# torn crop in baby pigeon



## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I have been flooded with babies, in the past two weeks I had five coming in. Anyways, just now I brought home a 10 day old baby. I noticed seeds and some cooked food sauce in the carrier and his tummy was all caked with it so I took him out to wash his tummy and noticed more and more is coming out. After I managed to clean his chest I noticed a big part of the skin flap coming loose and you can see his inside. I can see the crop but not where it is torn. I gave a little water and it is coming out from above the flap (from inside) I don't know if the description is clear enough but you get the picture. 
He doesn't look too good and I doubt he can make it. I called the lady from the raptor center back (where he came from) but she is gone for the day.
I don't know what to do here, any ideas?

Reti


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

Sounds like you need to see a vet. Is there one nearby? Others will be on soon and they may have another solution for you. Good luck!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

wolfwood said:


> Sounds like you need to see a vet. Is there one nearby? Others will be on soon and they may have another solution for you. Good luck!


The vet is 170$ to walk in the door after hours (emergency fee). And honestly I don't think this baby would make it through anesthesia and extensive surgery to repair the damage.

Reti


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

You might be surprised. They really do quite well.
Perhaps we can raise the funds here to pay for having the crop repaired.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thanks Charis. I got hold of the rehabber and I will take him back to her in the morning, they do have vets and experts on staff. Hope the little guy will make it through the night. 
She suggested to tube some water, but as far as I go with the syringe and tube the water is still spilling out. I am injecting some sterile water subcutaneously to keep the guy hydrated.
I am sure he has internal bleeding as his tummy is distended and the skin turns blue. The vet bill in this case would be in the thousands and we don't even know how extensive the damage is, it doesn't look good though.

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I'm so sorry to hear about this little one, I hope he makes it to the rehabbers'.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

He made it through the night and is a little perkier today.
I am not sure about taking him to the rehabber now, what if they put him to sleep. He certainly has a strong will to live. I gave him two medium sized pellets and I am waiting to see if they will be digested, if they do and I continue hydrating him with subcutaneous fluids maybe the wound can heal on its own? 
How long does it take for such wounds to heal?

Reti


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Reti...if the food is coming out the way you say, it probably won't heal on its own. and it does need to be stitched up if there is enough to stitch. Sometimes there isn't. I think this bird needs a vet rather than a rehabber.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Charis said:


> Reti...if the food is coming out the way you say, it probably won't heal on its own. and it does need to be stitched up if there is enough to stitch. Sometimes there isn't. I think this bird needs a vet rather than a rehabber.


yes the vet may beable to use a "glue" vetbond, that they sometimes use for small or delicate tissue, then he may need to be fed small numerouse meals instead of a full one at one time.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

spirit wings said:


> yes the vet may beable to use a "glue" vetbond, that they sometimes use for small or delicate tissue, then he may need to be fed small numerouse meals instead of a full one at one time.


Yes that would work if there is enough tissue to glue....sometimes there isn't.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I also think he needs a vet and the only one who will see this bird is the one who will also charge two arms and two legs. I am stuck here. Today he will charge the emergency fee and tomorrow he is out. He works only four days a week.
I had another look and seems like his insides are torn pretty bad. I flushed with some water and got a couple more seeds out but no pellets so I gave three more.
I don't know if the glue would work there is too much damage there.
I will sent an email off to my old vet see what he has to say.

Reti


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Can you hold him somewhat upright while food and water's getting through? The rip in the actual crop is obviously over to the side somewhere out of view--won't be that far. Get a magnifying glass and a small flashlight and see if you can look inside.

Pidgey


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Pidgey said:


> Can you hold him somewhat upright while food and water's getting through? The rip in the actual crop is obviously over to the side somewhere out of view--won't be that far. Get a magnifying glass and a small flashlight and see if you can look inside.
> 
> Pidgey


Did that and flushed the wound. Lots more seeds came out and the pellets. The rip seems to be on the front of the crop, including lower part of the esophagus and all the ways down more than halfway of the crop.
Doesn't seem there is much that can be done here. 

Reti


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Can you take and post a picture?

