# I'm So Upset



## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

My feral flock (26 Birds) which nets and roosts on my roof are being run over intentionally in the street.

I have a neighbor 2/3 houses down the street that is very sympathic to the pigeons and feeds them every morning right after dawn. Unfortunately this neighbor, although he has good intentions does not want the bird poop on his driveway or sidewalk so he puts seed out for them in the middle of the street. Although this street is not a major thoroughfare it is part of a 100 track house development so there are many cars that use it to get in and out of the development.

There is a young guy in a pick up truck that leaves for work around 7:30AM every morning. He speeds down the street and this morning I saw him intentionally swurve directly into the piegons. He killed two of them thismorning. One had a broken neck and the other was crushed beyond recogonition.

This is not the first time. I have already lost other birds in the past to him. I have found them crushed in the street.

I have called the police about this, but even though I report him as speeding, they are unwilling to put a police car on the street in the morning to catch him and they could care less about what is happening to the birds.

I have spoken to the neighbor and told him to stop feeding the pigeons in the street as he is only making them a target. I don't know if he will stop, but the birds are so used to this being a source of food for about 6 months now that they wait for him in the street every morning.

I don't know what else to do to stop these murders. If he stops feeding them will they eventually not go there any more in the morning???

I just hope I have gotton through to the neighbor who feeds them and he will stop.

I'm just so upset and needed to rant a bit.

Louise


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

lwerden said:


> My feral flock (26 Birds) which nets and roosts on my roof are being run over intentionally in the street.
> 
> I have a neighbor 2/3 houses down the street that is very sympathic to the pigeons and feeds them every morning right after dawn. Unfortunately this neighbor, although he has good intentions does not want the bird poop on his driveway or sidewalk so he puts seed out for them in the middle of the street. Although this street is not a major thoroughfare it is part of a 100 track house development so there are many cars that use it to get in and out of the development.
> 
> ...


Well, I would call the police again and again and again............don't mention the pigeons. If it's a housing developement, surely there are children somewhere? What if he hits one of them??? Focus you concern on a human of some kind and not the birds. If the person speeding and killing them can be stopped, then the birds will benefit too.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Thanks Renee........I'll keep trying with the police.

I am just so sick and tired of peoples disregard for these birds. I've put up with birds being poisoned and shot with BB guns in this neighborhood in the past. Now running them over in the street.

I wish I could take all these birds and move to the middle of no where someplace, maybe I couldn't protect them from natural preditors, but atleat I could keep them safe from the human kind.

Louise


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## little bird (Aug 11, 2006)

Louise, I think you should be on the street where the birds are being fed a few minutes before the man arrives and try again to get him to put the seed in a safer place. Then I would wait until ''nasty neighbor'' drives by and try to photograph him swerving to hit the birds .... maybe you could get a squawking type of noise maker to scare the birds into flight when you see him coming.
Second... if the feeding neighbor will not listen to you about moving to a safer place ,,,, the next smashed bird you find, pick up the remains and take them to SHOW the man what his indifference is doing to the birds. I know that won't be easy for you to do but maybe you could shock the guy into changing the feeding spot. Maybe he hasn't seen the results of feeding in the street.


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## Grimaldy (Feb 25, 2007)

Contact the Nevada Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (702-873-7722). Under Nevada law certain designated members have the power to arrest persons who torture, kill or mistreat animals, and that happens to include pigeons. Tell them you want to prosecute this character under NRS 574.100(d), which provides for fines and possible imprisonment.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I am so sorry that you and your flock are going through this Louise. It was the same with the flock of white doves that we fed at River Green. Only it was not just one person that targeted them.

There was no food in the street but they would wander off to peck for grit (ignoring the grit we gave them) or to drink from puddles. The extent of human malice makes me despair.

Cynthia


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Nona,

I had the neighbor out in the street with me when I picked up the two dead bodies. He saw what happened to these poor birds. I hope he will stop, but he is about 85 plus years and I don't know if I got through to him.

Grimaldy.......I will try the SPCA......but in the past when I had the shooting & poisioning problem they did nothing. There is absolutely no regard for pigeons here in Las Vegas. It is well know that the Casinos poision them regularly and nothing is ever done. It's more important to them that the tourists aren't bothered with any piegon poop.

I have an idea..............

