# Help! Sick indian ringnecks!



## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Help! Sick indian ringneck parakeets!*

I hope somebody can help. My kids just got two indian ringnecks and they are sick. About 6 months old, lethargic at times, sleep more than they should, not very active. Breathing seems ok-I have only heard one sneeze from them the whole day. No nasal discharge, vents are clean. One is not eating very well-only ate some millet spray and a little shredded apple. The other is eating fair- but could be more. They are a little thin and very quiet. One has watery creamy yellow colored droppings. The others droppings are ok, but both don't have enough droppings. Also the female has something sticky on her feathers, I am having trouble getting it off. I washed her with a small damp cloth earlier, that helped some , but there is still a lot of it on her tail feathers and wings. She keeps trying to get it off too-she has dowsed herself in the water dish several times today. Can I safely use some kind of soap to help clean it off? I think it is probably from tape-  , the bird traders here often put tape not only on the wings to keep them from flying, but to keep their whole body restrained!  ! There are no vets here to speak of-they mostly treat sheep and camels....
So if anyone can reccomend some med. Antibiotic??? or something I would really appreciate it. I can get just about any antibiotic/antifungal etc for humans without a prescription here. As long as it is not a controlled substance the pharmacists will give you whatever you ask for.  ....
I would need to know also the approx. dose for these birds too.
Thanks for any help you can provide, Melissa


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Hi Melissa,
I am sorry your doves are sick.
I have no experience with doves but the supportive care guidelines are the same for all birds. Keep them in a warm place, with no drafts and no direct sunshine..
They should be well hydrated, if they don't drink give them water with a syringe or eye dropper.
They should be eating something, so you will have to feed them at least a couple of times a day.
They could have some infection viral or bacteria or even fungal, that is why it is hard to say what antibiotic you can use if we have no diagnosis.
You can use a drop of apple cider vinegar in the water, it might help or not but it won't harm them, and if they have something fungal going on, it might actually help.
Some rehabbers use with great success colloidal silver, it is a natural antibiotic, we used it in Europe on human babies and I used it on my birds when all else failed and it seems to be killing single celled parasites.
You can give your birds a drop a day for a few days.

Also you can give them vitamin C, 1/4 tablet once a day for three days. Vit B complex the same, vit A and vit E a drop a day.

All this is supportive and will help them keep going and boost their immune system.

Ideal would be if you could take a fecal sample for testing to the vet. You think they would look at it?

Reti


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Melissa, 

Just to add to Reti's excellent suggestions, you can also try probiotics. These are good bacteria that is found in things like yoghurt and cheese. You can purchase these capsules for humans at a drugstore or heath food store. The capsules can be opened and you would sprinkle the powder on lightly oiled seeds or you can just pop one capsule each down the throat of the doves. Corn or sunflower oil is used to moisten the seeds....just a few drops then mix the seeds up. If you want to give them a whole capsule down the throat, lubricate the capsule first with water so it's easier to swallow. Probiotics are also known to stimulate appetite. 

Yes, without knowing what exactly is going on, it's not beneficial to just medicate randomly. If you can get them to a vet for a throat swab and a fecal float, this is a great start to finding out many things that could be wrong.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Are these Indian Ringneck Parakeets or Ringneck Doves? Just curious as the advice given is good in either case. If you can get Dawn dishwashing liquid it should be able to remove the "gunk" from the bird. You can try cleaning the sticky area with mineral oil first and then use the Dawn to wash away the residue.

Here's a link to some info on Indian Ringneck Parakeets for any who may be interested: http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww13eiv.htm

Terry


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Sorry! Duh!*

Sorry that was stupid of me, they are Indian ringneck parakeets.   
Thanks everyone for the replies- I'm going to check out that link now!
Melissa


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thanks, Brad, I keep on forgetting about the probiotics. I am still looking for a good one.
Is the human probiotic recommened to give anytime to pigeons?
Also, how often do you give probiotics to healthy birds for maintance?
Of all my birds it's only Angel who always gets the runs after probiotics.


