# Found pigeon that was attacked by cat, broken wing



## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

I found a pigeon yesterday, it had been attacked by a cat. The cat pulled out a lot of feathers above its tail, put a small hole in the top of it's head and chewed on the very last joint on it's right wing. The small wing section is just hanging on by a small amount of skin, the bone is broken and separated from the rest of the wing. It seems like a very small section of the wing is going to be lost. 
I placed it in a large box last night, I placed a small bowl of water and another filled with white rice, some raisin bran cereal, a piece of banana and some bread crumbs. It laid still all night, when I got up this morning I could tell it had eaten and drank some water. It has also been pooping a lot, it's poo looks normal as far as I can tell. I fixed up it's box, put in a couple of perches and cut a hole in the side where I inserted an 8 inch diameter clear plastic container. I put a 3/8 inch dowell through the plastic container and the bird perches there all the time, looking around. 
The bird seems very alert, can walk easily, it bobs it's head back and forth once in awhile, it even spreads it's wings. It seems like it just may survive but I'm curious if it will ever fly again. I don't think there is any chance that the little piece of it's wing is going to heal, it's just dangling there. I am thinking it's going to have to be cut off, it's literally hanging by a tiny piece of skin. As I said it's broken at the very last joint if the wing. 
Should I go ahead and cut it off? If so I am thinking a pair of scissors would be best. If I do cut it off will this bird ever fly again? 
I know from past experience the local vet will not work on wild birds and I can't really afford to spend a lot of money on a vet anyway. I do want to do everything within my means to help the bird, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks! Aaron.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Aaron, thanks for rescuing this little guy.
If you could post up some pics of the bird it would help some of the members to ascess the damage so to speak. Its surprising just how much a bird can recover from.
If you could also post a pic of its recent poops, theres experts here that can give a better view of its health from that.
The bird will need some medical attention in the way of antibiotics as saliva from a cat contains bacteria that is deadly to birds.
It may not show at the moment as pigeons are very adept at hiding illness and injury untill it is often too late to do anything about.
Usually it needs the antibiotics within 24 to 48 hours of attack.
I'm sure someone will be along very shortly who will give you more info on the meds.


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Quazar said:


> Aaron, thanks for rescuing this little guy.
> If you could post up some pics of the bird it would help some of the members to ascess the damage so to speak. Its surprising just how much a bird can recover from.
> If you could also post a pic of its recent poops, theres experts here that can give a better view of its health from that.
> The bird will need some medical attention in the way of antibiotics as saliva from a cat contains bacteria that is deadly to birds.
> ...


 Thanks for the info. I will get some pics in the morning. Do you know if pigeons have a lot of nerves in their outer wings? I'm kinda curios what type of pain they feel, to photograph the injuries I will need to spread it's wings, I hate the thought of causing him/her pain! Do you know if such antibiotics are available over the counter at a vet clinic or farm supply? 
Thenks again for the help! Aaron


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Aaron,

Let's have a look at a picture or two, please, before anyone advises about taking off or not taking off the tip of the wing. Thank you so much for assisting this pigeon.

Where are you located? That will help us know where you might find over the counter antibiotics. Pet stores do carry some but they won't be helpful in this case. A farm supply may have something that could be used. What kind of places do you have near you?

Terry


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

TAWhatley said:


> Hi Aaron,
> 
> Let's have a look at a picture or two, please, before anyone advises about taking off or not taking off the tip of the wing. Thank you so much for assisting this pigeon.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I live in a small town in northern Ca, Fall River Mills. There's one vet clinic in town. There's also only one farm supply type business. The nearest city is about 80 miles away. The bird was active all day, it sleeping right now as far as I can tell or I would take some pics, it's sitting on a pertch I put in it's box with it's head tucked under it's wing, he/she seems comfortable so I'm going to leave it alone until morning, I will post some pics then. Thanks! Aaron


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Aaron, ASAP you have to get either Tri-sulpha (sometimes called 'triple sulpha") or Amoxycillin antibiotic.

Hoping the bleeding has stopped and still awaiting photos...BUT you have to get some antibiotic into that Pigeon by Saturday evening.

Call the farm-supply store ASAP. if they do not have it, call Jedd's Pigeon Supply and have them express mail you some so you get it by tom'w, Saturday. www.jedds.com (call, don't use the online form). Also, a plastic cc syringe.

With this sort of injury, a Pigeon needs to start antibiotics w/i about 48 hours or the bacteria from a cat will overwhelm their circulatory system. Doesn't matter if they 'look' OK and act OK....the Pigeon already has an infection.

Thanks for helping your pal. Let us know what's going on .....


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Jaye said:


> Aaron, ASAP you have to get either Tri-sulpha (sometimes called 'triple sulpha") or Amoxycillin antibiotic.
> 
> Hoping the bleeding has stopped and still awaiting photos...BUT you have to get some antibiotic into that Pigeon by Saturday evening.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the help! I will get the antibiotics here as fast as I can. In the mean time, here are a few pictures of the birds injuries. I tried to get them as close and detailed as possible but it was hard to do by myself. The picture of the wing is the very last joint on its right wing, its hard to tell from the picture but the bone was actually exposed, the dark are is scabbing or dried blood, it's not bleeding anymore at all, it didnt bleed a lot when I first found it. I did try to clean it right after I found it but it was difficult to do by myself. I have been keeping it as clean as I can and wearing gloves so I dont spread anything to him/her. The picture from the rear is of the area between his wings and towards the tail, there is some small areas where it had bleed, I cant see any serious injuries, it looks more like the cat had pulled the feathers out.
I am going to check on the antibiotics right now so I am keeping this short. Thanks for any advice on keeping this poor guy comfortable. It has been eating and drinking water so I am hoping that is a good sign! Thanks again! Aaron


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Here are a few more pics, in one you can see where the cat had put a small hole in the top of his head, it seems to have already healed but the feathers are kinda goofy now.
