Pidgey


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Charis said:


> Yes that would work if there is enough tissue to glue....sometimes there isn't.


true, but I tend to be optimistic.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Be sure and look at this one:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f45/self-destructing-32635.html#post348246

...which was a continuation of this one:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f45/hit-by-car-32225.html

I talked with Reti on the phone about this one. Yes, it's a difficult presentation--there's actually a hole on either side of the crop, one side being over a couple of inches long and in the shape of a "U" or "J". Crop contents can come out both sides and can flow down subcutaneously to the area between the legs. Now that's not inside the actual abdomen--it's just subcutaneous. So, if Reti just tapes, glues or sutures the skin together at the wound, food and water will flow down there. However, some would make it into the proventriculus and, therefore, the system to be used to live another day. Management of the other problems will turn into exactly that: management. It's not so different to what Pierpont was like. In cases like this, it usually takes more courage to emotionally deal with things and do what has to be done under the circumstances.

Pidgey


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Dear Reti,

I just want to send you many good wishes; what you are doing takes tons of courage and strength! I'm not so experienced with wounds, but the ones I've seen in my wild doves have healed strikingly quickly. I had one male dove who had the side of his whole chest torn right open as well as talon wounds from a hawk attack. He was walking and flying the next day, and seemed much better within the week. They are very hardy birds, so don't give up hope.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Well, the wound of this little one is much bigger and when If lift the skin flap there is much empty space. Actually I think I am looking into the crop. I inserted a tube down his throat and it comes out, dangling in what used to be the crop. Very extensive wound. I am thinking even the vet would put him to sleep.
Now if my old vet was here, he likes to experiment and maybe we could insert and suture a tube into the small intestine and then suture the crop and until that heals feed him through the intestinal tube, something like a PEG tube.
When Lee gets home I will try to get some pics so you can see what I am talking about.
I have Ringer's solution, now if I could get a vein and inject some of it, it might buy us some time.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Reti, I'm so sorry this little one has such terrible injuries. I know he is in good hands, and that you are keeping him as comfy as is possible.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

> I have Ringer's solution, now if I could get a vein and inject some of it, it might buy us some time.


Why not do SQ?

Jennifer


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

jenfer said:


> Why not do SQ?
> 
> Jennifer


That would be the best.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I think he would benefit more of it if it was iv rather than sq.
I am giving sq and he is so perked up, he is squeaking for food right now. Breaks my heart.

Reti


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Hi Reti............I have been following this thread........all I can say is God Bless You for all that you have done and are doing for this poor little pidg. It breaks my heart to hear that he is squeaking for food and there is no way to get any into him right now. IV or SQ Ringers solution is the only chance this little one has right now. Hopfully you will be able to find a vet that can insert an intestinal tube and properly suture his crop. 

Please know that my thoughts and prayers are with you and this little one. I know you are doing everything that is possible.

Please keep us posted.

Regards,\
Louise


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you Louise. It is heartbreaking.
I followed pidgeys advice and closed the whole area on the skin with silvadene and xerofoam wrap and kerlix on top. Then I gave some well soaked pellets, maybe they get somewhere where they can be digested. More Ringer's and in the morning I will flush and repeat the process. 
I will however give more Ringer's throughout the night.

Luckily he was a plump pidgey to begin with, he still has some reserves.

I uplaoded a blurry pic in my profile, but you might get the idea of what is going on.

Reti


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti.........The picture is so sad.........the wound is so extensive. He/She is sooooooooo cute and appears to be fairly alert. I hope with the wrap some of the nutrition from the pellets get through. This is really heartbreaking. I pray this little one recovers. Keep doing what you are doing.........this little one has made it this far......he/she is definately a little fighter.

I will continue to pray for you both.

Regards,
Louise


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Reti,

That is such an extensive injury, its shocking to see it. You are so brave to keep taking the necessary steps which will give it a chance to live...after this, i don't think anything could phase you! I hope it digests the pellets and makes it through the night ok. You are an incredible person.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you Louise and Bella. This little one is the worst I've ever seen. Still hanging in there, so will give him some more ringer's solution.

Reti


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Did you find a vein ok? This must be so hard on you


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I haven't looked for a vein, he won't sit still as he wants to eat and keeps on pecking my fingers.
I give it still sq.

Reti


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Ah thats so hard, Reti, seeing him so hungry and wanting to survive, but having such a slim chance. Do you use pain relief in these cases, or does that make things worse?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

You're probably really watching to see what comes out the back end--if we get some poop with solids then we know we've got a chance.

Pidgey


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I don't think he is in pain, he might feel some discomfort but he is way too alert and eager to eat.
We have only one tiny little green slimy poop from last night, guess nothing got really digested.
Got to think what to do next now.

