# shaking pidgie



## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

Hi again, I posted about this before but got no answers... please input. I have this young pigeon(3 to 4 months old) that was hit by a car and hes all healed up, but he still shakes all the time. The vet said it is probably nerve damage from his trauma. He has been on Metacam and Sulfatrim but these did not help.He was not and is still not eating on his own though he tries very hard. He can however drink water on his own.I tube feed him exact baby formula three to four times a day depending on my work schedule. He is very cuddly and Ive noticed when I wrap him in a towel or hold him long enough and talk softly to him...his shaking will lessen , but is still there. He tries to preen the best he can and bathe/ He coos at my Dove (she could care less)I care for him very much but wonder am I doing the right thing by keeping him alive or am I being unfair to the poor guy?Any one know anyhting to help him???


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Birdbabe,

I'm sorry you didn't get any responses to your prior posts.

It's hard to say what is causing these tremors in the bird. It could very well be the result of the trauma from being hit by a car.

It's just my opinion, but as long as this bird seems happy and healthy, I'd do my best to keep on as you have been. Sometimes it takes many, many months for trauma related problems to resolve, and sometimes they never resolve. As long as the bird has a good quality of life, and it sounds to me like this is the case, then just keep doing what you have been.

If you could post some pictures of the bird, I'm sure we would all love to see him or her.

Terry


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## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Help Birdbabe and welcome to Pigeon Talk. I know you must care for this young pigeon that has come into your life.

Is it worth keeping him alive you ask. Yes it is. The key point you mentioned is that you care for him and that says a lot in the fact that you have been caring for this pigeon in need. 

He is dependent upon you right now. A bad situation happened to him that was out of his control.

As Terry mentioned, it could take a while for him to get better. Please be patient and continue to do what you have been doing . Love him and keep on cuddling.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe, 


Would you describe in more detail what you are refering to as 'shaking'?

Is this Pigeon flying allright? Landing allright? Wings and Tail spread evenly when he flies?

Phil
Las Vegas


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hello and thank you for your supportive and loving care of this bird.

If the bird has been treated for everything, and is now off of the meds, I would put him thru some good supportive nutrition now. Nervous problems, can be attributed to weak immune system as well as trauma and nerve damage. Make sure the bird is getting plenty of calcium and B complex vitamins in a good avian multi-vitamin mineral supplement. These nutrients are specific to nerve health and function and will help heal with time. Also, I would get this bird on some Now brand garlic, one small gell a day, to build up his immune system, and some probiotics to replenish the gut bacteria that was lost due to stress and anxiety. I know the feeding formula has some probiotics in it, but this bird needs more. Gut bacteria is constantly depleted when a bird is anxious or stressed.

I would also continue to offer this bird a heat source, if he should desire it, as he needs to expend energy on healing, not keeping warm. This way he can use his energy to rebuild and lay down healthy brain and nerve cells.

Last but not least, the bird needs to get on a regular diet of grains,legumes and seeds. There is alot of nutrition in the variety afforded in a good pigeon mix. I'm not saying to go cold turkey, he needs to be weaned and introducing him to seeds and getting him started on hand feeding him seeds will help. If he is drinking on his own, he needs to eat on his own. Feeding him formula on occasion is okay, but he needs a grown-up pigeon diet.

You will see a tremendous change in him.


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*re;shaky pigeon*

Hi all, thank you so much for you thoughts. He does fly but not real well, he lands ok but will stumble till his feet get it together.His shaking is as if a nervous wreck all the time, whole body and head shaking. Poor guy. Ive tried putting seed in the back of his mouth and its a heck of a fight...he does swallow some of them, but spits some out too. I put nekton vitamins in his formula and drop a drop of grapefruit seed extract into it every other day. (is this not enough)by direction of a vet and bird breeder.I have liquid calcium and he gets that once a week(again...not enough?)He picks at the seed thru instinct, I lay on the floor and try to entice him,playing with seed and putting it in my hand to his mouth, he is interested. Maybe he will get better with time???He has a heating pad in his cage where he sleeps at night and my house is usually at 80 degrees.So he never feels cold. Ill be looking forward to his total recovery but also realize he may never.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi BirdBabe, 


Sounds like you have been doing a fine job of it...!


