# pigeon pox..help please



## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

hi everyone

Today I came across a black pigeon, who was walking around. Finding this unusual, I went to get a closer look, and saw that his/her face was entirely disfigured with pox.
I could catch him, and we have named him Ruku ruku.

He is not making any attempt to resist when I pick him up. His one eye is almost closed by the boil. The boils are there his entire head, disfiguring his beak. I can also feel hard areas where his wings start. The boils are there inside his mouth as well.

He doesn't seem to be in shock. He is looking around and preening himself occasionally. Also kind of yawning at time, perhaps due to the boils inside his mouth. 

I gave him water using a dropper, and some food. I know pox is viral, but is there any medication I can give to make him feel better? If I continue the force-feeding will he improve? How long will he take to recover fully?

And my biggest fear is: How do I ensure this disease doesn't spread to my other pigeon - who is already not so healthy on account of relapse of PMV symptoms. I have kept them physically separate. Does this spread through air?

I have attached two photos. I doubt whether this is a baby, which might explain why it is not scared of me.

Thanks in advance for all advice!


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

kunju said:


> hi everyone
> 
> Today I came across a black pigeon, who was walking around. Finding this unusual, I went to get a closer look, and saw that his/her face was entirely disfigured with pox.
> I could catch him, and we have named him Ruku ruku.
> ...


He may be yawning because the pox - or just possible a canker growth which has sprung up in his weakened state - is causing a blockage making it difficult for him to breathe normally, or is causing an irritation in the throat.

The disease is usually spread pigeon-to-pigeon by contact. Shared food/water, fighting (and a pigeon getting a sick bird's saliva on it) and suchlike. As long as they are physically separate by a good distance there should not be a cross-infection problem (from our experience, anyway).

There is, as you already know, no direct anti-pox medication for the sick bird. One could give precautionary doses of Metronidazole in case of opportunistic Canker (one of the few cases when I might treat a bird for something it only 'may have').

Food and water, possibly bird vitamins if only to help its system.

If it was a Wood Pigeon I would say he was a goner, but Ferals & similar can go through it. Something like diluted Betadine could be applied to the EXTERIOR pox lesions. It won't fix anything, but I have seen it suggested as a help towards drying them up a little quicker.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you so much for the advice. He is active but I don't see him eating, so I am feeding him.
Do you think it is a baby? And I can feel hard areas on his back where the wings start. Is this related to pox?


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Pretty hard to tell what age he would be. If his cere or wattle appears to be white under the pox lesions, then he is at least a well grown young bird, if not a mature adult.

The lumps, unless you can actually see anything there, are probably joints. If you feel the same thing on both side of the bird, I would not think it is anything to do with pox. Remember that pox usually appears on the unfeathered parts and/or the mouth.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

Hi,I remember that you are from Kerala too.....I do think its a baby,does it squeek when u feed him/her ?
also you can tell the age from its primaries,if he/she has already started into molt.
Coming to pigeon pox,as u know Pox is a viral Disease spread by Mosquito bites.
As with all viral diseases,there is no real treatment other than Prevention with Pox
vaccine but Nevertheless you can try any of the following methods.
1) apply potassium permanganate on pox daily untill they get dried
2) Make a paste of Turmeric and neem leaves in coconut oil and apply
it daily till it get dry
3)Homeopathic medicine - Variolinum 30 or 200 one drop once daily for 3-5 days
4)Salicylic acid ointment + betamethasone ointment once daily on it
till it falls off
Try any of the 4 methods and let me know which worked for you.Make
sure you also give them a multivitamins everyday.
Regards


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you very much for the replies.
The lumps on the pigeon's face are quite hard, not filled with fluid. He is quite active and drinking water, but not eating. He squeaked once, so I guess its a baby.

Which multivitamin do you use for pigeons? 

I got the homeo medicine you mentioned, will keep you posted. Thanks once again.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> Thank you very much for the replies.
> The lumps on the pigeon's face are quite hard, not filled with fluid. He is quite active and drinking water, but not eating. He squeaked once, so I guess its a baby.
> 
> Which multivitamin do you use for pigeons?
> ...


Try "A-Z" drops.If possible do apply the salicyclic acid ointment


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you Boney, I will try the ointment.


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

I am in agreeance with John ......in the past two of my youngsters that were still in the nest came diwn with an extreme case of pox , one of my babies lost sight in one eye due to the pox completely covering the eye . I used iodene / betadine except near the face mouth and wattle area . I also used clavamox to prevent any further infection . I would imagine he will carry some scars after it clears , this can take anywhere up to 6 weeks , with the yawning issue I would definately treat the bird for canker.

Good luck and hope he heals well .


