# 2012 Auction Race



## smazz (Dec 23, 2009)

Hi All,
Just wanted to post a note about my club's 2012 auction race.. Our bands are $15 a piece and you choose your handler or you can send birds to our live auctions (we have 2 of those 1 in March and 1 in April) at no cost to breeder to enter.. This past year we paid out 20 positions.
One of the PT members, KBraden, wound up 9th with her bird. 50/50 split between handler and breeder. Contact me if you would like to join us this coming year. 
Thank you,
Sal


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## orock (Mar 28, 2011)

Where is the auction race being held can anyone buy.


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## smazz (Dec 23, 2009)

Our club is the Marion County RPC out of Ocala, Fl and only club members can handle the birds.. As far as bidders go, anyone can bid who is in attendance on the auction day. Sal


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## smazz (Dec 23, 2009)

Thanks Kathy. Great to have you back again.


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## smazz (Dec 23, 2009)

Bands are ready to go if anyone is interested. $15 a piece.


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## Paragon Loft (Jun 27, 2009)

hey sal is there a phone number to call for the bands,i might get in the race thanks.


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

What are the pay outs?


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## HmoobH8wj (Apr 7, 2011)

How dose this work? Is it just like one loft race?


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

HmoobH8wj said:


> How dose this work? Is it just like one loft race?


You buy the band and band your youngster with it, you can with 50% of the prize money if the bird places well in the specific race...you will not get your birds back.


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## HmoobH8wj (Apr 7, 2011)

so i have to places like top 5 to win my birds back with prize right?


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

you dont get your birds back no matter how you place, you just get 50% of the prize money


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## HmoobH8wj (Apr 7, 2011)

wow really. so i have to do it just buy band and band one of my yb and send it back to Auction race? with no cost? just 15$on band? there got to be more info about this. i wanna learn this.


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

you probably have to pay shipping too.


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## HmoobH8wj (Apr 7, 2011)

buy band, and band yb ship it then race?

how far will the race be?
i dont bid on anything?


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## HmoobH8wj (Apr 7, 2011)

wow it wont cost me then if i just use my au band then. but it will cost for shipping only but suck that i wont get my bird back if i lose or win.


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

Why would anyone send pigeons to races out of area,and not be able to get the pigeon or pigeons back that do well or even WIN ??? If the winning birds are going to be sold at Auction(at least),the BREEDER can buy it back....With no option at all to get your WINNER back,why bother ??Alamo


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

Alamo the only out of area race I'm doing is the LBRA race....if I win 4,500 buck I wont be very upset about them keeping the bird.


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## rpalmer (Mar 10, 2011)

Alamo said:


> Why would anyone send pigeons to races out of area,and not be able to get the pigeon or pigeons back that do well or even WIN ??? If the winning birds are going to be sold at Auction(at least),the BREEDER can buy it back....With no option at all to get your WINNER back,why bother ??Alamo


I agree with you 100%. And will never enter such a race. If I check out a race site and see that the birds are not returned or offered for return I take note of it and never return.



First To Hatch said:


> Alamo the only out of area race I'm doing is the LBRA race....if I win 4,500 buck I wont be very upset about them keeping the bird.


If your loft can afford to kiss good buy a bird that brings home 4.5K then you are doing better than most. But from your previous posts I know that is not true.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

First To Hatch said:


> You buy the band and band your youngster with it, you can with 50% of the prize money if the bird places well in the specific race...you will not get your birds back.


Let me see if I have this right. For $15 you send out your bird, to be housed in some loft you don't know, never to be seen or heard from again, for the chance to win 50% of the Capital prize money. And if I am not mistaken, there is no mention of what the 1st Prize would be, since the organizers themselves don't know what the prize amounts will be. 

I would rather send my birds to a well known and well run One Loft event. Where I know who will be caring for and training my birds. Where at the least, I will get 90% of the capital prize money based on a series of races. And then after the event, my birds are then shipped back to me. If I want to "help out" a particular club or combine, then I would send them a donation. But, for the most part, I am thinking that clubs and combines should cover their own operating expenses and not depend on out of the area fanciers to help support their hobby, but hey, that may just be me.


