# Help w/ hurt pigeon



## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

I need to talk to someone as soon as possible. I found a baby pigeon in the parking garage where I work. It has a 1/2dollar size wound and when I found it, two big black birds were harassing it.
It made it over night, I have it in a cage on a heating pad and have tried baby food peas and carrots. It is very vocal today and pecking at my hand. I put some baby bird food type stuff in my hand in hopes it would eat it. The little pigeon just sqawks alot and boinks around trying to flap appearing to look for food. I think I ended up wearing most of the food... help.

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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good evening and Welcome to Pigeons.com,
Thank you very much for helping this little pij. 
You mentioned a baby. Is he not fully feathered? For an approximate age you can click on 'Baby Sara' back on the home page to help determine it's age.
It sounds as though you are doing all the right things as he has made an improvement overnight, however, about the '1/2 dollar' size wound. Where is it located and have you cleaned it as best you can? Do you notice any other injuries?
Other members should be along to help with more detailed treatment. In the meantime you might want to click on 'resourses' in the upper right corner. It gives valuable information about feeding and caring for your little patient.
Any other information you can offer regarding injuries will be most helpful.
Please keep us posted.
Cindy


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello and thank you so much for helping this squeaker









Do you have any idea how old the pigeon might be? 
Does he still have little yellow hair like things on his head or body?

You can check out "Baby Sara's" Photos on the front page to get a general idea of your squeaker's age.

The pigeon may be dehydrated, gently dip his beak into a dish of water and see if he will suck up some.
If you have wild bird seed you can soak some for about 3 hours in water then hand feed it to him by placing him on your lap, opening his beak with your left hand and keeping it open with your thumb and index finger, then take some seeds in your right hand and put it in his mouth. It's abit messy but do this until his crop (Puffy chest area) feels full but squishy NOT hard otherwise he could choke.
If you have baby bird formula you can mix some with the soaked seeds mixture.

You said he is wounded, Can you take a look at him, Where is the wound located? Is it very deep? 
I hope someone can come along shortly to give you somemore advice especially concering the injury.

Keep us posted.

Mary

p.s I see you are located in Austin, TX, check out Devorah's home page she may be able to help you. http://www.austinduckpolice.org/ 



[This message has been edited by maryco (edited February 18, 2003).]


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Thank you so much for replying back tonight, I'm so worried about this little guy. I looked at Sara and it looks like my little pij is somewhere around day 13. His wound is under his left wing. I took him to the vet right when I found him and they gave me some Neo-poly-bac and Trypzyme-V liquid for external wounds. I've been doctoring his wound round the clock and he's trying to flap both wings sort of, of course the right wing is easier to move it looks like. 

He and I and the food aren't getting along too good. The first day I did the syringe with baby food and then this morning he took a little bit but at lunch forget it and then tonight he just squawks and acts likes he's starving. I soggied up some cat food along with some baby bird food I got at Petco. I put it in a dish and held it for him. Sometimes he got his beak in there other times he didn't. He really acts like he is starving which is really freaking me out. I left him with another dish of food right by him incase he gets the desire to eat again. What now? Thank you so much, I really appreciate your help. pb



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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Hi Mary,

The feeding isn't going too well. The little guy keeps moving his head around and squirming. Yesterday I could open his beak, today forget it. The wound doesn't look any better really but he's moving around and trying to flap the wing that's right over it. The vet said their skin is too thin to stitch back up so I'm trying antibiotic ointment and some stuff called Trypzyme-V. I'm really nervous and I'm not sure what to make of all the wiggling and squeaking. I'm worried he is starving. He acts like he is sucking on the soggied up cat food/baby bird food I got at petco. 

I looked at Sara and it looks like my pij "jerry" is about 13 days old.

This website is really heads above the austinduck site. Thank you for being here for me.




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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Hello again,
Just checking in before I retire for the night.
Do hope Jerry is doing better. 
Try 'hand' feeding him. Put a little bit of the 'soggy' food between your fingers and see if he will stick his beak in the food. That is how Mom feeds them.
I was able to get a really good picture of our rescued Jesse feeding her baby, maybe you can get an idea of how she does it.
Here is the website where my pictures are at: http://community.webshots.com/user/azwhitefeather 
It is the first picture in the album titled: Frank & Jesse's Babies. The other albums have some fun pictures as well.
I usually click on the album then click on slideshow.
Keep us posted, if anything comes up please let us know.
Cindy



[This message has been edited by AZWhitefeather (edited February 18, 2003).]


