# PMV-1 virus in Australia update/questions



## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

It looks like the PMV-1 virus that spread to Australia last year is quickly spreading. Its reached NSW now, and the racing clubs here in QLD are having meetings about how to handle the virus `when' it reaches here. I'm so terrified. The government reports are saying that 98% of feral pigeons in Victoria are now dead. 

Its said to be different to the PMV virus found overseas, which is why the overseas vaccine was not approved for use in Australia...there were concerns that the overseas vaccine would introduce a whole new strain of PMV-1 here, apart from the strain we already have , according to what I read here: http://eshop.bellsouth.com.au/epage...ories/FAQ/Fact_Sheets/Vaccination_for_Pigeons


So I have spent some time looking more deeply into the vaccines that are available for use in Australia....how to vaccinate, the costs, what one to use (the dead one is best by far- last longer, is safer ) ..I was thinking ok, I'll vaccinate the whole wild flock if I have to, and I'll keep them with me for the duration of the infectious stage. But then I realized that's not going to work in the long term - the vaccine will wear off and they'll be vulnerable again.

So my first question is, considering the vaccine wears off (noone here can say how long it takes, bacause its an off label vaccine used for chickens ) , is it unreasonable to consider vaccinating some of my wild flock anyway? Some are already tame enough to catch easily; some could be tamed to walk into my house & caught as well. If I put my mind to it, I could vaccinate 100 pigeons in batches, before the virus gets here....say even if I took in ten per month and housed them during the virulent stage, I could get 120 odd vaccinated. And I'd try for more.

But these are the other issues: To get the vaccine involves a lot of hoops. For starters, you need a permit, and to get that you need to give desirable-sounding explanations as well as all your personal details down to your mother's underwear colour. I don't know if my concern for feral pigeon welfare will cut it with these authorities.

And the vaccine is expensive too - $175 for the vaccine, plus at least $90 for the vaccinator (according to this web site)

http://eshop.bellsouth.com.au/epage.../bellsouth/Categories/H/VACCINATORS_VET_EQUIP

So..this is difficult. I have some time to prepare, but I'm not 100% sure what road to take..


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Hi Bella,

I’m so sorry to read that PMV is making its way to you. What you describe sounds incredibly grim and depressing. The high mortality that is reported there is certainly something that I have no experience of here with my flock, as the strain that seems to be affecting them is just not THAT infective. Or maybe it’s because it is so endemic here that most pigeons have developed some level of immunity to it. The survivors are also immune for life supposedly. At any one time, I am seeing about 10 per cent of my pigeons with it, but that’s about the extent of the spread. Of those almost all make it with just support – feeding and hand feeding for a couple of months. But I can see that it would be absolutely deadly for a pigeon without that support, let alone one that was half starving to begin with. I'm just hoping your pigeons can ride it out with your help. 

The pigeon that I mentioned that was attacked and is now recovering nicely, had had it for the last two months and was almost to the point of his symptoms completely resolving. So yeah, that’s the other issue – what to do with those who recover but still have recurring episodes if it’s many birds - some will definitely be unreleasable. 

I was also thinking about immunizing my flock against it – the vaccine that’s specific for pigeons here gives them protection one month after application for 10-12 months, and then they need a booster every year, so it would be doable for me. It’s sold in large quantities and not individually anyway, so one may well immunize the whole flock even though it’s not cheap. But I have heard you have to be sure the birds are very healthy first, which is a hard thing to be sure about with feral pigeons. 

I read the Q & A that you sent the link to, and was left with the impression that you’ll only need a permit if using the live Newcastle vaccine, which is not recommended anyway. Otherwise, I agree a love of feral pigeons is hardy a compelling argument for the authorities. Maybe if you can make the case that immunizing feral pigeons will prevent the spread of the disease to native pigeons.....


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Eva,
I really appreciated your post and your emotional support; I've known this is coming, but I guess I was hoping it would be an `in the distant future' kind of thing. But its pigeon racing season now, and the government has cancelled all former pigeon movement lock downs, so we're going to get the virus spreading everywhere over the coming months. Its a walk in the park for a newly vaccinated, infectious, racing pigeon to fly to my town, or a new state. And the government isn't doing anything about it.

