# Video of how the Pigeon triesto eat.



## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

The same Pigeon, ive been having problems with. I have included two videos each 2.5 minutes, in one movie the pigeon even takes it head back completely backwards..and many more things.
Please have a look at both videos and tell me what u think is wrong.

The pigeon doesnt fly still. Sits in the cage, eats well, drinks well..but it just doesntfly well. Its poop is not liquid, sometimes it is well...by looking atthe stains on the newspaper.

pls have a look at the video..pls

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE7yy16Q4C4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ot97sFPTIk


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi w, 


What you are seeing here is his manner of managing larger Seeds...this may be some mild PMV effects, but overall he is pecking very well.


Smaller Seeds and he might not do any 'head raises' at all.


Severe head raising problems or pecking which gets into 'star Gazing' shalings and so on tend to be at their worst with usual sized or lager Seeds, and diminish quite a bot with small Seeds...and for these problems, one can steady their head and Beak in the Seed Bowl if need be, for them to eat without so much extra movement.


Far as PMV or PPMV symptoms go, yours would seem to me to be very mild, if they are even attributable to PMV-PPMV at all.


Best wishes...


Phil
l v


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

did anyone see the videos? do u think its PMV?


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

First off, I want to commend you for the care you are giving this lovely little pigeon. Your cage is so nice and roomy and very clean. It is a nice home for him to recuperate.

Yes, to me, it has all the characteristics of PMV. However, it appears he is able to eat very well. I also noticed that his poop looks very good. Most of the time, with the PMV's we have cared for, their poop is very watery. Does he have access to water most of the time?

Recovering from PMV just takes time. I remember a little girl pigeon we had that had mild symptoms but could not fly. It took about 3 months for her to be able to do that. I put her on the floor one day and you can imagine how thrilled I was to see her fly onto a table. 

I hope you will be able to keep this pigeon because sometimes if they get under a lot of stress, mild symptoms will reoccur even though they no longer shed the virus.

Thank you for caring for him.


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

hi thanks for ur reply. but i cant keep it long for 3 months, i will be moving out soon.

yes it gets regular supply of water. i keep the cage very clean and everything, because i am myself very particular about keeping things in hygeine and clean conditions.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I just remembered that we do have a member in Saudi Arabia, I can't remember her name or her posts and she hasn't posted here in a while. I don't even know if she is anywhere near the Kuwait border so you could maybe meet with her. I was just thinking maybe she could help you out with this bird, if anyone can remeber her name or posts. It's been a while.

Also if you could take the bird with you to India, we have some members from India, again, I have no idea how close they are to you.

This bird won't be able to be released anytime soon if ever. It seems like PMV, pretty much the symptoms are typical.

Reti


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

Reti said:


> This bird won't be able to be released anytime soon if ever. It seems like PMV, pretty much the symptoms are typical.
> 
> Reti


  
if u know someone from saudi.. she can drive into kuwait and take the bird... but make sure she dont consume pigeons for food..cos many do !


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

wahegurubol said:


> if u know someone from saudi.. she can drive into kuwait and take the bird... but make sure she dont consume pigeons for food..cos many do !


Here are some members who may be in your area, I can do a group pm
to them, you might want to contact them yourself in pm as well. Explain
that you need to find accomodations for a rescue w/mild Central Nervous
Symptom signs. You can give them links to your threads so they can read
for themselves and see the videos.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/member.php?u=7574

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/member.php?u=4481

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/member.php?u=4898

I think MaryCo is in the Middle East, though I don't know which country she
is located in. Good luck, I hope one of these members is closeby and can help you out.

fp


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

All right, I did just send a pm to all of the members that I listed in my last
post and asked them to contact you.

fp


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

I think Maryco is in Dubai, at least she was about a year ago.

Melissasue would be great because she really loves pigeons but don't know how easy it would be for her to meet up. She also has said she has a lot of problems with getting on the net.

fp - great finds - don't know how you do it sometimes!


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Lady Tarheel said:


> I think Maryco is in Dubai, at least she was about a year ago.
> 
> Melissasue would be great because she really loves pigeons but don't know how easy it would be for her to meet up. She also has said she has a lot of problems with getting on the net.
> 
> fp - great finds - don't know how you do it sometimes!