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Thank you Cindy. 

He made it through another night, yea!!
What about all the sqeaking he does? We've got the soggy food in a small dish working but he really ends up "wearing" alot of it. I do think he is getting some in. He's just so busy squeaking and flapping to eat but it seems he really wants to eat. His wound is maybe getting a little better it's really hard to say. The one thing that is different from yesterday morning is that there was hardly any poop to clean up.

Ideas? advice?

Thank you. 

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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Good morning,
So glad your little 'squeaker' made it through his second night! That's wonderful news.
He is 'squeaking' and flapping his wings because he is hungry, just as you thought & probably thinks YOU are his Mom.
Did you try putting the food 'between' your fingers (don't be shy, use a enough food)then put your fingers down to his level and let him come up to them? I believe if you have enough food between your fingers, he will get his beak in there and get some of the food. Were you able to check out the picture? 
"Little poop" usually means "Little intake". It may be that he will need to be tube or syringe fed. We will see what other members think. Tube feeding is much more complex and we have very experienced members who can advise you on that.
Keep the good new coming. You are doing a great job.
Cindy


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello again,

Glad you have his wound looked at by a vet. 
I would NOT feed cat food.
ONLY dog food, please. 

You can soak some pieces of dog food in warm water and handfeed piece by piece.

I find the seed method to be very effective but you have to probably know how to do it.
It is messy but by holding the beak properly it should go in and he will swallow it.

Whatever method works for you best.

Keep us up to date!

Mary

p.s SInce he looks 13 days old he will still need handfeeding until about 15+ days you can leave little dry seeds around and by pecking at them with your index finger he should learn to eat them on his own.


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

About "Tube feeding" 

Well, you could ask your vet to show you how, it's much easier.

You will need a rubber tube(from your vet) and large syringe, and someone to help you hold the bird down.

The beak is stretched up and opened then a tube is inserted in the right side of his throat (Your left) it goes all the way down to the crop and then the syringe can be squeezed and all the formula will go into his crop. (1/3 of the tube will go into his crop)

Mary


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Hi Cindy,

I'm so worried about the food. All I have for him right now is dry cat food. Our dog eats wet food. Tonight I can get some though. I'll try the food in the hand again at lunch time. He boinks his beak around all over and only sometimes pecks at the food. I left a dish with the soggy food in it with him this morning. Will he know to help himself? Thank you for your help. Maybe I should find a professional rehabber person?

thanks,

Pam

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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello again









No, I don't think he will take on his own. He is too young and needs to be handfed.. If you have some soaked seeds please try it.. I have raised 5 healthy babies on this mix and they love it.
Don't worry about the mouth, if you hold him on your lap and gently open his mouth with one hand then put a bunch of seed inside with your right hand and let him swallow. Then do it again until he is full.
Please try not to get anything in the hold behind the tongue since that is the windpipe. Put the seed infront and he will swallow + he holds his windpipe shut when he is swallowing.

I wouldn't give the cat food though.

Mary


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Hi Pam,
Excellent suggestion!
If there is a local wildlife rehabber in your area, most certainly give them a call, however, DO NOT take your little pij to an animal shelter.
I would strongly suggest on the tube feeding you make sure you know exactly what to do before attempting it.
Will talk with you bit later.
Please keep us posted.
Cindy


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Pam,

Thank you for all you have done to help this little bird. Devorah of the austinduckpolice.org is an experienced pigeon rehabilitator. If you can get in touch with her, I'm sure she can help. Please keep us posted.

Terry Whatley


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Pam, and welcome.

I hope that you have manged to get in touch with Devorah and/or resolved the feeding problem, but if you haven't...

