# Opossums pests???



## Vova (Mar 27, 2012)

I have lots of wild life out where I live, every now and then pigeons go missing. last week one disapeared I see coyotes sometimes but they cant get to the pigeons, birds of pray aren't around right now, cats don't touch the birds. Today I found a opossum in my live trap that I set up by/in my barn where I keep my pigeons, I know that rats and opossums eat eggs but can they catch and eat large full grown pigeons??? I'v raised baby opossums before but they only ate my dogs food and and table scraps. They ignored my pigeons.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

yep, they will eat the pigeon if they can get a hold of it.. usually if one did get a bird it leaves the body there but the rear end is first eaten out. so that is how one tells if the "possom" was the culprit, at least around here that is what has been seen with fellow bird keepers.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

They are also very good climbers, making getting at the birds fairly easy at times. And I have actually had a possum cut their nose/face so bad digging through the buried wire that when I caught it to remove it from my fly pen, part of its nose and upper lip were left behind. I have never seen such self mutilization. Must have been one hungry critter. And after all that trauma, it never did get a bird.


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## Vova (Mar 27, 2012)

Any suggestions what I should do with her?


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Do you have any wildlife rehab centers in your area? Or does your city/town have an animal control office? You could give them a call. Or you could drive several miles away and release it. The farther the better, or you could end up seeing it again.


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## Sonorgirl (Sep 7, 2011)

Boy he sure does look pissed off! Definately food for thought when designing the fly pen this spring. Thanks for the info almondman.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Sonorgirl said:


> Boy he sure does look pissed off! Definately food for thought when designing the fly pen this spring. Thanks for the info almondman.


Your welcome! You may have seen the other thread about using chicken wire. My visitor was one reason for my changing wire.


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## Sonorgirl (Sep 7, 2011)

Yes I did see that thread, I personally do not use chicken wire. I can certainly understand why you would change it. I had a Opossum on my property once, my dogs sent it up a fence, it never came back but I am wary of them.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

almondman said:


> Do you have any wildlife rehab centers in your area? Or does your city/town have an animal control office? You could give them a call. Or you could drive several miles away and release it. The farther the better, or you could end up seeing it again.


Just remember, opossums may have a family too


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## Pijlover (May 5, 2010)

Thank Goodness we dont have any such things in here, only rats, cats and hawks


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

possie's are nomads, they do not stay in one area long
they are very misundertood
need to make it so nothing can get into the loft, there will always be more critters coming and going, if the loft is secure you should have no problems


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Quazar said:


> Just remember, opossums may have a family too


True. It is that time of year.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

almondman said:


> Do you have any wildlife rehab centers in your area? Or does your city/town have an animal control office? You could give them a call. Or you could drive several miles away and release it. The farther the better, or you could end up seeing it again.


Vova - do you still have the critter? ( kinda hope you don't )
Quazar brings up a good point. An alternative, if you still have the critter, or maybe for future problems, is to take him to the edge of your lot line, and create as much noise as possible as you release it. Banging metal trash can lids could work nicely. This MIGHT keep it from coming back.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Possums are a fact of life for me. In TN it is illegal to relocate them. The rehab centers will take the ones hit by cars only to put them down and test for rabies and such. Farm caught possums are either your pet(which is illegal) or fertilizer(trying to put it nicely). So you have the choice in TN of popping a cap which is leagal or relocating the animal which is illeagal. So you know I have and will continue to do illeagal and leagal removeal.

Possums are marsupials so if they have babies they will be with their mother this time of year. Remember them being nomads coment above. They do not nest and go back to it each night. Fathers have no further duties with the babies once made.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

just let the critter go 10 miles down the road in a nice rual area.


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## Ross Howard (Nov 26, 2009)

Thanks spirit wings just what we in the country need more pigeon eaters. Fix up your pens get a dog leave a radio on over night whatever but don't make your problem our problem. We are not a dumping ground for feral cats , possum , **** etc . Look after your own we do.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

honeyrobber said:


> Possums are marsupials so if they have babies they will be with their mother this time of year. Remember them being nomads coment above. *They do not nest and go back to it each night*. Fathers have no further duties with the babies once made.


Not quite true. they are nomads, but will settle in one place with family (usually in a hollow log or under a house) and continue to return untill food in that area becomes harder to find, or untill the home becomes unsafe, then they will move on. Incidently, the young when born are absolutely tiny (you can fit about 10 on a SPOON) 

Actually, they are not really that aggresive or destructive & eat garbage, fruit, vegetables, green plants, snails, slugs, snakes, and insects, including cockroaches, crickets, and beetles. They catch and eat rats and mice. They also eat dead animals of all types, I suppose if hungry enough they may eat pigeons but doubtful if they would actually try to get into a loft unless there was a space big enough.


