# Is this a feral pigeon or a lost domestic pigeon?



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

A pigeon decided to adopt the local grocery store where I work part time. It was cute for a while, until, with the cold weather, he started roosting right by the door, making quite a mess. The manager wanted him gone. We thought we saw a band on him, so set about catching him. We now have him caught, in a large dog crate, in a garage out of the wind, but not inside since he is used to the cold weather...the bottom line is, I am trying to find out of this is a "wild" or feral bird, or a former pet? Do feral pigeons have feathers on their feet? He is totally white, looks bigger than a dove, but was not terribly panicked by people; we could often get within four feet of him. 

Thanks for any help. 

Joanne


----------



## JasoninMN (Nov 5, 2005)

He sounds like a lost pigeon to me, ferals would not be pure white with feathered feet. If you have a feed store in town ask them if anyone reported a pigeon missing or if they know anyone who keep pigeons. They might take it from you and give it a home if you decide not to keep it. Does it have a band or not?

Jason


----------



## EvilMonkey666 (Dec 1, 2005)

Heres a link I found..check this out ..

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=12246

That is assuming he did indeed have a band on his leg. I would imagine he might have belonged to someone if he wasnt too afraid of being approached. That is usually a sign that he is used to being around humans. Hopefully the link can help you. If its at all possible try to get him into a warm place if the temperature is too terribly cold. There was a reason he was by the door..he was cold. His feet might become frostbitten. Is there anyway you can take him home with you and set something up temporarily while you try to figure out what his situation is? Or know of someone who can?


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*"Snowflake"*

Okay, yes, the other ladies at the store and I named him. "Snowflake", since he is so pretty. 

I have brought him home, and have him in the garage where he is out of the wind, but not in 70-degree weather. Would that be too much of a shock for him, to come into such a warmer temperature? He is in the cage, in the truck cab, in the garage, which is not heated. He has food, water and a perch. I couldn't remember if I said that part before. Oh, and we have two blanks over the cage that cover two sides of the cage. 

He does not have a band.


----------



## andinla (Mar 11, 2003)

*Hi that is very nice of you to take the pigeon home but I*

wouldn't put him in a truck , car etc, in cold weather a car can act like a refrigerator. Personally I would take him out of the truck and set him up on a table off the ground in the garage with a heating pad set on low, depending on how cold your garage is maybe set on med heat, put the pad under a towel first and then place it with the bird allowing a space for him to get off inside of whatever it is your keeping him in. So half of the box would be with heating pad with towel over it, and the other half no heating pad at all just newspaper. Is he eating bird seed and drinking? He maybe ill. Others will come along on here that are more experienced in pigeon care. Good luck in findiing him a home. 

Andi


----------



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Catservant, 


Usually an 'all white' Pigeon on the loose, is one escaped from one of those 'Wedding' Bird Release businesses, who let a big bunch of White Pigeons loose at Weddings or funerals or birthdays or anniversaries or store openings or whatever they are hired to let 'em loose for.

The Birds of course are trained to return to the loft to await the next occasion of being released.

Sometimes, the Bird figures he or she has maybe had enough of that stuff and elects to keep-a-going instead of returning to the loft.

Or, the Bird wished to return, but got hurt somehow and wayward in transit somewhere.

That, or it is an escaped pet...

So, this Bird may not have much prior experience being either out of doors, or foraging out of doors for food.

Too, since it was not amid feral others...did not seem to have joined the feral flock or casual feral flock grazing sequences...the Bird might not have made any feral Bird friends to learn where things are that are of interest to them and so on or to have companions variously.

If it came from some Wedding Bird provider, and is returned to them, my guess, is that the Bird will simply split again the next time it can...unless it is in fact injured or ill, and that is 
'why' it did not fly back to the loft.

If a lost Pet, who accidently got out and flew for a while and got lost, maybe the owners are worried and looking for it, so, check the 'Lost Pet' column in the Want ads.

If nothing there, then...likely someone who has a good situation for Pigeons could provide a home for them...and this Bird can be socialized into their Bird's society...and maybe even be let out again someday as their judgement sees fit.

Thanks for helping this wayward Pigeon...!

Regular Mixed Wiuld Bird Seed that you get in those 5, 10 or 25 lb Bags at most grocery stores will be fine for them...fresh water in a wide base cup that gets scrubbed out every day...and, let us know what the poops look like, and if the Bird seems to be eating and drinking allright...or if it looks 'fluffy' or artichoke-like or sleepy.

