# Best methods for taming my pet pidgies?



## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

Alrighty, so my pair of pidgies have been in my home for a little over 2 months acclimating to inside life, and I want to try to train them to be a little more tame. I started out kind of rough since they had coccidia and the vet gave me a medicine that was oral 2x/day, so my birds don't trust me at all. If they're hungry, Henry (the male) will sometimes eat seeds out of my hand, but Willow (the female) would rather stay on the nest and starve than come near me. I've heard that food is a great motivator, but since Willow was underweight I wanted to keep food in the cage at all times to encourage her to eat when I'm not there since apparently that's when she eats.

Does anyone have any tips or tricks to train me to train them? I'm familiar with basic training methods for other animals, but these are my first pidgies (or birds, for that matter), so I'm a little clueless. I've read a lot of conflicting things too regarding whether or not to handle them daily or to keep hands off and let them come to you, so any insight into pigeon behavior and psychology would be great! Do parrot training methods work for pigeons? I don't necessarily want them to do tricks or even be cuddly, I just want them to stop being afraid of my hands. Thank you!


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

What med did you have to give them 2X a day?
Food isn't a motivator if they are forced to come to you for food. That isn't gaining trust. Since you've read both on handling daily or hands off till they come to you, then it doesn't seem to make sense to post it over again. These are birds, not puppies. You cannot force a bird, you have to get him to want to. If they are afraid of your hands, then grabbing them every day seems counter productive to me. Be patient and let them get used to you. Build trust...........not fear.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> What med did you have to give them 2X a day?
> Food isn't a motivator if they are forced to come to you for food. That isn't gaining trust. Since you've read both on handling daily or hands off till they come to you, then it doesn't seem to make sense to post it over again. These are birds, not puppies. You cannot force a bird, you have to get him to want to. If they are afraid of your hands, then grabbing them every day seems counter productive to me. Be patient and let them get used to you. Build trust...........not fear.


It was a sulfa drug of some sort (I don't remember the name), the vet said since I only have two birds it would be better to give it to them orally to make sure they got the proper dose rather than put it in their water since the amount they drink is variable. This was about a month ago, and I haven't touched them since because I don't want them to be afraid of me. Before I tried anything else actively, I wanted to learn more first. The last thing I want to do is damage my relationship with my birds.

I really wish there was a book or something for me to read up on bird psychology, specifically with pigeons. I can find all sorts of things with parrots, but I don't know if it's applicable. Do you know of any resources where I could learn more? I want to do what's best for them.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Take your time and give them time to trust you. All pigeons love chopped unsalted peanuts or sunflower hearts. Mix just a bit in their feed so they will eventually try them. When they do, they will love them. Eventually, they will come to you for the treat. But for now you don't force them. Be around them a lot without trying to pick them up. Talk to them. They will get used to you. Where are they kept?


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

I have them in a double decker ferret cage in my computer room. It is almost 6 feet tall, 24 inches deep, and 36 inches wide. They have enough room to flutter from shelf to shelf without their wings touching the sides. (They're old german owl's so they're kind of small). I have 3 shelves for them to sit on, and a nest bowl on the top shelf that they use a lot. I sit about 4 feet away from them at my computer every day, and they can hear me talking on the phone and such. They seem to be totally fine with my presence until I stand up. I always make sure to move very slowly to try not to be scary, and every time I go into the cage I make sure they see me putting a handful of seed mix next to their food dish (they normally get free choice Roudybush crumble). I'm hoping maybe one day they associate me with extra treats.

I will try the peanuts and sunflower hearts! They don't seem interested in safflower seeds that much. Henry will occasionally come down to peck a few seeds out of my hand when he's out of the cage (he's much more adventurous), but usually they opt for their boring every day food instead no matter how long I sit super still in the middle of the floor with seeds offered. Henry will peck a few seeds, then jump back in the cage!

Every time I open the cage doors, they freeze, and if I reach in to change the water or the food, they run away and panic, no matter how slowly I move. It makes me very sad.

They're already 2 years old and lived in a loft before, so I expected it to take a while, but I didn't think they would still be this fearful after 2 months... 

By the way, thank you so much for taking the time to help me think through this. I really appreciate it! I guess right now I'm also partially venting frustration, so I really appreciate you reading through and responding. I wish I could talk to them, even for just 5 minutes to tell them I love them!


