming lack of knowledge and the cruelty towards fish that I have seen from them at our local store), but if you find the seed mix I linked to above, it is a very good blend for ringneck doves.


vanja said:


> DO they need to go in for regular check ups at the vet?


Most people I know take their birds to the avian vet once a year or more for a checkup, and whenever they are ill. I haven't found a good local bird vet (just a traveling one who comes here once a year.)


vanja said:


> If the pigeon has homing instances and I move will it fly back to where I lived before?


I would think so, though I think that can also be remedied. I have never had pigeons, though, so others on the site can help you there.


vanja said:


> Is there a benefit to 1 vs 2?


Well, when you have one dove, they will often decide you are their mate, which has benefits and problems associated. (Bird wants to be around you all the time, and cuddles, but also can become territorial/aggressive with others.) I find that--because I work during the day--Edmund gets very lonely. (Which is why I'm buying a ringneck dove hen to keep him company/be his mate--She'll be here 12/28!)


vanja said:


> Would they both have to be the same sex?


It's best/easiest to have either a hen and cock, or two hens. You can be more sure of sex if you buy from a breeder. My two diamond dove hens get along beautifully and spend lots of time playing, cuddling, and preening each other. Two males often (not always, but often) will fight. That is actually how I wound up getting Edmund, as he was being beat up (plucked, bit, and bludgeoned) by another dove and my friend couldn't keep him as a result. 


vanja said:


> How much mess to they leave?


More than my parrots ever did (cockatiel & parakeet). They shed a lot more feathers somehow than other types of birds I have kept. (Though I have met some finches who could probably match them!)
They also like to throw seeds around. I got Edmund a ceramic doggie bowl to eat out of and it helped some of the seed mess. 

Basically, put them in an open spot where it's easy to sweep up and you'll be fine. The plus is that ringnecks and diamonds have the easiest to pick up poo I have ever known--even after spending the summer interning at the zoo helping the keepers clean up lots of poo. (It's just dry little balls.) 


vanja said:


> Do they leave feather dust?


 Yes, but if you keep swept up it's not horrible. My cockatiel was worse. 


vanja said:


> Do they require toys in their cages?


Depends on the bird. My diamond doves love their swing, and anything to peck that makes an interesting sound (like the water bowl lol  )
My ringneck sometimes plays with a little grass ball that has a bell inside, and he likes the sound of harmony balls (though I do not keep those in his cage or within his reach). He loves listening to/trying to sing with the radio, if that counts as a toy--but only to songs that are not scary, like Christmas music, happy classical, and the happier or sad bits to opera. I have heard of pigeons playing with cat toys. 



vanja said:


> I know they are a lot and I'll probably have more once I hit post but if anyone could answer even a few it would really be helpful. Thanks in advance.


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## Libis (Oct 8, 2010)

I forgot to mention grit--I use a grit by Kaytee that has calcuim and other minerals in it.



amoonswirl said:


> Hello Vanja and welcome!
> Male doves coo and laugh quite loudly, while females are generally quieter.


Edmund has never laughed. Why do you think this is? He seems perfectly healthy otherwise, and people who saw him when I first got him can't believe it's the same bird b/c of his improvement in condition (rescue bird who was then beat up by the other doves he was rescued with.) For a while I wondered if he was part/all Eurasian Collared Dove, but he also doesn't scream as they are known to do.

Edit:
Now that I ask this, this morning he threw a new sound at me. XD It was in the tone I have heard ringneck doves laughing on YouTube, but was quieter and more like he was testing the voice. It sounded like he was saying: "doy.... dimmit.... dimmit..........doy...... doy..........dimmit" (not with any rhythm--more like a guy cursing after stubbing his toe.) I woke up and looked at him and he was just making these noises happily sitting in his food bowl.


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## Libis (Oct 8, 2010)

vanja said:


> Thank you. For the cage part I meant I have found what the min requirements are but was looking for a more ideal size. Sorry, not clear.
> I have heard that with some female birds that egging can give them problems such as the egg being 'stuck' and they then have to go to the vet.
> I have been thinking about a female but worried about the birthing accept. Would she miss the eggs?
> 
> If I were gone about the time as a regular job is that too much? I wont be going on overnight conferences of anything but I do have to a pretty regular schedule.


I have fortunately not had to deal with an egg being stuck, but as far as I know if a bird thinks you are it's mate it is likely to still lay infertile eggs and sit on them. If you have two females, sometimes they'll lay four eggs (each laying two) and sit on them. If the eggs are infertile in situations such as this, they need to be allowed to sit on them for at least 14 days so that they don't lay more and become calcium deficient. If you have a male-female pair, and don't want lots of babies, you'll need some dummy eggs.

I am gone a similar amount of time each day, and found that Edmund was still getting rather lonely. I'm getting him a mate. 

