# days are getting worse



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

hey i woke up this morning to see that a hawk broke into my pigeons killed my fantail. i only have 1 bird left the rest have disappeared 1 white homer 
beanie baby blue barred and a checkered. if any finds any please email me at [email protected] setting a trap for this hawk then letting it out 200miles away and hope for the best was thinking of killing it but thought its only doing its job to survive.

buried the fantail. 

o yeah even my ringneck is missing


----------



## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Robert, 

I'm really sorry about this How do you know it was a hawk that "broke" in? And how could it achieve this?


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

it plucked the fantail clean and eat its head leg no cut marks on the body. Any other predator i know would have left slice marks on it

well some good news beanie baby was found sitting pearched on a tree scared.


----------



## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Robert, 

How do you think it "Broke" in though? You've got to fix this problem otherwise trapping the hawk and releasing it elsewhere won't really solve your problem. The coop has to be made predator proof. This includes hawks, cats, rats/mice, weasels, raccoons, skunks, possums etc.


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

i do know it is predator proof my bro left the trap open last night. this is first time something has got in.


----------



## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Anarrowescape said:


> i do know it is predator proof my bro left the trap open last night. this is first time something has got in.


I see....well then the hawk really didn't break in. Your brother has got to be more vigilant and careful. This is really a tragedy and it could have been even worse.


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Robert, is Beanie Baby now safely back inside? I hope all the missing birds have survived and will return.

I sure hope you can get through to your brother that he has to be way more careful and responsible about the birds. 

Terry


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

yeah i caught beanie baby easily was pearched on a tree branch bro pulled it down while i got bb they are in 10 x 10 shed 2 of the birds was 4 years old and recently recieved im just hoping they know there way back to ny

i think the white 1 will come home always does


----------



## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

if you have a trap And a hawk got in. I think it might have still been there. As its not that easy for a hawk to get back through a trap. With just the head and a leg being gone. It could have been a cat even. I have seen where a fox wopuld do this too. But it can not climb as well like a cat. Any way you look at it from wire size to any method you have to make the loft a fortess almost.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

ROBERT!!!!!!!!!!!!! Am I going to have to drive down to GA and get my baby back? First of all, no hawk went in your loft at night. Something that is a night creature went in the loft. If a hawk went through a trap it couldn't have gotten back out, so whatever got in was able to get back out after it had it's dinner. Now that I think about it, even if the trap was open and something could get in, how the hell did the BIRDS get out? If it's a trap with bobs, the birds can't get out, that's the whole point of installing traps!!! What are you not telling us? I'm really getting annoyed with the way Beanie Baby and the rest of your birds are being treated. Beanie Baby nor the other birds deserve to have to live their life in fear and it's really making me mad. Is this really another of your brothers doings??? Fess up!! To think that I sent BB to you so he could "live his life" in peace and he's not had a moments piece since he got there. He's basically had to figure out how to fend for his self and stay alive!! I sure hope that pigeons don't have a memory like we do because BB must wonder why I sent him to such a place..............


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Robert,

This is getting very scary. Beanie baby & your birds don't have 9 lives, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE get thru to your brother, or have mom and dad talk to him.

Please secure your coop...and your brother...


----------



## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I don't want to offend anybody here, but I must tell and I can't stress it enough that our younger folks (and some not so young) have to get responsible and keep their animals safe, clean well cared for. There are way too many accidents lately. Those poor creatures depend on us for protection, food, water and to stay clean and healthy. When you take in an animal you need to be responsible, you have to care for them and there is nothing more important than that.
When your brother goes out to the birds, go with him, make sure everything is alright. Those poor birds have done nothing wrong to be tormented like that.

Reti


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Reti said:


> I don't want to offend anybody here,
> Reti




I'm getting to the point that I don't even CARE if I offend any one. It's getting rediculous with birds dying, escapeing, young folks answering questions when they don't have a clue what they are talking about.........I'm sorry but I'm in tears over how BB is being treated. I know it's been bad lately for ALL the birds, but lets face it, BB was one of my PERSONAL babies and I feel I let him down and sent him to what is eventually going to be his death if something is not straightened out. I'm outta here for a while...............................


