# Forced Release of Rescue Pigeon.



## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

I rescued a pigeon last october in front my building. He recovered well in two weeks to a month, it was too cold to release then and he bonded with me. Today City Inspector came and forced me to release the pigeon, I did so immediately. Here is the full story:

https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/general-10/a-sad-story-4175616539/


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You usually release them anyway as I recall, whether they are ready or not. So to use your own words, " Let nature take its course." Only a pigeon..right?


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> You usually release them anyway as I recall, whether they are ready or not. So to use your own words, " Let nature take its course." Only a pigeon..right?


Thanks for your kind words and valuable support. Last time I released the pigeon as it was ready to go. That was the only one I released.

This time I wanted to keep him for good as he appreciated living with me greatly. However, local law is law, if I am forced this badly then I have no other choice.
I am only a small person with limited resources, trying my best to help the needy pigeons that I come across as best I can.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Would tell them it is a pet pigeon, not a feral. Ater being in captivity, feral equals pet i think if rescued. Hope he does ok. Dont know why they would hassle you over a pigeon...i dont think they are considered protected and needing to be wild and not kept as pets, in the US.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Would tell them it is a pet pigeon, not a feral. Ater being in captivity, feral equals pet i think if rescued. Hope he does ok. Dont know why they would hassle you over a pigeon...i dont think they are considered protected and needing to be wild and not kept as pets, in the US.


I was honest with social worker, since it is illegal to keep feral she had to report it to City it appears. Different local rules, in Quebec, Canada. Lots of pests in bldg., so all are forced to take strong measures. This seems to have been part of that.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That other bird wasn't ready for release, as he wasn't yet flying well.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> That other bird wasn't ready for release, as he wasn't yet flying well.


He had adapted very well with his handicap outsides, he wanted to be outside, he wanted to be with his buddies outsides. After release on several occasions I saw him outsides playing with his other birdie friends around the same area.

I have limited space and resources. I will try my best to assist the next pigeon in need that comes along my way.

The inspector told me that the pigeon I released and the new birdie friends he makes, I can also feed them in my balcony. So once the ice is gone in a few days, this can be an option.

The commercial bird industry basically follows the cash, all love cash, cash is good. People pay big cash for toos (mytoos.com was a related site), too related supplies and other similar big colorful so called bright and cuddly birds. However, these parrots have big needs and if not cared for properly they end up causing issues. Pigeons are good to race as the race makes cash. All love cash, cash is good. Exterminating pigeons also makes cash for the exterminators etc., so this industry also appreciates this side of pigeons.

I am very glad to learn via this forum and other pigeon related sites about the high intelligence, warmth of pigeons. It is still a learning experience for me and a work in progress.

Best Wishes.

Thank You.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Just called Local SPCA was told that even what I did is illegal. I am not allowed to care for a sick or injured wildlife, was told to call them, fix an appointment and turn it in. Was also told that now the City may monitor me and can even give me high fines of over $100 if I am seen doing anything like this or keeping a feral as a pet.

Edit:
So basically only someone with a Wildlife care, rehabber permit can do this.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Most of those people will not help a feral, but will just euthanize. Pigeons are not a protected species, so should not be illegal, but here is another thread on that you may like to read. I'm not sure of where you are in Canada.
http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f115/ontario-by-laws-on-keeping-pigeons-21417.html


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Most of those people will not help a feral, but will just euthanize. Pigeons are not a protected species, so should not be illegal, but here is another thread on that you may like to read. I'm not sure of where you are in Canada.
> http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f115/ontario-by-laws-on-keeping-pigeons-21417.html


I am in Montreal, Quebec.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Most of those people will not help a feral, but will just euthanize. Pigeons are not a protected species, so should not be illegal, but here is another thread on that you may like to read. I'm not sure of where you are in Canada.
> http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f115/ontario-by-laws-on-keeping-pigeons-21417.html


Thanks very much for this thread, reading it now.

Edited to add:

Read that thread. For me it was a very bad luck and all the pieces needed for me to evict my pigeon were in full place.
Some have told me that not seeing him around is a good sign, this means he is fast adapting to his new life outsides.
Not sure if he will recognize me after few days, weeks or months if he comes across me outsides.
So far I have done my best and have to move on.

Jay3 is correct that they will likely euthanize a feral pigeon due to shortage of time, resources.
Around 2010 or so I found a pigeon struggling around in pain, loosing balance, limbs shaking, unable to eat or drink. Kept it for a day and then
took it to SPCA they said they will quickly euthanize it. It will not survive.

They list Rock Doves and pigeons on their site for adoption,
with a fee of 8 bucks. Will have to fill out paperwork etc., then the transportation. No wonder anyone wanting a dove will avoid all this trouble and
just buy one at pet shop. It takes a real caring person to adopt a bird in need.

Edited again to add:
https://www.spca.com/?page_id=4819〈=en&lang=en

Lots of pests and other issues with building my apt is in, so entire bldg., will be under radar of City for a while until all issues are corrected.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Poor Pauly I released him suddenly without preparing him due to intense pressure. It was so sudden, hope he forgives me for this. I will be in big shock also if I am given a place to stay for long term and suddenly thrown out without explanation or reason. The Inspector said that they can give me 2 more days or so but I felt intense pressure in the situation.

If one has lots of cash and has a racing pigeon, this is fine, belonging to a pigeon club and flying pigeons is ok even if they come in contact with nature and other wild birds, buying doves in pet stores and adopting them is ok, taking all these to vets is ok. All these help the economy, all love cash. However, a feral poor pigeon can carry diseases, is a risk, costs cash and hence is not wanted. Cash is good and all love cash, follow the cash and the reasons are clear.

