# not pigeon, a goose with foot problem..



## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

ok, i CANNOT believe myself sometimes! I found a goose, feeding them, that was limping and laying down most of the time, not eating. well, it would come by the food, but the other geese would get it first.
so, i am waiting on this rehabber that will deal with geese to call. I'm hoping that she will see it worthwhile because it is a goose and not a "dirty" pigeon. We'll see if she can make the trip. if not, I wanted to throw this out there now so anyone that knows a bit about geese could help me out.
also, does goose poop ALWAYS smell so foul? or is it a sign of sickness? It smells SO SOUR!
i cant get a pic right now, the thing is hissing and bearing it's teeth at me! Yes, i swear i see little sharp shark teeth in there!
also, was this stupid to catch it, because wont they be flying south soon? I just figured i had one chance, and if need be i could just let it go with it's flock again, then again, the flock doesnt stay in one place, do geese have homing capabilities?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Have you been able to have a look at the bottom of the foot? It could have a splinter. There is also the possibility of bumble foot or maybe a sprain. Knowing you, I don't know how you could have just left it. I wouldn't have left it either.
I hate to say it but Geese get canker too. Try to have a look in the mouth. It really doesn't have teeth, LOL, but those goose pecks can really hurt.


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

Moxie, thank you for helping this poor goose. You weren't stupid to catch it. The fact you were able to means it is in trouble and would not be able to make the flight south anyway. We used to have pet geese and I have special place in my heart for them. No, goose poop shouldn't smell that bad. It's messy and profuse, and doesn't smell good, but it shouldn't have a strong, sour smell. The goose may have more than one problem if it's limping. They are prone to bumblefoot, a bacterial infection in the pad of the foot. It probably needs antibiotics. I hope the rehabber will respond. 

Those little "teeth" you see are actually serrated edges of the bill, used for cutting and tearing grasses. Geese can pack a pretty mean bite and give you quite a smack with their wing butts, too. The hissing means the poor thing is stressed and fearful. 

What are you feeding the goose? Can you get some chicken scratch? They also like greens; Romaine lettuce is best. Poultry pellets would be ideal but I don't know if you have access to them, or if the goose will even recognize them as food. But he/she should like grain and greens. Best of luck and keep us posted. Is this a Canada goose? Around here we have them year-round. They have decided, like so many visitors to California, that it's a good place to live and they no longer migrate. If it's not a Canada goose but a domestic goose from a park, it wouldn't migrate anyway as they can't fly, or at least not well enough for long flights.


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## Caliandra (Aug 29, 2007)

A good way to control a goose is to firmly grab it's beak and hold it with your hand on it's back while someone else is checking it. I learned this with Granny's geese. If you don't grab the beak, it will use it. Another thing is hold the wings down. I usually get a grip on the beak and then press the wings down and hold it under my arm.


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## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

what do you mean by grains? What kind of grains? like oatmeal or something? I thought they couldnt pick up little specks of grain because of their larger beaks?
what do i look for on the foot? i'll try for pics later, but i have to go to class until 10 pm, so i wont have everything figured out until the morning.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

xxmoxiexx said:


> what do you mean by grains? What kind of grains? like oatmeal or something? I thought they couldnt pick up little specks of grain because of their larger beaks?
> what do i look for on the foot? i'll try for pics later, but i have to go to class until 10 pm, so i wont have everything figured out until the morning.


Wheat, cracked corn, whole oats


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## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

So, Charis, just to let you know, really quick, about something i learned about the Animal Rescue league (ARL) here. This rehabber, told me to take it to New england wildlife (N.E.W), and N.E.W told me ARL would give it a ride. Well, ARL wont take anything to the cape wildife center right now, and they wont take anything to N.E.W right now either, some weird technical reason, until next september.
So, they said they will take it to Tufts veternary hospital, in western Ma.
IF they think it is worth their while, in spending the money on gas. The vet at ARL would make that judgement. The rehabber, the one that might take this goose, said ARL will PTS, no doubt about it. As I thought, as EVERY animal i ever sent them got PTS.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

This has got to be so frustrating and heartbreaking for you, Moxie. I wish we could find some compassionate and reliable help for you.