I think Tressa makes the most apt suggestion at this point - to focus on his Nutrition now and continueing to work with him for him to be self-feeding and pecking successfully.

Getting him small whole Seeds, such as Canary or Finch Seed, in a small cup or bowl so the Seeds are 'deep', may make it easier for his attempts with pecking to succeed.

Sometimes something can throw them off to where pecking is difficult for them, and of course this prevents them from self-feeding even though they may try.

Time and patience...

If for now, while they still continue to improve from their neurological injury/compromise, you could augment the formula with some additional ingredients which will help nourish them more deferentially.

If you have a regular Kitchen Blender, you can blend into a fine powder, some White Safflower Seeds, Goji Berries ( any health Food Store ) and some non-salty Sea Weed or Purple Dulce...and add this to the KT or whatever powder formula mix you have been useing. Add some dried dark sour cherries also if you can find them ( Trader Joes, Health Food Stores, or Mail order from gorwers or sellers in Michigan ) 

You can add some fine powdered Garlic also.

In a blender, you usually have to make about a Tea Cup full for the blades to reach it, and to also stop now and then while blending to scrape up the untouched or partially blended stuff around the bottom.

But, say, take a Tea cup worth of White Safflower Seeds...add thirty Goji Berries, a dozen small dried Cherries, add maybe a good teaspoon full of powdered Garlic, and about two or three easy Tablespoons full of dry Sea Weed or one full tablespoon full of Purplr Dulce, and just blend it all dry into a fine-ish powder and add this 50/50 to your KT. Keep it dry and covered in the freezer for further use.


Moderate additions also of B-Vitamines...

You might consider to Worm him also sometime soon when you feel he is stronger.

You could also make his Water for drinking and formula mixing, to be the ACV-Water, which ( in my book anyway, for something like this, would be) Two Tablespoons of raw Apple cider Vinegar to a Gallon of good quality Water ( never hot tap Water)...


How are you feeding him?

And is he still 'nuzzleing' and asking to be fed in his way?


Good luck..!

Phil
Las Vegas


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Hi, and thanks for caring for this little guy. It is very hard when you have an animal who isn't 100% healthy and you are faced with the question of keeping him alive or not. I always go by the quality of life. It sounds like he has a wonderful quality of life, if he is eating (or allowing you to feed him), and especially if he is cooing to your little dove. It sounds like a lot of work for you, but if you can keep it up, I would definitely do all you can for him. If he was fighting the feeding, or lethargic and depressed all the time, that might be a different story. I can just see him cooing to the dove, and that usually means a pretty happy pijie. His shakes might just be an annoyance to him and hopefully don't bother him as much as it appears. I hope this and what everyone else writes is some kind of help for you. Please feel free to post any questions or thoughts about him and good luck!!


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*shakey pidge*

Hi again, thank you for all your input. I managed to get 10 warmed corn kernels (the frozen ones) down him yesterday and 6 more plus 3 green peas so far today along with his formula. Yes he still nuzzles and were still trying the seed playing.He took a bath today,and now hes resting on the couch. HIS COUCH by the way. What if I put about an 1/8 th or less of powdered garlic in his formula?? Im italian so he will smell yummy to me. Ill try the blending thing tomorrow, Ill do 2 more feedings before I go to work tonite.(Graveyard...yuk! Not by choice) Thanks again everyone.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe,


Powdered or granulated or fresh-minced Garlic sounds like a fine thing to me.

I add these also now and then, to their Seeds ( glistened with fresh Olive Oil first, ) or to their formula...and of course I get garlic-breath Pigeons and Doves.

It is good for them generally, it discourages any internal parasites, and they seem to like it, so...

Now, as for feeding him for the time being...

My own method is to use the hollow side of a regular soft rubber people-baby-nipple.

Your Pigeon is nuzzleing, asking to BE fed, so it should be easy then to let him eat his formula out of the hollow side of a Nipple.