ToySRus filed for bankruptcy and the founder passed away recently. Many retail stores are going bankrupt. Wonder if Petsmart will go bankrupt, that will be quite something. As economy tanks more folks may start to keep pigeons perhaps as pets.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I don't think many of the pet industries that cater to dogs and cats will do badly, as people love their dogs and cats. Probably enough people who can afford to spend, own dogs and cats.
Here, it isn't illegal to keep pet pigeons, as they aren't a protected bird, but if you have a landlord who doesn't want pets, they can stop you. Also many towns will stop you from putting up outside lofts or such for pigeons. Too many rules.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> I don't think many of the pet industries that cater to dogs and cats will do badly, as people love their dogs and cats. Probably enough people who can afford to spend, own dogs and cats.
> Here, it isn't illegal to keep pet pigeons, as they aren't a protected bird, but if you have a landlord who doesn't want pets, they can stop you. Also many towns will stop you from putting up outside lofts or such for pigeons. Too many rules.


It is not just dogs and cats, petsmart sells a lot of exotic pets, related supplies. endoftheamericandream.com had some good info. in the past on how the retail industry is collapsing, even info about dead malls etc., deadmalls.com is another related site. Not sure how they are doing but if petsmart closes or greatly reduces then this will be a big trend indicator.

(Edited to add this:
https://www.peakprosperity.com/podcast/113829/james-howard-kunstler-coming-economy-less

Here is yet another author, artist who feels the same way)

Anything feral is a no no here and the rules are strongly enforced specially when one comes under the radar. It takes a lot to get under the radar as there are a lot of people and the system is busy. However, with my kind of bad luck, I don't need enemies, went under the radar by default big time. Landlord is ok with pets as I still have my other parrots.

Yes, all those rules are there to prevent from helping a needy poor wild bird pretty much. However, if one is ready to open their wallet, then one can get any bird they wish from a different door, I can say this as I have gone thru this door in the past, it is very nice and works amazingly well even for Doves.

The poor feral pigeons have so much personality, can't help feeling for them. I am forced to look at the entire picture logically, do my best and then move on. I can't help every needy pigeon out there in all situations, I can only do my best under my limitations.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Thank you for hejping ferals when youcan. They are sadly maligned and misunderstood.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Thank you for hejping ferals when youcan. They are sadly maligned and misunderstood.


Thank you for your kind words and support. I am still a work in progress. Have had pet birds for 20 years, most of which have been following the main stream pet industry and helping their sales.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Thanks for the article. Interesting.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Thanks for the article. Interesting.


Welcome. I am quick to admit my drawbacks as this helps me improve. I am slow, things are happening faster. Check this one:

500 pets abandoned at West Edmonton Mall store up for adoption
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/edmonton-humane-society-1.4584076


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Oh, that's terrible. To just abandon them. For crying out loud...........they could have let them go for cheap as is being done now. At least they would have found them homes.
Too bad.......yes the economy is a mess.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Oh, that's terrible. To just abandon them. For crying out loud...........they could have let them go for cheap as is being done now. At least they would have found them homes.
> Too bad.......yes the economy is a mess.


Yes, so if this is the condition for fresh pets from the pet factory, where are the ferals ?


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Here is one another that shows similar trends:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/pjs-pets-pets-unlimited-closing-1.3550160


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Wow! Maybe people just can't afford the high prices any more. Many unemployed or under employed. People are making less, but prices continue to rise.
Same thing here.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Very sadstory about the abandoned pets. Hope they get homes. If i lived closer I would help adopt some.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Wow! Maybe people just can't afford the high prices any more. Many unemployed or under employed. People are making less, but prices continue to rise.
> Same thing here.


Yes these stores wanted 1000s of profits to survive, the chains wanted profits in millions of dollars. So there is a lot of money for sure. Cash is good, all love cash, so follow the cash. What happens when the cash flow slowly reduces greatly ? Then pets are getting to be worse than ferals, atleast ferals can survive outsides for sometime on their own.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

I was told that I have broken the trust of this pigeon Pauly I was forced to release suddenly. Was told that he will never trust me again and even if he seems me outsides, he will keep his distance and ignore me. Anyways, even young pigeons when they growup, don't interact with parents once they leave their nests. Was wondering if he might return to be fed or for short times together, guess this is not going to happen. Feels sad but need to accept this and move on. Life is what it is, have to turn the page. Will see what other help I can offer in the future to others.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Came across this very interesting book:
http://www.10000birds.com/review-of-flyaway-by-suzie-gilbert.htm


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

This is the worst outcome when it comes to stray animals and the system is strained:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/peo...feeling-distraught-having-euthanise-dogs.html


This book examines Collapse of past societies in general:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collapse:_How_Societies_Choose_to_Fail_or_Succeed
Interesting to compare it to what we are seeing today in present times. The challenges of pet/feral birds are a fall out of these major events.

Edited to add:
As economy declines, folks are even stealing animal shelters of their cash. If this is a significant loss, the cash can't be replaced, then I have read before in some cases, the animals are euthanized as suddenly the resources are strained.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...anasia-cash-stolen-restigouche-spca-1.4197867


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

rvijay said:


> This is the worst outcome when it comes to stray animals and the system is strained:
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/peo...feeling-distraught-having-euthanise-dogs.html



That's a sad story. And the thing is that too many people, even over here, blame the shelters that have to euthanize the many cats and dogs. It's ridiculous. It is the many people who treat the animals they get as disposable trash. They bring them to shelters when they tire of them, or they get old or sick, or they just change their mind, or are too lazy to train. They don't get their pets fixed because they are too cheap. So there is so much breeding out there that many animals end up in shelters. They don't have enough people adopting to be able to help every animal they get in. Euthanizing is sadly the only answer. Then these stupid people blame the shelters and the people who run them, for what is their own fault.
People would rather buy from a shop, a new puppy, often of a certain breed. They just help to keep the puppy mills going. But they don't care........as long as they get what they want. /So they should blame themselves, not the people who have to take care of the mess that others have created. Always easier to blame someone else. Don't get me going..................


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> not the people who have to take care of the mess that others have created. Always easier to blame someone else. Don't get me going..................


