# Introducing Mini and Max



## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Hi all,

I just wanted to introduce my two new baby pigeons Mini and Max.
They are eight days old and are doing great.
I have named them Mini and Max in reference to the amount of fluff on their bodies...just like with Baldy and Fluff....Mini was born with nearly no fluff...and Max had Maximum fluff coverage 
Here is a link to Mini and Maxs Album...just click on each pic to see the pictures from day 1 to 8:
http://www.pixalbums.net/?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&subdir=Mini and Maxs Album

They are just starting to colour up...and Max is another Recessive Red and is going to have white flights, just like his big brother Fluff.
Mini is a Girl, and has dilute (the short fluff), and her colour is coming out a honey golden colour (I think she is also Rec Red, but the Dilute makes the Red look Yellow), I think she is really going to be a stunner.

Regards
Alaska


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## Symbro (Oct 28, 2005)

and why do you say he and she? i mean you sound so certain


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi alaska,

The babies (Mini & Max) are adorable, just as gorgious as Fluff, Baldy and of course, Elle.

I can't wait to see pictures of them when they get older, also!

Thanks for sharing.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Oh, joy, two more to ooooh and aaaaw over. They are so adorable, I just want to reach into the computer and pick one up.

Maggie


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Congratulations!*

Another two beauties to watch with awe!

Sure look forward to more pictures and updates!


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Thanks for the photo series. It looks like babies don't have any fluff where their tails will be, maybe to aid in hygiene? Love Max's punk hairdo on day 5!


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Thankyou all for your replies 
It's now day 11 for Mini and Max, and their feathers are starting to open.
As I thought, Max is Recessive Red, like his big brother Fluff and his mum Ruby, however he has two white flights on his left wing, and three coming from his tail, and the Rec Red colour is slightly darker.
Mini is Recessive Yellow (Rec Red, with Dilute), and is turning out to be the most beautiful Golden Honey Colour, plus she is going to have about six white feathers in her tail!!
Here is a pic of them today:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=day11mnm.jpg
I just went into the loft to get the new pic, and picked up both Mini and Max to check out their feathers, Lady Tarheel.... there is nothing like holding one of these little baby pidgies is there 
Terri, from my experience you are right, no matter how fluffy they start off, they never have any fluff around their tails, and the tail feathers remain short until they get older, then they grow long...probably Mother Nature at her best ensuring they stay healthy.
Symbro, as for knowing the sex of the pigeons I work on some hard genetic facts, behavioural, and some gut instinct to best determine my he's and my she's in the loft.
Both Baldy and Mini where born carrying Dilute...the fact that Ruby (their mother) does not show Dilute (she would be Recessive Yellow otherwise), tells me that Cecil (the father) is carrying heterozygous Dilute (carrying it, but not showing it)...and has passed this onto his babies, and therefore both Dilute babies must be females to show it.
This is a very compressed description and a full one would take a bit longer...it all has to do with Dilute being a Sex-Linked Recessive Gene, and the X and Y sex chromosomes in pigeons.
But basically I am genetically 100% certain that both Baldy and Mini and girls.
On the other hand I know Elle is definately a girl due to her fathers recent behaviour...he even went as far as topping her.... so this tells me she is definately a female.
As for the boys Fluff and Max...I work more on gut feeling and percentages...the way Cecil passes on his Dilute gene, I feel that these two would also be Dilute if they were girls...plus both have hatched first, been slightly larger, and just seem to have that 'male' look in their eyes.
I could be wrong assuming these two are boys, but most of the time I am fairly good at 'picking' the sex on gut feeling anyways.

I will keep you all updated as Mini and Max keep growing up.

Regards
Alaska


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Alaska, thanks so much for the information and photos. Too bad you're so far away - those babies are irresistable!


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Alaska, I am so envious. All these beautiful, sweet little ones to cherish. I must say, I believe Max will give Elle a run for the money in looks. Just keep them coming.

Maggie


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## BirdDogg10 (Aug 23, 2005)

Hey there, looks like you own the Andrew sisters

Patty(Elle) Maxine(Mini) and Tinkerbell(Baldy)

Ok ok the last one's a joke


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Yes, we are all far away physically, but isn't it great that we can still share here in the same place  We just haven't developed touch internet...yet!!
Elle certainly has some fierce competition in the looks department coming along...just look at the honey coloured feathers Mini is starting to show 
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=day13mnm.jpg

Ruby has just laid her second egg for the next round...I really should pull the eggs and let her sit on fake ones...otherwise I am concerned it might get a little crowded in the loft. It's just so hard to pull the eggs when I know what the beautiful babies would turn out like if I left them 

For anyone interested here's a little bit of info on what I have noticed about the 'Fluff' on my birds when they are born:
A 'normal' pigeon has medium length fluff when born.
Both of my Rec Red Pigeons have been Extra Fluffy when born.
Baldy is a Dilute Pigeon and was born with next to no fluff.
Mini was born with just the slightest bit longer fluff than Baldy.
I was wondering if she was Dilute, but I thought that she had more fluff than Baldy had....
Now Mini has turned out to be a Dilute Rec Red Pigeon.
So if you imagine a 'normal' pigeon, then put Dilute, you get next to no fluff, then add Recessive Red, which lengthens the fluff just slighty.

