# Racing stations & measurement distance



## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Hi guys 

My loft is almost ready for my race team. I was told I had to get measured from my loft to different race stations. When I get the station numbers how do I get mapping information from the station number is there a book or web site with this info? I look forward to the road work and racing. 

Thanks


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Your Secretary wil most likely use a GPS at your loft to get the location put it in the club computor and then he will -and you will know the distances to/from each race station.


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

sky tx said:


> Your Secretary wil most likely use a GPS at your loft to get the location put it in the club computor and then he will -and you will know the distances to/from each race station.


Sky, Your probly right and that's how they will be doing but they might be behind the times and might still be using a survey company like Bowens. Just ask the club secretary what they are using GPS or Bowens either way sombody from the club should take the measurement.


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## billyr70 (Jun 11, 2009)

It should be GPS. Quick and easy.


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

They can't expect you to do it the AU says it takes 2 club members to do it weather it be by gps, or bowens.
Dave


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

GPS, Bowens, either way, they will get your coordinates and record it. Then on race day, they will take the coordinates of the exact location they released and send it out to everyone, along with the time they released. When they put all the information into winspeed, it'll crank out the distance for each station. As far as getting the air miles for your training spots, there are a lot of sites out there where you can map it out, OR you can be old fashioned like me and measure it out on the map by hand  LOL. Say an inch is 5 miles or whatever. So I'll mark every inch down the race course and find convenient release spots near the increment marks I want to train at.


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Not sure how it works but one club in the Dallas area uses Unikon clocks and when the bird clocks it shows up on all your computers.
It may be called 
Wincompanion ?---Wincompanion.com??????
Wish I had more info.


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## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Thanks guys

I get great information on PT, so now I have an idea of the process. The bowens process after completion issue a card with all the stations on it, for your area. Is this the most accurate process Bowens. 

Thanks again


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

This is the only controversial thing I have heard about at the local club, so far. And its not my club I just visit, and ask questions/hang out. Ive heard of another club with an old guy that refuses to use an electronic clock, and he wins most of the time. I think if your not winning it will not matter which one is most accurate. I hope your winning and then they will let you know which one they feel is needed. And maybe a couple of readings and the surveyers.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

newtopidgeons said:


> This is the only controversial thing I have heard about at the local club, so far. And its not my club I just visit, and ask questions/hang out. Ive heard of another club with an old guy that refuses to use an electronic clock, and he wins most of the time. I think if your not winning it will not matter which one is most accurate. I hope your winning and then they will let you know which one they feel is needed. And maybe a couple of readings and the surveyers.


are you allowed NOT to use the electronic clock?.....


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

spirit wings said:


> are you allowed NOT to use the electronic clock?.....


Evidently he is. I think it may be up to the club, he is the president you know
I really dont know enough to elaborate any, I saw there is some reason for concern though. Im guessing cheating....


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

newtopidgeons said:


> Evidently he is. I think it may be up to the club, he is the president you know
> I really dont know enough to elaborate any, I saw there is some reason for concern though. Im guessing cheating....


how does the club know what time the bird got home?.. does he wright it down?... how does he get away with not using the clock?...


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## jpsnapdy (Apr 4, 2010)

MaryOfExeter said:


> GPS, Bowens, either way, they will get your coordinates and record it. Then on race day, they will take the coordinates of the exact location they released and send it out to everyone, along with the time they released. When they put all the information into winspeed, it'll crank out the distance for each station. As far as getting the air miles for your training spots, there are a lot of sites out there where you can map it out, OR you can be old fashioned like me and measure it out on the map by hand  LOL. Say an inch is 5 miles or whatever. So I'll mark every inch down the race course and find convenient release spots near the increment marks I want to train at.


Yes, that's what I do with Google Earth and plus or minus a mile doesn't matter much for training.


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## jpsnapdy (Apr 4, 2010)

spirit wings said:


> how does the club know what time the bird got home?.. does he wright it down?... how does he get away with not using the clock?...


You HAVE to use SOME sort of clock !??


