# Why have I lost so many YB’s?



## Granny Smith (Jul 16, 2011)

What am I doing wrong? During the months of July and August, local club members have been generous enough to provide me with 26 YBs. At this point I only have 8 that have stuck around. Most were squeakers, some were young but no longer squeaking. I would estimate that most of them were 30 to 45 days old when I received them. My loft has both a settling cage and an aviary. I have been making sure that the YBs have been spending plenty of time in each for about 1 to 1 ½ weeks before placing them on the landing board without the settling cage. Many of them would progress from the roof of the loft to the roof of my house and re-enter the loft for about a week. Then when they got the courage to start flying over the trees, they take off never to be seen again. All of these losses have been when loft flying, none of these birds have been road trained. I am always outside when the birds are out of the loft, and to this point I have not had any trouble with hawk attacks.

What am I doing wrong, and what can I do to improve my odds?


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Did the Club members tell you how to settle the birds???????
Did you listen to them or decide to do it your WAY?


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## Granny Smith (Jul 16, 2011)

Did the Club members tell you how to settle the birds??????? YES

Did you listen to them? YES


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Granny Smith said:


> What am I doing wrong? During the months of July and August, local club members have been generous enough to provide me with 26 YBs. At this point I only have 8 that have stuck around. Most were squeakers, some were young but no longer squeaking. I would estimate that most of them were 30 to 45 days old when I received them. My loft has both a settling cage and an aviary. I have been making sure that the YBs have been spending plenty of time in each for about 1 to 1 ½ weeks before placing them on the landing board without the settling cage. Many of them would progress from the roof of the loft to the roof of my house and re-enter the loft for about a week. Then when they got the courage to start flying over the trees, they take off never to be seen again. All of these losses have been when loft flying, none of these birds have been road trained. I am always outside when the birds are out of the loft, and to this point I have not had any trouble with hawk attacks.
> 
> What am I doing wrong, and what can I do to improve my odds?


Im not sure if your doing anything wrong... how are you training them to come in when called?... what time are you letting them out.? do they come to your feed call without hesitation from the settling cage?

one week may of been too early for new birds.. they need time to settle in.. not sure if they learned your feed call in one week.. usually the first time out they are about 7 to 8 weeks old... perhaps you need to slow down.


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## horseart4u (Jun 16, 2011)

i agree if you are in such a hurry to get ready to race i think you are rushing it, i would keep them inside for at least 2 maybe 3 weeks before even starting to trap train so they get used to the loft both inside and in the aviary so they can look around and survay the serounding get used to seeing certain things as markers. Do you feed them 2 times a day and how much, you could be feeding them to much, thats why they flew off, well fed, lets go fly.


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## egpigeon (Jan 15, 2008)

I think you was hurry to make them ready to fly the race

but you must review your system again and take your time and give the birds the time to be ready 

Good luck


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## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

One thing you might try is when you let them out for the first week or two do it in the heat of the afternoon or in the evening. Use Dark and heat to help you. The heat will make the birds not want to fly long and the dark will help bring them in. I would not feed all day, release them and in about 10 min or so call them in. If they want to fly wait until most have come down and then call them in. Don't at first worry about them flying so much as to come in when you call and get the trap thing right. Keep in mind they want to want to come home. Does every bird have a perch, are they over crowded etc. Get the birds early at about 24 to 30 days, this will help. I agree that the feed is very important. Hungry hungry for the first week or two. I sent my partner 40 birds at about 30 days old. He has 35 going into the first race. The 5 he lost were the first time out of the loft. You will get some fly off. Start late day then move to mornings when they have it figured out. If you feel that you have overfed, don't let them out.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

I don't know if you have seen this video by Dr. John Lamberton on settling older ybs but it helped me when I settled mine. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPReyZgHzWY

Like someone said before there really is no right or wrong way to this...its more of an art then a science so you'll just have to keep trying until you figure out what works best for you. Good luck.


