# Baby pigeon hatched today. Help!



## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Hi all,

My daughter has two pigeons who have had a few eggs that they didn't look after, but the latest one hatched today. We were going to let the parents raise the chick but when Bridey went out to check on them, the father was standing on the babys head and the baby was cold.  We've bought it inside and put it under a heat lamp with some water for humidity, now what? We have no pet shops that stock formula here. It's crop is full of what looks like yolk, its yellow. What can we feed it and how do we keep it hydrated?

Any information is greatly appreciated. Thankyou!


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Where are you located, incase we have a member that can help you?


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Australia. Blue Mountains.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

That would be the bottom of the world...right?
Have you hand fed a baby bird before and do you have a syringe ?
How about baby cereal?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=15236

Read the link I have provided from our resourse section. I'll go back and look for other links that will be helpful.


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Our internet is about to go from a storm, is rice milk any good with weetbix?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Can you pulverize some of the feed you give to the parents and make a slurry? If the rice milk has sugar, don't use that.


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Ok, we're going to pulverise the bird seed. Should we just add water? Looking at the recipes for formula I see it needs oils, is the seed oil enough? We have olive oil and wheatgerm oil, are they any good?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

The slurry is only temporary until you can get the ingredients needed for the formula. Remember to make it runny, room temp. Don't reuse formula you have added the water to. I would skip the wheat germ oil.
Did you get the PM?


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi all .. I'll see if I can reach Susan (theAussie) and find out what might be readily available for this baby.

Thanks for all the good help, Charis .. 

Welcome jadeosaurusrex and good luck with this baby. Keeping it warm and dry is very important in addition to getting the proper nutrition into it.

I'll be back in a bit.

Terry


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Thanks so much guys, he's such a little sweetie and he seems strong. I hope he makes it!


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Do you have the little one in some type of little "nest" .. something pretty small and lined with a soft fabric that will allow the little one to grip well with those tiny feet? If the baby is kept on a slick surface, the legs will become splayed.

Terry


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

We do, we have him in a soft little nest, we've made him a slurry and we're waiting for his crop to empty. How will we know when it is properly empty?


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

*a message from the bottom of the world*

Hi all, and G'day to you in the blue mountains. If you PM me, I can ring you if you like - I know nothing about what to feed a pigie baby but with the internet and a phone I am sure we can work it out.

Firstly - weetbix would not be a good idea i dont think. That is 97% Wholegrain wheat - Vitabrits is organic and maybe a better option and as for Gerbers Baby food, I didn't think they still made that, I had it fed to me when I was a kid, and I am 39

So are you rural and what have you got as a place to purchase food, are you close to a supermarket at all?? Like in our situation we have a Woolworths an hours round drive from here.

If the gang on here can tell me what she should be feeding, I will do my best to 'translate' it into an Aussie alternative.

So we can chat on the phone if it is easier - but if someone can explain what the food is that can be used for a Pigeon I will do my best to help this person get something to help it - as close as possible for the time being

I know you are having a storm, in the blue mountains, all of Australia including us down here are getting lots of very needed rain.

love Susan in Tasmania xxxx


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

I'm looking at the MacMilk recipe link. Thanks is that the kind of thing??? If so, a strained chicken food for babies would be easily found in a supermarket I am sure, even a small one - with all the baby foods in that section. No probs either getting yoghurt. I am not sure what you have on hand with the vitamins? 

The Blue Mountains is a very VERY beautiful place and home to some incredible wildlife. Have you had pigeons for a while, do you belong to a club or know of anyone close by who has pigeons, have you looked online to see if you have a bird rehabber in the region who may be able to help you with the baby formula???

If the bird takes the pulverised food, would it be likely or possible that it may be returned to the parent to feed tomorrow???


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

No - Vitabrits would not be suitable either, it is very much the same as weetbix - which for anyone overseas is a biscuit shaped cereal food. Made of mostly wheat.


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

I just looked up Pigeon clubs in NSW - there is a list of different clubs here - if you found one close to you, you could ring them and ask their advice on something suitable to feed, I am sure they would be helpful and at least they are aware of what we can and cannot get here readily in foods/brands etc - actually it wouldn't matter if you rang one that was far away, I just thought this may help as a resource if you needed to know what things we can get here in Australia for a baby - or perhaps could feed just for now quickly from what you have on hand. They would know what I do not know sadly, but I hope these links help you. 

http://www.birdmunchies.com.au/associations/Bird Clubs/nsw.htm

is there any here in the list that is near you?


