# Freedom Lofts Burglarized



## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

One of the local fanciers sent this to me thought it had value


Carolyn Dewberry reported Freedom lofts had been burglarized last Thursday night. Most of the birds taken have import bands. Two of them were Netherlands birds and the last 3 digits of the band numbers were 650 and 026 a Grizzle hen and a Dark check hen.
These were birds that had been sold and were awaiting shipment. As can be expected, she is quite upset over this. She has asked that we put out the word that if the birds are returned immediately she will not pursue this with the evidence that she has that may identify the person or persons responsible. 'There will be no questions asked'. If anyone has any information about this or is approached about "Questionable" birds please contact Carolyn at 918-299-4887 or 918-510-9393.

Please Pass this on


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Thanks for posting this here. I saw it on doves-pigeons just a little bit ago and suggested that it get onto 911 Pigeon Alert. 
I'm sure the poster to doves-pigeons will see that it gets there as I know she is a member.

I hope all the birds make it safely back home.

Terry


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

It's a shame when this sort of thing happens, but it also brings home the point that if you own valuable things in your back yard, then you should have effective security safeguards in place. This is not a crime where it only happens to the "other guy".

One of the laws of loss prevention, is that adequate measures are only put into place after losses have occured. I would have thought that large commercial sellers like the Dewberry's would have had more then a padlock protecting their stock.

Since the crooks apparently knew which birds to take, and which to leave, I suspect that these were stolen by or for pigeon fanciers, and as such, I would be very surprized if theses birds are ever seen or heard from again.

If any good can come from this, it may be a reader reviewing his or her own security around the loft. If the only thing you have in place is a padlock, or a cheap lock in a door knob, then you effectively have no security at all.


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## TheSnipes (Apr 9, 2007)

i only have a hobby flock of other people's unwanted castoff birds, but I use video surveillance. I love my birds and would be crushed if something happened to them. If anyone prowls around, they should smile cuz they're being recorded


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

The only thing I can think of is a BIG BIG MEAN dog.......after all, all the locks in the world aren't going to keep someone out of a loft if they REALLY want to get in. All you need is a pair of wire cutters........ Kind of hard to keep someone out of a cage/building that's surrounded by wire. Maybe a full time security guard with a gun and a big stick?


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## learning (May 19, 2006)

This is where my two big security guards (my dogs) might come in handy! At least we would know they are there. Renee is right however. If someone really wants to get in, they are going to find a way. The security camera thing would probably help in identifying the perpetrators but that is still after the fact.

Sad we have to worry about such things. Look at people like Dave Clausing who had the winner of the South African Sun City race stollen out of his loft. That was a bird worth tens possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost offspring.

Dan


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## TheSnipes (Apr 9, 2007)

Lovebirds said:


> The only thing I can think of is a BIG BIG MEAN dog.......after all, all the locks in the world aren't going to keep someone out of a loft if they REALLY want to get in. All you need is a pair of wire cutters........ Kind of hard to keep someone out of a cage/building that's surrounded by wire. Maybe a full time security guard with a gun and a big stick?


I like the big stick part


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

That loft is just south of Tulsa, which is my town. I don't think I've ever seen a loft that was built to be that secure against a determined burglar. All you usually need is some wire cutters to get through flight portion, if nothing else. The sides are plywood and can be sawn through. I think the big mean dog is probably the better option. Otherwise, you'd need special motion detectors, alarms and a shotgun full of rocksalt.

Pidgey


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

*Warning Trespasser's Have Been and Will be Shot !*

It is true that with most loft designs, a pair of wire cutters would get you into a lot of lofts. However, that person would have to be able to get to the loft in the first place, and then that assumes they will be given the time and privacy to then cut their way through. 

If one is a commercial seller of pigeons, like Mr. Dewberry is, then all one has to do is invest some of those profits and hire a private security consultant or firm to show you what all can be done. Some things can be very simple and inexpensive, others more complicated and expensive. 

Motion detectors, lights, alarms, security fences, attack dogs, armed guards are just some of the tools which I use to protect my investment, and the shotguns are not filled with rock salt, but with 00 buckshot. 

My philosophy should serve as a warning,xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, but an intruder who invades my domain, will never do it again, that I can promise you.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> *an intruder who invades my domain, will never do it again, that I can promise you. *


I hear ya, Warren. 
That same 'rule' applies at our household. 

