# Adopted a sick bird I am trying to save.



## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Someone asked me to take a young sick bird off their hands. I couldn't refuse. This little guy has been severely pecked, has mites (I already dusted) and a wound on his head I am not sure what it is. I have attached some pictures of him or her. Can anyone help with diagnosing and treatment for this head wound? Please! He has lasted this long in an over-crowed, neglected coop, he's got to be a fighter. I have kept him away from my new coop. He is in the house in a dog kennel.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Thank you for rescuing him. He is a cutie! Someone more knowledgeable than I am should respond soon.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

He is eating food, red grit and drinking water. I just want to get this wound treated ASAP since he is such a fighter. I told my granddaughter it will be our ugly duckling!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Wash with saline and cover it with Neosporin. To make saline solution, boil a quart of water, and add to it 1 tablespoon of salt. Use it warm to clean off the wound, then apply the neosporin. Then apply the Neosporin once daily. It should heal okay.
Poor baby. He's very cute.
Looks like he was attacked by older male pigeon. At least it's usually a male. Too bad.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

THANK YOU! I knew you would know and could help!! The person who had him has an over crowded coop and does not keep it very clean. I think she thought he would expire and when he didn't she felt bad and asked me if I would try and save him. Tonight he looks so happy to just be comfortable and not to hid in a corner and be pecked. His appetite is good, so if I can just get his head healed, he has a good chance. 
So this is what a wound looks like on a pigeon when it has been excessively pecked?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

They call it scalped. The scab will eventually soften up from the Neosporin, and you will be able to gently clean it, and as you do, some of that will come off. It will heal. Keep it clean. I hope you are going to keep him. Would be a shame to give him back to a crowded loft like that.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Oh no! He is mine now. He looks better today already. Probably getting rid of the mites helped too. But mostly not being abused.
I'll keep you up to date on his progress.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Thanks. Glad you're keeping him. Were you able to get any of that dried blood and stuff off? Be careful though, as you don't want to start it bleeding. It will soften up some with the Neosporin.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

No I just did some saline compresses and then rubbed Neosporin on it. I didn't want to irritate by being too aggressive. He has a hard white piece in the area. Not sure what it is, but I tried to work in lots of Neosporin. 
It's 103 here today! My coop enjoyed another bath to cool off.
When should I reapply another coat of seven dust? I am not sure if what I can still see is dead.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Wow, that's hot! In time it will soften up and come off some. I wouldn't be too aggressive with it either. You did right. Is he still eating well?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

He is eating, food and grit. He seems stronger when I was treating his head this morning. I am sending 3 pictures from this morning to show you how it is progressing. He kind of looks like he is loosing a few more feathers on his head. Or maybe its because the black is shrinking. Do you think its doing better?
Sorry I don't know why I cant get the pictures to show right side up when I transfer them!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Oh I feel so bad for him. Poor little thing. Looks about the same to me, but he should improve. He's very lucky that you took him.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Thank you for helping the little guy! He's a cutie.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Thanks for tryna' help the bird out.
Glad to know he's doin' better.
Is that pox my eyes see on his head?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

PS: I'm sure you do!but be careful with the eyes when you treat him


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Thanks for the feed back. You asked "Is that pox my eyes see on his head?" What is that? Today the majority of the black scab fell off. I will post another picture probably tomorrow when I am treating his head.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

I think that yellow proliferation on its head is pox. Did that yellow thing fall off along with scab?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

No the yellow thing did not fall off. Here are this mornings pictures. What are pox and how do I treat it?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

*Advice for pigeon pox?*

I now have many questions. I have been reading up on pigeon pox. It must be in the early stages. I have read to use tea tree oil, along with many other suggestions. Also, support the pigeon for 4 weeks until it runs its course?
Questions for suggestions or advice PLEASE
1. Can a bird recover and be placed back into the avery with my other birds? 
One site said they will always be contagious and will be separately caged
forever. The other sites say no. 
2. My other 6 pigeons I got 2 weeks ago are from the same avery, they 
don't show signs but will they also get this virus? Is it too late to vaccinate? 
4. I got this little guy about a week after the first 6 when the person called 
and asked it I would consider taking him because he was being pecked to
death. He has been housed in my house in a cage since I brought him
home and have been treating him. 
5. What has anyone used on this virus and advice for your experience.
6. If I start using tea tree oil now to dry it up, will that lessen the spread and stop the advancement of this virus?
This is just awful! I was so excited yesterday when his scab from the pecking came off! I thought the little guy was home free!!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

The injury does look great. Not sure if that is pox or just from the injury. It's usually mosquitoes that carry the virus, although other biting insects can carry it also. If he has pox, then he will probably get more of those bumps. There is something under his eye also. The pox virus comes out on the skin where there is an absence of feathers. I wouldn't use tea tree oil so near his face and eyes. Keep a watch on him and see what develops. Make sure you use very good hand washing when you handle him. It is very catching to the other birds. If it is pox, he may get just a few, or may get many. If he does, and has a hard time eating or drinking, then you may have to hand feed him till he is well. No they don't carry it for life. Many believe they are then immune to it for life. But there are different strains, so maybe just be immune to that strain. If it is pox, it will in time dry up on its own. Too late to vaccinate when they have it. 
Still not sure that is what it is. It could just be chunks of him healing from the injury. He was pretty well chopped up.
I think you will have to come up with a very special name for this little one after all he/she is going through. You're doing a great job with him or her.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Thanks, again Jay3! If it is pox, how long will this virus last? When will I know if he is out of the wood to get it? And since my other birds outside in my coop came from the same place, will they get it too and should I vaccinate them in case they have been exposed before I got them? I sure hope this is just from the damage of the horrible pecking he endured!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well either he has it or he doesn't. All you can do is wait and see what happens with him. As far as y our other birds, if they were going to get it from their first home, then they would have it. Haven't you had them for over a month? 
As far as vaccinating, you can choose to or not. But not because of where they came from. It can get into any loft from mosquitoes or whatever. A lot of people do vaccinate, and it would have to be done yearly. All birds need to be done at the same time. Keep an eye on him to see how he does, and wash hands well after handling until you know. It's always a good idea to separate new birds anyway, for a month before putting with your birds.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Thanks for posting pics. Thank Lord that ugly scab fell off.
This does look like pox!!!
Please check the vent area and all over the body for more pox lesions. If there are more of such yellow lesions its pox, sorry. If you don't find any, keep a close watch for a couple of days for it.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

I recently had many cases of pox in a friend's loft. One young couldn't make it,rest of the nine have survived. If its pox, your bird needs supportive care,which ofcourse you're giving him.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

I now have many questions. I have been reading up on pigeon pox. It must be in the early stages. I have read to use tea tree oil, along with many other suggestions. Also, support the pigeon for 4 weeks until it runs its course?
Questions for suggestions or advice PLEASE
1. Can a bird recover and be placed back into the avery with my other birds? 
One site said they will always be contagious and will be separately caged
forever. The other sites say no.
There are different strains of pox. When a bird is attacked by the pox virus at young age and he survives,he becomes immune to it for life. Yes, its highly contagious. Make sure,mosquitos,external blood sucking parasites and flies can't get to the birds as they are common vectors. It can spread via almost all possible means though
2. My other 6 pigeons I got 2 weeks ago are from the same avery, they 
don't show signs but will they also get this virus? Is it too late to vaccinate? 
If they had gotton pox in their childhood they're probably immune to it. You can vaccinate them now if they're showing no signs
4. I got this little guy about a week after the first 6 when the person called 
and asked it I would consider taking him because he was being pecked to
death. He has been housed in my house in a cage since I brought him
home and have been treating him. 
Thanks for accepting him as a part of your pigeon family. But for now, keep him away from others,in open fresh air preferably if he has pox.
5. What has anyone used on this virus and advice for your experience.
You can give your pigeon the med that they give to children when they get chicken pox. Here an homeopathic med called variolinum is given to pox affected birds. Iodine can be applied on pox lesions externally. 
6. If I start using tea tree oil now to dry it up, will that lessen the spread and stop the advancement of this virus?
I haven't used tea tree oil. But tradionally old folks in Belgium used to apply,I mean they still apply some spices which gives results after three days of application. Please read pox related sticky:threads available on sick and injured doves/pigeons discussions forum, here on PT
This is just awful! I was so excited yesterday when his scab from the pecking came off! I thought the little guy was home free!!