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Yes, to race you do have to use some kind of clock. I'm with the old guy...manual clocks are best!  And if he's winning, who cares! If they get him an electronic clock set up, that'll mean he'll be beating them by even more seconds, which would have been wasted catching the bird and clocking it yourself. Manual clocks are just as accurate as electronic clocks, it's just it takes you a little more time to get the bird clocked in. And it's impossible to cheat with one as well.


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

You better find out if the club uses GPS or if they use bowens. Two club members will have to do it, if you just do it and win they will accuse you of cheating.
Dave


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

MaryOfExeter said:


> Yes, to race you do have to use some kind of clock. I'm with the old guy...manual clocks are best!  And if he's winning, who cares! If they get him an electronic clock set up, that'll mean he'll be beating them by even more seconds, which would have been wasted catching the bird and clocking it yourself. Manual clocks are just as accurate as electronic clocks, it's just it takes you a little more time to get the bird clocked in. And it's impossible to cheat with one as well.


There's been plenty of ppl who have been caught cheating with the old clocks. Either with the clock or with the counter marks. If the guy filling out the sheet is working with the guy putting th birds in how hard is it to pocket a counter mark. And I've seen a guy get caught with a clock that could be bumped and then you could turn the barrel back to reveal the hole again and then he could then put a counter mark in when the bird finally got home then manually move the hole back to the hole that should be up. It was somthing to do with sombody grindding off teeth on one of the gears. Plus we fly for some big money here so it gives ppl more incentive to find a way to cheat.


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

Pigeon0446 said:


> There's been plenty of ppl who have been caught cheating with the old clocks. Either with the clock or with the counter marks. If the guy filling out the sheet is working with the guy putting th birds in how hard is it to pocket a counter mark. And I've seen a guy get caught with a clock that could be bumped and then you could turn the barrel back to reveal the hole again and then he could then put a counter mark in when the bird finally got home then manually move the hole back to the hole that should be up. It was somthing to do with sombody grindding off teeth on one of the gears. Plus we fly for some big money here so it gives ppl more incentive to find a way to cheat.


I heard them say you can bang it then bump it back


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## Gnuretiree (May 29, 2009)

Manual or Quartz clocks are considerably cheaper than the electronic clocks.


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## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Hi guys 

Thanks for all Your inputs, I just wanted to know how to get measured and use that for training tosses. It's sad people would cheat, but when it's big money there's always one gonna attempt to cheat. It puts a black eye in the sport. My investment in my first year of racing is high because race bands cost from 10$ to 100$ each. I can only hope no one cheats


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

If you just want it for training get a hand held GPS, any more cell phones have them.
Dave


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Wake-up boo-boo
As for as measureing for training--If you are with-in 1-2 miles--you are close enough.
The birds do not fly in a PENCIL STRAIGHT line from the race station. They fly UP & DOWN-and wind will push them BACK & FORTH.
There is more ways to cheat than just the clocks.
I guess it just depends on what you call cheating.--what feed ?--what vitimans?-what "durgs"--thats what medication is-- you use to treat your birds.?
Set your birds up to fly home to 14 day old eggs?--14 day old squabs?


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

boobooo96 said:


> Hi guys
> 
> Thanks for all Your inputs, I just wanted to know how to get measured and use that for training tosses. It's sad people would cheat, but when it's big money there's always one gonna attempt to cheat. It puts a black eye in the sport. My investment in my first year of racing is high because race bands cost from 10$ to 100$ each. I can only hope no one cheats


Now I remeber talking to you a few months back and how you live near one of my training spots. What club are you joining? If it's one of the Long Island Combine Clubs your gonna be using GPS since thats what we use. But from the price of the bands I'm guessing your flying those Bronx Clubs money races. The WTCM, CME, and the JPM if so you might also need the Bowens since last year I know a guy from my club had to get them for those races. But like I siad just ask your club secretary they'll tell you what you need.


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## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

sky tx said:


> Wake-up boo-boo
> As for as measureing for training--If you are with-in 1-2 miles--you are close enough.
> The birds do not fly in a PENCIL STRAIGHT line from the race station. They fly UP & DOWN-and wind will push them BACK & FORTH.
> There is more ways to cheat than just the clocks.
> ...


