# 'Anatomy' - Some views of a Pigeon's Skull -



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi all, 



I found a deceased Pigeon recently, under one of the neighbors parked cars. The resident Ants and sundry microbes and so on had done their work, and what remained was in effect a feathered skeletan.

I gently removed the Skull with the intention of studying it, and thought you may find some images of it to be useful to your appreciations also.

The upper mandible-beak is especially delicate in it's girder-engineering and enforcements.

We can see also how and where the lower mandible actually hinges, which is much further down and back than one may have expected.

We can see here also, how both upper and lower Beak are in reality such very thin bone mandibles, whose normal in-life covering is of the keratinaceous material of 'Beak' proper, of which a little remains here at the tips.

Lastly, just to blather on a little more, we can note how truely large the Eyes are, which we easily may not notice when they are surrounded by Feathers.

http://community.webshots.com/album/469522890oHJDLd


Love, 

Phil
Las Vegas


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Thanks for sharing those photos! Although I looked and looked and still can't 
figure out how Walter fits in all that oneryness!


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Another excellent series of photos, Phil. I know the subject is sad and that many will not want to look, but some of us =need= to see and know this stuff, so thank you!

Terry


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Terry,


Thank you!


Yes...

I for one found this very helpful, since I had not really appreciated how their Beaks are more coverings for very sophisticated, delicate bone Mandibles.

\Nor had I understood the manner of how their lower mandible hinges.

Other Bird's Beaks-Mandibles will differ of course, but as for our beloved columbiformes...

I can see now very well, the 'bridge' of the Girder-arrangement of the upper mandible, which on my Crow-Baby had been pecked away for his upper Beak subsequently to distort and curve around as it does.

At one time I had supposed that their entire Beak was 'like' a nail or claw in it's structure, as if it grew out in the same manner as those items do, but of course, that is not the case at all.

How large their eyes are!

Wow...


I am temtped, when I find another similar deceased one, to see if I might preserve and mount the Skeletan entirely.

It would help me enourmously to understand then, the kinds of injuries to Wings, Thighs, Hips, Keels and so on, which we sometimes confront, and so aid me or others in imagining how to 'set' or address them for healing.

I realize now the value of preserved and mounted skeletans for being able to envision what is so hard TO envision in a live model/patient. Especialy if one has never seen the actual structure in three-dimensions, merely as itself.

Recourse to drawings on the internet and so on had not informed me anywhere near as well as this little Skull has...


Phil
Las Vegas


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Phil, 

Those pictures of the skull are quite interesting. What I found most surprising as well is the hollowness of the upper mandible. The beak as a whole just looks so fragile and delicate. I guess pigeons don't need a hard, solid beak that some birds have to tear, peck and grapple with prey or other food sources. Pecking seeds is easy, simple work requiring a simpler beak.

I've seen pictures of the skulls of other birds and they look much more sturdy than a pigeons. A crow's beak is like you thought the pigeon's would be. The upper mandible is all one structure with no hollowness to it, except for the holes where the nostrils are. Other birds like parrots, hawks, owls, have sturdier beaks as well.

Nearly all birds have huge eyes that take up a good 2/3rd of their skull. The larger owls have bigger eyeballs than humans do. And ostriches have humungous eyeballs!

Thanks for the pics,


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

The third dimension makes such a difference - the skull looks so fragile! You can see how easily infections could move from one area to another, since they are only separated by thin membranes.

On the first picture, there is a rough spot just behing the beak and between the eyes. Does this seem to be an injury or is this normal? Is the wide piece at the base of the beak (looks like it would be under the cere) bone or cartilege? How that area develops is intriguing.

The small hole halfway down the lower mandible on both sides seems to flow forward into a groove along the lower mandible. Is this space for some part of the salivary glands?


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

*Possible*

to make those photos a sticky? When available, future bone structures could be added (legs, wings, etc.)

Could be quite a help to those who have the means/ability to work in rehabilitating injured pijjies and/or have no access to an avian vet...


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Mr Squeaks,

What a great idea!


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hmmmm...

If the Moderators did wish to make a 'sticky' of this, I would be glad to see if I might make some better images for it.

These were fairly casual and could be done closer up even.

But I think it would certainly be a good idea for me to learn how to clean and mount an entire skeletan...and to photograph it well for our studies and understandings.