Am I missing the 3rd point???


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Birds lookin good, any updated pics? Pox will run its course, keep him happy, well fed and watered and should be good to go.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

christispigeons said:


> Thanks for the feed back. You asked "Is that pox my eyes see on his head?" What is that? Today the majority of the black scab fell off. I will post another picture probably tomorrow when I am treating his head.


You are doing great for this poor little fella. Even if it is pox it will recover, don't worry. Just some special care is required which you are already taking. keep your other birds away from him and also place him somewhere mosquitos can't approach him else it may spread. He will be fine.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I cant tell you how much I appreciate all the advice and support I have received here! What a great resource and people!!!

These are from just now after I cleaned him and put more Neosporin on his head. He looked better before the cleaning, this tend to accentuate the yellow nodules. The one on his left nostril is much better from last pictures. And he is getting stronger every day. He squeak's and complains at me a lot now when I try to catch him, which is good. Before he just sat there and allowed me to pick him up and gave no fight. He eats and drinks good and likes his red grit. 
Once he is completely healed, all nodules gone, yellow gone and feathers grown back. How long before I know he is safe from spreading the virus so I can begin to introduce him to my other birds?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Just wanted to show a few pictures of my healthy birds outside in my coop. Thank goodness they are not showing any signs of pox!!! They are happy and healthy and I can't wait to start training they for outside fun! I have been working with them, getting them used to coming in the trap door. They act like they have already done that before. Only two hesitate for a few seconds. The others just went right through.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

What a bunch of white snow balls!
They're lovable. Thanks for sharing.

On the safe side, don't introduce the rescued bird to them for one more month. A new bird should be isolated for over a month anyway.

Pls keep posting!


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Really they are soooooo sweet... Snow balls!! nice name Jass. 
Thanks for the pic. 
Well how is little birdie doing? Any improvement?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

These are picture of the little one today. Still eating and drinking good. Some yellow falls off and some still there. He has a little spot in the middle that has a little puss on it that I am treating with Neosporin. But overall, he continues to get better each day.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You're doing a good job. Are you sure that isn't a feather caught inside there? Just wondering.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

No unfortunately! The pictures don't show this very well. But he is still do great. When I was done cleaning his wound, he started flapping his winds and I held his body with one hand and feet with the other so he couldn't take off and get hurt. But he loved the exercise. Now he is sound asleep in his cage!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Good. You wouldn't want a feather coming in there, where he's trying to heal up. 
He's very cute. Glad you got him.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

As for the POX! How long will my baby pigeon keep getting the sores that start out a pussy spot, then change into what looks like a shriveled yellow kernel of corn and then falls off? It's still only on the top of the head. The one on the nostril and close to the eyes are gone. And hopefully stay gone. But will he keep getting these sores for 4 weeks? I feel so bad for this little guy!

This is what he looked like tonight. This morning it was white when I cleaned it with salt water and then put Neosporin on it. Tonight it's yellowish and tomorrow morning it will look like the shriveled corn kernel. (Like the one to the right of it) Any additional advice or how long will this continue?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I still don't think it's pox. I think it's just from the attack. Have any of the other birds gotten pox where he came from? I'd ask the owner of the other birds, or go look at them myself. Think it's just the damaged tissues healing over.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

So glad to see the cute little guy is healing! Good idea to find out if the birds where he came from have pox or if it's just his injury healing.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

So keep cleaning with salt water and using Neosporin? No my other birds are showing no signs of this.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I don't mean your other birds. I mean the birds in the loft he came from. That is where he would have had to have caught it, if it were pox. Those bumps came out right away, so it it were pox, he would have had to have caught it there. If no other birds in that loft have it, then I doubt that it is pox.
I wouldn't keep cleaning it now. Just keep it covered with the Neosporin, and do keep it clean. If it were to get soiled somehow, then I would clean it. Otherwise, just let it heal.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Hey christispigeons,
Can you take the bird outside and take a closeup clear pic in natural light before applying neosporin when its not shiny?
Thanks


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

I think by other birds christispigeon means 3 others birds which were brought from the same loft? If I remember..


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

kiddy said:


> I think by other birds christispigeon means 3 others birds which were brought from the same loft? If I remember..


Yes, I know. But that is only 3 other birds. Knowing if any other birds in the whole loft, came down with pox would be interesting.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I took these pictures this morning Jaz Samoplay asked me to take a picture outside before I put Neosporin on. By looking at these, obviously his head looks much better after I clean and treat it. But these will be gone in a few days. This appear and then clear up in about 5 days. I hope they stop soon!
As far as going over and looking at the coop where I got my birds......well, it's a little tricky since she gave me 6 baby birds. And our idea of how to raise pigeons in a coop is completely 180 degrees. I will try. 
But my little guy is feeling so good he exercises his wings in his cage now and has got strong and vocal when I pick him up. Though he settles down and enjoys the contact when I hold him. 
Let me know if you guys have any advice after these pictures please.
Thank you!!


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

These pictures look horrible! He really does not look that bad!!! He doesn't look like this tonight. This is the only day I didn't clean him with the salt water. If he looks like this tomorrow I might start again!


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Thanks for sharing pics!
Woah! Okay!
If you say so we believe that it isn't that bad as it looks. But then why antibiotics aren't clearing this thing when the scab has already fallen off.
Either your bird has pox, and thankfully, along with your supportive care he has passed the virus course as you say two yellow proliferations have fallen off or your bird has developed something fungal. You might wanna try some antifungal on it but if you think neosporin is working, continue with it. Pls keep posting atleast until the bird gets fine.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

So with POX, as it runs its course, they don't continue to get this lesions that as they dry up turn into yellow and fall off? These clear up but others begin on his head in this area where he suffered the scalping. This area is under where the entire scab was. This showed up after it fell off. I was wondering if this is the process for the POX virus as it runs its course?
I will definitely keep you up dated.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

You won't believe, my friend had an exact same case as yours few weeks ago in his loft where ybs had pox months ago. I will post pic of the bird but now its healed. The yb was beaten badly by some other cock. First his head got swollen and was bleeding badly. After three days the swelling receded and scad started to form. As scab fell off, there comes the pox. The pox lesions showed up on the exact same spot where the yb was pecked at and from where scab fell off. (That doesn't mean your baby bird has pox.)
The virus ran its course and now the yb is fine. After the lesions ripe and fell off they never show up again. This is how pox works.
If the lesions on your bird are showing up again and again then don't wet the spot daily and try something else on...
Can you show it to a vet?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I was reading, again, this morning and I think I will just leave it alone for a few days and see what happens. If this doesn't help, I might try drying it up with tea tree oil. I could easily dab it on with a Q-tip and keep it out of his eyes. Something has got to stop these things to stop erupting under the skin. So maybe drying them up would help. But first I am going to just leave it and see what happens. He is getting watched very closely since he is in our family room.

What did your friend do to treat his pigeon. I would be interested to see a picture of his because I searched the internet for hours since he got this and haven't seen anything that looks like my little guy.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Does it not seem strange that the only bumps are on the site of the attack? Didn't go anywhere else. Here is a description of how the pox virus runs it's course. Do you see this in your bird?