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

also, I will just put these links up in case they could help you with any food/formula or phone help - you never know

this is the big wildlife rescue organisation in the Blue Mountains
http://www.bluemts.com.au/wires/
they offer help and advice on all sorts of critters

and then there was a list of other wildlife helpers in your area 
http://www.rspcansw.org.au/what_we_do/shelters/wildlife_rescue_contacts

I am hoping on the first list in my other post that you could ring one of the pigeon club contacts closest to you and just ask them about what would be suitable as a formula in this situation or they might be able to suggest what you can use from your own cupboard - though it sounds like you are doing pretty well 

I'll shut up now. And see what your next report in says. I'm just here to help if I can. I don't have pigeons, I am a member here because this board gave me some help with some dosages for my pet starlings. I have starlings and a blackbird but I'll always do what I can to help anyone with any creature of coure


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

Ok - we have now got an electrical storm happening here and I have to go offline till it passes or we may get our modem fried again


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

hi Jadeosausrex, 



As for means of feeding, he will gladly eat, if VERY delicately, and tiny amounts, often, by inserting his tiny Beak into the cut-off end of a plain people-baby-nursing-teat...which you can slightly squeeze to make narrow in the fore and aft for his Beak to open and close as he eats...some casual images here, if in this case with a MUCH older Dove - all you would need, is the 1/2 inch or so of the 'end' of one for now...


http://public.fotki.com/PhilBphil/baby_dove_-_july/


Food must be 'liquidy', and, be body temperature.


Tiny "TINY" meals...ohhhhhh...every half hour or so...and watch for the little 'poops'...which show things are going through alright...

Good if he can be a little humid...so if in an enclosed or covered place, have a damp little cloth near him but not against him...

Very liquidy, for the formula, for one this new...


And, of course, he must be thoroughly "warm" through and through continuously...if you pick him up, he needs to feel just s-l-i-g-h-t-l-y 
'warm' to the underside of your wrist...and if not, find a way to make his situation a little warmer...

No feeding unless he is properly warm...


Good luck...!


I am pretty good as for what to feed them once they are four or five days old...happy to blather on about that if you wanted...but in theory, as you may know, in Nature, they would ONLY 'eat' ( drink ) their parent's "Milk" for about the first five days...or more even...


No 'dairy', but Oat or Rice or Almond 'milk' should be alright I would think, to use as an ingredient in his formula...


You can grind Seeds and Berrys and other things in any small counter top electric Coffee Grinder, into a fine powder, but I think he is a little young for that...

Graham Crackers, made into a fine powder, would likely be a good in ingredient to consider...a little bit of fresh, NEW Bottle, Olive Oil...


Most people 'baby' foods have far too little nutrition for Avian situaitons unfortunately, but "Malto Meal" is pretty good, and tastes good to them also...not cooked of course...but I do not know if you have that there...it is a 'Hot' Cereal over here...but a good ingredient just plain out of the box...


Anyway...

You have your Hands full now..!


Best wishes!


Phil
l v


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

I'm logging on and off in between storms here. Hi there Phil (waving from the bottom of the world)  - I do not believe Graham Crackers or Malto Meal are available here in Australia, I haven't heard of either of those - I am pretty sure they must be something only you have. 

I do so hope this one does alright, it is such a cutie!!

love susan xxxx


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Thank you, Susan! I appreciate the help! WIRES is a good place to call. I forgot about that and even know someone in WIRES.

Basically, we are looking for a hookbill formula or a human baby food cereal that can be mixed up with hot/warm water to feed the baby. Here in the US the hookbill stuff is Kaytee, Lafebers, Roudybush ..

Any dry baby cereal that can be mixed with water would be good and the addition of any meat based baby food to the cereal mix would be good for the first week. After the first week, the meat baby food can be done with.

Terry


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

*A Link For WIRES*

http://www.wires.org.au/

Terry


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Suzan..!


( Waves hand from wherever Las Vegas is! - sort of upper middle of the side I s'pose...)


It would sure be swell if any close by Pigeon people might have a Nested Pair whose Babys are hatching about now, to surrogate the little one to...



Well hmmmm...