----------



## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I am sorry lovebirds, I know how you feel. This is very frustrating and this happening to one of your birds makes it even worse.

Reti


----------



## Garye (Feb 20, 2005)

Those hawks. Just when do they migrate? I want to see them GO.

I feel your pain.


----------



## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Renee,

I feel your pain and outrage. Robert, tis time for you to be a man and call Renee on the phone and get this all straightened out. If that means you need to return Beanie Baby to Renee, then please do so. I do realize you are working and busy and cannot be home to look after the birds 24/7, but if your brother and/or other family members cannot look after the birds in a competent and responsible manner, then you need to give up your surviving birds at least for now .. that's just my opinion, but I would like to think it's pretty right on.

I truly do appreciate your honesty in posting about these incidents on Pigeon-Talk .. hope you will continue to be brutally honest with us, but do expect to get thoroughly "dinged" by the members when this type of thing happens. 

I think you are a stand up guy and will take the heat and do what is right and what needs to be done.

Terry


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

the remaining birds are in a 10 x 10 shed no way out but past me now i put a combination lock on the door so no1 but me can get in. my dad knows the code just incase. i am trying my best to give the birds nice life but when i mistake comes up i am tired of getting mouth off by other members i will be giving up on pigeons now i am sure some of you will be happy.i will be sending bb back to renee since i am not doing a good job and i am in tears wile writing this i hope you are happy


----------



## kippermom (Jan 11, 2006)

Just read this thread...and as hard as it is to return the bird and give up keeping pigeons until another time in your life when you have greater control over their circumstances...keeping animals is "not all about you"...it is "all about them".

They are the ones that depend 100% on their keepers...and when we are unable to meet their needs for any reaaon...it is time to find them a home where they are safe and comfortable....even if doing so causes you grief and tears.

I am certain everyone is sorry that you are feeling pain, but happy and relieved for the birds who depend on you if they end up in better homes.

You can look forward to the day when you are older and have a place of your own and the time and money to devote to birds...then you can keep them healthy and safe and really enjoy them without the guilt and pain of losing some or doing them an injustice..which is the pain you are experiencing now.


----------



## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Robert, I am not happy that you are feeling pain and discouragement. I am sure the others do not feel happy because of the failure that has occured at your loft. Sometimes when things in our life go into another direction, sometimes we have to make a change. The change you are making is agreeing to give BB back to the original caregiver.You indicated that you are giving up pigeons for now. You are feeling sad, lonely, rejected...many things right now. 

The membership that has "mouthed off " at you did so because of the love and devotion that they have for pigeons. Many members have made mistakes in the past, including me. In fact, you were supportive to me when I lost Tooter on the 1st of January, so I know that you are a compassionate understanding young man. Just focus right now on getting back on track.I do not know you or your family situation, so I am not going to judge you, but it seems that maybe you might want to ease off from at least having too many pigeons at least for right now Robert. 

I hope you will stay on as a member. We learn from our mistakes.


----------



## upcd (Mar 12, 2005)

*pigeon keeping*

There are many things that can go wrong. Predertors of all kinds. Diseases, more than I can count on my hand.Pigeon behavior, they can be aggressive or flighty. Some days it is like a soap opera. And there is regular care. Feed and water, cleaning, banding and medding. It can be crazy.


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

i dont think i have to many birds the most i have had was 6. i really want to keep pigeons but tired of losing them. i try my best to keep them in but its hard when my twin loves to see them fly. i really love my birds including beanie baby. i wish i could keep him but dont want to stress renee out. i apoligize for upsetting you renee  . where my birds are now there is no way any pray can get in unless they can break or tear thro wood including my brother.

renee i have nothing to fess up to i have not let the birds out in awhile. my older bro woke me up and told me about the fantails body. the trap is set like a square connected in the middle. the connection in the middle seperated which made the trap seperate. i have remade the trap to where it wont fall apart anymore by making the bobs smaller. there is now 2 traps. i will be removing the trap in about a week just incase pigeons come back.

again very sorry renee if you would like beanie baby back i would ship him to you as soon as the post office lets me.


