# Young woody with serious cat bite injuries



## Rooster2312

One of my work colleagues dropped off a young woody to me last night who had been caught by her cat. After our original phone conversation, I had expected to receive an adult pigeon that had all it's tail feathers pulled out during the attack, but on receiving the bird, it was found to have much more serious and extensive injuries. The initial assessment of the bird was outdoors in an outbuilding using a red light torch to minimise stress. There was a nasty looking wound on it's back and it's neck with muscle tissue exposed. The bird was alert but obviously stressed, so we took the bird indoors for the night and placed it in a covered large cage with blankets, heat, and food and water. Since we only have a small amount of baytril to hand and no synulox, we administered an estimated starter dose with a small drop of metacam added.

The bird survived the night and we have since had a further look for injuries and discovered that there is a puncture wound to the chest and further nasty wounds under each wing. We need to try and wash out these wounds soon but it was too stressed during this examination to do this at the time. We have since administered another dose of antibiotic and metacam at the time of examination and the bird appears settled and still alert at present in a warm room. It had a full crop at the time of rescue, and has pooped in the cage overnight. We don't know if it had taken any water from the water bowl, but we gave it a 1ml syringe of water and managed to pop a few seeds down also after administering the medication. 

There is a good local wildlife rescue that we are considering contacting if they can take the bird, although I was concerned that the advice they gave to my colleague when she first phoned them, before I suggested bringing the bird to me, was to put the bird back out into the garden!! Although we did not know that the bird had injuries at that time, I can't understand why they thought it was ok to leave the bird without any tail feathers!

Despite the bird being alert just now, I'm thinking that the prognosis is not good due to the number and extent of the injuries. We are not sure what to do now. We think that the rescue place (they do take pigeons) will put the bird to sleep but without a proper veterinary examination, it's hard to say whether these injuries are survivable.

Is there anything else I should be doing in the meantime?

Thanks,

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

The injuries are survivable, but it might not be releasable so might be PTS. Flush them with sterile saline daily to keep them clean, let them heal from within by gently debriding the wound daily. I use intrasite gel to keep wounds moist, removing it daily, but some members are not too keen on that. KY gel can also be used to protect a wound from bacteria.

You really need synulox for puncture wounds. I am just about out of that but can send you a tab of 3 if you PM me your adddress, I have to take Kit-Kit to the vet, so I will try to get another prescription then and I can send some more.

Has the puncture wound on the chest pierced the crop? The crop lining could be ruptured. If so, you will be able to feel seed that has spilt from the crop through the skin.

When this happened to a little dove that I had I had to feed it below the puncture site, to allow the lining to hael, and the spilt seed gradually made its way up to the external puncture wound. Water leaking from the crop can cause serious problems.

BTW, Metacam is a single drop every 24 hours. The Baytril can also be administered once every 24 hours (reduces stress) at 15-20 mg per kg bodyweight.

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

Thank you very much Cynthia for your quick response and for offering to send me some synulox. I have PM'd you with my address and phone number.

I don't think the crop is punctured but will have the chance to examine the bird's wounds more closely when we attempt to wash them out this evening. I have checked on the bird throughout the day and it remains standing and alert. I will try to get a further update to you later this evening.

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

Hopefully you will receive them tomorrow morning.

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

Thanks Cynthia,

We have just managed to irrigate the wounds as best we can but we didn't have any sterile saline to hand so we just had some warm previously boiled water and made up a salt solution. The lacerated wound on the back that extends behind the wing to the lateral thigh is much worse than we originally thought as there is an extensive skin deficit with muscle tissue exposed. The same can also be said for the ventral neck, although skin margins may be viable for skin suturing. The chest wound is however more superficial than we first assessed. The GI tract appears to be intact. This poor bird has been severely plucked with much bruising and minor abrasions. There are no tail feathers and many flight feathers are absent. We were concerned that the skin around the back wound does not look a healthy colour and slightly malodourous although this may be bruising, we are not sure.

