# stray pigeon



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

We have a new guest at our house.
I found him/her in the garage in the bottom of a sunflower seed sack (hard telling how long he might of been there).
It is a tan and white pigeon that is obviously used to being around people and has a band around its leg.
He has been roosting in our garage (I leave the door open for him at night) and has been here for a week now and appears to have no intention of leaving.
We have lots of bird feeders and bird baths so I think he thinks he's in paradise.
But he seems to be lacking in bird social skills, he is easily intimidated by the wild birds that chase him away.
I can't quite get close enough to him too grab him and look at his band, but am wondering what I should expect to see if I do.
Even thought about building him a pigeon house if he's going to stay.
I used to have pigeons when I was a kid (fantails, tumblers, and regular pigeons) so I have a soft spot for him.
But I only want the best for him.
Any suggestions???


----------



## WhiteWingsCa (Mar 1, 2002)

Hi Marvin

thanks for looking out for this little guy....they can be vulnerable to owls and cats when out on their own.

You can put some popping corn (un-popped, of course! LOL) and some black sunflower seeds in a dish in the garage for him..then he won't have to fight the wild birds for a meal.

If he is roosting in your garage, is it possible to quietly close the garage door after dark, then grab ahold of him to find out his band number? If you can get the number...make sure you get all the letters and numbers listed, post it here, and someone can point you in the right direction to find his owner. There will be a year, plus some other letters, with a number at the end.

It's hard to say what is "best" for him.....hopefully his owner will be happy to have him back, and perhaps he has a mate at home waiting for him..... Or, perhaps his owner would be willing to let you keep him...in which case, I'm sure you'll be what is "best" for him!


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Just got back from catching the pigeon.
My girlfriend read the numbers as I held him.

The numbers are 98(vertically) then 141GNBRC

Can you tell me what these #s mean and what I should do with them?

Can you tell me if he is a homer?

He doesn't seem to be any worse for the experience. Obviously this isn't the first time he's been handled.

Please reply ASAP!

Thanks!


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Ok....I found the NPA link, which listed an E-mail address for the NBRC (whatever that stands for) and I gave then the band # and my phone # and we'll see what happens.

Isn't the web a wonderful thing!!!!!!!!!

You can even find out about lost pigeons!!!!!


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Marvin!

Good work on catching the pigeon. It sounds like s/he is very lucky to have ended up with you.

Yes, it is amazing what can be found on the internet these days.

Should you not be able to locate an owner or if the owner does not want the bird back will you be keeping the bird? I sure hope so.

Terry Whatley


[This message has been edited by TAWhatley (edited May 02, 2002).]


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Hi TA!

Don't know if I will keep him or not if I can't locate the owner. As content as he seems here I don't now if I'm going to have a choice!!

I've been reading alot about pigeons on the web.....very interesting.........

This pigeons has a NBRC on his tag, does that mean that he is a Birmingham roller??

What is the difference between a roller and a tumbler. When I was a little kid my dad had tumblers, is that the same thing??

Is a roller short for Birmingham roller or are there other types of rollers??

Why do rollers roll??

Great website!! 

marvin


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi again,

Well, you are going to have to wait for all the roller folks to chime in here to answer most of your questions. 

As to the NBRC ... what was the actual name of the club when you found it on the web? If it was the "something Birmingham Roller Club", then most likely the bird is a roller. If it was the "New Brunswick Racing Club", then who knows? Just making these names up, of course, but usually the initials translated to the actual club name would give at least a small clue as to what type of bird.

Terry Whatley


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

NBRC = National Birmingham Roller Club


----------



## indie backroll (Aug 3, 2001)

There are a lot of types of roller, what you have is a birmingham roller from the National Birmingham Roller Club.

Tumblers and rollers are different although i have heard people call a roller a tumbler if it doesnt roll well. Its partly about the performance.

No one actually knows the true reason that they roll, some peolpe think it a form of epilepsy, others think that they just like to do it, kinda like the people that like excitement, ie. base jumpers, bungie jumpers.

I would suggest if you cant find the owner for you to keep the bird, if I was to lose a bird and someone found it the first thing I would ask is if they would like to keep the bird, maybe to help them get started in the pigeon hobby. It will change your life. And rollers are so fun to watch.


For more information look under a couple of other topics on in this discussion (are helmets performing. & not to be rude) 

~Brian


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

UPDATE:

Received an answer back from NBRC on tag I.D. 

Bought by a gentleman in West Virginia.

I am in Des Moines, Iowa. He must have sold it to someone here, right? Roller wouldn't have traveled that far would it?

Anyway, going to call him tomorrow and see what I can find out.

