# Worried, as usual.



## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Seeing as I had no idea exactly how to use the nipple method, and the formula was a bit too watery, though I followed other people's instructions, my baby pigeons MAY have aspirated something. Thing is, I'm not certain at all. They were both born with a clicking noise when they breathe. It has gotten less severe, but has not ceased. One baby was born 2 days ago, and the other was born yesterday. Both babies eat with much enthusiasm, more than 2mLs and are hungry, peeping and jumping within about 1.5-2 hours. One of them, even at 2 days, seemed to want to see the world from day 1. Her/his eyes open sometimes, especially when he/she is jumping and peeping for food.
My questions are simply HOW will I know if they have gotten an aspiration pneumonia? I now feed them even more carefully, and they eat and swallow all of their food down properly, though they do get a bit messy. No bubbles are coming from the nostrils, and no formula gets into them. However, as we all know, babies are effected very easily. If they have or do catch a pnemonia, what can I treat them with? What would be the safest thing? They are both gaining weight (both were born at 15 grams, and now one is 19 grams and one is 21 grams), and haven't lost any, and all signs seem good.
I also have some baytril lying around...Would that be good to use as a precaution, or do I have to be sure? If I am to give it, what would the doses be for such tiny creatures?
Thank you and SORRY for all of the questions. Just want to be careful.


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

And you don't have to tell me I'm a terrible parent. I already know I am.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Vasp said:


> *If they have or do catch a pnemonia, what can I treat them with? What would be the safest thing?*
> 
> *I also have some baytril lying around...Would that be good to use as a precaution, or do I have to be sure?* If I am to give it, what would the doses be for such tiny creatures?


If you do think there's a problem brewing, I would suggest consulting your avian vet.

When you're dealing with a newborn(s) (or any bird, for that matter) it isn't a good idea to give an antibiotic as a *precaution*.

Cindy


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## karla (Jul 8, 2006)

Come on! you are a good parent . Worring about the babies !!!!!!!
Look I fed my babies with a syringe , I felt more confident with that method .
Don't worrie if they are happy and eating your doing fine  
Karla


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

I just don't want to kill them. Feeding baby parrots is so much easier because you just stick the syringe in, point it to the right and let loose. They bob their heads and drink it all down. They're usually also bigger.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Vasp said:


> My questions are simply *HOW will I know if they have gotten an aspiration pneumonia?* I now feed them even more carefully, and they eat and swallow all of their food down properly, though they do get a bit messy. No bubbles are coming from the nostrils, and no formula gets into them.



Hi Vasp, 

I know it's hard, but please stop fixating on this "obsession" you have with aspiration pneumonia. Your worries aren't going to change anything that has happened up until this point.

You've been given instructions how to be a little more careful with the feedings and you yourself have thickened the formula somewhat to help stop the bubbles from the nostrils. 

You REALLY don't want to get into the whole treatment with drugs/antibiotics at this point, you're opening up a whole caldron of problems if you do and it will spiral out of control. Drugs are man made and aren't the fix "all" that we all think and hope for.

Please, have some patience, relax and let things happen a little more naturally than you feel comfortable with. If these babies are going to die, it's mostly out of your hands anyway. I know this isn't very comforting but again, you took on this challenge and you're doing all you can and hopefully without running to the drug cabinet from such an early age


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Good advice there.

Yeah, I have a bit of an obsession with aspiration pneumonia, I think.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Vasp, if you have fed baby parrots with a syringe why not try it with these babies?


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

I suppose I could. They seem to like this feeding method a lot though.
The more I think about it and watch them, the more I feel better about their health.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

okey-doke.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

You're doing fine, Vasp. I know it's worrying when you are trying to care for something so small and so fragile. Just keep being as dedicated and as observant as you have been and hopefully all will be well. 

Terry


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

H Vasp my eyboard s havng some problems...some of the letters are not happenng...and cannot get to next lne so all must run on...but anyway...call me f you want and we can dscuss Baby feed stuff...all sounds allrght to me from your descrpton...but f you want...e-mal me off forum and me wll send you my phone no....Phl - Las Vegas ---- very tedous tryng to type ths way...LoL...


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Wow, that sure seems to be a keyboard problem. I'm just the usual anxious parent, though. If there's a slight thunder shower, I grab them and run downstairs and keep them warm because I don't want there to be a power outage, or simply for them to get hurt. If I need someone to talk to, I think it would be you guys, so I'll definitely get in contact with you if I suspect anything wrong... A thing I've noticed is that what I assume is their lungs is very pink. (Then again, so are their legs, wings, and faces). I was wondering if this could be inflammation, or if the lungs are simply pink because they are getting lots of oxygen; our lungs, I believe, are pink.

The babies eat well, and their poops are well. They're also gaining weight.
Should I be worried about the clicking noise? I'm a rather anxious person, especially when parenting any creature (I was seriously shaking when hand feeding a baby african grey parrot for the first time), so I tend to make a big deal about things that are perfectly normal. Sorry. 