We are both on the same page here. This is consumerism, always wanting you to buy more and new for a better experience, discard the old. Same with pets also, no difference, so the pet industry makes nice profits, passes the dirty laundry and blame somewhere else as smoothly and easily as possible. This is the bottom line. Same with electronics and tech, buy new phone, computer, stereo, TV etc., So all these old things are adding to landfill. Folks like me who are content with the old are ostracized and treated as dinosaurs in the society. However this is fine. I have made peace with my poverty and bad luck.

In a way I am glad for what happened, if Pauly my pigeon is more happy outsides now then this is what I wish for him also. I am using this experience to strengthen me, help me learn more about birds in need in my area, pets in general and assist as best as I can given the limited resources that I have. Who knows perhaps in future I might assist a friend of Pauly in need or one of his family even ? Such thoughts are still a work in progress tho and I keep missing him sometimes. It snowed a bit and temp. dropped to -10C at night, so was wondering if he is ok. He was in warmth of my apt. till then. I blame myself for not using the extra time they offered me to release him slowly, make sure he was ready with the idea and comfortable. Guess with time he will even forget me if he is happy with his life outsides, This is fine also then as long as he is ok.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Well I hope he is okay and maybe you will see him again.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

http://vernonbirdsanctuary.format.com/injuredbirds

Wow, checkout the Canadian Wildlife Act on this page. It is not just provincial in Quebec then, this is federal. Violation of a federal law is a felony basically. This is quite serious stuff.

Edited to add, burnout in rescue work:
http://www.naiaonline.org/articles/article/burnout-the-monster-in-the-rescue-closet


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Well I hope he is okay and maybe you will see him again.


Thanks, with all these laws it seems like even meeting him will be illegal. I can feed him outsides, this is allowed. However, if they are not fed in winter outsides this is no good. So will reflect and see.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

rvijay said:


> http://vernonbirdsanctuary.format.com/injuredbirds
> 
> Wow, checkout the Canadian Wildlife Act on this page. It is not just provincial in Quebec then, this is federal. Violation of a federal law is a felony basically. This is quite serious stuff.
> [/url]


They don't mean pigeons in that wildlife Act. Pigeons aren't a protected species.
They mean domestic birds, the protected species. We have the same laws over here. I think it is to stop people from owning domestic birds. They are protected. Of course, it does also stop people from rehabbing them, but people who don't know what they are doing can sometimes cause more harm than good. So actually the laws were made to protect wildlife. Many just ignore it if they find a bird who needs help.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> They don't mean pigeons in that wildlife Act. Pigeons aren't a protected species.
> They mean domestic birds, the protected species. We have the same laws over here. I think it is to stop people from owning domestic birds. They are protected. Of course, it does also stop people from rehabbing them, but people who don't know what they are doing can sometimes cause more harm than good. So actually the laws were made to protect wildlife. Many just ignore it if they find a bird who needs help.


Thanks for this clarification, is there a link to your first post/intro. here, do you have a profile or site online regards to your rescue efforts with pigeons ? Thanks in advance, this will be a learning experience for me.

By the way, I checkout local SPCA on petfinder they only have 2 budgies and a love bird for adoption, in a way it is good that there are not many homeless birds locally. I am happy about this. )

Edited to add:
I checked a few months ago, local kjiji also hardly has any birds for sale, so this is also good.


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Here in the US people arent generally hassled for rescuing feral critters. We have rescued and released a baby crow, a woodpecker, and a scrub jay.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

No, I don't have a site online. I am not a registered rehabber. We have a loft of rescues, who have come to us with different things, and from different places.. They are now our pets. When it is more than what we can do, we go to the vet like everyone else. We have learned a lot, and have even taught some to one of our vets who treats birds but doesn't know a lot about pigeons. When I came home with our first rescued babies, I knew nothing about pigeons. It has been a real learning experience. I think we are all always learning. We can always learn something from someone else. 

Yes, it is good that you cannot find a lot of homeless or needy birds for adoption.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

cwebster said:


> Here in the US people arent generally hassled for rescuing feral critters. We have rescued and released a baby crow, a woodpecker, and a scrub jay.


I think most of us have done that, but it is illegal here too. So just depends on who knows. Vets are not supposed to treat wild birds either. They will tell you that.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> No, I don't have a site online. I am not a registered rehabber. We have a loft of rescues, who have come to us with different things, and from different places.. They are now our pets. When it is more than what we can do, we go to the vet like everyone else. We have learned a lot, and have even taught some to one of our vets who treats birds but doesn't know a lot about pigeons. When I came home with our first rescued babies, I knew nothing about pigeons. It has been a real learning experience. I think we are all always learning. We can always learn something from someone else.
> 
> Yes, it is good that you cannot find a lot of homeless or needy birds for adoption.


What was your first pet bird ? When did you get into bird rescue ?


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

If i can help and release a critter i will so i guess they will just have to lock me up.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

My first pet bird was a parakeet when I was in High School. My Mom always had parakeets when I was growing up. My pigeons is another story. I took this from a recent post here where I was telling someone about my pigeons.


I'm sitting here laughing. That is how I got started several years ago. I came home with 6 babies that had been strewn all over someones yard when they replaced their porch. It was a really cold spring day. April, cold and rainy. I brought them home, not knowing a thing about pigeons, as far as raising them. I had planned to raise them and then release them also. LOL. All I had was the Good Lord to guide me. I found Pigeon Talk about 3 weeks later. Two of the babies were about 1 and 2 days old, nest mates. No one thought they would make it. I was also working, which made it even more interesting. To get enough feeds into them, I got up at 5:00am to feed, rushed home during the day when I could, came right home after work, and last feeding was at about 10:30 or 11:00 at night. The other 4 babies were about 1 to 1 1/2 weeks old. You really had to be here! Somehow I figured it out and did the best I could. Then later I found out from the posters on PT that they would probably not survive out there in the wild if released.
So we ended up building them a loft. They are our pets. You are right in that some things choose you. Those very young babies mated up, and are still living happily in our loft. Of course many have been added since that time. Rescues that others have found, oops babies, and a few little hens that I brought in for mates for my single boys. Sometimes we wonder what we ever did with our time before the day I brought home 6 little babies that surely would have died out there in the cold. It poured rain the next day too! On the days when I feel like life would be easier without them to care for, I just go out to the loft, (it's a walk in, so I can go inside), bring treats and play with my birds. I look at each one and think about how they would not have made it had we not intervened, and know that it is all worth it...............................most days! LOL.
__________________

Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass........It's about learning to dance in the rain.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

cwebster said:


> If i can help and release a critter i will so i guess they will just have to lock me up.