Terry


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

xxmoxiexx said:


> So, Charis, just to let you know, really quick, about something i learned about the Animal Rescue league (ARL) here. This rehabber, told me to take it to New england wildlife (N.E.W), and N.E.W told me ARL would give it a ride. Well, ARL wont take anything to the cape wildife center right now, and they wont take anything to N.E.W right now either, some weird technical reason, until next september.
> So, they said they will take it to Tufts veternary hospital, in western Ma.
> IF they think it is worth their while, in spending the money on gas. The vet at ARL would make that judgement. The rehabber, the one that might take this goose, said ARL will PTS, no doubt about it. As I thought, as EVERY animal i ever sent them got PTS.


You can by pass ARL all together and take the goose to Tufts yourself. It won't be easy but there is a comuter train from South Station.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Charis said:


> You can by pass ARL all together and take the goose to Tufts yourself. It won't be easy but there is a comuter train from South Station.


Don't be ridiculous--she'd get goosed!

Seriously, is that possible to take a goose on a commuter train? And isn't she in the middle of classes already? I think she messed up a class last year during BB's story anyhow.

Pidgey


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

If anyone could pull it off, it would be Moxie. I have great confidence that as a one time shot, she could pull it off and it's probably a better alternative than living with a goose in her room. or...we could pool our money and buy her a car.


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

I'm so sorry you haven't been able to find anyone to take in this poor goose, Moxie. I'm afraid I don't have any ideas. I found it hard enough to transport a goose in the car, let alone on a commuter train! And a non-tame goose, at that.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Birdmom4ever said:


> I'm so sorry you haven't been able to find anyone to take in this poor goose, Moxie. I'm afraid I don't have any ideas. I found it hard enough to transport a goose in the car, let alone on a commuter train! And a non-tame goose, at that.


The only way she could do it would be to put the goose in a kennel.

Moxie, I found a Farm Sanctuary on line and I have emailed about the goose and your general location. I'm hoping they will have some advice. They are;
Winslow Farm Sanctuary
37 Eddy Street
Norton, Ma 02766
508-285-6451

I'm putting out a challenge to the others of you that may be able to help come up with some resources for Moxie. I would appreciate the help, I know Moxie would and then there is the goose...


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Big birds and Bumblefoot writeups and pictures:

http://www.worldwidewounds.com/2003/august/Cousquer/Avian-Wound-Assessment.html

http://www.worldwidewounds.com/2003/november/Cousquer/Avian-Wound-Management-Part-2.html

Moxie, you might be able to take a look at those feet and see if there's anything approaching the lumps or sores that can be seen on some of the Bumblefoot patients on those two pages. It'd definitely need a wildlife-oriented vet to take care of such a thing. Another thing about the bigger birds is that they drink the Baytril down a lot faster than pigeons due to their size so it can get pretty expensive working on them.

Pidgey


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

xxmoxiexx said:


> ok, i CANNOT believe myself sometimes! I found a goose, feeding them, that was limping and laying down most of the time, not eating. well, it would come by the food, but the other geese would get it first.
> so, i am waiting on this rehabber that will deal with geese to call. I'm hoping that she will see it worthwhile because it is a goose and not a "dirty" pigeon. We'll see if she can make the trip. if not, I wanted to throw this out there now so anyone that knows a bit about geese could help me out.



Hi Moxie, 



You need to patiently make friends with this Goose in order to be able to examine their Foot-Leg...and, to make things easier for you both.


To do so, a good place to begin, is to make some nice food...and to pretend to be eating it, and, then, to look over at them, and to offer to share it.

More on that in a moment...




> also, does goose poop ALWAYS smell so foul? or is it a sign of sickness? It smells SO SOUR!



Might be a sign of some illness or enteral problems or just that he/she had been eatin gvery sub-par foods...