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you very much. Yes I also suspect canker, there are mushroom-like white growths on either side of his mouth deep inside. He smells also real bad.
I have metronidazole with me. I am trying to get the correct dose, assuming 100 g of bodyweight.
Yesterday I applied salicylic acid, but since most of the boils were around the eye or the beak, I didn't apply much fearing it will get into the eye or get ingested.
One of the boils have come off, exposing a dark red dried spot. He is active today, flying around.
Thanks, will keep you posted.


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## John_D (Jan 24, 2002)

Another thing, as a safety precaution ... wherever you have kept a bird with pox while it recovers will need to be well cleaned out and disinfected once it is empty. When the Pox lesions dry up and drop off, infectious virus can remain in the immediate environment for a period afterwards.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> Thank you very much. Yes I also suspect canker, there are mushroom-like white growths on either side of his mouth deep inside. He smells also real bad.
> I have metronidazole with me. I am trying to get the correct dose, assuming 100 g of bodyweight.
> Yesterday I applied salicylic acid, but since most of the boils were around the eye or the beak, I didn't apply much fearing it will get into the eye or get ingested.
> One of the boils have come off, exposing a dark red dried spot. He is active today, flying around.
> Thanks, will keep you posted.


Metronidazole dose for this young bird will be 20 -30 mg once daily....considering this birds weight ,which may be hardly 200-300 gm


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

50 mg of the Metronidazole daily wouldn't hurt him. Under dosing could cause resistance to the drug.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks. I gave him 20 mg metronidazole yesterday, I will give more today. Thanks John for the advice on cleaning the space, I'm terrified that the pox will spread to my other pigeon who is in another enclosed space a few feet away. So i need to be taking all precautions. I read somewhere that pigeon dander can also spread the pox through air, which is really horrible news.
I got Thuja drops(homeo) and Thuja ointment for ruku ruku. I am also giving the Variolinum drops. Plus multivitamins. He is eating (or atleast pecking the grains) today. He doesn't seem to be affected by the presence of pox all over his face.

Hopefully, he will come out of this just fine!


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

hi everyone
I'm glad to say that Ruku ruku is slowly but definitely improving. His pox lumps are getting yellow and slowly drying up. 
Now I know for certain he is a baby, because I am having a lot of trouble feeding him. He squeaks to give him food, so I hold some seeds in between my thumb and middle finger, and show it to him. He manages to peck at this half the time, but at other times he misses and the grains fall on the floor. So it is really messy, apart from the fact that lot of food is wasted. He doesn't like me taking the seeds from the bowl, and slaps me with his wings. I tried imitating the pecking from the bowl by using my finger, but he continues to slap at me.
He dislikes being held wrapped in a towel, and struggles a lot. But this is the only way I can ensure that food is not wasted. Is it fine to put 5 or 6 small seeds at a time, inside his mouth? He hasn't choked yet. But he resents the process.

He is also drinking a lot of water, and hence it looks as though he is urinating rather than pooping. His poops are green strings in a large pool of water.

I am continuing with the metronidazole. The white growths in his mouth have turned yellow.
Sometimes his eyes get shut after a nap. I am using dilute ACV to open them up again.

Yesterday, he was sitting on my shoulder while I took a bite of food. He immediately started squeaking, as if to say that he too wants the food. It was so funny to watch.
If anyone has any ideas as to how I can feed him better, please let me know.

Thank you very much


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## kingdizon (Jan 14, 2013)

kunju said:


> hi everyone
> I'm glad to say that Ruku ruku is slowly but definitely improving. His pox lumps are getting yellow and slowly drying up.
> Now I know for certain he is a baby, because I am having a lot of trouble feeding him. He squeaks to give him food, so I hold some seeds in between my thumb and middle finger, and show it to him. He manages to peck at this half the time, but at other times he misses and the grains fall on the floor. So it is really messy, apart from the fact that lot of food is wasted. He doesn't like me taking the seeds from the bowl, and slaps me with his wings. I tried imitating the pecking from the bowl by using my finger, but he continues to slap at me.
> He dislikes being held wrapped in a towel, and struggles a lot. But this is the only way I can ensure that food is not wasted. Is it fine to put 5 or 6 small seeds at a time, inside his mouth? He hasn't choked yet. But he resents the process.
> ...


sounds like youre doing pretty good with ruku ruku,taking real good care of him. Idk bout the 5-6 seed thing,that whole he hasn't choked *yet* kinda scared me,but maybe thats me. just keep up the care and love and a watchful eye on him. try to feed him a couple extra seeds than you do,just to make sure he isnt having belly rumbles. funny about him squeaking for your food


