# beheaded pigeons



## Dee McCoy

Hi all-
haven't been here in a while-new and improved! 
I have a ?. I found two pigeon heads out under my palm tree, and then I found another, this one with the body still there, and the head about a foot away. Then later, found a partially eaten carcass out under the palm(where one of the heads was found). Does this bring a certain predator to mind for anyone? I want to know what I'm looking for. I thought maybe a possum or ? from under the house, but the carcass in the yard seemed as though it was perhaps dropped from the tree, indicating a bird (owl, hawk ?) any thoughts? Thanks, Dee McCoy


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## Evan Garris

Sounds like a person to me.


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## Dee McCoy

That's creepy, but there are those around here who want to see them gone....but how would you think they would be doing this?


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## Evan Garris

How clean are the cuts? Can you send a pic to my e-mail? Send me a private message and I take a look at it. I know it sounds sick but I need to see it. The probably trap the pigeons and either pull its head off or just cut. Evil ain't it?


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## pigeonrescue

That's typical of a cat attack.


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## Evan Garris

I've never seen a cat behead a bird.


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## Eileen

Hawks also will decapitate birds, but they usually eat the heads. We get a fair # of calls from people that they found birds in their yard with no head.

Evan's question, how clean are the cuts, is important. 
Holy smokes, I surely hope it's not a person who would do this, though I don't know why I still get surprised..


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## Evan Garris

Some people are sick and some kill animals just to feel powerful.......those are usally future murderers(acorrding to the local news).


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## WhiteWingsCa

weasel would be my guess - especially if you're finding the carcasses in the same location -- they like to pile up their "kill" for later consumption. 

Beheading is a trademark of a weasel kill


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## Evan Garris

Just look at the window and see if you can see what it is. Feed stores often sell live traps.


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## Nooti

Beheading is a trademark of a weasel kill 
********************************8
Cats tend to take the heads off their prey, but the heads are usually chewed.
Raptors ignore the head and eat all the meat off the breast, typically leaving a carcase lying flat on it's back with all the breast missing. They also pluck their prey and masses of feathers are left lying at the scene.
Typical of beheading birds are the corvid family - crows etc.
And crows will hunt, attack and kill pigeons. Have watched them do this many times.


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## Evan Garris

once again if the cut is clean that usally means a kinfe was used.


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## Joel

I had this happen several years ago before i built my new loft. My old loft was really a rabbit cage on stilts surrounded by a chain link dog kennel with the top and bottom very secure with chicken wire. All birds were killed in the exact manner you described. I lived in the city, with a wooded back yard. My first guess was maybe rats but later learned that a weasel will kill like this. Whatever it was it was small enough to get in and out through this chain link fence. I now keep the birds in my garage. Both the aviary and cage are made of small hardware wire.

Joel


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## Eileen

Nooti said:


> Raptors ignore the head and eat all the meat off the breast, typically leaving a carcase lying flat on it's back with all the breast missing.


This is not always true. The head of an animal is a favorite part for raptors (sorry to share this but the second favorite part are testicles  ). If food is plentiful, often a raptor will just eat the head & leave the rest of the animal.

We have 5 red-tailed hawks, 3 kestrals, & 2 great horned owls who are permanent education animals where I work. I almost never find a head of their leftovers in their aviaries, but often find the bodies. (BTW, to ease everyone's mind, we feed humanely pre-killed rats & mice only to our birds. And I have pet rats, so this is not easy for me.). But even our rehab hawks & owls, the head is the favorite part.

Still waiting to hear if the cut is a clean one, which would indicate human foul play..


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## Pigeonpal2002

My two cents worth.....I'm sure various predators will kill in such a manor and heads are often discarded. But from my own previous experience when i was a kid and had homing pigeons, the cat that got my birds ate the bodies and left the head, wings and feet mostly uneaten. Cats are pickier than most predators and although savage, usually leave tell tale signs such as these after their slaughters.



Brad


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## Pigeonpal2002

*Typical of beheading birds are the corvid family - crows etc.
And crows will hunt, attack and kill pigeons. Have watched them do this many times*.


Hey Nooti, are you sure it's crows and not ravens stalking the local pigeon population? As a crow aviculturist myself, I've never seen such a thing here. Crows will scare pigeons but like a hawk, lack the necessary speed, skill and agility to full out hunt down a pigeon who's healhy at least. I'm not saying you're incorrect, just i've never myself witnessed such behaviour in the north american corvids. Yet, i've heard many stories of European Ravens partaking in such pigeon feasts. Though I wonder how on earth they would catch them in full out flight. Crows and ravens are smart and crafty, which is the only way I see them taking a pigeon, by sheer surprise tactics. But again with a crow weighing about the same as a much more muscular pigeon, It's hard to comprehend them killing, dispatching them and eating one that is in good health. In comparison, pound for pound, a pigeon is much stronger. I tend to ramble, but this is what I know


Brad


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## John_D

I have seen posts on another forum which suggest that, where there are hawks around, to have crows nearby can be a blessing as they will drive off the hawks. How accurate that is, I don't know.

