# I just got PIGEONS!



## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

Hello every1,
thnx for ur helpp and now i have 2 pigeons (white fantails) . They are really cute and i'll have pics up in no time .

I have some questions:
1. They keep on cleaning or grooming themselves with beaks too often. Is it normal? 
2. How long till they lay eggs?
3.Do poultry vitamins do well for pigeons? I'm in Pakistan and there arent any pij vitamins.
4. How often should i clean my cage?
5.How should i clean them and how often?
6. How should i feed them? Hand? Bowl? or seeds scattered on ground?

Thank you very much..and oh..I need 2 names....for my girl/boy pijjies!!
any suggestions?


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hi Hamza, 

Congratulations on the new white fantails Post pictures when you can for sure.

Pigeon do spend a lot of time grooming and preening themselves so yes, this is normal. However, if you notice them digging and scratching at their feathers very aggressively, they might have lice or mites. Have you inspected them for any external parasites? With white birds, it's pretty easy to spot them. Look under the wings and hold them up to a light source when you look. Part the feathers near the vent and neck too and check for insects near the skin. 

If you have a true pair (male and female) they will need time to acclimate to their new home. What kind of housing are you supplying them with, size and location? Are these indian fantails, the ones with the large tail like a peacock? If they are, these birds sometimes have difficulty with successful copulation. It's hard to give you a time frame on when to expect eggs from them.

You should clean their cage once a day, offer them a bath 2-3 times per week, maybe more since it's likely hot & dry in Pakistan.

You can provide their seed in sturdy and preferably untippable bowls made of ceramic, glass or hard plastic. Clean all water dishes once a day with soap and water or bleach. Clean food dishes one a week or as necessary the same way.

Hope this helps


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

Yes, they are English fantails with smaller tails than the Indian type.

HOw should i bathe them? with a wet towel? a cloth? or let them do it themselves?

And is it okay for the *male to get on top of the female and flap its wings?*
The female keeps sitting for the whole day and the male walks around. Is THIS normal?

PLz reply...

THNX again...


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hamza said:


> HOw should i bathe them? with a wet towel? a cloth? or *let them do it themselves*?
> 
> Yes, provide a pan or tray for them to bathe in, they will bathe themselves.
> 
> ...


Also, please post the pictures of them, their cage etc when you can


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Congratulations on acquiring the fantails, they are quite a beautiful breed.

If the hen is sitting still, the male has probably been driving her to the nest, as Brad said, she will be laying eggs within 5 to 10 days, or less.

You should provide the hen with a nice nest bowl and give them nest material, like clean, and dry pine needless, even strips of clean white paper. She needs a place to lay her eggs that has a rounded bottom, a nesting bowl, with some traction, where the eggs can be incubated by them comfortably , and where the babies will be able to maintain their position with feet under them. Without that their feet can come out from under them and they can develop a condition called splay legs.

Please provide them with a good calcium grit, as they both need it, especially the hen-so that she has plenty of calcium for her eggs, the babies, and her calcium reserves.

I would try to find an avian multi-vitamin mineral for all types of birds if possible. Can you tell us what exactly the vitamins and minerals in the poultry preparation and how much of each?

Here is a thread on pet pigeon care:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=10848


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

I will post pics by tomo... 

I provided them with a bowl with dry grass and twigs kinda made into a nest but they start to flap wings and starting pecking each other and themselves for insects i guess or they dont like it...So i removed it...

What *EXACTLY *is a grit?

Is there a natural alternative for calcium grit?
I dont know abt wat the poultry vitamins contain but i'll let u know...

and again THANK you all very much...


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Red pigeon grit, is especially designed to meet a pigeons needs. It is one of the most important things you need for your birds.

It serves two purposes, pigeons swallow it when they feel the need, grit actually helps to grind the seed, and grains in their gizzard, to prepare it for digestion.

The minerals in the grit, provide the necessary calcium/magnesium, and more, for hens to maintain good healthy eggs as well as enable strong bones for her chicks.

There are many types of calcium you can provide the birds, but they must also have the grit for digestion.

