# breeding colours



## 19pigeonracer88 (Nov 13, 2011)

hey can any one help me i was wondering if ne one knew what colour birds would be produces if i crossed an andalusion over a red check also is i crossed a dominant opal over a bluegrizzle ? hope some on can hekp thanks richard


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Not sure on opal but an andalusion to a redcheck or mealy would produce a few things, Depending on the andalusian but lets assume he is het spread so only has one gene of spread

You would get a mix of blacks, Blues with indigo ( bronzing ), andalusians, Blues without indigo, Red spread ( strawberry ), red with indigo and without which would not appear much different to each other. Also depending on the patterns under the andalusian would depend on the patterns you got in the offspring. Do you have any idea of the patterns of the parents of the andalusian?


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## 19pigeonracer88 (Nov 13, 2011)

i have attached a pic of the andalusion cock bird


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Nice bird!


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Well, putting the andalusian cockbird over a red check hen will be a sex-linked mating. All sons will be red (pattern depends on what each are carrying) carrying blue - some of which will be indigo, and at least half of them will be spread (so turning these to lavender and lavender indigos). All daughters will be blue, some of which will be indigo. At least half of the daughters will be black/andalusian. If your andalusian cockbird is homozygous spread, then all the kids will be spread (lavender/ash-red andalusian sons, black/blue andalusian daughters)


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

With dominant opal, half the kids will be opal, half will be non-opal. Depending on whether your grizzle bird is het or **** grizzle, either half or all the kids will be grizzled as well.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

MaryOfExeter said:


> Well, putting the andalusian cockbird over a red check hen will be a sex-linked mating. All sons will be red (pattern depends on what each are carrying) carrying blue - some of which will be indigo, and at least half of them will be spread (so turning these to lavender and lavender indigos). All daughters will be blue, some of which will be indigo. *At least half of the daughters* will be black/andalusian. If your andalusian cockbird is homozygous spread, then all the kids will be spread (lavender/ash-red andalusian sons, black/blue andalusian daughters)


If the cock is Het Spread Would half the daughters be andalusian or 1 in 4? Half would be spread and Half would be Indigo but what percentage would have both indigo and spread? I would guess 25% but my math is not great

If the cockbird is **** Spread then half the daughters would be andalusian.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

If the andalusian is heterozygous for spread:

Sons:
25% ash-red without indigo or spread
25% ash-red indigo without spread
25% ash-red andalusian (not sure what else to call it, but ash-red indigo spread)
25% lavender (ash-red spread) without indigo

Daughters:
25% blue without indigo or spread
25% blue indigo without spread
25% andalusian
25% black


We don't know what other pattern the hen is carrying or what patterns the cockbird has because the spread hides it. SO, you could literally get ANY pattern at this point until test breeding shows what he is and what she carries.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

If he is homozygous (pure) spread:

Sons:
50% lavender
50% ash-red andalusian (ash-red/spread/indigo)

Daughters:
50% black
50% andalusian




We know for a fact that your cockbird is only het indigo because andalusians with two indigo genes have a much lighter body with a dark head. I call these "light phase", while the het andalusians "dark phase" (or "normal" andalusian as it is the most common and that coloration is called blue andalusian in chickens and even horses).


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

Now for the dominant opal, which I'm assuming is blue based as that is the most common. With a blue grizzle, all the babies will be blue based (unless of course the cockbird is carrying brown but I will assume it does not as it isn't very common).
I also assume that the cockbird is het dominant opal because in the homozygous state, most cockbirds inherit the lethal gene linked to it, which kills them in the shell or shortly after hatching. VERY few homozygous dominant opal cockbirds live long enough to breed. It is possible, just very rare. This is because dom opal itself is not lethal, but rather it is located very closely to a lethal gene on the chromosome. Because they are so close (or "linked"), when the chromosomes cross over, they usually travel together and thus inherited together.

Anyway, assuming the hen is het grizzle:

Sons:
25% dominant opal without grizzle
25% dominant opal grizzle (het)
25% blue grizzle (het) without opal
25% blue without grizzle or opal

Daughters:
The exact same results as above


Now, if the grizzle hen is homozygous grizzle:

Sons:
50% Dominant opal grizzle (het)
50% Blue grizzle (het) without dom opal

Daughters:
Same as sons

The patterns will vary because well, you didn't tell us what the dom opal was or the blue grizzle. The pattern they carry can also make a difference. That can be determined if you have a pedigree.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

MaryOfExeter said:


> Well, putting the andalusian cockbird over a red check hen will be a sex-linked mating. All sons will be red (pattern depends on what each are carrying) carrying blue - some of which will be indigo, and at least half of them will be spread (so turning these to lavender and lavender indigos). All daughters will be blue, some of which will be indigo. *At least half of the daughters will be black/andalusian*. If your andalusian cockbird is homozygous spread, then all the kids will be spread (lavender/ash-red andalusian sons, black/blue andalusian daughters)


So just to clarify, atleast half the daughters will be andalusian *only* if the cockbird is **** for spread, Otherwise if he is het then 25%.


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## MaryOfExeter (Sep 30, 2007)

NZ Pigeon said:


> So just to clarify, atleast half the daughters will be andalusian *only* if the cockbird is **** for spread, Otherwise if he is het then 25%.


Yes, if he is **** for spread, then half of the daughters will be andalusian, and the other half will be black. What I was saying before is that at least half of the daughters will be spread until we find out for sure what he is. Making them either black OR andalusian. I realize now it may have sounded like I said all of them would be one or the other. But that's not what I meant


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

MaryOfExeter said:


> Yes, if he is **** for spread, then half of the daughters will be andalusian, and the other half will be black. What I was saying before is that at least half of the daughters will be spread until we find out for sure what he is. Making them either black OR andalusian. I realize now it may have sounded like I said all of them would be one or the other. But that's not what I meant


Sweet, Im with ya now, I can see what you meant. Just wanted to check that my understanding was correct, Im still only learning about the genetics of the colours


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## 19pigeonracer88 (Nov 13, 2011)

here is a pick of the dominant opal cock bird


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## 19pigeonracer88 (Nov 13, 2011)

dominant opal cock


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