# I need info on feeding 3 day old pigeon



## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

I raise a few pigeons, today a mother refused her hatchlings and one died, the second is weak and very young, approx. 3-5 days.
I read online about mixing honey or sugar with baby food or a little bread (to tide me over until I can locate baby pigeon food) along with water and the boiled yoke from an egg. I combined the ingredients, cut the end off a 1 cc medical suringe (spelling?) then heated contents in a small plastic cup by placing it in a pan of hot water.... it was only warn, not hot.... I do not have a feeding tube.... however... i opened babies mouth and inserted this thing pushing small amounts into the back of its throat. It seems to be swallowing but I am afraid of doing more harm than good. The feeder tube would be really helpful but none are avialable where I am located. I have ordered one but 2-3 days wait until delivery. Therefore... I have no time to waste and much provide nourishment to this little guy before then.,
Please, if any of you have experience in feeding tiny baby pigeons, I would appreciate your help. I am pretty good at instructions and don't mind the effort.
Also, I am trying to keep it warm without cooking it.... I have a heating pad and of course... it's either too hot or not hot enough.... ugghhh
D
D


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

debsart4941 said:


> I raise a few pigeons, today a mother refused her hatchlings and one died, the second is weak and very young, approx. 3-5 days.
> I read online about mixing honey or sugar with baby food or a little bread (to tide me over until I can locate baby pigeon food) along with water and the boiled yoke from an egg. I combined the ingredients, cut the end off a 1 cc medical suringe (spelling?) then heated contents in a small plastic cup by placing it in a pan of hot water.... it was only warn, not hot.... I do not have a feeding tube.... however... i opened babies mouth and inserted this thing pushing small amounts into the back of its throat. It seems to be swallowing but I am afraid of doing more harm than good. The feeder tube would be really helpful but none are avialable where I am located. I have ordered one but 2-3 days wait until delivery. Therefore... I have no time to waste and much provide nourishment to this little guy before then.,
> Please, if any of you have experience in feeding tiny baby pigeons, I would appreciate your help. I am pretty good at instructions and don't mind the effort.
> Also, I am trying to keep it warm without cooking it.... I have a heating pad and of course... it's either too hot or not hot enough.... ugghhh
> ...


http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f25/various-methods-to-feed-young-squabs-9682.html you can place a towel under the baby and roll a sock around him and put the container that he is in on the heating pad on low and then a towel covering the top of the container.
here is a link with info


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

Have you hand fed a baby pigeon yourself? I understand there is an area inside thier mouth that opends into thier lungs... I am afraid I'll hit the wrong spot or it'll choke as result of me doing something wrong.

Does a mother pigeon allow baby to eat from inside her mouth or does she insert her mouth into babies?
D


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

debsart4941 said:


> Have you hand fed a baby pigeon yourself? I understand there is an area inside thier mouth that opends into thier lungs... I am afraid I'll hit the wrong spot or it'll choke as result of me doing something wrong.
> 
> Does a mother pigeon allow baby to eat from inside her mouth or does she insert her mouth into babies?
> D


I have but the baby had a health prob and did not make it..
the parent birds let the baby eat from inside the beak and regurgitate the food to the baby. here is one way of feeding if the baby will eat this way may be easier, may take a few times for them to get the hang of it here is a pic of a dove being fed.http://feeding[/IMG

here is a link to where the pic came from about feeding diamond dove babies, which is basically the same, have to scroll down to get to the part of feeding.
[url]http://www.diamonddove.info/bird05_Raising.htm[/url]


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

I have tried making a larger syringe with the plastic on the end, I've used the smaller with the direct method but without the tube.... by tomarrow I will have some kind of a tube to hold me over.... I will try this method too.... I don't know if she'll be able to work with a spoon but I am willing to try anything. 
She'll get really tired and sleep... just about the time I believe she's going to die... then she seems to get a spurt of energy and is moving all about. A little while ago I went to check on her... and she was GONE.... seemed she had wiggled out of the little nest like bowl lined with tissue and wrapped with a fleece blanket... I found her fast asleep snuggled up in the blanket....Needless to say... I paniced but she seemed fine and I gave her a bit more nourishment and she's asleep again.
How much should I give a tiny baby like this? I am using a 1cc syringe and it is a lot in comparrison to her.... she is only about 1/3 to 1/2 the size of my hand..... I would guess about 3 ounces or so. "tiny"
The larger gadget with the plastic baggie on the end cut to allow her little beak inside didn't work as well as the smaller syringe directly into her mouth. The larger ended up being very messy and she seemed to have more difficulty swallowing.
I will do my best to find that baby pigeon food in the morning..... did the misc. items I listed sound OK for now to you?
Thank you SO much for taking your time to help... I appreciate you more than you know.
D


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

debsart4941 said:


> I have tried making a larger syringe with the plastic on the end, I've used the smaller with the direct method but without the tube.... by tomarrow I will have some kind of a tube to hold me over.... I will try this method too.... I don't know if she'll be able to work with a spoon but I am willing to try anything.
> She'll get really tired and sleep... just about the time I believe she's going to die... then she seems to get a spurt of energy and is moving all about. A little while ago I went to check on her... and she was GONE.... seemed she had wiggled out of the little nest like bowl lined with tissue and wrapped with a fleece blanket... I found her fast asleep snuggled up in the blanket....Needless to say... I paniced but she seemed fine and I gave her a bit more nourishment and she's asleep again.
> How much should I give a tiny baby like this? I am using a 1cc syringe and it is a lot in comparrison to her.... she is only about 1/3 to 1/2 the size of my hand..... I would guess about 3 ounces or so. "tiny"
> The larger gadget with the plastic baggie on the end cut to allow her little beak inside didn't work as well as the smaller syringe directly into her mouth. The larger ended up being very messy and she seemed to have more difficulty swallowing.
> ...


feed untill the crop is full and then only feed when it has gone down. here is a link to day to day development and in the pics you can see the crop looks like a little ballon in the front, those are full crops.http://www.speedpigeon.com/baby_racing_pigeon.htm


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Hi Debsart .. 