Is there any way to tell if it's a male or female? I have also been told it may be a dove, I thought pigeons and doves were pretty much the same thing? Anyway, her the guy is. Thanks! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed, thanks for rescuing this little one. Yes, it is a Dove and Doves are very closely related to Pigeons, in fact, they sometimes refer to pigeons as Rock Doves and they both belong to an order of avian species called Columbiformes.

I would not wait to order in the antibiotics, call the farm supply and they should have a sulfa based medicine called Sulmet or Albon, get the smallest size of this you can it is a liquid suspension med. Also get a 1cc syringe, the kind without the needle attached, and we will dose orally, instead as the instructions on the bottle says, to mix in water.

With the wing, for now just pack that wound well with some Neosporin, and a light coat on any other minor wounds/scratches. We have one member, Pidgey, who is very good with these kind of wounds, he PMed me to let me know he is going to be kinda' hit and miss for being around for the next little while, but I will PM him to see if he can advise on your thread.

So for now, a quiet, small, confined cage/box so he does not want to flail and further injure himself, meds from the tractor supply + 1cc syringe, Neosporin on the wounds, wild bird seeds for food and water of course.

Good luck with him,

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Thanks! I just got off the phone with the vet, they refuse to give me any antibiotics or even look at the poor thing. They won't treat wild animals, I wish I would have told them it was a pet! I am heading to the farm supply right now to see what they have. I did put some neosporin on his wing yesterday, I will put some more on it when I get back. 
Thanks for the help! And thanks for identifying it as a dove! I do have it in a small box, it seems to perch on the water dish and in the round plastic bowl I stuck through the side of the box. I will post more later. 
Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Thanks! I just got off the phone with the vet, they refuse to give me any antibiotics or even look at the poor thing. They won't treat wild animals, I wish I would have told them it was a pet! I am heading to the farm supply right now to see what they have. I did put some neosporin on his wing yesterday, I will put some more on it when I get back.
> Thanks for the help! And thanks for identifying it as a dove! I do have it in a small box, it seems to perch on the water dish and in the round plastic bowl I stuck through the side of the box. I will post more later.
> Thanks again! Aaron


Aaron, yes, because it a native species of bird, vets are not really allowed to treat or offer to treat these birds and they can't be claimed as pets, as a wild, native bird can not be a pet, or kept as a pet. In truth, technically, you only have a certain length of time before you are in violation of certain wildlife codes, as you can do what you have done, rescue this little one, then you are supposed to seek out a licensed wildlife rehabilitator in your area to turn the bird over to, to continue care. However, the problem with doing that with this little guy is that he will almost certainly be PTS (put to sleep) as he will, again, almost certainly, never be 100% in flying ability and not be releasable, hence the death sentence for him.

Let me know what you come up with at the tractor store and we'll take it from there. Terry, who has posted to your thread, is in California as well and I am sure will be able to offer a good deal of information on what our options are.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Hi, they had nothing like the antibiotics you suggested at the farm supply, the only thing they had was penicillin. I have some Septra in my frigde, my daughter left it here last weekend when she visited me, it was for my grand daughter, would something like that help? I also have Cipro, sulfamethoxazole-tmp, it's the pill form of Septra. I also have Clindamycin in a capsule form, could I use any of these crushed and diluted with water? I did pick up a few syringes when I was at the farm supply.
Let me know if you think I should try any of these. I understand whatever I do is my responsibility and will take any advice you can offer. 
Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Hi, they had nothing like the antibiotics you suggested at the farm supply, the only thing they had was penicillin. I have some Septra in my frigde, my daughter left it here last weekend when she visited me, it was for my grand daughter, would something like that help? I also have Cipro, sulfamethoxazole-tmp, it's the pill form of Septra. I also have Clindamycin in a capsule form, could I use any of these crushed and diluted with water? I did pick up a few syringes when I was at the farm supply.
> Let me know if you think I should try any of these. I understand whatever I do is my responsibility and will take any advice you can offer.
> Thanks again! Aaron


Arron, my goodness, why didn't you say so, you have everything we need, and more, already on hand, and if I had to name the drugs I would like you to have on hand, you've named them all, I am serious .

Let's start this little one on the Septra suspension (this is also Trimethoprim/Sulfa) you have in the refrigerator, please confirm the strength, it may say something like 48mg/mL. Do you have a 1cc dosing syringe?

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Dobato said:


> Arron, my goodness, why didn't you say so, you have everything we need, and more, already on hand, and if I had to name the drugs I would like you to have on hand, you've named them all, I am serious .
> 
> Let's start this little one on the Septra suspension (this is also Trimethoprim/Sulfa) you have in the refrigerator, please confirm the strength, it may say something like 48mg/mL. Do you have a 1cc dosing syringe?
> 
> Karyn


Sorry to leave you hanging there, I got a call about ten minutes ago from a wildlife rescue worker that I called this morning, she had time for me to bring the bird over to her. She told me that it is in worse shape than I thought, the wing is completely destroyed and she says it most likely will never heal. 
She suggested I have it put to sleep. She told me if it did survive it would be stuck in a cage the rest of its life. The bone is exposed in the major portion of its wing and it will require surgery, it wont heal on its own. Now I dont know what to do, I'm not prepared to spend the money to have surgery. She told me if she were to take it she would have to put it to sleep.
She advised me on the antibiotics so I did give it that. I am going to think about what to do and will get back to you later. I really dont want to have it put to sleep but it sounds like it would be best for him in the long run. I hope i dont sound cold hearted! I'm really not, I hate to see anything suffer. Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Aaron, yes, as I mentioned, this would be the fate of this little guy is taken to a licensed rehabber. Look, why don't you hold off for a bit and see what Terry has to say and there is a chance Pidgey may be around later to comment as well. You got this little guy started on antibiotics, so there will be less worry about infection setting in, out of curiosity can you tell me what med and what dose you were advised to give.

