# Mated Pair is an Unmated Pair?



## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Has anyone ever had a pair of birds mate, the hen lay the eggs, then have the pair fight? A couple times they were really being aggressive, the female would be sitting then run out and attack the male, but now it's like the male is trying to drive the female to the nest...I separate them for a small period to "reset" them, but when the male is sitting in the nest by himself and I put her in, he starts the driving chase and she keeps running from him and trying to get out of the cage. When she is sitting on the nest by herself and I put him in, he of course goes right to the female and she runs off the nest and after a chase he sits on them again...They are young, not even a year old yet, and this is their 4th clutch. Recently we had her separated for a week and a half when she was sick, but they've paired up and laid these eggs so I thought all was good...The last few clutches they rotated properly with no problems...I'm confused lol. It's like they both recognize the eggs as their own, but not recognizing each other as mates? I tried to read on the internet what to do, and I get conflicting info on whether or not to separate them and for how long. Anyone have any experience with this or would know what to do??? I'd appreciate any thoughts!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

my first thought is if they are being forced to nest in a cage then they may just need more room, being in a cage can cause stress and boardum and fights will happen. I find pigeon pairs do better in a loft with nest boxes where the pairs only can come and go from their own box, they can get out to eat and drink and bath or sun themselves in the aviary which is important as well. if you can let them out of the cage in the loft I think they will do better. being young they do over do things sometimes and it comes out wrong..they do settle and mature as time goes on.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

That makes sense...I try to leave the cage open when my husband or I are home so they can have more freedom, but some days we work long hours. I guess I'll just leave them in the same cage and see what happens and be lucky that the male WANTS to sit on the eggs and not like some who wants no part in it lol. It just seemed strange to me that they were mated, laid eggs, then acted like they weren't a pair anymore. He's still chasing her around the cage to the next box, the poor girl...


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Hi Renalight

I think exactly the opposite. The breeding pairs are locked in breeding boxes for some reason. The ideal sized breeding box is l/b/h 2/3/2 feet.
When you removed the hen when she was sick it was the time difference brew between the cock and the hen. I have hens that would pair up with a new pigeon if their partner is away just for 2 days,yes just for two days. They never mourn or stay sad, just give in to new pigeons advances. So your cock might be seeing some other hen when his partner was isolated and this may be reason for their fights as happened in my case. The cock might be hurting her and she likes to keep distances and/or probably retailiate as its her eggs which she laid having labour and pain. The present eggs must be thrown away so that neither of them have a reason to be protective. The nest bowl also need to be removed.
The pair need to kept locked up in a breeding box so that they can see and stay with each other all the time. And the hen or the cock have no other pigeon to fool/flirt around with. This way differences can be settled, not by letting them do what they want to do. Their food and water need to placed within their breeding box which is better kept away from any readily available cock and hen or other birds.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Jass SamOplay said:


> The present eggs must be thrown away so that neither of them have a reason to be protective.


I threw the eggs away since I came to the same conclusion that both were fighting over them and I wanted them to start anew. We only have this pair as indoor pets so there weren't any other birds around to mess up their bonding. They have mated again and they would sleep on the same perch and acted passive and all lovey-dovey and she has just laid her first egg today. Things were fine again and I let them out to take a bath, but as soon as I started to put them back in their home she went to sit on the egg, and he came in behind her, and she rushed back out and he chased her around for a bit pecking at her head again...I know he's trying to get her to sit in the nest and she might not really want to until she lays the second one, but I'm worried they're going to keep this chasing up again like last time and crush the eggs or something...He might be aggressive when he wants her to sit on the eggs but I don't think she should keep running back out of their nest box and away from him all the time. I've got them out still and he went in his home and is chilling at the top part of the cage and she's outside perched on top of the cage, and I guess I'll see how they behave in an hour or so when I put her back in the cage...I'm just confused at this behavior since it's the second time it's happened. Before now they had no trouble sitting in the nest box together and swapping at the proper times...


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Or I might be looking into this too much and being an overprotective parent lol!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

How large is the area they are kept in?


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

A flight cage. It's big enough for 3 of me to be standing in it. And I let them out when I'm home and can watch them, so they should have enough space to do whatever they want, even though they usually try to peck at stuff on the floor most of the time or perch on their cage top. 

I just put them back in together and she's still running from him...How can they be so together before the eggs then her be afraid of him after she lays?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Do you have pics you could share?
Maybe she just wants to be out of the box, but he is driving her back in to lay another egg.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

It's a big cage and I built the shelves in there for them and they get around easy. I just closed them up in the nest box together to see if that would help them bond again, and after an hour or so of Ring Around the Rosy he's sitting on the egg and she's sitting next to the nest away from him, and it's 11pm so she should be sitting on it...

Trying another way to load the pictures...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Don't force them into the nest box. He could injure her. Going in should be her choice. You can't force them to bond. Let her out if she wants to be.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Hopefully this picture will load correctly...I took a picture by the couch as a reference on how tall it is. And him chasing her...lol I feel bad for my princess...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It would be better if the nest box could be raised higher. She would feel safer I think to have babies in a higher box. Pigeons always want to go high up where they feel safe. Especially with other animals around. It's instinct. Please don't lock her in the box though. Stressing her out is not going to help any. The box could be put up across and a bit higher than that board on the left.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

I've thought about that, and I'm not sure how to rig it that way...it doesn't look it, but that nest box is heavy! I might have to build another one with lighter wood, we bought that one with the cage when we got it. I have one of the standard single nest boxes, but I like the bigger one better since they have more room. Do you think she doesn't approve of the nest? They were happily building it earlier this morning before she laid her egg. He's still chasing her around the cage...he will sit on the egg when she's in the cage during breathers, but when I had her out to give her a break from him, he would perch out of the nest and not sit on the egg. And of course when I put her back in...they're gonna be up all night playing tag.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Morning update: He is still chasing her around the cage. The behavior reminds me of a pair of pigeons who have not mated yet. He tirelessly chases her towards the nest and she's not interested. I'm thinking it might be the position of the nest...but if she didn't like the nest location she wouldn't have laid there would she? Or would she since it was the only nest in the cage to use? This behavior is starting to stress me out, I just want them to get along like they did before she laid the egg!!