With good food, Goose or Duck poops are moist, well defined, firm and havbe about no odor at all...




> i cant get a pic right now, the thing is hissing and bearing it's teeth at me! Yes, i swear i see little sharp shark teeth in there!



They can be entirely fierce...and they are strong, too of course.




> also, was this stupid to catch it, because wont they be flying south soon?



Not all geese fly south...and not knowing the species or history or provenance of this one, there is no way to say...





> I just figured i had one chance, and if need be i could just let it go with it's flock again, then again, the flock doesnt stay in one place, do geese have homing capabilities?



You did the right thing to grab him/her...and to appreciate their injurys/illness were likely not going to get better fast enough with them on their own, for their survival to be very secure without help.


Anyway...to make friends...


Spend ten bucks on some really nice small kernal Frozen Corn...frozen baby Lima Beans, Tofu ( the soft kind) some Cilantro, some fresh Sprouts, some Oat Groats if you can find any...


Some frozen Mixed Berrys ( Blackberrys, Razzberrys, Blueberrys)...and a few large cans of the best Sockeye Salmon.


Get a small deep tray, Cassorole dish or the likes, something three inches deep or so...and around eight or ten inches by eight or ten inches in size.


Put into it two and a half inches of clean cool water...add a half Cup of the Corn, half cup of the baby Limas, a half cup or so of pulled-apart into individual Leaves of Cilantro, and about a half cup of Tofy cut into little cubes the size of a finger tip...


Have this on the floor, on a towell...and get down on all fours and pretend to be eating it and commenting on how yummy it is.

Other Meals can consist of the Berrys, defrosted of course! And Salmon and Cilantro...

Vary the meals, even as you or I would like our meals varied.


Once he/she is looking a little interested at you pretending to eat out of this on all fours, gently indicate you are happy to share, and either coax them over to it, or, bring it over to them and then back off.

Remember you are a lot taller and bigger then they are, so try and keep low, keep humble, keep your arms against your body and not moving them...bow a lot...avert your eyes from theirs...speak in soothing up-beat tones, re-assure...


Especially since you had grabbed them to get them home, they will likely be anxious not knowing what else to expect...so be consistant in showing them that what they can expect is gentleness, sensitive manners, good food, and respect.

A few rounds of this, and some gentle approaches, even pretending to eat with them once they accept the chow...and they will likely let you touch them...and do not touch them on their back, but instead, gently, touch or preen their Crop area and intently focus your eyes on the spot before and during...

Then...if some progress with these things, you can explain to them that you need to examine their foot and leg, and likely they will let you do so after a day or two, with merely light protests.


If not, then gently and firmly, with a friend to help, examine the Leg and Foot anyway...cover their Head with a thin cloth as you do so.

Look for any 'dark' areas of injurys or possible infections or foreign objects in the Foot...look for swelling or discolorations of the Leg as a whole...


On good food, such as I described, the poops will soon become odorless, and firm enough to pick up with one's fingers to discard.


Possibly, the Goose has some enteral Bacteria problems which would benifit from an ACV-Water regimen or Nystatin or some other means of address.



Good luck..!


Phil
Las Vegas


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## Margarret (May 3, 2007)

Phil,

I swear, you should write a cookbook with recipes for avian recovery. But in all seriousness, I love to read your recipes.

How are your guys doing? Is the one amigo still hanging in there, is Poppa Shotwing still OK? When you have time, could you post a little update?

Margaret


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## xxmoxiexx (Oct 2, 2006)

So, to update, the rehabber is willing to take the goose to her vet in northern MASS, but her vet isnt there yet, not until monday, he's on vacation. After describing the foot to her, she said it doesnt seem that it needed emargency surgery, so we could wait for the vet to get back. I guess she cant hold the goose, because her father has cancer and is on chemo and livig with her, so she asked if i could hold it until next week. Let me tell you, i dont have a bedroom anymore!!
So, the commuter rail, i would say is a bad bad idea with a goose. this goose had a horrible time with me restraining it for a 20 minute taxi ride. They wouldnt let me on this bus with the moving noisy box!!