Reti


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Might be your only option left is to go tube-fishing for the bottom of the crop to the entrance of the thoracic esophagus (that goes between the crop and the proventriculus). If you can make your way there and get the tube basically down to the proventriculus, you've got a chance at getting feed through. You need to use a fairly soft tube for this. The actual entry point into the thorax is in the crux of the "V" defined by the two coracoids so study these drawings and think it through:

http://people.eku.edu/ritchisong/skeleton.html

Basically, you're fishing for a port of entry that's less than a centimeter forward of the actual vertebral column where it's attached to the back. So, as a bird normally stands, it's actually pretty high up there ABOVE the crop proper. The elasticity of the crop typically has to lift the contained food up to that drain hole OR the bird has to be kept vertical for gravity to do the job.

Pidgey


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thanks Pidgey. The bird is at the vets in surgery as I type this.
The vet said it is pretty bad as he might not have enough crop tissue to suture but if that is the case he will insert a feeding tube which will stay in for 10 days till whatever is left from the crop heals.
He will also feed him after the surgery.
I will know in a an hour or so of how the surgery went and what he did.
I just hope he makes it through the surgery.

Reti


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Thank you for taking the baby to the vet, Reti.
Let us know the costs so we can start a fund. I think that would be more than appopriate.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you Charis. The estimate was around 500$ will know for sure later. This is a very good price considering. I am forever grateful to my vet. A local friend will help also.
Thanks again.

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Reti,

I'm glad you got the baby to the vet.

Any update on the little one yet?


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

I'm glad you're hanging in there with the baby, and that the vet isn't giving up either. I paid close to $300 to have a simple crop fistula sutured, so $500 for this kind of extensive repair does not seem too bad in comparison.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Just called the clinic. Everything went excellent I am on my way to get him.
I am not complaining about the fee jenfer. It is more than fair.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Reti said:


> Just called the clinic. Everything went excellent I am on my way to get him.


I am so glad to hear that.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Reti, I am so happy to read your update.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

I knew you weren't complaining, Reti! Just musing out loud and offering a comparison. And even though it's reasonable for the skill/work required, $500 in one shot is still a lot of $.  Is this the same vet who you initially didn't want to go to?

Jennifer


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

Great news!


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti............. Thank you ever so much for taking this baby to the Vet. I am so relieved that this little one made it through the surgery. I was praying for this little one to survive. Hopefully he will now be able to get some nutrition into him. It's amazing the will to live that these little one's have, but without all your dedication and care this little one had no chance at all. It was so heartbreaking knowing how hungry he was and his begging for food. It really broke my heart.

I think Charis has a great idea setting up a fund to help with the cost for this little one's Vet bills. I personally would love to contribute to his care. 

You are an angel for all that you have done for this bird. I can't wait to hear updates about him.

God bless both you and the little one.

Louise


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Reti,
Bless you for giving this little one the 'special' care he so deserves. I am also glad to hear you decided to seek the assistance of a vet. 

Bless you, *sweet baby*, for hanging in there. 

I will be in contact with Charis regarding the fund as Chuck and I will be more than happy to make a contribution. 

You two take care and please do post updates as time permits.

Cindy


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Wonderful news, Reti! I'm glad the surgery went well and hope that the little one will have a full and quick recovery.

Terry


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you all so much.
This is an amazing bird, what can I say. 
It is the vet I initially was reluctant to go (the only good one down here), it was the financial part I couldn't figure out how to do. Last night I was calling the credit cards to get a higher credit line and one accepted so this morning I knew what I had to do.
The crop was torn in more places but he was able to suture almost all of it together. The crop capacity will be close to normal.
He left the skin tear open, I forgot to ask why (maybe skin suturing is not included in that fee - just kidding). 
He mentioned though that his insides started rotting, they were smelly, maybe that's why.
He is on Cipro and Flagyl, small feedings (6cc's) every four hours or when crop emtpy. And I have to pack the skin with silvadene twice a day. And follow up in 10-14 days.

Little chirpy didn't stop chattering all the ways home. Guess he was telling me of all his adventures.
BTW I need a "strong" name for her. 

Thank you all so much. It has been so depressing here the past few days.

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Oh what a little trooper, he sounds like he/she is just as chipper and perky as can be, he must be feeling better.

Did they already attempt to feed him?

I'm so glad he is over this ordeal and has a chance at life, thank you for everything you have done for him/her.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

This is definately an amazing, resilient little bird, and you are an amazing caregiver. This is one lucky little bird to have found it's way to you. 

So glad that he will now be able to eat. He's been begging and pleading for food for days. How wonderfunl that he can now get nutrition. Sounds like this bird has alot of spirt and spunk. How about Spunky for a name??