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> If anyone has any ideas as to how I can feed him better, please let me know.
> 
> Thank you very much


Hi Kunju....
Ee video kandu noku,you will get an idea

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FCE1IcT9pw


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks for the video. I saw it, and I am trying to figure out how to make such a bottle as shown in the video. 
My pigeon is quite big as compared to the one in the video. Also, he trusts nothing except my fingers (which he feels is the source of food). I am wondering if I can guide his head into such a container.
Also, seeing the video, I just got a doubt. The beak is entirely inside the container. Can the pigeon suffocate, since its nostrils are on its beak?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It's easier just to pop frozen peas and corn which have been defrosted and warmed. Hold him on your lap and open his beak. Put in a pea or piece of corn and push it to the back of his mouth and over his tongue. Let him close his beak and if you have pushed it back far enough he will swallow it.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> Thanks for the video. I saw it, and I am trying to figure out how to make such a bottle as shown in the video.
> My pigeon is quite big as compared to the one in the video. Also, he trusts nothing except my fingers (which he feels is the source of food). I am wondering if I can guide his head into such a container.
> Also, seeing the video, I just got a doubt. The beak is entirely inside the container. Can the pigeon suffocate, since its nostrils are on its beak?


In nature,the young pigeon feeds from the mother like this.The mother/father Keeps the mouth open and the young pigeon used to put her beak inside the parents mouth/throat....it wont suffocate the young bird.Just cover a open mouthed container with a cloth or other stuff,then make a long slit on the centre.Try to introduce the beak of the young bird 2,3 times into the slit.Once the bird understand that there is food in it.It will just go for it.


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

When I have youngsters I like to feed on a white towel - as you say feeding seeds makes quite a mess , but I have found that as those seeds drop to the towel , they are pretty much instantly curious and wil start picking at them , being on a white towel they stand out .... It doesn't take them long to catch on . I figure the sooner I can get them eating for themselves , the easier my life becomes


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you all for the suggestions. 

Till now, I have been feeding most of the food by covering him with a towel, just as Jay suggested. When both of us are exhausted, I try the finger method (pinching the seeds between two fingers) so he can peck and try to get it. I think the bottle will be much easier, I will definitely try and let you know.

The white towel - its very interesting, the way these babies think. Thanks for suggesting, I will try this out.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

The bottle with the slit did not work. I tried several times to put his beak inside the bottle, but he didn't like it. Maybe I didn't do it right, or perhaps he wasn't too desperately hungry to try it out. I am feeding him now by holding with a towel. He is slowly resigning himself to this process.
His pox are getting much better, but the white growths in his mouth remain, though some of them have changed to yellow. I had given metronidazole for 5 days.
He still smells bad, but I suppose it could be the pox? Anyway he has a good appetite.
Today his bad eye which was covered with pox opened finally. He looks much better!


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

I have another problem with his eyes. His one eye which was closed by pox has opened, but now both eyes are watery and get covered with crust when he sleeps. Each time he takes a nap, I have to slowly moisten his eyes to make them open again.

Vision is ok till now. Yesterday in desperation I used the Ciplox eye drops I had here (for human use). Today the eyes are actually worse.

Can I continue with the Ciplox drops? How many times should I administer it in a day?

I don't get colloidal silver here, I read somewhere it could be used as drops. I have ACV.

Thanks a lot in advance.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Would appreciate if someone can help me in this.. The eyes are getting covered with a crusty layer whenever closed for a long period. 
I just read up about young bird sickness, and I am starting to feel that my bird also does sit with its crop area fluffed outward. Plus he smells really bad. Any advice??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I wouldn't use any antibiotic in a birds eyes unless I was sure that it could be used in birds eyes.
Just wipe them with warm water or saline when needed.




SIDE EFFECTS:
This medication may temporarily sting or burn your eyes for a minute or two when applied. Eye discomfort, itching, redness, tearing, eyelid crusting, feeling as if something is in your eye, blurred vision, 
http://www.medicinenet.com/ciprofloxacin-ophthalmic_drops/page2.htm#SideEffects

USES: This medication is used to treat eye infections. Ciprofloxacin belongs to a class of drugs called quinolone antibiotics. It works by stopping the growth of bacteria.This medication treats only bacterial eye infections. It will not work for other types of eye infections. Unnecessary use or overuse of any antibiotic can lead to its decreased effectiveness.
http://www.medicinenet.com/ciprofloxacin-ophthalmic_drops/article.htm


*Have you checked way down his throat for canker? The stress of having pox could easily bring on canker.*