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## Vova (Mar 27, 2012)

Thanks for your opinions guys. @sprit wings, exactly what I will do this weekend when I go to my grandmas lol


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

almondman said:


> They are also very good climbers, making getting at the birds fairly easy at times. And I have actually had a possum cut their nose/face so bad digging through the buried wire that when I caught it to remove it from my fly pen, part of its nose and upper lip were left behind. I have never seen such self mutilization. Must have been one hungry critter. And after all that trauma, it never did get a bird.


Quazar - I would beg to differ with your opinion that they would not try to get into a loft. May not be their normal hunting grounds, but they tried on at least one occasion. I know of other times when possums were caught in chicken coops stealing eggs, and on several occasions, eating chicks. This happened on my in-law's farm. And although they are normally not that aggressive, be very careful if you get one cornered.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Its strange, as they dont normally dig either, unless they were really in starvation mode, but yes they do eat eggs also. 
They are wild animals, and I certainly wouldnt want to corner one.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Ross Howard said:


> Thanks spirit wings just what we in the country need more pigeon eaters. Fix up your pens get a dog leave a radio on over night whatever but don't make your problem our problem. We are not a dumping ground for feral cats , possum , **** etc . Look after your own we do.


I never even thought of a different solution. this critter should not be condemed because he wonderd on to a property with pigeons, or was attracted by them because we want them. really they are harmless if you shore your poutlry/pigeons up the way they should be, so no worries if one comes bumbling around. have to have some respect for mothers natures creatures IMO.


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## Ross Howard (Nov 26, 2009)

That's right spirit wings shore up your pens the way they should be & release them where you found them.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Ross Howard said:


> That's right spirit wings shore up your pens the way they should be & release them where you found them.


what is so hard to understand about taking a critter down the road to an unpopulated area/ forest where he will not get into trouble and releasing it. If peope decide to live in the woods or in the country these animals all are a part of it. I would not let it loose in someones back yard and that is what you are trying to make it out to be which is wrong.. I usually go places like my friends 200 acre place., no one living even near her, I release there allot of times.. Im not stupid.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

sw, no, you may not release them near other homes, but many do. I have seen it lots of times, where people will dump cats "in the country", on a dirt road, but very near houses. And they all end up at the house at the end of that dirt road. One summer we were at the park in our town with our dogs, and a guy drove up and released a few squirrels that had been emptying the bird feeders in his yard. He told us that in the last couple of months, he had released 18 squirrels there! Well that park had woods behind it, but also abutting it were homes. And a couple of the homes were very close to where he was releasing these problem animals. There are too many people out there that don't care about the problem they are creating for someone else, as long as they get rid of the problem. And most don't have a friend with 200 acres of woodland. Yes, people that live in the country do have to learn to live with these things, but I can sympathize with them not needing the problem made worse. And I think that is where Ross Howard was coming from with that comment. People should be more responsible about where they bring these animals. 

If you make your loft and aviary predator proof, as much as possible, then you don't have to make these pests some one elses problem. If people who have birds would put more effort and a little bit better materials into their lofts, they wouldn't have to worry about losing their birds. If you put value on your birds, then you shouldn't mind spending a bit more to keep them safe. Their safety is up to the keeper. If something gets in because you use cheaper materials, then that is your fault, not the animals, who is just doing what animals do. Build a safe environment for them, and they will be safe. There will always be predators around. No way around that.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Jay3 said:


> sw, no, you may not release them near other homes, but many do. I have seen it lots of times, where people will dump cats "in the country", on a dirt road, but very near houses. And they all end up at the house at the end of that dirt road. One summer we were at the park in our town with our dogs, and a guy drove up and released a few squirrels that had been emptying the bird feeders in his yard. He told us that in the last couple of months, he had released 18 squirrels there! Well that park had woods behind it, but also abutting it were homes. And a couple of the homes were very close to where he was releasing these problem animals. There are too many people out there that don't care about the problem they are creating for someone else, as long as they get rid of the problem. And most don't have a friend with 200 acres of woodland. Yes, people that live in the country do have to learn to live with these things, but I can sympathize with them not needing the problem made worse. And I think that is where Ross Howard was coming from with that comment. People should be more responsible about where they bring these animals.
> 
> If you make your loft and aviary predator proof, as much as possible, then you don't have to make these pests some one elses problem. If people who have birds would put more effort and a little bit better materials into their lofts, they wouldn't have to worry about losing their birds. If you put value on your birds, then you shouldn't mind spending a bit more to keep them safe. Their safety is up to the keeper. If something gets in because you use cheaper materials, then that is your fault, not the animals, who is just doing what animals do. Build a safe environment for them, and they will be safe. There will always be predators around. No way around that.


what does your no mean? Iam talking about a wild animal here, not a feral animal and esp not cats and dogs, so Im not really interested in that, as it never enterd my mind, so Im not the one to be preachy too find the offenders of your subject. something so simple as letting a oppossom go weither he was trapped or rehabbed should not be so hard to understand and no need to go off on a direction with domestic animals and what happens with poor choices of others.... even though Im sure it happens. what can I do about that subject?, It does not even pertain to me ATM. but great for you for telling others about your knowledge on the subject of pets being dumped.