Usually when I wake up in the morning the birds are already off my roof. I am going to put out dishes of food before I go to bed tonight on my back lawn. They are used to being fed there in the evening when they return to roost at sunset. I'm going to set my alarm for before dawn and see if I can encourage them to feed in the back yard and maybe if they get their fill in the morning they will stay off the street. I know it will take about a week to get them used to this but I think it is worth a try.

What do you guys think?????


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## little bird (Aug 11, 2006)

I think that is brilliant, Louise. With a secure back yard they will always be safe. Too bad the old gent is so dense, don't know how he can KNOW that they are being killed and not change his ways. People, .. bah... humbug!!


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## Margarret (May 3, 2007)

Louise,

I think your idea of getting them used to coming to your yard in the a.m is probably the most likely thing to suceed in stopping this horrible violence. As to the guy in the truck, I would get a picture of him driving by, just to have his license number and an image of him. He might think twice if he thinks he is being photographed, but I wouldn't count on it. He is typical of the violence we see all around today. He has no compassion or sense of guilt at all and unfortunately there is no way to instill it in someone. The only thing that works with these people is to hold a big stick over their heads and then it only works part of the time.

Margaret


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## Teresa (Jul 10, 2005)

My heart goes out to you, Louise! Please DO get a picture of the idiot swerving and put it up on the 'Show and Shame' thread, so we can all see what a prize prat looks like.
Trying to get them to come to you to feed sounds like a brilliant idea! Is there a chance of putting a piece of plastic or similar on a stick, near the part of the street where they get run over, to put them off? Of course that's not as good as a human presence and an alarm call, but surely you can't always be there.
Hope the NSPCA can help, but Renee also raised a very important point: speeding and swerving in a residential area has to be a serious driving offence! And a question: is the pick-up truck his? Because if the answer is no, the owner might not approve of his Indianapolis-style driving!


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## irretractable (Jun 4, 2008)

Wow - it never ceases to amaze me how cruel people can be. It makes me so sad to see things like this. I had a similar experience the other day - a pigeon was flailing in the road by my apartment complex - it had already been hit. I avoided it (there was plenty of room to do so), but the car behind me ran right over it again. I was so furious. I got out of my car and started waving traffic away, wrapped the poor bird up in a towel, and put it in my car. It was crushed, and it died fairly quickly. I just don't get it . . .

Good for you for watching out for these birds. I'm sorry you're having to deal with such idiocy and cruelty...


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

I have been in and out of my house thismorning since 5:00AM, trying to coax the feral flock to feed in the back yard.

I did manage to get a few of them to come to the back and feed, but the rest of them were out in the street waiting for the old gentlement to feed them. Fortunately, he did not come out thismorning, so maybe I did get him to understand yesterday.

I saw the guy in the white pick up truck go by and he did not make any attempt to go at the birds as he saw me standing in the street.

Half of the birds have now left, but the other half are still waiting. 

I think if the old man does not feed them any more they will eventually either come to the back yard or will go to the park which is 2 blocks away. I believe that's where they used to go in the morning before the man started feeding them, because I would always see them flying in that direction.

I'm going to keep trying every morning..........Wish me luck.

Louise


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## little bird (Aug 11, 2006)

Louise, is there a ''way'' to your backyard? Maybe you could lure them a few feet at a time??? Once they discover the gourmet table set in your yard they will be daily customers.!!! Am sending you load of good wishes for success.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Hi Nona.......the only way to the back yard from where the birds are is down the sidewalk up the front of my house down the side walkway through the back gate and into the yard. I have no problem trying to lure them, but I am afraid of the other neighbors between my house and where they are down the street. Except for the old man they all hate my pigeons. I don't want to lure them by going in the street, because I am afraid intentionally or unintentionally they will get run over by a car.

I'm just going to keep trying and hopefully every day a few more will get it and more will come. There are a few different factions in the flock and a few bullies, so I think it will take time to get them all together. They all manage to roost together at night but there is always fighting for the prime real estate up on the roof.

I just love these birds and don't want to see them harmed in any way. Besides they are my Jacks family and he would be real made at me if I didn't protect them.

Thanks and regards,
Louise


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## Teresa (Jul 10, 2005)

*Well done, Louise!*
A morning with no victims is brilliant news! And to be able to convince some of them to go to the back of your house and feed there is a great achievement, as often it takes ages to break a habit. To do it as discreetly as possible to avoid getting the neighbours' hackles up... even better!
Best of luck! Keep us posted, and God bless your caring heart.