I agree.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> If i can help and release a critter i will so i guess they will just have to lock me up.


I am planning to check with local police also on this and see what they think. This is for myself, will not mention this site.


Edited to add:
Here so far from what I gather is that the system is going come for the rescuer without a permit with fines, threat of evictions which
will get even more serious if something happens to the rescue like it never heals, creates a pest issue, dies etc., The system will do
what it can to hurt the most for the incident and stop it, will be in media also likely with related restrictions placed perhaps by law.
There will be related perhaps lengthy legal battles in Court also.

Cops will likely only get involved if the person refuses to give up the wild creature and puts up strong resistance. This is just my take
on this so far.

Edited again to add:
Manufacturing is almost very little these days in North America. Present economy is called service economy, however drama economy is a big
part of it, if one gets blamed, then legal system, police, corrections etc., all get involved. This drama economy is also great for media, ratings
and teaching others a lesson etc., So it is best to avoid unwanted attraction/attention. Parrots attract too much attention, however a rock
dove or columbian white pigeon bought from pet store will not attract any attention, just make sure to keep the receipt and log record of
purchase online somewhere. This is safe. As an alternate consider getting a wildlife rehabber permit, this takes some work but is
worth it more if there is a good number to rehab. Most of these comments are for self but sharing here for discussion and mutual learning.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> My first pet bird was a parakeet when I was in High School. My Mom always had parakeets when I was growing up. My pigeons is another story. I took this from a recent post here where I was telling someone about my pigeons.
> 
> 
> I'm sitting here laughing. That is how I got started several years ago. I came home with 6 babies that had been strewn all over someones yard when they replaced their porch. It was a really cold spring day. April, cold and rainy. I brought them home, not knowing a thing about pigeons, as far as raising them. I had planned to raise them and then release them also. LOL. All I had was the Good Lord to guide me. I found Pigeon Talk about 3 weeks later. Two of the babies were about 1 and 2 days old, nest mates. No one thought they would make it. I was also working, which made it even more interesting. To get enough feeds into them, I got up at 5:00am to feed, rushed home during the day when I could, came right home after work, and last feeding was at about 10:30 or 11:00 at night. The other 4 babies were about 1 to 1 1/2 weeks old. You really had to be here! Somehow I figured it out and did the best I could. Then later I found out from the posters on PT that they would probably not survive out there in the wild if released.
> ...


Excellent Jay 3, thanks for sharing, much appreciated. So you are not the owner of this site/forum then. Who is the owner ? 

Edited to add:
Jay3 you are very fortunate to have the space to care for such pigeons. You did amazingly well with those little babies. Will see if I can have the same luck in future if I come across one.

One thing I have noticed is that my pigeon made me super calm, reduced my need for external entertainment, made me very happy, content. Before he came my parrots were very loud and I was trying my best to calm them. After he came, they have all gotten to be very calm now. So he served a very nice purpose. I feel deeply rich, content and appreciated the very small finer things in life even more. If Pauly doesn't wish to return and is gone for good, if my parrots start being loud again, I might just buy a pet dove from the pet shop. This is a consideration for future, in the next 3 months or more.

I went for walk today, saw very few pigeons on ground but this was not feeding time. Saw a big flock of pigeons flying high, thought Pauly might be among them and was glad he was released. There was one pigeon feeding on bread ends outside my apt. bldg., Will drop some seeds around that area sometimes, this might help those pigeons.

Edited to add:
I also have a feeling that the flying outdoors is good exercise for Pauly. it is no good if he is at home indoors all the time and ate seeds, was inactive. This could give him diabetes and other issues in my tiny apt.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Time flies so fast, it is amazing. It is a week already since the forced eviction of Pauly, no trace of him outsides. The longer it passes since someone or something is lost, lesser the chances of finding they say. The only thing is that there is still
some snow outsides on my balcony and related areas, perhaps this is preventing other birds from coming for feeding. Can only pray for his peace of mind, contentment, happiness, good health, good food/water and nice company of other pigeon buddies.

The one thing regarding feeding pigeons outside is that there is more food now and a lot less in winter.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Thinking from the pigeon point of view, what if Pauly prayed to Lord asking, Lord this guy is nice, I appreciate his help, now the weather is nice, time for me to live outdoors, enjoy nature, get a GF etc., please make this happen ? Then boomm there comes the City Inspector along with social worker and makes this happen.

Now continuing to think from point of Pauly, he was in this dark room for long and followed me around, got good attention. He must have felt cramped without much room to fly around, now he wishes to totally enjoy his freedom and catchup on all the time spent indoors. Hence, he is off somewhere. He was wild and was meant to be released, perhaps he will return after a few months or not at all even.
Time will tell.

I did learn the benefits of a pigeon as a pet from Pauly. Will try and use this experience to help others.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

How did the city inspector learn about you having a pigeon?


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> How did the city inspector learn about you having a pigeon?


Old building, lots of issues including pests. So City conducted an inspection with several inspectors all over bldg., including all tenants. I live in tiny apartment and pigeon was discovered during this process. Since pests are an issue, keeping a wild pigeon that can carry pests and diseases as a pest is a big NO NO for city. So this issue is also there. I told that I have had pigeon for over 5 months, he is doing fine, this is beyond quarantine period but still it didn't help. Now that he has not even returned for a tiny visit, I think releasing him was good. I will give more attention/interaction to my parrots now.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Makes me wonder tho why Pauly didn't show his desires to be released earlier.
Guess he enjoyed the care and wanted indoors when it was cold outside and other pigeons were huddling somewhere.