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

Let me see...XXX Loft sends birds out to 4 OOA races....His birds place very well,and even WIN a MAJOR OLR or Futurity....So XXX Loft does not WANT the CHAMP back to BREED from to raise MORE WINNERS.....How foolish can one person be...Even GANUS wants HIS WINNERS back from a MAJOR RACE,so he can breed more,and SELL the off spring...XXX Loft might not SELL birds,and that`s fine..But WE should allways want our BIG RACE winners back to breed from...Keeping the loosers at home,and the winners in someone`s else`s loft does nada for your breeding loft....Alamo


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## kbraden (Mar 27, 2010)

As usual on this forum, another thread shot to crap over differences in opinion. This race isn't going to get you rich! It is not going to make you the next top flying name. If I spent $600 for perch & race fees, yes I would want my bird back. But that is not what this race is costing. It is best suited for people on a tight budget to begin and see what their birds are made of. That's it. 
Like I said, for me I obtained a lot of knowledge from this past season. More than anyone else would have taught me. I was able to ask stupid questions without being a made a fool of in public, which is a common thing on this forum.


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## bbcdon (Oct 16, 2007)

Oooooohhh!!! That hurt!!!


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

KBRADEN....NO one is trying to demean you or the race...Various opinions are very much a part of this sport...Alot of folks want their birds back,especially if they have done well....Why can`t you let the Handler/Breeder work it out by themselves ?? If the handler likes the pigeon,the breeder can get the bird back,and send a YB from the pigeon,or a brother or sister to the handled pigeon later on...This is done quite a bit....Only the BIG races keep the top 25 or 50 birds to be auctioned off...And the Breeders can buy their bird back....AKA Melsloft...He bought back his 16th place AU 2011Convention bird....I just think the "You can`t get your bird back",is unjustified for a Futurity Race...Let the Breeder/Handler figure it out,with no outside people telling them what to do with their bird....Alamo


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

rpalmer said:


> If your loft can afford to kiss good buy a bird that brings home 4.5K then you are doing better than most. But from your previous posts I know that is not true.


My loft can afford to kiss that bird good bye because I can't afford a one loft race (perch fee, shipping fee, entrance fee). This LBRA race I will drop the birds off when I visit family down in NYC. I'm still going to have the parents to that bird, sibling, cousins, etc. $4,500 will get me over 180 bags of pigeon feed, I only buy like 15 bags of feed a year so that money will last some time. So what the bird won that much money doesn't mean its a good breeding pigeon, plus I'll get the satisfaction of saying I bred that bird!!! I want to see my birds fly well, especially for others, I want to see them breed well too. So many guys in my club get upset when they are beat by their own birds, I don't know why means your a good breeder, I'd rather get beat by my birds than someone elses. Just like I would like to see other people do well with my pigeons, I am ok with not getting that bird back and I can afford to not get that bird back.


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## brown7683 (May 9, 2011)

Any birds I handle for my club races would be returned to owner once races was over if they requested it. It's there bird and it says it flyer that it becomes property of handler unless other arrangements are made. Well I can tell you now as a handler this year anyone who wanted there bird back would just cover shipping and it would be returned. Thats how I would want it so that is how I will do it for people.


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

kbraden said:


> Alamo, it's all good, I didn't take this as a personal attack, was speaking in general terms for the most part. Each club has their rules this is just how this club does things. The actual auction is prior to any races as all, so for a breeder to buy back his bird is not possible, or he would then have no one to fly the bird. Yes, the auction money goes to their club to pay for shipping of birds, expenses, etc... Got to make money somewhere I suppose. Was just saying, for me as an example, this past year this auction setup worked well. I was a bit strapped for cash (had to go buy a fancy new camaro LOL) so to have no entry fees to speak of and still race birds, heck that was right in my budget! Had a few new breeding pairs I wanted to try in a "official" setting, and got to do that. I would not make this particular race a career move, but definately a poor-mans tester.
> I did ask the handler when this was over what happens to the bird. If he had said cull, I would have asked for it back, not that I need another prisoner, but out of humanity. If he had said breed, I would have asked for a baby from it. But, he said race, so off to race we go for OB (no cost to me) and see what we can get this boy to do
> 
> *This forum is a scary place sometimes to ask questions for new people because they do get made a fool of, simply becasue we all have different opinions & insight on things. *I try not to ask things on here, and research elsewhere first. So for a first time racer who wants to see how the races work & learn the terms & prodeedures, this is perfect. Then again, that is only my opinion


 I think what happens here, happens in many places on the Internet. People tend to "say" things when writing on threads like this, that they would not say to your face. Then there is that lack of voice inflection, or facial expression. So what might be considered "normal conversation", can come across all wrong. 