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

They will tame I think if you are patient. An adult racer we adopted, Lucy, would freeze or fly whenever we approached, for five months. Now she is very tame.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

cwebster said:


> They will tame I think if you are patient. An adult racer we adopted, Lucy, would freeze or fly whenever we approached, for five months. Now she is very tame.


Thank you for the encouragement. I guess more than anything I need to work on being patient.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I have a rescue loft. Many of the birds I have gotten in were very unfriendly when they arrived. Some from lofts that either didn't handle them nicely, or often. Some are feral pigeons who were not handled at all and who were pretty wild.
I get them in for a reason. Most are sick or injured on arrival, so they need handling and medicating. And that is the beginning of our relationship. Not helpful. But afterwards, when they are feeling better, they are often let out in the living room where we spend time. If you do that late in the day, then it is easy to catch them without chasing them. Let it get dark, turn out the lights, locate them before you do, and walk over and pick them up to place them in the cage. They usually won't fly in the dark as they can't see well. Although I did have one that would. LOL. They get the exercise they need, and learn that they can go about their business on their own without being grabbed. Being kept in a cage 24/7 doesn't help them to calm down any. I try to make friends before putting them out in the loft with the others. 
Once in the loft, I offer treats to them. First it is mixed in their feed so that they will try it. Then when I offer the say, chopped peanuts in my hand, they won't usually come near me. So then I give it to that bird by leaving them just near him. Usually they will come around and take them from me. On occasion I get one who will just never calm down. I don't force it with that bird. I let him have his space. I have one bird who panics whenever you go near him, but he is now mated up to one of my friendliest and favorite hens, so he is slowly getting used to me. Some don't take very long, but others can take a looooooooooooong time. Each is different, and if the bird was handled badly before, or if he is just a high strung bird, it can take a while. Your birds need to get out of that cage. Right now they probably see you as their jailer. LOL. Just cover things with towels or something to protect them from droppings. It will get better.
Where are you located?


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

I'm about an hour east of Atlanta, GA. Forgive me for not being more specific, I'm kind of paranoid on the internet . I have been letting my pidgies out of the cage (almost) every day for an hour or two before sunset. Henry will actually put himself away if I turn all the lights off except one lamp so he can see, so I don't even have to be scary and grab him in the dark, which is nice. Willow isn't quite as cooperative when she comes out on her own, but she follows Henry when they come out together.

I have good news though, I did as you suggested and mixed a few pieces of raw peanut and other various seeds in with their food so they would try it, and yesterday when I sat on the floor and offered seeds and peanuts in my hand, both of them ate from my hand!  

Henry had done it before, but this is the very first time Willow has even offered to come near me willingly, and she ate a few bites from my hand. She alarm coo's at me still, but it was a good first step. 

I'm trying very hard to be patient, and it's working.  Thank you for your encouragement and advice.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If they will come to your hand to be fed, and they haven't had to go without food in order to do that, then that is wonderful. It's a beginning. Get them hooked on chopped unsalted peanuts, and they will come for it. You are doing a good job, and they will come, slowly, but they will come.

You have to understand that they either were not handled at all before you, or maybe not gently. They have no reason to trust a human. And they are afraid of hands anyway. So they just need to learn to trust you. I think they will.


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## wiggles and puddles (Sep 3, 2015)

I have two indoor pigeons like you. I have found that my two really like some bird toys. For my two, they like anything multicolored, multi textured and has a bell. They like to play with that until they come out for around the house time, and then they are more calm, more cuddly, and generally want to sit on my head or shoulder, who ever gets what spot first. Another treat they like is chopped up lettuce. They go bonkers for that. My guys are picky and want _Butter_ lettuce. Your male seems the most interested in you, so after he gets more comfortable eating from your hand, sometime when he is out of the cage and he has perched himself somewhere, go to him and see if he will eat out of your hand out of the cage as a next step. The female will watch and should join in at some point. It is all about baby steps. Maybe after they are good with that you can see if they will hop on your hand for a treat, and yes, you can train them to do things, they are VERY smart. Find a favorite treat, and only use it as a treat associated with teaching them how good you are, they will catch on. I would not act scared or slow around them when you go to pick them up or go in their cage. You are showing a sense of fear, and they are picking up on it. Be confident, be gentle, make it a routine, and they will understand that it is not something to be afraid of. 

Do you have them near a window, or someplace they can see out? I don't mean in front of, just near by, so they could see out? Also, do you leave the tv running, or a radio near enough and long enough during the day for the birds to hear more of a constant human voice to help get them used to people?