Terry gave you a good advice with the dawn, it almost always helps.

Reti


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Reti, 

I use both human and pigeon probiotics now. The more strains of good bacteria, the better, I feel. I tend to like the human grade better because I'm sure it's processed under better quality controls as are most things for humans as apposed to what is made for animal consumption. 

I give my birds one or two capsules a week as a general maintenance schedule, then once a week with the powdered bird probiotics on the feed.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thanks, Brad.
Sounds good, I will do the same.

Reti


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Still alive, but barely.......*

I got my husband to drive me all over the place last night trying to find some medicine or a vet who would/could treat birds. Finally found one-I'm not sure how much he knows about birds, but I am going to try to see him today if I can get him to answer the phone...  ......The bird is worse today...  , I was sure she was going to die earlier, just sitting, eyes closed, not eating at all...I found some vitamins for birds last night-finally! I gave her a few drops by mouth & placed her on a towel covered heating pad and covered her with a small towel. After about 2 hours she had several large watery-black-bloody- smelling stools . I thought maybe it was the vitamins-they are something from Germany I think-can't read much on the package except vitamins and pictures of various birds... But I gave some to the other bird who is a lot better than she is, and he didn't do that, and he is eating well, but still sleeping too much. I gave her some warm water with a pinch of salt and sugar in it. She took about 5ml. drop by drop and I was amazed after about an hour she got out of the towel and was drinking herself. I had been crying-sure she was going to die. Maybe she still will, but that was a good sign...It's amazing how fast I got so attatched to her. She is such a sweet bird...I also gave them each a few drops of a bird wheat germ oil blend-I'm not sure if that was a good idea, but she really liked it!
The bloody droppings have changed back to white/yellow watery-small amounts. I keep giving her the water w/ sugar-salt by dropper (haven't found gatorade here) I'm still trying to reach this vet-I need to get something for the other one so it doesn't get like this one too. I hope she makes it.Can I give her a drop of cider vinegar by mouth? I wasn't sure if it would be too strong if not diluted in the water-maybe I'll just put a drop in the water I am giving her by dropper...I know there is nothing you guys can do, but it helps me to talk to somebody even if it is not face to face.Very isolated here. I'm very grateful for all your help, Melissa


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi melissasue,

I'm sure you are feeling overwhelmed with the issues of these birds. Remember you are doing everything you can for them, it may not seem like much but it is most important for the moment.

Continue with the what you are doing as they seem to be responding, yes, the drinking is a good sign! Make sure they have access to food and water. They might start to pick at it when they feel better. You can discontinue the sugar water once they are stabilized.

Apple cider vinegar should only be given mixed in their water, but I would hold off for now. It may be too much all at once. Did you find the prob-biotics?

Hope you can find an avian vet to see them.

Keep up the good work.

Treesa


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## Lin Hansen (Jan 9, 2004)

Hi Melissa Sue,

I wish I could offer you some suggestions, but I'm leaving this one to our knowledgeable experts.....you are in very good hands with their advice.

I'm sorry for you that you are in such an isolated place with all this going on, but I'm glad that we are here to support you, even if it is from quite a distance.

I'm sorry I can't offer anything other than my best wishes for a good recovery for your birds....good luck.

