# Tipplers and Homers differences



## gem023 (Mar 22, 2012)

Good day guys, 
I'm a bit confused on this, how can you tell whether the pigeon is a tippler or a homer


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Physically, homers are bigger and longer in size. They have bigger wattles,beaks and eyes ceres(skin around the eyes). They have broader chest than tipplers. They are heavy,broad and impressive unlike tippler which are lean which enables them to fly for long in air. But I've seen homers that look like tipplers and a novice could be confused.
U can post the pic of the birds here,PT mates gonna help u out with that... 

A tippler will fly high in round circles around loft and tip in the sky whereas a homer usually fly low,( in routing)


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## Doig (May 18, 2013)

I find what Brocky Biebers information to be interesting. 

IT may perhaps be true...

Though I have noticed that most/all tipplers iris color is never a red like as of how some homers are... I mostly see tippler pigeons iris color being a whitish-grey or whitish-red rather the homer like eyes orange-red. 

Though I believe both still home correct??? .. sorry for asking another question upon another one already.. thinking maybe it will help gem023 a bit more and me.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Doig said:


> Though I have noticed that most/all tipplers iris color is never a red like as of how some homers are...


Yes you are true. I've never seen a tippler with red eyes. Homers can have any eye color but tipplers don't come with red eyes.

Tipplers have poor homing ability. They can return from 5 to 8 kms but I've not seen tipplers that can home from greater distances. But homers play the homing game like no other...


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Tipplers have been known to home up to 100 miles. And some Tipplers do have orange eyes, It depends on the line of tippler, If Pearl eye is locked into their genotype then you are correct, they will all have pearl eye but I have red eyed and pearl eyed tipplers and I suspect some of the guys in the US do as well.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

NZ Pigeon said:


> Tipplers have been known to home up to 100 miles


This is shocking to me. Thanx for telling.here we don't have such tipplers. They are used in competitions to land where ever they are let out.
I've never come across such tipplers ever. Here we don't have any pure bred tipplers with red eyes.
Would love to see red eyed tipplers if u wanna show us how they look like This gon be exciting


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

I think one needs to remember this is a world wide forum, so what may be the norm in your area may not be the case all over.

The take a lot more training but they will home if trained well.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

NZ Pigeon said:


> The take a lot more training but they will home if trained well.


Does that mean homing doesnot occur naturally to tipplers like it cccurs to homing pigeons.?
Pure bred tipplers are never used for homing in any part of the world whereas homers are known worldwide for their homing abilities.


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## gem023 (Mar 22, 2012)

I'm getting more confused. Haha! *BUT* the information that you guys are telling helps me also. I'm so interested to know more about these beautiful creatures  THANKS! Gonna post some pics, hopefully later, and maybe you could help me. ^_^


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

brocky bieber said:


> Does that mean homing doesnot occur naturally to tipplers like it cccurs to homing pigeons.?
> Pure bred tipplers are never used for homing in any part of the world whereas homers are known worldwide for their homing abilities.


homing occurs naturally in all pigeons, that's what keeps them round the loft, Tipplers have been selected for high flying so need more time and training to be able to be released and home back to the loft.

I am not disputing whether homers are better than tipplers at homing, that's in disputable, however, you made a claim that they can only home 8 or so miles, that is simple inaccurate.


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## Print Tippler (May 18, 2011)

I would like to go as far and say tipplers never have the orange eye gene. They can have very poor pearl eyes which are grayish and covered in red vains. Tipplers can home. I'm not and expert but I think if you have any breed of bird that can fly over the loft for an hour time has the potential to be slowly homed out. I've taken my tipplers out a few miles. Never lost one. They take there time getting back and are not racing homers but they do make it back. I will one day probably start homing flying flights but I wouldn't even start taking them out until they are atleast one year old, same with the tipplers.

Anyways here's some links to homing tipplers

http://www.mumtazticloft.com/a_TipplersasHomingPigeons.asp

Here's a whole site devoted to it
http://www.tossingtipplers.com/index.html

This is the above person friend who also homes.
http://www.jagloft.com/

I got birds from him and they were larger and more robust. Could have been mixed somewhere down the line. Tipplers are a mutty breed of pigeons. There is a lot of variation in the breed and other similar breeds can easy be mixed in without great visual effect as they are pretty basic looking.

I don't know the origins of homing pigeons, all of what breeds went into them. Here is something intresting though. 

Dr Willard F. Hollander in a genetic booklet he put out found on the npausa website on page 19 shows this below.

http://www.npausa.com/pdf/NPA-ProjOnGenetics.pdf










Take it for what you will. He said something silly after that.

Also heres a post about a New York Flying Flight. Which I consider pretty refined birds as far to color goes but this guy states on of his birds came home from 10 miles with no training. When he sells "roll out" that is a thing the flights do when the as a flock make tight swooping circles slowly moving away from the loft until sometimes leaving sight. Not exactly a route as homers who may just dart straight off. But flights still come back.. Most of the time.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f39/flying-flights-26138.html



wallflower said:


> ND,sorry which ones? The flights I've flown have homed pretty well.I've had them go out of sight for a while and all end up back in the loft.I gave some to a friend just about 10 miles from me,he let out some of the old birds by mistake and they came right back to my loft. I don't know about the Iranians I haven't flown them long enough yet.Another thing about the flights is that they are just about the best parents that you could find.