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

wiggles and puddles said:


> Do you have them near a window, or someplace they can see out? I don't mean in front of, just near by, so they could see out? Also, do you leave the tv running, or a radio near enough and long enough during the day for the birds to hear more of a constant human voice to help get them used to people?


I have their cage positioned where half of it is next to the window and half of it is not so they can choose where they want to be. Leaving a radio or tv on is a good idea to desensitize them against human voices! It would benefit my dog too, I think.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

Just as an update, I have been leaving the cage open to let them come and go as they please as much as I possibly can, and they seem much more comfortable with everything now. I have been offering them a seed mix that is different from their normal diet as a treat since I have no idea what they like (they have ignored the peanuts and the safflower seeds and the sunflower hearts!!), and that seems to work alright. Willow actually flew over and landed on my desk next to me this afternoon! As soon as she did though, the pigeon I'm temporarily keeping for a friend of mine made a giant racket and scared the daylights out of us both. I'm not sure if she'll fly over to the desk again any time soon, but I feel that today was good progress regardless. 

I feel like something loud and scary always happens elsewhere in the house as soon as we start to have a friendly bonding moment! It's frustrating, but that's life. *shrug*


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That's wonderful. She came to you. Big step in the right direction. Well done! Peanuts, safflower and sunflower are just treats. Too much is not good for them. Thanks for letting us know.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

Henry suddenly started acting terrified of me. I checked him out, and he doesn't seem to have anything medically wrong with him, including his poop (which I looked at under a microscope). I had to grab him to check to make sure his eyes and throat were clear and I think that broke whatever small shred of trust was left by doing that. Now Willow is acting distrustful of me too, probably because I had to pick Henry up and he struggled and didn't like it. I am about to give up. I'm back to square one. Maybe they're acting weird because my friend's male bird is here, but I put a divider up so they can't see each other and he's been here over a month and they were fine up until just recently.

Do pigeons go through any sort of hormonal changes at this time of year that would make them act terrified suddenly for no reason? Willow is even back to alarm calling when I walk near, and neither of them will take treats from me anymore. My heart is broken, and I have no idea what happened to scare them so much.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I don't understand why they would all of a sudden get more terrified of you. If you chase them to catch them, that would do it. Picking him up to look at him wouldn't make that much difference. Don't understand what the problem is. There are some that just never tame up. All are different.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

I had changed nothing in our routine, and one day he was suddenly extremely skittish. That's why I wanted to look at him to make sure he wasn't sick. If I need to look at him closely to make sure he's healthy, how am I supposed to do that without chasing him to catch him?

Warning: rant ahead. I apologize in advance.

I suppose my problem is that my expectations for having them as pets did not match up with reality. People on here and on the Palomacy website keep saying what good, wonderful pets pigeons are, and I'm trying really, really hard to have a good relationship with them, but nothing I do is working. I keep seeing happy pictures of happy pigeons in adorable pants hanging out with their happy people, but mine are scared of me and I can't even figure out what treats they like because they freeze when my hand enters the cage and ignore me when they're out in the room.

They're still scared of my hands, despite me working with them every day with treats all over the place. Not that they particularly like any of the "treats" I'm trying to give them anyway. :/ They freeze until I put the treat down and walk away, and then they sometimes maybe eat it. Usually they ignore it until later, and at that point I think they don't associate me with it like I want them to anyway. 

None of the positive reinforcement type stuff I'm trying to do with them is working, and I'm at my wit's end. Every time things start looking like they're going well, something happens that I'm apparently too obtuse to notice and their trust evaporates, leaving me crestfallen.

I'm thinking that they were too used to loft life not being handled, and I'm starting to think they might be happier if they were returned to an outdoor aviary situation to live in peace. I don't want to give them up, but I don't want them to be scared all the time either. I don't know what to do.