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## night cow (Sep 7, 2011)

First and foremost, I would make sure that there are no cooper hawks around. Also, a good precaution would be to make sure that the birds are always in my sight and are responsive to the sound of the feeding call before even considering letting them out. -Lee


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## freeonrdavin (Sep 13, 2011)

Did the Club members tell you how to settle the birds


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Grannysmith.... MIA... soooo did any of this help?...


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## Granny Smith (Jul 16, 2011)

Thank you to all that have provided constructive information. In response to some of the questions and items listed:

•	I was not in a hurry to push the YBs out because I have no intention of racing this season. I was told by those individuals that provided the birds that it is a balancing act regarding when to let the birds out without the settling cage. They recommended a week to a week and a half. Too short a time and the birds are not settled, too long a time and they are too strong on the wing.

•	The YBs were always released prior to eating and called back in to the loft by shaking the feed can.

•	The first 3 or 4 times that they are released were always an hour or so prior to sunset so that they would want to return to roost for the night. I may need to extend this step for another week or two.

•	Overcrowding has not been an issue. There are several extra perches and I have never had less than 2 sq. ft. per bird.

In most cases, it was not the first time out of the settling cage that the YBs would fly off. It has usually been after a week and when they start flying above the trees. One of my problems I think is that my neighborhood is filled with large high trees. The opening for my lot is probably about 100’ by 200’. Once they get over the trees, they can’t see the loft anymore. It seems that a lot have wandered off and are unable to find their way back.


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## Nomad_Lofts (Apr 12, 2011)

I lost quite a few also and my mentor tells me it just happens so do not be discouraged keep them flying


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## lmorales4 (Jul 8, 2010)

I really wish I could figure out what has been going on with youngbirds this year. I just lost my last 8 birds that I was flying they where flying for about an hours fly time, two of these birds where a bit older and had already come back from two miles away. Then the day before yesterday I let them out around four ocklock and they didn't come back, they had been flying at my home for about a month give or take a few days. This stuff is starting to get a bit rediculous I feel like I'm just adding to the feral population!!!


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## ace in the hole (Nov 27, 2007)

I totaly disagree with letting your young birds out at night. How can the onset of darkness get them back to your loft when they are out to far and lost. If a hawk hits or they get spooked at dusk you will have a night flight and will loose birds. 

Just like *sky tx*, I'm sure I must be wrong. Don't listen to me.

My young birds are never let out at night any more untill they have been down the road many times. Untill then I release them only in the morning and at first the hottest most humid day I can. If they do fly off the heat will drive them down. When it gets close to dusk it cools down and the birds are rested and hungry. 

Loosing birds while settling them is not just part of training birds. I have not lost a bird while settling them in several years. Even in training, if people would pay more attention to what the birds are telling them by how they come home and how they act when they land most training losses could be avoided.

I started this year with 28 young birds. I let them out for the first time on a very hot and humid morning. Some of you read about that on my thread *One In A Million* and read about my magic cow bell. On their first training toss a son of my YORK 830 & 836 hit a wire hard and did not make it so I stocked the other two from that pair. Now the remaining 25 birds were out to eight miles east and west when for the first time they did not come home all together. I could tell it was a respiratory issue form all of the heavy rain we had. Training stopped and they went on meds. They were fed to the bell in the morning and for the first time allowed to loft fly at night. They are now back out to 8 miles again and showing me they are ready to move on but they will not do that until they have three days of probios. I am still training 25 birds but if I had not been paying attention to what they were telling me I would have started to loose birds soon.


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

ace in the hole said:


> I totaly disagree with letting your young birds out at night. How can the onset of darkness get them back to your loft when they are out to far and lost. If a hawk hits or they get spooked at dusk you will have a night flight and will loose birds.
> 
> Just like *sky tx*, I'm sure I must be wrong. Don't listen to me.
> 
> ...


Sorry but I dont believe you havnt lost a single bird in training in years.
8 miles is nothing.


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## ace in the hole (Nov 27, 2007)

newtopidgeons said:


> Sorry but I dont believe you havnt lost a single bird in training in years.
> 8 miles is nothing.


I said in settling not in training!

I never said 8 miles was anything at all other than were the birds broke up for the first time and I noticed several of them were panting real bad. If I had not stopped them right then and medicated I would have started loosing birds too.