Make sure you have the lights on for them by day, and you can turn them out at night...while you decide what to do...


Phil
Las Vegas


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Thanks, you guys*

We will bring him in from the garage. Maybe into the basement, where it would be 60-something. I just hate to put him into a temperature change shock. 

He is eating well. We have been feeding him wild bird food at the store. And a customer bought him a suet cake that he is particularly fond of.  

Okay, to have a bird like this as a pet, would it take a BIG cage? Right now I have one OLD cat who ignores my parakeets, unless they are loose, and then even old Scruffy can't resist, so he doesn't get to be around. Besides Scruffy, I have the four parakeets and a greyhound. Oh, and a part ownership in a Jack Russell *Terror* and Beagle Mix. That dog would be a worry...

I will check the Lost and Founds, and see if I can get to the newspaper archives to go back a few months. 

I will keep you all updated. Thanks so much for the info you have given me so far!

Joanne


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi Catservant,

Thanks for helping this lost pigeon out. Please do post on the link provided, they are very helpful in trying to find owners of lost pigeons and are very knowledgable. The heating pad is a good idea, and if the garage is drafty perhaps you could cover all 4 sides @ night. Also, just a check here, your garage/basement doesn't have any rodent problems does it, I don't mean to be rude but that could be problematic for the bird and one never knows unless they ask. If possible, could you check inside the pigeon's mouth by gently opening the beak w/fingers of both hand and see if it is clear and pink. If the owner can't be found, and you aren't wishing to adopt, we also have an adoption section, but let's take it one step at a time.

Thanks again for caring about this pigeons welfare.

fp


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Snowflake*

Okay, Snowflake is tucked into the basement nice and warm. No rodents/mice here. We put a broom stick through the bars of the dog crate, and he is perched on there, seems content. 

I tried to post once on that web site above, and I am not sure if it went through, on the lost and found, so will try again tomorrow (when I'm not working). He might get a checkup from the local vet tomorrow, just for an overall check. I decided he can't stay here permanently, but we will cross that bridge when we come to it. 

Again, thanks for all of your help. I will keep you updated.

Joanne


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Thanks Joanne, for bringing him into the vet and in general making provisions for him, it's very kind and generous of you. 

Well, they do make good pets and are a load of kicks....if the owner isnt' found.
Also, post a pic here in the adoption forum if you decide not to keep him. He/she sounds like a real cutie. BTW, I use one of those collapsable dog cages, they are nice and roomy.

fp


----------



## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Hi CatServant,
Sounds like Snowflake may be your new Pet Pigeon 
I would agree that it is most likely that this bird came from a release and couldn't or wouldn't return home.
Do you have a digital camera so you could post a picture of Snowflake so we can se what he looks like, by the sounds of this feathered feet, he may be a show breed. You can post the pic here or use my www.pixalbums.net/pigeon site and them post a link to it here.

As you already own 4 parakeets, you would be already familiar with basic caregiving for birds, however pigeons require a slightly different diet to hook beaks, higher in protein, they also require pigeon grit to crush food in their crop (they swallow seeds whole, as opposed to hook beaks that shell their seeds). Pigeons prefer to sit on flat surfaces (they are descended from Rock Doves that lived on rocky cliffs, not in trees like other birds), so a flat piece of timber or a brick would be a better option for perches. As for a cage, it depend on the size of the pigeon, but most say about 4ft square is about right for each pigeon, however the bigger the better so that they can get a bit of exercise and fly around a little.
Here are some pics to show the above:
Basic Pigeon food and Pigeon Grit (available at most food supply stores):
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=pfood.jpg
Basic seeds in Pigeon food:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=pfoodcontents.jpg
My current Loft/Flight design (I currently have 9 pigeons in this, but it could hold a few more):
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=nloftpen.jpg
Most loft designs are more enclosed, I live in Australia and it is warmer here, so I get away with the more open design.
Hope this stuff helps incase you can't find the original owner, and you decide to keep Snowflake 
Regards
Alaska


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Snowflake*

So here is where I am with snowflake...

I called the vet, and they said they don't just "check over" a bird, it would be a thorough exam and expensive. I'm not ready to go there just yet. They don't want him because he could be carrying diseases...? They did not recommend I let him get close to my birds, yet. They suggested the SPCA. I have a call in to them, but what do you guys think? The vet's office said they would be able to rehabilitate him if he is wild, which I just can't imagine, he is so tame, or they would know where to take him. I decided I can't keep him permanently, but can for a couple/few days while we decide what to do with him. I did go into the archives in the newspaper and did not see any lost pigeons - not locally, anyway. I have taken a couple of pictures of him, now have to figure out how to attach them.  