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

He has white growths inside his mouth on the ends where his lower jaw/beak starts. I don't know whether these are canker or pox. When I started medication using metronidazole, one of the white growths seemed to lessen in size, while the other turned yellow. One pox lesion is on the edge of the beak, and it can be seen as a white surface on the inner side of the beak (hope you got what I mean).
I gave metronidazole for 5 days. Around 40 mg each day.
Today his eyes are not crusted in the morning, though one eye looks smaller (??). 
I found another thread 
www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/help-found-a-pigeon-with-problem-in-its-eyes-62760.html
Here, a person has had some success with ciplox. 
I will do the saline eye-wash also, but I am thinking I will not stop the ciplox, since it seems to be working.
Thanks a lot for the advice. If he has canker, would he be eating so well? He squeaks a lot and keep shivering his wings to give him more. Was metronidazole for 5 days less?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Often with pox, they need to be treated for canker as well. The stress of any illness will often bring on canker, so treating for canker is a good idea I think. Yes, he could still be eating well with canker. Normally would treat for canker for 5 to 7 days, but sometimes if needed longer. I would go with the 7 days, and see after that if I felt he still needed Metro for longer. Isn't going to hurt. I'm glad his eyes are looking better.


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## PigeonHandRearer (Sep 25, 2002)

kunju said:


> hi everyone
> I'm glad to say that Ruku ruku is slowly but definitely improving. His pox lumps are getting yellow and slowly drying up.
> Now I know for certain he is a baby, because I am having a lot of trouble feeding him. He squeaks to give him food, so I hold some seeds in between my thumb and middle finger, and show it to him. He manages to peck at this half the time, but at other times he misses and the grains fall on the floor. So it is really messy, apart from the fact that lot of food is wasted. He doesn't like me taking the seeds from the bowl, and slaps me with his wings. I tried imitating the pecking from the bowl by using my finger, but he continues to slap at me.
> He dislikes being held wrapped in a towel, and struggles a lot. But this is the only way I can ensure that food is not wasted. Is it fine to put 5 or 6 small seeds at a time, inside his mouth? He hasn't choked yet. But he resents the process.
> ...


aw, cute I am glad he is well  Its great handrearing a pij, You can try feeding him pronutro (i dont know is you get it in india) 20ml, 2 or 3 times a day.It must be mixed with warm water (cooled from kettle)not too hot, feel it with ur finger. porridge thickness.

good luck


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks Jay and Pigeon. His eyes are much better now, there is no discharge from them now.
As for the feeding, we have progressed to the stage where he knows that I have a different style of giving him food, and the towel is no longer needed to hold him. He is a very sweet inquisitive fellow. Yesterday he was sitting contented on my shoulder, and as soon as I began to sing, started staring at my mouth. He also observes me washing dishes, cleaning the house, and doing other chores, with great interest. If I show him his bowl with seeds, he stares at it with an intelligent expression, but not quite knowing what to do with it.

It sure is a lot of work caring for a baby, but every moment is worth it. I can't wait to introduce him to my other pigeon Rudy..once he gets healed completely.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

One eye is perfectly fine now. The other eye... well it is surrounded by pox still, and there is a yellow colour to the skin around the eye. The eye is a bit watery, but there is no stickiness and forming of crust like before. I'm a bit worried about this eye.
I have been feeding him 3 times daily, but his chest seems hard and bony. The pox inside his mouth has got yellow, and one fell off yesterday. I cannot see anything deep down the throat, so perhaps there is no canker. Can I try to pull off the rest of the pox gently, from the mouth?

He stands still and rests for most of the day, but does not seem ill. His mind is alert, and when he gets hungry he climbs on my lap and squeaks and flaps his wings. I haven't given any antibiotic course till now, except for the metronidazole. 
If anyone knows how to get colloidal silver in India, please let me know. I would like to try it for the eye.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

Hi,just ask for "Silverex ointment" in medical shops,we usually use it in Humans for burn wounds.It will be available in the usual medical shops in our place


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks a lot Boney. I suppose this ointment would help for his skin. But I cannot use it for the eye, right?
What do you think can be done for the eye?


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## whytwings (Feb 12, 2011)

kunju said:


> Can I try to pull off the rest of the pox gently, from the mouth?


I would not attempt to do this , there is a high probability that the bird could bleed to death. I would suggest letting the medications do their job and allow the pox lesions fall away naturally. You might like to be made aware that colloidal silver contains heavy metals in it .