If you want a bit of reading to do, why don't you have a read of this thread, it may help with your decision:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/first-posting-from-canada-please-help-16607.html

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Dobato said:


> Aaron, yes, as I mentioned, this would be the fate of this little guy is taken to a licensed rehabber. Look, why don't you hold off for a bit and see what Terry has to say and there is a chance Pidgey may be around later to comment as well. You got this little guy started on antibiotics, so there will be less worry about infection setting in, out of curiosity can you tell me what med and what dose you were advised to give.
> 
> If you want a bit of reading to do, why don't you have a read of this thread, it may help with your decision:
> 
> ...


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Arron, I asked you confirm the strength of the Septa, but I already had a pretty good idea at what strength it is formulated at, which would be Sulfamethoxazole 200mg, Trimethoprim 40mg; per 5mL, or 48mg/mL, as I mentioned. The 0.25mL dose you gave is going to be bit too high, (1/4 mL, will be 12mg of pure med, although you did mix it with 1/2 a mL of water). Don't worry, this will be OK for a loading dose, to get high level of med into the system with a higher first dose, but going forward I want you to give 0.15mL (in the middle of the first and second line on a 1cc syringe, this will be 7.2mg) this will be about right for a Dove weighing between 125-150g, and do this twice a day, every 12h. No need to dilute this with water just give it straight, and as a reference, this is roughly three drops of medicine, shake well before each use.

Everything else sounds real good, they sometimes are not quite in the pain we imagine and let's see what happens, hopefully we will hear from both Terry and Pidgey before too long. Any adoption will have to be done on the QT, as because this is a wild bird, as mentioned, is is technically illegal for you to have this bird past a certain time, so it would not be a good idea to advertise you have one for adoption.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Thanks for all the info! I will follow up with the doses as you suggest. I just found out that this breed of dove is actually considered a pest animal in California, it's not indigenous to California and therefore legal to own. The rescue lady pointed out the band around it's neck. Does this sound right? She seemed very knowledgeable about the laws and said she liked to do things by the book. 
It's been getting more active all the time, it's been eating like crazy and walking back and forth between the two perches I put in the box. Right now it seems to be sleeping, it's feathers are all puffed up and it's eyes are closed. Do they always puff up their feathers while sleeping or could this be a sign that it's cold? Thanks again for the help! Aaron


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Aaron, this is exactly what wildlife rehab centers do. Put unreleasables down. Some do it quite zealously, actually.

In CA, it isn't illegal to keep an unreleasable Dove. If you give her to a wildlife rescue, it will be curtains for that Dove. If you treat yourself, she has a decent chance of survival but may be unreleasable. If that is the case, then down the road you will need to find an appropriate home for her/him. It would need to be an aviary or flight cage or something along those lines. Wildlife rehab centers always make it sound horrble: "A life behind bars forever", etc. But the reality is hardly that. Many people give loving homes to Doves and Pigeons.

Maybe a bridge to cross when you come to it.

First off...stay on track ~ start the Dove on the antibiotic IMMEDIATELY. This is a Dove, they are smaller and more fragile than Feral Pigeons....he/she needs the meds in far less of a window than the 48 hours I noted for a Feral Pigeon (which tends to weigh 3x as much as a Dove). Even though she's more active, she needs that medicine....

One thing to be careful about...Doves are far more skittish than Feral Pigeons. Make sure whatever you are keeping him/her in does not have anything which can catch on a wing or foot (i.e. bars with too much space in between them, etc). They don't like being handled, and although neither do Feral Pigeons, the latter usually do acquiesce when caught and held...while Doves most certainly do NOT. Just saying, handle your friend with the utmost of care and security...they can be escape artists and that gets them into tons of trouble....


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Thanks for all the info! I will follow up with the doses as you suggest. I just found out that this breed of dove is actually considered a pest animal in California, it's not indigenous to California and therefore legal to own. The rescue lady pointed out the band around it's neck. Does this sound right? She seemed very knowledgeable about the laws and said she liked to do things by the book.
> It's been getting more active all the time, it's been eating like crazy and walking back and forth between the two perches I put in the box. Right now it seems to be sleeping, it's feathers are all puffed up and it's eyes are closed. Do they always puff up their feathers while sleeping or could this be a sign that it's cold? Thanks again for the help! Aaron


Thanks for the information on this breed of Dove, good to know there is no risk now keeping, or possessing, this little one with any authorities. These guys can withstand some pretty cold temperatures, so the puffing may be to stress and perhaps a bit down to that Columbiformes do sometimes puff to keep body heat in when resting. Keep checking back, as we will have to deal with the wing, and I would like to get one of our best people on it if possible. I have only seen Pidgey on twice in the last week, so I am hoping sooner, rather than later, but hang in there.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Dobato said:


> Thanks for the information on this breed of Dove, good to know there is no risk now keeping, or possessing, this little one with any authorities. These guys can withstand some pretty cold temperatures, so the puffing may be to stress and perhaps a bit down to that Columbiformes do sometimes puff to keep body heat in when resting. Keep checking back, as we will have to deal with the wing, and I would like to get one of our best people on it if possible. I have only seen Pidgey on twice in the last week, so I am hoping sooner, rather than later, but hang in there.
> 
> Karyn


Thanks, he will not stop eating, I put some bird wild bird seed in there and some unsweetened cornflakes, he didn't seem to care for the seed, he likes the cornflakes more. Should I not be feeding it freely or should I let it eat all he wants? He is pooping as fast as he eats so I put a paper towel in with him and have been changing it once an hour. I hope I'm not creating an obese bird!