So...I can now predict which babies are Dilute, Dilute Rec Red, or Rec Red, just by the length of their fluff when born!

Not that I am looking to have more due to that overcrowding issue mentioned above...maybe just two more...or a bigger loft 

Regards
Alaska


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Alaska, 

The new photo is just grand Mini is a doll and her tawny feathers remind me of a collared dove in colour. She's going to be striking when she grows up just like all your youngsters

Don't you wish you could just have 100 pigeons? LOL, I know I'd love to have more myself and see all the beautiful patterns that might have come from further breeding of Henny and Eggbert. *sigh*


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Two beautiful birds playing "choo-choo train". Alaska, I think, for our sakes, you should build a really large aviary and raise all that you can, so we can see them.

They are adorable. Maggie


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*That latest picture*

of Mini and Max is soooo adorable! Never have seen a picture with one BEHIND the other! Toooo funny!

BTW, how is ELLE's size holding up in comparison to the the others? Is she still a + size or has she stabilized?


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Alaska, excellent observations regarding the relationship between fluff and color genetics. Guess I'm a big fan of the dilute coloring, because Baldy and Mini are just too cute!!! You are a great photographer!


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

I certainly do wish I could have 100 pigeons...perhaps I should just place a huge mesh over my entire backyard and make it one huge loft 
I'm torn between wanting more and being concerned about space...I really could just make a bigger loft for them to fit...but inevitably there will be a time that I will need to stop or else start to hinder their lifestyle...so I am thinking perhaps it is best if I just stop now...after all I can always continue breeding in the future if I wish to then.
Mini and Max are a bit odd in that they now prefer to sit in a line instead of opposite direction next to each other..perhaps they won't grow out of this...how funny.
Elle has stabilized a little in her weight...but saying that she is still broader and taller than both of her parents... she even tried to start picking on her mum Penny, and was pecking her off the same perches for a few days...she thought she would get away with this until Penny all too readily reminded her of that powerful wing-fu wing slap that Penny has...it soon put her back in her place 
Having Baldy and Mini come out Dilute was a huge bonus...I didn't know Cecil was carrying Dilute...and I too love the diluted colours that the pigeons come out as. Thanks...taking photos comes easy when you have great subjects 
Regards
Alaska


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Day 20 and both Mini and Max are doing great, both are standing and walking around the nest area. Most of their feathers have opened up.
Max has two white feathers on his left wing and has a dark charcoal colouring blended into his Rec Red down his back and tail, and is quite dark in his tone.
Mini has white tail feathers and just keeps getting more golden each day
Here is a pic of them today, showing their colour, and also some of their white feathers:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=day20mnm.jpg

Regards
Alaska


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Alaska, 

Mini and Max are looking spectacular! They seem to be growing so fast but could also just be those wonderful parents of theirs too The babies are very well nourished and the colours are just gorgeous!

Thanks for the new pics!


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## LondonPigeon (May 10, 2005)

very nice looking birds 

the colour of mini's wings are like that of a soft cute chicken


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Alaska,

The babies really compliment each other in their coloring. They are so cute!

Thanks for sharing.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Well Alaska, with every picture you post, I wind up saying the same thing. They are absolutely gorgeous. The sweetness in their faces with just a touch of wariness really gets me.

Thanks so much

Maggie


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Awww...*

Mini and Max shore are purdy!!!

All kidding aside, they are growing sooo fast and will continue to be gorgeous birds!

Any updated pics on ELLE, Baldy and Fluff?


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## Lin Hansen (Jan 9, 2004)

Alaska,

Thanks for the updates on Mini and Max....ALL of your birds are just so beautiful and healthy looking....a pleasure to see.

Linda


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Their colors are developing so beautifully!