(Sorry for the scattered answers. Just kept thinking of more you might want to know.)


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## Jeannine (Sep 10, 2010)

I have a lot of Ringneck Doves and 2 Pigeons...It is best to keep them separated - Pigeons with Pigeons and Doves with Doves. Ringneck Doves are less than half the size of a Homing Pigeon - think of it like this: Doves are one hand birds while Pigeons are two handed birds (diamond doves are 1/4 the size of a Ringneck). 

They sound different too - while I really have not noticed much difference in activity/frequency/volume between the males and female doves; the doves laugh and "coo" the pigeons "voo". 
I have a female dove who will laugh randomly, very loud - something must be funny to her; a few boys who hardly make a sound (other than bow-cooing), and another female who is always making noises to herself, a Roller Pigeon who only 'voos' if he is angry because another bird is in his personal space...they all have unique personalities.


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## amoonswirl (Nov 14, 2006)

Libis said:


> I forgot to mention grit--I use a grit by Kaytee that has calcuim and other minerals in it.
> 
> Edmund has never laughed. Why do you think this is? He seems perfectly healthy otherwise, and people who saw him when I first got him can't believe it's the same bird b/c of his improvement in condition (rescue bird who was then beat up by the other doves he was rescued with.) For a while I wondered if he was part/all Eurasian Collared Dove, but he also doesn't scream as they are known to do.
> 
> ...


Hi Libis,
Hmmmm....not sure...
When I got my very first dove he was shy and quiet for awhile. Maybe Edmund is simply taking his time adjusting to his new home? Being beaten on by the other doves was probably traumatic and maybe he needs extra time to get over it? 

Also if he is a single dove he may just feel there's no reason to laugh. The laugh is often made as a dominance or territorial gesture over other birds - and sometimes over humans, haha. Maybe he does not feel the need to stake out his territory? 

He could also be a she. Females are generally much quieter and laugh less often - some of my hens rarely make a sound.


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## Jeannine (Sep 10, 2010)

If he is young he may be going through a stage where he *is* practicing his coo. Between the peeping stage and the cooing stage they can make a lot of strange sounds.


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## amoonswirl (Nov 14, 2006)

vanja said:


> I have heard that with some female birds that egging can give them problems such as the egg being 'stuck' and they then have to go to the vet.
> I have been thinking about a female but worried about the birthing accept. Would she miss the eggs?


Females usually do not lay eggs unless they 'bond' with a male bird. Though sometimes they will bond with another female, or with a human if there are no other birds around.

If she lays infertile eggs, let her sit on them until the incubation period is over - about 14 days. Then take them away after she loses interest. This way she will not deplete her calcium reserves by continually laying eggs. If she has a male mate, then you can replace the eggs with dummy eggs for the incubation period instead.

The 'stuck' egg can happen, but if your hen gets enough calcium and stays healthy, it's not likely. If it does happen, sometimes placing her on a moistened washcloth on top of a heating pad will help her to pass it. (check to make sure your pad is moisture safe of course!) Some mineral oil applied carefully to the vent can also help this. If she doesn't pass it in an hour or two, then call a vet.

It's good to be prepared ahead of time, but egg binding should really not be an issue for a healthy bird...



vanja said:


> If I were gone about the time as a regular job is that too much? I wont be going on overnight conferences of anything but I do have to a pretty regular schedule.


This should be fine, so long as you make time for your bird when you are home. Single birds crave attention more than a pair of birds would.


Update:
Regarding regular vet visits...
I don't take mine to the vet unless they are sick with something I can't treat myself. I am lucky to have found an avian vet who is very knowledgeable about pigeons and doves, and I use him in emergency situations. But otherwise, I have a stocked medicine chest and plenty of mentors to go to for advice. I watch carefully for any signs of sickness and try to catch things early. 

They are hardy birds, and rarely should need to see a vet. You may wish to take your birds to the vet regularly though - that is a personal decision.


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## Libis (Oct 8, 2010)

amoonswirl said:


> Hi Libis,
> Hmmmm....not sure...
> When I got my very first dove he was shy and quiet for awhile. Maybe Edmund is simply taking his time adjusting to his new home? Being beaten on by the other doves was probably traumatic and maybe he needs extra time to get over it?
> 
> ...


Well, he is by no means a quiet bird. He coos loud enough to hear outside. 
I've had him since June, and other than this he seems fairly settled. I will be interested to see how he reacts to his new companion who should be arriving this afternoon.


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## ringneck_redneck_dov (Jan 29, 2015)

vanja said:


> Can good food be bought at petco or would I have to purchase online?


 I actually find that I can feed my dove cockatiel food with some ground up egg shell a week.( make sure they are ground up properly into a powder or it could hurt the bird.)


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