# removal of ferals



## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Ok, I searched this forum and got an over load of threads with nothing in common with what I need to do. I need to catch a pair and all their offspring from this year(about 8 birds total) from a horse barn. If I am not successful they will be shot. So first question is how to go about catching them. I thought about my days of catching chicken for my grandmother. Use a flash light shining in their eyes and snatching them off the rafters. I doubt though they would stay settled for me to get the ladder near enough to them. I did stand 2 ladders up hoping that Monday night they will be close to the ladders. I also plan to bring my fishing dip net that is used for catching chicken when they get out. Any advice for catching these birds?

Next thing is since these raised in this barn will they not "home" back to it if I release them? So I thought about keeping them. I have 4 homers and about 20 fantails. I know to quaratine these. Keeping them is a 2 fold plan. The first is to keep them alive and second I love messing with my pigeons and would not mind having a few more. Any thoughts along these lines would also be helpful.
Thanks in advance, John


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

well that is a hard one.. it is not easy catching feral birds which are allot just like wild birds..so the job is a hard one. you already know pigeons..so my first thing would be to go at dark and try to get them while roosting at night with very low light..but even then they may flutter from your grasp. a net may help and if the barn can be closed and you have a helper to perhaps catch any fluttering in the dark and landing on the floor may help. I think it would be a hard job to do alone. and have your crates ready for your helper to put them in and secure them one by one. I would go slow and move about from one area to the other and any falling or flying off in the dark barn perhaps could be picked up by your helper while you are still on the latter. this may take days...not just one evening.


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## horseart4u (Jun 16, 2011)

i agree with spirit wings, best time to catch is at night, you should be able to just grab them if you are quiet enough getting close to them, yes a net may play a great part in the ordeal and a helper for sure. if there are horses in the barn be careful if a bird falls in the stall thet you don't get kicked trying to get the birds out, see if the owner will help you as well by holding the horse if you do need to go into a stall. hopefully the barn isn't that big for you. if you do keep them i would keep them seperate from yours for 3 weeks or more and if you do let them go yes they may return to that barn.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

The barn is closed but the over hang(where rafters go over the side walls) is open. No horses in the barn unless one gets injured in the next few days. The idea of them getting loose and going back to the barn then took care of in the barn owners way is the main reason for keeping the birds. This barn has new owners and I have worked for this person many times on their other farm. He moved his saddles and tack into the barn and the pigeon poo all over the tack is the reason they have to go. He is giving me sometime to get them. I have caught alot of chicken in odd places(trees, barn loft, on top of house, ect) so I have the general idea of catching a bird while it is on roost. But pigeons can really fly. Chickens, turkey, and ducks fly off roost if missed but can normally be picked up from where they land. A few times catching them out of trees though they get to far from limbs large enough to get out on.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

I agree that night time is the best time to get them, with a net is best. But if you have to catch them during the day, something that's worked for me is getting them to eat in a guinea pig or bird cage, with one end held open by a stick, attached to some rope. When they are in the cage, you pull the rope and the trap closes. If they are hungry and the food is enticing, they will get used to eating in the cage within a day or so.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

honeyrobber said:


> The barn is closed but the over hang(where rafters go over the side walls) is open. No horses in the barn unless one gets injured in the next few days. The idea of them getting loose and going back to the barn then took care of in the barn owners way is the main reason for keeping the birds. This barn has new owners and I have worked for this person many times on their other farm. He moved his saddles and tack into the barn and the pigeon poo all over the tack is the reason they have to go. He is giving me sometime to get them. I have caught alot of chicken in odd places(trees, barn loft, on top of house, ect) so I have the general idea of catching a bird while it is on roost. But pigeons can really fly. Chickens, turkey, and ducks fly off roost if missed but can normally be picked up from where they land. A few times catching them out of trees though they get to far from limbs large enough to get out on.


well the only things going for you I would say is the dark and a helper.. even when a pigeon trys to fly in the dark they don't go far and someone can have a net or blanket and put over them if they can.. good luck..let us know how it goes.