The thing that makes my stomach turn is the government , pigeon racing clubs & vets would regard the annihilation of ferals here as a desirable secondary effect. And the native pigeons are mostly so shy, if they are all wiped out it would hardly create much of a public stir, let alone an outcry. 

Anyway I am looking into prices for the vaccination via the local vets. If they are too greedy, I'll have to save up for the vaccine which is available online and do it myself, or talk to the local racing club about sharing a batch of vaccine with someone.



> I read the Q & A that you sent the link to, and was left with the impression that you’ll only need a permit if using the live Newcastle vaccine, which is not recommended anyway.


Thats a good point. interestingly, my state pigeon racing club is advocating the use of this live virus. I am not sure, but my guess is its because its the only one that can be self administered (with a permit), and perhaps its way more cost effective that havign avet do it?. If that's not the case, then these guys are dumbasses and are playing risky games with flying birds infected with the live virus, and spreading it just like they did victoria.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Bella,

You can say that by vaccinating the feral pigeons you would be helping control the spread of the disease to unvaccinated racing pigeons and to native pigeons and doves.

You can only vaccinate as many as you can afford to vaccinate, but that will give each pigeon that you help a better chance of survival. It is another starfish on the beach situation.

But does catching a feral pigeon to vaccinate mean that by law you can't release it as it is a non native species?


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hey Cynthia! I nearly missed your post, so sorry!

I'm not really sure about how that law is enforced, since non native racing pigeons are deliberately released into the environment in masses every year, and its all perfectly legal. And then you have escaped feral pets, again this is not an offense in legal terms. I just think that certain professionals involved in animal welfare hide behind that supposed law when it suits them, but its not enforcable or enforced anywhere, except by those people themselves, for their own personal reasons.

I think because in my case these pigeons would be kept as pets during and after the vaccine is given, there would be no problem, in that regard. I would just band them all and quarantine for at least 8 weeks. After that, I'll see what else I can do for them in the long term.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Oh wow Bella, that would be a lot of pets! I hope your boyfriend has started liking pigeons a whole lot more, because after 8 weeks with you they may decide to make the arrangement permanent. 

I just hope this whole PMV thing is not as severe as is expected and somehow passes you by lightly. Are there any news as to how things are developing?


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Hi Eva,

Regarding developments of PMV Australia wide, the sad thing is that previously there was a `lockdown' in the state where the virus first appeared, Victoria, but the government lifted it in March because it had gotten so out of control (mostly because they made the lockdown voluntary, instead of compulsory). Now, shortly afterwards, the virus is in a new state already.

The main problem is that the Pigeon Racing community keep flying their birds injected with the dangerous live virus vaccine, `Lasota'. The government allowed this, and the Vets encouraged it, even though there is safer and effective dead virus vaccine available. So via the racing pigeon community who fly infected birds, and that Dr walker who keeps pushing them to do it, knowing it will kill wild birds, the virus quickly got into the feral pigeon population, the turtle dove population, and is also killing native raptors.

The really depressing thing is that the main Pigeon racing club in my state, QPRF, are also heavily pushing the use of the live virus vaccination. This means that every year, twice a year (once after the vaccination, then again after the booster) there will be racing pigeons spreading the PMV virus into the wild birds. We get a lot of racing strays in our city, so the ferals will be infected in no time, and we know that the raptors will be affected too. Who knows what will come of our beautiful native doves and pigeons

I just want to punch someone but I can't. 

So..I guess i'll be rounding up my friends and doing what I can. My guy will be ok with them in captivity, he just won't assist with their care and he'll grumble about the cost of their food. Truly, I don't want a million pigeons & to live my life cleaning up pigeon poo. But I know myself- when the news hits that the virus is here in my state, there's no way I will let my friends die.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

This doesn't makes sense on any level. Quite apart from it's impact on feral and native pigeons/doves, it is well known that the live vaccine is not safe - so why would anybody use it when there is a safe killed vaccine? 

I'm very disappointed in Dr. Colin Walker - this is criminally irresponsible. And I actually read online whatever I could find of his, because he always struck me as someone very knowledgeable about pigeons. Guess there's no money to be made in caring about non-racing pigeons, so why bother.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Yeah exactly, Eva...Dr walker is pigeon racer himself, and his attitude very much mirrors the general racing pigeon community down there in Victoria. There's probably some real nice pigeon fanciers down there, but the people representing the clubs and big races - the ones with the power- don't care about feral pigeons or stopping the disease- all they care about is the money and continuing to race. 

