# pigeon websites



## sabina (Mar 11, 2006)

I've recently joined some pigeon listservs (New York City Pigeon Rescue Central and Pigeon People), first to help with finding Biko and now to keep up with activity around the proposed ban on feeding pigeons in NYC. I am very impressed with all the work that is being done by some dedicated individuals. Fred (pigeon person) in particular has written some excellent letters. Anyway, I just wanted to post the links to a few pigeon blogs/websites which have been recently created to get some positive images of pigeons out there.

http://peopleforpigeons.blogspot.com/

http://pigeonlovers07.blogspot.com/ 
(some text on this site is sarcastic, I know some people don't like seeing pigeons written about this way, but the person who created this site loves pigeons and has been doing A LOT of work around the proposed ban)

http://www.enidcrow.com/pigeonpeople.htm
website with press release from Pigeon People

This is a clip of news segment on pigeon feeding ban, including a little part with Al Streit, from this forum and Pigeon People. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0yVpq8ayPc

Nice to see so many people caring about pigeons!

Sabina


----------



## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Great sites, Sabina. Thank you for posting them.


----------



## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

I watched that video and saw a pigeon that looked almost exactly like Mary, my homer.  The white one that flies in around 1:01...It was quite a surprise...haha.
http://picasaweb.google.com/MaryOfExeter/MyHomers/photo#5135428245131956962
They could pass as twins I tell you!


----------



## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Sabina, thanks for the links.

It was nice to see Al Streit in person. In the first link, I thought the comments by the vet (can't recall his name) were very good and I was tickled that the one lady had her last name changed to "Dove". (It made me think of Dovena for some reason  )

What worries me is that people make up their minds that pigeons do carry diseases and nothing anyone, like the vet, says will change their opinion.

Thank you so much for being an advocate.


----------



## sabina (Mar 11, 2006)

Glad you liked the links! 

It _was _nice to see Al Streit, I've never met him before (Aias did a couple years ago for our first rescue).

Maggie, I can't take credit for doing a thing, I've just been reading what everyone else is doing so far!

Sabina


----------



## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Well, you can too!

You posted those links for us to read and every little one you and Aias rescue continues the advocacy. 

Another think that is bothering me - if "Foolish" Felder gets his way, how will it affect people like you and Aias or Fred or Al and Bobby and all the others who see a sick or injured pigeon and pick it up to care for? Wonder if there will be a fine for that too?


----------



## Guest (Nov 22, 2007)

Maggie,
It will be devastating. Just to give one example, today I was running some chores on an avenue. I came across a bird lying on the sidewalk. When I tried to get near him, he flew and hopped away a bit and he did it every time I approached.

I ran into a store and bought the first thing I could find, pretzels. I crushed them and dropped them onto the ground. A group of pigeons came over including the one I was after. I grabbed him and have him home. He has string injury plus a monster of an infection on one toe. His droppings indicate that the infection has already entered his system.

He couldn't be gotten without food so in the future, if I don't want a $1,000 fine, this bird would have been lost.


----------



## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Fred, I'm glad, at least for now, you were able to catch him and are now treating him. Maybe, something could be written into the law (of course, I hope it never becomes law) that would allow people to pick up the sick/injured ones like you describe.


----------



## Guest (Nov 22, 2007)

Let me give you an example of the stupidity we are dealing with. One woman sent an email to the ASPCA of New York City, a supposedly knowledgeable and compassionate organization with full police powers to protect animals. Here is the email back to that woman and it really set me off. Read it carefully and look for any signs of intelligence in the woman who is responsible for Education of the Public by the ASPCA:

"Thank you for contacting the ASPCA to voice your concerns about the recent statement supporting a bill proposal to fine individuals found feeding pigeons in NYC. We appreciate your concern and hope that we can help you understand why we support this proposed legislation.
New York City Pigeons are resourceful birds that will find plenty to eat without the well intentioned but damaging assistance given by humans. The overpopulation of the pigeons would be far more damaging to the birds in the long run than will be our helping to sustain and control the population by ceasing to offer them *extra* food. Nobody from the ASPCA is suggesting we starve any of the city's pigeons to death. What we tend to forget is that, barring special circumstances, truly /wild/animals usually survive and thrive best WITHOUT human interference."