Any sort of people-baby 'Bisquites' or Biskets, or people-baby-cereal that actually have a meaningful Protean content, made into fine powder or left that way...a little dab of 'Vegemite'...some plain Malt Powder or fresh ground Sprouted Barley or if none available, then some sort of Sucrose but not Honey...Molassas even, Sorgum, Cane Syrup ( not 'corn' )...a little( fresh Bottle ) Olive Oil...m-a-y-b-e, some white Safflower Seeds and some Goji Berrys, both made into fine powder in a little Coffee Mill...all these then, combined...Water or other to make into a medium thin 'Soup'...


Might muddle though alright...

Fats...Proteans...Vitamines...and plenty of hydration...but they need to be 'gentle' and Natural and easily digested ones of course...


Hope the Weather goes easy for you all...!


Phil
l v


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Even if only a meat based human baby food (the pulverised, smooshed stuff) is available, that could be mixed with water and fed. After a day or two it could be thickened with the addition of baby cereal flakes. Even grinding up good quality dry cat or dog food in a coffee grinder and then "smooshing" it would work .. a hard boiled egg yolk added to the mix, and I thiink we would be getting there. My apologies for using the terms "smooshed and smooshing" .. hopefully you get the idea for the word .. probably they aren't even words .. just trying to convey the idea. 

Terry


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

Well I think Terry, that a call to them would be a great idea, and ask them what is the best option available here. They will know I am sure what the equivalent is over here "down at the bottom of the world" - I cannot help as sadly I have only raised the Lorikeets and they have their own special diet powder. I haven't had any other hookbills to know the name but I think maybe Kaytee is available in Australia.

There are also a great online pet store that ship fast in Australia, let me try and find that link as I got something within 2 days from them and I am sure they are based in New South Wales..........which would mean you would get anything you order most likely within 48 hours, I have found them to be so speedy

here it is

www.petplus.com.au

They are very good and may have one of those formulas, or a call to anyone in the Pigeon clubs in NSW list would be sure to know the name of an equivalent. So if needed, it may be possible to order it online from the site above, just in case this one needs a few days or weeks of care

I hope this has been helpful. I really do pray this one makes it!!! I actually just said a little prayer for it.

love susan
gripping onto the bottom of the world, in Tasmania, Australia xxxx

So I will leave you now and I feel sure there are contacts that will be of help with just a phone call or two. WIRES looks fantastic doesn't it! I was delighted to see it was in the Blue Mountains which by the way, is truly one of the most INCREDIBLE and stunning parts of Australia, it is an awesome place. 

Good luck with the sweet baby and I pray someone on those lists will be able to give you any advice you need on what you can get here or use quickly to help the baby.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Thank you, Susan! Your help is greatly appreciated! I also have to sign off and go check on my baby and get to bed. I truly appreciate you responding to my calls for "help" here!

Terry


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

We've realised that what we thought was the crop wasn't. So we've given the baby 2 mls of the pulverised stuff. I was reading somewhere that you're supposed to tube feed a baby? We're using a childrens panadol dropper. Poor little thing, I wish we could give him back to his parents, but we're too concerned for him. The parents are probably just inexperienced. Is it normal for them to tred on their babies? Not sure how resillient they are.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

[email protected] said:


> We've realised that what we thought was the crop wasn't. So we've given the baby 2 mls of the pulverised stuff. I was reading somewhere that you're supposed to tube feed a baby? We're using a childrens panadol dropper. Poor little thing, I wish we could give him back to his parents, but we're too concerned for him. The parents are probably just inexperienced. Is it normal for them to tred on their babies? Not sure how resillient they are.


Well, the inexperienced parents may well tred on their babies. 2 mls is about right for a newborn/newhatched. I have no clue what a panadol dropper is .. assuming it is something like an eyedropper here in the US .. please let us know. Isn't it just amazing that those of us who speak English still can't commuicate ?? The babies are QUITE resilient . keep it warm and get some nourishment in .. it'll be there!

Terry


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

Panadol is a brand name for a paracetamol here (sp?) it is the best known tablet you take for mild pain. So I would say this is a dropper that has come out with some liquid form of the paracetomal. I'm sure that is wrong spelling. LOL


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

A Panadol dropper is like an eye dropper, its used to dispense paracetamol to infants for fevers etc.

He seems to be doing ok, feel so sorry for him being without his Mum. We put him back in to see if the parents would take over, but they ignored him and sat on the other side of the nesting box. Its cold and wet here tonight so we're not going to risk him dying of cold. He's in a warm nest with flannelette lining the box and water and a heat lamp. I hope he'll be ok! Really attatched to the little darling. I'll keep you posted on how he's going and I'll post more photos as he grows. Thanks again for all your help.  