Edited to add:
What a healthy pigeon needs is nature, outdoors, GF, raise family, nest, food, water and other pigeon buddies.
So let him lead his life. Must not get too close to rescues from now on. Just help and then release them ASAP.
If pigeon doesn't care or think about me, then I must do the same, this is all good.
Need to eliminate the emotional attachment I had for him and look at the rescue more as a task that was needed to be done and was well done. This will help me even better for the future.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bird_feeder

Reading the above now, good to be informed.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

rvijay said:


> Makes me wonder tho why Pauly didn't show his desires to be released earlier.
> Guess he enjoyed the care and wanted indoors when it was cold outside and other pigeons were huddling somewhere.
> 
> Edited to add:
> ...


Failing along this line of thought and missing Pauly a lot since last evening. feeling low also quite a bit. This after I chat with a friend who supported me having him recently. Went on balcony early morning and there were 2 pigeons far away that were not Pauly. They flew away on calling. Feeling shaken again about what happened so suddenly. Perhaps I got attached to him more than he got attached to me.

As per MBTI I am INFJ and a feeler, need to reduce the F mode mostly for this and get into the T mode that is my minor. If Pauly returns and he wishes, then I can go into F mode for him again. F = Feelings, T= Thinking.(Logical)

Edited to add: It was not practical for me to expect to give up my feelings for Pauly in a day or even a month. I had him for close 5 months and he interacted a lot with me. Now it is practical to expect to still have some feelings for him. Will try to giveup my feelings for him slowly like over a month, reduce my feelings slowly, this is more practical.
Also, as long I think he is not ok and needs my help still it hurts even more. I need to think that he is ok somewhere with a pigeon flock and gf. Need to remember that I am an empath. Certain people, things and happenings may trigger my memories and feelings for Pauly. Poor thingie.

If over a month I still keep missing him badly, then I might have to get a domestic dove to help me with my feelings. Hope it doesn't come to that, I need space to help another rescue pigeon.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

My Basic thoughts are that: Pauly is not ok, Pauly needs me, Pauly misses me and wants my company. However reality is different, Pauly has left, he has not returned so is ok, he doesn't miss me. He wanted me to help him heal, appreciated my time with him somewhat but other than that wanted his independence and his wild life. So if he doesn't care for me, why must I care for him after he is gone ?

Will try to follow this and see if it helps me:
http://www.thoughtsfromatherapist.com/2012/07/12/thoughts-emotions-behaviors-triangle/


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He may well have gotten himself lost and doesn't know how to return. You will unfortunately never know for sure. Much has to do with how old he was when you got him. If he was an adult feral then he had learned how to survive out there. If he was a baby who had not yet learned the things he needed to survive, then his chances of surviving out there go way down. Also in his flying ability and health when he left. I hope for his sake that he is doing well and is okay.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> He may well have gotten himself lost and doesn't know how to return. You will unfortunately never know for sure. Much has to do with how old he was when you got him. If he was an adult feral then he had learned how to survive out there. If he was a baby who had not yet learned the things he needed to survive, then his chances of surviving out there go way down. Also in his flying ability and health when he left. I hope for his sake that he is doing well and is okay.


I told inspector all this, she kept repeating he will survive and return. Keeping feral is illegal and this is the law, no compromise. Maybe I must have resisted her and kept him. Maybe I gave him up too fast under intense pressure. Worst case they could have taken me to court and threaten to evict me. It is a process. Meanwhile, I could have explored other solutions. But I was not thinking straight and was under stress. Now I do have regrets. She also said she will call SPCA and then they will release him, I must have had the story that he will not survive in wild, he is weak etc., Even they were surprised that I gave him up so fast and were glad. I am even in tears sometimes still thinking about this. Perhaps he even thinks what is the point of returning when I was evicted so suddenly.

Edited to add:
For 4 hours after release, he was on the roof. I could have dressed up gone on the roof and given him some food, water atleast. But I was not thinking straight due to intense pressure, saw him too late on roof and by this time he flew away.

Few days after release, it got very cold at night like -10C or so. He was in warm environment in my apt. all the time and suddenly the cold. Previously, whenever I took him to window he always returned insides showing he wishes to stay with me.

My feel is that he was young, left nest early and was not trained to survive outdoors. He was weak when I found him, wanted affection and care. Moreover, indoors he got tired when he flew around for a few minutes. However, Inspector said he will pick all that up outdoors.

I can learn many vital lessons from this but can't let this get to me even if I did lot of mistakes towards the end and he didn't survive. Dear Lord, give the strength to deal with this issue and move on. Stay with Pauly and assist him where ever he is also, In Jesus name I pray. Amen.

Lord is above all of us, City Inspector, Social Worker, pigeon, myself, landlady etc., Lord could have easily given me lots of cash, a very nice building etc., to have a nice bird rescue. However, he has put me in this situation for a reason. I will learn from this, pray for all others involved and try to do my best from this point on following will of Lord.

Assuming the best, he is out there having fun with his new flock and enjoying the outdoors. I called to him when I saw him on the roof, 4 hours after release, he kept looking at me but didn't return, this indicates that he wanted to leave.

Assuming the worst, he was not fully prepared for outdoors, didn't survive the elements and fell to a predator/fatigue. In this case, I did my best for a feral in need, the inspector was unexpected due to severe pressure I released him immediately. Must try to minimize the hurt feelings, loss feelings, learn from this experience, do better next time and move on. Nothing is for ever, he would have likely died in october without my help, so I extended his life as much as possible and gave him much comfort. All living beings die, some sooner, some later, accepting this gives peace. Will do will of Lord as he leads me.

https://thepowermoves.com/how-to-stop-worrying-and-start-living-summary/


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Just had a chat with a local Janitor, she also said law is law and be glad I was able to release before the weather got to be nice. There are quite a few pigeons like a block or so from where I live and he will likely start a family there she said. Another man she knows, helped a squirrel for a year and then released him to nature. She told me that her friends feeds pigeons outside my bldg., and to keep an eye out, perhaps Pauly may come to feed and recognize me there. I can even hear the pigeons calling out to one another now.