Here is my letter responding to this brilliant person in the ASPCA:

"I don't think you understand the real nutritional needs of pigeons. They are basically seed eaters. They will eat berries if they can find them and an occasional insect for protein. These are not true wild birds. They are feral, previously domesticated birds that have been tossed into very terrible circumstances.

The pigeons of NYC are malnourished. They suffer the diseases common to malnourished creatures. Bread has no value and is very counter productive to their health because aside from having no value, it contains yeast and many, many birds are sick from yeast infections. If you wish to confirm this, please contact the Wild Bird Fund at Animal General. These are very clean birds but they have been forced to live in a city made dirty by humans.

The lack of fresh water condemns them to illnesses that people do not contract such as Trichomoniasis which is prevalent. During the winter months, lack of fresh water forces them to drink water in the streets that contain salt used to melt snow and ice. This leads to salt poisoning and death. Lack of adequate calcium in their diet produces many egg bound hens and ailments such as overgrown beaks that eventually prevent them from eating anything. String that people drop in the streets creates very painful injuries to their feet and legs which need immediate attention if they are to be saved from infection and death. Eating pieces of frankfurter and hamburger from the street puts them in jeopardy of developing a kidney disease called visceral gout. Lack of adequate Vitamin A in their diets condemns many of them to Hypovitaminosis-A and causes an early death.

A pigeon can live for up to 30 years but their average life expectancy due to the above and many other factors, relegates them to 2-3 years in the city, if that. Because of the lack of food these birds suffer every day of their lives, the mortality rate of their babies is dramatically high. What does resourcefulness in finding scraps of bread have to do with their overall health? if you were forced to live on the diets they are stuck with, how healthy would you be? Do you have any knowledge of nutrition at all? I don't understand how you can make such an assertion because you are painfully ignorant of their true dietary needs.

I don't mind a debate with someone who has a good working knowledge of these birds but your education in the needs of these birds and their plight is apparently nil. If you are in the Education Division of the ASPCA, I would expect you to learn a lot more before you send out emails that shows ignorance of the real needs these birds have and support sadistic proposals.

Nobody in the ASPCA is advocating starving the birds? They are already starving. The Felder proposal will kill thousands of these birds and since rats eat dead pigeons, their numbers will explode and will increase even more dramatically when the food that the birds find on the streets, goes to them. That's what your support of Felder's idiotic proposal will accomplish.

Your organization has ignored reports of torture. Your organization has ignored pigeon nettings and now, you are poised to support starving them to death and starve, they will. The people who feed, rescue and rehabilitate these birds are far more educated than you and the rest of the ASPCA. I've lost total respect for your organization."

Gee, I didn't receive a response to my email to the ASPCA.


----------



## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

That is a very well written response, Fred. They are probably dumbfounded by your knowledge and the realization of their lack of it.


----------



## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Kudos to you Fred. That was a really great response to that woman, especially about increasing the numbers of rats.

I'm not surprised you received no response.

Poor babies, they already have it so tough and now one more thing set to destroy them.


----------



## Guest (Nov 22, 2007)

Folks,
All these emails are probably for naught. Something will be passed. Most of the people who are fighting for these birds are under the assumption that it is only a matter of contesting a fine for feeding them. I think it will go a lot further and will encompass some draconian measures. I know what some of them are and don't want to post them to give anyone more ideas. If this thing passes in any form, other cities are going to follow suit.


----------



## sabina (Mar 11, 2006)

You are very sweet Maggie.

Fred, the letter was excellent. I think it's possible that an outcry from pigeon supporters could have some effect. People who hate pigeons probably assume almost everyone else feels the same--once councilpeople see that a substantial/vocal number of people oppose the ban, it may affect their vote . In any case, I don't think it's possible to pass any bill with a $1000 fine attached, it is just too absurd.