And Dr Walker.. I gratefully read everything he writes and find him knowledgable and generous with sharing that knowledge. But I am so disappointed in who he is as a person. He told me personally a few years back that all feral pigeons should all be euthanised and I shouldnt be helping them. He put like this `you better be careful (helping feral pigeons)', like he was threatening me. I instantly thought `psycho', and my radar is pretty good with that kind of thing. He quoted some law that I've since discovered doesn't exist. 

And now *coincidently* he has had a huge role in spreading the disease to the racing pigeons (it happened in his office) and then spreading the virus into the wild birds via the dangerous live vaccine. He's also the main driving force behind encouraging the use of the live vaccine Australia wide, instead of the dead vaccine. I find his behaviour psychopathic coming from Vet, who has taken vows to do no harm to animals.

Ah, it just makes me feel like crying Eva. So many birds that I know personally will die if the racing pigeon community here start spreading the virus around with this live virus vaccine. And thousands more that i don't know. I think I could go mad with grief and anger.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

I just did a bit more research and I think I made a mistake about Dr Walker.

As it turns out, although Dr Walker initially sold and pushed for the use of the live virus vaccine in Victoria, the vaccine that he is advocating as of this month is the Lasota vaccine. 

Lasota is normally known as a Live virus vaccine, but what I just learned is that Lasota comes in both live virus and dead virus versions. It is the inactivated (ie Dead virus) version of the vaccine that Dr Walker is advising people to use now, due to some trials he conducted off his own back financially. These are the only trials conducted in Australia to date, so people will listen and take them very seriously.

The Dead virus was shown to be over twice as effective as NDV4 (newcastle Virus vaccine for chickens), which is a live version. The Lasota dead virus vaccine has a much longer duration of protection from the Virus also. So I basically assumed the Lasota vaccine was live, when it wasn't.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

This information is the latest about the vaccine. The news is still very bad, as the tests showed that the vaccine doesn't prevent racing pigeons from contracting and spreading the virus. All it does is protect the vaccinated bird. 

So in a nutshell, vaccination with live or dead virus will both still spread PMV amongst non vaccinated birds & feral pigeons, though the dead virus vaccination will only do this if the bird comes in contact with an already infected pigeon, say a feral from a wild flock or another infection racing pigeon 


Subject: Pigeon Paramyxovirus vaccination trial update
Please be advised of the latest vaccination results of the pigeons in Victoria: 

100% of the pigeons vaccinated in the groups below had developed sufficient NDV antibody levels to indicate that when exposure to PPMV1 occurs , these birds will be, most likely, protected against the clinical signs of the disease. 

The 2 vaccination groups tested were; 

1. ND live V4 followed by inactivated vaccine 4 weeks later and 

2. Inactivated vaccine twice 4 weeks apart 

The level of antibodies in the group receiving the inactivated vaccine twice was significantly higher than in the group that received live +killed vaccine.. 

Further confirmatory tests are planned by AAHL (the Australian Animal Health Laboratories) at Geelong 

Protection against the clinical signs of the disease DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY WILL BE PROTECTED AGAINST INFECTION BY THE VIRUS. IT ONLY MEANS THAT THEY WILL NOT BECOME SICK. 

In other words, birds exposed to the virus may still become infected and transfer the virus to other susceptible birds. 

Regards 

George 

Dr George Arzey 
Technical Specialist Poultry
Senior Veterinary Officer (Avian Health) 
Department of Primary Industries


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Great thread! I know nothing about the disease so cannot add anything useful but I really hope things don't hit too hard Bella, If they do I will help if I can.... unfortunately my mortgage demands prevent financial help but any thing I can do to raise awarness or help in other ways count me in.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

You're so awesome Evan, thanks so much for your support. It means a lot


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

OK, so he does not advocate for use of the live vaccine, but he still thinks all feral pigeons should be euthanized!!!? That is quite shocking.....you 're right, the guy is a total psychopath. 