Hmm, I thought Maryco was in Yemen, not sure anymore though, if that's where she is it would be too far away to retrieve this bird, but is she is in Dubai, that would be much closer.
Melissasue is whom I was thinking about. Would be wonderful if she could help. Hope she can be contacted.Thanks for the great finds.

Reti

Reti


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

well no one has contacted me.

anyways today for the first time i saw the pigeon missing its seed. while it tried to get to the seed it came and hit the edge of the bowl with its beak several times. i also saw it walking in circles.

as i was cleaning the cage, i put the pigeon on top of a table near by , it got scared and it tried to fly, but it landed upside down, makes me look as if it tries to fly backwards.

i think the disease has bcome maximized now... what you think will happen, will this pigeon every fly again, i feel sorry for its life. it was young, recently born and got PMV. I think i shouldnt have rescued it in the first hand. 

God decreases the suffering of these animals by giving them a quick death, but I have just held the bird captive now for 3 weeks and it has no friends, it is lonely, it cant socialise with other pigeons, it may not go insane? do you think this can make it insane?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

As I said before, it is definitely showing the symptoms of PMV and it will need time to recover. Canaryjayne sent one up to me a few weeks ago, the pigeon is no longer showing any signs of PMV and is able to fly...If Jayne hadn't picked her up then she would have died of starvation, got herself run over or caught by a predator.

Please leave a cup shaped container of water in her cage all the time. I have had pigeons with very bad residual neurological symptoms, they have no trouble drinking. This is a link to a video of two PMV pigeons that other people have rescued and passed on to me. Dizzy is unusually badly affected, the pigeon that he is fighting with at the end of the video recovered from PMV a few weeks ago and is fine now.

As you can see Dizzy is badly affected by stress (and don't worry, your pigeon is not going to end up like him) but he is able to drink safely.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rllcIUzUiKY

Cynthia


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, my bird, Second Chance, went through a few months of that suffering and is downright delighted to be out in the loft with the rest of them, now. The one before her has settled down with a fellow and is happily trying to raise chicks from plastic eggs.

Wahegurubol, many of us have come to a juncture in our lives where we were either hurt badly or have gotten very sick to the point of it being a life-threatening event. For instance, I had some kind of encephalitis as a child and very nearly didn't make it and years later broke my back in a bad fall. I've suffered and all it's taught me was to love life all the more and hold onto it harder than ever.

I can speak from experience that the birds we save would rather live than die. I remember one that Reti had that was in such bad shape for a couple of weeks that about all it could do was lay there kinda' twisted up. It appreciated Reti holding, cleaning and feeding it through the worst of it when it could do nothing whatsoever for itself. It made it through and so will this one in time if you'll be patient with it.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

Hello,
I had opened the cage of the pigeon today and it ran out of the cage and tried to escape, it was trying its best to fly, first it was walking in circles, for 3 weeks it has not seen a single pigeon until now, so it must be getting real real lonely. please i have recorded all of it, including its two attempts to fly. have a look at the video and give me your comments as to what you think is happening with the bird.

i also gave the bird it seeds in a large deep tray and it sits in the tray on top of the food now.. and it poops everywhere... Gawd !!! is this normal for pigeons to do like this ???? 
is the poop of the pigeon unhygenic, what i mean is that if the poop is left for to long what happens, can it be bad for the pigeon?
let me know.
and what food do pigeons enjoy the most, i heard they like wheat seeds a lot.

here is the video, please give me comments , it is a 5 minute video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3M42oX2z-k


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

Pidgey said:


> Wahegurubol, many of us have come to a juncture in our lives where we were either hurt badly or have gotten very sick to the point of it being a life-threatening event. For instance, I had some kind of encephalitis as a child and very nearly didn't make it and years later broke my back in a bad fall.
> 
> Pidgey


Well thanks to God, I am 26 and until now I have never had any life-threatenning disease or infact any bacterial/viral disease until now. My brother went through tuberculousis, measles and all sorts of diseases as a child, but I never got. Some people say that he has become immune to those disease now and I can still catch it, is it true?


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Sitting atop a bowl of seeds is pretty normal behavior and I don't think attributable to CNS displays. I frequently lift the blanket from a cage in the
morning and the bird will be sitting atop the bowl of seeds. Is it healthy for
them to eat seeds that have droppings in it? I personally change the 
seed bowls and wash when I see them poo in the seeds, though there is
some good or beneficial bacteria for them in the droppings. W/out testing
we don't know what else is there, though. The video is now loading.