Can't wait for new pictures and updates.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Yeah, they fed him at the clinic, it's now time for his feeding and I am terrified.
Spunky is a good name, my hubby suggested it too. So Spunky it is.

Reti


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Reti...Please let us know how much the bill came to so I can start a fund.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

You're my hero Reti; what you've done for this baby so far was so unbelievably hard! Its amazing how perky and alive he's remained through all of this. He seems to really want to live.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I can't thank each and one of you enough. 
The bill was 450, very reasonable. A 1/5th of what Yodi's treatment costed last year and Yodi had no surgery.
His poops are small and slimey but I am not worried about it yet after all she's been through.
Will check his crop now and give him another feeding and then call it a night. 
Tomorrow I will post some pics.

Bless you all wonderful people, without your help and support we could have never made it.

Reti


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Great news, Reti! I will be looking forward to pics of little Spunky. Bless you for your never ending dedication to the needy birds and animals that come your way.

Terry


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Hi Reti..............Been thinking about little Spunky and wondering how he is doing. Please give us an update when you can.

Regards


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Yeah, I was taking pics. He is as spunky as can be, you'll see in a minute in the pics.
Eating every three- four hours, pooping fine solid poops and being happy.


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

That's one lucky little fella!!! Congratulations (to you BOTH)!!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

wolfwood said:


> That's one lucky little fella!!! Congratulations (to you BOTH)!!


Thank you. 
You can imagine this little fella will be raised in a bubble, he will never go hungry again and will be protected always. 

Reti


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

As it should be!!


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti..........He is so precious. Looks like we gave him the right name. He looks like he is so full of life........real spunky. So very, very glad to hear he is eating and pooping well.

Thanks for the pictures...............he is the cutest, most adorable, precious little bird.

Thanks for all your devotion and dedication in saving this little one.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I've started a fund for Spunky's surgery. At this point, we still need to collect $150. If yu can help out with even a small amount, such as 5-10 dollars, let me know.
Thanks


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

Please PM me your full name & address so I can send a check


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Oh Reti, he is so worth everything you have gone through to save him. What a little doll baby. I bet he feels better having food in that little tummy. This is really what it is all about!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Lady Tarheel said:


> Oh Reti, he is so worth everything you have gone through to save him. What a little doll baby. I bet he feels better having food in that little tummy. This is really what it is all about!


Well, at this age I don't think they care about anything else.

Reti


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

wolfwood said:


> Please PM me your full name & address so I can send a check


Yes, Charis talked about taking up a collection. How do you want us to go about it. Do you just want to post an address that we could send it to?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Please contact me through PM if you wish to contribute.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

OH MY! What a precious little one! Thank you so much, Reti, for seeing this through and also thanks to everyone helping with the bill. Pigeon-Talkers are the ABSOLUTE BEST!

Terry


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Reti,
Many thanks for posting the updated photos. 
Spunky is looking wonderful.  What a priceless little one he is. 

Cindy


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Just to let you all know, we still need to collect $100.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Charis said:


> Just to let you all know, we still need to collect $100.


Appreciate the update, Charis. 

Many thanks to all who have made (or plan on making) a contribution to *'Spunky's Fund'*.

A special thanks to you, Reti, for caring for this adorable little guy. 

Cindy


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

*Up Date*

The Spunky fund is doing great. Only $60. to go.
If you can help out, please send me a PM.
Thanks.


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Spunky is just adorable, Reti!!

My gang and I are sending POSITIVE LOVING HEALING THOUGHTS WITH HUGS AND SCRITCHES to Spunky and look forward to healing updates!!

Shi/Squeaks/Dom/Gimie/Woe


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

OMG... I have been so out of touch online lately that I completely missed this thread. Reti - my heart goes out to you but I am so thrilled to hear of Spunky's progress... he truly has the fight and the will to live and has sure found the best caregiver!!. Bless you for caring for him when so many others would have given up. Huge {{{{hugs}}}} to both of you!!!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you so much for your generous donations. Having such great friends means the world to me.

Little Spunky is eating every 3-4 hours 6's. The skin is healing but there is still much to go. He doesn't keep his bandage on, he is too spunky, moving around a lot especially when he sees me.
Last night he was funny. I was planning to feed him at 10, before going to bed but I wasn't seeing any poops from the previous feeding. I waited another 30 minutes, nothing, then another 30 minutes, nothing again. Lee said to give him some warm water, so I took his cage off the counter and there they were, behind the cage three big poops. He managed to poop through the cage bars and behind the cage. What a clean baby, doesn't want to get his nest dirty. He is just the coolest little guy.