I'll post update.

Later..........


----------



## fred2344 (Jan 9, 2002)

Many fanciers kill the lost birds in order to retrieve the bands so that they can be placed on a baby bird.
I'm sorry you looked so hard to find the owner. Pray that this is not going to be the bird's fate.



------------------
"Until he extends the circle of compassion to all living things, man will not himself find peace."

Albert Schweitzer


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Is what Fred says true??

Why wouldn't they just buy new tags in order to be accurate with birth date etc.??

How expensive is a tag??

Anyone???............


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Marvin,

Well, I kind of tried to clue you in when I said to tell the owner you really, really liked the bird and would be interested in keeping it. Maybe just offer to buy the bird. You already have it, thus no shipping required. Unless this is an extremely valuable bird to the owner, I suspect s/he would be open to this.

Certainly not all owners who race birds would kill a bird that did not successfully complete a race. Unfortunately some do. Others just don't care. We are fortunate on this discussion board to have members who do care for and about their birds and who can fill you in on all the details about racing birds.

A more likely scenario is that you won't even get a return call from the owner. Or, as you have surmised, the bird was sold, and you may not even be able to locate the new owner. If that is the case, then let your conscience be your guide .. you did the right thing by trying to return the bird .. if the owner doesn't respond or can't be located, then I'm happy the bird ended up with you and your family.

As to the bands .. an identification band is inexpensive. A band purchased for a specific race may be quite valuable or also may be of little value .. depends on the race and the purse. You would have to get the details on this from our reputable members who race their birds. There are old posts in the archives about the scams involving trying to retrieve the "expensive" bands.

At any rate, you have done all the right things, and I hope things work out for both you and the bird.

Terry Whatley


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

so......welcome to the dark side of pigeon racing.......

Thank you for clueing me in, I wouldn't have guessed.

So I guess it's all relative, the expense of the band, the value of that particular bird, the distance the bird is found from the owner, the owner themselves. I guess I need to look it as more of a "sport" and less as having "pets". It's just that I'm an animal lover and it's hard for me to justify killing ANYTHING for no good reason. I put more value on life than that.

You talked about this being a homer but it has NBRC (national Birmingham roller club) on his band. So I'm assuming it's most likely a roller that was sold to someone in this area (band was sold in West Virginia, I'm in Iowa). 

Your causing me to rethink my quest for locating the owner. I have a phone # but now I'm hesitant to call it. I think I might ask point blank if he wants the bird back or if he just wants the band. Could I just send him the band? Hmmmmmm.......This puts a whole new twist on things. 

I'll let you know what I do.


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Spoke to contact given me by NBRC who might know registered owner as they supposedly live in the same state. As it turned out they don't (screw up on NBRC's part)

Anyway.......I asked him about the owner wanting the bird back just to kill the bird and get the band and he said "they wouldn't do that.....the bands cost about .12 ea."
He said what probably happened is someone around here probably bought the bird and it got lost and have no homing ability to find its way back home.

Anyway, the quest continues..............


----------



## Badragoon (Apr 22, 2002)

The owners of Racers or Rollers that have a club around here usually shoot them with a shotgun or feed them to their dogs. If they try to get away, they sic the Pointers after them. Then Pow. It is very cruel. I try to buy the birds from them before they do this. When the owner no longer wants them you get them for cheap. I say call him. If the band is not the snap on kind then you can't usually take them off. You can take them off by either cutting the band (which makes the band unusable) or cut off their feet. If he wants the band for reuse and it is not a snap on, then I would refuse to give him the bird.


----------



## raynjudy (Aug 22, 2000)

Yes, while you can't paint them all with one brush, some die-hard racing/performing lofts systematically cull/kill any of their little charges, that lose their way. The aim is the "purity" of the genome--a temporary state, at any rate. 

From a practical, insensitive stand point, the methodology is tried and true--it works.

But at what cost? Well, I suppose that depends on your values. To use Brian's coin analogy, there is another side.

I may well be accused of anthropomorphizing here, but...

The only analogy for human application that comes to mind from recent history, and hold onto your butts, is Nazi Germany.









This is anecdotal, but I always found it amusing that Hitler looked to be the exact opposite of his Arian ideal. Somehow, he had special dispensation. It seems most high leaders grant themselves that, doesn't it?

While it is not my aim to offend anybody, I will call a spade a spade. The analogy holds, regardless of any reaction to it.

--Ray


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Well I've got 3 local names that are NBRC members but am reluctant to call them now. 

Any NBRC members out there??

I would like to hear from you about this.

What say you?????