The bird remains surprisingly very physically strong and alert and has allowed us to administer medication, food and water throughout the day. 

We are hoping and praying that this lovely bird makes it through another night and we are able to take it to Jude's work tomorrow (vet's) in the hope that it's wounds can be sutured.

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

Can you PM or e-mail ruff72 (Barbara)? She has been nursing a pigeon with similar cat injuries...and the same malodorous problem . I have checked the thread but it is very long and doesn't have all the details in it...She treated it under the guidance of her vet and will be able to discuss this and the problems she encountered with you.

The dose for the Noroclav (generic synulox) that I sent is 1/2 tablet twice a day.

Cynthia


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## amyable

Hi, I know that Barbara is still having problems with her bird's wound. The hole still isn't healed. She has been using Intrasite gel initially then flushing it out with diluted hibiscrub more recently. As of Saturday it was still being a problem.

I have just been reading a post where someone with years of experience suggested using a mixture of Tumeric, (spice), mixed with sunflower oil. It is obviously a good natural remedy, but apparently is very successful. I'll just go and check which thread it was in and report back.
I still have a bird with a chest wound that won't heal so I thought I might try that myself.

The vet I saw last week with this bird told me to use Sudacrem in it as it will keep it moist while it heals and obviously has the antisceptic advantage. He also said Nivea cream would do the same but hasn't got the antisceptic. 
If you've ever used Sudacrem you'll know that it is very thick so he recommended that every few days to bathe it off with some mild soapy water or diluted hibiscrub to keep the feathers around from clogging up.

Janet


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## amyable

Hi,

Just to let you know the thread where I saw the Tumeric idea is in 'Sick and Injured Section', Pigeon Wound in Chest.
It's 2 tablespoons of Tumeric Powder and 1 & half spoons of oil. Granted he says the bird may be a little yellow around the wound!
Gurbir posted this suggestion and has been used by his family for years apparently. It's worth knowing if all else fails.

All the best with this one.

Janet


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## Feefo

Hi Janet,

It is the whole process that Barbara will remember and be able to describe... the lungs were visible at some stage.

Nooti had "Almost Lunch" (AL) who had muscles on his back eaten by a sparrowhawk. She smothered the wound in antibacterial cream and placed him under a heat lamp (on antibiotics, of course)...he could not be released but he is living happily is Karen's aviary.

Cynthia


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## amyable

Hi,

Yes the lungs were visible, Barbara has done an amazing job. I think at least the smell has gone now, she had to rename him from Stinky as he was originally!!


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## Rooster2312

Hi, Just a quick update on the pigeon. It was taken to the vet this morning and underwent surgery under anaesthetic to suture the major wounds. I was worried about the bird all day at work, but I am pleased to report that it made it back home and is now back in a warm comfortable cage to rest. 

Thank you Cynthia for the synulox!  The pigeon also came home with some synulox tabs from the vet, so I can return the ones you kindly sent if you are in need of them.

I am encourged that the bird has remained alert throughout this ordeal and appears to be doing well at present. I realise that there is still a huge risk of wound breakdown and infection and a long road ahead to recovery if it does survive. 

Thanks for all the help. I'll keep you informed of the bird's progress when I can.

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

That is an encouraging update, thank you.

Hang on to the synulox just in case you need it. It is always worth having some to hand if there is a cat caught pigeon. I am hoping to wheedle some more out of my vet on Thursday, if that fails I will let you know!

Cynthia


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## Birdmom4ever

I just got to this thread and haven't anything useful to add, but want to praise you for helping this poor wood pigeon! We're all pulling for him--he sounds like a real trooper. 

-Cathy


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## amyable

Just to add my good wishes for the bird's recovery.


