# What do y'all think?



## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

HELLO!!
I am new to the pigeon world and this forum! I just recently aquired a few pigeons and I was wondering if y'all could help me judge if these guys are show quality?! Also where can I find all the information needed for shows? I am getting some more birds this weekend so I will post those there as well! I wasnt sure what kind of photos were needed so i just winged it! Thanks in advance! I'm excited to join the pigeon world!!

This is my male American Fantail-
I have not yet learned to lace the feathers so the pic is just of him as is.
How can I get his tail feathers back to normal and not rigid looking at the tips? 









This is my female American Fantail-
Again I don't know how to lace so she is just as is.
How do I get her feathers looking better at the tips?


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

This is my male trumpeter-
What color is he classified as?


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

This is my female trumpeter-
What color is she classified as?
Her feather were clipped for breeding


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

This is my male(?) west of England-
What color is s/he classified as?


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

This is my female(?) west of England-
Is s/he a splash?

















Sorry for the seperate posts it would only allow me to do so much at a time!


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## pigilover (Jan 29, 2014)

*lovely*

those are some pretty birds ya have


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## Woodnative (Jul 4, 2010)

Welcome!! Pigeons are a great hobby. How did you get into pigeons? OK....now for show birds......each breed has its own standard.....and if you are seriously interested in showing you should study the standard, talk to others who show that particular breed, and buy from a reputable person who shows and can help point out the strengths and weaknesses of each bird. If you are keeping them because they are nice to look at and just want to show locally for fun, than you are fine. 

The fantails look like they were rubbing the tips of thier tails agains something.....possibly the wire of a small cage. They may not look perfect again until after they molt next fall. The trumpeter looks like a recessive red......the other a red mottle (?). Less sure on the second. That female WOE is sharp looking......I dont' know if you would call it a splash or if it is tiger grizzle (?). You should check the WOE standard online as I know this mixture of white is common in wests.

If you plan on breeding be sure to order the appropriate size seamless bands before babies start hatching. BTW, if you have an open loft your different breeds may/will cross and you will end up with some mutt babies. This may happen on occasion even if you have matched pairs, as there is always a chance of "cheating". Some of the breeds may also be more aggressive than others so keep an eye on things. IMHO it is better to focus on one or two breeds, especially at the beginning and if they are all being kept in one loft. Learn as much as you can about those breeds before buying other types. 

Another warning is buying birdds from different sources. Any new birds should be quarantined for several weeks to be SURE they are healthy before mixing with your current birds. One sick bird can spread disease through your flock and cause heartache. 

How is your loft set up. Is it secure? VERY secure against racoons and mice and hawks? Give them clean water all the time, quality food and grit, fresh air and a place to sun themselves. Plenty of perches and secure, private places to nest. Good luck with them. You have some very nice birds there.......keep them healthy and happy!


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

Thank you pigilover!! I enjoy them


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

WoodNative- I actually have chickens and ducks and showed them a few times and grew up showing livestock so I guess showing is just what I have always loved to do! I actually found my love for pigeons when my first pigeon "pidgie" adopted me! he was a wild pigeon that just showed up in my chicken coop with some missing feathers, bloody nose, and a broken wing I nursed him back to health and he never left! Sadly 3 years later I went out to let the birds out and found him in his nest passed away he touched my heart and I have loved the birds ever since! I have been wanting to show for a while and I am just now getting the chance!!
I got the birds from a friend as a gift for my first start! I am going this weekend to get some show jacobins and possibly some more fantails(main ones i want to show)!! I would love some frillbacks but that will come at a letter date! I have looked at some breed standards but I would love to get some personal experience advice to help build my knowledge! These particular birds may just be pets if the aren't up to standards! I would like to show here locally at the fair and possibly in Amarillo and Clovis and maybe once I get the hang of things branch out to bigger shows!! I am building "coops" for them myself! I have done big tall boxes with perches and Each box has a pair of birds! Is that ok? I do have a big area that is chainlinked in that I was going to put them all in for a period of time to exersize(like a flight pen) but I haven't put a top on it yet! 

