# What is this?



## LittleJohn (Jan 1, 2009)

I have a birmingham roller that has a very unique color, it is a hue of pink with black speckles. Can anyone tell me what it's color or designation is and how it may have possibly been bred?



















Thanks


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

I think that is alomond, but it is blue.??....soooo pretty! looks kinda like a grizzle to???..I dunno a grizmond.....LOL.... here is a link about almonds
http://www.4persianlaneh.com/About Almond (Suror).htm


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## Pegasus (Feb 6, 2007)

That one looks like one of the feral visitor I have here...I think that color is called Grizzle...

Here's the definition I got from a site...

Grizzle is a term which implies an intermixture of black and white. Grizzled hair is hair which has both color and white on the same shaft. Another term we could use for it is salt and pepper. Grizzle in pigeons means the same thing, a mix of white and color on the same feather, i.e., the barbules of each feather are white and colored in a seemingly random mixture. It is this coloration which pigeon breeders usually refer to when they mention grizzle. Grizzle has been found to be partially dominant to wild type. That means it's visible in its heterozygous state, but that its phenotype (how it looks) in this state is different than how it looks in a homozygous condition.


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## LittleJohn (Jan 1, 2009)

It is actually pink....color does not show real well in photo, but it is a definitive pink. Here is one of my grizzles for comparison.


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*Almond*

Almond (the stipper gene) makes birds this way. Your grizzle looks to me like an almond grizzle.

I have a couple of birds that are very similar to your pinkish one. Mine came from two completely different sources but the birds could pass for nestmates.

Do you have any indigo? It can give a pinkish cast but so can some other things. One of mine came from a yellow hen which turned out to be a DeRoy almond and an andalusion cock (spread indigo). I call mine an indigo almond but it might just be spread almond as spread turns them grayish, like yours and mine.

Do you have a photo of the parents of the bird?

Bill


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## LittleJohn (Jan 1, 2009)

Nope I wish I did. This bird was open loft bred, so it is a crapshoot as to who it's parents are.


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## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

LittleJohn said:


> Nope I wish I did. This bird was open loft bred, so it is a crapshoot as to who it's parents are.


*Hi JOHN, One thing you should know about almonds is that as they get older they tend to get darker in color.* GEORGE


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*I breed open loft for the most part*



LittleJohn said:


> Nope I wish I did. This bird was open loft bred, so it is a crapshoot as to who it's parents are.



You should at least know which bird laid the egg. Even in open loft, we can tell who mom and dad are 80% to 90% of the time. If you know which pair raised the bird, these are your odds in knowing who the parents are. It is actually pretty good odds, just keep track. They do fool around abit and create some mysteries but we usually should know the parents anyway just by looking around to see who it might be.

Almond hens are only produced by almond cocks (they can produce both) and almond hens are only able to produce almond cocks when mated to non almond birds. You're bird that you showed as grizzle is a likely candidate to be the dad of this one, especially if you don't have others that look like this.
As George says, almonds tend to darken with age. It is actually a reversion to the undercolor as the stipper gene (almond) weakens over time, letting more of the undercolor come through.

Bill


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

George, i learned about almonds getting darker last week end when i picked up my 4 orientals. the gentleman i got them from showed us the father to my almond , who was much darker. I have never been a color breeder of pigeons, i have had performance, or things like show kings, runts, fantails, all in single color types. And when i bred poultry it was not what color, but what quality of color i was breeding for, such as ducks, geese, bantams, and standard chickens. (That is why i have not ticked off any one in the threads on color breeding) LOL! I agree with jbangelfish, Pigeons may fool around, but it is the 80 to 90 % sure they will only carry sperm from their mates. It is the FIRST breeding that counts, when the pair are hot for each other, i do not think pigeons have great sperm retention. Dave


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*We had a discussion about this on another site*



LUCKYT said:


> George, i learned about almonds getting darker last week end when i picked up my 4 orientals. the gentleman i got them from showed us the father to my almond , who was much darker. I have never been a color breeder of pigeons, i have had performance, or things like show kings, runts, fantails, all in single color types. And when i bred poultry it was not what color, but what quality of color i was breeding for, such as ducks, geese, bantams, and standard chickens. (That is why i have not ticked off any one in the threads on color breeding) LOL! I agree with jbangelfish, Pigeons may fool around, but it is the 80 to 90 % sure they will only carry sperm from their mates. It is the FIRST breeding that counts, when the pair are hot for each other, i do not think pigeons have great sperm retention. Dave


Some guys recorded as much as 21 days without a male to producing a fertile egg in pigeons. More than I expected. Pinning down when is the best time to fertilize an egg seemed to be around 10 days prior to the laying of the egg. The freshest sperm is also most likely to be the "winner" at the time of the fertilization of the egg. This would be at least part of the reason why there is so much breeding activity prior to laying a couple of eggs.

This was utilized by myself in the breeding of show guppies. They are great at having babies every 30 days or so for up to 7 months or so after being bred but bringing a new male into the picture, you could change the father to the new one with more viable sperm. Same goes for birds. This has also been proven out by guys who move birds from one mate to another in IBP breeding. The last one to breed prior to the fertilization of the egg is nearly always if not always the real father.


Bill


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## LUCKYT (Jan 17, 2009)

AH Guppies, My first breeding victims, EER... i mean experiences! LOL!
Weird i still think about breeding them. I put two or three dozen in my small "Wild life" pond in the back of the yard now for skeeter control, by the end of the season, there are THOUSANDS! I agree with you about the sperm thing, i had forgotten that, which means the mate of a hen is most likely to be the supplier of the most, and most likely freshest sperm.But it can SOMETIMES be a different cock. Dave


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Is it possible this is Qualmond?? If not I would say blue spread Almond. Neither had been mentioned above so thought I would throw it out there


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

That was my first thought.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Sorry which one Qualmond or blue spread almond, Hard to tell as the two can look similar to me


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

I have one very similar to yours...posted it a couple years ago and never did find out what color he was 
Your right, the 'pink' is very difficult to pick up with the camera. This one is 'pink' with blue flight feathers and black speckles. The only thing that darkened on him as he got older was his neck......its reddish, and the black flecks got darker. He's almost 5 now.









This is the same 2 birds at 4 months old









I'd love to know the correct term for this color!


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

The bird on the left appears to be a blue based bird - Defenitly got the almond gene in it.

As for the bird on the right and please note this is only a guess but from what I see maybe dilute blue T pattern with Indigo. Could be way off on tis bird but Im 100% you have an almond with the other bird there.


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