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

First of all I want to thank everyone for their support and concern on this matter. 

Robert, we will discuss privately what to do with BB. But publically, I want to say if I was to hard on you in the previous posts, I apologize. There is much suffering that goes on in the animal world and certainly, none of us can "fix" it all, but when an animal that we are responsible for suffers at our hands because we can't give it the care it needs, then it is up to us as humans to fix the problem. We make mistakes and bad things happen. The first time it is a mistake but the second and third time, it's no longer a mistake. There is going to come a time in all of our lives when the animals we love will have to be handed over to some one else that can give them the care they deserve. That time may be because of lots of things, getting old, getting sick or in your case, having the "want to" but not the resources that are needed. I too appreciate the fact that you've been honest and told what was happening. There are some people who would have just kept quiet and none of us would have been the wiser. For that, you are truly a stand up guy and that tells me that when the time comes for you to be in a position to have pigeons and care for them, you will do an outstanding job. Maybe now is not that time due to circumstances beyond your control. Anyway, I'll be in touch with you.


----------



## WhiteWingsCa (Mar 1, 2002)

Everyone else has said it all... except remarking on the fact that Robert was going to try and trap the hawk.....

Not a wise idea for anyone to do... unless you have lots of extra cash lying around. Fines for trapping/injuring/killing a hawk anywhere in the US run into the thousands of dollars......

It's called the circle of life folks.... some hawks do eat birds. If you don't want to EVER lose your birds to a hawk, or any other preditor, keep it in a cage in your house.....


----------



## elvis_911 (Apr 26, 2004)

All i can say is, give this renee a chance to correct himself, to learn, and to find out how to care for pigeons. If he learns he can be a pigeon supporter have birds which maintain a happy lifestyle and promote pigeons as pets or as sport in north america. Pigeon racing is a sport in which basicaly only old people participate in ( no offence to anyone ) and youth is the anserw to an almost dieing sport, although he doesnt race (I think) he still promotes it. It also promotes love for pigeons.

I agree on some form of punishment, but stripping him of his birds is a bad one lol


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

elvis_911 said:


> All i can say is, give this renee a chance to correct himself, to learn, and to find out how to care for pigeons. If he learns he can be a pigeon supporter have birds which maintain a happy lifestyle and promote pigeons as pets or as sport in north america. Pigeon racing is a sport in which basicaly only old people participate in ( no offence to anyone ) and youth is the anserw to an almost dieing sport, although he doesnt race (I think) he still promotes it. It also promotes love for pigeons.
> 
> I agree on some form of punishment, but stripping him of his birds is a bad one lol


Look, first of all you should learn how to care for pigeons, dogs, cats, frogs.........whatever BEFORE you get them. I'm talking basics, feed, water, KEEP SAFE, etc.............don't comment on something that you know nothing about. There's more than meets the eye here. Sorry if I seem short but you and lots of others don't know the whole story..this is not, someone screwed up one time and we're out to get him. You don't learn about taking care of animals of any kind at the animals expense............


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

WhiteWingsCa said:


> If you don't want to EVER lose your birds to a hawk, or any other preditor, keep it in a cage in your house.....



Just had to add and/or clarify.......

How about a large outdoor coop with extended aviary, also a large enclosed patio? It works for my guys. I don't think keeping them indoors in a cage is the only option and it is not fair to our sweeties.


----------



## elvis_911 (Apr 26, 2004)

When you gave him the birds you did not see that he was incapable of keeping them safe? or did you ship them?


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

the white homer came home. I did not have this problem when i lived in ireland we had 1 local hawk there but my pigeons was bigger than it and flew higher when it was near. I never knew hawks over here was alot worse than in ireland.
I am not gonna trap the hawk as some1 mentioned it was only doing wot is needed to survive.


