# skinny - hunched and ruffled up



## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

I've got one sick too. She eats and drinks, but not enough and is skinny. She just sits in the corner all hunched and ruffled up. is there any med. someone could recommend that I might try, even though I don't exactly know what's wrong? 
Thanks,


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

There could be so many things going on with her. Are mice getting in? Have you checked her throat way down with a flashlight to see if there is any canker? Although sometimes it doesn't show. Is she drinking more? What do her droppings look like? If you can't get her to a vet, or at least check the droppings, than if it were me, I'd treat her for canker and add an antibiotic like Baytril. 
Global sells Salmonella tablets that would be similar. Contains 10mg Norflaxin

http://www.globalpigeon.com/index.php?cPath=24_56&sort=2a&page=2


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

I have a similar situation happening with me at the moment . So far I have treated for Canker ( Flagyl ) , salmonella and coccidiosis ( Sulfa AVS ) and a course of probiotics . I am still not getting the result I would like . I now have the bird on a course of antibiotics ( Baytril ) and will contine this for 10 days .

Any unwell bird I have is brought inside my home .......I think it's a good place to recover and has yeilded me best results .


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

whytwings said:


> I have a similar situation happening with me at the moment . So far I have treated for Canker ( Flagyl ) , salmonella and coccidiosis ( Sulfa AVS ) and a course of probiotics . I am still not getting the result I would like . I now have the bird on a course of antibiotics ( Baytril ) and will contine this for 10 days .
> 
> Any unwell bird I have is brought inside my home .......I think it's a good place to recover and has yeilded me best results .


What did you use to treat for Salmonella?

Sorry..........I just reread it. When you treat in the drinking water you can't be sure how much they are drinking, especially when ill. Treating individually, you are sure they got enough of the med. I usually treat the ill birds individually, and bring them inside as you do. You can watch them better that way. Then I treat the rest of the flock in the drinker, just in case.


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

Jay3 said:


> What did you use to treat for Salmonella?
> 
> Sorry..........I just reread it. When you treat in the drinking water you can't be sure how much they are drinking, especially when ill. Treating individually, you are sure they got enough of the med. I usually treat the ill birds individually, and bring them inside as you do. You can watch them better that way. Then I treat the rest of the flock in the drinker, just in case.


Your dead right Jay ........I wasn't convinced she was drinking the treated water , so every morning & night I used an eye dropper and dropped 3 drops down the hatch over 3 days as per instructions .

*Sulfa- AVS* it is for E.coli and coccidiosis infections . It is a combination of Sulfadiazine and Trimethoprim and lifts the form of pigeonswith E.coli infections . It is supposed to be highly palitable to the birds .

I remember Dobato hadn't heard of it before , but she did find some info on it and said that it was even better than the triple sulfa she was trying to help me locate . It's written up in a pigeon medicine book from a Dr. Rob Marshall which is where I've got my dosing instructions .


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

whytwings said:


> Your dead right Jay ........I wasn't convinced she was drinking the treated water , so every morning & night I used an eye dropper and dropped 3 drops down the hatch over 3 days as per instructions .
> 
> *Sulfa- AVS* it is for E.coli and coccidiosis infections . It is a combination of Sulfadiazine and Trimethoprim and lifts the form of pigeonswith E.coli infections . It is supposed to be highly palitable to the birds .
> 
> I remember Dobato hadn't heard of it before , but she did find some info on it and said that it was even better than the triple sulfa she was trying to help me locate . It's written up in a pigeon medicine book from a Dr. Rob Marshall which is where I've got my dosing instructions .


Where do you buy that, and what are the dosing instructions? Just 3 drops down the throat a day?


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

I initially started a course of Baytril for Salmonella , but I stopped it and got the Sulfa AVS into the bird as I wasn't quite sure if I could use the two together .....anyway I have re commenced the baytril in hope that Baytril will knock it out if it is Salmonella .

what do you think ??


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

Jay3 said:


> Where do you buy that, and what are the dosing instructions? Just 3 drops down the throat a day?