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## Ivor (May 12, 2008)

Louise, you are doing an excellent job, not many people will get up that early, you are such a great person, and I'm sure the birds will start moving away, as long as your neighbor don't feed them anymore, they will return for a couple days, if you start feeding them in your back yard I'm sure they will find the way to get there.

Just keep doing it for a couple days, it won't last if your neighbor already stop feeding them.

And for the stupid man that kill the birds, try to take a pic of him if you see him around, then we can post that pic in all the websites, and say this is the nasty _____ that kill birds, I really hate that people, I can't believe that some people can have those instints.


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## Dezirrae (Oct 6, 2007)

I really like your idea Louise - and am glad to hear the first day was successful! Some people's disregard for the life of animals just amazes me... and is so frustrating too. I'm real sorry you're having to deal with this - but at the same time I'm so glad you are! I'm certain you're Jack is proud of your efforts  

Please do be careful with the idiot driver though - if he's nuts enough to be tryng (& succeeding) to hit birds who knows what he could do if he feels threatened. If you can, try to catch him on video tape - but from a safe distance. Reckless driving is a serious offense and the police _should _take it seriously.

Sending all my best wishes for your continued success.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Been in and out since 5:30AM today. The birds were out in the street again waiting for the old man.

I have managed to lure them down to my house and I fed them in my driveway. At least they are out of the street. 

My husband is not to happy about it, but I promised him I would hose down the driveway every morning after they leave, so I think he is OK with it.

I think if I move the seed up the walkway a little bit each day I will be able to get them all to come into the back yard.

This is going to take some time, but it is worth it.

Here is a picture of the birds in the driveway, it is about half of the total flock.

Regards,
Louise


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

GOOD FOR YOU! I think it will work!! I opened your post, and without reading it, scrolled down to look at the pictures and for a minute, I thought the car was going down a street THAT close to the birds!!! 
Then I read the post and saw that it's a parked car in the driveway.. WHEW!!


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## little bird (Aug 11, 2006)

WOW, Louise, that is a very narrow street. Good you are luring them away as it would be impossible not to run over some as they eat if in the street, even if the driver is not aiming for them.
I must say Jack has a lovely family, and you are a good woman,... even cleaning up the table after breakfast!!!


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## Teresa (Jul 10, 2005)

That is great news! Thank you for your perseverance in the face of unGodly hours! The ferals are lovely and look healthy. It would be just lovely if they all survived!


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## Ivor (May 12, 2008)

I'm glad things are working very well Louise, I'm so proud of you, again not many people will get up that early, you are just a wonderful human, and I know they will be better that way, they are so lovely, I do feed some around my job but is in SF downtown, so is hard sometimes because too many people, but they know the time and where to go, is funny when they see me they start flying close to me, when I didn't even noticed they were around.


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## Grimaldy (Feb 25, 2007)

By the way, one obvious solution is to park your car on the street and feed the birds on the street behind the car so that the car is between the clown with the pickup truck and the birds.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Hi Everyone......

I've been outside every morning and now have the entire flock coming to the driveway for food, plus I have an additional 10/15 birds coming I guess from other roosts in the neighborhood. Battery in camera needs to be charged so I will take a picture tomorrow.

The minute I open the garage door they start to fly in. There are some really beautiful birds in this group. I just hope I don't run into a problem with my neighbors. I need to keep doing this very early in the morning and keep them hidden between my car and the front bushes. I've been trying to coax them to the back with no luck. I hope as they get to know me better, I will have success. I'm trying to get them used to me calling them while shaking the bag of feed. If they get accustomed to this maybe I can start calling from the back yard and they will automatically come to the back.

This is going to take some time, but it is worth it.

Regards to all,
Louise


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## 4zpigeons (Jul 7, 2008)

What about leaving a trail of seed with a dish or two of grit ~ from your driveway to an area of your backyard? 
In the past I've left trails of food and dishes of grit during the day / evening and assisted them again in the early morning to relocate where they dine... Since the morning is when they come to dine; and you are working to relocate their food source... ~ Plus by now they (must) know you. I'd leave a small trail and add to it in the morning so its reinforced that it is you that provides them with the special treats... (and safety)...
Good luck.
~ 4zp.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I'm sorry you are having to deal with this. I just don't get it. How a human being can hate any creature so much just for being alive. This guy can't be playing with a full deck. Not if he actually enjoys inflicting pain and death on a little bird. I think your idea is wonderful. It'll just take time to make it work. How cruel. Please keep us posted and let us know how you are doing with this. You would think the old man would have thought that the road wasn't the best place to be getting pigeons to land and wait for a meal. Poor things.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Grimaldy said:


> By the way, one obvious solution is to park your car on the street and feed the birds on the street behind the car so that the car is between the clown with the pickup truck and the birds.


