# Sick collared dove, green poop & lethargic



## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Hey everyone, I'm worried about my collared dove Reginald, the last two days he is sitting at the bottom of his cage puffed up, his poop is green and he's losing his appetite, I've given him some wet chick crumbs in a dish although he hasn't tried any yet, I have some Baytril 2.5 in the cupboard from a recent vet visit with a budgie, can anybody advise me of the dose I'd need for a dove? Thanks, Laura


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

I forgot to add a bit more information, he's a few months over a year old and was a rescue from very young, he had some feathers apart from around his face and had a nasty fall, he recovered wonderfully as did his smaller sister although she sadly died a few weeks ago, she suffered brain injuries in the fall and would turn somersaults sometimes when flying, something spooked her in her cage and she broke her neck. Reginald has been depressed recently, it wouldn't surprise me if this depression has triggered sickness. Any advice would be very much appreciated.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

The best you can do for him is put him on heat - a heating pad set on low is best, if you don't have one - a hot water bottle wrapped in towel. If he's not eating, you must hand feed him. Take him to your vet immediately. The Baytril may or may not help - he sounds critical and there's no time for experimentation - you need a diagnosis.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Thankyou for the advice nycpigeonlady, I don't have a spare heat mat but I do have a hot water bottle, I'll get him on that right away, it's dumb of me to not think of that since that's a big part of treating my other birds when they're sick. The reason I'm so worried is because I don't have money to pay a vet until Monday, I recently paid more money than I could really afford for one of my chickens to have an operation; literally no money until Tuesday - and even then I don't know of a vet that'll see him :/ I'm happy that he seems a bit more alert today and there are some tell tale gauges in the chick crumb 'porridge' I gave him so he's been eating in the night, he's had a little water too but I'm not happy at the amount, I'm going to watch him very closely with his eating and syringe feed him some electrolyte fluids; between now and Tuesday I have to find a vet that will see him, can't call til Monday, only one emergency vet is open on a Sunday and I already called them, they won't see pidges. These vets are supposed to be animal lovers, all many of them do is offer to euthanise or let them suffer!


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

The Baytril 2.5% dose is 0.1 mls (2 drops) for evey 100 grams he weighs. Take a poop sample before giving him any so that if they can be tested if necessary.

My avian vet will always start a pigeon or dove on Baytril immediately just in case there is an infection. Doves are very fragile so if there is a bacterila infection it needs to be tackled fast.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Thanks Cynthia for the Baytril dose.
Pijwij, if he's not eating, the poop will be green because it's mostly bile. It can be green due to the illness of course. Best to monitor the size and number of poops and compare to what his usual is for an idea about his eating. I wouldn't count on the gouges he made at night in the porridge, for all you know he could have made them with his feet, and anyway, birds don't eat at night when they can't see. A very easy way to hand feed without fear of aspiration, is popping defrosted warmed peas at the back of the mouth. You can just run the peas under some hot water. They also provide hydration for a bird that's not drinking.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Thanks Feefo and nyc; I am still confused at the dosage as my vet recently prescribed 0.4 of the same Baytril in every 50ml of water for my budgie, will 0.1 be enough for him? Then again I know if I'm to give it him orally without dilution it's much more concentrated; I'm going to weigh him now and work out how many drops I'll need. I usually leave a little night light on for my sickies so that they can have a munch if they should get peckish, then again Reginald has always eaten around the clock if he's awake, come to think of it all my birds eat at night if the feeling takes them! Never as much as in the day but certainly a nibble then back to sleep; the room is never totally pitch black as all of them have night terrors - especially the tiels.I'll still definitely be vigilant over the food, I've just seen him hop up onto the ledge of his seed dish and eat a little, he seems a bit perkier and his poop volume hasn't changed at all but I'm going to watch him like a hawk nonetheless. I gave him a nail and beak trim the other night, I was very conservative with the clippers but am going to check his toes and beak just in case there was any accidental damage I might have missed. Thanks for the advice on the peas, that's ingenious and might well come in handy!


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

That is the dosage for giving it directly into the lower beak, if you are giving it in water follow the vets instructions. It is for the 2.5% solution which is what small animal vets in the UK use.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Thanks again Feefo, I gave it him orally, he weighed 142 grams so I gave him just a bit under halfway between the 0.01 and 0.02, I know that sounds like an odd measurement but I didn't want to round it up or down and risk going under or over by the slightest, he took it very well and let me use the opportunity to give him a few mls of water too by dripping it on the end of his beak, he's gone straight back to the heat mat, really not happy with how much I've seen him eat so I'm just about to nip out for som baby rice and dried mealworms, I haven't fed him via syringe, adapter and balloon since he was a baby, it would be cute if it wasn't in these circumstances. One thing I've just noticed, his eyes, they've gone from a dark reddish dark brown colour to near enough amber, is that typical of any particular illness?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

What you describe would be the right dose for his size dose for his size, it is roughly 3 drops.

