# Tumblers vs Rollers



## JMoriarty (May 16, 2011)

I feel stupid asking this, but what is the difference in flying of tumblers vs rollers. I know that the tumblers have feathered legs and crests, but other than that?


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## Revolution Lofts (Aug 7, 2008)

I believe tumblers fly higher and roll less. And rollers don't fly that high and roll more.


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

Tumblers just tumble, and rollers roll. Or to be specific you can count how many times a tumbler roll while it would be difficult to do so on rollers.

There is a possibility that some tumblers don't have feathered legs and there are rollers that have ones. Usually when a roller has feathered legs people assume them to be not pure rollers. It gets confusing isn't it?

There is this speculation that rollers may have came/evolved from tumblers. With mutations tumblers ending up tumbling more (roll) that they were selected for this trait so we end up with roller pigeons.

Also there are tumblers that tumble differently among other tumblers.


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## Pigeonmumbler (Jun 6, 2010)

Hello JMoriarty, I have seen many folks Today totally miss understand what the word “Tumbler” and what it means when describing Pigeons. Tumbler is a group of birds that many breeds fall under. All Tipplers, Rollers, NY Flying Flight, Dutch High Flyers, Etc,,, are all “Tumblers”… There are Hundreds of breeds of pigeons that fall under the “Tumbler” Family group or Title. I have 3 different types of Tumblers in my Loft and none of Which Roll or Flip backwards like Rollers, I have Dutch High Flyers (Whitesides) and Dutch & Cologne Tumblers breeds, None of which Roll in flight as individuals, but what they do is fly in a tight kit formation and “flip” all together as a whole kit, making tight turns as a group simultaneously at once all at the same time… Now on occasion I will see one or two of my birds Clap off the loft after mating and do one flip backwards just like I have seen many NY Flying Flights & Chimney Sweeps (Bronzy’s) and other breeds do, but only a few will do this!… So when here hear someone say I have “Budapest Short Face or Long Face Tumblers, Catalonian Tumblers or Vienna Tumblers Etc, don’t assume that they roll backwards or fly like rollers because many do only flip once or twice in the air and many others don’t flip backwards at all…!


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## rpalmer (Mar 10, 2011)

I haven't read anything about these except here on PT. So I find it interesting. I had always assumed that tumblers tumbled in the air and rollers rolled on the ground. Very interesting stuff here.


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## JMoriarty (May 16, 2011)

Oh okay... That actually makes sense. So do tipplers roll or tumble individually, or primarily as a kit? 

(Thank you for not making me feel like a moron asking these questions!)


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## Pigeonmumbler (Jun 6, 2010)

JMoriarty said:


> Oh okay... That actually makes sense. So do tipplers roll or tumble individually, or primarily as a kit?
> 
> (Thank you for not making me feel like a moron asking these questions!)


No each Breed or Strains within the Tumbler Group or Family of Birds have been bred to perform different feats of Flying Styles, Color Markings & Body Shapes…
Tipplers do not Roll or Tumble, But Rollers do! Though many will look the same & have some of the same Color Markings & Body Shapes, but they where bred for different feats of Flying Styles… Many Tippler and Roller Breeds & Strains can be Identified by their Color Markings which are Distinctive, Example; you have Bold head Rollers & Then you have Pakistani Tipplers each one looks totally different then the other, But many strains of both Tipplers and Rollers Look the same so much so, that if you where to toss them all in one coop you could not tell the differences between them. You would have to fly them to distinguish one from the other…!


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## tipllers rule (Aug 2, 2010)

TIPPLERS DON'T TIPPLE OR ANYTHING ELSE 
rollers roll straightdown fast and u can count the rolls
tumblers just tumble up,down,sie,to,side kk so were good

@ rodsd feathered feeet is a trait specidicaly in the mee family sometimes u getfeather feet very lightly though


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

It seems that tumblers in the past were breed with some bird that don't roll resulting in babies that don't roll anymore. Then through selection you get high flyers like Tipplers with that. If your Tipplers still roll I would still call it tumblers.

Yeah, I know about Rick Mee's family. They are beautiful to boot as well with those white coloring. And they seem to perform irrespective whether there are feathers in the feet! 

The concept of purity about rollers seem to be hot discussion in some areas. Now if rollers is descended from tumbler families who may/may not have feathered feet, then probably the concept of pure is meaningless.


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## Pigeonmumbler (Jun 6, 2010)

RodSD said:


> It seems that tumblers in the past were breed with some bird that don't roll resulting in babies that don't roll anymore. Then through selection you get high flyers like Tipplers with that. If your Tipplers still roll I would still call it tumblers.
> 
> Yeah, I know about Rick Mee's family. They are beautiful to boot as well with those white coloring. And they seem to perform irrespective whether there are feathers in the feet!
> 
> The concept of purity about rollers seem to be hot discussion in some areas. Now if rollers is descended from tumbler families who may/may not have feathered feet, then probably the concept of pure is meaningless.



I think we both know that cross breeding is something that not only the Master breeders of yesteryear did to create different strains, whether it be to create Better flyer’s that roll or not, certain Colors or different body features or other defining characteristics, is something that is always evolving even to present day… I really don’t know too much about Mr. Rick Mee’s Rollers & his Birds or how they look, because rollers have never really been my “Cup of Tea” if you will…! But the man maybe Building his own particular Strain of rollers with feathered feet that one day may be know as a Pure breed… Remember that the Racing Homer we see today is a mutt that has been crossed with 4 or 5 different breeds in the past to create the racing homer we see and enjoy today… So the Racing Homer of Today is now Considered a pure Breed…!

I have an article on my website that explains what Strains or Breeds are and how they evolve …! Its based on some defined facts and some of my own insights & opinions on what Constitutes a Strain & Breed and the differences’ Many may find it Interesting & Others may think what they may! Check it out… 

https://sites.google.com/site/pigeonmumbler/the-chronicles/feb-pigeon-strains


Louie


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## 2y4life (Apr 5, 2010)

RodSD said:


> The concept of purity about rollers seem to be hot discussion in some areas. Now if rollers is descended from tumbler families who may/may not have feathered feet, then probably the concept of pure is meaningless.


Now it all depends on what we mean by pure. In pigeons, we really don't have something like the AKC that is a registry of all purebred dogs. The fact that rollers came from a mixture of between 3-5 different breeds is the reason why every now and then you get a roller with feathered feet or a peak/crest. Or sometimes you get a roller with its wings placed like oriental rollers because that's what is in its genetic make up. 

As far as pure again, everything you see is technically a mutt. The homing pigeon was a cross. Every breed now is a cross. It's the same in dogs. Every breed that is registered with as a purebred dog once came from crossbreeding.


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

I positively agree that what we have are technically mutts! But it is a purebreed mutt! LOL! I mean if I cross a homer with a fantail I probably would not call it homer anymore.


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## YaSin11 (Jul 23, 2009)

JMoriarty,
Welcome to PigeonTalk  Thanks for asking a good question,wish you good luck with your pigeons.Peace 
YaSin


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