Avian pox occurs in 2 forms, cutaneous (dry) and diphtheritic (wet). The cutaneous form is the most commonly observed and is a self-limiting infection with the lesions regressing and forming scars. Initially, this form of pox appears as a small white, pink or yellow vesicle (blister) on unfeathered parts of the skin (feet, legs, base of the beak, eye margins and head). The vesicle is a result of the separation of the surface layer of the skin with the formation of pockets of watery fluid rich in multiplying virus. The vesicles become nodules as they increase in size, coalesce and burst. Lymph from the cells congeals and scabs are formed. The surface of the nodules become rough and dry and the color changes to dark brown or black. The size and number of nodules present depends on the stage and severity of the infection. Bacteria may gain access causing secondary infection and resulting in a purulent discharge (pus) and necrosis. Eventually, the scab falls off and a scar forms at the site. It takes 2 to 4 weeks for complete healing of the affected areas on the skin providing the lesions aren't too extensive thereby preventing the bird from feeding.

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153-10370_12150_12220-26362--,00.html


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Yes, except for the color of the color the color being dark brown and black. And I'm not sure if they are saying they come at one time or continue to erupt over this time during the process of the virus. What would the bacterial infection, as a secondary look like? His wound does not smell. I am just wondering if my keeping it moist with Neosporin is keeping it from drying, therefore, continuing. So I am going to not put it on today and tomorrow and see what happens.
And yes, it has not went anywhere else, only where the scalping injury was on his head.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Leaving it alone may help you to see more how it is doing, but I'm sure that is what has kept infection away. With pox, they don't just go away. They dry up first. It usually starts with one and new ones come out as they go along.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Oh I had thought from what people had said that because they keep going away and others come, that POX doesn't normally do that. So I thought maybe the Neosporin was keeping it too moist. So do you think I should continue with the Neosporin to keep from infection? 
Just doing nothing feels like I am neglecting him.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm sure the Neosporin helped a lot. For healing the damage from the scalping, you wanted to keep it moist and clean. It isn't really raw anymore, but healing up, so you could probably let it go for a few days and see what develops. Since there is a question here of pox, just watch it to see how it goes for a few days.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Ok thanks. Just now when I cleaned his cage, he is the same as last night. No better, no worse. So we will see. He also is hitting my hand with his left wind when it gets near him. I like his spunk! But then when I cuddle him to my chest, his eyes start closing. I think he is just so tired of all this and want to go be a bird!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

They are adorable at that age.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Sorry I was out yesterday!
Here's the pic!
The pox lesions showed only at the head where he was pecked at. You can still see small under skin sort of lumps if you see closely.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I wish this looked like mine! Thanks for posting the picture for me. If this is what POX looks like, mine guy has something else. His bumps as they begin, are bigger and softer looking. You can see one coming in the 4th picture, over his left eye, on the left-side of the crease.
I have been just trying to let it run its course the last two days and haven't put anything on it. This is what his head looks like right now, this morning. Really no worse, no better. I am still going to just leave it and see if it will dry up on its own unless it starts looking infected.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

The bird in the pic I posted looked exactly like yours before. Its has just healed now.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Still think it is just the pecking wound trying to heal.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

So will the feathers grow back or is he going to look like a Bald Pigeon? Maybe the hawks will be scared of him and think he is a strange looking eagle?
Whatever it is, I just hope he heals soon. Before he imprints on us, like we have on him.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Usually the feathers will regrow. Would though depend on the damage.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> Still think it is just the pecking wound trying to heal.


I too, hope so... All I want is that the bird gets needed medications in time if its pox or something else. Cuz if pox over powers bird's immune it might become difficult for the bird to....
Every year I come across hundreds of pox cases in summers in people's loft. Pox is not that benign as we might think,in India and neighbouring conutries especially where mosquito numbers are high.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> So will the feathers grow back or is he going to look like a Bald Pigeon? Maybe the hawks will be scared of him and think he is a strange looking eagle?
> Whatever it is, I just hope he heals soon. Before he imprints on us, like we have on him.


Feathers once plucked when raw won't grow back. He's young , so he may bud out some feathers. But he will have some bald spots in his head.
He's back in the loft mingling with others and eats fine.

So now that you haven't washed the growths with water, are the growths containing any puss or do they have some water like substance in them. Try peeling off a tiny bit to find out!


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Jass SamOplay said:


> I too, hope so... All I want is that the bird gets needed medications in time if its pox or something else. Cuz if pox over powers bird's immune it might become difficult for the bird to....
> Every year I come across hundreds of pox cases in summers in people's loft. Pox is not that benign as we might think,in India and neighbouring conutries especially where mosquito numbers are high.


hey jass...some years ago when my young pigeons had pox....i went to the pet shop from where i brought my pigeons ....the owner who is a old guy said me to apply camphor and coconut oil to the pox. i did and only after 2 days pox was gone...only 2 months ago someone gave me injured pigeon full of pox around mouth and head....it couldnt make it due to bad injuries...but i tried my best to avoid pox to my pigeons from him but still some young pigeons got it...again i applied champor and coconut oil and puff 2 after days pox was gone....what do you say about it??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Jass SamOplay said:


> I too, hope so...* All I want is that the bird gets needed medications in time if its pox or something else. *Cuz if pox over powers bird's immune it might become difficult for the bird to....
> Every year I come across hundreds of pox cases in summers in people's loft. Pox is not that benign as we might think,in India and neighbouring conutries especially where mosquito numbers are high.



If it were pox, there are no medications. It would have to run its course.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Nare J said:


> hey jass...some years ago when my young pigeons had pox....i went to the pet shop from where i brought my pigeons ....the owner who is a old guy said me to apply camphor and coconut oil to the pox. i did and only after 2 days pox was gone...only 2 months ago someone gave me injured pigeon full of pox around mouth and head....it couldnt make it due to bad injuries...but i tried my best to avoid pox to my pigeons from him but still some young pigeons got it...again i applied champor and coconut oil and puff 2 after days pox was gone....what do you say about it??


Wow Naresh, Amazed to know if it works so well. So camphor dissolved in coconut oil?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Pox has to run its course.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

May be camphor has something to do with the virus and so it runs away in two days. Lol.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If camphor chased viruses, we would all be using it whenever we got viruses. LOL.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Not all viruses, just pox


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

a virus is a virus and has to run its course.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Now that I am leaving his head alone, he is still getting lesions but it appears more watery than pussy. One of his eyes is watering and drooping a bit today. I think it is from the lesion beginning above that eye but will have to wait and see. 
I am open to try to find and get some camphor (oil?) and use it with coconut oil. I will try anything other people have used and has seemed to help. For now though, I am going to continue watching him, as long as he doesn't get worse and continues to eat and drink good. 
I cant tell you guys what a wealth of information and wisdom from our advice has give much comfort and help to me!! THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> If it were pox, there are no medications. It would have to run its course.


Yes, no matter what, virus has to run its course. But we can do / give something which can alleviate the symptoms and help the bird get through the course. Something that gives him strength to fight the battle against the virus. The body will fight the virus only if it has the strength.

When we get common cold we do know that a virus causes this but we still take medicines so we feel comfortable and we can get pass the virus course comfortably.

As you know lesions are breeding grounds of the virus where they multiply. We can apply iodine and other traditionally used recipes to supress the virus and not give him favourable grounds to mutiply.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Yes nare and kiddy, previously in the very thread talked I about some spices which helps with the pox.
I'm not talking of them cuz we still aren't sure if its pox. But now that Christina says water is coming out of the lesions it does sound like pox. Coconut oil mixed with either saffron or camphor does help with the virus.