People have used crushed oyster shells, egg shells-crushed, even tiny pieces of cuddlebone, for a calcium resource, but they still need the grit for grinding seeds.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

I've posted da picks...They are in da cage though... Hope u like them... Is there a way to post larger pictures...

anyways i've moved them to an outdoor cage which is quite big... HOw can i make them to be not so afraid of me.. cuz everytime i change their water they are scared to death( make loud coos, run about, or go into a corner) 

Any tips?


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## Victor (Dec 18, 2004)

Hamza said:


> I've posted da picks...They are in da cage though... Hope u like them... Is there a way to post larger pictures...
> 
> anyways i've moved them to an outdoor cage which is quite big... HOw can i make them to be not so afraid of me.. cuz everytime i change their water they are scared to death( make loud coos, run about, or go into a corner)
> 
> Any tips?


Welcome to Pigeon Talk Hamza. Fantails are sweet gentle pigeons. I have 6 pet pigeons but only one Indian fantail. He is white with some black markings on his fan tail. His name is Uchiwa.

Most pigeons will calm down once they get used to you. Spend time with them. If you are the one that feeds them, they will know that you are the one that is providing them with food. Speak to them in a nice soft voice while your hand is in the cage, and move slowly. Do not make any sudden moves. 

Some pigeons Hamza, just do not like to be touched or grabbed on. Try and respect this. In time they may not mind. 

I have a retired racing pigeon that does not liked to be touched at all, and I have had him since last early Summer.

I also have a female pigeon that will fly to my head or arm when SHE wants to, but does not want to be grabbed either.

The other 4 have no problem being touched. It depends on their personality.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Question?*

My female keeps on moving her neck back and forth very fast with force.The male doesnt do that at alll.......what is she doing?Why isnt the male doing it? IS it normal?

Are dried grass and twigs good nest building materials?


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hamza said:


> *My female keeps on moving her neck back and forth very fast with force.*The male doesnt do that at alll.......what is she doing?Why isnt the male doing it? IS it normal?
> 
> Are dried grass and twigs good nest building materials?



Can you describe the neck motion a bit more clearly? Can you take a video of this?

Twigs are good for nest material, raffia is ok too and something you could probably get in Pakistan.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

Where can i post a video of this movement?

ANd well my birds are preening themselves aggressively and as u said Brad, they may have some mites etc. The thing is that they're really scared of me and so i cant pick them up to check them. They are also losing quite a lot of feathers while preening...Is this moulting? 

They know i put feed in their cage cuz when i refill the container, they are in the corner (scared) but as soon as i leave, i peek from the side and they rush to the container and start eating. What should i do?

They/ve made a small nest of dried grass twigs and strips of cotton. Will this cause splay legs?

PLz help as i'm in need of ur assistance....
Thhanks


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Hamza said:


> They/ve made a small nest of dried grass twigs and strips of cotton. Will this cause splay legs?
> 
> PLz help as i'm in need of ur assistance....
> Thhanks


Hi Hamza,
Your birds are beautiful, by the way.  

I would suggest placing a small piece of cloth *under* the nest of twigs. This will help keep the babies legs from sliding out from under them.

If you don't plan on having lots of babies, I would also suggest buying some artificial eggs to replace their natural eggs. 

Please keep us posted on how things are going.

Cindy


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

Hamza said:


> *ANd well my birds are preening themselves aggressively and as u said Brad, they may have some mites etc. The thing is that they're really scared of me and so i cant pick them up to check them. They are also losing quite a lot of feathers while preening...Is this moulting?
> *
> They know i put feed in their cage cuz when i refill the container, they are in the corner (scared) but as soon as i leave, i peek from the side and they rush to the container and start eating. What should i do?


PLz help with other questions and AZfeathers thnx for ur support


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hamza said:


> Where can i post a video of this movement?
> 
> ANd well my birds are preening themselves aggressively and as u said Brad, they may have some mites etc. The thing is that they're really scared of me and so i cant pick them up to check them. They are also losing quite a lot of feathers while preening...Is this moulting?
> 
> ...


Hi Hamza, 

You can upload your video to www.youtube.com and then just provide the link to your video in your post here. You will need to register before you upload your video.

You're going to have to take them in hand to inspect them for lice and mites, whether they are scared of you or not and if you need to treat them. They might be moulting, yes. Pigeons moult year round and will lose feathers here and there, but the *main* moult happens only once per year. 