Hey Sky tx

I was asking for what are the requirements for measuring and by who the IF , AU, or clubs just if there's a standard. I found out that the races I will be participating require bowens. I think one wants to train in somewhat the path of the race and not the opposite direction. I've never raced before and just needed some guidance. About cheating I didn't talk about this in this thread I'm just a squab didn't even know about loft measurements. Those that cheat will until caught and embarrassed. I'll take baby steps. Thanks anyway

Pigeon0446 took your advise and called the club and was given the same info you gave. Thanks I look forward to training & racing in the direction of the race.


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Your club will send someone out to get your info/location and send to Bowens.
O K boo boo--Training
You may want to train from the point-to the best of your knowledge- that your birds will need to break from the pack to come to your loft.
Just my way of getting the birds ready-----------
9 days before the first race I take them 30 miles ever morning.--the breaking point?????
Maybe ever put them in the crate the night before. get them used to staying in the shipping crate overnight. Remember they will be in the shipping crate 8-10-12 hours.
They may have a railroad track-highway or something they can follow to your loft.
Let them up about sunrise or 1/2 hour after sunrise. Let them watch the sun come up.
You will have some members that are "serious" racers and some just fly for the fun of having birds come.


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## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Thanks sky tx

I will take your advise for training this might help me. I want to race for fun but since these bands cost so much. I hope my birds return first and maybe win a prize. I like your method I'm sure there are very serious flyers that just want to win at all cost. I'm happy to be flying racers for the first time.  thanks any more advise I would appreciate


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

My wife helped me a lot--she was a good handler and did most of the training. She puts lots of miles on the car.
That year we/she ?? had 6 club firsts and 1 combine win.


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

sky tx said:


> You may want to train from the point-to the best of your knowledge- that your birds will need to break from the pack to come to your loft.
> Just my way of getting the birds ready-----------
> 9 days before the first race I take them 30 miles ever morning.--the breaking point?????


My breaking point is right in the area of BooBooo's loft. He lives right near the spot I train my birds from all the time. Most guys train their birds down south by Canarsie Peir and Fort Hamilton. But even though I'm one of the guys on th south side out on the Island I like to trian my birds up north more. I want my birds to come across the Hudson River by the Statue of Liberty since from what I see on a map that is online with my loft and the race station. But these other guys train their bird on Staten Island. So they come across by the Verrazano Bridge. But I feel it's about 3 miles off course which it is but the guys out here even the guys a few miles north of me still train down by the Fort and on Staten Island. But you can't tell these ppl they are all stuck in their ways and I'm the one who's wrong even though I beat them all the time.


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## boobooo96 (Dec 13, 2010)

Hi Pigeon0446

You seem to know the direction of the three bronx races were do you think my breaking point might be. I could not probably beat you, just want to give my birds a chance of coming back home. Thanks


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## Pigeon0446 (Apr 22, 2007)

boobooo96 said:


> Hi Pigeon0446
> 
> You seem to know the direction of the three bronx races were do you think my breaking point might be. I could not probably beat you, just want to give my birds a chance of coming back home. Thanks


I've never flown those Bronx Club races but I've paid attention to them and always wanted to fly them maybe next year. I can't this year since I'm a handler for the IF Convention race and I've got birds coming in for the race so I can't really breed to many of my own to band them for those races. As for the breaking point I really don't know where it would be for those races. Since the ppl flying it are so spread out acroos NJ NY and I event hink part of CT and the races are pretty far and the birds seam to come in pretty broken up. I would say there really isn't a braking point you can train for unless you want to take your birds 150 or 200 miles which I think is a lil crazy. But I say you'd want a breaking more for the combine races where we have a couple of thousand birds going up and a few hundred coming in the lead packs. You want to teach your birds a spot that they know so they break out instead of going to far of course with the other birds. Like I said I use a spot right in your area as my breaking point so I feel the birds are coming right over you already. But if you want a spot thats 30 air miles thats right online with the first race station. It would be the spot I take my birds for their 57 mile toss since your pretty much right online with me and about 27 miles shorter then me. It's a Toy"R"Us parking lot in Watchung NJ. It's actually a big shopping center but there's a Toy"R"Us in there. I looked up the address on the Toy"R"Us website.

1701-45 US HIGHWAY 22
WATCHUNG NJ 07069

I hope this helps.


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