...
On the bright side, my friend's pigeon rode around on my shoulder and preened my eyebrow today, so that was nice. It's like he could tell I was frustrated and was trying to make me feel better.  He was easy, he loves barley, so I trained him to step up onto my arm so I wouldn't have to chase him around. That's one of the reasons I'm so frustrated with mine. I would LOVE to train mine to step up so I wouldn't have to chase them around anymore, but they won't have it.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Have had several,pigeons. They have all gotten extremely tame but with some it takes patience plus at times for example when they are laying eggs they revert back to being territorial or afraid. The more time you spend with them and the more you are patient, the tamer they get. Would just keep trying. Out friendliest pigeon, Phoebe, would sit on our shoulders and groom us while we sat at a desktop and watched tv. Trust takes time.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't work with all pigeons. It could just be their high strung nature, or maybe they were handled roughly. Maybe even you have done something in the handling to scare them more. I have rescues, so they come from all kinds of situations, and most have eventually gotten used to me and accepted me. But to different degrees of course. Some will become friendly, but sometimes one will just not. They will run wildly if you get too close, they will growl or make that warning sound they make. Who knows why. But in a loft situation, it doesn't matter so much. I can enjoy the friendlier ones, and just accept those others for how they are. As a pet though, it's different. You want a bird that likes you and is comfortable with you. That isn't always going to happen. I also think it's easier in a loft situation, because I can go in and try to work with the scared ones to get them to come closer for treats and such. They see the others that are comfortable with me, and often that does help. It also isn't necessary to me that they come around totally, so I don't push them. In a house pet kind of situation, people often push it and try to rush the birds to accept them. That only makes things worse. Also, when kept in a loft, You can just walk in and spend time, and hope that they get used to you. When kept in the house in a cage, it just isn't the same thing. Pigeons can be good house pets, but not necessarily. They are all different, and with pigeons, you really need to accept them for who they are, not try to make them be how you want them to be. I think sometimes people have expectations that the bird just isn't going to meet. Maybe another pet would be a better fit.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

I think that for now, I'm going to try to accept that they don't want to be handled, and that they probably won't ever. It is about that time for Willow to start laying eggs again, as they just abandoned the fakes I had put in, so maybe it is hormonal. Who knows. I was very frustrated yesterday, and I really appreciate your patient replies.

I think I did try to rush it too fast, thinking back. Pretty much as soon as they started getting comfortable with eating from my hand, I tried to pet them. And then I was paranoid that every cough or sneeze was illness and I picked them up a lot to check. I think those were my mistakes. I handled them too much too quickly, even though I meant well.

I'm going to start over from the beginning. It will probably take even more time since I rushed it, but I want to see if we can eventually enjoy each other's company with a completely hands off approach. And this time, I'll try not to rush it or get frustrated. If they still seem unhappy after a few weeks of no handling, I'll try to find a better home for them where they will be happy. In the mean time, I'll spend more time with my dog to get my animal affection out of my system.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

ArgentBadger, hopefully with time and patience and just talking to them a lot without trying to handle them, they will get friendlier.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I think that's probably what happened. Most pigeons don't like being petted. They like being able to come to you, but not being picked up and petted. They will follow you around, and hang out near you, but don't want to be picked up and petted.

Also harder with a pair of birds, then with a lone pigeon. They have each other so don't really need you as much. But that is actually a healthier relationship. When a lone bird is viewing you as their mate, that isn't really a healthy relationship. That is a very confused bird trying to adjust to a human world. Not great for the bird. They should be allowed to be birds. Birds want the companionship of other birds. Trying to make them a pet like a puppy or kitten, isn't what they want, or even what they are made for. We have to accept them on their terms, not ours. They may never be the kind of pet you are looking for, but in the mean time, I'm sure your dog will appreciate the extra attention.


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

After a week of leaving them alone, I'm happy to report that Willow has returned to cautiously eating seeds out of my hand. Henry, on the other hand, is still acting really sketchy. When I let him out, he flies up to the highest piece of furniture he can find and stares at me like I'm going to eat him if he moves. Eventually he returns to the cage on his own when he's hungry or when I turn the lights down, and that's when I close them back up. I'm really wondering if there's something medical going on, even though none of their fecals showed parasite eggs under the microscope and his throat looked clear when I checked it last week (back when I was so frustrated, haha).

The only reason I'm so worried about his behavior specifically is that when I very first got him, he was the adventurous one who would always come eat seeds from my hand and he was so sweet, even when he was loaded down with worms and cocci. Hopefully it will just take some more time to get him back to his happy self.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He was probably so sweet because he didn't feel well then. Now maybe he is feeling better. They are usually a lot more docile, and friendly appearing when not well.
You also said that you chased them a lot and kept handling them and checking them. Pigeons hate that. He probably doesn't trust that you aren't going to grab him now. Why would he?


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## ArgentBadger (Apr 25, 2016)

Good points. I honestly hadn't considered that he might have been more friendly when he wasn't feeling well and more skittish when he felt better. I had assumed it would be the opposite! That's what assumptions get me. 

I'm learning more every day! I'll take it to mean that now I need to gain healthy Henry's trust now that I know his true personality.


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