Or some iodine based ointment may also help like betadine


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I wouldn't say the lesion is "running water." As the last two opened they were shiny and clear looking inside as it opened instead of pussy looking. And then one just go the yellow looking covering and the other got a brown scab. You can see these in the pictures I just took and posted here. None of the yellow you see is puss. I felt it all and it dry. You can see in the picture that his left eye looks like its getting pulled up. I think it from the lesion above the eye. We will just have to wait and see. 
I will be glad to try anything that might help. I will look for camphor at a neighboring town heath food store. I live in a small town and might have to order it. I have coconut oil. I will give him a day or two more of nothing because it looks like things might be drying up.
His right side is almost looking normal! So I am hoping we are on the down hill side of this stuff!
*EDIT*EDIT*EDIT*
Darn it! I just saw in the picture due to it being magnified on here, that there is a lesion in that left eye, in the inside corner! Poor guy! And I'm sure there is nothing I can put in his eye. This just keeps going and going and going!!!!


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

kiddy said:


> Wow Naresh, Amazed to know if it works so well. So camphor dissolved in coconut oil?


no it doesnt dissolve in oil...maybe oil is used just to make it wet so that camphor would stick good to the pox..
and chritispigeons condition of this young looks bad, you should take action as soon as possible..


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Darn are you saying to start using camphor as soon as possible? How do you mix it with coconut oil, what amounts and how to apply it? Though it I s not going to help for the one in the eye that's just starting. I am hoping that's the only one he gets there!
Also, I read B complex and vitamins A & E in his water???


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

christispigeons said:


> Darn are you saying to start using camphor as soon as possible? How do you mix it with coconut oil, what amounts and how to apply it? Though it I s not going to help for the one in the eye that's just starting. I am hoping that's the only one he gets there!
> Also, I read B complex and vitamins A & E in his water???


sorry but i actually cant understand if its pox or something else....i didnt read the thread so i dont know what you are using now...but you can use camphor better than waiting....just take a little camphor and wet it with coconut oil and apply, simple!! and i get camphor powder from a ayurvedic shop here... i dont think vitamins are going to help in this but probiotics will surly do!!


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

O my, look at the eye


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Jass SamOplay said:


> O my, look at the eye


jass, is it pox??
its a young bird and lessons all over head, could'nt think anything else than pox!!!
christispigeons i would say apply camphor as soon as possible...it wont hurt at all!!! it may take a week for ur one to heal. apply camphor and coconut oil twice a day for a week..


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I am trying to find camphor powder somewhere in my driving area without having to order it. I see camphor oil when I search online. Does it work the same?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> I am off to try and find camphor powder for my little sick guy! I am so upset it went into his eye! Hopefully he doesn't end up losing sight in it. If camphor can get the head under control and cured, maybe it will stop progressing. If I can only find camphor oil, will it work the same as powder?


I think camphor cakes will be easier to get and their application too is easier. Dip an edge of the camphor cake into the oil and massage it onto the lesions. DO NOT let it get into the eye.

Yes Nare, it does look like pox but not sure!


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I got camphor powder and oil. I tried mixing it in melted coconut oil and couldn't get it to a consistency where I felt wouldn't possible fall or run into his eye. So I used the oil. Fingers crossed that applying this twice a day begins to heal his head. His eye is bad. It is swollen and you cant see the eye ball. I sure hope this is the only one he get in it!


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

christispigeons said:


> I got camphor powder and oil. I tried mixing it in melted coconut oil and couldn't get it to a consistency where I felt wouldn't possible fall or run into his eye. So I used the oil. Fingers crossed that applying this twice a day begins to heal his head. His eye is bad. It is swollen and you cant see the eye ball. I sure hope this is the only one he get in it!


just wet the camphor powder with oil and apply... i saw that camphor falls after it dry... but there will be a shine on the pox..... if you are using only coconut oil it will not help much...


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I am using camphor oil since I couldn't get the powder to work. I had bought both just in case. His eye is so swollen I am afraid it will get in it if it falls off.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I think he is looking better already after only 24 hours of using camphorI I will post a new picture tomorrow or the next day to show.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

christispigeons said:


> I think he is looking better already after only 24 hours of using camphorI I will post a new picture tomorrow or the next day to show.


i never tried camphor oil.. but as ur saying looks like its working...keep it up...


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

OK friends. Today there seems to be another batch of this stuff coming to the surface! You can see a few more bunps under the surface getting ready. This is the first black scab since the large pecking scab fell off initially. All others have been yellow scabs. He did look better yesterday. 
His poor eye makes him look pitiful! For his eye, I am just wiping it with a clean tissue and getting all the yellow out. It comes out very easily and a clear watery eye socket is shows. I am hoping when the swelling goes down on his head and eye, that his eye will center in its socket again. He is still eating and drinking and hitting my hand with his wing when I pick him up. So food, water and attitude are good signs....just waiting for this to be done!


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Four more pictures after I cleaned his wound and put camphor oil and crystal to coat it. My poor little guy!


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## gingerpoo (Jul 31, 2008)

wouldnt hurt to put colloidal silver drops in his eye. might help


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Thank you for the suggestion of colloidal silver drops. I just researched it on the internet, and I would have to order it, which would take days to get. Does anyone know of an eye drop or ointment I could use from a pet or farm store?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

christispigeons said:


> Thank you for the suggestion of colloidal silver drops. I just researched it on the internet, and I would have to order it, which would take days to get. Does anyone know of an eye drop or ointment I could use from a pet or farm store?


pox seems like has healed but eyes condition is bad...experienced member will help you on what can be put in his eyes....till that keep doing with camphor oil...


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> Four more pictures after I cleaned his wound and put camphor oil and crystal to coat it. My poor little guy!


Holy Canoli !!!
Have mercy on this poor bird, Big Mother!

Hope you're giving him vitamin supplements, acv and calcium already to boost his system to fight off pox. If you have electrolytes on hand give him twice weekly in drinking water.
A pox ridden bird stays fine until he eats, drinks and poops fine. Hope he continues to do so. Keep him in fresh air.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Nare J the pox has not cleared. It looks lik it is in the second set of pictures when the would is packed with campor crystal and campor oil. The set of pictures before those were take the same day BEFORE the treating of his head. It's just so frustration that they are not going away! I will continue with the camphor. 
Jass SamOplay exactly what type and of vitamin supplements, acv and calcium should I be giving and how much?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Braggs Organic ACV for gut balance and supplying him with probiotics, vitamin supplements and calcium for proper body functioning,vitality and strength and electrolytes to help him regain lost body salts, is what's gonna help him. Your other birds too,should get these things on weekly basis. Have you checked pigeon supply places? Like for pigeon elixir, calciboost etc.

Pox will take time to clear. It may take upto two weeks but something positive shall be observed after 3-4 days of application. If blisters are turning yellow and big then they're rippening after which they fall off.
Sorry, but his eye, I mean its making me fear for his life.
Hats off to you, you're taking so much pain helping this guy survive. Hope it pays off.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

You say "It may take up to two weeks but something positive shall be observed after 3-4 days of application." I have been treating him since I got him on June 5th. I got him June 5th. Its been 20 days. 
Is POX in the eye deadly? I know that's what he has because I saw it in one of the pictures I posted here. Is that why you say you fear for his life because of his eye? I am able to clean the yellow crushed stuff out twice a day very easily, leaving only clear liquid in the socket. I started giving him eye drops too. 
Again, why is the eye making you fear for his life?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> You say "It may take up to two weeks but something positive shall be observed after 3-4 days of application." I have been treating him since I got him on June 5th. I got him June 5th. Its been 20 days.


I meant after you started treating with camphor



christispigeons said:


> Is POX in the eye deadly? I know that's what he has because I saw it in one of the pictures I posted here. Is that why you say you fear for his life because of his eye? I am able to clean the yellow crushed stuff out twice a day very easily, leaving only clear liquid in the socket. I started giving him eye drops too.
> Again, why is the eye making you fear for his life?