Conversely, on Islay off the west coast of Scotland, where there are still wild Rock Doves, there are documented reports of isolated instances of Hooded Crows (northern equivalent of Carrion crow) killing Rock Doves. In those cases, I'd think it likely that the pigeons were already weak or sick.

One place I sometimes visit and feed the pigeons, I see them keeping well away from the Crows and the Rooks - but several times I've seen a pigeon wing slap a Jackdaw (smaller member of the Corvids).

John


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## birdy

Hi John_D,

I see crows chasing hawks almost weekly around my place. The crows never bother my racers. Now these are small flocks of crows, maybe ravens - I need to learn the difference. A neighbor lady feeds the crows which is a about 200 yards from my place and we are separated by a large field. There is a resident hawk and he will hunt the same field but only when the crows are not there.

The only time I have hawk problems is in March when hawk migration is at its peak. Unfortunately, it's also the time that I'm training my youngsters. I have to watch those hawks like a hawk - they're awesome birds.

I used to have purple martins (the largest swallow in N. America) until I added on to my loft and it was too near their house. Martins need about 60 feet of unobstructed space circling their birdhouse. Well, they were the only birds other than the hawks to mess with my racers. It was actually very playful. As the racers were flying around the loft the martins would dive bomb the pigeons but to no affect. Racing pigeons can easily avoid the smaller martin. It was great fun watching these birds share the sky. These giant swallows are beautiful birds and how they can fly. I'm working on another placement for their house to try to get them back next year.

birdy


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## Pigeonpal2002

Hey Birdy, 

Oh, I bet that was amazing to watch the purple martins and the racing pigeons do an aerial ballet in the sky!!!  


Brad


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## birdy

Hey Brad,

Purple martins are very cool birds. If you haven't had a martin house and the pleasure of their company for a summer, I highly recommend it. You can find a lot of information on the web about them. There's nothing like enjoying a sunset watching those graceful birds zoom around. Racing pigeons are cool too. So are crows, ravens, and hawks!    

birdy


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## Eileen

I live in New York, & we have so few crows left here because of West Nile Virus. It's very sad. How cool that you guys have ravens - we have some in upper state New York, but none down here.
But it's true, crows will definitely chase off hawks.
Where I work, we always know when there is a hawk nearby because our permanent hawks scream as a warning. Then we go outside & collect our ducks & put them away until the danger is over.
Birds in general are just plain cool!


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## Snowbird

Crows, Ravens, Gulls--very similar: will eat anything, love pigeon chicks, and couldn't catch a healthy pigeon and don't try. Pigeons may react to a low, surprise visit from any of those birds but relax on the first circle. Ravens particularly sometimes like to "buzz" roosting birds for fun, but they will also regurgitate food toward you if you walk under their tree if they have a fledgling--they are just a very rude bird.


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## Pigeonpal2002

Hey Snowbird, 

LOL! Yes, ravens and other birds have developed this "projectile vomit" as a means of defense of their young and nests. Hehehehehhe. Quite effective, isn't it? Gulls, ravens and crows are all aggressive and highly successful birds and it's due to the fact that they ARE omnivores. Omnivorous species are an adaptive species, able to take advantage of many types of food sources and changing environments. Pigeons are also highly adaptive as a species which is why they've colonized almost the entire globe. Don't feel though that ravens or such are "rude"...they are just doing what they need to in order to survive Great observations though!


Brad


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## Shellee82

Evan Garris said:


> How clean are the cuts? Can you send a pic to my e-mail? Send me a private message and I take a look at it. I know it sounds sick but I need to see it. The probably trap the pigeons and either pull its head off or just cut. Evil ain't it?



Am I able to send you a video? I found one outside of my business. 😬


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## Marina B

This is an old thread. Can you start a new one and add a photo?


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## John B

WhiteWingsCa said:


> weasel would be my guess - especially if you're finding the carcasses in the same location -- they like to pile up their "kill" for later consumption.
> 
> Beheading is a trademark of a weasel kill


 I absolutely agree. I have witness the same thing, only they were my beloved pets and the culprit is a mongoose. I live in Hawaii and we have a lot of wild cats, and mongoose. The trade mark of the mongoose is leaving the head. They attack the prey at the neck. The weasel would behave very similarly.


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