Kind regards, Jade.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

[email protected] said:


> We've realised that what we thought was the crop wasn't. So we've given the baby 2 mls of the pulverised stuff. I was reading somewhere that you're supposed to tube feed a baby? We're using a childrens panadol dropper. Poor little thing, I wish we could give him back to his parents, but we're too concerned for him. The parents are probably just inexperienced. Is it normal for them to tred on their babies? Not sure how resillient they are.



Hi jadeosaurousrex, 


I think you missed my missive, several posts above...I will repost it...


best wishes..!


Phil
l v


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

repost



hi Jadeosausrex, 



As for means of feeding, he will gladly eat, if VERY delicately, and tiny amounts, often, by inserting his tiny Beak into the cut-off end of a plain people-baby-nursing-teat...which you can slightly squeeze to make narrow in the fore and aft for his Beak to open and close as he eats...some casual images here, if in this case with a MUCH older Dove - all you would need, is the 1/2 inch or so of the 'end' of one for now...


http://public.fotki.com/PhilBphil/baby_dove_-_july/


Food must be 'liquidy', and, be body temperature.


Tiny "TINY" meals...ohhhhhh...every half hour or so...and watch for the little 'poops'...which show things are going through alright...

Good if he can be a little humid...so if in an enclosed or covered place, have a damp little cloth near him but not against him...

Very liquidy, for the formula, for one this new...


And, of course, he must be thoroughly "warm" through and through continuously...if you pick him up, he needs to feel just s-l-i-g-h-t-l-y 
'warm' to the underside of your wrist...and if not, find a way to make his situation a little warmer...

No feeding unless he is properly warm...


Good luck...!


I am pretty good as for what to feed them once they are four or five days old...happy to blather on about that if you wanted...but in theory, as you may know, in Nature, they would ONLY 'eat' ( drink ) their parent's "Milk" for about the first five days...or more even...


No 'dairy', but Oat or Rice or Almond 'milk' should be alright I would think, to use as an ingredient in his formula...


You can grind Seeds and Berrys and other things in any small counter top electric Coffee Grinder, into a fine powder, but I think he is a little young for that...

Graham Crackers, made into a fine powder, would likely be a good in ingredient to consider...a little bit of fresh, NEW Bottle, Olive Oil...


Most people 'baby' foods have far too little nutrition for Avian situaitons unfortunately, but "Malto Meal" is pretty good, and tastes good to them also...not cooked of course...but I do not know if you have that there...it is a 'Hot' Cereal over here...but a good ingredient just plain out of the box...


Anyway...

You have your Hands full now..!


Best wishes!


Phil
l v


PS - 


You would be far BETTER off, and he would also, if you only used the 'rubber' END of an 'Eye Dropper' and let him eat from the Hollow of it, which is his natural manner...than to be trying to force anything down his throat with an 'eye dropper' or 'tube' of any kind...especially as his food at this phase, needs to be quite liquidy...


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## [email protected] (Dec 3, 2007)

Ah, thanks Phil! I did miss this post, still learning my way around. I will definately try this method of feeding, thankyou so much.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi jadeo, 


Or any other sort of small, soft rubber 'cup' suited to his Beak size...like the smallest one shown in my album images there...wide enough for him to open his Beak an 1/8th inch or so.


Tiny meals, and often...more or less around the clock, or, whenever you are not sleeping.

He needs slight humidity also, or for the warmth to be a little humid...covered of course so no drafts or cooler ambiant air chilling him...


Good luck..!



Phil
l v


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## theAussie (Jun 3, 2007)

*checking in*

I somehow missed some posts here too?

How did this little one go? Did it make it - I do hope so

love and light
susan xxxx

Hope you got as much needed rain as we did down here in Tassie. And to think we dug a dam just before it rained. Wonder if that is the same as 'washing your car' - which always ensures it will rain the next day.


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## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I would work on getting the parents to take care of it. I would reintroduce it back to the nest and observe it for a bit. See if the parents will resume care for it. To leave a baby unattended is not always bad. They may be regulating the temp of the nest. I would try this first. Then if they do not feed and water it, then care for it. 

Randy


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

You can always put a stuffed animal/soft toy in with him for him to snuggle up to. I'm hand raising a baby who's about twelve days now and he loves to snuggle with his fluffy stuffed moose.  I hope the baby is doing well.


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