As well as to do emphasis for specific areas such as the Wings, Skull, Legs-Hips, and Tail-back areas, and so on.



Phil
Las Vegas


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I think this would make a great sticky, Phil, great job.

The eye holes are truly large, and now I understand why when a pigeon has an eye issue or a blow around the eye, that he more then likely will lose the sight of that eye.

I can also see why colds and stuff spread easily from the infected eye to the other eye, and also nasal colds, because it is all so close together.


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Phil and all, 

Here is a crow skull for comparison. It actually has many of the same features as the pigeon skull just with a much larger beak. There are even the same holes in the bottom mandible.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

What struck me was how tiny and vulnerable their little skulls are. maggie


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## Larry_Cologne (Jul 6, 2004)

*Pigeon skull*

For years I had a pigeon mummy (found in the dust of a church bell tower in the Netherlands in June 1990. My wife eventually made me get rid of it as she was tired of living with "dead things" (old books, photos, memories, etc.) in our one-room apartment. I kept the skull, but cannot locate it. 
For two months I have had a deep-frozen pigeon in our small refrigerator in the hopes of finding someone who would be interested in determining cause of death (e.g. a vet school). On a Tuesday afternoon in August I brought home a weak and immobile pigeon, very light, with almost no breast muscle. I weighed it at about 200 grams (28,5 grams = 1 ounce), fed it. It ate and pooped. Wednesday morning it weighed 220 grams. In the afternoon it mostly slept, fluffed up. Thursday morning at 5:55 it woke me when it fell over dead. It weighed 179 grams. Perhaps I will mummify it next week (low prolonged heat in oven, with dessicant silica gel for moisture absorption) when my wife is out of town for a week. We have a young pigeon in the apartment right now, apparently successfully integrating with our street group of 7 pigeons, and I have to be aware of contamination issues.
I read a book ten or fifeen years ago on the history of the Smithsonian Institute, in which it discussed using weevils (?) or dung beetles (?) in large vats with cadavers. The insects ate away the flesh and soft tissue, and at the appropriate time they would put in a fresh cadaver for the insects to work on. Ths way they assembled their collection of skeletons. If the insects were not introduced to a fresh cadaver, they would eventually eat the skeleton also. This procedure provided clean, white bones in the correct anatomical positions. Something to consider.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

This is an interesting area...!

Sometime soon I will do some 'Googles' and see what I may learn on what-to-do for cleaning, preserving and mounting a Skeleton entire.

Certainly the Ants here would be glad to aid me, if asked.

There is a feral Cat with whom I have been flirting for about five or six years now, who recently, has been stealthily comeing into my Workshop to catch Mice. She has never bothered the Bird in quarenteen out there, and, so far as I know, does not appear to ever bother the Birds outside.

Very rarely have I seen any clues of predation in the deceased Pigeons I sometimes find. Usually, they are in effect, 'Mummies' with sometimes evidence of perhaps Ants or other small beings having removed the internal and underlieing tissues and so on, leaving the skin, feathers and bones intact.

I have not shown the little Skull to any of my present Birds, but sometime I will, to see what they may indicate as for appearences of interest or curiousity. I am sure they would know what it is, even as Elephants and others are known to of their bretherin's bones...

I will keep you all abreast of my progress in this...

Thank you for your interest and encouragement!


Phil
Las Vegas


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## TerriB (Nov 16, 2003)

Brad, thanks for posting the photo of the crow's skull for comparison. Regarding the hole in the lower mandible, I checked on Walter and tissue covers that part of the beak, so perhaps that's where the blood vessels and nerves emerge? On the pigeon skull, this hole is approximately in the middle of the mandible, whereas the crow's mandible has about 80% anterior to the hole. That should give the pigeon better leverage and a stronger grip with similar amounts of muscle.

Lady Tarheel - yes, so fragile!


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## poco (Mar 20, 2005)

*Thank you for the photos*

Hello,
I really found your photos interesting. Thank you for posting these (and all the others).
Poco


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi Phil,

Thanks for posting these pics, to be of use for all involved in rescue work. Wonder what the birds in your area did before you became their dedicated advocate???

fp


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## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Phil, I commend you for the very interesting thread and pictures of a pigeon skull that you shared with us.

It is amazing how small in comparison the the otherwise large body a pigeon otherwise has.

Lady Tarheel is right in stating how vulnerable their little heads are. 

Thank you for sharing.


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