Just give them time to adapt to their new home and the people there. It will take them about a week to start feeling more at ease. Also, talk to them softly every day, spend a lot of time with them each day but watching them from a distance. Eventually, they will get used to your presense and realize you don't mean them any harm. Some pigeons are more nervous than others so it just requires patience, gentleness and persistance on your part


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Just asking...*

Who makes the nest? male or female?

I noticed one just stands while the other is ever so busy making the nest...


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Hamza said:


> Who makes the nest? male or female?
> 
> I noticed one just stands while the other is ever so busy making the nest...


The male brings the nesting material to the hen and she arranges it.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

Is there a thing such as *Over-feeding*? My pigeons are _always _pecking around for food and are always hungry! Should i feed them _all _the time?


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Hamza said:


> Is there a thing such as *Over-feeding*? My pigeons are _always _pecking around for food and are always hungry! Should i feed them _all _the time?


yes there is such a thing. How you feed really depends on the type of birds you have and what they are for. Since you have Fantails, you could do a few things. The "rule of thumb" is 1 oz per bird per day. So........you can either measure out what you give them and keep track of how much they eat and go from there, OR, you can leave feed in front of them 24/7 and let them eat as they want to, but doing this will cause them to throw food around and look for the "good stuff".......... Either way will work,,,just depends on how "spoiled" you want them to be. 
As an example, my racers feed gets measured always. I know exactly how much they are getting. I've got 4 Satinettes that do nothing but "hang out" all day. I give them a bowl of feed every morning, not measured and empty what ever is left the next morning and give them some more. I'm not trying to get them to do anything special like fly and trap in a loft, so I really don't care if they eat a little to much. They are just pets and something pretty for me to look at so, if they're happy, I'm happy.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hamza said:


> Is there a thing such as *Over-feeding*? My pigeons are _always _pecking around for food and are always hungry! Should i feed them _all _the time?


Have they been wormed?

You might give them a garlic capsule down the throat each day.

http://store.thecatalog.com/1790.html


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

WHat usually occurs before the hen lays the eggs?

and why does Sonu(male) continously ram into Monu(femail)?

It has been cold in KArachi, hi-22'C low-9'C. Can my pigeons survive this? THey seemed to have been doing ok for 2 cold nights so far?


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

My pigeon (male) is flapping his wings hard moving in a circle on same spot. What IS he DOING?

HE also got on top of her and flapped wings...(this is mating as i was told before)

IS there a natural alternative for Vit E?

and can someone plz explain the process of pigeon reproduction....!


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Hamza said:


> My pigeon (male) is flapping his wings hard moving in a circle on same spot. What IS he DOING?
> 
> HE also got on top of her and flapped wings...(this is mating as i was told before)
> 
> ...


Flying in circles in the same spot is his way of exercising his wings. No worries.
On top of the hen flapping his wings........yep, he mating........No worries.
Don't know about the Vit.E........... Sorry
Once the birds start mating........the hen should lay in ABOUT 10 days. Sometimes earlier, sometimes later.....but 10 days is the "rule of thumb".
Once she lays her first egg, she may or may not sit tight on it. Most just sort of "hover" or stand over it, protecting it, but not actually keeping it warm and incubating. Once she lays the second egg, which will be two days after the first, she will sit tight on both eggs. The hen sets from around 4:00 in the afternoon, and all night, until about 10:00 the next morning. At 10:00 the cock will take over and sit on the eggs until about 4:00 and they'll switch. (these times are approximate......not set in stone) This will go on for about 19 days from the day the FIRST egg was laid and then they will hatch. The parents will keep up the above schedule until the babies are around 10 days old and they will gradually leave them for extended periods of time. The older the babies get, the longer they will leave them. They will feed them 4 or 5 times a day..........other than that, the babies are left alone in the nest to sleep and grow. Hope this helps.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Fantails*

I read many threads in this forum regarding problems of fertility faced by fantails due to their tails. Why is this so?

I have fantails and am quite worried...!!!


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Hamza said:


> I read many threads in this forum regarding problems of fertility faced by fantails due to their tails. Why is this so?
> 
> I have fantails and am quite worried...!!!