You know what, okay leave it. I don't wanna be negative.
Can you take him to a vet?


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Jass you said out of 10 birds in your friend's loft 9 survived, only one couldn't make it. So why should we fear of this pox this time? The eye is really bad and it is painful to see him. Hope and pray he survives. 
I wonder how they make camphor oil. Seems it is camphor dissolved in some oil so doesn't seem much effective. Wish I could be of any help, camphor is easily available here.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Web MD online

Camphor is used topically to increase local blood flow and as a “counterirritant,” which reduces pain and swelling by causing irritation. *It is important not to apply camphor to broken skin, because it can enter the body quickly and reach concentrations that are high enough to cause poisoning.*

http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-suppl...ingredientid=709&activeingredientname=camphor

This bird should have been treated for canker.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Well, I guess it really doesn't matter now if it was POX, canker or I poisoned him with camphor because as I leave right now to go to work, he probably will not be alive when I come home. He's not eating or drinking today on his own and is weak. I have hand forced with an eye dropper water with electrolytes and vitamins. Stopped camphor today and used Neosporin and put some tetracycline cream in his eye. Nothing is going to help, I think hes just tired. It is so very sad! I have done all I could and worked very hard to save him but it just wasn't to be. Thank you all for your advice and input.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That is very sad. Never would have used the camphor though. I would have treated for canker and let him heal, which he may have without so much help.
I'm really sorry you lost him. It's very sad that he had to go through so much. I was pulling for him.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

I don't know what went bad with him but I know that sometimes nothing helps. No matter what you do. Really sad, the efforts shouldn't go in vain...


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

i hope he is still alive.....if yes start treating him for canker with 50mg flagyl ....
he is in great stress so canker may have developed which may be the reason he is not eating....but please dont lose hope


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

Jay3 said:


> Web MD online
> 
> Camphor is used topically to increase local blood flow and as a “counterirritant,” which reduces pain and swelling by causing irritation. *It is important not to apply camphor to broken skin, because it can enter the body quickly and reach concentrations that are high enough to cause poisoning.*
> 
> ...


i usually dont beleive everything written on internet....
when we burn camphor it spreads in the air...when we breath it do we get poisioned.??
i dont know about camphor oil but camphor powder is safe i have used it many times on pigeons....


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Oh no,
The bird's health look really bad. The pox virus has overpowered his system. Once that happens the birds falls victim to it.

Kiddy, the one we lost couldn't digest seeds anymore and would poop only if we gave him some water. His system was blocked. Others we handfed kept digesting and pooping normally hence came outta pox


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He isn't going to make it. He's probably gone by now. Poor thing.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Actually, he is still fighting. I only give him a 1% chance to survive at this point, but there's still a chance. I am force feeding him softened multigrain cheerios and probiotic vitamin water. Neosporin on his head and tetracycline eye cream his eye. He has a hard time standing up , his head wants to go backwards. I think the pox in his eye and directly above it have created a big mass and is effecting his brain. So he mainly sits in one spot and sleeps. Walking a straight line is something he can't do very well. He's most comfortable sleeping on his side in my hand. But the most important thing is he does not appear to be suffering! So I will continue until he appears to suffer or dies. I am an eternal optimist!!


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Ho.... and he is still pooping.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Yessss, I was really dying to hear something positive from you. I get stressed seeing negative posts. 
You are doing a fabulous job. But his eye looks really bad. Is there any improvement in eye? Pls keep feeding him. Really hope he makes it. 
Thanks a ton for the post


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Thank you for your kind post and positive thoughts. The support means a lot. I will keep the updates going.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

kiddy said:


> May be camphor has something to do with the virus and so it runs away in two days. Lol.


camphor is the basic ingredient for all antibiotics....so said a dr at abbott labs (they make medicines) i worked for a while ago.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> I wouldn't say the lesion is "running water." As the last two opened they were shiny and clear looking inside as it opened instead of pussy looking. And then one just go the yellow looking covering and the other got a brown scab. You can see these in the pictures I just took and posted here. None of the yellow you see is puss. I felt it all and it dry. You can see in the picture that his left eye looks like its getting pulled up. I think it from the lesion above the eye. We will just have to wait and see.
> I will be glad to try anything that might help. I will look for camphor at a neighboring town heath food store. I live in a small town and might have to order it. I have coconut oil. I will give him a day or two more of nothing because it looks like things might be drying up.
> His right side is almost looking normal! So I am hoping we are on the down hill side of this stuff!
> *EDIT*EDIT*EDIT*
> Darn it! I just saw in the picture due to it being magnified on here, that there is a lesion in that left eye, in the inside corner! Poor guy! And I'm sure there is nothing I can put in his eye. This just keeps going and going and going!!!!


i've used drugstore eye antibotics on my doves before......i'd go to the drug store and tell the pharmist what is going on and see what he suggests....take the picture. That's what i did, and the pharmist recommend and eye antibotic that was an "over the counter" drug for human eye inflamations.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> Actually, he is still fighting. I only give him a 1% chance to survive at this point, but there's still a chance. I am force feeding him softened multigrain cheerios and probiotic vitamin water. Neosporin on his head and tetracycline eye cream his eye. He has a hard time standing up , his head wants to go backwards. I think the pox in his eye and directly above it have created a big mass and is effecting his brain. So he mainly sits in one spot and sleeps. Walking a straight line is something he can't do very well. He's most comfortable sleeping on his side in my hand. But the most important thing is he does not appear to be suffering! So I will continue until he appears to suffer or dies. I am an eternal optimist!!


give him some baby applesauce.....that should perk him up alittle, also baby peas is good too.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

LeeLu said:


> camphor is the basic ingredient for all antibiotics....so said a dr at abbott labs (they make medicines) i worked for a while ago.


camphor is in "cold rub" (dollar store) it's a saave....stronger camphor content in "Blue Star" saave Walmart...camphor is also in CARMEX....all three are thicker than neosporne....i hope this baby is stil alive....maybe the pox in the eye has taken a toll on his energy level....i'd keep him warm and hold him as much as you can...they need that love touching to know you care, too.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

thanks for the update ......but please go to the human drugstore and buy flagyl tablets..for treating him for canker....he may have developed canker which is the reason he is not eating...


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

How's he holding up!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Think he has had canker all along, as I mentioned earlier. 
Unfortunately, you can't just go to the drugstore and buy the Flagyl here. It can be gotten at bird supplies online, or a vet. Most pet shops that sell tropical fish sell Fish Zole, which is Flagyl, but must make sure that it doesn't contain another drug for worms, which it sometimes does now. That is something that anyone who has birds needs to have on hand, as canker is very common.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

He might have canker but along with pox. I've seen canker nodules bursting out of mouth. Triches don't survive the open environment, as we all know. So when canker growths come out they sort of look like cracked black burnt or chapped skin not yellow or lesions like that


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Those lesions could also have been pus from infection. Birds don't have pus like humans. It is solid and looks like that.
As far as canker, any bird under that much stress should be treated for canker as well.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> Those lesions could also have been pus from infection. Birds don't have pus like humans. It is solid and looks like that.
> As far as canker, any bird under that much stress should be treated for canker as well.


i've never seen what canker looks like, mine are inside, but we are moving again...thinking of putting them in a dovecote on my patio outside...so i guess i will stock up on canker medicine ...i will gradually put them outside, might even change my mind, i love them inside with me, but i know they would love the freedom of outdoors...gonna find a balance my breeder flies his birds everyday...he says they fly around their house but would rather just set on the roof all day, staying close to their home. 

hoping we hear today how this poor baby is doing; i hope he is still alive!


