# trowing out blood



## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

one of my friend got a shock of his life as a breeder when he went out yesterday morning on his breeder loft and found a splatter of blood on the floor the ferch and side wall. then he called me today and ask if i know whats the cause and remedy of this or any experience of this situation and i said nooop and i told him ill ask the guys on the internet if they could help us. and the bad thing is he dont know who is the coulpret..... please fell free to put any links,suggestion,medicine or anything to sovle this matter before its getting out of hand.. thanks so much!!


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

It's hard to guess what may be the cause. I would guess an injury as the most likely cause. Perhaps one of the birds got severely pecked or perhaps got caught on wire or another sharp object in the loft. I suppose it could be some type of illness or disease, but I'm not coming up with any that would result in blood spatters like you have described. Could also be a rat or other animal that got in the loft and attacked one or more birds. 

If you can get us some more details, that would be helpful.

Terry


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

I had one, once, that had bled a lot and when I looked him over, I discovered that he had a toenail completely missing. It grew back in time but I never did know how it happened. Anything can happen.

Pidgey


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## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

okay,but i went to his loft and check everything and it seems everything is perfect,no injured bird,no rats cant get in, they eat very well,they fly around the loft and we found the bird that has blood on his foot we check and double check and found nothing no cuts,his not even lemping,,not even a scrape on every part of his body,, no sign of illness on it.this is very wierd,we cant figure it out, and then he showed me the blood,its a lot of blood i guess maybe one tablespoon or more on it,on the floor,ferch,wall, ect.. it cant be on the poop coz this is pure blood nothing mix on it...


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Of course without actually seeing what you're talking about, it's very hard to know. I know I've seen blood spattered or tracked all over the place and it looks like a murder was committed. LOL Every time except one, it was always, as far as I could figure a fight that had taken place. 
However, I did on one occasion find quite a bit of blood one morning. It was a little spattered, but mostly because it hit the floor from about 6 feet up. I had a suspicion on who it was. From purely guessing, I caught one cock bird and locked him up in a pen all alone. Next morning, I found more blood, in his pen. I wormed him and he was fine after that. 
So, really depends on how well this person knows his birds I guess. This one particular bird was the newest in my loft, so I figured if the blood was anything besides a fight, he was probably the culpret.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I have seen giardia display in that way.


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## amoonswirl (Nov 14, 2006)

Just a thought - could it be a blood feather that was damaged somehow? I just had an incident like that. Had to do a close inspection to figure out that it came from a broken flight feather. Some of the larger wing and tail feathers can bleed a lot if they are broken as they're growing in.


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## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

Charis said:


> I have seen giardia display in that way.


whats giardia display? noop, we check every fligth feathered,tails, nothing missing...by the way the loft size is 5x6x6 with only eigth birds,four breeding pairs and all of them has eggs, theres only two ways this thing going out from intake or outtake side,


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

*Overview of Giaridia from Wikipedia*

Giardia lamblia
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Giardia lamblia 


Giardia cell, SEM 
Scientific classification 
Domain: Eukaryota

Phylum: Metamonada

Order: Diplomonadida

Family: Hexamitidae

Genus: Giardia

Species: G. lamblia


Binomial name 
Giardia lamblia
(Kunstler, 1882) 

Parasite life cycle.Giardia lamblia (synonymous with Lamblia intestinalis and Giardia duodenalis) is a flagellated protozoan parasite that colonises and reproduces in the small intestine, causing giardiasis. The giardia parasite attaches to the epithelium by a ventral adhesive disc, and reproduces via binary fission[1]. Giardiasis does not spread via the bloodstream, nor does it spread to other parts of the gastro-intestinal tract, but remains confined to the lumen of the small intestine[2]. Giardia trophozoites absorb their nutrients from the lumen of the small intestine, and are anaerobes.

Contents [hide]
1 Hosts 
2 Life cycle 
3 Manifestation of infection 
4 Prevention and Treatment 
5 Microscopy 
6 Research 
7 History 
8 References 
9 See also 
10 External links 



[edit] Hosts
Giardia affects humans, but is also one of the most common parasites infecting cats, dogs and birds . Mammalian hosts also include cows, beavers, deer, and sheep.


