# Testing



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Hello

I have a question about the tests we do on pigeons.

What can we find out from which tests?

Fecal tests are easy but what won't come up in them?

Are there other tests like blood tests that we should do?


----------



## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Hi

If you are already familiar with fecal tests, then you would probably be able to detect the presence of worms (or, at least, worm eggs), Coccidia, Trichomonads (if the sample is fresh) or Hexamita. If you have a powerful enough microscope, you could probably also detect bacteria, though it's unlikely you would be able to get a good enough view to be sure if they were beneficial or potentially harmful. Of course, if you know the numbers you should be able to check if there appears to be an overload of coccidia, trichs or bacteria. personally, I know nothing about for instance) cocci counts and the method of checking.

A bacterial culture should be able to identify what suspected harmful bacteria are sensitive to, if not precisely what species of bacteria they are from, and therefore point to the appropriate treatment. We send samples (and throat swabs) for laboratory testing by professionals, not having the skills and knowledge to do it ourselves.

If we want to test for Salmonella we have to request it, as I believe the testing is more involved.

Symptoms aside, blood tests would normally be the route to identifying virus.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply

If droppings are not normal but fecal tests done never find anything wrong, would the next step be a bacteria culture?

Thank you


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

And I don't do the fecal tests myself. I take them to a vet. sorry if I wrote it strangely


----------



## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Well, no expert, but if there were a bacterial infection or an overgrowth of E.coli, I would have expected someone with the equipment and skill to detect something that needed further examination. If there was no evidence of unusual bacterial activity, I don't know if a culture would be useful.

An exception would be Salmonella, since it is shed sporadically in droppings, so one would need 3 - 4 days of samples to do a good fecal check, and cultures.

Also, trich would not show up in samples more than a few hours old, as the organisms do not survive long outside of the host animal/bird.

If you have a specific case, maybe you could post a clear pic of the offending poop and detail any symptoms the bird is showing - food intake, weight, behavior, etc. Someone may recognize a possible cause.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

To continue with John_D,,,
There is Cavader examination for fungal lawns in lungs and microscopic exam of deposits and skin scrapings for Aspergillosis

Bacterial examination of droppings along with tissue for Streptococcus

For candida, throat swabs and ink stain test

Bacterial exam of nasal and eye discharge in case of catarrh

Cadaver examination air sac inflammation serological blood tests for mycoplasmosis

Tuberculin test and exam of organs for tuberculosis

Blood test for DNA to know gender and Viruses like pmv


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you very much for your replies.
I have a picture I am taking to the vet today. Thanks to your replies I can ask him to do further testing depending on what he thinks. I am new to this and the vet is good with birds but not used to pigeons so much. He knows stuff from the books but not much experience, so more info helps. Thanks



















No birds are eating, drinking or acting different. One has bad feathers but that is because of parasites and he was bullied in the smaller loft. But he is very awake.

Only I find strange droppings, a small amount, so I think from one birds. I have not managed to see who does them. I caught them all and put them in boxes for a few hours before i changed loft, and then checked the droppings in all the boxes and colour was normal for everyone, so I did not manage to find out who it was


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Your birds aren't eating satisfactorily. The dropping in second pic looks bad,honestly.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

I know thats why I keep taking samples to the vet.

I used to feed once a day and leave the food for a couple of hours.

Then there were a few dark green droppings and I know I had a bad situation because one of the lofts was being renovated and I had a rather small area with more males than females so I thought a big male might be stopping a couple of my smaller males from eating properly.

I increased the food and even started leaving it out all the time (not at night)
The droppings were ok most of the time, with a bright green poop sometimes.

Now in the new loft they are just males and much more space. No more fighting.
I leave the food out all day so when the big males still try to keep the food they only do it for a short while. So everyone can get food

I put them on probiotics 1 time a week.

Since I still had green I decided to get rid of all parasites they might have - I know they had round worms from the test.
They still need the second wormer tomorrow. 
It helped dry some droppings but these little green ones stayed green.