The oppossom if rehabbed or trapped would be released in a place which it can thrive but not in a populated area.. plain and simple. the picture the thread starter posted is an oppossom is'nt it? (yes that is supposed to be sarcastic)


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> what does your no mean? Iam talking about a wild animal here, not a feral animal and esp not cats and dogs, so Im not really interested in that, as it never enterd my mind, so Im not the one to be preachy too, something so simple as letting a oppossom go weither he was trapped or rehabbed should not be so hard to understand and no need to go off on a direction with domestic animals.. even though Im sure it happens. what can I do about that subject?, It does not even pertain to me ATM. but great for you for telling others about your knowledge on the subject of pets being dumped.
> 
> 
> The oppossom if rehabbed or trapped would be released in a place which it can thrive but not in a populated area.. plain and simple. the picture the thread starter posted is an oppossom is'nt it? (yes that is supposed to be sarcastic)


What is so hard to understand that people living in the country are tired of people dumping both domesticated and wild animals near their property? That was my point. People do it all the time, so people living in the country are sick of it. If they would bring a wild animal to a place far from other homes, fine. But many times they don't. I'm pretty sure when rehabbers release, they do so in a place away from homes, as they don't want the animals to be someone elses problem. And they want them to be safe. Most people don't care.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

don't hurt me, i'm just trying to survive in a world taken over by humans


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

altgirl35 said:


> don't hurt me, i'm just trying to survive in a world taken over by humans


Aww! That's cute!. I know..............it isn't their fault. They are just trying to survive. We get them in our yard on occasion too. They don't bother me. I know they can't get to my birds, and they mind their own business, and I let them be. Eventually they will move on.


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## Ross Howard (Nov 26, 2009)

Well said jay 3 up here in Canada the MNR allows us to live trap wild critters fix the trouble spot if they got in to something & release un harmed 100' from where you trapped them. Most folks don't realize that if you release away from there home area other critters take exception to the stranger ( like you would in your home) & kill , injure etc the stranger who ends up dying a slow death , illness etc. So it's really not the best thing to do if you really care for the critter. Being l live right beside a 300 acre forest in a very rural area I have had to make my pens very critter proof , dogs , lights , heavy wire good wood etc but just recently had a possum rip a hole in a corner over night .& kill a hen. I repaired the hole with tin caught the possum in trap next night when it came back for more . Shook the hell out of the trap , let the dogs give him hell barking .& banging the trap , poured water on him & turned him loose back in the forest (his home)& so far no more problems with him. Just sayin where you found him leave him just make it unpopular for them there .


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Jay3 said:


> What is so hard to understand that people living in the country are tired of people dumping both domesticated and wild animals near their property? That was my point. People do it all the time, so people living in the country are sick of it. If they would bring a wild animal to a place far from other homes, fine. But many times they don't. I'm pretty sure when rehabbers release, they do so in a place away from homes, as they don't want the animals to be someone elses problem. And they want them to be safe. Most people don't care.


Im not even going to mention domestic animals.
why was it your point? did I say I thought someone should do that? not sure why it was even brought up. but thats ok. If one lives in the country how would one know where a possum came from anyway...lol.. oh my goodness. I might see one tonight, I live in the country and then I will be sure to get mad because someone COULD of dumped it off.. my birds are protected so no worries anyway.. which makes me think what the point of all this crap is for anyway..


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Personal reflections - 
When a wild animal gets caught, injured, etc., in an urban environment, and is taken by animal control, or a rehabber, what do they do when the animal is heathy again. They rarely release it back into an urban environment, depending on the species. They take the majority outside city limits. 

Although I'm sure there is concern for human/animal interaction, the main concern is for the well being of the animal. I am very aware that we all have possum, deer, ****, fox, coyotes, even turkeys all around suburbia and even in downtown areas. But the chances of an animal being injured or killed are dramatically greater in town than in the country. 

If the animal is unhurt and is not causing any problems, then leave it alone. But if an animal is injured, become too populated in one area, or is trapped for whatever reason, I think the animal stands a lot better chance of survival being let loose where they don't deal with cats, dogs, humans, cars, etc. 

There is also the concern for disease control. I personally would rather not take a chance on a rabid animal being around my neighborhood. A healthy animal will probably never be noticed unless you have something it wants, or it gets caught in a trap. Our pets are normally given shots to prevent disease such as rabies and distemper.

As already pointed out, there are way to many domestic animals being let loose in the country. These animals do not belong there. But releasing a wild animal back into the wild has the best interest of the animal at heart. If there are already to many of that species in the area, the new animals will usually move on until they find a place of their own. This doesn't create more of a problem for those living in the country. I bet that no one would even notice a wild animal release unless they actually saw it happen. The DNR and other groups routinely release birds and animals back into the wild to increase the populations of turkey, pheasants, and endangered species. I personally think releasing an animal back to the wild causes no harm to humans, or to other animal populations.


