# are Scandaroons a good breed in pigeon racing?



## gideondelosreyes (Dec 9, 2011)

I was wondering, because the Racing Pigeon as we know came from breeding different kind of pigeons. i was wondering if i could use a Scandaroon or an English Carrier to breed with my Racing Pigeons and get a more stronger and faster bird. I know they are fancy pigeon breeds and it's kind of crazy but i was just wondering.


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## meldrew (Jun 10, 2009)

I wouldn't think so, you would have hybrid vigour due to the cross so would have strong birds, however racing and homing ability would be lost initially. Interesting idea though.


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## gideondelosreyes (Dec 9, 2011)

I thought so too.  I never had a Scandaroon before, that's why i don't know their capabilities. Do you have any idea about other breeds that has good homing ability?
thanks for the reply.


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## meldrew (Jun 10, 2009)

As far as I know the only breeds with good homing abilities are racing homers and Egyptian Swifts. There are possibly others that I don't know about.


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## Stina (Aug 29, 2012)

"hybrid vigor" applies only to extra-species true hybrid crosses....not to crossing breeds within a species. 2 breeds don't create a hybrid....2 species create a hybrid. There may be some benefit to the heterozygosity created when creating a crossbred/outcross animal....but "hybrid vigor" would be an incorrect term for this application.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Gideon - Scandarons and carriers have been bred for years for looks so although they have a reasonable homing ability it is not what they are known for, Racing homers have been select bred for years since the original crosses you talk off and the breeders over the years have improved and honed in on certain charecteristics within the homing genes that make birds slightly different within their own breed, Long distance, Sprint birds and such.

You could cross them and train them out a wee way and see how they go but don't expect much, A few backcrosses to racing homers - good ones if you can should improve the ability to the point you could get them out to 50 maybe 100 miles. The hard part would be keeping the interesting looks of the carriers and roons and also improving the ability but anything is possible with pigeons, 10 years, a lot of space and money and you can do a lot. Just think about whats been done already creating the 100s if not thousands of breeds we have today.

Stina, Although you are technically correct "hybrid vigor" as a term is used commonly within the pigeon racing community and I am sure a lot within other pigeon communities too. 

Because some of the pigeon lines in racing and also fancy breeds are so inbred you get a similar sort of reaction when breeding them together as what you would when crossing two species so although pigeons were not where the word originated the term itself is appropriately related to pigeons.

Meldrew- Tipplers have been known to home out to 50 kms, There are probably other breeds that do it that neither of us have even heard of.


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## Stina (Aug 29, 2012)

> Stina, Although you are technically correct "hybrid vigor" as a term is used commonly within the pigeon racing community and I am sure a lot within other pigeon communities too.


Being commonly used doesn't make it correct. People use it in dogs for mutts too...but it still isn't a correct term. There is already so much misunderstanding about genetics and genetics terms......why intentionally perpetuate the misuse of terms?


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

NZ Pigeon said:


> Stina, *Although you are technically correct *"hybrid vigor" as a term is used commonly within the pigeon racing community and I am sure a lot within other pigeon communities too.





Stina said:


> Being commonly used doesn't make it correct. People use it in dogs for mutts too...but it still isn't a correct term. There is already so much misunderstanding about genetics and genetics terms......why intentionally perpetuate the misuse of terms?



Don't get me wrong, Your comment was appropriate and interesting but this is the general discussions area, Not the genetics discussion so lets not get too heavy.

I use the term and will continue too, I am not here to change the world, More so learn myself what is correct where possible but for ease of conversation if well known, incorrect terms are used by the majority I will ride with them.

Once again, I am glad you made the comment, it is more than appropriate but I just wanted to point out the flipside, as incorrect as it may be.


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## gideondelosreyes (Dec 9, 2011)

NZ Pigeon - I didn't know that about droons and carriers.  I guess it would really take that much time and effort for that experiment, really appreciate your insight. Maybe I'll try an initial breeding experiment on a few of my racing pigeons and see what happens with their offspring before I dedicate myself into it.

Stina - I don't know about genetics and the terms they use. 

Meldrew - I guess there are a lot pigeon breeds I don't know about. 




*thanks for all your replies. I appreciate it.*


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Hybrid vigor isn't just a term used in pigeon breeding, it's used in most animal breeding, mostly cows. But even though they are not real hybrids, it has the same effect.

Anyway, no, crossing a Scandaroon or any other breed with the racer will benefit you. Scandaroons were once flying and homing birds but not anymore. Same with English Carriers and Dragoons. You'd be going backwards.


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## gideondelosreyes (Dec 9, 2011)

MaryOfExeter - Really? so the Racing Pigeon is perfect as it is? so there is nothing else I can do to improve or enhance it by mixing with other breeds?


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