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## horseart4u (Jun 16, 2011)

well good luck to you on getting these guys safely.if its dark even if they fly they can't really see so they will fall, have a flash light handy  if they fall shine light and be ready with net


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I agree...the best way, from my experience, is after dark...all lights out. Carry a flashlight for you, or your helper, so that you can flash it on and off quickly for the purpose of locating the pigeons. You can have your helper flash the light if it's easier. Be very careful and proceed slowly in the way you move.
Once you get to a pigeon, grab it by putting your hands over the wing area. When I have a helper, I had the bird to my helper to put the pigeon in a kennel. If I am alone, I put the bird in a pillow case until I can get off the ladder and place the bird in a kennel.
Years ago, my husband tried catching with a net and the result was several pigeons with broken wings. Keep in mind that while you moving the net, the pigeon may move and the rim of the net can come down on the pigeon causing injury.
In the last 2 years, I've caught over 100 pigeons with the method I told you about. The most important part is to remain calm within yourself.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Well I have 2 ladders in the back of the truck and the owner has 2 ladders. Plan is to place these ladders in areas which show the most use(droppings) as soon as I get there in a few minutes. Net and flash lights are ready. Wish me luck.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Be careful with the nets, as the birds could be injured. When catching a bird from the edge of a roof or similar place, I have found that throwing a towel over the bird works really well. And no one gets hurt.


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

Dear john. what you want feral pigeons for? personally if the farmer doesn't want them there i would ring their necks, just take a squab or eggs and hatch under your fantails. Its a shame they cant live wild in the barn. you could hatch your fantails under them and they could live wild and find their own food and water. Imagine keeping pigeons and never having to feed.

I used to take my fancy pigeon eggs down to the river where i knew lots of pigeons lived under a bridge and I would swap their eggs. It was fun watching arc angels and croppers grow up with the wild ones but they never lasted long,.. a year,.. maybe two. I remember a big fat modina survived for years with the ferals


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

thepigeonkey said:


> Dear john. what you want feral pigeons for? personally if the farmer doesn't want them there i would ring their necks, just take a squab or eggs and hatch under your fantails. Its a shame they cant live wild in the barn. you could hatch your fantails under them and they could live wild and find their own food and water. Imagine keeping pigeons and never having to feed.
> 
> I used to take my fancy pigeon eggs down to the river where i knew lots of pigeons lived under a bridge and I would swap their eggs. It was fun watching arc angels and croppers grow up with the wild ones but they never lasted long,.. a year,.. maybe two. I remember a big fat modina survived for years with the ferals


Excuse me, but this is a pigeon advocacy Forum, and the wringing of necks is not endorsed here. Don't think your idea of putting domestic eggs under the ferals was so hot either.


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

opps sorry, i didnt know. my bad


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

seriously though,.. doesn't anyone here cull their stupid and/or ugly birds?


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

thepigeonkey said:


> Dear john. what you want feral pigeons for? personally if the farmer doesn't want them there i would ring their necks, just take a squab or eggs and hatch under your fantails. Its a shame they cant live wild in the barn. you could hatch your fantails under them and they could live wild and find their own food and water. Imagine keeping pigeons and never having to feed.
> 
> I used to take my fancy pigeon eggs down to the river where i knew lots of pigeons lived under a bridge and I would swap their eggs. It was fun watching arc angels and croppers grow up with the wild ones but they never lasted long,.. a year,.. maybe two. I remember a big fat modina survived for years with the ferals


I'm not surprised, fancy pigeons are not wild birds & cant survive long in the wild. They have been bred to be exactly what they are - FANCY SHOW PIGEONS. 
How can you say it was fun! For someone who keeps pigeons it was a cruel & heartless thing to do.
Maybe someone shouldve taken you from your parents & dumped you in the jungle with some apes !!!
Same scenario, then again, maybe not, - the apes would probably have had more compassion & looked after you.


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

Hi again,.. sorry about the culling comment i just read the 'Forum Rules of Conduct'

so no more talk about culling, ringing necks or chopping heads off. 

Wild pigeons often don't survive for longer than a year anyway, do they?... thats why pigeons reproduce so fast. duh!

I still see pied pigeons under that bridge,... they are half fantails half racers. they survived fine and from what i can see multiplied even


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

All pigeons are descended from the rock dove, but the majority of birds you see in & around the city, although feral, are descended from lost "racers" or "homers". They are good at adapting and over the years have learned to live on buildings & under bridges, similar to the way their ancestors the rock dove lived on cliff faces & caves.
Fancy birds & "acrobatic" types have been bred out by man, and the genes within these birds which give their distinctions, mean they are more prominant to predators. Fancy pigeons for example are not very good fliers so easy prey for just about anything.
In general, a feral pigeons life can be quite short, average is prob about 4 - 5 years, whereas in a domesticated situatuion some folk here have had birds for 18 years.