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

He is still alive but barely. For the past two days he cant stand on his own without falling. He is very weak I am keeping him swaddled like a baby to keep him warm. Force feeding his Kaytee Exact and a probiotic/vitamin liquid. I keep expecting him to be dead each time I approach the cage, but he's still got a steady, rhythmic breathing and opens his one eye. His bad eye is actually looking much better. Since using the tetracycline cream in it, it has been clear and the eye ball is coming up to the eyelids with the swelling going down. I still think it is a miracle if he pulls through, but as long as he is fighting, I will too? 
And Yes LeeLu, I can tell he feels comfort when we hold him!
Thanks for all the suggestions and support.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> He is still alive but barely. For the past two days he cant stand on his own without falling. He is very weak I am keeping him swaddled like a baby to keep him warm. Force feeding his Kaytee Exact and a probiotic/vitamin liquid. I keep expecting him to be dead each time I approach the cage, but he's still got a steady, rhythmic breathing and opens his one eye. His bad eye is actually looking much better. Since using the tetracycline cream in it, it has been clear and the eye ball is coming up to the eyelids with the swelling going down. I still think it is a miracle if he pulls through, but as long as he is fighting, I will too?
> And Yes LeeLu, I can tell he feels comfort when we hold him!
> Thanks for all the suggestions and support.


Thanks for the update....have you named him? If so what is it....your dove is in my prayers, i so want him to live! Hold him as much as you can, he needs the LOVE and it gives him the feeling of safety which he needs especially since he is so weak. Thanks for swaddling him....also, i think the suggestions for canker medicine are good, it seems logical that the infection could go into his throat from his eye.......glad to hear his eye is better....would love another picture.....easier to keep him in my thoughts from a picture...miracles happen everyday....this dove is not meant to die...i know it in my heart... ...please don't give up on him; and by all means keep him warm!


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

christispigeons said:


> He is still alive but barely. For the past two days he cant stand on his own without falling. He is very weak I am keeping him swaddled like a baby to keep him warm. Force feeding his Kaytee Exact and a probiotic/vitamin liquid. I keep expecting him to be dead each time I approach the cage, but he's still got a steady, rhythmic breathing and opens his one eye. His bad eye is actually looking much better. Since using the tetracycline cream in it, it has been clear and the eye ball is coming up to the eyelids with the swelling going down. I still think it is a miracle if he pulls through, but as long as he is fighting, I will too?
> And Yes LeeLu, I can tell he feels comfort when we hold him!
> Thanks for all the suggestions and support.


Thanks a lot for not giving up, you are amazing. I really
hope he gets well and we all see a miracle. Glad that he is recovering his eye. I just love this baby.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

LeeLu said:


> Thanks for the update....have you named him? If so what is it....your dove is in my prayers, i so want him to live! Hold him as much as you can, he needs the LOVE and it gives him the feeling of safety which he needs especially since he is so weak. Thanks for swaddling him....also, i think the suggestions for canker medicine are good, it seems logical that the infection could go into his throat from his eye.......glad to hear his eye is better....would love another picture.....easier to keep him in my thoughts from a picture...miracles happen everyday....this dove is not meant to die...i know it in my heart... ...please don't give up on him; and by all means keep him warm!


Thanks a lot for such a beautiful post, I feel the same way. Thanks again for all the posts which were really needed here.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I cant find any flagyl tablets except from ordering on internet and that would take a week. Any suggestions? I am keeping Regan warm and holding him a lot. I thought once birds got this weak, they couldn't survive very long. But he just keep breathing! Isn't it a good sign he is still pooping regular looking poop? I don't want to take a picture now. He looks like the last pictures but sleeping. Only opens his good eye for a few seconds at a time.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

LeeLu said:


> i've never seen what canker looks like, mine are inside, but we are moving again...thinking of putting them in a dovecote on my patio outside...so i guess i will stock up on canker medicine ...i will gradually put them outside, might even change my mind, i love them inside with me, but i know they would love the freedom of outdoors...gonna find a balance my breeder flies his birds everyday...he says they fly around their house but would rather just set on the roof all day, staying close to their home.
> 
> hoping we hear today how this poor baby is doing; i hope he is still alive!


I don't know if they really like to fly free in open sky. My cock returns to his cage or in room if I open him outside. Few days back my 3 months old fledgling flew away so I tried to fly my cock so they both hang together and come home safely but he didn't fly at all. When I opened him far away from the cage, he still saw it and landed on it immediately. I did it twice but he didn't
go and so I didn't force him for
the third time . May be some homely birds don't feel safe outside as I have seen my cock, he seems scared when kept opened on terrace.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

christispigeons said:


> I cant find any flagyl tablets except from ordering on internet and that would take a week. Any suggestions? I am keeping Regan warm and holding him a lot. I thought once birds got this weak, they couldn't survive very long. But he just keep breathing! Isn't it a good sign he is still pooping regular looking poop? I don't want to take a picture now. He looks like the last pictures but sleeping. Only opens his good eye for a few seconds at a time.


Oh that wouldn't be available over the counter there probably and ordering online will take time to deliver. Have you asked for Metronidazole or Ronidazole? Flagyl is just a brand name.

Yes this is truly a good sign. He has actually lost his energy fighting with his disease for such long time. But yes he can surely regain it with your help, probiotics and vitamins. I really hope he recovers soon. 
People give them sugar water for strength but I am not sure in this case it should be given or not.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I told you that pet shops that sell tropical fish often sell Fish Zole. It's Metronidazole, which is what Flagyl is. But it has to be the one with no other drug in it.
Call around your area and ask if they carry it.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Thank you for not giving up on him and for all you have tried. You have given him the best chance and love.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

I will be call first thing in the morning to every fish store open. Since it will be Monday, I am hopeful to find one.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

christispigeons said:


> I will be call first thing in the morning to every fish store open. Since it will be Monday, I am hopeful to find one.


Hope you get Metronidazole or fish zole soon for him.


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

How much do I give him and how often?


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

50 mg per pigeon...for 10 days....but since he is young i couldnt decide the dose...you can wait for other members


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

30 mg once daily.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> I will be call first thing in the morning to every fish store open. Since it will be Monday, I am hopeful to find one.


Bless you! This poor baby is going to get well; i feel it in my heart. Thank you jay and others here for all the good advice! christispigeons...Regan was heavy on my mind as i fed my doves last night; it came to me that the reason he probably cannot stand is because the mox is probably also in his ear...no equilibrium, so keeping him swaddled gives him a feeling of safety; as he can't try to walk; if he could walk, it would make him feel really sad; giving him the fear of death since not being able to walk would make him feel he would soon die. 

Also; i believe the other doves in his old loft; that pecked on him were afraid of him. Doves are very intelligent; they knew Regan was very sick, they didn't want his disease (natural self-preservation) so they were trying to kill him. i frown on the previous owner for letting him stay so long in the same cage with other doves pecking on him, when he was obviously very sick. How cruel! i do believe you were meant to have this dove; and also believe he will be such a joy to you and your family when he recovers.

Thanks Kitty for your kind words....i have so much compassion for the Father's creation ; i've been accused of being a sort of "empath" feeling others with my heart (even mechanical stuff like hard working engines...gets my attention). i believe you understand what i mean.

keep us updated christfispigeons, i would certainly check his ears, especially the ear under the bad eye!


