# Help.caught Stock Dove. Advice Needed



## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

I've managed to catch the Stock Dove that's been looking very sick in my garden.

It is very thin and wheezing as it breaths. Had some seeds stuck in his throat and it looks blocked. What is the best way to get the Spartrix down him?

I'm dripping rehydrating fluid on his beak and have him wrapped up in a towel keeping him warm on my lap at the moment.

Any advice welcome, not had one like this before.

Janet


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

amyable said:


> I've managed to catch the Stock Dove that's been looking very sick in my garden.
> 
> It is very thin and wheezing as it breaths. Had some seeds stuck in his throat and it looks blocked. What is the best way to get the Spartrix down him?
> 
> ...


Hi Janet

This is the instance where you could crush the Spartrix to a powder as far as poss and add 1 ml water. You can give it for more than 1 day. I don't know if it is as effective as the tablet on its own, but worth trying unless you can find a vet who can give it metronidazole in liquid form. 

Maybe Cynthia will advise a slightly less qty of water.


John


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

I've crushed it and sprinkled it on his tongue, Seems to be struggling for breath when I give it water. His tongue is sticking out the side of his mouth with the obstruction.

Can I overdose him with Spartrix as I lost some as I put it in his mouth so was thinking of giving him some more.

Should I give him any meds aswell, I have Baytril and generic Synulox.

I'm so glad I've got him, he is so poorly.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

John_D said:


> Hi Janet
> 
> *This is the instance where you could crush the Spartrix to a powder as far as poss* and add 1 ml water. You can give it for more than 1 day. I don't know if it is as effective as the tablet on its own, but worth trying unless you can find a vet who can give it metronidazole in liquid form.
> 
> ...


Hi Janet,
I suck up water in an eyedropper & place that in a *small * cup, then drop a Spartrix in the water. It dissolves nearly instantly. I refill the eyedropper with the solution & administer it to the bird.

There is very little water involved so as not to dilute the Spartrix too much, but enough dissolve it.

I've had good results with it. 

Cindy


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

AZWhitefeather said:


> Hi Janet,
> I suck up water in an eyedropper & place that in a *small * cup, then drop a Spartrix in the water. *It dissolves nearly instantly.* I refill the eyedropper with the solution & administer it to the bird.
> 
> There is very little water involved so as not to dilute the Spartrix too much, but enough dissolve it.
> ...


Useful to know, Cindy

John


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Thanks, I've done that so he's had probably just under two tablets now.

I've put him on some heat with just water in his box, no seeds I assume for now as he can't swallow well.

Janet


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

You could give him the rehydration mix if not already, Janet - the salt/glucose (or suitable substitute)/water. Aside from rehydrating, it is a basic electrolyte mix so is good for the system and a little booster.

John


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Janet,

I was just off to the post office when I caught this thread. Poor little one, he must be in a bad way if you caught him, they are so shy of humans.

I am sending you some Poly-Aid, hopefully that will arrive early tomorrow, you will have to give it drop by drop but at least it will have some nutrients in it. In the meantime can you give him some glucose to keep his energy levels up?

Another thing I will send is some treats mix, these are tiny seeds and the first solid foods that birds with canker can get down. They are also excellent for weaning woodies.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi Cynthia,

Thank you so much. I have spent all day trying to outwit him.
It was actually quite funny as after my near miss last night I sat and worked out what exactly I had done wrong to miss him on those three occasions.

So... I put three cages on their sides around the garden where he usually fed, then I draped myself in green garden netting and sat still until he appeared. Then as he was pottering about I edged closer, an inch at a time until I was able to throw the net over him, luckily this one time he was behind a bush.

My husband saw me on my first attempt and died laughing. Do you know the old tune, ' They're Coming To Take Me Away Ha Ha'. I can't remember who sang it but it was all about men in white coats taking someone to 'the funny farm'.
Seems I've been humming that to myself all day while I hid under the net!! :

Seriously though it was worth it, I do hope I can turn him around now.