If I decide to try the adoption route through here, I will probably be asking for help. I want to make sure he goes to a caring and proper home. I saw the warning about that. 

I feel like I need to post every move I make, because I'm so unsure. I really appreciate everyone's help here. 

Joanne


----------



## upcd (Mar 12, 2005)

*Snowflake*

Is so blessed you are taking to find her or him a home. Sometime people buy a white pigeons for wedding or funels. Then they turn them loose because it make them feel better. But that is not best for the pigeon. Or they get pigeons as a pet and let them out to soon and they get lost. My friend Rena and Terry run Pigeon 911 for lost pigeons. They might have some ideas for you. If you have any questions please continuing to post we will help you.


----------



## snowy (Nov 27, 2005)

*White Muffed*

Sounds Like A Dutch Tumbler Or West Of England Or Some Other Fancy,
My First Pigeon Was A Pure White Albino Muffed Pigeon, Look At My Site & Please Sign My Guestbook.
But Would Be Best To Put Him With Other Pigeons Instead Of Your Basement, But Glad You Cared For Him


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hello and Welcome to Pigeons.com

I'm kind of late here on this one.

I just want to let you know that I think that finding him a home is a good idea, or keeping him yourself, as this bird is probably not a feral.

Always isolate a new bird from your birds, just in case, if you should decide to keep him.


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

If it has a muff. Feathers on its feet. Most with muffs will band on the upper knukle of the leg. Thats just above the knee joint. This way the muff is not messed up[ and the band can be found. You migt feel there just in case a band is there cover by feathers. And its probably not a fearal. But may have never been banded by a person. How long are the muffs.


----------



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Catservant,


So far so good then...

Can you describe their poops?

I would not let this Bird be pecking at a 'suet cake', even if it wants to...might make him sick...these Birds need to get their fats from Seed sources and not bovine or animal ones.


If there is a Petsmart or Bird Supply Store near you, get them some White Safflower Seeds...they contain plenty of the kinds of fats that are right for a Pigeon.

Skip the S.P.C.A. unless it is just to ask them for reference info about Pigoen Clubs or rehabbers in your area maybe, and probably they would not know anyway.

You Vet is an idiot...and has a bad attitude as well..!
So, see if you can find another Vet in case you ever really need one.

Probably your Bird is healthier and more germ and disease free than the Vet themselves are...

If the Bird is not 'fluffy' or wilty or sleepy or withdrawn...if the Bird is eating well and pooping moist (pick 'em up in your fingers of 'firm' ) 'Raisen' sized White capped brown-green poops a-plenty...if the Bird is preening and active and alert...it is very likely quite in the pink of health anyway...and the Vet, if they had one sincere bone in their body, could have solved that riddle for you on the phone in ten seconds, or, in a quicky visit and exam for no charge, or a modest charge, or for some small contribution to the 'Coffee Fund'...

If the Bird had strained some Wing muscles or other, or is slightly injured in some way, then of course a more thorough exam would be in order, but even that takes about fifteen seconds for a practiced hand to do 90 percent of.

The Bird was flying, yes?

Just acted 'tame' ...?

If your Basement is overall fairly Bird-Safe, you do not even need to use a cage for that matter...and, it would be better to let them fly in there and roost where they like, fly down to graze in a feed tray, and to get some excercise.


Are all it's Feathers smooth and sleek? No areas that might suggest an injury or contusion or dog bite or anything? Tail is full and long? Eyes vivid and bright?

Have you any way to weight the Bird? 

And to post some images somehow, say, on 'Webshots' or something? - which is free...

Best wishes!

Phil
lasvegas


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Pictures of Snowflake*

www.pixalbums.net/pigeon

At the above site, there is an album called "Snowflake's Album". I think one picture posted twice, but there are two views of him. 

I am not used to handling a bird of his size. To really check him for a band above the feathers, how do I grasp him? Use a small towel?


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Looking at the picture. The muff is real light. It could very well be a feral cross. And it shows NO band. and such a light muff it would show up for sure. It could also be a breed cross. Of some domestic breed. Any way looks as if you have a new pet. Oh and it will be just fine in an outside shelterd pen. If you wish to do so. Pigeons are very tough birds.