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Thanks! I gave it some antibiotics already and will keep it up until it's all better. This bird seems very comfortable with me handling it, I only hold it when I apply meds to the cuts and give it the antibiotics, even so it doesn't struggle to get away and actually goes to my hand when I put food and water in. It even eats out of my hand before I can set the food down. I have it in a 16 inch cubed box so it has room to move around but not enough to try to fly, it occasionally will spread it's wings but it seems more like he's stretching. 
Thanks for the advice! Aaron.


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Thanks, he will not stop eating, I put some bird wild bird seed in there and some unsweetened cornflakes, he didn't seem to care for the seed, he likes the cornflakes more. Should I not be feeding it freely or should I let it eat all he wants? He is pooping as fast as he eats so I put a paper towel in with him and have been changing it once an hour. I hope I'm not creating an obese bird!


Yes, for now, you can let him eat, but I would cut back on the cornflakes (even if they are unsweetened), use them as a treat, and let him start to get hungry enough to eat the seeds. Make sure there is always fresh water for him and he should be good for now. Good to hear it is coming out the back, as fast as it is going in the front, this is actually a very good sign, as many times between the shock of the attack and the stress from being newly confined, they don't eat much for a period of time.

Karyn


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Aaron, if you are up to it, it may be best if we immobilize the hurt wing for now, so that he does not try and use the wing and make things worse. To do this we can do what is called a figure 8 wrap to the wing. Here are some links below that show, and explain, how to do this and if you are not clear on any of the information, or any point, I will try and help you with this. They all basically show the same thing, how to do a figure 8 wrap, but I am posting all three, as sometimes seeing a few versions of a technique clarifies things in the mind.

http://www.duckpolice.org/BirdWeb/PigeonResourceWeb/brokenwing.html

http://www.starlingtalk.com/fractures.htm

http://ccwr.org/membership/members_only/2010_Symposium_Handouts/Duerr_Bandaging_Techniques.pdf

When doing this you will need to go over the gauze wrapping with either some micro-pore tape, or sport/vet wrap (green bandage shown in the first link), as if you don't, he will certainly pick at the gauze and the fine threads may get caught around his head as they unravel.

Also, if you have to wrap over the wound on the wing, you can pick up a curved syringe like the one in the link below, you can put the ointment into it, and slip the tip under the bandage and to keep the wound packed with the Neosporin, the wound must not be allowed to dry out any time soon (ignore the price, as this is for a box of 50).

http://www.labplanet.com/kendall-he...curved-8881412012-tip-syringe-412-curved.html

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Hi, I have been watching little Pecky (my grand daughter named it) closely and he seems to keep the wing by his side, folded up, even when I take him out he is very comfortable and doesn't thrash around at all. I think I'm going to hold off on wrapping it right now. He seems to be healing well and is still eating great. 
I have been keeping the neosporin on all his wounds and so far they look really good, the wound on his wing looks about the same, it is covered with a scab on both sides, I am still covering it with the neosporin. I have also been giving him the Septra twice a day. 
I will keep a close eye on him and make sure he doesnt start thrashing around, if so I will imobilize the wing. I looked at the instructions on the websites you suggested and it looks pretty straight forward. I want to keep him comfortable and so far he seems to be doing very well. 
Thanks again for all your help! Pecky wouldn't be alive without all the help you all have offered! I will keep you up to date on his progress. 
Aaron.


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Hi, I have been watching little Pecky (my grand daughter named it) closely and he seems to keep the wing by his side, folded up, even when I take him out he is very comfortable and doesn't thrash around at all. Aaron.


OK, good. Doves are notorious for spontaneous bursts of flailing and thrashing, and I was concerned he may make things worse with the wing if he started doing this. Along as he remains calm and does not flap, you could do as you are doing, but if Pecky does start to flap the wing, it may be best to wrap it. 

It's really important the wound area stays well coated with the Neosporin, as if the area starts to desiccate at all, it will interfere with healing. The rest sounds good, we'll take it a day at a time. Keeping checking back, as I mentioned, I did PM Pidgey and his feedback will be quite useful when he checks in.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Today Pecky started grooming his feathers, I noticed him doing this right after I cleaned his box, he groomed everywhere except the end of his right wing. He looks a lot prettier today, he seems to be straightening out all the feathers that where out of whack. He didn't do this at all until today. I think this is a really good sign how hes feeling. 
I really am glad I decided to keep him alive! My eldest daughter has expressed interest in taking him in when he gets better, I don't know if this would be a good idea though, she lives in a nice apartment and I don't know if it would be a good place to keep him. Do you think it would be better that he should be kept in a cage outside or have people had them in cages indoors? I told her to think about it and read up on what it takes before she makes a decision, I don't want someone to take him in only to realize it's a mistake and lose interest. 
I haven't had a lot of time to read up on the bird myself, I am going to try to look up more info this afternoon. Anyway, he is doing really well and seems content for now. Thanks again! Aaron


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

Sounds great so far, Aaron. You are fortunate to have a calm patient....keep it up !