Their formula needs to be warmed in a Tea cup or similar in a pan of warm Water ( never use a microwave, and never mix with hot tap water..) for the formula to be about your own body temperature.

Stirr well and constantly and test some on the underside of your wrist.

Make it kind of 'soupy' or about like melted Ice Cream anyway..and if you use the ingredients I listed, he will really go-to-town with it.

Just hold the Nipple at about his mid Crop level and gently guide his Beak into it...after a few times he will dive into it on his own when it is presented.

Consider to add about 1/4 to 1/3 plain Malto Meal, just as it is, to the dry ingredients.

This really makes a difference to them, and even the most finicky Pigeons or Doves will be won over when an otherwise excellent formula they turn their little Beak up at, has plain old fachioned Malto Meal in it.

Make up the dry ingredients and keep them in the freezer or refridgerated and covered for when needed.

Make the day's formula the night before, and refridgerate it covered, and with enough water simply poured on top of the dry ingredients, so it can hydrate completely in advance. Stirr it when you are going to warm it, and if needs any additional Water, add it then.

...at the end of the day, toss it out, and make the next small batch for the next day. Do not keep longer than that.

Get some 'Nutrical' at Petsmart, likely in the 'puppy' isle...and add a big squig of that to his day's formula also...

If all is well, this will really cheer him up, in addition to being really good for him nutrition-wise, and he will also get on with pecking at his own pace in the mean time...

They truely LOVE being fed, and it is fun to do for us, also of course.


Best wishes!

Phil
Las Vegas


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## Rockie (Jan 18, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe. I just wanted to add my thanks for what you are doing. It also sounds to me like he has more than a fighting chance and definitely quality of life. 

I have been stunned at times about the sudden recovery from neurological issues. I've had a bird that had to be wrapped like a burrito for 2 wks, with only his beak sticking out, all the while wondering if I was torturing him or not. Then one day he just stopped flapping all over the place. He started preening and the rest is history. Now "Clyde" is one of my most special pijies, and he has ways that show me how appreciative he is for helping him to hang in there.

It's a lot of work what you're doing, but well worth it, as it seems you feel as well. Please keep us posted.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Leslie it's nice to see you here,

I just wanted to add, there is one more supportive measure for any bird that has any kind of central nervous system disorder, and that is a homeopathic called Bellodonna. It has been used with success in a number of diseases that involve injury/trauma as well as PMV, relating to the nervous system.


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*Bellodonna?*

Hi everyone, Ive been not feeling well so I havent been here a couple days. All the web search on this Bellodonna has gotten me ancient Druid rituals and poison plants??? Where is this available and Im kinda scared to use this since Ive never heard of such a thing. Pidgarooni is hanging in there, he still pecking at the seed but no luck. He threw up the last couple days on his last feeding for the night...Im concerned. He seems ok during the day. Im trying to adjust to this new work schedule but Im so tierd and Im feeling like the birds are stressed out too. Could this be affecting him to the point of throwing up his food? Just a thought. He keeps the majoraty of the corn and peas down, but I have noticed a couple undigested corn kernals in the regurgitation. Ive given him some of the Zu-preem fruity things my cockatiels eat and hes dosent toss those. Im still putting Nekton and calcium in his formula along with a touch of garlic.I havent gotten to the store to get the malt-o-meal yet. I wondering if oatmeal could be used. I must rush home after work cause the birds want fed and let out for the day. Im not trying to cop- out on this malt-o-meal thing.Ill have time on monday,,,thats my only day off. I feel so bad like Im not doing the best for them. All of a sudden I have this new butt-head boss who decided that I need to work graveyard after 5 years of day shift and everyone is starting to suffer.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe,


Lets start with some basic things -


Can you post an image of this Pigeon?

Or, if not, can you say with some certainty how old they are?

How long have you had them?

What do their poops look like?


Are you keeping them definitely "warm" so their body is in fact warm?



Phil
Las Vegas


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Birdbabe,

I'm sorry to hear you are not feeling well.

You can purchase the Bellodonna at your local health food store, in the homeopathic section. It comes in small pillutes, in a tiny pill container.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe

Sorry you haven't been feeling well and hope you get better soon.