Wouldn't that still keep them coming to the street? They would be waiting not just behind the car, but all over the road. Better to get them away from the street and into the backyard. Besides, the neighbors won't be seeing them in the backyard.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Jay...........Fortunately they do not wait in the street. It's amazing but they all sit up on the rooftops of my house and a few ajoining houses. Then there are others that I don't know where they are flying in from. I do have a samll group that does go in the backyard, but that group is from my flock that never wander far from the house. Two pairs are nesting. I leave food in the back for them and they eat it, but I just can't seem to get the others to come to the back. I have left a trail of food going to the back up my walkway but they haven't touched it. I think that is because the trai of seeds runs adjacent to the nextdoor house and they have a big dog behind a gate in their back yard.

There just is no easy way of doing this, but I'm going to keep trying.

I'm out to feed them now, I see them on the roofs waiting for me.


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Well.....I had about 50 birds show up for breakfast thismorning. I had to put seed out twice. Everyone stayed in the driveway and only wandered to the gutter to drink water overflow from the sprinkler system which I have set for 5:30 AM so I know they get their water too. Thank God, when the seed is all gone they don't linger around they all fly away. I think they spend their days at the Park which is very close to here. Then my group returns around an hour before sunset to roost on my house for the night.

See......the problem with the old man was that he was spreading their food in the middle of the street and they would be so busy pecking at the ground they wouldn't even see the cars coming or get out of the way in time when the jerk in the truck would come speeding dowm.

I've been buying the big bags of wild bird seed at Wallmark. Anybody have any ideas where I can buy it cheaper. Looks like I'm going to be using alot of seed here.

Louise


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I think we should take up a collection to help Louise pay for the seed. I mean, it is a good cause, and it is going to take a lot of seed. I for one wouldn't mind being in on that. Anyone else?


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## rainbows (Aug 19, 2008)

We know you have a car, so, ....do you have a granary in the outskirts of Las Vegas where you might buy feed directly from there?


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Thanks so much for all the kind words, but honestly I would feel totally uncomfortable accepting any donations for the seed. It is our pleasure to take care of these birds. I am going to contact the local farm feed store and purchase the seed in 100lb bags. It is really much cheaper that way and it is not a financial burden to us at all.

Donations should go to a much more needy cause. I don't know how many of you are aware that Egypt Swift Lady (Robin) has a Wild Animal Sanctuary that is totally privately funded by her family.She has all sorts of animals including Pigeons that she cares for. None of them are ever adopted out. They live out their lives in the comfort and care of her sanctuary. She surely could use the donations.

Regards to all,
Louise


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## Grimaldy (Feb 25, 2007)

There should be a farmers grain and feed store somewhere around there, hopefully not too far away. There you can buy 50 and 100 pound bags of shelled corn, they love it and it is very high in calories, for about $12-$15 per hundredweight. They often sell other seed products as well.

Look for horse supplies and feeds.


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## KIPPY (Dec 18, 2003)

> I've been buying the big bags of wild bird seed at Wallmark.


Is that suppose to be Walmart? If so they are way more expensive.

They have 40lbs bags of bird seed on sale at Petsmart for $9.99.
Petco has there's on sale at times also.


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Iwerden, I hope you can lift a one hundered pound sack, lol. You should be able
to get a fifty pound sack of 15-1/2% pigeon mix at a local grain and feed store
for under $20 and if you measure out the amounts per feeding it might last you
for the best part of a month.

If you continue to see birds killed in the road, I would put the dead bird(s)
in a plastic bag and show the neighbor who that is feeding in the middle of the
road what the results are.

There have been a couple of folks around here that have fed in the middle of
the street and folks just run over the birds. I started sweeping the seed out
of the street and one of the street feeders stopped....the other one stopped 
when there was a really bad accident.

Sometimes folks just don't stop and think about the repercussions of their
actions.

fp


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

It doesn't really seem all that hard to figure out. Street.......cars.......squash! Would they put their kids toys in the middle of the road and then tell them to go out and play? HELLLOOOOO? Anybody home?


