# Barless Ash Red



## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

How do you go about producing a Barless Ash Red? What color/patterned birds do you use? I just think they are beautiful looking birds.


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

WOW. That IS a pretty bird.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

There are two ways of getting a barless ash-red, or "lavender". The first way is the easiest - mate a spread bird (black or brown) to an ash-red bird. You'll turn them out quicker by having a ash-red cock over a black hen, as all the babies will be red. Also, if both the hen's parents were black also, then all the babies you get from the pair will be lavender.

The other TRUE barless ash-red, is made by breeding the barless gene into a red bird. I would get an ash-red cock with a barless blue hen (from someone like Dennis Kuhn). Then take one of their sons, who will be split for the gene, and mate him back to his mother. Then you will throw 50% barless birds, regardless of sex.


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## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

*Hi HENRY, Can you post pictures of the tail and the wing so we can see the primary flights* GEORGE


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

Sorry George the bird in the picture isn't mine. I found the image online just for an example.

Becky - I think I have the right birds to get started with but I have one question...is a red bar the same thing as an ash red? I'll post pictures of the birds I'll use as soon as I get home from work.


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## james fillbrook (Jan 2, 2009)

g0ldenb0y55 said:


> Sorry George the bird in the picture isn't mine. I found the image online just for an example.
> 
> Becky - I think I have the right birds to get started with but I have one question..*.is a red bar the same thing as an ash red? I*'ll post pictures of the birds I'll use as soon as I get home from work.[/QUOTe
> it depends where you live where i am its a red bar and a ash red for those who do not have the bar say a checker


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

g0ldenb0y55 said:


> Sorry George the bird in the picture isn't mine. I found the image online just for an example.
> 
> Becky - I think I have the right birds to get started with but I have one question...is a red bar the same thing as an ash red? I'll post pictures of the birds I'll use as soon as I get home from work.


Yes. Ash-red is the color, so technically, a red bar is really an ASH-red bar, and there's ash-red checks, etc. It's the genetic term, and helps save a little confusion for the people who see red and automatically think recessive red.
But heck, I still call everything red bars and red checks  So we'll still know what you're talking about.


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

Here are the two birds that I will try this with if they fit the profile.

COCK Ash Red









HEN BLack Spread









Do these two fit the bill?


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Yep, that works!


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

MaryOfExeter said:


> Yep, that works!


Nice! I was hoping you would say that. I wasn't sure if the hen was a spread or a t pattern velvet. What is the difference? I've seen velvets that look just like my black spread hen.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

The main difference is the tail and body color. The head, chest, and wings may be dark, but from the chest down, it tends to fade back to a normal blue instead of continuing to be dark. Just a black bird overall should have a fairly consistant color all over. And the tail in a velvet bird will look like what you'd find on a blue bar, whereas the tail on a black should be all black. In your case, you happen to be able to faintly see the bars on the wings and tail on your bird. That's common in a lot of black homers. Just means the spread gene didn't cover it as thoroughly as it might on other birds. 


One more thing, is a lot of velvets do end up having very dark wings, but _usually_ if you look real close, you can see at least a few of those little "T"s on the tips of the shield feathers.


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

Great stuff Becky thank you very much for answering my questions!


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

No problem  Glad I could help!


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

oh....one more thing Becky....

What if I use a white hen will I get the same results? Is white a spread like black is?


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Nope, white doesn't have anything to do with spread. Typically the two things that cause solid white are grizzle and recessive white.

Some homozygous ash-red grizzles will turn out completely white, normally with colored eyes. On the other hand, recessive white is much like recessive red. It covers up the actual genetic color underneath. So the bird could actually be blue or red or whatever, it's just the R. white covers it up. Recessive whites also have bull eyes.
Certain combinations of other different white factors (like piebald) could probably make a solid white as well, but typically if you have a solid white bird, it's one of the two I mentioned first


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

With all that Becky what would an ash red bar cock and colored eye white hen normally push out?


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Well, assuming the hen is really an ash-red grizzle because of the colored eyes, you would get all grizzles, and as far as base color.....

Sons:
50% Pure ash-red (no blue flecks in tail), 50% ash-red carrying blue

Daughters:
50% ash-red, 50% blue


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

I also want to add that if you have a recessive white bird mated to a normal colored bird (who is NOT split for recessive white), all the offspring will be regular colored and carry the recessive white gene.

If you have a recessive white bird mated to a normal colored bird and you do produce recessive white babies, it is because that normal colored bird was secretly split for rec. white.

Now saying that, two normal colored birds can technically produce a solid white baby, if they are both carrying the recessive white gene.



And ONE more thing I'd like to add. Depending on what other forms of white the birds may carry, you could get pieds and splashes that are almost all or completely white, changing the percentages in your outcomes.


White is a crazy lack-of-color! -brain scrambles-


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## g0ldenb0y55 (Dec 23, 2008)

Thanks Becky! The way you explained that was crystal clear! The White hen in question in a bull eyed bird so from your previous post that would make her a Recessive white. The only thing now is to find out what color she's hiding under that white. She has already paired up with one of my young BC cocks so I think I will let her have a round with him to see what they produce. Then from there I will have a better idea on the the color she is hiding. If you don't mind I'd like to keep you posted to get your thoughts on their offsprings.

Thanks again -Henry

P.S. I'll post pictures of the pair when I get a chance.


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## CoLynx (Aug 14, 2021)

g0ldenb0y55 said:


> How do you go about producing a Barless Ash Red? What color/patterned birds do you use? I just think they are beautiful looking birds.


This is not an ash red barless, but an ash red spread as a result of the spread gene it carries. It probably has pattern but because the spread gene is dominant, it has covered that particular pattern, it could be any of the four patter; T check, check, bar and barless. The only way you can tell the pattern with certainty is through breeding.


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## CoLynx (Aug 14, 2021)

Sure....you can breed the colour of the bird in question( ash red spread/ lavender), All the best


g0ldenb0y55 said:


> Here are the two birds that I will try this with if they fit the profile.
> 
> COCK Ash Red
> 
> ...


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