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## egpigeon (Jan 15, 2008)

wow .. monster


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> Im not even going to mention domestic animals.
> why was it your point? did I say I thought someone should do that? not sure why it was even brought up. but thats ok. If one lives in the country how would one know where a possum came from anyway...lol.. oh my goodness. I might see one tonight, I live in the country and then I will be sure to get mad because someone COULD of dumped it off.. my birds are protected so no worries anyway.. which makes me think what the point of all this crap is for anyway..


Don't know why you seem so defensive over this? I didn't say that you said someone should do that. Ron Howard made a comment, and I could see his point. Everybody dumps every animal they don't want in their area, in his area. Why should he not mind that? If people would not do that, it would be nice. Just seems that if everyone made their lofts safe, then they wouldn't have to be making problems for someone else. The problem animal will leave when it can't get to the food. If people were more considerate of where them dump their problems, that would be nice too.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Ross Howard said:


> Well said jay 3 up here in Canada the MNR allows us to live trap wild critters fix the trouble spot if they got in to something & release un harmed 100' from where you trapped them. Most folks don't realize that if you release away from there home area other critters take exception to the stranger ( like you would in your home) & kill , injure etc the stranger who ends up dying a slow death , illness etc. So it's really not the best thing to do if you really care for the critter. Being l live right beside a 300 acre forest in a very rural area I have had to make my pens very critter proof , dogs , lights , heavy wire good wood etc but just recently had a possum rip a hole in a corner over night .& kill a hen. I repaired the hole with tin caught the possum in trap next night when it came back for more . Shook the hell out of the trap , let the dogs give him hell barking .& banging the trap , poured water on him & turned him loose back in the forest (his home)& so far no more problems with him. Just sayin where you found him leave him just make it unpopular for them there .




LOL. I've done the same with neighbors cats that come around and sit under my songbird feeders all day. Trap them, then let the dogs terrorize them for a bit, then when you let them go, they will think twice about hanging around in your crazy yard. LOL. 

It's true that when an animal is released to another area, they often don't make it. Either there isn't enough of their natural food in that area, or the animals that have already claimed that area will run him out. I can see killing rats, as they breed so fast and would over run an area quickly. But most wild animals will just eventually go on their way if you don't make it easy for them to get food, which is what they are after. That's up to us.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

i even have a heart the rats, i take them into the woods away from houses, buildings and roads
they may not make it, but at least i gave them a chance, because sooner or later someone is going to poison them, then a raptor or something else will eat them and become poisoned


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Jodi, I tried that in the beginning. Didn't work. It depends on where your are, and your circumstances. When you live near the woods and a river, and your neighbor is leaving food out for feral cats, and that food brings everything up from the woods and river, including rats, well it quickly goes downhill from there.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Im sure my pigeons and other outdoor poultry birds brings everything up from the woods too, Im not getting rid of my birds or stop keeping them. they are attracked close to homes for many reasons.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes they are many things that will bring them. But not like cat food left out, and where they can get it. When we finally had to call exterminators, and the guy asked if anyone was leaving out cat food, as that is their favorite, and they can smell it for a mile away. If there is a food source that they can get at to eat, they will keep coming back. Then they start living and breeding near that food source.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

it's me bringing them LOL!! it's my bird feeders, and i don't want to stop feeding the birdies, so i'm just hoping to keep the numbers down


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Then if they are not allowed to feed the cats..what happens to the cats starve?..euth ? so then you have someone else not happy about their poor kitties in the woods. if they are trapped then what happens to the wild cats.. they can't be tamed, so something uncomfortable seems like it needs to happen to solve your rat attracked to cat food problem

I got it.. no food for the cats except for rats they catch. I bet Jodi will not be releasing any of hers there..


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> Then if they are not allowed to feed the cats..what happens to the cats starve?..euth ? so then you have someone else not happy about their poor kitties in the woods. if they are trapped then what happens to the wild cats.. they can't be tamed, so something uncomfortable seems like it needs to happen to solve your rat attracked to cat food problem
> 
> I got it.. no food for the cats except for rats they catch.



Well they were slowly dying and predated by coyotes and such, so it was down to two females left. I offered to split the cost to get them fixed so that they wouldn't keep having babies, but the idiot didn't want to do that, as she likes feeding them. Sure................keep helping them to breed so they can suffer and get sick and freeze in the winter with no one to take them to a vet or give a damn. Lots of places they will trap and fix them so they stop breeding. They will die off on their own as they don't generally live very long out there on their own. They are cold and sick all winter, and they have run ins with other animals that could be rabid. It's an awful life for them.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Has anyone here heard of CWD? Chronic wasting disease. It is a horrible disease that effects deer and elk. We started getting the disease in southern Wisconsin and it has caused us a lot of grief in our deer population. It is spread when deer congregate in one area to feed, whether in their natural feed lots in the wild, *OR* because humans put out feed plots, feeder stations, or even bird feeders. We think we are helping Mother Nature feed her offspring when we are causing the spread of disease that kill many animals. Our legislature has passed a law banning any form of feeding deer in the affected areas.