Reti


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

good poops means good news!


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti..............So glad to hear that little Spunky is doing so well and it living up to his name. My thoughts and prayers are with you both for his continued recovery. What a truly special little bird his is.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

> The skin is healing but there is still much to go.


Reti, calendula is very good for healing skin. I have a huge bag of the flowers and can send you some if you like. What I do is make a wash by steeping the flowers in boiling water; drain through a coffee filter, let cool, and apply to the skin with gauze or cotton pads. It's real soothing and cuts down on itching too.

Jennifer


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Great update, he already wants to PLEASE mama and keep his little house clean, like sweeping it under the rug.... 

What a smarty!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Jenfer, that sounds great. I am cleaning the wound with normal saline but I know it bothers him as he keeps on pecking at the wound then he gets all the silvadene on his beak.

Treesa, he is so cute, he keeps his area spotless.

Reti


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

I just saw this whole thread, I must say I was half dreading the end! What a miracle that this little baby has made it this far. You really do have such courage and strength as others have said, Reti. My heart goes out to you taking care of this baby, I know it must be so hard and scary to do, he's so small. But obviously has a huge heart and will to live. I hope the other babies do well and are releasable quickly. I'm adding some lofts to the aviaries this summer and if any spots open up somehow or another, you can ship me some of your "extra residents" who would like to live the luxury life outdoors. . You and the SF Kings are right at the top of my waiting list, if you ever need and I have room. Good luck with this little guy, best wishes for him.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

maryjane said:


> I just saw this whole thread, I must say I was half dreading the end! What a miracle that this little baby has made it this far. You really do have such courage and strength as others have said, Reti. My heart goes out to you taking care of this baby, I know it must be so hard and scary to do, he's so small. But obviously has a huge heart and will to live. I hope the other babies do well and are releasable quickly. I'm adding some lofts to the aviaries this summer and if any spots open up somehow or another, you can ship me some of your "extra residents" who would like to live the luxury life outdoors. . You and the SF Kings are right at the top of my waiting list, if you ever need and I have room. Good luck with this little guy, best wishes for him.



Thank you so much MJ. I could certainly rehome some birds. I got too many babies this past weeks, it's overwhelming.
The Broward wildlife center doesn't take any non-native species anymore. So the raptor center calls me now to pick up pigeons, if I don't they will be pts, they don't keep pigeons. So, what can I do. I take them in. But this can't go on forever. I have wayyyyy to many birds.

Reti

Reti


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

*more pics*

S/he is doing great. I just feel bad s/he doesn't get enough food at one sitting and s/he always wants more. 
I am going to clean the wound now, it already looks better, healing nicely. Will post pics later.

Reti


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

preciouse little fighter!......


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm so glad he is doing better. Awfully cute little thing.


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Absolutely amazing. He looks so good. He certainly doesn't look like he's in need of any more food in those pictures!  Hopefully by June I will be able to help you out. We need to have the King Care-a-van stop at your place and take on some pijies.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

maryjane said:


> Absolutely amazing. He looks so good. He certainly doesn't look like he's in need of any more food in those pictures!  Hopefully by June I will be able to help you out. We need to have the King Care-a-van stop at your place and take on some pijies.


What's a King Care-a van?

His crop does look full with only 6cc's of food. That is sad as she wants to eat more than that. And it bulges only on on the left side. But her crop empties in three hours so she can eat more frecvently now.

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I am so glad Spunky is doing so well, sounds like he is well on his way to mend. I already see a great improvement in him from the first picture.

His feathering may not look so good at first,nor his size, as he needs all his nourishment to build new healthy cells (mend that wound) and to grow on. So his size and/or feathers may not look so hot at first, but he will catch up.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Unfortunately today we had complications.
I went to give her breakfast and noticed she is not as spunky as usual. I looked for poops, none, all night she had no poops, crop still full.
I called my vet and he is out of town till Monday but he referred me to another covering vet.
I called her and we drove up to Ft.Lauderdale in 20 minutes (my fastest ride ever to Ft.L)
Spunky has sour crop. The vet pulled the crop contents out gave her reglan and sq fliuds and if she is not better we go back tomorrow morning.
Well right now she is sitting fluffed under the heating lamp not looking good at all. I am worried sick. 

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Oh dear.....I'm so sorry to hear about this set back. 

I'm glad the vet removed the contents and I pray everything starts moving again.

Are you putting a drop of ACV in the formula or probiotics?