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

The old man that was feeding them in the street has stopped, however the habits of the pigeons are that they wait in the street for him. What I have done now to discourage them from the street, is that I put seed in the driveway before I go to bed at night. So now, by the time I get up at around 5:30/6:00AM some of them are already in the driveway eating. The rest are either up on the roofs waiting for me as well as some of them are still in the street. When I spread the rest of the seed they all come into the driveway. Thankfully when all the seed is gone they take off for the park or other parts unknown. I have not had any luck trying to lure them into the back yard. The only birds that feed in the back are my own flock which feeds when they return home to roost before sunset. I have left seed and bowls of water in the back all day long, hoping that some would see it and come back, but the only luck I have during the day is from the little sparrows.

I went to Petco and was able to get two 25lb bags of seed for less than $16. It's just wild bird seed, but it will do until I can get to the farm feed store which is quite a ride outside of town.

Thankfully there have not been any more deaths in the street and little by little I think the birds are getting the idea that there will not be any more food in the street. Every morning there are less waiting in the street and more waiting up on roof tops. They are starting to know me and don't seem to fly away as much when I try to approach them.

Regards to all,
Louise


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You sure are doing a great job. It's funny, if you didn't want them in your backyard going after the seed for the songbirds, they'd find it and be there all the time. At least you've pretty much gotten them out of the srteet, and safer.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

lwerden said:


> I went to Petco and was able to get two 25lb bags of seed for less than $16. It's just wild bird seed, but it will do until I can get to the farm feed store which is quite a ride outside of town.
> 
> Regards to all,
> Louise


Try Petsmart .. much less expensive. The current "regular" price for 40 pounds of Wild Bird Seed Mix at Petsmart is $10.99 though it has been on sale for the last week or so at $9.99 for 40 pounds. The comparable product at Petco was running $17.99 per 40 pounds .. definitely out of my price range for as much of it as I go through.

You may be in for a surprise at the feed store .. last time I was out in Norco, the seed/feed was even more expensive than here in the pet stores .. didn't use to be that way.

Terry


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Terry, that's a great price. I'll go to Petsmart tomorrow, I hope the sale is still on. I'll stock up seeing that I am now feeding 50/60 piegons a day. It surely won't go to waste.

Thanks for the info.

Louise


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## Margarret (May 3, 2007)

Louise,

I am so glad that you have been able to get the street feeding stopped and at least lure them to your house. One consideration though. If you have already factored this in, then disregard my post.
You don't want to feed them so much that they come to be dependent on your feeding and don't forrage for themselves. So that in mind, I would limit the amount of feed put out each day as it is easy to feed more and more as their friends arrive. And they will! When we lived in another town, I fed the ferals in my yard and what began with a few swelled to fifty in no time at all.

How have others that feed feral flocks handled this?


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Margarret...........This has been a serious consideration for me. 

This neighborhood is heavily populated by pigeons as it is only one block (less than 1/4Mile) from a park. Within the houses that surround me there are atleast 1 or 2 pairs that nest on each roof. I believe my roof has the largest concentration of birds approx. 25. 

Within 2/3 days after I started feeding in the driveway I have about 50 birds. I haven't seen any increase in that amount for about a week. I haven't actually measured how much seed I put out, but I would estimate it to be about 10 cups of seed. It takes them about 10 minutes to completely finish all of it. It appears that they all get a fair share of it.
Thankfully when all the seed is gone they do not hang around. They all take off for the park or other parts unknown.

My biggest concern is the neighbors!!!! I haven't had any complaints yet and I think it is because I am doing this right after dawn each morning when almost everyone around here is still asleep. 

I would be really interested in hearing from other members who feed the ferals and what problems they have encountered.