The actual dosing instructions are 1/4 teaspoon per litre of water .....I thought Dr. Rob Marshalls products were available world wide .

I should point out the 3 drops I was giving was in conjunction with the required dose that was in her drinking container ......if she wasn't drinking from the container I wanted to make sure she was getting something hence the 3 drops 


http://toploft.com.au
I was able to find it thru here and met up with and purchased it from the stockist for this state .


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

whytwings said:


> The actual dosing instructions are 1/4 teaspoon per litre of water .....I thought Dr. Rob Marshalls products were available world wide .
> 
> I should point out the 3 drops I was giving was in conjunction with the required dose that was in her drinking container ......if she wasn't drinking from the container I wanted to make sure she was getting something hence the 3 drops
> 
> ...



Thank You.


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

Armanitvrs said:


> I've got one sick too. She eats and drinks, but not enough and is skinny. She just sits in the corner all hunched and ruffled up. is there any med. someone could recommend that I might try, even though I don't exactly know what's wrong?
> Thanks,


Do you worm your birds?
I've written this many times, and I'll repeat it in case you've never seen it 
This is my routine and works very well for me.......When I see a thin bird just kind of standing around, I separate it and put it into a cage. First thing I check is its throat for canker. If its throat is fine, I give it .13ml (6mg) of pyrantal (wormer), then wait and observe for at least 12-18 hours. MOST of the time they will pass a small clump of worms, then perk right up. I keep them in for a couple days to give them extra food and more strength. And thats usually the end of it and he goes back to the loft. Then I worm the whole loft again 10 days later.
IF no worms pass, then I start to look for coccidia, e-coli and salmonella, and treat with antibiotics. I usually give 2 antibiotics to cover all. Baytril and albon together is my 1st choice because it will cover all three. Or smz-tmp (triple sulfa) and metronidazole together if I suspect canker.
Hope this helps.


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

can someone recommend where to order the wormer from?


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Armanitvrs said:


> can someone recommend where to order the wormer from?


google pigeon supply and some will come up.. I like foy's or new england pigens supply.


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

I think I should get this, http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/medications/canker-products/1315-foys-all-in-one 
pricey!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Armanitvrs said:


> I think I should get this, http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/medications/canker-products/1315-foys-all-in-one
> pricey!


all in ones really are a preventative..not a cure..so get exactly the med and one med for what you need it for, and go by the directions to cure... not a preventative medicine.


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

yea, that's what I thought too, but the description says that the ingredients used to treat canker and coccidiosis are both a preventative as well as a cure. And it's a wormer which is said could be the culprit.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

All in ones don't have enough of any one med to cure anything. They may even help to build up an immunity to that drug.


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/medications/worms-wormers/2515-avioworm-powder

http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/medications/multiple-use-medications/2508-aviocox-powder

Should this be good?


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

I'm curious to know how your bird is getting along ......any progress ?


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

she died, She was on her back dead one morning when I went out to tend the birds. Actually, it was the next day after my last post on here. Thanks for the inquiry though.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

She was sick.............she should have been brought in. Not left out there to die.
I'm sorry for the poor thing.


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## Armanitvrs (Apr 29, 2012)

What would bringing her in had done? unfortunately I didn't have any med. on hand and I've learned that lesson. If she was inside she would have most likely just died in an area that stressed her out even more.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

When a bird is sick, you bring her inside away from the other birds, where she can be watched and kept quiet, with feed and water in a dish of her own. And try to hand feed. So she isn't getting jostled and maybe picked on by the other birds. So she can at least die in piece if she dies. Besides, you also separate a sick bird from the others, as what the sick bird has could be spread to the others.


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## Dima (Jan 15, 2011)

Jay3 said:


> When a bird is sick, you bring her inside away from the other birds, where she can be watched and kept quiet, with feed and water in a dish of her own. And try to hand feed. So she isn't getting jostled and maybe picked on by the other birds. So she can at least die in piece of she dies. Besides, you also separate a sick bird from the others, as what the sick bird has could be spread to the others.


You're darn right Jay. 
I think she had chances to survive if all above were done.
Anyways, i am sorry for the loss of the pigeon.


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