The same can be said for leaving feed out for other animals. Bears that acclimate to human garbage end up getting killed as pest animals. Coyotes and raccoons are shot on site when they come into contact because humans have left garbage around. Most areas that have some kind of animal complaints can be traced back to something that humans have done, including feeding feral cats.

And bringing wild/feral animals into where you might also be feeding your pets increases the chance of pets getting fleas, ticks, diseases, and being attacked by these same animals.

Feral cats are usually capable of living off the land. Especially if there are high numbers of rats, mice, voles, and other natural prey animals. If they isn't enough food for them in one area, they will normally move on until they find food somewhere else. Too many people who feed ferals, end up with bigger problems with wild animals. No cat food left outside, no wild critters sneaking into your yard looking for a free meal. Left to their normal devices, most animals will not come into contact with human habitats.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

almondman said:


> Has anyone here heard of CWD? Chronic wasting disease. It is a horrible disease that effects deer and elk. We started getting the disease in southern Wisconsin and it has caused us a lot of grief in our deer population. It is spread when deer congregate in one area to feed, whether in their natural feed lots in the wild, *OR* because humans put out feed plots, feeder stations, or even bird feeders. We think we are helping Mother Nature feed her offspring when we are causing the spread of disease that kill many animals. Our legislature has passed a law banning any form of feeding deer in the affected areas.
> 
> The same can be said for leaving feed out for other animals. Bears that acclimate to human garbage end up getting killed as pest animals. Coyotes and raccoons are shot on site when the come into contact because humans have left garbage around. Most areas that have some kind of animal complaints can be traced back to something that humans have done, including feeding feral cats.
> 
> ...


you should wright an article and have it published.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> Then if they are not allowed to feed the cats..what happens to the cats starve?..euth ? so then you have someone else not happy about their poor kitties in the woods. if they are trapped then what happens to the wild cats.. they can't be tamed, so something uncomfortable seems like it needs to happen to solve your rat attracked to cat food problem
> 
> I got it.. no food for the cats except for rats they catch. I bet Jodi will not be releasing any of hers there..


oh lordy don't get me started on cats


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Every year there are hundreds/thousands of animals born to wild parents. Every year these new born animals grow up and have to find their way to their own living areas. Many times they will come into contact with their own species that have already established territories. There will be conflict, but this is natures way and cannot be avoided. This is one reason why they come into contact with humans. Then there are obvious problems.

I don't personally see any difference between baby's growing up and being forced to find new areas, and freeing trapped animals into rural areas. The people living on farms, farmettes, or country estates already have a population of animals living side by side with them. One more "city problem" opposum is not going to cause that rural land owner any more problems than they might already have with any existing animals. If the land, woods, and fields already support the species, a released animal should be able to survive.

For the record, I am against any pet animals being let loose in either city, or rural areas to fend for themselves.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

my sister was getting ready to take a "dead" possom and bury him...untill he woke up...lol.. glad he did. they are welcome here as my lofts/coops are secure.


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## Tuule (Nov 30, 2010)

Feral cats and the people they plague is a vicious cycle of not being able to do much about it...the government and society in general make it really difficult to do anything about the excess in cats, some of the only options in Montana are to capture all of them yourself and take them to the humane society, or if you have a feral cat organization come out all they want to do is capture all of them spay/neuter and bring them right back to your property...while the last makes the population stop or at least hinder growth it didn't get rid of the problem of too many cats.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

spirit wings said:


> my sister was getting ready to take a "dead" possom and bury him...untill he woke up...lol.. glad he did. they are welcome here as my lofts/coops are secure.


Surprise, surprise!!!!! Lucky she didn't get to meet its teeth. 😖

Tuule - my sister-in-law started feeding ferals in her barn's milk house. She had a trap door that allowed her to catch the cats and have them neutered. So far so good. She kept them for vermin control. Unfortunately, the cat food she left out to supplement their diet also attracted raccoons. My brother-in-law has now had to shoot 12 raccoons since the end of January and has been attacked twice when he was feeding hay out of the barn. He is now wanting to shoot not only the *****, but the cats too. Vicious circle.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

almondman said:


> Surprise, surprise!!!!! Lucky she didn't get to meet its teeth. &#55357;&#56854;
> 
> Tuule - my sister-in-law started feeding ferals in her barn's milk house. She had a trap door that allowed her to catch the cats and have them neutered. So far so good. She kept them for vermin control. Unfortunately, the cat food she left out to supplement their diet also attracted raccoons. My brother-in-law has now had to shoot 12 raccoons since the end of January and has been attacked twice when he was feeding hay out of the barn. He is now wanting to shoot not only the *****, but the cats too. Vicious circle.


awww come on, so 12 raccoons have died because she feeds feral cats!!!
so ignorant!