I can't speak about the belladona because I've never used it but Treesa is very good with natural remedies and knows what she is talking about.

About the feeding. I would like to make it simpler for you to help take the stress off both you and the bird. We feed our young and/or sick pigeons Exact but we use a syringe with a cat nipple attached but you can use whatever method you've been using. I simply mix the Exact with hot water from the faucet and then stir in about a teaspoon of plain yogurt which will help his digestion. Make sure you mix it really well because the Exact will swell some. By the time you've stirred it well it should be at the right temperature but always put a dab on your wrist to make sure it isn't too hot. You can alternate the plain yogurt with a probiotic called Benebac that I believe is available from Petsmart. As far as I know, you can continue to add the calcium and garlic but I don't think he needs the extra vitamins (Nekton) right now because the Exact has vitamins in it.

Continue with trying to help him eat seed and if the Zupreem is something he can manage continue with that - only not too much - and not the sole source of his food. Our pigeons love Zupreem as a treat.


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*For Phil*

Hi Phil, this little guy is no more than 5 months old. Ive had him about 4 months.His poopies are a drab olivey green with white and clear liquid. I dont know how to post pics here but I can video and upload from my phone and send that to your Private E-mail if you like. Im here in Arizona and its still quite warm. When I pick up Pidgarooni, he feels warm as do his feet, like I said he has a heating pad in his cage set on low if he chooses to lay on that...its on half of the cage bottom.Thanks for your help as everyone else.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Birdbabe, 



Hmmmm...

Might be a good idea to Worm them...

At least that gets rid one one variable of whatever might be vexing or taxing them.


How goes their self-feeding? Are they pecking any better yet?

I know sometimes I get in adults who poke at the Seeds and actually 'peck'' nothing as for getting anyitng into themselves, and this takes whatever time it takes to clear up...during which time of course I have to feed them one way or another.

If your Pigeon has the PPMV, then this can throw them off of course in any of many ways.

Direct Outdoor Sunshine, and often, if you can...would certainly be good for them...

Best wishes!

Phil
Las Vegas


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*update on pidgarooni*

Hi all, well he still hanging in there. I elected not to get the bellodonna as I talked with my avian vet and he says to be careful with those homepathic medicines. he was going to do some research on it and get back with me. I totally trust this man, he is one of the best. He has saved the lives of a couple of my birds in the past. Were keeping up on the teaching to self feed,but he still gets his fomula with extra calcium and the grapefruit seed extract in the water along with the apple cider viingar in the water also. I alternate these on different days. he looks good except for the crappy tail that he props himself on when hes resting. Still shaking,and cuddly. I keep you updated evey week or so. Thank you all for everything.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Can you describe this propping-himself-on-his-tail thing? Is it like sitting up with his rump firmly on the ground?

Pidgey


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## Baby Goose (Oct 10, 2006)

After reading this post about other challenges in saving a pigeon I realize that the only delima I had was to get him to feed from a syring and then to wean him off the syringe to seed. Im still finding it challenging to get him to entertain any other food ideas....

picky bird. 

All I really wanted to say was BRAVO and GREAT JOB!~


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## Birdbabe (Jan 24, 2006)

*pidgarooni*

Hi again, were still trying to eat on our own here with no luck, I notice he can pick them up but then drops them again when he tries to get them back to swallow.I am a patient mom though....laying on the floor with him playing with seeds in my hand and he walks(stumbles) over and tries to eat. He shakes constanlty! His new thing is prooping himself on his tail and sitting back on his "heels" butt almost touching the ground. he gets very melonchaly and sits in front of the arcadia door looking outside for hours. We went outside once so far but he got so nervous his shaking was almost uncontrolable. Poor guy. he likes the back of his neck and cheeks rubbed, this seems to lessen his shaking.When I leave for work, I put him on the bed and punch a spot in the pillow for him to nestle into, hell still be there in the morning looking all comfy.He still can drink water on his own which is a big help to me, but we need to get this eating thing down, then I wouldnt worry so much about him. Thanks for all your help everyone.


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