Before I joined this list I found a couple of baby pigeons and fed them on stale soaked wholemeal bread (which was what Pigeon Recovery recommended) until they were able to eat on their own. I found out since that it isn't ideal because it could exacerbate any yeast infection, but they lived and thrived so in the absence of any other suitable food it should help! You can wrap the baby gently in a towel, then force its beak open gently and poke the food right to the back of the throat. It will swallow.

So many of us have been in the situation that you are in now, so we really do sympathise!

Cynthia


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Moderately good news! We got about 8 cc's of baby formula down Jerry at lunchtime. We just didn't take no for an answer. I hope I go home to a bunch of poop. Thank you all for your help, I know I'm not out of the woods but I feel better knowing I can make him eat. I'll try the soggy dog food tonight and try that for variety and to avoid force feeding. If the two of us can't get it together I'll try Devorah. I got two names from the Texas Parks and Wildlife animal rehabbers and would you believe they don't take pigeons? Their loss I guess.

Thank you,

Pam



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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Hi Cynthia,

I've mentioned before that my little pij "wears" alot of his food. I don't want him to get cold but how can I go about washing him or should I just not worry about him being a little messy? 

The feeding is still a struggle but I know I got some food down him doing like you suggested. Will he automatically put down his tounge? I'm worried about food going in his windpipe.

Thank you,

Pam




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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello,

Yes he will hold his windpipe closed when swallowing, you just have to put the seed inside his mouth infront and he will swallow it on his own. Allow him to have abit of a rest in between every handfeeding.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Pam,

I used a damp face cloth to wipe the babies down after eating, otherwise the food stuck on their feathers became cement hard!

They close their widpipe for food, but you have to be very careful with liquids. If you have to feed liquids (eg meds) always feed slowly into the right hand side of the beak (the pigeon's right hand side) because that is the bit that leads to the crop. Work slowly and try to avoid any struggle because that is when they can accidentally inhale.

Cynthia


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## turkey (May 19, 2002)

Use warm water on your wash cloth. Warm not cool, and then towel dry him. 

You said you are using a heating pad. Make sure you have enough between him and the heating pad. You don't want to make him too hot. 

I put some babies in a card board box with the heating pad underneath the box. There was a few towels underneath the baby pigeon and one over top of them. They could move off of the heat if they wanted to. 

Julie

[This message has been edited by turkey (edited February 20, 2003).]


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

I'm worried something is not quite right with the little pij. I've been feeding him about 18cc's of baby bird food every couple of hours (4 to 5). When I fed him last I had gotten in about 12cc's when I noticed that he seemed to be shivering. He is always busy flapping one wing or the other and kind of moving around and of course chirping but never this shivering movement. He also seems to always be hungry. Sometimes he opens his beak really wide and I can see what I guess is his crop and then other times I just get the tip of the syringe in the right side of his beak and squirt in a little at a time. 

I have given him some seed mixed w/warm water. He boinks around in it and has even gotten in the dish but I don't think he's got it down yet what he's supposed to do. When I put the seed in my hand he does the same thing. He gets seed all over his face but hasn't figured out that he should open his beak. 

Thoughts/suggestions?

Thank you.


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Hello,

I have just recently tried the "dog food technique" and it's great!

I used the little balls of hard dog food bits and then soaked then in hot water until they swelled up, after that I used a knife to cut each into quarters then poked piece by piece into the back right side of the pigeon's throad, He loved it and it was SO EASY for me









I hope this works for you.

Mary

p.s As for the shivering, I'm not really sure, I've never seen anything like it, Maybe another member can help?

[This message has been edited by maryco (edited February 23, 2003).]


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Pam,

If there is any doubt whether the baby is getting enough food, then definitely try the soaked puppy food technique. It is easy for you and easy for the bird and lots and lots of protein in it.

The shivering I think is probably normal .. baby pigeons just "go ape" when the food person shows up. There is always peeping, squeaking, wing twitching, and generally just a little "live wire" wanting to be fed.

Terry Whatley


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Thanks for writing back. How much is enough food? A pij person told me 21cc's every four hours. After I cut the dog food into quarters, how do I stick it in his beak. Will the pij quit poking at my fingers when he's not hungry anymore? 

His poop on day one when I guess his mom had fed him was uniform and squiggly, now it's soft and brown like diarehea, sp-10. Anyway, it's still in little piles everywhere but not like it was on day one.