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## Jack Wooldridge (Dec 28, 2006)

*Higher nest box.*



Jay3 said:


> It would be better if the nest box could be raised higher. She would feel safer I think to have babies in a higher box. Pigeons always want to go high up where they feel safe. Especially with other animals around. It's instinct. Please don't lock her in the box though. Stressing her out is not going to help any. The box could be put up across and a bit higher than that board on the left.


Pigeons do prefer higher nests but you must make sure there is a platform outside the nest or there is danger of the squab falling and injuring itself.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Jack Wooldridge said:


> Pigeons do prefer higher nests but you must make sure there is a platform outside the nest or there is danger of the squab falling and injuring itself.



You run a board 2 inch high across the front of the box, It should keep the babies in okay.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Renalight said:


> Hopefully this picture will load correctly...I took a picture by the couch as a reference on how tall it is. And him chasing her...lol I feel bad for my princess...


Im wondering if they just may know there is no space in there for more than two birds. raising more in there will be even more messy and when the squabs are weaned the male will bully or fight them or it. IMO if you only have them as pets and in a cage, use fake eggs for hatch control . 

if there is another loft someplace then I would move them in there and have a few different nesting spots, you would want the loft to hold all the prospective young that you are thinking of letting hatch.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

I was really just trying to get a bird or 2 from them since my father-in-law wanted a couple birds to start a loft of his own. But this is their 6th or 7th clutch and they acted perfectly normal up until the last 2 times after she got sick. They've cooled it down some and will even sit on the same perch, but they will have their little chasing episode and it still seems like she doesn't quite like him when he chases her like that. She's got that short little grunting coo to let him know she had enough and she does the little wing twitch to show she's irritated at him lol. I just wonder where she will lay her second egg today...I managed to find a bookshelf and moved some things around in their cage so they have 2 nest boxes. The original one on the floor and another one up higher. I'll take a picture in just a minute...


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

This is the set up for right now until I can rig up a better version of it...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That's nice, they at least have choices.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Well...I think this clutch is a no go. I just came home from work and she just let the egg fall from where she was perched.  This behavior is just puzzling me, and I don't think he's being aggressive, he keeps trying to puff up in front of her and everything. I'm just confused that everything is fine and they get jiggy wit it every day up to the day she lays and even builds the nest together, then after she lays it, it's like that's it. She goes to sit on the egg after she lays and as soon as he goes in the nest box behind her it's like she's afraid of him, and he's just trying to steer her to the poor nest...

On a side note: The last time this happened he had taken a bath and she attacked him when she was on the nest, maybe thinking he looked like another bird. And this time they both took a bath at the same time after she laid the first egg.

Or maybe it's just due to inexperience...They haven't had a successful clutch. Long story there but many high chick mortality rates, probably due to her being sick and us not knowing at the time.

They're both on the same perch, but he's trying to impress her and she's trying to peck him, and now he's trying to peck back with a couple wing slaps...

And I thank you all for trying to figure this out with me! I'm not that experienced with pigeons, so sometimes they're behavior like this baffles me and I want what's best for them, but maybe I'm not doing what they want lol.


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Still no bonding...he's kept her running around so much she's half starved and thirsty by the time I get home from work. Doesn't look like he's hurt her, there's a ruffle of feathers on the back of her head, and she stubbed a nail trying to get away from him and drew a little blood. The poor thing just lay down flat in my hands when I let her out when I got home. 

I've partitioned the cage into 2 parts, and she's got the treat of the bigger upper half of the cage and he's got the bottom half. Let's see if time apart really does make the heart grow fonder...


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

time apart will make him even more anxiouse when he gets with her IMO. what he is doing is driving her to the nest..it is a normal behavior of paired birds. he wants her to pick a nest and lay eggs.


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

I have come across pairs which break apart while the partner bird is sick, however in both of my cases it was the male bird which was sick and the female picks up another male from the flock. While I successfully paired back one of the them the other pair never paired up.

So my wild guess is that, in your case the factors of the weird behavior might be - sickness, lack of room, absence of other pigeons


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

Well, I have some good news. I kept them separated for about 2 days, and when it looked like she was showing some interest in him, put them together and wa-la! Pigeon bonding! They've been cuddling in the lower nest box since I paired them up, and totally ignoring the higher nest box lol! Guess they just needed to "reset" things with each other. We'll see how they behave tomorrow, but at least I'm not stressing out about them anymore after I saw this tonight. It might have been just like us, if you stick a husband and wife in a house with nothing else to do but try and make babies, sometimes a little time apart can fix things? Not sure exactly what caused this behavior, but I'll keep you guys posted if it happens again and any observations I noticed. Thanks for the help everyone!


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## Renalight (Jun 5, 2013)

I'm thinking she's overprotective of her nest...Everything has been going smoothly, they had another run in after I think the cat scared them early one morning, separated them for an hour or so to let them cool off, and everything was good. No problems until today when I took them out for a bath. I scraped the inside of their cage clean while they were out and about, then when I went to put them back in after a little bit they were at it again. Looks like I won't be able to clean their cage till they're done nesting...it seems to irritate her lol.


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