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## Rooster2312

It is now a week on since we took in the wood pigeon and I am pleased to report that we still have it...but as of today, I am thinking that there is still something going on with it, and fear it may not be 'out of the woods' yet despite the fact it is now eating and drinking on it's own and still remaining on antibiotic treatment. It is still strong and fiesty, hissing at me when I go to retrieve it for medicine administration, but this morning I thought it was breathing a little faster than normal and one of it's eye's is a little more closed than the other. It could just be the stress of captivity, but I am a bit more concerned than I was a day or two ago. 

We were going to stop the antibiotics tomorrow, but I think we should keep going for a few days more. I also have the bird in my bedroom away from the cats, and was going to have to relocate it to one of our out-buildings this week for continuing rehab, which could take several months if the bird does survive. It has absolutely no tail feathers, and is still looking a sorry state after being plucked by the cat. I would normally be happy to keep the bird in my room (where it WILL remain till I am satisfied that it is not sucumming to infection) but all being well, I will have to move it out to a more suitable rehab location in order to minimise stress. I suffer from pigeon fanciers lung and am currently going through a bad flare up of alveolitis which is not being helped with having the bird in such close proximity. I stress that, I will be keeping the bird indoors for the time being though, and really hope that all is well and it is not deteriorating.

Thank you all for your wishes for the bird's recovery!

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

Take care of yourself!!!!

I had to have My Little Angel indoors and isolated for weeks, because she was a PMV suspect as well as having oher problems. I put her cage on a shelf in the cupboard under the stairs, with a heat pad and an infra red heat lamp. There she was safe and I could check on her regularly. I hoped that the location would minimise the circulating antigen...I don't know if that worked or not, because at the same time I had Delorious and Holly flying free in the computer room, and I couldn't wear a mask and see out of my glasses at the same time so I had a lot of exposure which I paid for with a flare up.

I bought a little oxygen sats monitor so that I can monitor my condition. I asked the doctor at what point I should panic and he said if the sats are at 84% or less for a full day. At that point they had been in the low 80s for quite a while, but on steroids they are staying at 94%, but while I am on steroids I won't know how effective my current antigen avoidance strategy is.

One of our current cat-caught juvenile woodies has lost her tail, and we think she is also blind in one eye...maybe that contributed towards her being caught.

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

Hi Cynthia,

I have some new concerns about the woody. The poops have been very watery the last few days (normal looking before), and I am also not so sure he is eating as much as before. I stopped the antibiotics as he has been on them for over a week and was wondering if perhaps they are the cause of the diarrhoea? We had been giving a probiotic with the medication, but there just seems to be something else not right with the bird and we are not sure what exactly is going on. We are going to have to hand-feed him tonight to make sure he has eaten and monitor food intake a lot closer over the next few days to see if there is any change. Is there anything else I should be doing/or giving? He is still indoors in the warmth and appears alert enough.

Thanks,

Lindi


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## Lovebirds

Rooster2312 said:


> Hi Cynthia,
> 
> I have some new concerns about the woody. The poops have been very watery the last few days (normal looking before), and I am also not so sure he is eating as much as before. I stopped the antibiotics as he has been on them for over a week and was wondering if perhaps they are the cause of the diarrhoea? We had been giving a probiotic with the medication, but there just seems to be something else not right with the bird and we are not sure what exactly is going on. We are going to have to hand-feed him tonight to make sure he has eaten and monitor food intake a lot closer over the next few days to see if there is any change. Is there anything else I should be doing/or giving? He is still indoors in the warmth and appears alert enough.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Lindi


You were giving probiotics AND antibiotics at the same time? No expert here, but I believe that the two would contradict each other, so if that's what you did, it's possible that the antibiotics didn't do what they were supposed to do.


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

He may have had something wrong with him which made him vulnerable to the cat attack. You could treat for canker and worms, but that wouldn't explain his rapid breathing andthe eye...I would take him back to the vet..they can check for canker and worms quickly with a microscope and take it forwardfrom there.