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Today Pecky started grooming his feathers, I noticed him doing this right after I cleaned his box, he groomed everywhere except the end of his right wing. He looks a lot prettier today, he seems to be straightening out all the feathers that where out of whack. He didn't do this at all until today. I think this is a really good sign how hes feeling.
> I really am glad I decided to keep him alive! My eldest daughter has expressed interest in taking him in when he gets better, I don't know if this would be a good idea though, she lives in a nice apartment and I don't know if it would be a good place to keep him. Do you think it would be better that he should be kept in a cage outside or have people had them in cages indoors? I told her to think about it and read up on what it takes before she makes a decision, I don't want someone to take him in only to realize it's a mistake and lose interest.
> I haven't had a lot of time to read up on the bird myself, I am going to try to look up more info this afternoon. Anyway, he is doing really well and seems content for now. Thanks again! Aaron



here is a link to what I think you may have.. I do think they can be kept in cages as pets , just like the ringneck domestic pet dove..esp because you have hand raised it and may not do well if released at this point..but they must be very hardy as they have spread in the US.. If they are not protected as a migratory bird then you can give him a good home, if you intercact with him every day as they are flock birds and like company and a mate.

http://www.diamonddove.info/bird11e Eurasian Collared Dove.htm


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Arron, I agree that things sound like things are going along well and also that with the calmness this bird has so far exhibited, he should make a good candidate for transitioning form his former life, to a new life with humans.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

spirit wings said:


> here is a link to what I think you may have.. I do think they can be kept in cages as pets , just like the ringneck domestic pet dove..esp because you have hand raised it and may not do well if released at this point..but they must be very hardy as they have spread in the US.. If they are not protected as a migratory bird then you can give him a good home, if you intercact with him every day as they are flock birds and like company and a mate.
> 
> http://www.diamonddove.info/bird11e Eurasian Collared Dove.htm


Thaks for the link, I will read some more this afternoon. I am pretty sure he won't be releasable as his right wing was chewed on by a cat, the cat chewed right through the last joint in it's wing. There is a scab over the injury now but it was obvious that the bone had been exposed and broken. If he doesn't lose that part of his wing it looks like at best it will be fused at the joint and no longer be able to move. I don't think it could fly very well if at all. I am afraid if I release it, it wont be able to fly away and escape another attack. Who knows though, nature works wonders sometimes! I have been thinking of ways to test out his flying abilities when he heals up, I wouldn't try it until it's healed ofcourse. If anyone has suggestions on how this could be accomplished I would love to hear it. I don't want to just let it go and find out it can't fly, I wouldn't want it to hurt itself or get away and get attacked. Thanks! Aaron.


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Dobato said:


> Arron, I agree that things sound like things are going along well and also that with the calmness this bird has so far exhibited, he should make a good candidate for transitioning form his former life, to a new life with humans.
> 
> Karyn


He is still very calm, when I cleaned his cage this morning, he just sat and waited, he let's me apply the meds to his wing and takes his antibiotic all by himself now, I just hold the syringe near his beak and he drinks it right up. He seems content. I am now starting to wonder if there's anything I can put in with him to keep him entertained? Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> He is still very calm, when I cleaned his cage this morning, he just sat and waited, he let's me apply the meds to his wing and takes his antibiotic all by himself now, I just hold the syringe near his beak and he drinks it right up. He seems content. I am now starting to wonder if there's anything I can put in with him to keep him entertained? Thanks again! Aaron


Aaron, some people put small mirrors in with their lone birds to keep them company, but sometimes they can get a little excited with this. I would like to keep him this calm for the next 7-10 days and worry more then about entertaining him. They do get great pleasure in being in a place where they can see all the coming and goings in the house, so you could do that for now, like a nice vantage point in the family room or kitchen, usually the two busiest rooms in the house. If in the kitchen, remove him if anything you are going to cook produces any smoke at all and be aware that if you use non-stick cooking utensils (Teflon) that these produce fumes that are invisible with no odor that are fatal to birds if they breath them in, so remove as well when cooking with Teflon, to be safe.

Karyn


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Although what I saw in the picture looked nasty from a "non-debrided" point of view, I didn't see anything that particularly scared me as to the structure of the wing. That is, the carpometacarpus looks rather more intact than the descriptions. I'd more suspect that some of the primary flight feathers may be affected.

In any case, let's just wait and see what happens after the antibiotic therapy and healing get done. These birds (this species) don't do a half-bad job of getting completely spoiled in captivity. I totally appreciate that quality. If it turns out that Pecky (bless his heart) makes a full recovery and can fly just fine, it may be possible that he can return to the wild but he probably won't think much of it should that be the case.