Then sometimes, like once or twice a week I find a yellow one like the second pic. But it is not all the time so I get confused.


the loft used to be my grand fathers
He has gotten sick and I took it for him. He had too many birds and we got rid of a lot and fixed one of the lofts.
But he never used tests or took them to vets. If they got sick they died and he got more. So he cannot help me with finding out what might be wrong. I have a vet now but I am still trying to catch up with getting everything ok.

today I am taking the bird that I think might be making these droppings and the pictures I showed you. I have not managed to figure out what is wrong yet. And I do not know if any of them have been given any injections or probiotics before. The bird is male and coos a lot. I've seen him drink and eat, but not take grit. But i'm not there all the time.


----------



## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

the deworming is going to help, wait till after treatment to consider flock treatment of an antibiotic, That is what I would do, with a broad spectrum antibiotic. I usually really do recommend a fecal test to see what kind of bacteria you are dealing with..but with this situation where the birds are in poor shape, I would just do it. 
cleaning is your friend right now.. the droppings should be scraped up everyday untill they go through their antibiotic..after that scrape as you would do normally. this will help to stop any cycle of bacteria. I would give these birds vitamins in their water as well. what you want to do is boost their immune system so they can fight off these parasites. a healthy bird usually can keep these things in check. clean water and good feed is a must to get them healthy


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

My vet was not answering the phone, so I went to another one. This one isnt really a vet so does not do fecal tests but he knows pigeons very well.

He took a crop swab and saw the pics
He said the bird looks ok but is not digesting his food well, and is probably drinking more than normal.
The swab he said had an overload of bacteria but he does not know what without testing and that is expensive.

He gave me 2 broad anti biotics.

I usually don't like just medicating but he sees a lot of the pigeons where I live and knows what sickness is common at that time.

He said to leave the wormer for now and give the antibiotics. What do you think?

I forgot to ask him if I should leave grit for them, do you think I should take it away?


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

I've decided to do the second wormer. Give them 2 days probiotics and start the antibiotics on Tuesday


----------



## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

The calcium content of grit can bind the medication. Best to avoid grit for at least a couple of hours either side of giving a dose, so in practise best and simplest to remove for the duration of the treatment.


----------



## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Better to give probiotics after the course of treatment really. Broad spectrum antibacterials are not too choosy about which bacteria they affect, so whatever good a couple days of probiotics may do would probably be negated anyway.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your advice.

I can give them the antibiotics the day after the wormer? Without giving them probiotics in between?

I thought that might be too much for them.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

LouisAnna23 said:


> My vet was not answering the phone, so I went to another one. This one isnt really a vet so does not do fecal tests but he knows pigeons very well.
> 
> He took a crop swab and saw the pics
> He said the bird looks ok but is not digesting his food well, and is probably drinking more than normal.
> ...


If the guy found fast moving bacteria in circular movements in fresh throat swab then this is indicitive of protozoa called triches which cause canker. And your pics show green droppings with lot of water dried off in them which is also indicitive of triches overgrowth. Would you like to tell us what antibiotics he gave you? (The salts in them)
I think you should go with dewormer and then give PREbiotics+probiotics and then mutlivitamins to get your pigeons ready for coming course of antibiotics. All deworming meds are POISON afterall,they do kill worms but also cost on pigeons bodies. Give prebiotics and probiotics + a day or two of multivitamins and then few days of rest will help your birds put their system on the track and get ready for coming antibiotic course IMO

It depends on what medicine you're using. Many meds bind to calcium in grit so grit needs to be removed from the loft until antibiotic course is over.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

I am confused. One thing he said is that he has no canker.

ok i am going to give you lists of all I have. I am sorry for the long post.

Antibiotics given to me by the vet

Sulfaprime:
Trimethoprim
Sulfadimethoxine
Oxytetracycline

Salmocoli:
Chloramphenicol
Furazolidone
Neomycin

Vitamins I give everyday with their feed:
5gm per pigeon
VitA, D3, B1, B2, B5, E, PP, B12, calcium, Phosphorus, Sodium and something else I do not know how to translate

Probiotics I have 2 types:

Avipro plus:
soluble probiotics, soluble fibre prebiotics, vit A, C, E and electrolytes

Liviferm (chevita for pigeons):
probiotic bacteria, prebiotic fructo-oligosaccharaides, and B-complex vitamins.


I gave them the second wormer today. Tomorrow do I give them probiotics? And monday do I start the antibiotics?


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

John is right in that giving them probiotics, and then next day giving antibiotic is pretty useless. The antibiotic will kill the probiotics you are giving to them anyway. Don't give the vitamins while giving antibiotics either. If I wormed, then I would wait at least a few days before giving any antibiotics also. What antibiotic are you giving?