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## November-X-Scourge (May 12, 2011)

You can go to the barn at night and get them then, one by one every night!


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

I am on their internet right now wait for it to get fully dark. Ladders are in place near where they were sitting 3 hours ago. Also the poo piles say these are their favorite places to sit. There are 8 birds total. I counted them while working on a building next to where they are staying. I loved sitting on the roof just watching them fly. I was told that this spring a pair showed up and raised 3 sets of 2 babies each time and from my count earlier it seems that their story has some truth to it.
I live about 30 miles by air away from here how likely would it be I can settle these birds to my loft? Plan is to put them in a rabbit hutch type cage built for chicken for a month or so then introduce them to my other homers. I will worm them and watch them close before joining with my birds.
As a hunter I have eaten plenty of wild dove. I would not shy from eating pigeon if I need food. Put killing birds just to get rid of them is cruel!!!!


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

Yes i agree, they taste great hehe. pigeon pie mmmm


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

kidding, kidding.


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## horseart4u (Jun 16, 2011)

THEPIGEONKEY = from your comments i take it you must raise them for food. you have no remorse or care for pigeons lives by the TONE i am getting from you


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

I got 3 of them. The security light let them see the way to escape. All 3 seem to be young and healthy. One has a problem that I am waiting for daylight to work on. It has grass string cutting into one of it's toes. I have dealt with this type of problem with chickens so do not see anything going wrong with me removing it. I will sterilize some flour ahead of time incase of bleeding. If yall did not know flour makes a great blood clotting agent. I have even removed toes on chickens if it is that bad. The toe felt warm and looks like it is still getting blood flow but it is swollen where the strig is around it. Next day to try and catch the rest is Wednessday night. Will update further as things progress.


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## thepigeonkey (Oct 12, 2011)

No, no, I was honestly kidding,.. i think us kiwis have a warped sence of humor. I love pigeons, I'm actually obsessed. I just made a new video and loaded it on youtube. I think i have bred a mosaic.


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## USA4thewin (Oct 10, 2011)

As I have worked in some farms around here I understand almost all horse owners do not want any pigeons or other feral animals around their horses or in barns for apparent reasons. 

Best way is at night yes I have also used a home made pigeon live trap in the past with a success rate of 1 pigeon per 3weeks. I later discovered a design flaw my trap doors were small and the pigeons were huge which gets back to the statement of a fellow member saying most ferals you see are ex racers/homers.

Any other method for trapping would like to hear from you.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

OK I need advice. I tried to remove what I thought was a grass string. It sort of was but only a small piece that got caught in the scab. What I found was fishing line under it. I got several wraps of it out of the toe with no bleeding(showed blood but nothing more). I know there is more in there as 2 more ends are showing and will not unwrap. I fear I need to cut into the toe to get to where it is wrapped. I sure did not think it was this bad when I looked at it last night. Anyone take toe off as this may be an option I can do. I am way to broke to take it to a vet. I thought if I can not dig it out in the morning with a person who has a stronger stomach than my helper this morning it may be better just to remove the toe to keep the chance of infection down. The toe in question is the middle toe on its right foot.


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## kamz (Jan 23, 2010)

Do not take the toe off!

You have a couple of options. 

Prepare yourself by having some items on hand before you have another crack. 

Please read the link below

http://www.pigeonangels.com/t146-feet-string-and-thread-injuries


This gives detailed advice for dealing with stringfoot injury. 

PLEASE do not underestimate the amount that a pigeon can bleed suddenly from a string foot injury when you are probing around with a seam cutter to find the fishing line. They can bleed suddenly, and go into hypovolaemic shock, killing the bird quicky. You need to have appropriate items on hand to stem the bleeding. 

I would add to the article above the advantages of having styptic powder on hand, as well as the tourniquet , in case of sudden severe bleeding. 

I have had this very experience, and it was only through being prepared (thanks to advice from people on here) that the bird I helped did not die there and then. 


You are doing a good thing, 

Susie/kamz


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

That page even talked about removing toes even the whole foot. It is only a last resort.