Pam


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

You can take a little piece(Quarter) and open his beak then stick it in on the right side behind the hole (which is the windpipe, WARNING: Please don't get anything in there)

I tried putting a piece in the mouth right infront of the windpipe and the baby swallowed it on his own! Just make sure you drain the liquid well otherwise it might drip in the windpipe.

Mary


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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Also you feed until he stops squeaking at you or you feel his crop(puffy chest area) and it should feel squishy like a marshmallow.. I use 10 little balls and each cut into quarters then feed about 3/4 of that amount or more if he is still hungry.


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## turkey (May 19, 2002)

I only fed little babies one time and they never stopped squeaking for food, even when their crop was very full. 

I hear that's normal. 

Julie


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## Rick07 (Dec 7, 2002)

Here is another idea for feeding:
get oats, as in the dry ones you use for baking(plain; no flavoring) put some bird seeds into it and mix with warm water until it is a mash like substance. Then pic some up and put it into your crack or your fingers and he should go for it. With my experience handling baby birds, that have fallen from the cilo, it works great!!!!! good luck


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Do you have a drawing of the pigeon anatomy? Jerry opens his beak for me now to let me squirt in the baby food or put in some cooked oatmeal and I see the tongue and I see this great big hole. I've just gotten the hang of feeling the marshmellow (crop) so I can make sure he's getting enough to eat. 

You guys have all been so helpful, I feel like I owe his recovery to you. His wound is better and he is becoming a pretty bird - no head feathers yet though. When do you supposed he'd like to take a bath? He doesn't do any preening either. I have Jerry in a cat carrier now. What kind of exercise would he like to do and when will he begin to sleep standing up?

Thank you,

pb

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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

The big hole that you see is the trachea! You can see why peple think it is the throat, placed as it is.

I will track down some pics and e-mail them to you!

Cynthia


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Quick question. Jerry looks about 25 days old now (comparing him to Sara). What is the plan now? He still doesn't want to eat unless I feel him w/ the syringe but boy have we got that down. He's growing like a weed. I've still got him cooped up in a cat carrier and he lives w/ a cat so I think he may think he's a cat, just kidding. I could get him a cage? or whatever is the next step.

Thanks,

Pam



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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

This is the cage that Julie built:
http://community.webshots.com/user/jujubear29 

Cynthia


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

And this is the one that Misty provided for her Ruffles 
http://community.webshots.com/user/mistruff 

Cynthia


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

...and I have e-mailed you a copy of Walter's cage (which is based on Julie's design)

Cynthia


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## turkey (May 19, 2002)

And this is the house that Jack built... (just playing).


I have updated my photos. There is now 2 photos of the cage's new development. They both have the words "cage upgrade" in their title. 

http://community.webshots.com/user/jujubear29

If you are building a cage, it might be best to start with the outline of your cage and add the perches and things as you go to suit your bird's needs. 

First you'll have to figure out where you are going to put the cage. That will tell you what size cage you can build. 

If the cage will only be indoors you can use a cheaper wire. I have used both chicken wire (cheaper) and hardware cloth (cost more) and of course I found that hardware cloth is much easier to build with.









Julie

[This message has been edited by turkey (edited March 03, 2003).]


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## pverde9901 (Feb 18, 2003)

Hello Mary,

Cynthia said I should email you directly about what to do now.... Now that Jerry is pretty much a big pij not quite eating on his own but pretty close. I've got him in a possumm cage that's bigger than the cat carrier but I had really intended to help get him well and grown up and then release him. I've even found a nice place with lots of bird food available to release him when he's ready. He flaps alot but hasn't tried flying although to hear his wings flap you'd think he was about to "lift off". He did a funny thing last night rolling over to one side and lifting his wing real high and then he rolled to the other side and lifted the other wing. I thought he might be flirting with the big white water bowl like it was a white pij or something. 

Thoughts/advice?

Thanks, Pam



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## maryco (Apr 1, 2002)

Check your email, Pam..


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## turkey (May 19, 2002)

When he lays on his side and holds a wing up he's trying to bath. Can you give him a wide pan of warm water?

Julie


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