Homing ability and flying ability in general in many breeds may surprise some people. A lot people just have it in there head XYZ can not do this so they never try.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

I have seen many tipplers with orange eyes, Not pearl with orange leaking through, Maybe they are not "pure"

Are you speaking about and including all breeds of tipplers worldwide or just within the USA?


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## Print Tippler (May 18, 2011)

English tipplers is the only thing I refer to as tipplers. I would say none of those ever have orange eyes from what I've seen and heard and I was make it a deciding factor if I were to decide. If the bird flew for 18 hours and had a orange I still wouldn't think it was a pure Tippler. I've never heard of orange eye tipplers anywhere and I do what I think is well rounded research. Seen pictures of the birds from around the world. As you know orange eye is dominant so it can't hide itself. All tipplers I have seen have pearl / gravel eyes.

Go to this site. The bottom two pictures are what you will normally see In a Tippler, an unrefined pearl eye. What did you mean by red eye though? The racing homer in on that same link has a "red eye" but it's still the pearl eye gene.

http://www.nwoetc.com/images/eye_chart.jpg


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

gem023 said:


> Good day guys,
> I'm a bit confused on this, how can you tell whether the pigeon is a tippler or a homer


Okay Gem, when u go to buy,the physical characteristics which I've stated in my first post of both birds gonna help you to distinguish between a tippler and a homer pigeon. Rest is controversial and going in a different direction.

People keep experimenting a lot by mix breeding and there exists many sub breeds. Bottomline is that homers are best known for their homing ability from greater distances. Homing ability refers to the ability that from how far a bird can find its way successfully back to its home not circling around the loft. Tipplers fly high around the loft and homers fly low and can ACTUALLY home back from 2000kms away.
Some of my PURE BRED NOT HYBRIDS tipplers have come back after 2 or 4 days after being released 10 kms away. Once my high flyer took 2 weeks to come back home when he was released in a competition. They fly high in circles and try to locate their home. Some home back, some never. Homers on the other hand go straight towards their home especially trained racing homers who don't even waste a second and come back as fast as they can. In races even some seconds can make a winner or turn him into loser.
U don't need to be that confused.


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Doig said:


> Though I have noticed that most/all tipplers iris color is never a red like as of how some homers are... I mostly see tippler pigeons iris color being a whitish-


I agree with that!
well, Google Tipplers and see their images and google homers and see how they look like this is the way I personally knew different breeds and distiguished between them, not by arguing who can home better than the other!!


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## gem023 (Mar 22, 2012)

Print Tippler said:


> English tipplers is the only thing I refer to as tipplers. I would say none of those ever have orange eyes from what I've seen and heard and I was make it a deciding factor if I were to decide. If the bird flew for 18 hours and had a orange I still wouldn't think it was a pure Tippler. I've never heard of orange eye tipplers anywhere and I do what I think is well rounded research. Seen pictures of the birds from around the world. As you know orange eye is dominant so it can't hide itself. All tipplers I have seen have pearl / gravel eyes.
> 
> Go to this site. The bottom two pictures are what you will normally see In a Tippler, an unrefined pearl eye. What did you mean by red eye though? The racing homer in on that same link has a "red eye" but it's still the pearl eye gene.
> 
> http://www.nwoetc.com/images/eye_chart.jpg





brocky bieber said:


> Okay Gem, when u go to buy,the physical characteristics which I've stated in my first post of both birds gonna help you to distinguish between a tippler and a homer pigeon. Rest is controversial and going in a different direction.





Abdulbaki said:


> I agree with that!
> well, Google Tipplers and see their images and google homers and see how they look like this is the way I personally knew different breeds and distiguished between them, not by arguing who can home better than the other!!


After reading your post and the references y'all shared, now i'm not that confused anymore.  Hehe, I also googled the images of the tipplers and homers just like you've said sir Abdulbaki.
Many thanks for the infos brothers.


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Hi gem, you welcome bro, but it's a common sense


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## gem023 (Mar 22, 2012)

Haha, I know bro but here in our country, particularly in our area, it's hard to determine which is which because most of the pigeons breeds that are raised here are mixed, most fanciers don't have a 'REAL' loft and they just a build a nest box for the birds, and all of them are free flyers so it's giving me a hard time. Haha! Anyway, thanks again to all of you. Hope this thread helped some newbies like me.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

While a tippler can home to an extent. It would not be good to train them far. Plus a tippler can be resettled much easyer then most any homer. THere is a very much difference in a race bird ands a tippler. NOW high flyers were mentioned I have seen cross bred birds that had high fliewrs in them . THey looked like any race bird. And the idea was to get the race birds flying higher So they could make faster times. THIS was back in the very early 1970s. As some people had that idea. Well ideas just do not pan out as we think some times. From a distance of 100 miles EVEN feral have made it home. But as you get out further things change. THE drive to get home And get home as fast as you can seperates race birds. All that is found in breeding and LUCK. Where other breeds well just have not been cultivated For that performance. Can they perhaps. But why go back wards to go forwards. It is hard enough raising a decent race bred bird much less trying a new breed line that would take many many years to cultivate over.