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## newtopidgeons (Mar 11, 2011)

ace in the hole said:


> I said in settling not in training!
> 
> I never said 8 miles was anything at all other than were the birds broke up for the first time and I noticed several of them were panting real bad. If I had not stopped them right then and medicated I would have started loosing birds too.


Sorry I misunderstood.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Granny Smith said:


> Thank you to all that have provided constructive information. In response to some of the questions and items listed:
> 
> •	I was not in a hurry to push the YBs out because I have no intention of racing this season. I was told by those individuals that provided the birds that it is a balancing act regarding when to let the birds out without the settling cage. They recommended a week to a week and a half. Too short a time and the birds are not settled, too long a time and they are too strong on the wing.
> 
> ...


looks like your doing everything right, The only weak point is the age your first letting them out as they have not been there long... 7 to 8 weeks old is perfect as they are not strong on the wing but they are well trapped trained by then and should feel your loft is home.. one week in your loft is just not enough time for them to feel attached to it. IMO... ones hatched there are different as they can pretty much call it home because that is the only place they know. I have heard stories of hard to settle ybs.. one in fact that was sold to someone at the right young age..the first time out he made a bee line for his home loft and he had never been let out... so maybe these ybs are real good birds and take more time in the loft before letting out.. as said 7 to 8 weeks old is not too old to be strong on the wing. try that age and see if it makes a difference.


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## Southwing (Feb 7, 2008)

I had a pair of pigeons that I never got to see how the young flew because they always flew away as yours did. They would be fine but once they got strong away they went never seen them again. That went on for two yrs trying to figure out what was going on, never did. I finally seperated them. LOL


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Southwing said:


> I had a pair of pigeons that I never got to see how the young flew because they always flew away as yours did. They would be fine but once they got strong away they went never seen them again. That went on for two yrs trying to figure out what was going on, never did. I finally seperated them. LOL


Hawks can be a factor in missing ybs too.


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## rudolph.est (May 14, 2009)

I have had similar experiences at my current loft. I think that terrain does make a great difference where young birds are concerned. 

I moved house last year, and got rid off all my flying birds, and kept 3 stock pairs, to which I have subsequently added a 4th pair. 

I've been breeding them in the new position since January, but have had a lot of fly aways too. About 6 out of 16 that I have bred so far. At the previous location, 4 years ago, I had no such problems. Keep in mind that most of the birds at both locations are from the same stock pairs. 

At the previous location, the loft was on level ground that was open for at least 20 m on all sides but the back. There, the young birds (still weak on the wing) sometimes disappeared for a day or two on their firsts few flights, but would come back. I was able to build up a flock of 10 flying birds in 6 months.

The new location has a lot of tall trees around as well as being sloped downward. Here, the young birds flying for the first time seem to be hindered by the trees quite a lot, and when they get lost, they seem unable to find their way back. I've been breeding at this location of 9 months, and have only been able to create a flock of 6 racers that fly regularly (the others are still young).

I have noticed that ever since I've had a group of strong fliers that fly high enough to clear the tree tops, I've had less losses of young birds. I think this is because the new youngsters join the kit as they circle, much higher than their predecessors flew on their first few flights. That has made all the difference.

I hope you have the same experience _Granny Smith_. Once you have a few birds circling high enough and predictably enough, I think you will find your young bird losses drop, as they will join the flock and fly over the trees.

Also take into account that losses are inevitable, some birds just don't want to stay! It is part of the sport / hobby. We can only strive to minimize losses.


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## ccccrnr (Jun 15, 2010)

Granny Smith,
sounds like the same advice i got when starting,

i kind of think some families of pigeons start developing a homing instinct by the time they are walking (so no where else will feel right)

Last year, i started with YB's, but they would stay out for hours and sometimes over night, at almost 4months i lost the YB team except for 1 on a toss less than a mile. i lost that 1 that came home a few weeks later loft flying. 

this year i've breed my YB's from prisoners and so far not had any problems with my YBs (assuming they make it back today  )


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