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

I've had four toes amputated on a string injured pigeon before but by a vet. Luckily they didn't charge but I do remember they quarterized it after and it was on anti-biotics as well.
As has been said, the bleeding is too much of a danger.
Have you held the foot in warm soapy water and massaged it as this can soften up the surrounding skin and with a magnifying glas you maybe able to see the route the wire is taking. Maybe if it softened well you could get hold of the end and see if it pulls out.
It's hard to advise not seeing it so sorry if this is of no use.
Is a vet out of the question? Would they not help if you explained the whole set up and that you're trying to relocate them and although he doesn't belong to you, you're prepared to do the after care if they can sort the wire removal out.
Just a thought but only you know your vet.

Janet


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

This is a thread on a pigeon with wire/string on its foot:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/pigeon-with-string-injury-on-foot-18056.html?highlight=scalpel

I posted in it, discussing using a scalpel with crescent blade (inner edge sharp).

Larry


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## kamz (Jan 23, 2010)

I should have said - dont remove the toe yourself - that should only be done by a suitably experienced vet. Unless you are a trained physician or vet you are putting the bird at too much risk - let alone the pain! 

I cannot emphasise enough, simply removing the thread places the bird at risk of sudden exsanguination. Let alone amputation of a foot. 

If you put up pictures online, there are some experts on here that can advise you further with a course of treatment. But they will need pictures. 

Those crescent shaped blades for cutting thread that larry recommended are wonderful for dealing with string injuries. 

looking forward to seeing the pictures, 

suz


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

I know most on here would not advise removing a toe and such on here but I am a shade tree vet. Being raised on a farm I have dealt with alot of medical emergencies for animals in my care. I have never removed a whole foot but I have removed many chicken toes over the years and really do not see a difference in doing that and working on a pigeon. I know they do not get drugs for pain but it is not bad. I will not tell my proceedure due to someone reading this and trying it themselves without the knowledge. Lets just say it is numb when the cut is made. I thing I got it all today. I will watch it close over the next few days. I used a budding knife used to "bud" trees, a type of grafting, that is beyond wore out(sharpened to the point the blade is very thin). I used a generic neosporen product on the wound. I think that curved scalpel would have been a better tool to use. 

I ended up not bringing the pigeons "home" so I did not have any bird seed. I watered them and gave them a piece of my bagel that first night. Home for the animals is my dad's farm. I am on the road alot so he feeds everything on days I am not there. The reason I mention this is their stools got runny and greenish. It is still not a good stool but all the birds look fine other than some ruffled tail feathers from the wire of their small cage they will be in for quaritine. How long should it take for the stool to return to normal? First time ever seeing something like this from giving a bird bread. Even my parrolettes get a few bites of toast.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

UPDATE, All is well with these first 3 I caught. The string foot injury is healing nicely. Stools have greatly improved now that they are on a diet of laying mash, cracked corn, and my bird seed mix(originally mixed for canaries and finches in a group cage). Plan on trying again Tuesday night to catch the rest(5 more) but I am changing my plan. First part is wait for dark and string my sein(spell check) net across the open spots in the rafters on the side with the security light to prevent their escape that way. Then go back to my original plan of ladder and dip net. Wish me luck as I only have till next weekend and he is going to use his shot gun.


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Just going to add 2 of the ones I caught are blue check. The third one is a smokey black. I have been looking at pigeon color pattern pics. I looks to be a T pattern. I have not got a in the hand look at the rest of the birds left in the barn but I know 2 more are blue check. I do believe all are either T pattern or blue check but once they start flying you can not get a good look at them. I wish I had a camera to take a few pictures.


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## USA4thewin (Oct 10, 2011)

hehe doing great I set up a pigeon live trap above a building 4 days ago and still nothing


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

I have several hav-a-heart traps for catch raccoons and other problem animals. I do not see how such a trap would work with pigeons. They are so light I do not think they would trip the trap. Other than a box/cage with a string how do you trap pigeons?


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## USA4thewin (Oct 10, 2011)

i made a box something like this but still my success with them is very low.

The Trap


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## honeyrobber (Apr 28, 2011)

Well there is no more pigeons in the barn. I tried catching them a third time over the weekend. The owner had an owl that is made to put on a pole/post. He placed this in the barn again(he tried it once before with no luck). Now no more pigeons. Our theory is that with something(me) getting after them in the night backed up the fake owl in their little brains they think the owl got their friends.

The toe is healing nicely. It has a good color and swelling is nearly gone.


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