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## Tuule (Nov 30, 2010)

altgirl35 said:


> awww come on, so 12 raccoons have died because she feeds feral cats!!!
> so ignorant!



I agree that ignorance may or may not be part of feral cat problems, however the ones feeding them are the victims...They are simply trying to do what they feel is right. We Humans are the ones who made the domestic cat, and though there are many responsible pet owners, there are equal bad pet owners who refuse to spay/neuter their animals or are too unintelligent to keep their unfixed cats inside where they cant cause problems for other people.

I love all animals, but my main love is for MY animals, and any that threaten them via bodily harm, stress or disease will be dealt with accordingly, be it a wild animal, feral cats or even uncontrolled house pets.

What I'm getting at is that all animals are cute at some point, racoons, possums, rats, kittens, etc...but the second they pose a threat to what is mine, cute doesn't matter, problems will be solved.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

altgirl35 said:


> awww come on, so 12 raccoons have died because she feeds feral cats!!!
> so ignorant!


I don't think the raccoons that he met were acting as cute as the one in your picture. Two or more were attacking the cats as they both tried to feed. And if you know anything about raccoons, and it appears you do, they can be very testy as adults. I would positively protect myself against any animal that tries attacking me, unless it was defending its young, or I had inadvertently cornered it somehow. And then it would depend on how aggressive it was acting. 

And I don't appreciate having my opinions or thoughts being called "ignorant". We are all entitled to our thoughts and ideas. And reporting facts is never ignorant. And neither is protecting yourself, or what is yours.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

i''m not talking about the cats
that's a whole monster problem all on it's own
i am against cats being outdoors, whether feral or pets, period
they do not belong roaming free in our country and are a devasting invasive species, period
deterring wild animals that belong here is a simple humane way to deal with wildlife
we have encroached on everything they need to survive
why does "protecting" what yours mean it's okay to kill everything in sight because your to cheap or lazy to really protect and maintain your property
if you can afford bullets, guns and traps
try investing in some quality wire, wood and elbow grease


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

i gotta check out of this thread, unless your a rehabber, you will never understand 
unless you get the ripped up animals from cats you will never understand
unless you get the poor bird or mammals suffering from bullet wounds you will never understand
unless you pour months of struggle to raise orphans of those mothers who's lives were stolen from them you will never understand


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## Tuule (Nov 30, 2010)

I am also against cats being outdoors, i have two strictly indoor cats and loathe when others let their animals roam on my property.

We have taken most of what a lot of wild animals need to live, however, racoons and other such creatures love eating what we throw away and are drawn to the city like moths to a flame. They thrive in and near cities, i do not condone random killing, however, nature will not miss the ones who stay too long where they shouldn't if they meet an untimely end. 

I am not simply talking about loft protection, when my outdoor loft is complete, it will be secure and i will not worry about critters getting in to pester them, i am referring to feces carrying diseases that can be tracked indoors to my animals, all forms of protection can be penetrated at some point, after that what then?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

almondman said:


> Every year there are hundreds/thousands of animals born to wild parents. Every year these new born animals grow up and have to find their way to their own living areas. Many times they will come into contact with their own species that have already established territories. There will be conflict, but this is natures way and cannot be avoided. This is one reason why they come into contact with humans. Then there are obvious problems.
> 
> I don't personally see any difference between baby's growing up and being forced to find new areas, and freeing trapped animals into rural areas. The people living on farms, farmettes, or country estates already have a population of animals living side by side with them. One more "city problem" opposum is not going to cause that rural land owner any more problems than they might already have with any existing animals. If the land, woods, and fields already support the species, a released animal should be able to survive.
> 
> For the record, I am against any pet animals being let loose in either city, or rural areas to fend for themselves.



I'll bet that guy living next to the park where just one guy released 18 squirrels wouldn't agree with you.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

altgirl35 said:


> i gotta check out of this thread, unless your a rehabber, you will never understand
> unless you get the ripped up animals from cats you will never understand
> unless you get the poor bird or mammals suffering from bullet wounds you will never understand
> unless you pour months of struggle to raise orphans of those mothers who's lives were stolen from them you will never understand


I have been a rehabber. I have spent most of my adult life working with animals. Over 35 years! * I think I understand* But I also understand the harsh realities that people face when wild animals come into contact with us humans, and our pets, farm animals,etc. If I have animals worth hundreds to thousands, and a coyote starts killing my livestock, guess which one is going to lose. If I have cared enough to spend hundreds of dollars neutering my cats, and providing a home for other peoples strays, and a raccoon attacks those cats, guess who's going to lose. In a perfect world, all God's creatures would live in harmony, but guess what, it's not a perfect world. So those of us that care do the best we can, those of us that have invested money in our pets, livestock, etc. will do whatever we have to to protect our animals and our investments, whether they are pigeons, feral cats, or a prize sheep. 