----------



## pigeonpoo (Sep 16, 2005)

I don't know how old/young this guy is but I do know that he is still posting........it would have been far easier to stay off the forum than admit to failure.


----------



## Anarrowescape (Jan 6, 2004)

I will always be posting here. every1 fails at something some part of there life. i would rather ppl know that than never seeing me again and then worry about the birds.


----------



## LondonPigeon (May 10, 2005)

i'm confused with whats happening


----------



## WhiteWingsCa (Mar 1, 2002)

Trees Gray said:


> Just had to add and/or clarify.......
> 
> How about a large outdoor coop with extended aviary, also a large enclosed patio? It works for my guys. I don't think keeping them indoors in a cage is the only option and it is not fair to our sweeties.



You are absolutely right ... indoors in a cage is not fair ... but if you wanted to be 100% sure that they were safe from predators, it would be the only way to do it...  

Letting them fly free in the house means there is a small chance they'll get out the door is someone opens it...

Any outdoor coop or aviary can be 'infiltrated' by some sort of predator - but we can make our birds as safe as possible by protecting them using proper hardware cloth, strong framing, locking things up tight at night (and when we're not home), etc. You would be amazed at what we've done in our lofts to make our birds 'safe'.

I don't like hawks getting my birds -- but I don't like people blaming the hawk for doing what it naturally does! Not only is trapping them unlawful - what if it's one of a breeding pair, that has a nest and eggs/babies?

I'm not coming down on you, Treesa... I know you feel the same..  This whole thread just kinda set me off for some reason....


----------



## pigeonpoo (Sep 16, 2005)

Anarrowescape said:


> I will always be posting here. every1 fails at something some part of there life. i would rather ppl know that than never seeing me again and then worry about the birds.


That's good and I think that you are a brave guy to do so.

Listen and pay heed to what the folks on the forum are advising you to do. They have a wealth of experience between them and newbies, like us, must be prepared to take the advice, whether we like it or not. The welfare of the birds is of paramount importance.

'Poo


----------



## Keys & Eyegone (May 9, 2004)

Robert, 
The perditor that probrably got into your loft was an opposum or raccoon by the sound of the kill. 
I remember when I first started my loft 2 1/2 years ago with just 5 birds. IT WAS HARD!!! Cleaning, watering, feeding, whaching for perditors, (and the occasinal jaskass kid that wanted to torment my birds). Also at the time I was in my school's concert band (met 2 times a week for 2 hours), working, piano lessons once a week, and then there was school and homework, not to mention chores around the house and yard. To have more time for my birds I quite my band and now have my piano lessons every other week. It's all about time managment. 
I know nothing about racers and these trap door things so I'm not going to pretend. But I would alway double check everything in your loft just before you go to bed. I do this ALL the time with my birds and one time it turned out to be a VERY good thing because a rat got in my loft once. It would have never gotten up to my birds cause their "house" is 5 ft in the air attacted to the side of the shed with only ledges to get in and out of the holes for the birds; I've also changed the wireing and tripled it on the bottom so no one worry. And it is true that we all make mistakes, myself included!
We all have to remember that each animal has it's own, very unique, personality so anything can happen. So take extra care, cause anything can go wrong when you're working with any type of animal. 
Hilary Dawn


----------



## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

This is the last time I'm posting on this thread. Robert and I have worked out or rather we are in the process of working out this problem. I have already stated I believe, that I realize Robert could have kept this all to him self and none of us would be the wiser. I appreciate him being honest. It shows me that he is a decent person. Some of the things going on are beyond Roberts control to some extent I believe. I think he's been hassled enough now. So lets all get back to helping and saving other pigeons and let Robert and I handle this from here on out. It doesn't matter what I saw or didn't see....everything that has happened up to this point can not be changed and further discussion is going to wind up hurting someones feelings and I don't want that.


----------