[edit] Life cycle
Giardia infection can occur through ingestion of dormant cysts in contaminated water, or by the faecal-oral route (through poor hygiene practices). The Giardia cyst can survive for weeks to months in cold water[3], and therefore can be present in contaminated wells and water systems, and even clean-looking mountain streams, as well as city reservoirs, as the Giardia cysts are resistant to conventional water treatment methods, such as chlorination and ozonolysis.[3] Zoonotic transmission is also possible, and therefore Giardia infection is a concern for people camping in the wilderness or swimming in contaminated streams or lakes, especially the artificial lakes formed by beaver dams (hence the popular name for giardiasis, "Beaver Fever").

As well as water-borne sources, faecal-oral transmission can also occur, for example in day care centres, where children may have poorer hygiene practices. Those who work with children are also at risk of being infected, as are family members of infected individuals. Not all Giardia infections are symptomatic, so some people can unknowingly serve as carriers of the parasite.

The life cycle begins with a noninfective cyst being excreted with faeces of an infected individual. Once out in the environment, the cyst becomes infective. A distinguishing characteristic of the cyst is 4 nuclei and a retracted cytoplasm. Once ingested by a host, the trophozoite emerges to an active state of feeding and motility. After the feeding stage, the trophozoite undergoes asexual replication through longitudinal binary fission. The resulting trophozoites and cysts then pass through the digestive system in the faeces. While the trophozoites may be found in the faeces, only the cysts are capable of surviving outside of the host.

Distinguishing features of the trophozoites are large karyosomes and lack of peripheral chromatin, giving the two nuclei a halo appearance. Cysts are distinguished by a retracted cytoplasm. This protozoa lacks mitochondria, although the discovery of the presence of mitochodrial remnant organelles in one recent study "indicate that Giardia is not primitively amitochondrial and that it has retained a functional organelle derived from the original mitochondrial endosymbiont"[4]


[edit] Manifestation of infection
Nomenclature for Giardia species are difficult, as humans and other animals appear to have morphologically identical parasites.

Colonisation of the gut results in inflammation and villous atrophy, reducing the gut's absorptive capability. In humans, infection is symptomatic only about 50% of the time, and protocol for treating asymptomatic individuals is controversial.[3] Symptoms of infection include (in order of frequency) diarrhea, malaise, excessive gas (often flatulence or a foul or sulphuric-tasting belch, which has been known to be so nauseating in taste that it can cause the infected person to vomit), steatorrhoea (pale, foul smelling, greasy stools), epigastric pain, bloating, nausea, diminished interest in food, possible (but rare) vomiting which is often violent, and weight loss.[3] Pus, mucus and blood are not commonly present in the stool. In healthy individuals, the condition is usually self-limiting, although the infection can be prolonged in patients who are immunocompromised, or who have decreased gastric acid secretion.[3] People with recurring Giardia infections, particularly those with a lack of IgA, may develop chronic disease. Lactase deficiency may develop in an infection with Giardia, however this usually does not persist for more than a few weeks, and a full recovery is the norm[citation needed].

Cats can be cured easily, lambs usually simply lose weight, but in calves the parasites can be fatal and often are not responsive to antibiotics or electrolytes. Carriers among calves can also be asymptomatic. Dogs have a high infection rate, as 30% of the population under one year old are known to be infected in kennels. The infection is more prevalent in puppies than in adult dogs. This parasite is deadly for chinchillas, so extra care must be taken by providing them with safe water. Infected dogs can be isolated and treated, or the entire pack at a kennel can be treated together regardless. Kennels should also be then cleaned with bleach or other cleaning disinfectants. The grass areas used for exercise should be considered contaminated for at least one month after dogs show signs of infection, as cysts can survive in the environment for long periods of time. Prevention can be achieved by quarantine of infected dogs for at least 20 days and careful management and maintenance of a clean water supply.


[edit] Prevention and Treatment
Treatment of drinking water for Giardia typically involves high efficiency filtration and/or chemical disinfection such as chlorination or ozonation. However, normal concentrations of chlorine and ozone used in mass water treatment are not adequate to kill the cysts. Scooping water from the top of a stream or river is not an effective way to avoid Giardia. Filtering (<1µm pore) or boiling is recommended for purification of drinking water in wilderness conditions.