Louise


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Hi Louise. First of all, I want to tell you that I think you are doing a wonderful thing in getting the pigeons off the street. I would have probably done the same thing. I commend you for caring so much about them. God knows, we need more people who are willing to step up and help the ferrals. It's too bad that the older gentleman created the problem to begin with. And you, like myself, could not just stand by and watch as the poor things were needlessly killed in the roadway. But all that aside, I do believe that you could be letting yourself in for more than you bargained for. You said that you have now, about 50 birds, and that you put out about 10 cups of seed. Please tell me that you don't mean that you put that much out all at one time. If you are, you are feeding them enough to fill them up. They will breed and bring back their offspring, and you will have 100 coming every morning. I started feeding the ferrals that come to my rooftop because of the bird feeders that I put up for the songbirds. I think I started with about 10 birds. That was a few years ago. Now I have about ( and I counted them yesterday ) about 35. Not sure if they were all there or not. I felt bad for them up there in the cold of winter, and the heat of summer. I love the ferrals, but I know the neighbors don't. I don't ever throw enough to fill them up. I would love to be able to meet all their needs, but all that will do is bring more and more. Plus the fact that they will then become too dependant upon me for their survival. I don't want that. I throw out only a small portion of what they require, and they must somehow forage for the rest, just as they were, I am sure, doing before I began feeding them. I would love to be able to give them all they need, and I must admit, that on occasion, I put out a little bit extra. Usually though, I put down just so much, and I try to harden myself to putting down more. It's not easy. I'm a softie for any animal. But I don't think it fair to make them totally dependant on me. Sure, it helps them for that moment, but in the longrun, I don't think so. And they must be finding food somewhere, because the flock actually looks very healthy for the most part. And they grow in numbers. What will you do when there are 100 coming? Put down 20 cups of seed? You have done a wonderful job getting them out of the street. Maybe, once that is accomplished, you could try to cut back by a cup a week say, until you had it down to just a few cups. I know you wouldn't be filling them up, but you would be helping them to get by, and you have accomplished saving them from the roadway. May I ask you how much the older man was putting out for them? Surely not 10 cups, and they were probably doing fine. You are making it easier for them not to have to look for food. Think about it. I don't know what's the right thing to do. I just wanted to tell you what I do and why. I guess it's an individual decision. If you can afford to put down more and more as their numbers grow, and if it won't cause any problem with the neighbors, then fine, but if not, just think about cutting back to less, and letting them forage for the remainder. Good luck.


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## SerendipityCA (May 2, 2008)

Oy, I think I've been feeding too much as well. I take a handful and throw one up on the carport roof for every two birds, roughly. Sounds like I'm feeding too much. Did I read that it should be 1 tablespoon per bird per day?


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

lwerden said:


> My feral flock (26 Birds) which nets and roosts on my roof are being run over intentionally in the street.
> 
> I have a neighbor 2/3 houses down the street that is very sympathic to the pigeons and feeds them every morning right after dawn. Unfortunately this neighbor, although he has good intentions does not want the bird poop on his driveway or sidewalk so he puts seed out for them in the middle of the street. Although this street is not a major thoroughfare it is part of a 100 track house development so there are many cars that use it to get in and out of the development.
> 
> ...





Hi Louise, 



I had not seen this thread, or it's initial relaying, when I had replied to your second, other thread about this.


Sorry...I had no idea someone was deliberately trying to run them over.



That is truely ghastly...


Phil
l v


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

SerendipityCA said:


> Oy, I think I've been feeding too much as well. I take a handful and throw one up on the carport roof for every two birds, roughly. Sounds like I'm feeding too much. Did I read that it should be 1 tablespoon per bird per day?


Well, what they can exist on, and what they can eat, are two different things. I think maybe you just don't want to give them so much that they begin to depend so much on your handouts. You just want to give them enough to help. I think. And to make them forget to hang out in the road.


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## Teresa (Jul 10, 2005)

Hi Louise,

I'm glad your hard work is paying off and the pigeons are learning to stay away from the road.
I try not to give my feral flock more than a tablespoon of pigeon mix per bird a day, plus any food scraps or crumbs. I say 'try' because when the weather is very wet or they look frail it's hard to resist giving them a little extra. I hope this is about right. They also forage in the street (which, being in the city centre, has limited vehicle access) and it has warmed my heart to see drivers slowing down and sounding their horns to avoid hitting them. But mortality is still high, due to disease, building works destroy nesting areas, and over the years the flock hasn't increased much. There are about 60 of them.
Most of my neighbours don't mind them, especially as I only feed them in my property, and because they act as a burglar alarm: once I heard them take flight at 3 am, and when I opened the window I spotted two burglars on a nearby roof! The police took ages to arrive, but the burglars didn't appreciate having a strong light shone on them and took off. To my mind, they are providing a public service!


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## lwerden (May 31, 2008)

Hi Everyone.........The morning feeding of the flock in the driveway is going strong. My flock has told all their friends in the neighborhood and there is now about 75 birds coming for breakfast.

I've gotten as close up as I can and they all appear to be healthy. No visable or obvious signs of canker or pox.