Today I just saw another pigeon limping, one foot is not ok and he even is forced to sit flat on ground sometimes. Tried to go near him and he flew far away. Next time I try to help a pigeon, I wish to ensure that he doesn't try to fly away, needs help and willing to accept it.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

There are many out there with string injuries on their feet. It is important to try and get it off, but they aren't going to understand that. Often our help in not appreciate, but very much needed anyway. But of course you can't help if you can't catch them.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Now I recall, once I played a youtube video of your squab sounds, this was few weeks after I found Pauly and he was healed, Pauly suddenly got very active, tried to find the squabs and also started looking for ways to exit my apt. I stopped playing such videos after that fearing for his safety. Now I see this is his natural instinct calling him.

Weather is very nice outsides, so pretty, lots of food outsides also now for the birdies. On my walk today outside I realized this, it is not just for pigeon, even I must be outdoors more. So releasing Pauly seems to have been the right thing to do now. I am getting more confident with time he will survive. Since in the wild, humans are considered predators, his natural wild instinct will likely return and he will avoid me if he seems me even, unless I am feeding him. This is perfectly fine, caring for him was a task that I had to do and did it well. Now to move on to my next project.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> There are many out there with string injuries on their feet. It is important to try and get it off, but they aren't going to understand that. Often our help in not appreciate, but very much needed anyway. But of course you can't help if you can't catch them.


Thanks, very good point indeed, can very well be a string injury. I thought it was a predator attack escape, but will not be this specific with a predator.

I need to be outside more and observe pigeons in the wild, this will give me a better idea about their lives in general.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/hawk-saved-by-montreal-police-pedestrian-1.1002147

Just saw this, it means there are hawks in my area as per article above.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Few more related sites:
http://wildlife.rescueshelter.com/ca
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-wild-bird-centre-rescues-140-baby-gulls-1.1107600
http://naturecanada.ca/about/faq/wildanimals/

Below is from nature Canada site, wish I had this info. before could have shown this to inspector and also seen if SPCA could have supported me:
Please keep in mind that juvenile wild animals do not make good pets because they become difficult to handle as they grow. Once used to humans, released animals are not likely to survive in the wild because they do not have the necessary skills to stay alive. They may also be attracted to people, which may lead to their premature death. Wild animals can also be attracted to properties that provide shelter and/or food, resulting in conflict and property damage.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

rvijay said:


> http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/hawk-saved-by-montreal-police-pedestrian-1.1002147
> 
> Just saw this, it means there are hawks in my area as per article above.


Hawks are every where. Of course they are there.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Hawks are every where. Of course they are there.


This I didn't know, is good to know.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Hope Pauly forgets me, doesnt try to get close to other humans and learns from other pigeon friends to survive well in the wild avoiding predators etc., This is all I can pray for.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Matthew 10:29
King James Bible
Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father.


http://biblereasons.com/reasons-for-trials/

The biggest question from this incident is why did God allow this to happen ?
First I didn't care much about other ferals in need, didn't bother to learn about them. I was into old computers and old software more:
https://www.linuxquestions.org/ques...d-oses-and-their-users-4175449680/page93.html
Wanted to learn older programming languages. If this incident didn't happen, I would have never bothered to come here, share all that I am sharing, learn more about local ferals in need and local wildlife rehab etc., My life was going in a very different direction. If this incident didn't happen, I will be very happy with Pauly in bliss and not learn as much about other ferals, wild life rehabbers etc., Also, I was not focused on the word as much when Pauly was around.


If Lord wants, he can help bring Pauly to me along with 10 other buddies of his. However, Lord has a different plan here for me it seems, I need to work with his intelligence and do as he leads me. I miss the spirit of Pauly more, not just his physical body. However, it is Lord who gave Pauly this mind and spirit.

Matthew 6:26
King James Bible
Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?

However, someone has to serve these ferals. Someone has to take interest in nature. Lord wants me to serve in this area in a small way it appears. This will be a part of my life, not the full part. Also, this challenge is getting me into the word and closer to Lord again.

I listen to this on my old mp3 player for relief:
https://librivox.org/world-english-bible-new-testament


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

rvijay said:


> Matthew 10:29
> King James Bible
> Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father.
> 
> ...


Why do you blame God for what people do? People have their own will and do as they want. 
Still don't see why they would stop you from keeping the pigeon, as they are not a protected species. Not like a protected wild bird. People in Canada do keep pigeons, both domestic and feral.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> Why do you blame God for what people do? People have their own will and do as they want.
> Still don't see why they would stop you from keeping the pigeon, as they are not a protected species. Not like a protected wild bird. People in Canada do keep pigeons, both domestic and feral.


Not blaming God. God is above everything. Protected or not, keeping feral is illegal here, like keeping a feral squirrel also. Was told that one man local raised a baby squirrel and then released it.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

My strategy is to remove any attachment feelings I had for Pauly. This is critical. Look at helping him as a methodical task performed by a wildlife rehabber assistant. In the future, I will use this same strategy to help any other wild bird I encounter and return it to outdoors ASAP. If I encounter a wild bird that can't be returned outdoors, then I will seek the assistance of authorities ASAP and see what they suggest. This will be best.

Birds really, really, really love me and my company but my conditions are different. Inside my apartment even the hardiest plant that needs the least sunlight fails to grow and dies in few months. It is that dark inside, specially in winter. Given all my conditions and the fact that I am under constant radar, the lesser live species I have, specially wild, the lesser things I have the better it is. Have to accept this fact of life. Some are blessed with excess room and lots of nature, in my case in life this is the opposite, so I have to accept this condition and make peace with it.

On the other hand, I can feed wild birds, observe them, help them outdoors if they need it. Inside my apt. I can exercise, listen to audiobooks, explore old software and enjoy paper puzzles like sudoku.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

I fed some wild sparrows again today, we are going to have an early spring snow storm tomorrow with some ice also. Hence, I decided to feed them on the table on my balcony. They came like 7 of them and seemed super happy. Will try and feed them again tomorrow before the storm. The pigeons are not noticing these seeds and this is fine for now. The small amount of seeds I put out helps feed several of these sparrows. Will try and continue to learn more about wild birds, perhaps must keep a journal even of my observations.