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

He doesn't appear to have any breathing issues of concern at present. I think he was just stressed when I approached the other day. We have just seen to the bird and it was discovered by my sister that he HAS eaten a little so we didn't have to hand-feed tonight. I've been at work all day, so I haven't been able to judge how much he has eaten, but she assures me that the 'tasty' peas and seeds have all dissapeared and it was just the usual lentils etc. that were left scattered. The poops look a little firmer, but the urates are rather yellow in colour. I have a day off work tomorrow, so I will be able to monitor the bird more closely. 

Thanks,

Lindi


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## Rooster2312

The wood pigeon in my care is producing some rather alarming poops (I've also posted in the 'what do poops really mean? discussion thread) and I am wondering what yellow urates signifies? He remains fluffed and sits with his left wing lower than the right although having checked both wings, they appear to be ok. I really don't know what is going on with the bird but am at least encouraged that it is still keen to eat and drink on it's own. I have been placing small piles of seed throughout the day and he seems to be polishing off most of it. I am wondering if I should perhaps start antibiotics again? Since the vet practice that my sister works at is charity run, she informs me that they will not be able to do any more for the bird in terms of taking feacal samples etc. due to the cost. They have already performed surgery on the bird initially to close the wounds inflicted by the cat. 

Here is a photo of the bird taken yesterday. I have also uploaded a photo of the poop in the general discussion thread as above.

Lindi


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## John_D

Ah, answered in the other thread not realizing it's the same woody.

John


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## Rooster2312

Hi all,

Sorry for the lack of updates lately. I have been working nightshifts and my body clock is all crazy again hence I am posting after 1am UK time! 

I'm pleased to report that my woody is still with me nearly 3 weeks on now since I received him. He does still unfortunately have yellow urates and was shockingly thin when we last picked him up a few days ago. Despite this, he is eating a lot better and appears to be much brighter and alert since the last time I posted. He is pooping lots and apart from the yellow urates, the poops are a reasonably healthy looking green (slightly pale) and of normal firmness. His eye looks normal again and I received a cracking wingslap yesterday when I cleaned the cage out. Despite his problems, I am amazed at how strong this bird is...definitely a fighter!

I remain worried though about the yellow poop and am concerned that the bird is going to go through a slow decline with liver damage even though he is bright at present. We were wondering if perhaps the hepatic function has been affected by the traumatic injuries received plus the surgery afterwards to close the wounds. Is there perhaps some internal tissue breakdown going on/or have been, with release of toxins etc.? If so, would the damage be permanent with no chance of recovery, or could liver function improve again?

I haven't handled the bird for a couple of days to avoid stressing it, but plan to examine him again tomorrow to further assess his weight. Is there anything that I can give food wise to boost his weight?

Lindi


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## Feefo

Hi Lindi,

I am sorry that his poops haven't improved, that together with the weigh loss is very worrying. 

You could give him Milk Thistle for the liver...I will do a bit of research tonight on homeopathic remedies that might help.

I don't know how the liver would react to these foods, but try giving him crumbled fat balls, chopped peanuts, safflower seeds, hemp and maize .

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

Hi Cynthia,

Thanks for the info about Milk Thistle. I'd like to give this a try when I am able to get some. I am working again over the weekend but will try to get some on Monday. I have no idea what this looks like. What form does it come in? Capsules? Is it just health food shops that would stock this? Sorry for all the questions 

I have been giving him some fatty seeds such as the ones you mentioned but hadn't thought about the fat balls. I tried him tonight with some defrosted garden peas and he loved them..scoffed in no time! He doesn't like the hard peas in the broth mix and is a bit fussy with other grains in this mix. He always eats the sunflower seeds, chopped peanuts, hemp seed etc. I have noticed that woodies do not eat orange lentils as they are always left when I put out broth mix for them. Since the abnormal poop started, we have been giving him vitamins every few days. 

We had another look at him this evening and we are pretty certain that he has gained a little weight since last time. He was a little more plumped out rather than the hollow chest that was noticed before. We really need to weigh him but don't have suitable scales at present. We also noticed extensive new feather growth at the base of his tail which had previously been pretty much plucked bare. His wounds look fine with no discolouration of skin or signs of infection.