Cindy


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Cindy, I'm swooning again.

Pidgey


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## bbcdon (Oct 16, 2007)

I agree that trained dogs are an excellent deterrent, but here in California, if the burglars are attacked and injured, there is a good chance they will file a civil lawsuit. That's just the way it is here in the progressive golden state.


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## TheSnipes (Apr 9, 2007)

bbcdon said:


> I agree that trained dogs are an excellent deterrent, but here in California, if the burglars are attacked and injured, there is a good chance they will file a civil lawsuit. That's just the way it is here in the progressive golden state.


Counter sue for the trauma to your dogs


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## bbcdon (Oct 16, 2007)

I thoroughly aggree.


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## Matt D. (May 12, 2007)

this is just really bad... people stealling pigeons... most people would laugh at this...


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Matt D. said:


> this is just really bad... people stealling pigeons... most people would laugh at this...


Possibly, but those are the ignorant and uneducated ones, while I have NO respect for them, it may be best they don't know -it's those kind of people that won't burglarize your loft. I believe the less people know, the better. I would never advertise the fact that I have pigeons or allow people to even visit my loft. You let in a world of possible trouble. I also believe if you care enough about your possessions, whether in your house or backyard you got to secure them, and the big dog sounds like one good preventative.\.


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## lawman (Jul 19, 2005)

SmithFamilyLoft said:


> It is true that with most loft designs, a pair of wire cutters would get you into a lot of lofts. However, that person would have to be able to get to the loft in the first place, and then that assumes they will be given the time and privacy to then cut their way through.
> 
> If one is a commercial seller of pigeons, like Mr. Dewberry is, then all one has to do is invest some of those profits and hire a private security consultant or firm to show you what all can be done. Some things can be very simple and inexpensive, others more complicated and expensive.
> 
> ...


*I shure wish more people had this philosophy!!!!! 

Point is that if you have birds or anything else that cannot be easily replaced, you should obtain good watch dog(s) (mine is Zues and he is a resque dog, half German Shepard and half Samoyd Husky) Then add in the electronic monitoring systems and alarms if you feal that it is needed. Just remember everyone that no system, no matter how good is fail safe. 

Lawman *


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## hillfamilyloft (Jun 22, 2005)

I think a guy or gal with birds that cannot be replaced would be wise to get a partner. Someone who they can stock with brothers and sisters or offspring of their best birds. This way in case your birds are stolen that you can get the bloodlines back. I have read about European fanciers doing this to protect from such things as theft or fire. I know if my mentor lost his loft that I would have him restocked in a season with his best bloodlines. Others use band covers to hide the bands of the birds. Anyone can get ring numbers from race results or web pages. Not everyone knows what nest box their target bird occupies. My thoughts are that they could replace bands with chip rings. A simple scan would be needed to identify a bird and also these could work with electronic clocks. 

Randy


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## lawman (Jul 19, 2005)

Your right Randy, unfortunately not everyone has the luxury to be partners. My best friend and partner also happens to be my younger brother, So with very few exceptions we can pretty much duplicate anything from one loft to the other. However with that said, I still don't want to be stuck between a rock and a hard place trying to replace birds taken from either loft. That would mean breeding strickly for stock purposes and loosing at least one round out of the breeding season, maybe more. Or repairing breeders in the middle of the summer (In So. California not a good idea) for special breedings. 

So we do our best to make sure the birds are safe from harm and/or sticky hands. 

Lawman


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## jack1747 (Sep 16, 2007)

Can you Microchip pigeons like we do dogs?????


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

jack1747 said:


> Can you Microchip pigeons like we do dogs?????


Yes, you could. It is quite expensive though if you have many birds.


Reti


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## SmithFamilyLoft (Nov 22, 2004)

lawman said:


> *.......Just remember everyone that no system, no matter how good is fail safe.
> 
> Lawman *


Hello again Lawman,

Most likely you would know more about this then most readers here, since you deal with crooks every day in the course of your employment. 

However, I think you will agree, that it is possible to make your loft, or home for that matter, more secure then the next guy. And by using the various loss prevention tools, you can establish in the crooks mind that your home and loft is just too risky to attempt a break in. And instead he will go down the street and hit someone else. 