There is a hard lump on his neck, I think that might be the canker bulging from inside.

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

LOL, I wish I had seen that, Janet.

Napoleon XIV...I identified with that song even before I got a dog!

Remember when you ran away and 
I got on my knees and begged you 
Not to leave because I'd go berserk? 
Well,You left me anyhow and then the 
Days got worse and worse and now you 
See I've gone completely out of my mind. 
And, 

They're coming to take me away, ha-haaa. 
They're coming to take me away, ho ho, he he, ha ha, 
To the funny farm, where life is beautiful all the time 
And I'll be happy to see those nice young 
Men in their clean white coats and 
They're coming to take me away, ha-haaa! 

You thought it was a joke and so you 
Laughed, you laughed! 
When I had said that 
Losing you would make me flip my lid, right? 
You know you laughed, I heard you laugh, 
You laughed, you laughed and laughed, and then you 
Left, but now you know I'm utterly mad. 
And, 

They're coming to take me away, ha-haaa. 
They're coming to take me away, ho ho, he he , ha ha, 
To the happy home with trees and flowers and chirping birds 
And basket weavers who sit and smile 
And twiddle their thumbs and toesAnd they're coming to take me away, ha-haaa! 

I cooked your food, I cleaned your house 
And this is how you pay me back 
For all my kind, unselfish loving deeds? Huh? 
Well, you just wait--they'll find you yet 
And when they do they'll put you in the 
RSPCA you mangy mutt! 
And, 

They're coming to take me away! ....etc


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Cynthia that's it !!!!!!!!!!!!!

I couldn't remember all the words now I can sing it to my heart's content, or at least until they take me away !!!!: 

Brilliant, I love it. I'm not the only one then...... Ha Haaaa


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

amyable said:


> Cynthia that's it !!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I couldn't remember all the words now I can sing it to my heart's content, or at least until they take me away !!!!:
> 
> Brilliant, I love it. I'm not the only one then...... Ha Haaaa



Here ya go............


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXZMZ-XvvzI


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Lovebirds said:


> Here ya go............
> 
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXZMZ-XvvzI


All Together Now..............................They're Coming To Take Me Away....

I can't get it out of my head.


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

ROFL... and there is the nasty cycle for that song  It stays in your head which makes you go mad 

Seriously - hope your patient starts to feel much better very soon Janet!


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

The flip side sure makes you nuts, trying to understand it played backwards 

John


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Cynthia,
Thanks parcel arrived first thing.

Bless him, he's still with me this morning. He's breathing through his mouth and his tongue is still sticking out of the side. I can hear him breathing in the cupboard where his box is and it is very mucousy, as if he's got a bad cold. I hope I've got the right diagnosis and am treating him right. There is no bad smell. His poops are dark green with very yellowy urates.
He has a very big hard lump in his neck, and I can see some white blockage in his throat. I am guessing this is canker. 

I gave him a dissolved Spartrix first thing but noticed it dribbled out of the corner of his mouth again. So I put another in his mouth, a bit at a time and dropped a bit of water in to help it dissolve. I hope he got some of it down.

I've dropped some very diluted PolyAid in his mouth as he can't seem to swallow anything thick/ solid. I hope this gets down him and be enough to sustain him for a while.

Should I give him any antibiotics?

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Janet,

When I had a pigeon with very bad canker I crushed the Spartrix and put the powder little by little at the very front of his beak, hoping that it would go down naturally. It didn't, next morning it was coating the canker nodules BUT the nodules had reduced to half their size. It migh be worth crushing the spartrix, putting it in just a drop or two of water and painting it on to the nodules.

Is the dove still drinking? It can probably survive just a bit longer without food, but it can't afford to become dehydrated. Be patient and give him the diluted 

The yellow urates are not a good sign as they could mean his liver is affected. However, I had a pigeon with bright yellow urates one day and normal poops the next.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi Cynthia,

I've just been a drive out to the pigeon supplies to stock up on Spartrix. How much can I go up to a day, it says on the leaflet if it doesn't respond within three days re-dose, but do you know if I can harm him if I give too much?