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Sorry I just saw that people have already replied on dosing so removed my post.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

LeeLu said:


> Bless you! This poor baby is going to get well; i feel it in my heart. Thank you jay and others here for all the good advice! christispigeons...Regan was heavy on my mind as i fed my doves last night; it came to me that the reason he probably cannot stand is because the mox is probably also in his ear...no equilibrium, so keeping him swaddled gives him a feeling of safety; as he can't try to walk; if he could walk, it would make him feel really sad; giving him the fear of death since not being able to walk would make him feel he would soon die.
> 
> Also; i believe the other doves in his old loft; that pecked on him were afraid of him. Doves are very intelligent; they knew Regan was very sick, they didn't want his disease (natural self-preservation) so they were trying to kill him. i frown on the previous owner for letting him stay so long in the same cage with other doves pecking on him, when he was obviously very sick. How cruel! i do believe you were meant to have this dove; and also believe he will be such a joy to you and your family when he recovers.
> 
> ...


Yes I do understand what you say and do empathise sometimes but the next moment it feels that they are non living. Don't you feel the same?


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Well, he finally gave up the fight early this morning. Thanks for the advise and sticking with me. Its was a long ride! I learned much from all the different opinions. Some of what I learned I would do again, some not. But I am learning. I am learning what to have on readily on hand to treat my coop. Maybe that would be helpful for new people like me, for one of you experienced pigeon people to make a list of "must haves" when you are a new person in the pigeon world. Vitamins, supplements, first aid, medicines etc. Of course there will always be many others as things arise, but the essentials for the most common issues pigeons have.
Again thank you all.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Really sorry you lost him.
There are threads like that on P.T. that have been done many times on what the basic needs are for pigeon owners. As you go through the site, you will probably see them.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Am really sorry for your loss. I know you did everything you could. Sometimes we just can't stop the inevitable. Thank you for trying and for comforting him!


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

It is hard to hear this, I can still see his face without seeing his pic again. He was in pain and I loved the way you tried for him. Even loved the subject line, people don't usually adopt sick birds. I wouldn't be able to forget him and your efforts in his survival. It is not only your loss but it is our loss and I am really sorry for it. I desperately wanted him to live but I am helpless when God decides something to happen and I accept His decision because He just took back whom He only sent to us, it is the destiny of every life so he reached his destiny but he must be relaxed and satisfied with your care. Thanks for trying to save him, thanks for such a helping heart.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Oh, sorry! He was a real fighter but couldn't win over his fate. Extremely sorry!

Thanks for all the love, care and support you gave him. You're so kind and generous. Keep the good work up in life


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons....so sorry to hear you lost him. You never gave up on him, bless you for trying so hard to heal him.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Canker, cocci and worms are most common pigeon ailments which they should be treated for or prevention course shall be run for them,once half yearly. But for one who keeps few pigeons indoors and don't race/often breed them, treating them once a year is fine.
Organic ACV, vitamin and mineral supplements weekly is enough to keep them healthy if they don't socialize with outside/feral/other birds. Just give them fresh air and sun for 1-2 hours daily.

Metronidazole for individual treatment and ronidazole/tinidazole for flock for canker.
Moxidectin Plus for worms.
Baytril for bacterial infections.
Calcium supplement with D3.
Garlic oil caps is what one shall have at hands all the time. Don't worry pigeons aren't that hard to care for...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It's good to have a couple of different drugs for the various things, so you can switch, and they don't build a resistance to the drug.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

sorry..... 
RIP little friend


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

Thanks for all the supporting words! I will continue with this new venture of pigeons. It is so heart breaking to not be able to save him when he fought so hard to live. But he taught me a lot and I learned much! My coop has 6 beautiful birds, and I will take this knowledge and keep them healthily, intercepting before they get they get as sick as this poor little guy was BEFORE I got him. He knew he was loved as he fought and died. I am taking comfort in knowing we fought together until the end! My heart just hurts right now.....


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

How very sad. I was hoping he would pull thru.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

I was listening to "see you again" by Wiz and Charlie and this little guy's pic flashed before my eyes. I'm sad


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

That is so sweet! Thank you.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

christispigeons said:


> Thanks for all the supporting words! I will continue with this new venture of pigeons. It is so heart breaking to not be able to save him when he fought so hard to live. But he taught me a lot and I learned much! My coop has 6 beautiful birds, and I will take this knowledge and keep them healthily, intercepting before they get they get as sick as this poor little guy was BEFORE I got him. He knew he was loved as he fought and died. I am taking comfort in knowing we fought together until the end! My heart just hurts right now.....


I can understand how you feel. You did great and everyone wants the efforts to be paid but yes we can't give anyone a life nor we can take. He was very very lucky bird to have you with him. You did awesome and I have a deep respect for you. I have no words to say you thanks. Pls gather yourself up, you have lot more to do. I know you can be of same great help for many more lives. Take a very good care of yourself.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

christispigeons said:


> Thanks for all the supporting words! I will continue with this new venture of pigeons. It is so heart breaking to not be able to save him when he fought so hard to live. But he taught me a lot and I learned much! My coop has 6 beautiful birds, and I will take this knowledge and keep them healthily, intercepting before they get they get as sick as this poor little guy was BEFORE I got him. He knew he was loved as he fought and died. I am taking comfort in knowing we fought together until the end! My heart just hurts right now.....


i know that hurt you're carrying right now. It's deep, i've lost many hens for no reason, the last hen was my favorite, she was special, beautiful, and such a good mother, she had 2 children a month and 1/2 old, she was setting on 2 eggs. Her mate, relieved her, she was eating and another male jumped on her and her head was under her body and she couldn't breath; dove communicate by telepathy....her mate did not come to help her, i was not around, but heard a faint cry from her...i checked for her and found her...i knocked the male off her back and picked her up, her beak wide open gasping for air....i didn't know what to do, i tried to blow air in her nostriles, she died in my hands.....she was a year and a half old......i so loved this beautiful dove, i cried for hours, my tears fell on her feathers, i buried her on my land, and asked the Father to let her be with her again.....i have her hen, she is 3 months old and is beginning to sound like her mom, truely a blessing and a comfort that i have her. Doves represent the Holy Spirit, and now i understand why Noah loved them so. Christispigeon, the hurt takes awhile, i understand your pain....the loss/hurt i had 2 months ago is still with me, reminds me my doves' lives are in my hands, and i treasure everyone of them.....i am their parent and i MUST take the best care of them i possible can.

thanks for the list of medicines to have on hand guys.....i need to do some shopping!  

Peace be with you Christispigeons!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

LeeLu, she was probably sick and having a hard time breathing before the male jumped her. Otherwise she would have been able to move and throw him off. When they are sick and struggling, other males will take advantage of that. More likely that is what happened to the poor thing.


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## LeeLu (Sep 23, 2012)

Jay3 said:


> LeeLu, she was probably sick and having a hard time breathing before the male jumped her. Otherwise she would have been able to move and throw him off. When they are sick and struggling, other males will take advantage of that. More likely that is what happened to the poor thing.


Jay, she wasn't sick, she did have a problem with her right leg, this same male dove, jumped on her back when she was one month old, i saw it happen, and again knocked this male off her back, she was just a squab... i thought her right leg was spraned, because she couldn't walk. or put any weight on it. This is why i grew so close to this hen, i saved her life, she wouldn't eat, she couldn't bend down to eat out of the feeder. So i hand fed her daily, i bought a very small 2"x2"x1" terrycloth foam rubber pillow that was perfect for her to put her right leg on and support herself with the left one that was fine. It took 6 weeks or more for her right leg to recover. She began to walk on her own. i kept her in a plastic 11 x 11 baking dish, with the pillow under her, a mirror outside the dish to keep her company and a cup of water on the side of the pillow.