Pidgey


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Thanks pidgey, the pic is a little deceptive, when I first found him that last joint in the wing was literally hanging on by a piece of skin, when I brought him inside I repositioned the last section of the wing so it wouldn't be dangling, I put some neosporin on the area and sat him in a box. The bones were completely separated and I almost snipped that thin little piece of skin but decided to wait and see if he even survived, I didn't want to cause him any additional pain if he wasn't going to survive. The next morning it looked like the blood had simply hardened around the wound like a scab, I have been keeping it covered with neosporin along with all the other little cuts, he has several, they look like only the skin was torn, meaning it doesn't look like any of the tissue underneath has been punctured. The largest wound other than the wing is about 3/16 to 1/8th inch in diameter. 
Today he started grooming his feathers for the first time and this evening he started grooming (preening?) the area around the wing injury, I noticed some very fine feathers sticking to his beak from the neosporin, he is able to get them off his beak using his foot. Should I be concerned if he ingests any of the neosporin? It doesnt appear that he is intentionally eating it or getting a lot in his mouth but I can tell some is. 
He doesn't flail around or make any violent movements but this afternoon I noticed him stretching his wings, the uninjured wing fully extended but the injured wing only extended as far as the last joint, they both looked to extend and position symmetrically except the last joint on the injured wing, I take that as a sign the reast of his wing is in good shape. 
He is acting very alert, watching me when I'm near his box, looking around, he really seems content. I am surprised how tame he has been acting, he doesnt move away or seem afraid of me at all, even eats out of my hand before I can set his seed down. I am pretty sure he's going to have a permanent Mohawk from the small wound on top of his head, his feathers stick straight up, my daughter calls him Mr T. 
Thanks for the advice! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Well, we don't want him ingesting the Neosporin if it can be helped, just a little lighter coats, enough keep the area well coated, but not enough where he could get a blob of it in his mouth and just a apply an extra time or two a day, since you will applying less. If he get a bit on his beak, with some preen debris, just wipe it off with a Kleenex. I am really glad he is so friendly and calm, this will make things so much easier on him going forward. Most times scalp would heal in time so you will never know it was there, but Mr. T is a cute name .

Karyn


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Yeah, I read that. Pictures are worth a thousand words:










The last functioning joint is between the red arrows.

Okay, take a few more pictures of him standing (side and top views) and hopefully one of him stretching.

Pidgey


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Pidgey, this is why we love you . Yes, of course, it's right there in the photo, the wrist joint certainly looks to be intact and the damage may just be in the skin webbing. I was wondering why you mentioned making a full recovery to flying again, now it is very obvious. I think I got caught up with the written description, that the tip was hanging by a thread, and did not do what you did, and should have done, looked more closely and studied the photo(s) better. Good eyes. 

Good call early on, by Terry too, advising not to start snipping away at things, until we got a real good understanding just where this bird was at.

Karyn


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, the webbing between the carpometacarpus section and the shoulder (attachment of the proximal humerus to the "front" of the ribcage) is actually from the bottom red arrow down. The portion that's actually affected seems to be where the primary flights leave the trailing edge of the carpometacarpus section. If those have been bitten off, then Pecky's obviously going to have a difficult time getting lift out of the wing without making some kind of special "glove" with correct primary flights attached.

Pidgey


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

This might better illustrate the portions of the carpometacarpus section that are possibly affected:










I don't have a picture of how the primary flights and supporting flesh overlays those bones, though... at least not in a digital file.

Actually, a photo taken above the wing with a person holding the wing out in extension might be the most helpful.

Pidgey


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Hi, I thought I would give you an update on Pecky the wonder dove. He is doing great still, he is eating well and seems very content. I still have him in the same box, I have recently been looking for a larger cage for him, I found a couple that may work, one is three feet tall by two feet square, it has a lot of perches that he can climb on but I'm not sure if I should put him in it yet, his wing still hasn't healed all the way, I'm still not sure what's going to happen with the last section on his wing, I have been watching him when he stretches and that section does not move. 
I noticed new feathers growing in all the places the cat had plucked, two days ago they were tiny little stubs, today they are about 3/4 of an inch long! It's amazing how fast they grow! I am still giving him the Septra, I give it to him one a day. He has also started standing up very straight, with his neck fully extended, he started that two days ago. He eats like crazy and drinks lots of water, his poop is completely solid with an occasional juicy one, I don't know if it's urine mixed in? Or what but it not as messy as it was at first. He goes about the same amount every day and now he does it in the same place in his box unlike before when he would go just about everywhere. 
He doesn't smell at all, I do keep his cage clean though, I clean it twice a day. I thought I read somewhere that they are stinky but he doesn't stink at all. I am going to keep him at least until all his feathers are fully filled in then I will start looking for a good home for him, I have grown attached to him and have considered keeping him but I can't decide if I would get bored of him, I don't want to keep him only to grow tired of him and have him become a burden, that wouldn't be fair to him. 
As soon as his feathers get a little more filled in I will post some updated pictures, he really does look better already though! Thanks again for all your help! If anyone has any suggestions on what type of cage I should look for, any special needs I should look for, let me know! Thanks again! Aaron


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Pidgey said:


> This might better illustrate the portions of the carpometacarpus section that are possibly affected:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting that illustration! It helps me understand what's going on in his wing a lot better! I just cleaned his cage and medicated him for the day so I will try to get some new pics of his wing tomorrow, I dont want to put him through anymore right now. I will get some pics of his wing exstended and while he stretches. His wings seem very symmetrical as he stretches except the last section, it still has a big scab on the wound so I can't tell what's going on underneath. He has been grooming the area around the wound every day, removing small damaged feathers around it. He doesn't seem to be in any pain at all, even when I put on the neosporin, he is really mellow the entire time I handle him, almost as though he knows I'm helping him (at least that's what I want to believe!) I will take as detailed of pics as I can so maybe we can tell if he may fly again. Will there be any way I could test his flying ability without hurting him when the time comes? I would hate to let him go, see him struggle and not be able to catch him again, I can see him escaping only to get attacked again because he can't escape an animal! I have actually thought of attaching some kind of line to a leg but I don't want to end up breaking his leg at the same time! Thanks again! As I said I will get some good pics tomorrow! Aaron.


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

Airspeed said:


> ...... I have actually thought of attaching some kind of line to a leg but I don't want to end up breaking his leg at the same time! Thanks again! As I said I will get some good pics tomorrow! Aaron.


 thats probably exactly what would happen, or his flight direction would be abruptly changed & he'd hit the ground, so a def no no.
If he is able to fly again, it would have to be indoors at first so theres definately no risk of him getting out of reach and you would be able to see just how good he was.

