# can pigeons pass diseases onto rabbits?



## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Was just wondering because my rabbits keep getting sick and they die from the bloat. E coli like symptoms. The latest episode was triggered by the recent heat wave we have had. 

The birds have handled the heat just fine. In fact I have one baby dove, and a pair of young archangels. I have experienced some infetility in my house pigeons lately. Other then that, no signs of major illnesses. 

The rabbits, on the other hand are a much different story. They get bloated stomachs. they die within two days no matter what i treat them with. so far i have only had two respond to coccidia treatment.

So, what can they pass onto the rabbits, in case its coming from them? They are housed in the same building together. they have no contact with each other. The building they are housed in is 12x24. The birds are on one side, the rabbits are on the other.

Its also possible they have picked up a new rabbit disease thats been going around in the US for the last couple of years. as far as i know, nobody else in myarea, or who shows has had issues with the diease. & I haven't been to a rabbit show in months, so theres little chance they could have picked up something from one.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

If they can they eat each other's droppings, there might be some exchange of disease, but it sounds like that's not the case? The doves would be most at risk , since they are more likely to peck at rabbit droppings than vice versa.

Otherwise, the heat stress itself can trigger disease without it being passed on by another animal or bird. Birds and Animals have all kinds of nasty bacterial inside them, but the numbers are kept down by a good immune system. If they get stressed, the population of `bad' bacteria can explode, which could be what happened to your rabbits. Another possibility is there is a virus going around, which can be transmitted via insects.

Can you find the name of the coccidia treatment you used? Some coccidia treatments are actually Antibiotics that treat coccidia as a secondary effect. If your rabbits had this type of coccidia treatment, then they may have had a bacterial infection that responds to Sulfa Antibiotics.


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Bella_F said:


> If they can they eat each other's droppings, there might be some exchange of disease, but it sounds like that's not the case? The doves would be most at risk , since they are more likely to peck at rabbit droppings than vice versa.
> 
> Otherwise, the heat stress itself can trigger disease without it being passed on by another animal or bird. Birds and Animals have all kinds of nasty bacterial inside them, but the numbers are kept down by a good immune system. If they get stressed, the population of `bad' bacteria can explode, which could be what happened to your rabbits. Another possibility is there is a virus going around, which can be transmitted via insects.
> 
> Can you find the name of the coccidia treatment you used? Some coccidia treatments are actually Antibiotics that treat coccidia as a secondary effect. If your rabbits had this type of coccidia treatment, then they may have had a bacterial infection that responds to Sulfa Antibiotics.


I normally use corid. i did use some sulmet yesterday. The rest of thre treatments have been the corid. That was one dosage. they were bloated before using either one. I even put them on a drug that kills the bacteria that cause clostridium(SP?) and thats not doing much good. I also mixed some terramycin in some water and that really seemed to help those that were recovering. Another had started to recover, but took a turn for the worste tonight.

The doves and pigeons have handled the heat great.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Thanks for the additional info. The treatment you gave for coccidia- corid- is extremely good. If your rabbits have coccidia, that would have been the ideal treatment. Sulmet is an antibiotic that can help with coccidia. But it acts slowly and doesn't actually kill coccidia parasites like Corid does- it simply stops them from reproducing. So its not as good as corid for a serious case of coccidia, if thats what your rabbits have. 

If you are dealing with a bacteria infection, on the other hand, and its not responding to sulfa antibiotics (Sulmet) or teracyclines (terramycin), you're probably dealing with a bacteria type that is causing sepsis ie the infection is getting into the blood stream. This happens a lot with ecoli infections. You would need a more serious antibiotic for treating sepsis, such as Baytril (enrofloxacin). You can get it from a vet or in an emergency, you can get the human equivalent of Baytril from a doctor, called `Ciprofloxacin'. DO you have any Amoxicillin handy? This could also be worth trying if you don't have anything else.

Can you remember which medecine you used on the rabbits that recovered? Also, why did you discontinue it?


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## Ross Howard (Nov 26, 2009)

You talk about treatment but have they been examined & diagnosed by a vet yet. Don't know if you have a good affordable one nearby or not. Just my thoughts. Rabbits don't sweat so usually just die from heat stress. Can you run a fan over them to move air or put outside in shade if it is heat induced ?


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Amoxicillin is extremely toxic to rabbits. 

None of the local vets around me will see rabbits.  I do have one who will sell me drugs for them over the counter. We have gone the baytril route when they started dying from bloat last summer, and it didn't work. They seem to respond better to the teramycin. 

There seem to be no more sick ones. But we shall see since we are supposed to have a heat index of 115 by the end of the week. 

I'm going to push pro biotics down the two remaining sick ones and hopefully they will pull through.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You know, bloat is often caused by hair balls blocking the rabbits intestinal tract, and can only be removed by surgery. Trying different medicines on them when you aren't sure what the problem is, can cause more harm than good. If you didn't know that the Amoxicillin that Bella suggested for you to use was toxic to rabbits, and used it, you could have killed them. So much for trying one med after another without knowing what you are treating for. You really should get them checked out by a responsible vet, so you are sure of what is going on. That way, when this problem comes up, you will know what you are dealing with and how to treat it. I think you owe it to your bunnies, as they depend on you to care for them.

Here is an article you may want to read.

http://www.ohare.org/images/harelines/v13n2.pdf


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

chinbunny said:


> *Amoxicillin is extremely toxic to rabbits.*
> 
> None of the local vets around me will see rabbits.  I do have one who will sell me drugs for them over the counter. We have gone the baytril route when they started dying from bloat last summer, and it didn't work. They seem to respond better to the teramycin.
> 
> ...


Amoxicillan along with other *cillins can be safely used in rabbits, but only if used by injection. *They should never be used orally*.

The antibiotic itself is not toxic, but if given orally, it does destroy good bacteria in the gut which in turn allows other bacteria to thrive & overrun & it is toxins from these other bacteria that kills the rabbit.

http://www.medirabbit.com/Safe_medication/Antibiotics/Safe_antibiotics.htm


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Sorry, I am still wondering which coccidia medicine you used on the rabbits that you said recovered? Was it Corid, or was it Sulmet?

The fact that these ones recovered from one of the medicines you used is your best clue so far as to the treatment.

Thanks for the info on Amoxicillin and rabbits!!


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