I've just been dripping ACV water along the side of his beak which he sips and an occasional squirt in his mouth. I'm not sure if he's drinking on his own in the box but yesterday, before I caught him he was standing with his beak in the waterfall, so I hope he was getting some into his system.

The blockage in his throat is still bad. You're right, I must be patient, I think I'm panicing as I want to see an improvement.

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Spartrix is supposed to be a single dose, but I think many of us panic because we can't sit back and wait for the nodules to disappear (I am in that group) and give a tablet daily for up to 5 days. Fortunately it has such a wide margin that a X32 overdose does no harm.

I hope your dove takes a turn for the better soon. Try not to squirt anything into the mouth, be very patient and if the esophagus is badly blocked give all fluids drop by drop into the lower beak, wait for it to swallow before giving another drop.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi Cynthia, I'll take care to do that as you say.

He is a bit quieter when I listen by the box. I've got him wrapped in a towel on my lap at the moment so I can keep giving him a drip regularly. He's as light as a feather.
There maybe another issue that I need to look at in daylight.
There is a patch of red skin with no feathers on his crop and something that feels like a long thin scar or scab right under the lump in his neck.
Not sure if it's connected to the lump or an old wound.

I'll gently bathe it tomorrow so I can see under the feathers.

Thanks for the help.

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Janet,

How clear is the obstruction in his thoat? Is there any canker in his mouth?
Can you provide a photo?

The canker nodule will often affect the feather follicles, so that could account for the bare patch on the crop. But although canker is the most likely cause of what you see, there are other conditions that look similar.

I am never very comfortable about stock doves. I was brought one that was thought to be suffering from canker, but it was some sort of cancer or bone deformity affecting his head Poor little thing died within 5 minutes of arrival and I was almost relieved as I didn't know what I could do to help it immediately other than warm dehydrate and give painkillers.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Cynthia,

I think he's dying right now, I feel helpless.

I've put him back on heat and dripping water along his beak and he's sipping it in.

He seems to be lying flat with one leg behind him, much like they stretch out when they die, that's why I feel he's going. I'm going to keep dripping the water, I don't know what else to do poor little soul.

The obstruction in his throat is still there, I wish I could see a way through then I'd know he was getting some nourishment down. I gave him another Spartrix this morning and it is still in his throat.

I took a photo this morning but have had to stay with him and haven't posted it yet.

I'm going to go back and check him now.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

This is heartbreaking. I am so sorry you are going through this.

Reti


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

He's breathing with his beak open but is still sipping hard when I dribble the water along his beak.
He's very weak and I have tried to at least get some PolyAid in him but I put it on the end of his beak and it just dribbles out.

These are the pictures I took earlier of the outside. I can't get one of the inside of his throat, it's too far down and would distress him too much.

















Please say a little prayer for him.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Janet,

That loooks like more than a bare patch or a scar..., is it a plug of necrotic tissue? I don't think that is canker. Any chance of getting him to the vet? Stock doves are not classified as pests or vermin, so they should receive kinder treatment than their cousins.

Canker in stock doves is rare, although if this one was using a garden feeder I suppose it could have caught it. I found this abstract, http://www.springerlink.com/content/c370w868xu275745/:
_
In October 2004, a free-living Stock Dove (Columba oenas) was found infected with Trichomonas spp. in the district of Soest, North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany. A huge buccal nodular lesion caused an occlusion of the esophagus and an external swelling. The bone of the mandibula was already softened and nearly solubilised. The microscopical examination of a wet swab sample from the carcass detected Trichomonas spp. in huge numbers. The morphological diagnosis of the flagellate revealed T. gallinae. A*lthough trichomonosis is well described for several other columbid species around the world, this is probably the first described case of a trichomonosis in a free-living Stock Dove. *The possible prevalence in the dove population is discussed. _

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi,
I just posted a reply and it disappeared, so I'll just try again.