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

Reti, are you treating for bacteria or yeast?


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I am treating with Cipro and Flagyl. I asked for an antifungal, she didn't think it is necessary to give.
I am not giving ACV as I thought it might be too painful for his scarred little crop, too much acidity.
I gave her a very diluted formula for lunch, as per vet. Still there is only one tiny green slimey poop. I guess we will be back at the vets in the am.
I have diflucan, maybe I should start her on it?
Monday is so far away till my vet returns.

Reti


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

What about feeding some warmed baby applesauce?


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Charis said:


> What about feeding some warmed baby applesauce?



Good idea, forgot about it.
Will send Lee to get some (I got to go to work tonight).
Sould I also give some diflucan?

Reti


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Oh Reti, I'm so sorry about the setback. I'm praying for her/him. And for you.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

If she has GI yeast, then Nystatin should work, and it's gentler/safer than Diflucan.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti.........I was out of the house all day and just caught up with the new posts. I am so very sorry to hear Sunpky has had a complication. I hope and pray that he will be allright. I know you are doing all you can. Poor little baby, he has already been through so much. I will continue to pray for you both.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Reti, I'm really sorry. I had hoped all her illness was behind her.

I believe you can safely give her Nystatin. I have never given Diflucan so can't speak to that. Another thing you can try is mixing a spoonful of Benebac in the formula or plain yogurt. 

You know I will be pulling for her. Much love.


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

Reti,

We're saying some prayers for Spunky here in Jersey too. So very sorry to hear of the set back. But I know he's in the best possible hands.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi reti,

I don't know much about IV, but is it an option to partially nourish Spunky intravenously for few days while his crop mends from the sour crop & injuries? I read through some old posts about sour crop on this forum, and a member suggested this, along with feeding distilled water and apple cider vinegar (highly diluted). I can't comment on the wisdom of this, but the member said they'd had success with it.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/sour-crop-14713.html

I also noticed that you have a great knowledge of sour crop from previous posts, so I'm sure Spunky is in very good hands.

Considering his crop was partially rotting and so torn up, I think its a blessing that sour crop is the only complication so far. I think you can sort him out! If anyone can, you can Reti. You are very kind to put yourself through this; it must be so hard on you


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

I'm so sorry that Spunky had sour crop. I hope by now he is feeling better and worrying you a little less.  Once he gets back on track you can try adding a bit of plain yogurt too, if you don't already, I think that helps sometimes. Poor little guy! The King Care-a-van is something put together to help find homes for all the king pigeons in the San Francisco shelters here. Our member Elizabethy does a lot of rescuing for them and some members here pitched in to get some of them shipped around to new homes, but the original proposal was for an actual caravan to drive them to their new homes. 

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=33005&highlight=king+care
I hope Spunky feels better overnight and he (and you) are certainly in my thoughts and prayers.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you all so much for your prayers, we really need them.
I came home from work this morning and little Spunky didn't look right at all, very weak, barely able to stand and peep. I called the clinic and the vet we saw yesterday is at the clinic today and said to come in stat.
She cleaned out the wound and opened it up a little and you could see the crop had torn again. Just a tiny bit but anough to cause trouble.
She lost over 30 grams in weight so surgery for today is out of the question. Dr S will feed Spunky today through the hole and hydrate her so she can do the surgery tomorrow.
I am so beside myself, I don't even feel like sleeping but I have to try. I had also a pretty rough night at work. 
Poor baby lookes so pittiful and all her spunk is gone. I Wish I could stay at the clinic with her.

Reti


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti.............I could barely sleep last night. I had Spunky weighing so heavily on my mind. I was waiting for your update today. I am so very worried for the both of you. Spunky is a little fighter, hopefully he will rally and overcome this setback. I will continue to pray for his recovery.

God bless you both.

Regards,
Louise


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Reti,

I'm so sorry that the crop is torn and that little Spunky needs surgery again. But at least it is only a small spot that is torn this time. 

I am definitely praying that he will be stabilized today , this special day, and do well for the surgery tomorrow. 

Put yourself at rest, he is in good hands, and you need your strength too!

Prayers for all, especially Spunky....take care and God bless you for all you have done and are doing for Spunky.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I slept only four hours and I have a tremendous head and neck pain.
Dr S called, baby is spunky again. Sure she is fighter. But she will have to spend the night by herself in the clinic in the incubator. My poor baby.
On another note, the raptor center called they have an adult injured pij for me, do I want him or....?
Oh gosh what can I do, he deserves a chance too. Hope he has no horrific injuries. Well at least adult pigeons are easier to deal with. 