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi Joanne,

A pillow case folded length wise or hand towel, will do the trick. You are basically wrapping around the wings and body to stabilize the wings. It doesn't need to be done tightly, just functionally so that you are able to proceed w/out interferance.

fp


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

HI Joanne, that is a very beatiful bird. Not exactly what I think of as muffed leggs, none the less quite beautiful....I think Robert to be correct in that the bird does not look banded.

fp


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Snowflake*

Thanks everone, for taking the time to check him out. 

I found a phone number for a man who has pigeons in the area. Maybe he would like to adopt him. Pigeons are flock animals, aren't they? Happier with more of their own? 

I got to thinking...we have "out buildings" that could probably be turned into something for him, but we are in the country and also have hawks, bobcats and other predators. 

And I really think he should go to someone who knows about the birds. So I'll try him tomorrow.


----------



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Catservant,


Wow...such a pretty Pigeon..!

Thanks for looking out for them...

Phil
l v


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

That is such a preety bird. I have seen muffed legs like that in feral pigeons.


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*One last question about Snowflake*

Because he is so tame, and based on his behavior and appearance, am I right in assuming he is not a feral bird? I shouldn't just let him loose, should I?


----------



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Catservant,


No...

You should not turn them loose.

Now, say, if you had initially found them in a feral flock, doing well, pecking and grazing with the others...and over time you kept seeing them amid the wild/feral others, well, then you could assume that the Bird had joined them sucessfully, whether or not it was an escaped Pet or Marriage-Release Bird who 'went feral' and was doing fine with it, which does happen, too!

But this one was all alone, acting 'tame' and easy, and does not at all sound as if it had adapted to the feral modes or ways...

So, it would likely be too dangerous and trying for them if they were loosed...since the last time they were out in the world, they did not seem quite to know what to do.

So...this is not a feral Pigeon by habit or adaptation, far as I can tell.

And they would likely perish if it were forced on them.


Phil
Las Vegas


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi Joanne,

It doesn't seem as tho this pigeon is a feral, being by itself and hanging out at the store that way. If you did release him, he may not be so lucky the next time. If you've definitely decided not to keep him, then perhaps post him here in the adoption section w/a link to your pictures @ Alaska's site. 

Good luck,

fp


----------



## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Hi CatServant,
Snowflake is definately a beauty, and I think from seeing the pictures that he may have been from a loft and didn't return, more likely than a feral, especially being recessive white (both his parents have to be this colour for him to be this colour), and the muffed legs.
As fp suggested, feel free to use the pics on my site to post here in the adoption thread if you do not wish to keep him, I am certain there will be many to wish to take him on board and care for him.
Here is a direct link to your 'Snowflakes Album' on my Pixalbums site, this way people can go directly to you pictures:
http://www.pixalbums.net/?site=Pigeon&album=Snowflakes Album
Let us know how you go with adopting him out or keeping him yourself 
Are you certain you don't want a beautiful pigeon pet....I too have Parrots and Finches...but Pigeons have to be the most peacful beautiful birds with the best personalities 

Regards
Alaska


----------



## Catservant (Dec 5, 2005)

*Snowflake*

Oh, how I wish I could keep Snowflake. Just from the time I have spent on these boards, I have become very curious and enamored with pigeons. I had no idea there were so many breeds, colors, and personalities! However, my landlord (dad) has said no more animals in my apartment (1 cat, 1 dog, 4 birds). Unfortunately, my apartment is connected to his house, so he knows every animal that comes in here.  

Snowflake is very nervous when I reach into the cage to change the paper, etc. I wish I could keep him and spend time really taming him. Someone said the males coo more...Snowflake is pretty quiet. I hope I'm not giving Snowflake a complex if he is really a she!  

I have posted him on the adoption board, and have contacted the pigeon 911 group that Terry and Rena have. 

Thanks for letting me use your site to post his pictures. He is such a cutie! He is so alert; when the dog is around, Snowflake keeps a very close eye on him. Either he has had a run-in with dogs, or maybe he is just curious. See...I can go on and on about him, and I've only had him 4 days! They are addictive!  

Joanne


----------



## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*I am so sorry that you*

can't keep Snowflake! Wouldn't your dad relent with a heartfelt PLEEEAASE? Maybe if he got to know Snowflake? Pigeons do, indeed, make great pets!

If you still can't keep him, please let us know that he found a good home!


----------