Glad to hear hes coming along well, sure pigdey will come up with some info if you can get those pics.

As for becoming bored with him if you keep him, I really doubt that very much, as they have a way of continually being interesting and inquisitive lol.


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Aaron, good to hear from you, I have been wondering how peck was getting along. Depending if the wound is still open, we are going to want to keep Pecky on antibiotics from 10-14 days, as do not want to risk infection setting into the wrist joint.

No, birds have very little smell associated with them, especially if it is a single bird and you keep things clean, and unless they are ill their droppings are not like many other small animals, that do have an odor to them.

As for keeping him, i don't see what the difference would be if you kept him a while and then decided if he was a burden, as if you do find you think he is, and could do better with someone else, that could be arranged later, the same as sooner.

For a cage you will want something with closer spaces bars and, for now something lower and wider, than taller. Here is link to a photo of a hamster cage, with small ladder for him to climb up and small platforms to perch on, something like this could work well (one a little bigger than this one would be nice), until we see in time how much use returns to the hurt wing. Try Craigslist, I have picked up a few small hospital cages there cheap, and at the time I did see some larger ones, like in the link.

http://www.petshoponline.ie/hamster-cage

I also wanted to mention that with how calm he is, and the way he has not frightened of you (a human) and especially the when you mentioned he starts to eat from your hand before you even set the food down (never heard of this in a wild adult Dove). There is a very good chance this was somebody's pet, part of why he got caught, he did not have the natural survival instincts a truly wild Dove would have. So even if he were to fully heal and the wing became 100%, I am not sure he should be released to the wild again.

You are doing a good job with him, and some new photos would be good,

Karyn


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

I came to this thread late and you've already done a great job with this dove. Thank you so much for helping him! I just wanted to add that he's _definitely_ a ring-neck dove and as they aren't native to the Americas you shouldn't feel any guilt for not being able to release him; they are considered domestic birds here. Though escaped ring-necks have established populations in North America, I don't believe they are considered a pest species. 

Ring-necks make wonderful pets and can become quite attached to their owners. I have found them to be calm, friendly and curious. We have 21 of them, mostly rescues. Most live in a large aviary outside but one little (very tame) hen lives in our house in a cage because she considers herself a person, not a dove. We give her plenty of time outside her cage each day to play and interact with us and she's a happy, friendly and engaging pet. 

From what you say of your dove, I suspect he wasn't a "wild" bird to start with but someone's escaped pet. An 18" x 24" cage is the minimum size for a ring-neck dove, with some daily play time outside the cage. If he's picky about seeds, try a good quality mix for pet finches: Volkman's is a favorite of my doves. Kaytee dove mix is good, too. Doves also need some grit, either pigeon grit or that sold for cage birds. They are particularly fond of greens. I give mine organic wheat grass and well-washed, organic romaine lettuce. Enjoy your little friend.


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Thanks everyone! He is definitely tame around me, as for being an escaped pet, I'm not so sure, since having him I have noticed a lot of them flying around my yard, I never noticed them before. It's like when you buy a new car, suddenly everyone seems to have the same one! My wife has been out of town for a few days so I haven't had anyone to help spread his wings and get a photo at the same time, the piece of wing that is damaged has started to hang down and flop around alot. This morning it was hanging below his perch. I can tell it's going to fall off any day, the wound has healed all around that joint and it looks like the skin is slowly covering the exposed bone. The injury looks very clean and the skin is the same color as other areas where he lost feathers so I am pretty sure there is no infection. I am still giving him the Septra everyday and he seems very healthy. This evening I had no choice but to cut the feathers shorter on the dangling wing section, he was having a terrible time getting around with it hanging down, I was afraid it would get caught on something and get torn off causing the wound to open up. I cut about three inches off the long feathers being very careful not to hit any flesh or cut them too short. He is much more mobile now and seems to be more comfortable. 
He started "cooing" a few days ago, the first time I heard it, it scared the crap out of me! I couldn't figure out where the sound was coming from for a few seconds! Now he does it every day, a few times a day. Last week I heard a strange whining sound, it almost sounded like my dog but the dog was outside at the time, do doves make such a whinning sound as well? 
He still eats out of my hand every time I feed him, it's kinda nice to know he's not afraid of me, wild or escaped he seems content. I have been lookIng for a cage, I found one the other day that I thought my be good but it was about 2 feet square and about 4 feet tall, from what I read above it may be too tall? I have no problem buying one if I can't find one, I'm just not sure if i should move him out of the box just yet.
I have been covering his transparent porthole at about 7pm, about the time it gets dark outside, I've noticed that his eyes seem to close about the same time it gets dark so I didn't want to bug him with the kitchen light going on and off all night, is this the right idea? I almost feel bad, forcing darkness on him like that but it seemed the right thing to do. 
I will definitely get some new pics of his injuries tomorrow, they really do look a LOT better and his feathers are regrowing at an amazing rate! Its almost like I can see them growing, every day they look noticeably l


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

I'm sending this on my phone and lost connection and can't get the edit to work, this is a cont. of my last post. Anyway, as I was saying, the feathers the cat pulled out really are growing back fast! he still has a goofy Mohawk though! Yesterday I was looking at his wound, in order to see them I have to turn him upside down, when I did he started shaking really bad, it scared me so I put him back in his box, he started eating right away so that made me feel better that he is okay, I am very gentle with him and can't think of what made him shake, actually vibrate alot. He hasn't done it since, my only guess is maybe I touched one if his wounds but they all seem very well healed. 
Again, thanks for all the help and reassurance! It's helped a lot!
Later! Aaron.