Lindi


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## amyable

Hi Lindi,

I bought some Milk Thistle tincture that can be put in drinking water. It's from Boots, their own make.
I haven't used it yet on birds so can't offer any comment on it's suitability but I did see some in a health food shop aswell.

Janet


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## Rooster2312

Thanks Janet, I had wondered if I could get the milk thistle from a chemists. You have also reminded me of the question I meant to ask in the first place..what dose would I give?

Thanks again,

Lindi


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## amyable

Hi Lindi,

Now there's my problem, I don't do mathematical calculations well !!

The instructions are geared to human consumption, and that is to take 1-2mls in a glass of water, three times a day.
Dose equivalent to 0.6-1.2grms of dried herb. This one is pure cold processed tincture, with no additives, suitable for vegans.

I don't know if a solid form would be more effective if there is one, purely for the reason you don't know how much a bird would actually drink.

I don't know if Cynthia has used it before and would be better able to advise. I'll try to look into it a bit more tomorrow though.

I'm pleased the bird looks as if he's put on a bit of weight. 

Janet


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## Pidgey

You might try Metronidazole (Flagyl)--it's good for liver infections if they're susceptible. I'd probably go with a Baytril/Flagyl combo.

Pidgey


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## Feefo

I haven't used Milk Thistle myself, but I have read about it on this forum.

Another calculation for Pidgey?

Cynthia


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## Rooster2312

I bought Milk Thistle yesterday, but sadly it is too late to use it. He took a very sudden turn for the worse last night and is not expected to make it through another night.

I went to bed late last night and there appeared to be no significant change with the bird on checking him before lights went out. I was then awoken with the sound of flapping in the cage about 01.45. Thinking that the bird had just become disorientated and fallen from his box and branch, I switched on the light to discover his respiratory rate had increased and was breathing noisily with an open beak. I knew this is not a good sign and removed the 'perching' boxes and branch as he was unsteady on his legs and kept falling off them with his wings awkwardly outstretched. I made the cage as comfortable as I could with padding and switched off the light knowing that there was little more I could do as my presence was just making the bird more stressed. I found it difficult to sleep knowing that I was going to fing him dead in the morning. To my surprise, I found that he was still alive in the morning, a little more settled on a warm cushion, but still looking very sick. I asked my sister if she could take him to the vet where she works and have him put to sleep if it was agreed by the vet that this was in the bird's best interest. I hadn't expected to see the bird this evening, but she called before she left work to say that the bird was still alive and no better or no worse and that the vet had given him a baytril injection and examined his chest (clear air sacs) while being keen to see how he responds to treatment. I was left with the difficult decision whether to take him home again with me, or have him euathanised. We agreed that we would take him home for the night and I am now regretting that decision. He is getting weaker and weaker and is stumbling with wings outstretched for balance and still in respiratory distress. He is really thin and has stopped eating and I know it is only a matter of time before he finally loses his fight to live. I wish I had spared him of his pain which I can only assume is liver failure which has progressed to total organ failure.

Lindi


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## Lovebirds

Oh Lindi, I'm so sorry to hear this. We can only make decisions based on what we know or feel at the moment. It doesn't do any good to say "would have", "could have"...........most likely, if you had put him to sleep, you would have wondered for a few days if MAYBE he would have made it if you gave him a chance. You did what you felt was the right thing and no one would expect you to do anything any different. Just be comforted in the fact that he's warm, and safe and is being given the best care possible until the end comes, if that's what happens. He could have passed in much worse circumstances.


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## amyable

Hi Lindi,

I am feeling for you. I too had a lovely pigeon who lost her fight for life two weeks ago with respiratory problems. What was causing it in the end was complex making the choice of treatment a matter of guess work, but the time watching her deteriorating was heart wrenching.
I know you think you shouldn't have let him carry on but then if the vet thought he might respond to treatment, you had to give him the chance or you might always have wondered ' what if'.
Bless him right now, and I pray that nature will do the right thing for him.