What a terrible situation - I know it feels really lonely and scary to be facing this grim unknown, and I understand why you're imagining the worst possible scenario, but I truly believe your birds will be come out of it OK even if a few do get sick - because with your care none will die. I actually think all the other diseases you've been dealing with are a lot more challenging than PMV. True that PMV symptoms last a long time, but so does pox. As I imagine you already have quite a few permanent residents, the biggest challenge with PMV I think, will be finding homes for the ones that cannot be released (and only a few are so severely affected). But if you manage to vaccinate most of them, then hopefully that will not be an issue. 

I understand why you feel so angry, sad and helpless. It is really heartbreaking to think about what will happen to the hundreds of pigeons out there that have no support.....if the virus does come. There's only so much a single individual can do, even one as determined, dedicated and caring as you.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

Dear Eva, you have such a soothing, rational personality; your hubby is so lucky to live with you

Yes, its difficult to get a sense of why the virus is killing so many birds in Australia, and why the mortality rate is so much higher than abroad. 98% mortality is shocking, and they are saying it kills in 3 days, which is not usual for PMV-1. 

This is the part that is scaring me. Is it government missinformation? Is this just how the disease works when it first hits a pristine population with no resistance to it? I don't really think I'm going to have my answers until I care for a pigeon with PMV myself. 

Being a reportable disease makes all this difficult to assess too, because once it is reported, the government takes control of the situation, which typically results in euthanising all the birds. therefore a lot of owners are not getting much of a chance to nurse their birds back to health, and if there are some who are successful, they would be keeping that information to to themselves to stay off the government's radar.

Anyway you are right Eva, i need to not get too emotional and just take the neccessary steps to protect as many birds as I can, as responsibly as I can.

Hugs to you, thanks for your support


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## RodSD (Oct 24, 2008)

It is normal for new population of animals to die fast and quick when they are exposed to a new disease. It is a natural selection thing. After that it should stabilise.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Bella_F said:


> Yes, its difficult to get a sense of why the virus is killing so many birds in Australia, and why the mortality rate is so much higher than abroad. 98% mortality is shocking, and they are saying it kills in 3 days, which is not usual for PMV-1.
> 
> This is the part that is scaring me. Is it government missinformation?


I looked at the Queensland Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry site and I just think that any time there is a brand new disease appearing, it is presented in a somewhat exaggerated manner. It happened most recently with the swine flu in people in the U.S. - it was in the news all the time, there were school closings every time someone sneezed, and everybody was extremely scared even though the number of fatalities wasn't even a tinny tiny fraction of what any old flu epidemic regularly causes. 

I understandably why people are scared - it must be a shock to see PMV-stricken birds for the first time, because the symptoms are not the typical sick bird symptoms but are very dramatic - almost flamboyant - and it's an alarming sight. I can also see PMV being extremely contagious among racing pigeons because of the way they are all packed together in one place, but I don't think transmission in a loft situation reflects what happens in the wild. The government site does say that sick birds can die in three days and I don't know what to make of that, because not eating alone shouldn't kill in that short a time. But certainly many cannot eat at all because their heads jerk back or to the side at the exact moment they try to pick up a seed, so even if they are surrounded by seeds (and how often does that happen) they still may not be able to eat even a single one, and that will bring down very fast a feral pigeon that is already half-strarving to begin with. 

Of course, you're right to fear - it could be a deadlier strain, or a deadlier effect on a virgin population, but it may also be a lot milder than is feared. I'll keep my fingers crossed....


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

RodSD said:


> It is normal for new population of animals to die fast and quick when they are exposed to a new disease. It is a natural selection thing. After that it should stabilise.


That's true. After all, there is PMV almost everywhere in the world and there are pigeons in all of those places, but it's little comfort thinking in those terms when the pigeons who may die are those you personally know and love and have cared for.


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## Bella_F (Nov 29, 2008)

That makes a lot of sense. I just found a report about the introduction of PMV-1 to the USA. 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/67979251/Paramyxovirus-1

This report was very dire too, with extremely high mortality rates reported, over 90%. But that was in 1985, so wild pigeons in the USA have had almost 30 years now to adapt to some degree.



> but it's little comfort thinking in those terms when the pigeons who may die are those you personally know and love and have cared for.


Eva, Yes, you understand perfectly..and once you've cared about any pigeon, its easy to care about the suffering of the ones you've never met too.


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