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply.

I wrote the anti biotics the vet gave me before.

How many days should I wait please?


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

LouisAnna23; said:


> I gave them the second wormer today. Tomorrow do I give them probiotics? And monday do I start the antibiotics?


Prebiotics gonna help the birds during the antibiotics course,probiotics will be washed off but they gonna help with the gut flora and absorb nutrients till you start antibiotics,making your birds a little stronger before the course. Since you have been giving two different worming meds e.g, ivermectin and then levamisole,the birds would be feeling the effects. Giving a gap and giving prebiotics and vitamins before course is gonna help them. Yes give them prebiotics and next day vitamins and let them eat grit if they want to till you start off with antibiotics course on monday. If the guy from whom you got prescription is experienced like you say and made a diagnosis then go with the antibiotics he gave you and pls update us.

Giving prebiotics and multivitamins before starting the course will help your birds.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

He gave you combination meds,let's hope the meds are in optimal strength and proportions to help your birds with the ailment. Follow the correct dosage and update us.

Yea one more thing,if you give prebiotics+probiotics and multivitamins before the antibiotics course it will help the birds better respond to the drugs and their bodies will come under less stress as antibiotics do stress on pigeons bodies.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your advice.

Yes, he's the person all the pigeon people in my area go to.

The packet says 3-5 days, he told me to do it for seven days so I think it should kill anything they have. He said after 3-4 days I should see that they are better.


----------



## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

LouisAnna23 said:


> Thank you for your reply.
> 
> I wrote the anti biotics the vet gave me before.
> 
> How many days should I wait please?


actually the probiotic is not useless. I have been prescribed to give it 12 hours after giving an antibiotic that day... it can help for a few hours.. gving it before and during and after is fine to give a probiotic. in fact my own doctor prescribed one for me when I was taking an antibiotic and told me to take my antibiotic in the AM and the probiotic that afternoon. there are opinions out there on it and I was one to jump to thinking it was useless because that is what I read but there are doctors who seen a benefit when giving it. I have too I give it during treatment and after.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply

I opted to give them a day of probiotics yesterday since I thought it might be useless, but it might help them get a bit of strength and its not going to harm them.

The vet said to change the med water at least everyday and if possible 2 times a day to have fresher medicine. I want them to take as much as possible of it so I think I will give them just the medicine all day.

I will definitely give them probiotics again after the treatment. The vet also said to come back after they are better to talk about vaccinations.

Do you have suggestions if I need to wait a few days or more between the antibiotics and the vaccinations?

I started the antibiotics today, and I scraped the loft as you said. Do I need to disinfect it too?
I usually use dettol in water to disinfect but I do not want to do that everyday as it is wet.
After the wormer I put cypermethrin powder in the cracks and under the wire where they cannot get to it but I dont think that will work as a disinfectant for the sickness.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

You can scrape clean the loft DAILY. After the course is over wash the loft out. For disinfection you would need a strong disinfectant like Virkon-S


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply.

I am scraping the loft daily. And removing the litter daily from under the wire.

Would bleach be a strong enough disinfectant? If not I can try get one of the brands they use in the dog sanctuaries.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Pigeons could get irritated by the strong fumes of bleach so if you can avail a disinfectant that is designed for poultry then its gonna be good.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you. I will try find one


I saw in a different post that you said after antibiotics candida infection can be a problem.
Would normal vit and probiotics be enough to stop this or do I need to get something else.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Candida albicans are controlled by normal gut flora of pigeons. When we give antibiotics,the normal gut flora gets depleted and candida can over grow. I ALWAYS treat for candida after giving antibiotics to pigeons. It is said that candida is opportunistic fungus so its the most overlooked pigeon ailment. but it grows in deficient and sick pigeons too and affects them greatly. Baytril and oxytetracyclines are notorious for causing candida to overgrow. Once grown out of control,it needs to be treated and high levels of vitaminA is needed. Wheat and corn are not fed during treatment as they are high on starch and candida feeds on starch,also anything sweet or sugary must not be given to pigeons as it can cause candida to grow considerably and turn pathogenic in only one night. Probiotics are very much needed to keep it under control after treatment


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Should i remove wheat during the antibiotic treatment or after?
Should I replace with something else or just leave them with the legumes?

so treatment is simply vitamin supplements?