It is a sad world that animals will die before their time. But neither of us can change that fact. All we can do is to keep our animals as best we can, and if we need to protect them at some point from other animals so be it. If that's *ignorance* then call me stupid.


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## Vova (Mar 27, 2012)

almondman said:


> Every year there are hundreds/thousands of animals born to wild parents. Every year these new born animals grow up and have to find their way to their own living areas. Many times they will come into contact with their own species that have already established territories. There will be conflict, but this is natures way and cannot be avoided. This is one reason why they come into contact with humans. Then there are obvious problems.
> 
> I don't personally see any difference between baby's growing up and being forced to find new areas, and freeing trapped animals into rural areas. The people living on farms, farmettes, or country estates already have a population of animals living side by side with them. One more "city problem" opposum is not going to cause that rural land owner any more problems than they might already have with any existing animals. If the land, woods, and fields already support the species, a released animal should be able to survive.
> 
> For the record, I am against any pet animals being let loose in either city, or rural areas to fend for themselves.


Virginia opossums are not native to the west coast so it doesn't really matter. If anything they bring harm to native animals, not as much as humans and defiantly not as much as the domestic cat that caused countless native animals to go extincted around the world. 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_opossum


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

All this started over one little opossum. Amazing! Nothing wrong with letting him go in the wild, as long as it isn't somewhere where he will become a problem to someone else, is all I was saying. Too many people don't think about that. But as Jodi mentioned, if we build our lofts so that predators cannot get our birds, it makes things a lot easier. That doesn't always solve the problem, but it does help.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> I'll bet that guy living next to the park where just one guy released 18 squirrels wouldn't agree with you.


I bet he wouldn't either. Thus the need to take such animals to rural areas for release rather than creating problems in a park. *Or don't trap them at all.*
I am against trapping/removal of animals except as a last resort. But it can be the only option at some point.

I totally disagree with that person's reason for trapping them. There are many ways to squirrel prove your bird feeders. Either be willing to spend the extra money to buy squirrel prove feeders, or buy feeders and feed just for the squirrels and place them as far away from the bird feeders as you can. His reasoning and actions are wrong.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Don't think the guy realizes that if he removes the dominant squirrels in his yard, that the others will just move in. That's why he just keeps catching them. He removes them...............and more will just move in.


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## altgirl35 (Sep 5, 2008)

No the ignorance is not about protecting livestock
The ignorance is leaving food out at night that obviously will attract wild hungry animals, then killing them, and of course they are going to fight for that food, so stop putting food out at night, geez
It would be like putting tying a pigeon on top of a loft and getting mad when a hawk comes down for the tied up bird and killing the hawk 
And i Didn't say you were ignorant


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It's true that if the cats were fed during the day, they would soon learn that. They would come then, and it wouldn't have to be left out at night when other wild creatures were around. This could be avoided. It is a shame that so many innocent animals had to die. I think that is what she called ignorant. So many animals being killed when it could have been avoided. They were just doing what animals do. If you leave food out, they are going to come.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

I am a great believer in responsible care of all animals. Everything that people have said here is very true. But as long as people don't take responsibility for their animals, there will be feral cats. I am sure that my brother and sister-in-law were trying to be animal lovers when they spent all that money getting the cats fixed. They did not create the problem, but cared enough to take these animals in to their care, and responsible enough to get them fixed after the cats were dropped off by other, less responsible people. 

They, and many people like them, do what they can to help solve a problem that is not of their making. But I don't think it's right to call something ignorant, because they don't take them inside, and do protect them from other wild animals. Is this really any different from all the people who take in feral pigeons? 

They have been fixed, they are provided with food and water, and they will die 
when it is their time. They are also provided with Vet care. In the meantime, the cats are in good health, are not repopulating, and have a great existence compared to what they might have otherwise.


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> It's true that if the cats were fed during the day, they would soon learn that. They would come then, and it wouldn't have to be left out at night when other wild creatures were around. This could be avoided. It is a shame that so many innocent animals had to die. I think that is what she called ignorant. So many animals being killed when it could have been avoided. They were just doing what animals do. If you leave food out, they are going to come.


The cats are fed early morning, but the feed can is kept in the milk house to prevent mice and rats coming up to the house. It is stored in a metal can with a lockable lid, but there is still a smell from the feed. Part of the bigger problem is the **** have tried to take up residence in the hay loft where many of the cats have made a home. The cats and **** simply do not like sharing the same space. And it would not work to lock up the feral cats. 