Linda


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

Thanks Linda and Treesa, and everyone else!
She is holding her own! Drinking well from the dropper. I'll stop the sugar/salt and keep hand feeding. She ate a little mashed up hard boiled egg!!! My 5 year old son came to me a little while ago and asked why "Rose" has black stuff all over her!!!  I couldn't imagine-or didn't want to---I went to see and she had taken another bath in her water dish !!!
I couldn't believe it!! She hates that sticky stuff on her so much I guess when she started feeling just a little bit better---time for another bath! She has been taking frequent baths since we got her in an attempt I guess to rid herself of that stuff. I am wondering what it is- I had thought tape-but it is even all over the edges of her tail feathers. I am starting to wonder if whatever that stuff is has caused her illness. But then again the other bird is not feeling well either and has no sign of that stuff on him . I have put off using the dawn for now to avoid stressing her more for now, but maybe getting that stuff off would help since she is so determined to get it off herself. What do you think? Can I use any brand of dish soap? Dawn is probably the best, but if I can't find it at the store is it ok to use a local type? Anyone know? 
I have allready put the drop of cider vinegar in her water when I saw your new post....
Thank God she seems a little better! I've been beside myself with worry-I feel kind of silly getting so upset over a bird, but-well---thanks so much to everyone for understanding and caring. I really mean it!
Her most recent stool have been almost pure water-mostly clear yellow with a tiny bit of whitish smear. And a lot! I had been giving her water and she wiggled out of the towel onto my shoulder and I suddenly felt this very warm sensation running down my .... 
I am going to search for a recipe for a soft food for convalescents-since she liked the egg. Any reccomendations greatly appreciated!
Melissa


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

Oh! I forgot the probiotics-I'm not sure I can find them here-maybe GNC but probably pretty expensive-everything there is expensive! Can I maybe try a drop or two of yogurt? I've seen conflicting ideas about milk products for birds, and someone here I think told me milk products are not good. It sounds like this is very important. Is ther any other source you can think of I might find at a grocery store??? I'm going to search the net some for that too.
Thanks again, Melissa


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Melissasue,

Sounds like you are doing a great job, considering the circumstances.

I don't think I would use any milk products. Continue the hand feeding, not too much, and keep the bird hydrated. 

Some avian vitamins have probiotics in them, also. Just check the labels. Some pet shops will carry probiotics for small animals and birds. They come in a tube that you squeeze out a pre-measured amount down the back of the throat. 

Treesa


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Thanks*

Thanks Treesa, and everyone!
I finally got hold of the vet. We took the birds there at 10:30 last night. He did a good physial exam, but did not do a fecal under the microscope--I didn't even see one-so I'm not sure if he has those capabilities on the premises, so it may have to be sent out. He said he suspects coccidia, I had wondered about that too...
He gave me something from a bulk jar to add to the water for coccidia and I am to give 1ml by mouth in a more concentrated formula three times daily, that he mixed up in an empty water bottle  . I am not given to have a great deal of confidence in the dosing--He showed me a small scoop and made it heaping and said put about this much in about half a glass of water...Not terribly accurate-but that is what we have to deal with here. Treatment is to continue for 5 days, re-check after 3 if not better and possible do stool cultures/fecal at that time, he said treatment can continue up to 9 days. He also gave something for the watey droppings-to firm them up. The vitamins I found are from Turkey as is the med. the vet gave me...I can't read Turkish  so I am at loss as to what is in them. I just have to try to have faith that he is giving me quality items. The packaging is not very proffesional looking the labels are poor quality paper/printing and put on the bottles crooked......so many things here are like that-it just serves to remind me how I feel like I am in a third world country even though it is trying to become more modern everyday! And how much I miss America! 
Before we left for the vet last night I mixed some egg, oatmeal, and a little yogurt and warmed it-She ate it like she was starving(probably is poor thing). The vet said he didn't have any probiotics- (after I got him to understand what I was talking about  ) He said yogurt was very good for her...  . 
This morning she drank some water on her own. Still very lethargic, and wouldn't eat even with handfeeding. I forced-gently the med. and some vitamins... and tried to get some more water into her, but only got about 2 1/2ml. Trying to keep her warm and comfortable as I can. I guess that is about all I can do for now. I am treating the other bird for coccidia as well even though he doesn't have the watery droppings, but is lethargic and thin, but eating well.
Gave him vitamins and a little wheat germ oil on his seed.
If anyone has any more suggestions please let me know!!!! 
Thanks so much, Melissa


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Melissa, 

Sounds like a fairly good and positive update. I suspected coccidia as well going by your description of the black/bloody stools and the smell. Thankfully, you've got a medication to give now anyways even though you feel the Dr. doesn't really seem like he knows what he's doing. I think that what you're doing for the birds is very good so far and the vitamins, egg meal, wheat germ oil, and now the meds are going to help significantly. 