Oh yeah. And I see tiny little pin feathers on the baby who was born two days ago. (I still don't know what to name them). He has little pin feathers coming in on his wings, and on his butt.  He's very precocious, opening his eyes and sprouting pin feathers so early.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hello Vasp...the Baby(s) sound healthy to me...Phl, Las Vegas


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*Hi Vasp,

I was very anxious myself, when I first fed my youngsters with a syringe. They are so tiny and seem so vulnerable in the beginning.* 

A thing I've noticed is that what I assume is their lungs is very pink. (Then again, so are their legs, wings, and faces). I was wondering if this could be inflammation, or if the lungs are simply pink because they are getting lots of oxygen; our lungs, I believe, are pink.
*
Why don't you post another pic and we will try to help and see if there is any concern on the pinkness.*

The babies eat well, and their poops are well. They're also gaining weight.
Should I be worried about the clicking noise? 

Oh yeah. And I see tiny little pin feathers on the baby who was born two days ago. (I still don't know what to name them). He has little pin feathers coming in on his wings, and on his butt.  He's very precocious, opening his eyes and sprouting pin feathers so early.[/QUOTE]

*You maybe should find a pigeon rehabber or even someone who raises/races/shows pigeons and ask them about your concerns. Even an avian vet might help put your mind at ease, or address your concerns

You have all the time in the world to name them, I would put that on the backburner until they are older.

*


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Thought I'd just share.










Here, you can sort of see that this little one has its eyes open sometimes. In this picture, however, its eyes are not as open as they are sometimes.










They also seem to have long hairs on the back of their heads. They look quite funny, and are constantly peeping, jumping, flipping backwards, fitting their beaks into any gap they can find, and wrestling, even if their crops are quite full. But alas, after a time, they both fall asleep.


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Vasp, a few days ago I read on this forum that the clicking noise is common with newborn squabs, something to do with their lungs getting used to the air. I'm sure someone else will be able to give you a more detailed explanation. But it's supposed to be perfectly normal. Now just try to relax, you're doing a fine job. Don't be so hard on yourself!!!


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Vasp, 

The new pictures of your two squabs are good I hope they continue to thrive and do well, considering all that you are doing for them


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Vasp said:


> They look quite funny, and *are constantly* peeping, *jumping, flipping backwards*, fitting their beaks into any gap they can find, *and wrestling*, even if their crops are quite full. But alas, after a time, they both fall asleep.


 Those are a couple of talented newborns you have there.  

Cindy


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Yes.  I expect them to take part in extreme sports later in life.


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

I have another concern. The smaller baby needs to poop, but can't seem to push it out right. He tries to, you can see him doing so, but can't get it out.

How can I help him? Oh, and should I add a drop of olive oil do relieve this as well?


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Vasp, 

Yes, you can try adding a drop of olive oil to the formula and this might help get thing greased up a bit inside the baby to get things moving.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Vasp, 

I think I read that you are feeding the Kaytee Exact again now. If you are, make sure you are mixing it VERY well. Stir and stir and get all the powder out of it and makes sure there are no clumps of powder whatsoever. Make it thinner than recommended as well. Do not microwave or reuse any leftover portions either. I'm sure you probably know all this though


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Okay, I gave him a little drop of olive oil. Hopefully it will go well. Yeah, I stir it very well and make sure what I give them is free of lumps. I don't know why this little guy is having a bit of trouble now, as he hasn't before, but I'll add some more olive oil and perhaps make the formula a bit thinner, though it's quite thin. Is it safe to say he'll probably be okay?


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

*olive oil in the formula*

Just a drop...no more, please.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

HelloVasp...yes, add a lttle Olve Ol to the formula...also, cover them wth your hand as f youwere sttng on them...that, and 'hand nest' tme...lots of hand nest tme...they are expectng 'someone' to be 'on' them all the tme, so the more you can do these two thngs, the better...Olve Ol must be a fresh NEW Bottle...no 'old' stuff from the cubbord...phl, las vegas


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Yep, I added just a drop, and it was fresh. The babies are doing okay now.


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

They are sprouting quite a few pin feathers, on their sides, butts, wings, etc. Is this usual for 2 and 3 day old babies? They've been mostly fed on Exact.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Vasp,

They will literally grow right before your eyes .. it's an amazing thing to see and experience. Enjoy it! Sounds like your babies are doing well.

Terry


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Yahhhhh...the Neonate here of the 'Offce' resdeng feral parents, has trpled n sze already, and s a few days old also...some breeds may dffer a lttle also as for how soon they 'sprout' ...but they do grow fast..! ---- Phl, LasVegas


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Thought you guys might want to see this.










Isn't he cute? I call that one Godzilla, because he eats insanely.


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