When she began to spend time off the pillow in her area, i knew she was going to heal...it took a long time for her to walk and fly, So the mating process for her was difficult because she couldn't bend down as far as was needed to mate. Davy, the only available male was hugh, she wouldn't let him on her back, she would dump him off, long story short, i didn't think she would be able to mate and lay eggs....so i put them together in a tall box with padding on the bottom of it so she could bare his weight and cushion her legs...it worked they mated successfully....had those 2 chicks after almost a year of trying to mate...after that mating, she got the hang of it, the two seemed to work out a way to mate. So, this same male that hurt her when she was a squab, stayed away from her until that day when she was alone and davy was setting on the eggs. I do not know how her head got lodged under her body, but when i saw her, she was completely laying on the floor, a position she can't physically get into.. The vet said that probably her legs cut off the air supply hence her head fell down, and she turned her head trying to get air, in under her body..... When i picked her up, i held her straight up and down, she was still alive, beak wide open, her eyes looking at me needing help...the vet said blowing in her nostrils wouldn't have helped, her air passages in her body had probably collapsed and only a vet would know how to get air into her body. She was a beautiful dove, a starrdard janssen stature, she had a 37-1/2" wing span, standing with wings at her side, they were as long as her tail; she had beautiful big dove eyes almost the size of her head, with the flesh around her eyes, not the usual grey, but crimmson red....she had a beautiful coo, high pitched singing coo that stood out from all the others cooing. i surley miss her. Maybe her hen will be as beautiful as she was, but i won't be as close to her hen because physically the same bond isn't there, her hen is perfectly normal.

thanks for listening....i am still heartbroken over the loss of her.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well that's terrible. I'm sorry you lost her. It often seems the ones we lose are the ones we favor for one reason or another. Here's hoping that her daughter looks as pretty as she did.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

LeeLu said:


> Jay, she wasn't sick, she did have a problem with her right leg, this same male dove, jumped on her back when she was one month old, i saw it happen, and again knocked this male off her back, she was just a squab... i thought her right leg was spraned, because she couldn't walk. or put any weight on it. This is why i grew so close to this hen, i saved her life, she wouldn't eat, she couldn't bend down to eat out of the feeder. So i hand fed her daily, i bought a very small 2"x2"x1" terrycloth foam rubber pillow that was perfect for her to put her right leg on and support herself with the left one that was fine. It took 6 weeks or more for her right leg to recover. She began to walk on her own. i kept her in a plastic 11 x 11 baking dish, with the pillow under her, a mirror outside the dish to keep her company and a cup of water on the side of the pillow.
> 
> When she began to spend time off the pillow in her area, i knew she was going to heal...it took a long time for her to walk and fly, So the mating process for her was difficult because she couldn't bend down as far as was needed to mate. Davy, the only available male was hugh, she wouldn't let him on her back, she would dump him off, long story short, i didn't think she would be able to mate and lay eggs....so i put them together in a tall box with padding on the bottom of it so she could bare his weight and cushion her legs...it worked they mated successfully....had those 2 chicks after almost a year of trying to mate...after that mating, she got the hang of it, the two seemed to work out a way to mate. So, this same male that hurt her when she was a squab, stayed away from her until that day when she was alone and davy was setting on the eggs. I do not know how her head got lodged under her body, but when i saw her, she was completely laying on the floor, a position she can't physically get into.. The vet said that probably her legs cut off the air supply hence her head fell down, and she turned her head trying to get air, in under her body..... When i picked her up, i held her straight up and down, she was still alive, beak wide open, her eyes looking at me needing help...the vet said blowing in her nostrils wouldn't have helped, her air passages in her body had probably collapsed and only a vet would know how to get air into her body. She was a beautiful dove, a starrdard janssen stature, she had a 37-1/2" wing span, standing with wings at her side, they were as long as her tail; she had beautiful big dove eyes almost the size of her head, with the flesh around her eyes, not the usual grey, but crimmson red....she had a beautiful coo, high pitched singing coo that stood out from all the others cooing. i surley miss her. Maybe her hen will be as beautiful as she was, but i won't be as close to her hen because physically the same bond isn't there, her hen is perfectly normal.
> 
> thanks for listening....i am still heartbroken over the loss of her.


Well I truly can't imagine the situation you faced. It is really heart breaking. I had many pets but stopped keeping them because I couldn't handle the stress when they leave. It seems hell on this planet. Still we have to move on, the life doesn't stop. We have to live with or even without them we love more than our lives. Just pray may God strengthen our hearts and give us patience in such terrible situations we can't handle without His mercy.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

It sounds like you were, you still are deeply connected to her  so sorry to hear about the accident and the loss. Try to cherish her in her daughter LeeLu


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Kiddy, seems a shame you don't keep pets now. Everyone has to die sometime. That's part of life. But the pain you feel when a loved pet leaves, is so far over shadowed by the joy and love that you share when they are alive. To give up one, you give up the other. That would make the world a very empty and lonely place I would think. God gives them to us for a while, but when He takes them back, then we need to try to think on all the good and special times we shared. I guess it is in learning to let go, and trusting that there is something better on the other side.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Yes completely agree with you and always wish to do what you say but you can't know how I suffer. I can't explain because it is unusual. You can help others until you don't need to be helped, when you yourself need help whom will you help then.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

You were telling someone to move on! Come on kiddy! You'll have to learn to do the same. Jay3's given beautiful words and that's how it should be happening.
Listen to Kelly Clarkson's "what doesn't kills you makes you stronger" for inspiration.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

I was telling as I know what is right and should be done and people can do it with some exceptions. Even I do it after lots of stress, hell of life and being scolded badly by my mother at last  And now she has strictly prohibited animals. These were the pigeons I brought for my nephew and niece and mom says you brought them for yourself lol. She scolds me whenever I feel stressed because of them, usually everyday I listen something because I brought them. and then i sit with them and tell them that I can listen this all because I love you all so much which you people don't understand.. Lol
I know I sound crazy and so I don't share all my crap.
I know I am good only until they are good


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## christispigeons (May 28, 2015)

What a sad story LeeLu! I am so sorry for you and your beautiful dove! 
I have been around animals all my life. I have lost many throughout the years. It's tough, some harder than others. But when you are an animal lover, and I am along with everyone on this site, there is always a new one that needs your attention. So on we go because that's what we do when we love animals.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

LeeLu, am so sad hearing the story of the loss of your dove! Agree with all that loving animals us so rewarding but so heartbreaking when they leave us. Am I in tears already fearing the loss of Phoebe pigeon way too soon.


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## naresh j (Jun 27, 2014)

kiddy said:


> I was telling as I know what is right and should be done and people can do it with some exceptions. Even I do it after lots of stress, hell of life and being scolded badly by my mother at last  And now she has strictly prohibited animals. These were the pigeons I brought for my nephew and niece and mom says you brought them for yourself lol. She scolds me whenever I feel stressed because of them, usually everyday I listen something because I brought them. and then i sit with them and tell them that I can listen this all because I love you all so much which you people don't understand.. Lol
> I know I sound crazy and so I don't share all my crap.
> I know I am good only until they are good


i know that feeling kiddy..


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Nare J said:


> i know that feeling kiddy..


Thanks


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## CBL (May 13, 2014)

Im with Kiddy on this one, easier said than done, words of encouragement are just words, feelings are much stronger. I too feel more stress than happiness fearing the loss of a beloved pet as Cweb is. Kiddy I now exactly how you feel and feel the very same way. Its a gut rot when they die, and I chose also to not have self induced torture. I have stopped all breeding, I will have no more cats or dogs. I will always help any bird in need, mine and others, but when they are gone, I will be freed of the stress and worry for their well being. I am already freed and grateful to never have to worry about any of my dogs again. No sickness, no fear of anything. A TOTAL relief. Im so happy to help friends and neighbours with theirs tho. There is a satisfaction to that without having to feel the strong feelings of loss when my own go.


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## kiddy (Feb 5, 2015)

Thanks CBL, you explained very well what I feel deep inside my heart. All of us feel the pain of loss in their own ways coz every one is different.


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