Immunity from measles(viral), but not from bacterial diseases.

fp


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

wahegurubol said:


> My brother went through tuberculousis, measles and all sorts of diseases as a child, but I never got. Some people say that he has become immune to those disease now and I can still catch it, is it true?


Usually, tuberculosis is a bad one and it's sometimes impossible to get rid of. There are some strains that are somewhat less contagious and some that are pretty bad that way. I once knew a mortician who'd gotten diagnosed with a strain that they'd thought was extinct for many years. Turns out he'd had to exhume a grave that was 50 years old and got it from the corpse. Heckuva' way to get sick.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

didnt knew such things survived even in corposes also, it thought baterial/viral infection died with the death of the body.

so did you see the video?

maybe next month i will need to travel out the country, i can leave someone here who can keep filling the water bowl but wont change the newspapers with the poos on it. i m wondering if the bird sis in the cage for 2weeks , poos in it and the poos get dried.. will it be harmful if it has to stay like this for 2 weeks!? i can leave enough seeds for it in the cage, it can keep eating for 2 weeks.


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

hi today
just a block behind my apartment i saw a lot of pigeons, a lot and and very colorful ones with black-white pattersn on them, i m thinking of realising this pigeon in that lot behind my block... it can stay safe with them, and people are always feeding them in that area, what u think?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Please don't release it yet , I watched the video and the nervous symptoms that it is showing would make it unable to react as it should in an emergency so that it wouldn't last. Also it wouldn't be able to complete effectively for food.

When I asked a friend whether he would be able to look after my pigeons in an emergency he also said that he wouldn't mind feeding and watering them but wouldn't scrape up the poops. 

But can you trust your friend to water and feed every day? Would he or she be able to put a fresh newspaper over the old one? Or perhaps you could line the bottom of the cage with wood chips, that is what I use in parts of the aviary, sawdust is not good because it gets wet, smells and flies all over the place. 

You could get it a large water fountain and a large seed hopper, just in case your friend lets you down.

Cynthia


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

hi cyro, the feeding will not be problem, i will leave it enough seeds to eat it daily. the only problemo is watering..that i can ask him to fill the cup of the water it is outside the cage daily ... but the poos will be problem, its place will get dirty in 2 weeks.

i will be going for 2 weeks, maybe on 30 octorber and come back on 12 november and then after one week i will need to travel again for a week or two. 

how much time more u think the bird will take to cure?

i had given it some large seeds to eat but it didnt eat any seeds and it threw the seeds all over the cage, i collected all the seeds and put it in one bowl, i am thinking of giving it to some sparrows, and other bird species which live outside my apartment, do u think any chance of spreading infection like this? the seeds also have the dry poo of the pigeon in it.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

I wouldn't feed anyone else those seeds because there is a possibility of passing the virus on. I always threw the ones from Second Chance away for that very reason.

They vary on how long the symptoms last but I wouldn't be surprised if it was a month or so.

Pidgey


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Yes, tossing seeds is one of the way the infection can spread, so dipose of any uneaten seeds.

And if you are going to leave him for any length of time, *please *leave his water in the cage where he can drink it! Water deprivation is stressful and will make his symptoms worse. If you look at the video that I posted you will see that pigeons with much worse symptoms than yours has can drink water from a cup with no danger, the risk is if the water is given in a flat dish.

Cynthia


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

I saw on the video that there is a hole in the side of the cage and the water tray is mounted on the outside of the cage. The pigeon has to reach through the hole in the bars to get to the water. That makes it pretty easy for the caregiver to get to the water, easier than dealing with the food bowl for that matter.

Pidgey


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Thank Pidgie, that is reassuring...it is also safe from poop in that position....as safe as any water container can be, I can't understand how pigeon will manage to poop in their drinking water whatever precautions they take.

Cynthia


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

yes I mounted the water tray outside the cage, after learning that it would poop in the water every day. 

I put a large bowl of seeds in the cage which can hold 1 kg of seeds .

but now i am wondering about the poop, there will be no one to change the newspapers with the poops on it... for 2 weeks, can this stress out or be infectious to the bird.. just let me know on that.