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

It has been 48hours since I started the antibiotics.

The colour of the droppings has not changed but I think they are drier. I hope tomorrow I will see a change in the colour


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

When you give antibiotics, it's a good idea to also treat at the same time with Nystatin, or similar antifungal. And for a few days after the antibiotic treatment. That will take care of the yeast. Vitamins are not going to fight a yeast infection as quickly. Also probiotics for a few days after the treatment.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

how can I give it to them? The antibiotic is in the water 2 times a day. I am afraid if I replace the antibiotics with another medicine for 1 time a day they will not get enough of the antibiotic.

Just to check are any of these antifungal chemicals?

Sulfaprime:
Trimethoprim
Sulfadimethoxine
Oxytetracycline

Salmocoli:
Chloramphenicol
Furazolidone
Neomycin


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

if yeast is bad why do many people add yeast to the food?


Sorry for the lack of knowledge and thank you for your replies


----------



## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

LouisAnna23 said:


> how can I give it to them? The antibiotic is in the water 2 times a day. I am afraid if I replace the antibiotics with another medicine for 1 time a day they will not get enough of the antibiotic.
> 
> Just to check are any of these antifungal chemicals?
> 
> ...


 using nystatin is helpful to ward off a yeast infection, but it is mainly used for one pet bird that can be dosed by syringe. it has to come in contact with the fungus or yeast to work.

for flock treatment

I would just give apple cider vinegar in the water three times a week after you are done with the antibiotics. That has been reported to solve yeast overgrowth. that is if they even get it. 

just think of one thing at a time and don't over complicate things.. sometimes the more posts you get the more you think you need to do..just be aware and finish one thing at a time.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Hi LouisAnna78,
In your situation I will complete one thing first. I would give antibiotics treatment first and let the course complete. Then I would definitely give antifungal after the treatment is over if my birds are weak. If they are healthy they may fight off candida on their own. But I always give antifungals after antibiotics,I don't let my birds suffer. As I've said before Candida is MOST OVERLOOKED pigeon ailment ever. Candida fungus live in almost every pigeon and stay dormant in healthy pigeon as normal gut flora keeps it in check. When antibiotics are given normal gut flora get washed away and candida over grow. Candida then start to feed on pigeons body from inside making them prone to other diseases. What most fanciers do is when they see any signs of anorexia(change in eating habits) they simply start medicating the birds which make the situation worse as candida will grow more when antibiotics are given. Candida is something which will never let your pigeons be 100%. I have much experience with candida,I know what its capable of. So on safe side I always treat my birds for candida after antibiotics.
VitaminA is very important for pigeons. It will help pigeons to build immunity and fight off candida after you control candida with a antifungal med. You can never completely eradicate candida from pigeons practically but keep it under control. This will be interesting that in small numbers it actually help pigeons to stay healthy as it act as a food for the normal gut flora of pigeons. Probiotics and vitamins will help birds to keep check on candida. They won't kill candida but help pigeons to fight it off and build natural immunity.
When one give antifungal medicine,its general precaution not to feed sugar,flavor or starchy things/diet to pigeons as it will feed candida and it may help candida to build resistance against the drug. All lentils are not a good choice to feed as they are hard to digest and they don't have readily digestable protein content in them if you don't give amino acids in water. So some lentils along with many other variety of grains and seeds like barley,milo,sorgham,peas etc can be given. Most helpful will be any oil bearing seeds you can find like flax,mustard etc. and add them to your pigeons feed. They are high on nutrition and will provide your birds strength naturally.

Yes, adding organic ACV a couple of times a week regularly will help to cure candida.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

LouisAnna23 said:


> if yeast is bad why do many people add yeast to the food?
> 
> 
> Sorry for the lack of knowledge and thank you for your replies


You are welcome with your questions.

There are friendly bacteria and we have harmful ones. Similarly there exists friendly yeast like brewers yeast and harmful that is candida albicans. People give friendly yeast to pigeons not harmful one. Many species of yeast help pigeons while candida albicans eat pigeons slowly from inside out.
If a bird is down with harmful yeast/fungus infection then friendly yeast can't be given until harmful yeast is cleared with antifungals.