A Giardia lamblia infection in humans is diagnosed with an antigen test or, if that is unavailable, an ova and parasite examination of stool. Multiple stool examinations are recommended, since the cysts and trophozoites are not shed consistently.

Human infection is conventionally treated with metronidazole, tinidazole or nitazoxanide. Although Metronidazole is the current first-line therapy, it is mutagenic in bacteria and carcinogenic in mice, so should be avoided during pregnancy.[3] One of the most common alternative treatments is berberine sulfate (found in Oregon grape root, goldenseal, yellowroot, and various other plants). Berberine has been shown to have an antimicrobial and an antipyretic effect. Berberine compounds cause uterine stimulation, and so should be avoided in pregnancy. High doses of berberine can cause bradycardia and hypotension. [5]

Drug Treatment duration Possible Side Effects 
Metronidazole 5-7 days Metallic taste; nausea; vomiting; dizziness; headache; disulfiram-like effect; neutropenia 
Tinidazole Single dose Metallic taste; nausea; vomiting; belching; dizziness; headache; disulfiram-like effect 
Nitazoxanide 3 days Abdominal pain; diarrhea; vomiting; headache; yellow-green discolouration of urine 

Table adapted from Huang, White..[3]


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

bloodlines_365 said:


> one of my friend got a shock of his life as a breeder when he went out yesterday morning on his breeder loft and found a splatter of blood on the floor the ferch and side wall. then he called me today and ask if i know whats the cause and remedy of this or any experience of this situation and i said nooop and i told him ill ask the guys on the internet if they could help us. and the bad thing is he dont know who is the coulpret..... please fell free to put any links,suggestion,medicine or anything to sovle this matter before its getting out of hand.. thanks so much!!


When was the last time the birds were treated for worms?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/catalog/1309.html

If is is giardia, you can treat all the birds with Metronidazole or flagel in powdered form, which can be purchased from Foy's Pigeon Supply. The link is provided above. The same treatment is used for canker. To prevent giardia it very important to clean water containers with a bleach solution on a regular basis. 
Many of the pigeon illnesses can be avoided by practicing good hygiene by keeping the loft clean and dry...not an easy job by any means.


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## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

Trees Gray said:


> When was the last time the birds were treated for worms?


 i ask him, he said it was 7 months ago, thats too long ha, soo where just gonna deworm this birds an everything would be fine... can we get that medicens on jedds cause where closer to it about 15 miles,


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

bloodlines_365 said:


> i ask him, he said it was 7 months ago, thats too long ha, soo where just gonna deworm this birds an everything would be fine... can we get that medicens on jedds cause where closer to it about 15 miles,


I don't see the Moxidectin on Jedds web site. The only one on there that I've personally ever used is the Ivermectin. What were the birds wormed with 7 months ago?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

bloodlines_365 said:


> i ask him, he said it was 7 months ago, thats too long ha, soo where just gonna deworm this birds an everything would be fine... can we get that medicens on jedds cause where closer to it about 15 miles,


You can get wormer and Metronidazole at Jedd's. Please keep in mind that these are guesses from us based upon our experience. There is absolutely no guarantee that either treatment will solve the problem.
Still, it is a good idea to worm and treat for canker, which is the same treatment for giardia, on a regular basis. Hopefully, the folks at Jedd's can advise you too.


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## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

okay,he told me that he got those birds a month ago,i mean his loft is pretty clean,he clean it almost every day and the floors totally dry never get wet, hope this would be the answer to it, ill keep you guys updated if there any progress , thank you soo much!


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## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I have some experience with hens bleeding when laying their first egg. Are there any first time hens in the loft? Just a thouht.

Randy


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## naturegirl (Nov 7, 2005)

I was just going to suggest the same exact thing. I would check inside their mouths also for fresh blood as if something is wrong they could be throwing up blood. Never hurts to check everything on these birds. 

Cindy


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## bloodlines_365 (Jan 15, 2008)

hillfamilyloft said:


> I have some experience with hens bleeding when laying their first egg. Are there any first time hens in the loft? Just a thouht.
> 
> Randy


yeah there is, one female but she layed eggs two days ago,,, yes we check the mouth and found nothing and also the behind its clean, and we check every birds on that loft,all of them are clean.. thanks


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