I've done what you have done.......read.........I really don't much about Fantails. I guess thier big tail gets in the way. I think some breeders cut thier tail feathers, but I have no idea how to do this. Hopefully someone with some experience will be along in a while.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*New Pics*

Here they are after 9 days in my captivity:


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## JoyfulSongTree (Apr 7, 2006)

Hi Hamza
Sonu and Monu are a very good looking pair!
There were two things that I noticed that relaxed my dove(s) and got them interested and used to me (aside from using the other advice that you've already gotten  ) 
One was to sit in a chair near their cage and just read outloud for awhile. 
The other was to do a project with my hands in front of them. This way they could watch me in action while I was concentrating on something else besides them. I think it really helped for them to be able to watch me instead of the other way around.
Best wishes
Carol


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Mating??*

Is there a sign or something that can tell me if my pigeons have mated?
I have seen them do the mating ritual many a time and think they have not mated yet...

If they preen each other like SOnu preens Monu and vice versa, does it mean they're mates??? I'm not sure if they have a nest but at around 5.30pm, 30 min before sunset, they sit in a corner and start to doze off..Is this their nest???

Please help...


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Hi Hamza, if Sonu was on top of Monu and flapping his wings, that means they have mated. As for the tail feathers, I think mainly breeders will trim them. I have had fantails and they mated with NO problems, and I did NOT trim their feathers. Sometimes trimming feathers is a tricky thing to do and can cause bleeding, so I would just not worry about that at all.  

They may take a little while to decide where their nest should be. If they are sleeping in the same spot at night, that is probably it now. You can place their bowl and materials there, if you like. They will probably lay eggs soon, since they have been mating. The kissing, preening, and little noises they make means that they love each other and are a happy couple. 

You asked about the cold. Are they outside? Fantails especially need a bit of help during the cold weather. I would make sure their cage is covered very well with a tarp, or thick blanket at night, and during days that it is very cold. Pigeons do well in the cold, but are happier when they're warm. You can also provide a heat source, such as a heating pad set on low, or a red heat bulb near them (but not where they could land on it and burn themselves, or get too close). Making sure they are warm will help them as they are trying to start a family, too. 

You can also offer them cracked corn to help them fatten up and stay warm. I would advise NOT measuring their food out, but as Renee said, leave a bowl out for them all of the time. Especially since it is so cold, and they are not racing birds. My birds are not flyers (they stay in their aviary all of the time) and have access to food at all times, and they are not too fat.  

To tame them, sitting in a chair near them and talking, reading out loud, or doing the project with your hands are very good ideas. They need to know that you are safe, and they need to get used to you. This will take a little time, but often they warm up VERY quickly. I have had wild pigeons turn tame in less than a month before, once they see they can trust me. If you keep your voice low, and don't make sudden moves around them, just let them get used to you over time. You can offer them treats when you go out to sit with them, and that will help them trust you, too. 

If they do lay eggs, it is a very simple process from there. The mom will lay on the eggs during the night and morning, usually, and the dad will lay on them during the day. After the first one hatches, the second one will hatch the next day usually. Then BOTH of the parents will feed the babies! They actually make pigeon milk for them, in their "ceres" (this is the fleshy part at the top of their beak). They will take turns feeding the babies this milk, then switch to feeding them regurgitated seeds. During this time, your only job will be to make sure they have plenty of food and fresh, clean water.  It is quite a joy to see your pigeons raise babies!

If you have any other questions, please ask and we will try to help.


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Poops!*

I used to get dark black/green poops with some white from me pigeons but now they are more white and less black green material...Is this something i should look into or be worried about?


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

*Whats wrong?*

Monu is not what she used to be... She has her chest really high and like kinda shows it by expanding it... She looks a bit plumpy (fatter) especially the bottom/below chest side... Sometime her cchest is so high she disbalances her self!

What may be the problem?


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

PLz help...!


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Is Monu getting ready to lay eggs?

Is she very full around the vent (where poop comes out) bottom?

Are they showing signs of wanting to nest, gathering materials, and is she laying in nest bowl?


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## Hamza (Dec 28, 2006)

What do you mean by full?

She rests usually in the afternoon from 12-4ish... No material gathering.... But they have chosen a spot where they sleep at nite and go there just before sunset that is 6.00pm... She surely eats a lot!


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hamza said:


> What do you mean by full?


Swelling around the vent.

Also, have you wormed your birds?


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