This of course should be obvious, but in case some reader would shrug their shoulders and think...what's the use...nothing is fool proof....it does make sense to make any crook think twice or three times, before taking the risk to try, because of all the security which must be overcome. You might agree that a lot of property crimes, are crimes of opportunity....like you leave your valuables in plain site in an unlocked car...as an example.

There are pigeon lofts out there, which don't even have a lock on the door, or even some basic lighting. These very basic steps if taken, could prevent some nighborhood kid from helping themselves to some "free" birds, and more advanced methods should be employed for more valuable items. Well...I'm preaching to the choir here....


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## KO Loft (Jul 1, 2007)

*re afterthought*

Just curious but have any of the racers or commercial breeders ever reviewed your insurance polices? A team could be decimated after such a theft and not have the financial ability to repair the loft and replace birds. Just a thought


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## KO Loft (Jul 1, 2007)

*reason i ask*

I recently had client that because of privilege i can not reveal came under almost same circumstances and well after reviewing their policy I came to the realization that they had no legal recourse with insurance company, lol and do not let me get into obtaining restitution from the vandals.

joe


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## lawman (Jul 19, 2005)

Hi Warren,

All the stat's I've ever reviewed showed one common thread; The car that most often gets stolen, never had any type of alarm system or steering system lock and/or the alarm (or steering system lock) was not activated at time of theft. likewise with homes and business' the ones that get burg'd had no motion sensors around them and they typically don't have any type alarm system and/or the alarm system was not activated at the time of the theft. Not all but most fall into the above catigories. 

*SO,*Watch dogs, motion sensors, locks on doors and or alarm systems of some type will make the common theaf go to another location that is not as well defended. 

However if you have a theaf that is determined to steal some item, be it a champion pigeon, race horse, ming vase, ect. ect. that's a harder nut to stop altogether. If, you can slow them down and frustrate them enough. They will usually get scared off before they are able to get what they wanted. But your not going to be able to stop them all. 

As for being able to get insurance on your loft or birds.......... well now that can probibly be done........... Just like with individual race horses and horse farm operations. Unless your refering to the grand champion and looking at years of breeding potential. With babies being sold for thousands of dollars each. I just don't think it would be cost effective for the average pigeon flier.

Yours in the sport,
Lawman


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## abisai (Jan 30, 2007)

Yeah . . kinda hard to deter a determined burglar. I have a good pad lock, motion lights, a pretty good guard dog and right nice neighbors that look out for each other.


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## DEEJAY7950 (Dec 13, 2006)

having been in law enforcement myself I have one piece of advise for everyone and that is you must learn to protect yourself at all times, you can't depend the the police to protect you, 95% of the time police come after the fact. 
That crime, that could have been prevented by patrolling neighborhoods has been circumvented by setting up radar traps because of revenue and money concerns, so sad that many departments are more concerned with taking in revenue then protecting citizens, I don't want this to become a debate but just look around sometime during your daily travels at all the resources (officers) being used on these details that could be better served! Yes at times it is necessary to have some areas watched but more times than not its all about the money and believe me they know where to get it !


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## lawman (Jul 19, 2005)

Hello Deejay,

Well I don't know how long you have been out of law enforcement, but at least here in the southwest the days of "radar traps" are long gone. Taken over by computers and cameras that monitor high traffic intersections. 

The push has been to return most if not all patrol officers back to set beats. Nw you all have to realizethat we are still patrolling with limited officers. I mean that the patrol officer ranks have not increased with the rate of growth in most cities. So you have fewer officers per hundred citizens than you did say 20 years ago. with the all types of calls for service increasing as well. So the blue line between the bad guys out there and the honest citizens keeps getting thinner and thinner. 

So Deejay you are right in saying that we each must do things we didnt have to do when I was growing up. like locking our houses and cars when we go out. Not to mention having to have alarm systems and motion sensors on and around our homes. Wish I knew the answers as to how to change things around (I do but the answer is not politically correct), but until people wake up and say enough is enough things are not going to change.

Lawman


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

It is sad that this is becoming so common place, and that crime/home invasions/robbery is advancing to rural areas as well as cities, my in-laws used to leave their doors unlocked just a few years back, and never had a problem or thought about it twice, until recently.

Everyone does need to be more aware in what goes on around them and take an active role in securing their homes and lofts. The neighborhood watch program is also a good program to have IF you live in a neighborhood.


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