----------



## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

as some of you know, it is illegal to feed them here. I now have to deal with harrasment of the worst kind by my neighbors, and all because of the pigeons poop, that ruins their car and dirties their skylights. 
they are now trying to go after me feeding the squirrells, and the stray cats. I love living in the city, but a city where there is not one speck of wildlife is not a city I want to live in. New york is next, then another town, and then your town. It started in the UK i believe, and it is spreading.
We all need to do something, what, i dont know, i am still at a loss as to what to do.
This has SERIOUSLY restricted me just FEEDING the birds, let alone saving the sick and injured. If i cant catch them with food, i can only get them when they are WAY too far gone to be helped.
Almost every single bird i caught wiothout the aid of food as bait died. A very sad, painful death, considering they had to get sick enough to not fly or run from me first, and the amount of birds now being poisoned is drastic, because these feeding bans give people the right impression that our so called leaders will turn their head to this cruel torturing of out pigeons.
I have seen a few birds so sick, not able to fly, that were crushed, or worse, only partly crushed by a car tire, only to die a slow death. these birds will get sicker and sicker without the small portions of good seed we all give them. It is truly sad, and sickens me. I more and more wish i lived far away from the city and these people. If i am to live in a city, i want parks, and birds, and trees and such. What do they want, no wildlife? do people really care THAT LITTLE now? I just get so sad at how selfish our society has become. 
Everyone wants more for themselves, no compassion for other people. let alone a bird.
I heard recently, how the miners used to take a bird into the mine shaft, so if the bird died, they knew they were next. Well, that mineshaft is our planet, and anything and everything that happens to that bird first, is coming for us next. We need to take care of our wildlife. And that includes pigeons.
Sabina, I just read about Biko, I am truly truly sorry, I know Aias must be crushed.  
I hope you do find him, if you need help of any kind, let me know..


----------



## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

Fred - everytime I read your letter I smile - it is just so knowledgeable; "nasty" without being overtly nasty (if you know what I mean). I do tend to agree that something will probably be passed which is really sad  But until that day I hope to do whatever I can to make sure the public realizes what a stupid bill it is and what a waste of taxpayer money it is!

I'm still left wondering just HOW it will be proven that someone is intentionally feeding pigeons (as opposed to finches, robins, swallows, etc.) Even the pretzels you put out Fred could be argued as being food for some other animal. 

And do the taxpayers realize their tax dollars are going to pay for this "pigeon czar" (now THERE's a business card I'd love to see  ).

It would be nice if the rally coming up on Nov. 28 would get some TV coverage. Hmmmm... I'll see what email addresses I can find for the local NY channels.

Details on the rally:
Press Conference to be held on Steps of City Hall. 
Please attend, with your help we can make a difference in the lives of thousands of pigeons!

*What: *Oppose sponsored bill by Simcha Felder (D) Brooklyn to 'ban feeding of New York City 
pigeons'. 
*Where:* Steps of City Hall, 131 Duane Street between Chambers and Vesey Streets in Manhattan. 
*When: *Wednesday, November 28, 2007, at 1:30PM - 3:00PM
Transportation: Subway 4,5 to Brooklyn Bridge; R,W to City Hall; A,C, 2,3 to Fulton Hall.

Even if you cannot attend in person you're opinion DOES COUNT!
The time to outreach is now, and it's absolutely critical that the Speaker's office be flooded with opposition to this proposal. You will be connected to her voice mail for your comments. Speaker Christine Quinn (D-Manhattan), (212) 788-7210


----------



## sabina (Mar 11, 2006)

Raina, Biko came back! Here's the thread about that: http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=23553 

I didn't realize it was illegal to feed pigeons in Boston. Is there a fine? If so, how much?


----------



## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

i am not sure about Boston, but chelsea, right by boston, it is illegal. It is called the wild bird ordinance, so i am not sure what the difference between an ordinance and a law is, but i dont know about a fine.
I know it is forbidden to build pigeon lofts for PET pigeons also, and you can feed ANY birds on public property, which in a city, EVERYTHING is public property.
I have been trying to get the paperwork concerning this from city hall, and they are giving me the run around. I think i am going to have someone else come in and say they want to learn how to make it illegal in their city to feed birds, then i bet they would give it up!
When i know more, i will fill you in.


----------