It might not be right to city folk, but along with the cat/**** problem many farmers consider **** as vermin, just like mice and rats that invade their grain bins. ****, deer, and turkey all eat and destroy the farmers corn crops and farmers can actually recieve payment for damages. Whether you think it's right or wrong, farmers do not take kindly to animals that take money out of their pockets.

If the cat holes are covered to prevent the **** from getting in, the cats have very few other places to go. A real Catch 22. I am not saying that shooting the **** is the best answer, but it seems to be the only one given the situation they are dealing with. 

I know that this has been beat to death, but there is always the other side that people should be aware of. As said before, I have spent a great deal of time with animals. I DO understand each and every argument presented here. And, for the most part, I don't disagree. But it is what it is. This debate has been going on since the pilgrims starting clearing land and started pushing wildlife out of their natural habitat.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Could the raccoons be trapped and moved to the country? Or would they not survive?


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## almondman (Aug 22, 2009)

This is in the country. My in-laws run 200 acres with about 120 in crops. I'm sure they could be trapped, but that is not the mindset for most farmers, and definitely not for my in-laws. Again, their mindset would see it as taking one persons problem, and giving it to someone else. They see all animals and birds that eat and/or destroy their crops as vermin. They only see live vermin as begeting more live vermin. If you kill the parents, there will be no offspring is a favorite saying in their area. And, except for protected species like bop, the Wisconsin DNR goes along with the"controlled and humane" euthanasia of vermin. There are even extended hunts in Wisconsin for deer and turkey. Wardens will tell you that it is to contol population growth, but most farmers will tell you that it is also to help control crop damage that costs our state millions. We even have a bill trying to legalize a wolf hunting season, even though they are the alpha predator up north to control the deer herd there. 

There is also the fear of animals spreading fleas, ticks, and diseases. Raccoons and possum are two of the biggest carriers here, along with bats. So it is like talking to a wall trying to explain the other side of this to them. Even though most farmers are animal lovers by nature, nothing had better stand in the way of their profits.

As I think I may have overstayed my welcome here, I better say good night. At least on this thread!


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Hope I can put this gently. Dad's farm has slowly become surrounded on 2 sides with housing developements. Deer have now become over populated. There are no natural predators any more for them. Our farm has become a favorite hunting place. We want them gone as they destroy our crops that we make a living from. We had an idiot neighbor that was new to the neighbor hood behind my dad's farm complain to the law about hearing gun shots. An officer came out to the farm and asked why there was so much gun fire. Simple answer it is deer season and there had been 2 killed that day. And our question was do you call 2 shot alot of gun fire. He left and came back and said the idiot did not want another deer harmed as she put out a salt block to ATTRACK them to her back yard so she could watch them. The officer knew we were in the right and she was actually breaking the law by baiting deer as someone else posted about the CWD problem. Luckily we have not had that problem with CWD locally. Due to disease it is illegal to remove a wild animal from the place it was trapped while living. I tend to relocate them even though it is illeagal across the river in a further away from people location.

Feral domestic animals are a different matter and my dad's farm before the last housing development went in was a dumping ground for dogs and cats all that could be touch were taken to the animal shelter. But sorry to say alot of them became target practice for deer season as a hungry dogs will always attack goats. To me there is no difference in me shooting them or them going to humane society to be put down. I have rehomed many personally without them even going to humane society.


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## Vova (Mar 27, 2012)

honeyrobber said:


> Hope I can put this gently. Dad's farm has slowly become surrounded on 2 sides with housing developements. Deer have now become over populated. There are no natural predators any more for them. Our farm has become a favorite hunting place. We want them gone as they destroy our crops that we make a living from. We had an idiot neighbor that was new to the neighbor hood behind my dad's farm complain to the law about hearing gun shots. An officer came out to the farm and asked why there was so much gun fire. Simple answer it is deer season and there had been 2 killed that day. And our question was do you call 2 shot alot of gun fire. He left and came back and said the idiot did not want another deer harmed as she put out a salt block to ATTRACK them to her back yard so she could watch them. The officer knew we were in the right and she was actually breaking the law by baiting deer as someone else posted about the CWD problem. Luckily we have not had that problem with CWD locally. Due to disease it is illegal to remove a wild animal from the place it was trapped while living. I tend to relocate them even though it is illeagal across the river in a further away from people location.
> 
> Feral domestic animals are a different matter and my dad's farm before the last housing development went in was a dumping ground for dogs and cats all that could be touch were taken to the animal shelter. But sorry to say alot of them became target practice for deer season as a hungry dogs will always attack goats. To me there is no difference in me shooting them or them going to humane society to be put down. I have rehomed many personally without them even going to humane society.


That must be a sucky predicament to be in. I have two Siberian Huskies that scare away all the deer out of my garden


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Humans never seem happy no matter which way it is..lol.. example
"oh I looooove nature! see the cute pretty animals! lets help them!"

and then.. "Dang nab it critters gettin in my garbage and eating my crops! kaboom goes the gun!."..


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