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Here we have Medistatin, which is a powdered Nystatin, that can be mixed into lightly oiled seed. Works good. It's made for birds, and is for flock treatment also.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you all for your clear replies.

As a precaution I lessened their normal grain, which has a lot of wheat, and gave them more of the parakeet grain which is a lot of millet and other smaller seeds.

As from this evening I also have a tiny baby sparrow to take care of! Only 1 day old and not eating very well but I hope it is alive tomorrow morning


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Yes I also use powdered one for flock. Dose only 200 grams for a tonne of feed. Medistatin is really a good product,takes care of candida very well.
For individual treatment I give Diflucan(nystatin+fluconazole,amazing drug). Dose only 5mg per pigeon


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Hello

Today was the last day of the antibiotics. I removed the antibiotics in the afternoon, scraped the loft, gave them a bath, sprayed the loft with a strong disinfectant that kills viruses (called Parvo-100 - safe for animals). 

I found a lot of lice on 3 birds so I sprayed them with the chemical I had bought before.

I washed all containers and put them in the strong disinfectant in a bucket for a few hours.

Instead of probiotics I decided to give them ACV tonight and probiotics tomorrow. Is that ok? I thought it might work better because of the yeast. I can give them the grit back and put vitamin in their normal seed now?


The droppings are nice and dry, very solid. But some are still green and are grainy - no whole seed but textured.

Is that because they have not had grit and I removed most of the legumes, wheat and corn form their food.

I have been giving them the cockatiel food - a lot of millet and some sunflower and some other seeds I do not know.

How long should I leave them rest before I give them their injections?


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

First thing they need is probiotics and then multivitamins. Don't over do. Let the things go smooth. (Do you have a vet liver tonic at hand? That will help detoxifying the birds) The droppings may not be normal for next couple of days so don't worry.

Some birds are sensitive to ACV so don't use it for next few days. Acv is used acidify pigeon's gut to keep the harmful bacteria away. Since you have killed harmful bacteria with antibiotics your birds need probiotics and multivitamins+enzymes.

If they're ok give them normal feedmix.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply

I will put them on probiotic in the morning.

What is vet liver tonic?

I have a tonic someone suggested to me called Ropa-B, it is based on oregano extract. I have not used it yet.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Liver tonic for veterinary use will help your pigeons to detoxify and will give strength to liver which will help the liver with proper functioning after the stress of antibiotics. Proper functioning for liver is very crucial for pigeon's health.

Ropa-B is preventative liquid which you can give to your pigeons a couple of times a week to prevent any future health problems. Do use it and share the results with us.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your advice

I do not have liver tonic. I will try to find it.

The probiotics are single packets - I use a packet a day like the instructions say. They say to give as only drinking water for 4-5days.

They have done 2 days. After 5 days what should I give them? Water, garlic, ACV or Ropa-B?

How many days should i give them vitamins? I do not want to give them too much.

I give them with oil in the food, just a little as they show on youtube.
They have done 2 days of vitamins also. I have not left the food all day because it is getting hot here and I think the oil will go bad outside. Is this right?

Should I give them food without vitamins tomorrow?
The probiotic medicine also has some vitamins in it


Droppings are some normal but many still green from not digesting properly

Thank you


----------



## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

all this is making my head spin..lol.. vitamins, and the probio can go on the feed if usuing an oil. just give ACV a few times a week and the rest nice fresh water..they need water not tainted with something most days.


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

LouisAnna23 said:


> Thank you for your advice
> 
> I do not have liver tonic. I will try to find it.
> 
> ...


You were talking about droppings with a bit off consistency,that's why I was suggesting liver tonic. Sometimes liver tonic give great results when birds are under stress/after medications.
Water soluble probiotics/vitamin supplements work best on birds. I wouldn't give them with oil on feed if you free feed them and oiled grains stay all day long in feeders.
Give them vitamins or probiotics according to the instructions. I work stuff on pigeons with two days interval. One day vitamins,then two days gap then garlic,then two days gap then calcium,probiotics etc I mean I give everything with two days gap. If we overdo then liver and kidneys of pigeons come under stress. Even access of probiotics is bad. I don't use ACV in water in summers because water in plastic feeders get warm and react with ACV. ACV should never be given with warm water,it can kill birds.