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## Print Tippler (May 18, 2011)

brocky bieber said:


> People keep experimenting a lot by mix breeding and there exists many sub breeds. Bottomline is that homers are best known for their homing ability from greater distances. Homing ability refers to the ability that from how far a bird can find its way successfully back to its home not circling around the loft. Tipplers fly high around the loft and homers fly low and can ACTUALLY home back from 2000kms away.
> Some of my PURE BRED NOT HYBRIDS tipplers have come back after 2 or 4 days after being released 10 kms away. Once my high flyer took 2 weeks to come back home when he was released in a competition. They fly high in circles and try to locate their home. Some home back, some never. Homers on the other hand go straight towards their home especially trained racing homers who don't even waste a second and come back as fast as they can. In races even some seconds


No one said homers are not the best or that tipplers are better at racing than homers, no one said either. The statement you made was they were poor. When you judge based solely on racers ability to home then sure they are poor but when you take pigeons as a whole into account they are pretty good. 

I think your confusing Tippler! We're not even talking about the same breed most likely. I don't consider Pakistani or Indian "tipplers" as tipplers. They are high flyers. The name Tippler is a breed not a characteristic. The one breed called Tippler is the English Tippler. Talking about releasing them from a place and seeing which one stays in the air the longest is a game with the Pakistani high flyers.

@Relee, you said it would not be a good ideal to train tipplers far. Where does your knowledge on tipples come from? First hand experience? Have your kept and flown the birds yourself? Why should I take your word over the words of other who have done it? There are plenty of people who home tipplers in New York. 

Who is talking about racing anyways????? You said the ability to get home fast and have the drive separates race birds. We're not talking about racing tippers. Just the ability to get back home when released. Isn't that what homing is? No one races there tipplers but some people take out adult birds for fun. There not trying make them faster at it.

The question/debate is are they able to home. I've proved they have been tossed out to 100+ miles. I consider that homing. Are racers better at it of course! But are tipplers able to do it yes.

Please let me know about the tipplers you have kept?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Hi Logan,
From how far your tipplers have come home and in what time??? I'm not comparing or judging their homing ability.. Just curious to know.. One more thing which re lee correctly points out is that tipplers are far more easier to resettle/rehome than homers...
And the tittle of the tread goes like this "Tipplers and Homers Differences". So I was trying to paint a clearer picture to help a newbie out. Thnx man


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## Print Tippler (May 18, 2011)

I never really worked them out. Had a lot going and only did a small group only out to 2 and 3 miles. There were times they came straight back and times they took an hour or more. I'm selling all my tipplers now most likely. I'll do with my flights most likely down the line once I have them in my new loft and flying for a year, but they like I said leave home naturally and return.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Ofcourse what we have here are tipplers not english tipplers so I don't know how much homing ability english tipplers got there. But thnx for the links u shared. You may not call other breeds tipplers but here tipplers are believed to have many sub breeds.
And I've also never seen a pure bred tippler with red/orange eyes.


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## gem023 (Mar 22, 2012)

Thanks for all the info you've shared brothers. 

Well I think that I made a mistake most likely on the thread title. I should have made it like this. "Tipplers and Homers PHYSICAL differences". SORRY. But still I learned a lot! ^_^


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Print Tippler said:


> No one said homers are not the best or that tipplers are better at racing than homers, no one said either. The statement you made was they were poor. When you judge based solely on racers ability to home then sure they are poor but when you take pigeons as a whole into account they are pretty good.
> 
> I think your confusing Tippler! We're not even talking about the same breed most likely. I don't consider Pakistani or Indian "tipplers" as tipplers. They are high flyers. The name Tippler is a breed not a characteristic. The one breed called Tippler is the English Tippler. Talking about releasing them from a place and seeing which one stays in the air the longest is a game with the Pakistani high flyers.
> 
> ...


NO I have never kept tipplers. BUT what does that mean. As you know IF you keep tipplers. Most are never used to HOME from any distance. That is not why they are kept. I never said they could not HOME. And homing taking a week or more as some breeds DO and have is 1 rather unsafe for the breed. 2 Hardly worth the effert to have any hope on that side of abilty. There are several hundred breeds of pigeons Are founded on a certion IDEA of use. And tipplers were never meant for homing needs At least as far as I can think they were. Why would you want to take them out 100 miles Much less ever think they could home from say 300 or 500 miles. Even feral have been known to home from over a 100 miles. But that just mean they made it home. BUT what percent never did. I never even thought about keeping tipplers As They never made it to my list of a breed that I felt I could use. DOES not mean they are not decent birds. It just means some people like having them others do not. BUT I do know something about pigeons


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Why has these become a debate about how fast they come home or why one would want to take them out that far, Brocky said Tipplers can only home out to about 8 miles, That is wrong, I and others have proved they have been taken out and released from farther distances and made it home. Period.


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## Doig (May 18, 2013)

Overall, racing homer or not....

TRAINING! is KEY. : )


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