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

Hang in there, Moxie! I can only imagine having to keep a goose in your apartment for a week.  Thank God there's a light at the end of the tunnel in that the rehabber can take it next week.

Do you have a large dog kennel you can put the goose in? They make good temporary goose pens. Do you have a bathtub? I'm sure the goose would appreciate a cool bath; they dearly love water and spend a lot of time there. It would take the weight off the sore foot, too. But I also know that a flapping, wild goose might be overwhelming in a small bathroom. Even if a bath is out of the question, be sure to provide the goose a deep enough drinking bowl that it can put its whole head in. It's important that they are able to wash their eyes and faces.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Moxie, 


You have not described the Foot to us though...


What have you been able to note about it?


Best wishes!

I am CERTAIN a Goose, one Goose, will make for a very full house...!


Phil
l v


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

New England Wildlife Center in Weymouth, Ma. can take the bird right away.
They are 20 minutes from Boston and are open 24 hours a day. Moxie may have a way to get there which would be really great for both Moxie and the goose. Certainly taking the poor goose there now would uncomplicate her life conciderably.
I was also able to give her some other contacts for future use earlier today.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Charis said:


> New England Wildlife Center in Weymouth, Ma. can take the bird right away.
> 
> I was also able to give her some other contacts for future use earlier today.


Great news and great work, Charis! I really appreciate all the time and effort you have obviously put into finding some resources for Moxie. 

Terry


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

That's awesome, Charis. Thank you so much for researching this. I wouldn't know where to start.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Margarret said:


> Phil,
> 
> I swear, you should write a cookbook with recipes for avian recovery. But in all seriousness, I love to read your recipes.
> 
> ...



Thank you Margarret, 



Well, Birds do love to eat..!


And offering good chow is a definite moralle booster and social-acceptance friendship booster which is hard to beat.


I'm the same way...if someone makes me a nice lunch or supper, I am devinitely moved...

I could never feed a Duck or Goose those bagged 'pellet' things...yeeeeeeesh...and the one Duck I had looked so hurt and disappointed when I let myself get talked into trying some on her...she turned up her Bill and just stood there as if to ask what had she done 'wrong' to get "this" wrteched stuff? ( 'Purina' Duck and Goose Chow or whatever it was...all 50 popunds worth! I fet it in small amounts to the outside Pigeons and Sparrows and they seemed ti find it to be okay...)


Oye...


Lol...

Phil
l v


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

pdpbison said:


> I could never feed a Duck or Goose those bagged 'pellet' things...yeeeeeeesh...and the one Duck I had looked so hurt and disappointed when I let myself get talked into trying some on her...she turned up her Bill and just stood there as if to ask what had she done 'wrong' to get "this" wrteched stuff? ( 'Purina' Duck and Goose Chow or whatever it was...all 50 popunds worth! I fet it in small amounts to the outside Pigeons and Sparrows and they seemed ti find it to be okay...)
> 
> 
> Oye...
> ...


Interesting you should say that, Phil. I had a terrible time getting my geese to eat pellets. The only ones they liked were special order off the Internet and it used to cost me more in shipping than the price of the pellets themselves, which were already expensive.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Birdmom4ever, all...


Yes...


"Real" foods are best I'd say...fresh foods, actual various genuine and ingenuous good tasting foods...meals which have different things one time to another.


They are Natural Grazers who left to their own desires, would seek out Green Seeds, tender Shoots, various tender Leaves, Grubs, insects, small Fish, Tad Poles, Mosses...and whatever else.

It seems heartless to me, as well, to insist they have only the same dreary yucky "dead" factroy made 'pellets' day after day, just because some schmuck in a lab coat at 'Purina' or where-ever says that is ALL the 'need'.

I'd like to see HIM eat that stuff and nothing else for a few years, see how much he likes it...


Oye!


Lol...

Love, 

Phil
l v


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