Sometimes birds can handle a wee bit of yoghurt, there are mixed ideas about giving it but a tiny bit in this case I don't think will hurt.


Best of luck with things over there


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

You are doing very well.

In ordinary circumstances where pro-biotics are readily available, I would use them, but since you have limited resources a very tiny bit of yogurt wouldn't hurt. What kind of yogurt is it? You may have better quality yogurts available at your local grocery store. 

I am kind of concerned about the cocci drug and what the ingredients are. But I know you seem to have all the right instincts with these birds, and I'm sure you will be careful measuring it out.

I thought coccidiosis the poop was very watery and green, guess it is different in every bird.

Treesa


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*???Still hoping>>>*

Hi! Thanks Brad & Treesa and everyone! 
It's fresh whole milk yogurt-plain, cow's milk, milk solids, pectin, culture, vitamin D, min. 3% fat, min. 8.5% milk solids non-fat.
I wonder why the pectin is in there? 
She hasn't eaten anything all day, I tried to force her by putting some of the egg mix in her mouth but she just pushes it out. She is not taking as much fluids from me either (by dropper). She tries, but seems too weak. She tries to open her beak to take the dropper but after a while just closes her eyes and I let the water drip into the side of her beak drop by drop until she stops swallowing. Such a sweet loving little bird....  .
I don't understand why she was so eager to eat last night that one time, but won't now. I would think she should be feeling a little better now that she is on some med. Her droppings are getting better-some dark formed-very little-small amt. white, and a larger portion of clear-yellowish liquid still. But at least something formed! I hope that's because of the cocci med, and not only because of the anti-diarrheal... What I mean is I hope she is getting the right medication. I also hope she is getting enough and not too much...the vet wasn't very precise in his measurements-  . He didn't weigh her-I didn't see a scale. I can feel that she is getting thinner and thinner-the keel bone is really out there and so little muscle. 
The male seems a little perkier tonight, still lethargic, but maybe a little better.
Any ideas on something that might get her appetite going? Just barely keeping her hydrated-I hope. Keeping our fingers crossed!
Thanks so much! Melissa


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

You must keep her hydrated and if you can hand feed her, she might not like it but it is necessary.
I think Anise oil a few drops over the seeds stimulates their apetite.
Someone recommended it once, hope s/he will see the post and let you know for sure.

Reti


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Sad news*

Hello to everyone, 
I have bad news, she just died about an hour ago. It's really hard, my 5 year old is devastated. At least she isn't suffering anymore...
We just have to keep the other one eating/drinking and hopefully getting better. But thank goodness he is stronger than she was. Hopefully he will make a full recovery.
Thanks Reti and everyone who has supported us. Your thoughtfullness has been a great help and comfort.
Yours, Melissa


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Melissa,

I'm so sorry to hear the news, and sorry for your 5 year old. It is very hard for them especially, but I know you are doing your best to comfort the youngster.

You did everything you could and I'm sure the bird is now in peace. 

Treesa


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Melissa, 

I too am very sorry to hear this new today...so very sad You did all you could though with the resources you have at hand. Oftentimes though, they are too far gone by this point and we humans can't tell. Birds are very good at concealing their illnessess and this one sounded pretty sick even so. It was probably too far gone for anyone to have helped. I know that is little comfort to you or your child but the same thing probably would have happened under the best of care and meds.

All you can do is try with the remaining ring neck and hopefully it will survive. Sending my best thoughts and hopes to you over there.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I am very sorry to hear that, Melissa.
You did everything you could for this baby, thank you for that.
I am sorry your son is heartbroken, it must be hard for him.

I hope the remaining baby makes, keep up the good work.

Reti


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## melissasue1968 (Jun 16, 2005)

*Thanks*

I want to thank everyone for your help and compassion and comforting thoughts. You are all wonderful people!
Yours, Melissa


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