Reti


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Reti, there is no rest for the weary, is there? 

Glad to hear he is still surviving and spunky. He will be cozy in the incubator and hopefully the vet can operate again tomorrow.

I'm sorry you are not feeling well. Do try to get some rest. Are you on duty again tonight?


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

I'm sorry you're not feeling well either Reti  You love and care for so many - I hate to hear about you being run down. As Maggie says, try to get some more rest and take care of yourself.

Glad to hear a positive report from the Dr. on Spunky. Very encouraging! We're still saying lots of prayers for him. I hope the surgery can happen - and is his last operation on his road to full recovery.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that the new adult pigeon is healthy and that you're able to locate a home easily (assuming that's what you're going to do at least  ).

Many {{{{hugs}}}} to you!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you Maggie.
I am not working tonight, I do though tomorrow and I will have to rest tonight.
Gotta go pick up the new babies now. I don't even know where I am going to put them. I am out of cages and out of space. 

Reti


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti...........I am so relieved that you heard from the Dr. and that Spunky is getting back to be her little Spunky self. She is sure a little fighter. Thank you so much for the update. I have really been worried.

I am so sorry that you are not feeling well. With work, home duties and all the responsibilities for all the birds you have been taking in, it is no wonder that you feel exhausted. Please try and get some rest. I hope you feel better soon.

I wil continue to pray for little Spunky. I am sure she is " as sung as a bug" in her little incubator. I hope the surgery tomorrow will resolve the current problem she is having.

Thank you again for all that you do to save all these precious birds.

Prayers and healing thoughts to both you and Spunky.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Oh the poor little thing. I hope the vet can fix her up. And I'm sorry you're not feeling well yourself. You're gonna have to try and get some rest. Won't do either one of you any good if you get sick. I will continue to pray for you both. Let us know how everything goes. Let us know about the new pijjie too.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thanks, I feel a bit better, with some coffee my headache went away. I will go to bed early today.
Spunky is well fed and hydrated and spunky again. So hopefully she'll do good during surgery tomorrow.

The new one, I will start a new thread as the older bird is a banded AU four year old pigeon. Smells bad, so will start some Flagyl, plus is very, very skinny, otherwise a gorgeous bird, will post a pic later.

The baby is about a week old and I put him under Giacomo and Homer, the best foster parents who will raise any baby. So far he is accepted, even though Gia is again staring at me, like "mom, this is another old baby which came way to early" I asked her kindly for her help, so she complied, like always, my dear Giacomo.

Reti


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I'm glad you feel a bit better.

Glad to hear Giacomo and homer have accepted their latest foster child, that certainly will help you out. What a wonderful couple.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Good Luck Reti! I hope you feel better in the morning, and that there will be some good news about Spunky. You are amazing, doing so much for these birds. Please remember to take care of Reti too! Theres only so much you can do


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Sheesh, when it rains, it pours. . .I'm glad your headache went away, and so sorry to hear that Spunky has had to return to the vet. I too am sure he's nice and toasty in his incubator! Good luck with the other new ones and I hope you get some rest, and some great news about Spunky in the morning.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you. I let you know in the morning how the surgery went.

I am feeling ok. Not even too tired, just worried sick.

Reti


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Spunky didn't make it.
I don't know what to do now, I feel like doing nothing, just sitting and stare at the walls. 

Reti


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Reti said:


> Spunky didn't make it.
> I don't know what to do now, I feel like doing nothing, just sitting and stare at the walls.
> 
> Reti


Oh Reti......I"m SO SO sorry.......I was so hoping that everything would be ok. I know that you must feel really sad and bummed out, but lady.....YOU TRIED.......the vet TRIED........and none of us can do anything more than that. You would have felt the same or worse had you not at least tried. 
RIP Spunky.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

I'm so terribly sorry.....

I know you did everything you could, and that is all that is expectd of you.

Please know that he is now in total peace.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

I'm so sorry, Reti. I know just how you must feel. Of the birds I've had who developed crop stasis (adults), none of them made it, and with youngsters it must be even more difficult to get them through.

A friend of mine once told me that she thought animals sometimes come to us just to experience being loved and cared for by a human before they have to leave again. In the case of pigeons in particular, so many people display such hatred toward them that when a person treats one of them with such loving regard, it's especially healing and valuable. So many people would have given up on that baby or simply not cared in the first place. You loved Spunky and he knew it, and that's the most important thing of all.