Then again, people often wish to retain some sort of anonymity, so their experience in the sport may be unknown. If one has been into pigeons for say fifty or more years, and asks a question, depending on the question, one might just flat out call him a knucklehead to his face if you are standing across from him, but if he has only had pigeons for a few months, that response would be totally inappropriate.

Like any other place in the real world, when you are the "new" guy, you might have to make allowances for those veterens who have been around the block a few times, and have paid their dues. Having said that, I once heard it said that there are no "stupid" questions, only stupid answers. So I suspect, more experieced folks on here have made even bigger fools of themselves when attempting to answer a "foolish" question, more often then some new person has made a "fool" out of themselves by seeking answers. 

Now if I read this thread correctly, you asked for some input about what some of the readers thought of Auction race, and that is what has been given to you. The concept of this kind of auction race is not new, it already has it's promoters and detractors. 

And these posts give you some idea what the task before you is. I think it requires a big selling job. When you say things like:

"Like I said, for me I obtained a lot of knowledge from this past season. More than anyone else would have taught me. I was able to ask stupid questions without being a made a fool of in public, which is a common thing on this forum." 

I think you take issue with the messengers, instead of the message. If you like and enjoy the idea that you can pay only $15 to buy and band, and send a bird to somone's loft, and then maybe you win a couple of bucks, if you like that idea, then go for it. These clubs that undertake such events, do so because there are people out there like you, who will pay $15 for their bands. That way the club members get other folks to pay their expenses to fly pigeons. 

The only reason why I am in the detractor camp, is because I don't like to see new and "poor" fanciers being taken advantage of this way. The odds are stacked againest you, and the house will always win. 

If someone is new and "poor" then go out and find some sponsers and partners. Let them put up the money and win the cash, but you get to send your birds to a One Loft Event. 

Typically, sending a bird to another loft, where it will be part of a "special" club race, might tell me something about that loft's location and the handler's skill vs. the rest of the club. But, it's not going to tell me very much about the bird since it was competing with other $15 bird entries in a club race.


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

The Greater Akron Club has a GREAT Futurity race....Last year 79 Lofts shipped 1134 Birds to the race....I would bet that at least 40% or more of the total entries were lost before the race...With that said,I would bet the total entries were 2000 birds...The band cost is TEN DOLLARS...Yes $10.00....And you are going to be racing against birds from:
NY...PA...OH...MI...WI..CA...FL...TX...UT...AZ...WV...IN...etc....In 2010,the winner pulled in WAY OVER $12,000....>>>>> $10 per band folks.....So just because the band cost is small,this is NO small race....You have to send your best...I suggest if you like sending birds out for OOA racing,send some here....Go on the Greater Akron Club site...This race is called the GNEO Futurity....All the info is on the site....Some of the best pigeon guys are the handlers...There is also an Auction for this race also...I think if you buy 10 Bands,they give you 2 free Auction Bands...Alamo


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## rpalmer (Mar 10, 2011)

kbraden said:


> Hey Warren, I wasn't asking for input. I don't much care what the opinion on this particular race is, I enjoyed it & it worked for me, and I will do it again. I was only speaking to fill in the other newer flyers what this was about & how it worked, because they didn't know.


You surrendered the moral high ground with your comment on the PT race.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

kbraden said:


> I did this race this past season, first time at a real race where I was involved, other than the PT Classic forum fiascle. I am very happy with the results. *My bird won money for me & the handler*. My handler stayed in contact and answered my questions along the way (and Lord knows I had a lot of questions and he probably wanted to strangle me a few times LOL!) This was a test to see what my birds can actually do, and what they are really made of. Do I have a problem about the handler keeping the bird? Not at all! Why? Because I have the parents  and the handler paid over $80 for my bird at auction, so pretty much paid the price for a bird. Best thing now, I get to watch my bird race again in the OB season and see how he does. I won't get any monetary value out of the OB races, but will get the knowledge of how the bird did going out to father distances. Sometimes the knowledge has more value than the money.
> 
> This year I am sending birds out to other One Loft Races, Sierra Ranch Classic to be exact. And thanks to this past race with Marion County RPC, I know exactly which birds to send.