He is actually standing up again on the heat, ( I'm using a sock and rice). and he's sipping well if I dribble the water from the syringe along his beak. 
I'm trying to give him some peace and quiet to see if he will stablize. His head is pushed hard against the corner of his box and he looks very dozey.

My vets will want me to leave him there to be seen later when the vet has time. I daren't do that as he seems to need the heat and won't drink by himself and they could leave him sitting in the box for a few hours. My car is off the road until tomorrow night so the other vet I saw that was 3/4 hour away by car isn't possible to reach. 

There is definitely something white in his throat but now don't know if that relates to the outside scar. It makes you wonder if the outside problem is the cause of the throat blockage, rather than the other way around.

Do you think I should try him on Baytril, as it's liquid and may go down, just in case there is something else going on. Shooting blind as Pidgey would say.
I'm grasping at straws to help him.

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> It makes you wonder if the outside problem is the cause of the throat blockage, rather than the other way around.


That is what I was wondering.



> Do you think I should try him on Baytril, as it's liquid and may go down, just in case there is something else going on. Shooting blind as Pidgey would say.
> I'm grasping at straws to help him.


As long as it goes down it can't do any harm. Did you see that Kippy thread where the pigeon threw up a big plug of necrotic material?

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=30048&referrerid=560

But if this lump is anchored in the neck, then it can't come out as cleanly.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi again,
He's just lying down on the heat but not really responding to the water.
I found him earlier with his head lolling back, he seems almost too weak to hold it up.

I did have him out and wrapped him up to have a closer look at this thing on his neck. I bathed it and some feathers came away. The skin by the lump is very yellow and there was what looked like a small clump of feathers sticking out of it. It was a piece of black soft tissue/skin. I really don't know but I wonder if it was tumerous it certainly was growing off the neck.
Apart from that the skin where the scar is, is red but no dried blood came off as I bathed it, so I haven't a clue what's going on there.
Maybe I'm kidding myself but I do think the lump is a little softer.

Compared to last night he is much weaker and I don't feel he'll now that he's going to make it. I hope to goodness I'm wrong but without being able to get much down him, I don't see how he can keep going.

I did see the story from Kippy, really interesting. If only this thing would come away and clear his airways like that.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Janet,

It doesn't sound good. I am sorry that you are going through this but glad that the dove is in your care, warm and safe.

Throat tumours aren't uncommon and they would grow in all directions.

Poor baby, he has been through a lot.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

I've lost him, I'm just so upset at the moment.

He just was gasping for air in the end poor little soul.

We were right though, it was a growth of some sort that was completely blocking his airways. I had to have a good look as I needed to know that I couldn't have saved him. There was a little blood in his last poop aswell.
I so wanted him to stop suffering, so he is breathing freely now bless his little soul.

Thanks for all the advice and support.

Janet


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I am so sorry, Janet. It never gets any easier.

Cynthia


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Hi,

Little Dove is sleeping peacefully under the shrub where I caught him.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> Little Dove is sleeping peacefully under the shrub where I caught him.


Good sleep to you little dove...

Cynthia


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

I'm sorry also, Janet. 

I've lost birds in similar condition to your Little Dove, and it's always very hard no matter how much you try to prepare yourself at the outset. It's always our goal to try to help them get better, but I do think the act of caring for such a creature (and being the recipient of such loving care) is valuable in itself.

Jennifer


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

Thanks both for your kind words.

I take my hat off to all of you on this forum that deal with so many tragic losses. I'm still very new to this and have only really dealt with a handful of injuries as opposed to very sick birds, so I have felt pretty bad about it today.

I did decide to look into what the little dove had been coping with, thought better of posting a picture. If I can learn something from it then he'd given something valuable to me. I realised he couldn't have recovered but I needed to accept that I hadn't let him down. I can only admire and love him for the way he'd kept going.

Janet


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