He had a fighting chance with you caring for him, I'm so sorry you're going through this with him, but at least he has you with him now.

Will be thinking of you tonight.

Janet


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## Rooster2312

Thank you Renee for your kind words. They mean a lot to me. I am a bit of a mess just now and crying as it is time for me to go to bed again and it is breaking my heart seeing him the way he is in the cage just now. I've just made another warm heat pad for him and I pray that he just goes quickly now. I really wish I had left him at the vets.

Lindi

Thank you Janet. Our posts just crossed.


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## Feefo

I am so sorry Lindi, I have been in the same situation and it is heartbreaking.

But I have had three pigeons put to sleep on veterinary advice on the day I found them and I regret that. On the minus side there have also been two pigeons that in retrospect I wished that I had let go , they were both woodies.

I think that you made the right decision because it was made with love. But it is such a difficult decison to make, specially with sick woodies.

Wood pigeons are fragile, mentally and physically. I know that they are a very successful species, but the sick rescues that have been through my hands have led me to believe that they have a very weak immune system, specially the juveniles. Even some that have made a recovery with care have succumbed to some other fatal ailment a year or so later. But we have others, like Wedgewood and Dagwood that have survived bad injuries and kept healthy.

A few weeks ago my vet refered a catted juvenile woodie to me. He survived, but then I realised that one eye was milky and blind so I kept him. I was about to send him down to Sussex as a companion for Taralotti's pigeon March when I inspected him very carefully with my glasses on and saw a tiny lesion on his beak, it is growing and I suspect that it is pigeon pox. I have also just been reading the FDW Harper book which says that the main cause of cloudiness, cataract and blindness is Salmonella infection so there could be that too...thank goodness March has not been compromised by this although I have to worry about the three birds that shared the doviary with him.

Wildcare puts wood pigeons with pigeon pox to sleep because the prognosis is so bad for them and the three woodies with pox on this forum died despite all efforts. But I can't let him go without fighting all the way, so he is receiving homeopathic treatment and I am going to try to get my vet to prescribe aciclovir for him.

Futher down the line I *may *regret my decison but if I give up now I know that I will *always* wonder and regret...

Cynthia


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## TAWhatley

Lindi, I, too, know exactly how you are feeling and what you are going through. Bless you for giving this pigeon a chance even at the expense of your emotional well being. I know how very difficult it is to watch our little patients go through their final minutes or hours. Sending you BIG hugs!

Terry


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## Birdmom4ever

I'm so sorry it's turned out this way, Lindi. I know from experience how difficult it is to do everything you possibly can and the bird still doesn't make it. And it's impossible to stay detached when they are in your care--your heart just goes out to them and that makes the end all the more wrenching. Sending a big hug your way.

-Cathy


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## Rooster2312

Thank you so very much everyone for your kind words, understanding support and hugs. I really appreciate them!

My woody quietly held out all night but finally passed away just after 7am this morning before I was about to leave for work. I was glad that I was with him in the end and was able to stroke his little head and comfort him during his final breaths. He looked so much more peaceful than last night and had his wings together in a normal sleeping position on a cushion covered with a warm 'vet bed' blanket. Just after he died, I opened the window above his cage to release his spirit into the sky and I felt happier knowing that his suffering was over.

Thanks again for your compassion and understanding.

Lindi


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## amyable

Lindi, I am so sorry, but also relieved for the little bird. So glad you were with him too. 

Fly high now little one, no more suffering.

Take care,

Janet


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## Feefo

> Just after he died, I opened the window above his cage to release his spirit into the sky and I felt happier knowing that his suffering was over.


That was a beautiful thing to do for him, Lindi.

Cynthia


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## corvid

Lindi, i just finished reading the post, I will not repeat what everybody already said, so i m just sending You a lots of hugs.

Nell


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