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

I'm not going to tell you that poop is beneficial for your rescue. However, there are circumstances in which birds do eat their own droppings to ensure something in the diet that is lacking, this is known as Coprophagy. Here's an article by a well known Avian Veterinarian who specializes in pigeons:

http://www.albertaclassic.net/novice/Coprophagy.php

We don't know what is present in a given ferals droppings, though I can tell
you that in their normal habitat, droppings accumulate and they survive for
years in a given location. Some pigeons utilize their droppings to make nests
out of as a sort of "mortar". I've seen them use poop to build a ramp w/when
eggs were positioned on an incline, to keep the eggs from rolliing out of the
"nest" area.

So, will it be the absolute best scenario for your bird? Maybe not, but will
having an unchanged cage floor for two weeks at a stretch kill the bird
if food is supplied and the water changed/filled, no it will not. If this is
what you have to work with, you don't have much of a choice and it is
a far cry better than releasing this bird into a feral flock outdoors. While
the bird continues to display Central Nervous Symptoms, it's best to continue
to provide support.

fp


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I didn't like to say it first  but agree with feral pigeon! The important thing is to ensure that he has food and water.

In the wild there is no loving person to clean away the pigeon poops and yet somehow they thrive alsthough they like to roost in the same place night after night..

Cynthia


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

I got a place where we can keep the pigeon for 3 weeks, we have a small store where we can lock it up in the cage.. and someone can be there to give it water, but there will be no sunlight.. the only sunlight will be from a small window, which will remain half open and rest of the store is closed.

what do u think?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

He can deal with dim light for that amount of time, no problem.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

Hi
I will be leaving this country now day after 2morrow. I will come back after 1 month actually.
So do you really think that it can live in the cage with no one changing its droppings.

Its cage wont be re-located now, It will stay the same place where it is, water bowl will be kept full most of the time. and I will leave 1kg seeds for it to eat. 

so do let me know please !


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, you might want to leave a little more seed than that, just in case. The droppings will dry down and get smashed by its feet. Hopefully, your caretaker could add a paper from time to time. Can you caretaker get online to this website, possibly with your sign-on, just in case?

Pidgey


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## philodice (Sep 30, 2007)

I think that this thread might help with the PMV affected pigeon feed and water issues.
http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=23142
It talks about how I made poop proof feed and water dishes from old milk jugs and gatorade bottles.
1. Drink water or gatorade.
2. Cut hole in front of the bottle big enough for a dove head.
3. Wire the bottle to the cage.


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

i have left the bird at the construction site, we have a small store which is closed and i put bird in a 1m x 1m box and put a lid on top with a small hole and place a bowl of water and a tray of seeds.. i told one guy to feed water daily.

what do you think? is it okay this way?

so i will be going day-after 2morrow and i will be gone for 4 weeks. so when i come back the bird would have spent 2 months in captivity from the time I had captured. Do you think that by this time the bird will cure out of PMV and be ready to fly ?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

It's possible. That's about the right amount of time to heal.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

i have put it in 1 mx1m box, u think its okay? cosi heard that most bird wings get sore and then they dont fly..


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, it doesn't seem to bother them much (flightwise) when they're kept in a cage for even that long. How tall is the box?

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

The box is very tall.. about 1 meter i think... i think lengthwise the box is 80 cm x 80 cm. if it stands at the center of the box it can fully expand its wings diagonally across.. otherwise it cant.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

And they will. That's enough for it to keep its wings in some kind of shape.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

Thanks !
One last thing I want to know is that at night, it will get extremely dark in the store from about 6pm to 8 am in the morning.. it would be dark enough for human not to see ... can the pigeon cope with it for 4 weeks?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Oh, sure. That's normal.

Pidgey


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## wahegurubol (Oct 1, 2007)

okay thanks a lot ! I really appreciate the help I received from all this forum members ! 
I will be leaving to canada day after tomorrow early morning.

so as for now the pigeon will be resting in the 80x80cm - 1m high box for 4 weeks.. lets hope and I request all members to please pray for the pigeon, that when I come back it is able to fly and join its flock.

by the way... bykeeping this pigeon, i have developed an interest in pigeons. 
when I was in university i use to go everyday at the lake to feed ducks ! and this duck would even let her small babies come and crawl all over me... birds are lovely creatures to just watch them in their habitat.


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