I don't know exactly how much I am feeding them, however I am going through about 25lbs. of seed per week.

So far......no complaints from the neighbors.....Thank God.

Regards,
Louise


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## Ivor (May 12, 2008)

Hi Louise, They look so healthy, I buy 20lbs a week, and sometimes is not enough because I cannot even finish my week, last Sunday they didn't have food so I was the first customer in the pet shop, because I didn't have food, and I was giving them all the bread that we had at home, and some canary food from my other birds, anyways, I have so many that I feed in my yard and around my work, but I'm having problems in the building, one of the tenants saw me once, and the poop is very obvious too, I tried to feed them but not in the same place but every time are more and more, and I don't have a heart to stop feeding them, but I know I will have problems eventually, they are very obvious and when they see me they start flying next to me, so people can see that something happen there, they are so lovely... but anyways I'm glad everything is well with you... and no more problems... Great job Louise... =)


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## SerendipityCA (May 2, 2008)

Ivor,

I live in San Francisco too. Where do you get your seed? I've been getting it at Lucky Dog in Berkeley on the recommendation of another board member. I buy 50# at a time and drive around with it in the trunk of my car - I have no place else to put it!

You know, I too worry about attracting attention from the neighbors. So I have a system that might not work for you at work, but it works for me at home - I go out late at night and put the seed out then. The birds come early in the morning and eat. I put it on the carport roof so I don't attract them down to the ground...because I don't want them to get hit by cars. This works on two levels:

1) The birds don't know me so they don't flock to me when they see me on the street. I think of myself as their Secret Santa. 

2) people don't see me putting the seed out.

Now I know you feed at work in an area that is very crowded with people all day every day, right? So I don't really have a solution there. I think you said your office is near the Embarcadero? Is there any place like a park where you could retrain them to go? Or do you arrive early enough that you could leave the seed out when people aren't around? 

I have a bunch of birds that I feed near a cafe I go to every day (well, I didn't used to go every day but now I look forward to seeing my pidgies so I don't miss a day). They literally wait for me on the roof of a building on the corner, and can spot me a block away. As soon as I am in view of that building I look to see if they're there, and a block away, they're just specks to me, but they take on the wing immediately and fly a whole block to greet me, then they impatiently accompany me up the hill until I am at the feeding location. Fortunately it's a nearly ideal spot to feed. It's near a street with lots of cafes so they keep up their foraging skills...but it's on the "blind" side of a large bank and it's shaded and there are trees, and that block leads down to a residential neighborhood so there's not a lot of foot traffic. So I can wait until nobody's around, and just casually drop the seed, and it would be tough to figure out what I'm doing unless you were staring at me for some reason.

The birds are a dead giveaway of course but right now I only have between 3 and 10 at any given feeding.


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## amyable (Jul 7, 2007)

That's a great picture, it's lovely to see the flock tucking in and having a good feed.

Janet


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Good job Louise! That is a good sized flock isn't it?

SERENDIPITY:
The only problem with leaving the food out at night, is that it is much more likely to attract rodents. Not only do you not want them coming around, but they could likely spread disease to the flock. I only say this because I know that if I did that, I would have them here, and it doesn't take long for them to locate the food.


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## Ivor (May 12, 2008)

Hi Serendipity,

I buy my food in Pet Club they are in Westborough Ave, after Serramonte, the prices are better than if you go to any pet store in the city, I visit some conures that are on sale for a long time, they are my friends and every time I go I play with them, of course if I find one of the guys that work there and is a bird lover.

I had been thinking about some strategies, but they know me already at work, they know even my schedule, when I leave from work and I go to the post box in front of my building they are already waiting for me, and you have to see their faces, I have to feed them, what I do I wait until nobody is walking in my way, because they come from all the places, it became a problem now, before when I start feeding them, they were around 4 or 5 but now they can be around 40.. and you know how is the financial district, so many people around, and here I am... anyways, I always act what happen here??? but I'm afraid that they will catch me soon..

I'm trying to find other places, but they like that spot in front of the post box, of course they know I'll be around there eventually because I work in that building... 

Anyways, check pet club and get the address from Westborough is not far from SF, I think Berkeley is too far away for me... and 20 lbs a week works well for me, and is not that heavy, if you go try to bring some seeds or bread because a lot of pigeons there, people feed them over there and they already recognize my car too... yes, pigeons know me everywhere.

email me if you want more info... would be nice to see you some day I'm Ivette by the way.


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