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## Blisters (Jul 1, 2016)

Your bird is exactly where it should be. Most likely with other ferals. In my opinion it is more cruel to keep a feral pigeon captive than to keep it. I know like many people when my time comes that I dont want to be in a nursing home or confined forever with drastic measures to keep me alive. Let nature take its course. If it lives it lives if it dont it dont but at least it is free. Now you need to let it go mentally get on with your life. You did a good job.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Blisters said:


> Your bird is exactly where it should be. Most likely with other ferals. In my opinion it is more cruel to keep a feral pigeon captive than to keep it. I know like many people when my time comes that I dont want to be in a nursing home or confined forever with drastic measures to keep me alive. Let nature take its course. If it lives it lives if it dont it dont but at least it is free. Now you need to let it go mentally get on with your life. You did a good job.


Thanks for your kind words. Much appreciated.

Edited to add:
Towards the end of this page, it says that if a wild pigeon can be released, then it must be also:
http://www.pigeonrescue.org/resources/in-case-of-emergency/


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Further Reflections.

The difference between my apt. and outdoors for Pauly is like hospital vs. real life. No one wishes to visit hospital staff often or stay in hospital for too long without a valid reason. Also, he can see pictures of outdoors from inside my apt., or watch from window etc., however he rather have the real thing, including a real pigeon GF rather than see a picture of a GF.

Now I could have turned Pauly's release into a soft one but he knows the outdoors in this area well, has his flock buddies so he wanted to be really out with them and is glad. Hence, he didn't want a soft release. Weather is not too great, his buddies are not outside that much close to my Bldg., so he is outside where they are hanging around and is safer, better for them. There is a very rare chance that I might encounger him, but this helps me understand the release was for the good and quite positive.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You really need to let it go. It is what it is. Let it go and move on. As long as we have learned from or taken something away from an experience, then it has not been in vain.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> You really need to let it go. It is what it is. Let it go and move on. As long as we have learned from or taken something away from an experience, then it has not been in vain.


Recording my thoughts and feelings so that in future it becomes easier. Certainly not holding on to it.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/disease-carried-in-pigeon-feces-blinds-n-b-woman

The article above is interesting, how come they focus on only wild pigeons and not on the many folks who have pet pigeons, racing pigeons etc., ?

Regarding the pigeon I was forced to let go, if I really loved my pigeon and wanted the best for him, I will release him to have his natural life. If he wants to visit me it is his choice, if not then that is fine, I have done my part.
So far I have not seen him again, but learning to live without him more daily.

There are more seagulls outside locally, they are loud, wonder if they are scaring away the other wild birds. Ever since the weather has started improving the pigeon and 7 house sparrows I started feeding in my balcony recently have not come back for the last 2 days.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_sparrow

Read this site for general info.:
http://pestcontrolcanada.com/birds/


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Cryptococcal meningitis isnt a disease caused by pigeons. It is in dirt but apparently can be hard on people with immune problems.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/321031.php
I hate to see pigeons singled out and blamed for this.
If you want to feed the birds why not get a pet bird?


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Cryptococcal meningitis isnt a disease caused by pigeons. It is in dirt but apparently can be hard on people with immune problems.
> https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/321031.php
> I hate to see pigeons singled out and blamed for this.
> If you want to feed the birds why not get a pet bird?


Due to different factors, this is not for me now. Have already considered this. Thanks.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

When I think about the pigeon I was forced to release, sometimes it still bothers me but not as much as before.

A pigeon with few toes missing on each foot used to come to my balcony for 2 weeks now to eat the seeds I put out. As the weather improved, I no longer see this pigeon for the last 3 days or so. Haven't seen any hurt pigeons on the ground so far, so this is excellent.

If there were just a few pigeons outside I guess no one will be concerned. It does become an issue if there are several of them in one location, then their waste goes up a lot. Over population of any species is a problem, even humans.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Sharing this in Pauly's name. All grab 20 titles or so of the best, read, enjoy and share with others also:
http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Animals-Wild_(Bookshelf)-Birds

God Bless You


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Thank you for sharing this.


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## tradecircle (May 9, 2018)

Human being is also devils... and angels. Btw, thank for sharing information about protecting pigeons


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## Aurelie (Mar 12, 2015)

Kestrels don't kill pigeons, kestrel hang out with buzzards in fields hunting mice.
Female sparrowhawks and peregrine though, they tend to kill pigeons, keep your pigeons inside if you see one of those devils in the sky.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

I have been feeding feral pigeons in my balcony now for few days, about 10 or so of them are coming. They are slowly starting to come closer to me. Most of them are young it appears and sometimes few even squeal like a mouse, feels very touching. The sparrows are not coming as the pigeons have taken over, but this is nature.

I have a feeling that there is a chance Pauly didn't make it, as soon after his release it got cold to -10C or so and even snowed. Wish I was given more time to release him. However, I did my best.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Saw Pauly, recognized him by the missing tail feather that is a bit away from the middle towards the left. This feather never grew back in him.
He is not tip toeing now as he did when he was with me, guess he was tired and also being cautious. Now he is walking with confidence and perhaps is a even a she. Doesn't respond if called, doesn't wish to eat from my hands. Seems happy and content with his other pigeon buddies, so this is all good. Just comes to eat, drink in my balcony and leaves fast. Glad to know he made it outsides. )


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## cwebster (Dec 11, 2010)

Glad to hear Pauly is ok.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

cwebster said:


> Glad to hear Pauly is ok.