Ropa-B wil really help your pigeons. You can safely give it with correct dosage. Give every supplement you wanna give to your pigeons with two days gap.

Please feel free to ask questions here on PT,I like those guys who prefer to ask, before doing/giving things to their birds which may harm them.

Do let us know about the results of ropa-b on your pigeons


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your advice. 

Instructions of the probiotics say to give them for 4-5 days so I will do that and then stop.

I read some people put lemon instead of ACV. Would that be better in summer or is it still bad in the warm plastic?


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Yes people do use few drops of fresh lemon juice to birds' drinking water. I have used it in the past but it didn't give any results so now I don't use it. I instead use a pinch of epsom salt to a litre of drinking water which puts digestion on track.
The Ropa-B you have, will give your birds good results.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your advice.
I will rely on the Ropa-B in summer.

I;m sorry but I have another question - what do bubbles in water droppings mean?
Is it because they are still disturbed by the medicine etc or do I still have a problem with sick birds?


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Yes it can be due to disturbances in digestive track or coccidiosis.
Probiotics should help with this if its because of the disturbances or stress of medicine. Wait for few days and see if they restore back to normal.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Over the past few days droppings have become nice and dry (except for the nesting birds but that is normal for them to be messy right?)

But they are becoming long and in the shape of the intestine instead of a lump.
Is that ok?

Also today one who was fine before suddenly had droppings with almost oil instead of water. Only one. I did get a new bag of feed (same brand but new bag) and added safflower as someone suggested it did not have enough oil.

Could this oily dropping be because I added too much safflower?

Yesterday night there was also a big rain storm and I was not prepared for it so some water got in overnight. I have litter at the bottom so it took the water but it was still damp.

Could this be the reason?

Thank you for your advice


----------



## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You only want to add a bit of safflower as it is high in fat.
No water should be getting into the loft. Dampness will cause bacteria to grow and cause illness. The loft has got to be kept dry all the time.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

Thank you for your reply

Yes, it was my fault for not finishing the roof quickly enough on the repaired loft. I put a gap in the roof to let the hot air out in the hot summer, but I did not finish the rain cover so it was open to the rain near the door.

It was very windy and it was not comfortable to work, but then I was not expecting the rain that came.

It is dry now, and I will finish the roof


----------



## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

Hi Louis,
Give your birds normal seed mix now. Oil seeds should comprise 15-18% of the whole feed mix not more than it. Now that your pigeons are over with antibiotics and stuff ,you can give them normal feed mix. You may give a little more barley for 1-2 days to add some extra fibre to the diet to soak up extra oil.
Keep the loft daily scraped and super dry.


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

I need your advice please

the oily droppings went away the day after. I stopped adding the extra seeds.

After antibiotics and probiotics I left them to get normal and they sort of did. Still some green, rough droppings but I thought it was them getting normal again slowly.

Vet said ok to injections and we gave PMV. They had no problems, no sickness from it.

Droppings were getting darker and then going green and then going darker but I check droppings when I go in the afternoon and I read that they change in the day and that morning droppings are the best to look at.

So I slept over on a few times.

Ropa-B is wonderful. The day after i give them Ropa-B all their droppings are brown and neat and dry. 
But it only lasts while I give it to them.
The day after I give them water.
The day after I give them ACV (i checked pH - it comes 5)
Then probiotics.
Then water again

They have dropped a lot of the under feathers since I started Ropa-B. Which is good right?

Yesterday they had ACV, and some night time droppings were nice, but I found some where the white part was not all white?? Can it pick up colour from the dropping?
When I went to feed them more than one had mustard coloured droppings in water, but then 1 hr later same birds had normal shaped, really nice shape but a little bit green droppings. I saw them poop so I know they are same birds doing it.

And there was one dry dropping that had the white broken up, not in once piece but everywhere over the brown dropping. Is this Coccoidosis?? 

I am really confused. I do not know if they are healthy or not. I do not know if I am doing something to change their droppings or if they have a sickness. No one acts sick at all.

Antibiotics should have killed coccoidosis also no?

Please advice where possible, I know it is a long story


----------



## LouisAnna23 (May 4, 2014)

I just read online that if the solid part is yellow it can only be chlamydia???!!!

Is that true???
Why did my vet not tell me this?

How do I treat for chlamydia?
Can it make the dogs sick?


----------