I don't know about the eye colour, it could be symptomatic of being ill rather than of a specific illness. Would your vet be able to examine his poops for bacteria or parasites without you taking him into the surgery? I think that taking him to the vet could be a stressful experience that he would be better avoiding.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

That's what I was hoping to be able to do, though to be honest I think I'll be lucky if they even agree to give him a look over, let alone run laboratory tests, it really does annoy me at their attitude to pigeons. I just read that the paler change in eye colour can be a sign of both anaemia and coccidiosis, I'm hoping it's just anaemia, but the course of Baytril should cover the possibility of coccidiosis; I'm worried about acquiring more Baytril, if they won't see him they certainly won't prescribe to him - in that even I'll simply have to take in a budgie and claim his cold is back. I hope it doesn't come to dishonesty, but right now I'll do anything I can to help my Pij. Just soaking some raisins to mush up for his syringe food mix, apparently they're high in iron, should help a little until I can get him a multi vitamin on Tuesday.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Just so you know - Baytril will not do anything for coccidiosis. Bactrim is the antibiotic that works for that, but it takes time unlike other medications which work right away.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

You should be able to buy something for cocci from your vet without taking the dove in.

Retford poultry partnership test poops for parasites and bacteria, but it takes a while.

Which is your nearest town?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Check whether the chick crumbs you use are medicated, if they are it means they contain a coccidistat. You could also hand feed the chick crumbs by syringe into the lower beak. They can also be rolled into wet pellets and hand fed, but you must make certain that he also has enough water.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

There really is nowhere local enough that will run tests on a feral pigeon's poop, they don't care that he was only feral born them domesticated soon after, the stigma is absolutely disgusting and many vets consider it some kind of insult to their degrees when you ask them to treat a pij; I have 2 vets to try on Monday, I want them to check him over plus give the relevent meds for whatever it looks most like, if they refuse to see him I really am out of options, unless they're willing to sell me some meds without seeing him, although they've had me take birds before that were not at all fit for travel but left me no choice or they'd refuse meds,. I presume so that I could be charged for consultation ontop of the meds. Vets used to be about caring for animals but now it's mostly corporate greed it seems :/ Just made him a high vitamin and iron syringe feed from watery chick crumb, a few drops of orange juice and the juice from some soaked and pulped raisins, hopefully he'll take it as well as he took his meds...


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

I'm not sure if it's medicated but it does say it has additives, i don't understand the names on it but will take a picture of the label for you; what is a coccidistat; if the vet won't see or prescribe to him, if i can acquire a feed with that in it would that help? Really do appreciate your help on this!


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

PijWij said:


> .....I just read that the paler change in eye colour can be a sign of both anaemia and coccidiosis......


I hadn't heard that about the eyes, but a pale mouth/ throat is a symptom of anaemia and coccidiosis. BTW, have you looked in your dove's mouth and down his throat to check for canker?


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)




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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

nycpigeonlady said:


> have you looked in your dove's mouth and down his throat to check for canker?


I really am having a duh brained day today, I hadn't even considered that as a possibility, I'm gonna have a quick look now before this feed.


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Unfortunately, the feed is just fortified but not medicated.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Absolutely canker free, didn't like his feed but managed to get about 1.0ml into him, drop by drop into his lower beak, I'll try him every couple of hours with another syringe - he took about half that of water too - he's strong enough to put up a good protest; I'll hold him a bit firmer next time though so he doesn't bother and use up vital energy, straight back to heat mat, I wish he'd sleep but he's just sat bolt upright watching everything around him, I'm going to get him a cat carrier on Tuesday with a heatmat, blanket, food and water dish, I think keeping him somewhere like my room with nothing going on in the day would possibly help him rest better; I just hope what I'm doing helps him to hold on.


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Thanks for checking it for me nycpigeonlady, I had a feeling that it wouldn't knowing our luck - is it worth trying to get some medicated feed ontop of trying for the vets? I have no experienc whatsoever in coccidistats :S Are they used alone in place of vet meds or in conjuction, or a preventative to help keep him free of it once recovered? I am learning so much today, I actually thought I was quite knowledgable about pigeons til this!


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## nycpigeonlady (Jan 22, 2012)

Medicated feed for chickens contains amprolium which kills coccidia, but I don't know if feeding him that would be enough to get rid of cocci if that's what he has. You'd use amprolium or something like diclazuril or toltrazuril against cocci, but I don't know if the feed is sufficient, sorry. You wouldn't keep him on medicated feed once recovered.
I hope the antibiotic kicks in soon and he feels better.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

If you have no joy with the vet tomorrow PM me your address and I will get some meds to you. 

Retford Poultry Partnership in Notts do postal testing but it would take a week or so to get the results.

Here are a few pigeon friendly vets in the UK: http://www.pigeonrescue.co.uk/veterinaryresources.htm


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## PijWij (Jun 24, 2012)

Feefo said:


> If you have no joy with the vet tomorrow PM me your address and I will get some meds to you.


From the bottom of my heart Feefo thankyou, I am really hoping it won't come to that, but if it does of course I wouldn't be happy taking them from you without reimbursing you, although it would more than likely be via postal order, unfortunately I have no bank account. To be honest i think the way he is I don't think I can wait a week til I give him a specific treatment, I think the best thing to do in this case is hazard a best guess given the visible symptoms and maybe try a broad spectrum antibiotic. Just about to give him another feed, I'm going to be waking with him through the night, I'd find this so much harder without so much support, big thanks to both you and nycpigeonlady for being so caring and responsive, this little boy means the whole world to me as do all my special rescue babies.


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