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

When I got up this morning I found that the last section of peckys wing had finally fallen off, I was sure it was going to happen but now I feel sorry for him! I can't imagine waking up to find body parts falling off! He seems completely oblivious to it, he's eating normally and seems happy as a dove! 
I don't have time right now but I will get some pics this evening of all his wounds and how well they are doing. Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> When I got up this morning I found that the last section of peckys wing had finally fallen off, I was sure it was going to happen but now I feel sorry for him! I can't imagine waking up to find body parts falling off! He seems completely oblivious to it, he's eating normally and seems happy as a dove!
> I don't have time right now but I will get some pics this evening of all his wounds and how well they are doing. Aaron


Thanks for the updates, will wait on the latest photos, try and get some of the angles Pidgey suggested.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Here are the pics, they're are kinda graphic so be warned! The one of his belly area is the only area that hasnt grown a lot of feathers yet, everywhere else the feathers are growing fast. The pics of his wing were taken today, after the last section of his wing fell off, feathers are even growing back in that area. The last pics are of the wing section that fell off today, the feathers were a lot longer originally, I cut them short yesterday because they were making it difficult for him to get around.
































You can see all the new feathers growing on his back, they were tiny little stubs just a couple days ago. All the wounds on his belly are healed up and hardly noticable, as are the ones that were on his back. The close up of the area where his last wing section fell looks like you can see the bone and the skin growing around it, I THINK thats whats going on but I am not sure if its a the bone or a feather. That is the only area that concerns me, if it is the bone I cant see how the skin will cover it up, I would hate for him to get an infection in the bone or something. I am still covering the area with Neosporin, I put it on very lightly so he doesnt eat to much of it. He has been grooming the area a lot today, he is acting normally otherwise and has been vocalizing a lot today. I can hear other doves outside (now that I know what they sound like!)so I am guessing he is talking to them. He has been eating normally, which is alot! He loves to eat! 
If anyone has any ideas what I can do for him if the bone is exposed please let me know! The part that I think might be the bone sticks out about 1/4 inch past the skin. The more I look at it the more I believe it is bone, you can see it in the dark area of the picture. I will try to get a better picture later, I had to plug in my camera, the battery went dead. I can imagine cutting the bone shorter would increase the chance that skin would grow over it but I wouldnt know how to even attempt such a procedure, I honestly dont think I could do it, I would be to afraid I would hurt him! I am hoping it will take care of itself. Thanks! Aaron


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Here is a pic of the wing section BEFORE it fell off, I posted it for comparison. The second pic is AFTER it fell off


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Aaron, thanks for the photos, I think it's best we wait for Pidgey on these, I will PM him to have a look in on thread, keep him on the Septra for the time being.

Karyn


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Dobato said:


> Aaron, thanks for the photos, I think it's best we wait for Pidgey on these, I will PM him to have a look in on thread, keep him on the Septra for the time being.
> 
> Karyn


Thanks, I am still giving him the Septra twice a day, he drinks it right up, I hold the syringe tip right against the side of his beak and he drinks it without hesitation. He then eats his bird seed right after. Above someone wrote that he needs some kind of grit, how important is it? I looked for some around my little town but no one sells anything like that, my daughter is going to pic some up this weekend, she lives in a large city and will bring it up on Sunday, is there an alternative that I might find in my small town? He has been living on the bird seed and occasional corn flake treats, he loves the corn flakes! Should I worry that he hasn't had any "grit" since I found him? 
Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Aaron, don't worry too much at all about grit for him right now, you have only had this little guy a short time and the odds are he still has grit in his gizzard from when he was in the wild. Your daughter should make sure she gets grit made for Doves/Pigeons and not grit for smaller birds, like budgies. He should be fine with the bird seed and corn flake treats, you might want to see if she can pick up a bag of Dove/Pigeon seed mix, it will have a nice balance of seeds the right size and mix for this little guy.

Karyn


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Here's a good radiograph that even shows the feathers:










And here might be where the missing parts start:










We'll be pretty sure when the feathers grow out a bit.

Pidgey


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

This is a nice size caged for an indoor dove and is sturdy and easy to clean: http://www.petsolutions.com/storefront/bird/pet-bird/cages-carriers/flight-cage/prodFlightCage.html


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## Airspeed (Apr 8, 2011)

Pecky has completely healed up, all his feathers have grown back and he is moving to a new home tomorrow. I found a woman who has a dove that needs a friend, hopefully they get along! she has an aviary so Pecky won't be stuck in a little cage. 
I will miss him, it's been a great experience to actually bring him back from certain death to the healthy bird he is today. I want to thank everyone again for all the advice! I couldn't have done much without all the help you guys offered! 
Thanks again! Aaron


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## Dobato (Jul 3, 2008)

Airspeed said:


> Pecky has completely healed up, all his feathers have grown back and he is moving to a new home tomorrow. I found a woman who has a dove that needs a friend, hopefully they get along! she has an aviary so Pecky won't be stuck in a little cage.
> I will miss him, it's been a great experience to actually bring him back from certain death to the healthy bird he is today. I want to thank everyone again for all the advice! I couldn't have done much without all the help you guys offered!
> Thanks again! Aaron


Aaron, thanks so much for stopping by and giving us this update on how things turned out for Pecky, you did just a super job with him. Sounds like he is going to a place where he will hopefully be happy and has received a second chance at life.

You take care,

Karyn


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## Quazar (Jul 27, 2010)

aaron i'm so glad Pecky made such a great recovery and you have found somewhere he can enjoy his life you gave back to him.
you did a good job and i'm sure you will miss him


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

I'm so glad this story had a happy ending. Thank you for the update, Aaron.


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