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks Whytwings for the advice. I was unsure about what to do with them, so thanks for clearing it up. There is also a great deal of pox around his vent, like a bunch of grapes. Seeing it, I feel like taking them out, but I guess I will wait for them to go away on their own.
I'm aware of the controversy regarding colloidal silver.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> Thanks a lot Boney. I suppose this ointment would help for his skin. But I cannot use it for the eye, right?
> What do you think can be done for the eye?


dont use it for eye.......alternatively you can try a mixture of neem leaves + turmeric+oil to bind them,make a paste out of it.and apply..this is what fanciers in Kerala usually do


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you very much Boney. I tried to vaccinate the other pigeon today at Kokkalai Hospital, but they don't have the vaccine unfortunately.
Do you vaccinate your birds for pox? 
Have you hand-fed baby pigeons? Right now, I am giving a mixture of seed and grains. He has a liking for broken wheat, jowar, broken rice etc. Also he likes raisins. I am giving maybe 2 tbsp , thrice a day. Is this enough?
Yesterday, I stopped the ciplox. Instead I washed his bad eye with Neem Juice (prepared by boiling neem leaves). The yellow colour around the eye is better today.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

Pigeons vaccines are not readily available in India,they need to be imported from other countries,so only the commercial fanciers may be having them.i have personally never vaccinated my birds.if you go to sakthan market ,in the shops selling cereals and chicken food,there is something called "Finisher",its a pellet feed for chickens given during breeding season....you can give them to this pigeon youngster,it will pickup growth very fast.Hand feed till the crop is full,then repeat hand feeding only after the crop is completely empty,,thrice a day is sufficient,do give water............_A normal adult pigeon drinks around 50-60 ml per day and eats 30 gms of food per day._


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thank you very much for all the info. I had gone to Shaktan market twice before, but I couldn't locate any pellets. I will go once again and ask for 'finisher', thanks.

I will try contacting some commercial breeders for the vaccine.


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

I got the pellets from the market. They smell like ...dried fish I think. Are they non-veg? Is this ok for pigeons?


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

kunju said:


> I got the pellets from the market. They smell like ...dried fish I think. Are they non-veg? Is this ok for pigeons?


Its full of protein........i feed my pigeons a mixture of "Kambe,manicholam,Big cholam,varagu,Pellets,Sunflower seeds".This is the mixture i give them daily


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

Thanks Boney. My pigeons unfortunately didn't accept the pellets. Even the birds outside our window didn't touch them. 
So I will continue with the seeds and grains. 
The pox scabs are coming out now from some places, but it is exposing raw pink areas without skin. 
There is another problem. I am not sure if the pox in his vent area is the culprit, but his poop gets stuck invariably in the vent area. His poop looks entirely solid, with a paste-like consistency. He does drink water on his own.


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## boneyrajan.k (Jul 15, 2010)

Just clean the vent,i know that now it may look scary to you.....but in due course of time,that entire mass like thing in the vent will dry and fall and the vent area will look completely normal,its just a matter of time.till then clean it gently


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## kunju (Mar 14, 2012)

The baby pigeon is doing fine, eating well and active in general. I am also giving him the vitamin/mineral supplements Miss Sassypants sent me.
Unlike what is described over the internet, pox has affected almost half his body, even the feathered parts. Feathers are coming away in clumps, attached to the dried scabs.
Half the affected feathers are gone, the other half are yet to detach. 
He looks a sorry state, though he is happy lively pigeon. 
Other than the supplements I am giving him, is there anything else I could do to help his condition? It is two months since I got him, but the scabs are still yet to fall away completely.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

[email protected] said:


> Guys, I found a baby pigeon about 5 days ago. He seems to have canker in his ears and boils all over his body. I suspect it's pox. I have been giving him 0.25 mg of metronidazole for 3 days now. I read in this forum that potassium permanganate can be used to dry the pox , can someone please suggest me the amounts I need to use? Also is this dosage of metronidazole okay? Really worried for the Lil guy. Help me out please


You have already started a new thread on this. Can you delete this one so that it doesn't just get confusing with people trying to answer to one or the other?


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## chandan290786 (Apr 10, 2018)

Dear All,

One of my Pigeon chick having one single pox on beak almost next to nose day by day it is growing and now its blocking nose to breath ...day by day bird had becoming weak not active ...i have tried 2 medicine ...
1. Thja - Cream - Homeopathy 
2. Neosporin cream 
Nothing improvement, kindly please guide me solve the issue


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## Marina B (May 5, 2011)

Nothing much you can do about the pox. It will clear up by itself in a couple of weeks time, those lesions will dry up and drop off. If the pigeon can't eat, you will need to handfeed him. Also boost his system with good food and plenty of vitamins. Sometimes they do get the wet form as well when the lesions starts growing in the mouth.

They sometimes also get secondary infections like canker, which also show up as yellowish growths in the mouth. These are usually towards the back of the throat. This disease can be treated with metronidazole.


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