Thanks I saw him again a few times, he is very glad to be outsides and doesn't even come close to me. Even when he was with me early on he would get very excited when I put on youtube with feral pigeons cooing. I am very glad that he has made it well outdoors. In future if needed, I will help another pigeon, sparrow or even sea gull.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Classic Audiobooks are free at librivox.org , that site is like the poor man's audio netflix. Lots to explore, share, listen and learn. Here is a nice new release of birds and nature, helps to know a little about other birds in nature that may compliment pigeons:
https://librivox.org/birds-and-nature-vol-xi-no-1-january-1902-by-various/

Now the feral pigeons are enjoying slow interaction with me, love to listen to me so I speak to them. When they see me on my balcony a whole bunch of them including Pauly come flying to feed a little. With time perhaps I even feel like reading a book or listen to an audiobook while seated close to balcony. They enjoy my company and vice versa. My only concern is to continue feeding them via winter, my balcony gets covered in ice and snow in deep of winter, hard to access it even, so will have to figure out a way of feed them.

Everyday I am glad I was forced to release Pauly, one of the best decisions and force actions that have ever happened in my life. Someone has to care for all these wild pigeons, they even appreciate a nice tub of water, helps to drink and splash around a little. Now I don't wish to get a pigeon of my own, all the mess and feathers etc., are outsides. Hopefully, with time Pauly starts breeding also, then this will be really excellent. )


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

This seems rather strange but will share anyways. For the last few days I am noticing 2 pigeons that seem like pauly but a lot younger. Sometimes I mistake them for Pauly but then realize their beaks are younger. Pauly is letting them eat first etc., Wonder if Pauly bred in the time since he was released.

Day before yesterday, early morning a Racoon came on my balcony and was looking for food. I gave him few pieces of tea biscuits. Now if the pigeons hang around a bit too late before night fall on my balcony, I scare them away, They fly away to the top of very tall local bldgs., to spend the night safely.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

It is quite grey and rainy here, Pauly and his buddies are very close to my balcony, drenched in the rain. I gave them enough food. Wish they went away somewhere for shelter from rain, they don't come indoors either. In the middle of winter my entire balcony gets covered with snow and eventually freezes to ice for few feet, can't open the door to it even. So was reflecting on how to feed wild pigeons in winter. If I put out extra reserve foods out, they will be snow covered soon. So only way is to go out as often as possible and feed them.
Also, need to stock up on wild birds seeds in advance as local stores had very few or none even in winter. The ice is slippery and folks have fractures, frost bite etc., with local hospital emergency rooms being full. So, can try to do my best without hurting myself. Any related tips, experiences are welcome.

Here are a few related links below.
Winter feeding of wild birds:
http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f14/questions-on-winter-care-11730.html
https://www.123rf.com/photo_7529257...hands-russia-march-05-2017-in-russia-peo.html
https://www.birdwatchersdigest.com/bwdsite/learn/top10/winter-bird-feeding.php
https://www.thespruce.com/winter-bird-feeding-tips-386586
https://www.thespruce.com/bird-feeding-myths-386615
https://www.wikihow.com/Feed-Wild-Birds

Handfeeding wild birds:
http://www.birdwatching.com/stories/handfeeding.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SCTtu2EUg0


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

When pauly was with me he had one mid tail feather missing. Recently I see that he is missing 2 or 3 more tail feathers, so am concerned, hope they grow back.
The one he had missing when he was with me never really grew back.

https://pets.thenest.com/purposes-birds-tails-11867.html


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You can shovel your patio of the snow and put out a feeder that blocks most of the snow. Not impossible. You can even build one. We have had blizzards here where we have had to force the door on the north side open just enough to get out, and shovel, we put down stuff to help with the ice, throw sand in the paths we shovel, and get out to the feeders. Not fun, but not impossible. We always try to stock up on seed when it is on sale to save money as we go through a lot of it. Actually, wild bird seed is more plentiful in stores during the winter months, as that is when most are feeding the wild birds.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

Jay3 said:


> You can shovel your patio of the snow and put out a feeder that blocks most of the snow. Not impossible. You can even build one. We have had blizzards here where we have had to force the door on the north side open just enough to get out, and shovel, we put down stuff to help with the ice, throw sand in the paths we shovel, and get out to the feeders. Not fun, but not impossible. We always try to stock up on seed when it is on sale to save money as we go through a lot of it. Actually, wild bird seed is more plentiful in stores during the winter months, as that is when most are feeding the wild birds.


Thanks for the very helpful response. I need to think along these lines, yes. Also what about water ? If I keep water out, it will freeze then.

I have mice issue. This is a challenge to storing the seeds. Need to get creative and come up with some good ideas.

There is so much evil out there these days, all being reported in media. Things are also quite expensive. So helping feral birds is an inexpensive but very satisfying hobby that feels heavenly/blissful as these birds are also God's creation. I feel my major objectives in life being satisfied when I serve these wild birds.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

http://englishrussia.com/2007/11/09/pigeons-attack/
https://www.pipa.be/en/trips/trip/trip-russia-pigeonsport-in-moscow
http://englishrussia.com/2007/08/18/nailed-eggs/
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/lonely-woman-must-pay-2300-7426683

pigeonpatrol.com - this is a big business where there is pigeon overpopulation etc.,

I did some related research and came across the above links. Must be very careful when feeding feral birds, not to attract unwanted attention, not to disturb other people specially. So far I have not been attracting big numbers and can't afford to feed that many consistently also. I can help feed a few pigeons, 10 mostly. 15 on a temp. basis. As long as they feed and leave fast, this must not be an issue with neighbors etc.,


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Don't over feed. Just leave a small amount. Seed can safely be stored in metal containers or tins without attracting rodents. If you feed the birds, more will come, so maybe best not to start.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

It is interesting how careful pauly is in trying to stay away and avoid me, like I am dangerous. I still feel compelled to feed him and few of his buddies like it is a duty. Maybe I care more for him than is needed. He doesn't seem to care for me, just wants to be fed and that is all.


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## rvijay (Jul 2, 2016)

I reduced my pigeons feeds some. Last few days was quite rainy. There is a dominant pigeon and 4 or so of his buddies that continue to come. The other 5 pigeons along with Pauly have left likely for a place where they get more, better food. In a this development of balance is positive. It is getting hotter also here now.


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