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Thankyou all 
I went out and took some pigeon family photos today, selected the best and here they are...
The latest pic of Mini and Max today at 28 days old:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=day28mnm.jpg
They are very close to eating on their own and have both ventured out of the nest and are both growing the final few feathers that come in last around their beaks 
Here is a pic of ELLE! She is now 71 days old:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=day71elle.jpg
She continues to do well and is still quite a big girl, and just the other day showed of her attitude by filling her crop and getting angry with Ash because he wouldn't let her near the food container! LOL, just like her father...super grumpy and with lots of attitude 
Here is a pic of the whole APT family:
http://www.pixalbums.net/post.php?site=Pigeon&album=Alaska&pix=theaptfamily.jpg
Baldy and Fluff are extremely tame...I go in with Safflower seeds in my palms and both jump up to my hands and stand there while they peck at the seeds. Fluff will even let me touch him without food and he won't move. As you can see from this photo Fluff is down the bottom giving me the 'you haven't got any safflower seeds on you?' look..LOL. It is amazing when they are this tame 

Hope you like the updated pics
Regards
Alaska


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*I'm running out of*

superlatives - again! 

ELLE is super spectacular! That white "bib" is sooo distinctive! She sure sounds like her character will match her beauty...different and with attitude! Her updates will always be special for me 'cause I remember "when" she was just a BIG baby!  

Keep those updates coming! Love hearing about Mini, Max, Baldy, Fluff and the parents!! THANKS! 

P.S. Are you gong to let ELLE have babies? If so, will you be able to control who her mate will be??? Be interesting to see if she will pass on her size? Think she will??


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

I'm like Shi - running out of things to say how much I love these pictures. I will say that Elle still rules! Who is that little cutie pie in the last picture - black and white? That is a beautiful bird.

Maggie


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Alaska, 

Mini, Max and family are all gorgeous, cutie pies of pigeons You are such a gloater Every one of your hatchlings have been such precious specimens of the pigeon world and YOU know it

Seriously, I'm thrilled for you and your birds....all are such healthy, robust members of their breed and you are the proud "parent", lol.

Love all the new pictures...keep em coming when time permits and try to practice a little humbleness here


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*I, too, wondered*

about the two-toned beauty. Went into Alaska's album and it sure looks like Ruby, one of Cecil's babies...BTW, check out Cecil's eyes! Really different!


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Hey, Brad,*

your post reminds me of the song: "It's Hard To Be Humble, When You're Perfect In Every Way!"


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

mr squeaks said:


> your post reminds me of the song: "It's Hard To Be Humble, When You're Perfect In Every Way!"



LOL! I can only IMAGINE, Shi....never heard of that song...but I guess it rings true in your ears and perhaps I'm a little pea green


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

LOL, love the responses 
I've got some good news...I have been considering upsizing my loft arrangement, and should be building it in the following few weeks......
so......
I also decided to let Cecil and Ruby keep there last pair of eggs......
you know what that means....
YEP more baby pigeon pics coming shortly 
I'll try to be humble Brad, but I can't make any promises 

Seriously though...I have been very lucky with this lot of babys that they have all been very healthy and have had some great colours come through from their parents.
Elle will always be my special girl, she was the first baby, and how can we forget how big she was!!
I am not looking at breeding Elle currently, but whos to say what may happen next year when I have probably purchased the next door neighbours house to build extensions for my Pigeon Loft...lol
The Black and White Pigeon in the photo is Cecil! my original Pigeon, and the reason why I now love pigeons and have all these little babies from him...Infact he is sitting on those new eggs in the pic...he is such a great dad. Ruby is the one standing on the feeder on the top left...looking down over her babies like a good mum.
Oh and don't worry Brad...I'm just as pea green over your beautiful Giant Runts!! I just wish I had the room to have pigeons that size.

Regards
Alaska


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Well, duh*

If I had read the caption under the picture more carefully, I would have realized it was Cecil and not Ruby!!! That'll teach me...  

Of course, I doubt if I'll make THAT mistake again...LOL


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## jimmyrenex (Mar 27, 2005)

*Cecil double take!*

 
Hey Alaska...
Those birds look incredible! They look to be in amazing shape as well! I noticed you mentioned that black and white one in the pic is named Cecil. I think I have Cecils twin! This little guy just left the nest a few days ago and he is a cutie... Whadda ya think? Twins? 
Yes, he does have 2 bull eyes...


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## alaska (Mar 17, 2005)

Wow, your new pigeon does look like Cecils twin....don't you have a mini version of one of Brads birds aswell?....I think you have a pigeon cloning machine at your place and your not telling us 
Even has the bull eye because of his badging across the head. Is his other eye a bull eye aswell or does he have different colour eyes (my Cecil has got one Pearl eye and one Bull eye).

Regards
Alaska


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

alaska said:


> .I think you have a pigeon cloning machine at your place and your not telling us



LOL! ALASKA!!!  sure seems like it


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