Jennifer


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

You did everything possible, dear Reti. I'm so sorry. I know you feel lost.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm truly sorry. I think her injuries were just too much. At least she was cared for, and everyone did all they could. She is at peace and no longer in pain, and maybe that is all that could be done at that point. Sometimes passing is kinder. She is in peace. You put so much of yourself into caring for these guys, but sometimes, it just isn't meant to be. I know how hard and draining that must be on you. All you can do is to know how much of yourself you gave to her. At least she had that. That is a lot.


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

Reti - I wish there were words I could say that would help ease you're lose... I know you know that Spunky being so loved and so cared for in his last days was a blessing for him. I too was hoping his rally yesterday would see him through the surgery. He really was in the best possible hands - and the best possible hearts. Peace be with Spunky and comfort with you Reti... {{{hugs}}}


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Im at a loss for words.... I just feel so bad for you, he/she was a sweet little soul.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

I am so very sorry, Reti. Bless you, for all you did.

*"Bless you sweet Spunky. May you spread your wings and forever fly free."*

Cindy


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Reti...........I have been crying over the loss of Spuny for the last two hours since I read your post. I am at a loss for words. This little bird touched my heart in such a dramatic way from the start of this thread and through each and every post. I know how extensive the injuries were and that both you and the Vet did everything you could to save him, but I was truly praying for a miracle for this little one. 

I feel so very bad for you..........I know how desperately you wanted him to survive and how attached you had become to him. My heart is broken along with you.

I know that Spunky is no longer suffering, is resting in peace and flyiing free in heaven.

Louise


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you my dear friends.
I still can't get over it. I was expecting to spend some time with him today. I was very hopefull he would beat this. We miss our little baby dearly.

Reti


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Reti, I am truly sorry.


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## wolfwood (Jan 26, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> I'm truly sorry. I think her injuries were just too much. At least she was cared for, and everyone did all they could. She is at peace and no longer in pain, and maybe that is all that could be done at that point. Sometimes passing is kinder. She is in peace. You put so much of yourself into caring for these guys, but sometimes, it just isn't meant to be. I know how hard and draining that must be on you. All you can do is to know how much of yourself you gave to her. At least she had that. That is a lot.


I echo Jay3's words - to the letter. I haven't even sent the $$$ for the vet yet as I was waiting to hear if there was more needed. I know the money is secondary, Reti, but I'll get that in the mail to you right away. Bless you!

RIP, little Spunky.


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

I was looking forward to a positive update when I came first to this page. After reading the first post...I _knew!!_ Forced myself to back up and read all the posts I had missed. 

Stories like Spunky's just break our hearts...we hope soooo much. Spunky was so loved and that's the important thing to remember! So much to overcome in such a tiny being!!

While all had been done that could have been done...Spunky's loss to you, we know, is so devastating. 

Only time will help heal your sadness and I join my fellow site members in sending loving healing consoling thoughts with hugs to help.

Perhaps Spunky had a wing in sending your newest pij to you. He knew you could and would help!

My most heartfelt condolences, Reti!

With Love and Hugs

Shi


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you all form the bottom of my heart. I hope Spunky knew how loved he was not only by us here at home but by so many kind and wonderful people.


Reti


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Dear Reti,

I am in awe of what you did for Spunky, and I am so sorry that there was no more that could be done; that must hurt a lot after everything you went through. Spunky was a special little guy, I will miss seeing pictures of him. Please take good care of yourself Reti, you deserve a lot of nurturing after this.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Reti,

I am so very sorry that little Spunky didn't make it. Bless you, the vet, and everyone here who was helping with Spunky's cause.

I know how you feel, and sometimes just sitting and staring at the wall is OK for at least a little while .. 

My heart goes out to you for this very difficult loss of Spunky.

Terry


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## surya-s (Apr 14, 2007)

Very, very sorry that little Spunky couldnt make it.May God bless you for all the efforts and to overcome this sorrow.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you again. For once I was glad to go back to work last night, brought some "normalcy" back into my life.

Reti


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## myrpalom (Aug 12, 2004)

Sorry I saw this thread late, Reti.
It is really a heartbreaking story.
I feel so sad you lost Spunky, who was such a little fighter.
You were really an angel for him.
Myriam


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

I have somehow missed this as well, I didn't know we lost Spunky. I'm so sorry. He and you both tried so hard and did all you could. He was very loved and cared for. I hope you're feeling better today.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Hadn't looked back in since I knew the little fellow was under a real vet's care, but, oh, how sad! My heart goes out for you and yours, Reti. 

Pidgey


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