Just out of curiosity..what did placing 9th payout? Also is this for avg speed over a season or for a particular one distance race?


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## koukoukou (May 12, 2011)

Usually it's hard to trust a handlers handling skills.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

koukoukou said:


> Usually it's hard to trust a handlers handling skills.


I would take my chances if the money was right. If my bird's win with another guy and I couldn't win with them then I know where the fault is.
I think the only way to know if your birds are good or not is to see how they do with other fanciers (and their methods of training). The price is right just not real keen on the no buy back unless the payouts make it a good deal.


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## Timber (Jan 6, 2009)

JaxRacingLofts said:


> I would take my chances if the money was right. If my bird's win with another guy and I couldn't win with them then I know where the fault is. I think the only way to know if your birds are good or not is to see how they do with other fanciers (and their methods of training). The price is right just not real keen on the no buy back unless the payouts make it a good deal.


But you could always contact a few of the handlers and make those types of arrangements. I have been a handler for this Race and the Gold Band Race, and like many of you, I would want a bird back if it scored well. So for me, if a person purchases bands through me and wants their birds back, I usually dont have a problem with it. But like so many things out there, if you disagree with any part of it, then dont participate.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

Timber said:


> But you could always contact a few of the handlers and make those types of arrangements. I have been a handler for this Race and the Gold Band Race, and like many of you, I would want a bird back if it scored well. So for me, if a person purchases bands through me and wants their birds back, I usually dont have a problem with it. But like so many things out there, if you disagree with any part of it, then dont participate.


I may have missed something in this thread...but is there a website that explains all the details of this race? Is this gold band race a single race or a series of races?


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## loonecho (Feb 25, 2010)

Alamo said:


> The Greater Akron Club has a GREAT Futurity race....Last year 79 Lofts shipped 1134 Birds to the race....I would bet that at least 40% or more of the total entries were lost before the race...With that said,I would bet the total entries were 2000 birds...The band cost is TEN DOLLARS...Yes $10.00....And you are going to be racing against birds from:
> NY...PA...OH...MI...WI..CA...FL...TX...UT...AZ...WV...IN...etc....In 2010,the winner pulled in WAY OVER $12,000....>>>>> $10 per band folks.....So just because the band cost is small,this is NO small race....You have to send your best...I suggest if you like sending birds out for OOA racing,send some here....Go on the Greater Akron Club site...This race is called the GNEO Futurity....All the info is on the site....Some of the best pigeon guys are the handlers...There is also an Auction for this race also...I think if you buy 10 Bands,they give you 2 free Auction Bands...Alamo


Alamo, I checked out their site and their information is a little sketchy on how to participate. Maybe its all self explanitory for experience fliers and/or local fliers. I clicked on the "order GNEO bands" tab and it looks to me like you have to order a minimum of 10 bands. If true, that is not a good fit for realatively new flier like myself. I'm looking for a race I can send maybe 4 birds to. They also don't go into detail about who to send birds to or the shipping window for sending them. 

Jim


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## Alamo (Nov 22, 2008)

Jim,I think to get 2 free Auction bands,you have to buy 10 regular bands...Just e-mail/call one of the people who are running the race...They are all honest,and run a great race....Alamo


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

Alamo said:


> Why would anyone send pigeons to races out of area,and not be able to get the pigeon or pigeons back that do well or even WIN ??? If the winning birds are going to be sold at Auction(at least),the BREEDER can buy it back....With no option at all to get your WINNER back,why bother ??Alamo


My club has a The Great South Bay Classic where the top birds are auctioned off and the LBRA auction race where the birds become the property of the handler. I can see it for The Great South Bay Classic that we auction the top birds off because the breeder is the one paying the entry fee and the handler isn't putting anything in other then the cost to enter the 5 bird minimum that handlers have to enter and place in other lofts because no handler can handle their own birds. But the LBRA is free to the breeder aside from the cost to ship the birds here. And the handlers are paying an average of almost 100 per bird. With many birds going for multiple hundreds of dollars. How are you gonna auction the top birds off after the race. I know I wouldn't pay 100 for a bird that I don't get to keep after the race. The LBRA was originally ment to be a local race but it's grown in a big part because of me spreading the word and getting ppl from all over the country to send birds. And now it's been the biggest race on Long Island and thats saying alot with all the money races we have here.


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