The tail feathers on the fantails are all broken as well! I herd you could pull them out and they would grow back the way they should??
I thought she was the best out of all of them she really caught my eye!! 

Thank you so much for you input!! I have researched a little and ordered books but it's always nice to talk to other fanciers


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

Also where do I get the bands??


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## Ross Howard (Nov 26, 2009)

Foys on web or join a local pigeon club .


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## Woodnative (Jul 4, 2010)

Yes, you can order the bands from NPA (online) or one of the pigeon suppliers like Foy's. On thier websites you can see which size band for each breed. For example our frillbacks need a size 10 band (10mm). The bands go on them at about 6-7 days old. 
Your breeds may be show quality.........you will have to find someone who knows those particular breeds well. The wests and trumpeters look good to me. Either way they are certainly decent birds and enjoy them. As you know from your other birds keeping them healthy and in top condition go a long way to looking good at the shows. You probably could pull the fans tails but most shows are over until next fall anyway. Most folks are starting to breed or planning to breed thier birds at this time of year so you may as well wait IMHO. 
Show some pics of your "boxes" here. How big are they? How secure? Do they each have a flypen where the birds can sun themselves? Are they raised up off the damp ground? Are they dry inside? Each pair should have a nestbox or preferably a double nestbox. You will need space for future babies too. Fantails don't fly much so don't need/want high perches like the other breeds might want. Think of the time you have to spend each day giving them feed and water and scraping. A lot of separate "boxes" may be a lot more work than one or two coops. These are just some things for you to think of. Also make sure you use the hardware cloth with the small holes on all vents/windows/flypens. Chicken wire is not good as mice will crawl through it and racoons will rip through it. Just things to think about. You have experience with your other birds so some of this information may be superfluous or second nature but I want to bring it up just in case! 
Enjoy!! I really like the color on those wests! The muffs and looks of those trumpeters are impressive too.....I don't see too many of them around here.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Hold off pulling the tail feathers for now. As it is mid winter. and the time it takes to grow new ones on the fans. would be about 6 to 8 weeks. You should trim the tail for breeding. And As I have said before. you DO NOT want them flying any more then a little. And no perch is better. FOR show birds. Far as quality. well they do need sort4ed and laced in the tail It is hard to explaing and understand with out you seeing. There are vidios and picture on the web. You can try utube on lacing a fantails tail. You can hold the bird and lightly work the faethers to smooth the webbing out some. I noticed texas panhandle. And If I remember right the was a pretty decent fantail breed in lubbock tex. And maybe in amarillo. The jacobins you speak of Will need trimmed also for breeding. NOW several breeds are fun to look at. BUT to build a good line for shows. Is best to limit them to 3 breeds or less. As working on building quality is your goal.


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

Thank you ree lee! I am getting the jacobins today(just a pair) so I will post pics of those! Now on trimming them for breeding how do I go about doing that? Should I tAke the perches out of all the show pens or just the fantails? The perches are not far off the ground(maybe a foot or 2). Also for the birds I am wanting to show should I not let them into the flight pen?


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Look at the tail feathers. As you look line them with the body cut them from that line straight up. OR trim each feather on each side at about 1 inche long leaving about 10 to 12 in the middles of the tail. THEN look at the vent you will see small fluff feathers trim them close about the size of a silver dollar. I would not let the fans fly much. As I would myself either lock them down in a breeding compartment OR just do not use a perch. The others a perch will not hurt that much. NOW the trumpeters. You will want to trim the muff feathers The feathers on the feet. As they can catch an egg break it. or nock from the nest. plus small young birds. Trim them close about a half in long. The jacs if you notice them not breeding well Might lock them down. A breeding compartment for the fans and the jacs should be about 24 inches deep. at least 30 long and about 18 to 22 inches high.


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## CKMatthews (Jan 28, 2014)

Ok great thank you!


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