----------



## joann woodring (Mar 27, 2002)

When in doubt ... Don't


----------



## raynjudy (Aug 22, 2000)

Well, one might use guile, if you're good at it...

One might leave a general message at an odd hour. One might mention vet bills, and reimbursement--then wait for at least TWO call backs.

One might then ascertain, if they really want the pigeon back. If they were just going to snuff it, they would not persist in contacting you, would they?

Again, these are harsh realities. But do not paint all fanciers with the same brush. There are also many kind, compassionate people keeping pigeon lofts.

--Ray


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

Ya know...something about this just doesn't make any sense to me. Remember we're talking about a ROLLER pigeon here. The only reason I can think of that a person would want a roller back is because he valued the bird. The bands are cheap. I found a place on line whee you could buy 100 aluminum bands for .25 ea. You mean to tell me someone would kill a pigeon for a quarter? They feed them to their dogs or shoot them? Maybe so...but would someone drive even across town to retrieve a pigeon just to do that to it? 

So the way I see it....the only reason a person would want this bird back is if it was valuable to him as a live bird. But I would verify that with him before I would turn it over to him.

Am I missing something here??

Am I missing something here??


----------



## raynjudy (Aug 22, 2000)

No, you're not missing a thing.

I had not heard the "band thingy" before. 

I have had tens of e-mails from people who recovered a pigeon and found that the owner did not give a rap about getting it back.

I have called people on behalf of a recovered pigeon, that did not give a rap about getting it back.

I have had people I trust, tell me about the immediate culling/killing of an individual pigeon that did not fit the template.

I have had described to me, by my Judy, my soulmate, a live pigeon shoot, in the presence of her ex-hubby (there was a well known horsey vet there too, shotgun at the ready), while she stood, stunned at the "spectacle".

I have conversed with David Roth, president of the Urban Wildlife Society, and I know that these atrocities are real, if comparitively rare.

I know that many of us take out expensive insurance policies, for those contingencies,
that are comparatively rare.

No. You haven't missed a thing. 

Thank you for helping a pigeon!

PIGEONS FOREVER!!!

--Ray


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Marvin,

You are a quick study ... you have it figured!

Integrity says you should try to find the owner .. so try to.

Compassion says you already have the bird .. if the owner doesn't really want it back, then you have a lovely new addition to your family.

Just listen to what is and has been said to you and then make your decision. We are not the Roller Police here and want only the best for the bird.

You are to be commended for your efforts to find the owner, your honesty, and most of all for your love and concern for the bird.

Terry Whatley


----------



## marvin (May 2, 2002)

I know what all of you are saying is true.

I'd kind of forgoteen about it until I got into this but as I mentioned before we had pigeons when I was a kid. We also had Black Labs and my dad used to raise and train them.

I remember going with him to dog trials or to train dogs with his friends, and them using pigeons for these purposes. They would wrap masking tape around the bird taping his wings to his body, then throw him like a softball, or hide him in the weeds for the dog to retrieve. When finished, if the bird was still alive, they would rip the masking tape off of them tearing off their feathers with it. They also used to have little baskets that they would hide in the tall grass with pigeons under them and a piece of twine going back to someone who would pull the twine, the pigeon would fly up and they would shoot them. I can remember as I small boy (about 8 yrs. old) praying that the pigeon would escape, as occasionally did happen.

That was 40 years ago. I didn't agree with it then, and I don't agree with it now. 

There are people that would read this and say "so what, they were just pigeons". What is the diference between a pigeon, or a cat, or a dog, or a person? People have their own agenda, and if something doesn't fit into that agenda, it is expendable. I think a life is a life. And put more value on it then that.

I don't think I could get into the "roller" thing if it meant having to cull your birds. I wonder how many serious hobbyists DON'T do this practice? My impression is that it is a standard operating procedure. I guess I would have to catagorize myself as a "consciensious objector".

Well...time to check on the pigeon


----------



## bigbird (Aug 19, 2000)

Responsible culling means finding a suitable home for any birds that are culled from a loft for any reason other than sickness. Many racing and show pigeon breeders thing that culling means pulling their heads off so they can rid the world of an undesirable bird. They do not look at life in the same way as I do. 
Carl


----------



## Scuiry (Jul 11, 2001)

> Originally posted by fred2344:
> *Many fanciers kill the lost birds in order to retrieve the bands so that they can be placed on a baby bird.
> I'm sorry you looked so hard to find the owner. Pray that this is not going to be the bird's fate.
> 
> ...


Is that the reason? I thought it was because a downed homer is probably sick and not likely to recover or because such a bird would not be good for the gene pool in a loft.


----------