You could use human baby cereal in place of the Kaytee Exact for now. For one as young as yours, I would also add a bit of meat based human baby food (chicken, turkey, or beef) for a bit of added protein if you are using human baby cereal. Once you get the actual hand feeding product, it will have the needed nutrition.

As a guess 1/2 to 3/4 cc/ml is probably going to fill this little one up. You can judge by how plump the crop gets. Also look on top of the back (shoulder area). There are two little "bumps" there that will also puff up when the baby is full. The babies put their beaks inside the beak of a parent bird, and the parent regurgitates crop milk which the baby sucks up.

You're doing a great job, so hang in there, and please keep us posted.

Terry


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

This is how I fed my 7 day old baby.











But when I had 2 day olds, I used an eye dropper, way to the back of their throat. I used pigeon formula, but as suggested, that could be substituted with baby cereal until you can get the formula. I found the eye dropper to be easier than the syringe for putting the food into the babies beak. Longer and thinner. I could get to the back of the throat much better.


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

Well... today is a tuff day.... I've been doing my best with "Squeekers".....seems she/he is not well today.
The combined water, honey, tiny bit of bread and hard boil egg yoke as a feed worked great... she was eating often... pushy at that.... but... I added some baby formula, non dairey as recommended by someone and ugggghhhh....(not baby cereal or baby food...but a liquid baby formula and I believe it was either too rich or didn't break down well in her crop or something.... it seemed to harden inside and she looked as though she felt terrible... she wasn't able to get all of it thru her) she became really sick. Perhaps some kind or non-tolerance to the new ingredient or perhaps she would have been sick anyway..... but last night I thought for sure she would die.
Then, this morning I finally found a tiny little piece of IV line.... made a feeding tube and gave her a bit of honey and water to rehydrite her..... I had located that Kaytee Exact forumual in a near by town but due to yesterday being a holiday.... the store didn't open until today.
I hurried there and returned a little while ago.... with the "right stuff". The problem being now, Squeekers is really weak and sick. I doubt she'll make it.... but... she has nourishment in her crop and with hope... she'll either pull through or go to sleep and not awake so she doin't have to feel so bad. 
These tiny little creatures are so fragile.
I regret not being able to provide the right formula stuff from the beginning..... however.... this large bag of furmula will be placed in my freeze to await the next needy baby if she does expire.....
I question what happened..... from a strong, healthy and hungry baby to weak and sickly......

I read where any milk product is not good for these babies.... however... this formula I used was a non-milk soy product....
I will always think the problem origionated with my feeding that formula.... however.....it may not be the culprit at all.

I love all these little babies.... I have quail, doves, pigeons, bird dogs, cats and horses.... I've spent many hours working with various ones that have had illness over the years.... and.... some times it works out.... some times it doesn't..... just the same.... it's all well worth the time spent.

I would like to know also... why momma bird decided to stop caring for the babies.... perhaps there was more here that she understood that I never will.

Thank you all... SO VERY MUCH.... for giving me such good help and suggestions and links to find info. It is wonderful to have people that know where to get this information and/or products.... when otherwise I wouldn't have had a clue.

We're not finished yet... Squeekers is still breathing.... perhaps sleeping... and who knows.... she may just wake up hungry like babies do!
I'll keep you posted.
Again, my sincerest thank you,

Debra J Hollingsworth


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

change of diet can upset the digestion, I think you can stop the honey. to get the crop moving some use baby apple sauce and also apple cider vinegar mixed with water.I think if you know how to use the feeding tube he may make it, but he needs to get that cereal out first. is he pooping?


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

*baby pigeon very ill*

Baby is pooping... but mostly when I pick him up and gently message the crop... that seems to stimulate him....perhaps just the movement... but he now laying very still... breathing... eyes closed... and that crop is still not going down in size very well.

I was wondering... is it possible to remove material using that feeding tube and syringe? I can insert it easily.... and... will do anything needed.
D


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

How much apple sider vinegar to water.... what ration?

I have called to town to have someone bring apple sauce... I already have the vinegar... therefore, if it will work... I will give the little guy some... only thing is there is so much stuff in that crop... it can't take too much more.
He did eleminate pretty good a little while ago.... perhaps time will just fix things... then again... I am really thinking that time is of the essence.... I worry about some type of infection, spoiled food and who knows what else....
D


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

debsart4941 said:


> Baby is pooping... but mostly when I pick him up and gently message the crop... that seems to stimulate him....perhaps just the movement... but he now laying very still... breathing... eyes closed... and that crop is still not going down in size very well.
> 
> I was wondering... is it possible to remove material using that feeding tube and syringe? I can insert it easily.... and... will do anything needed.
> D


I'm sorry you and the baby are having troubles. It is fairly difficult to hand-raise a baby, even for those of us that are experience, so please try not to feel too badly. You've done all you could so far. It sounds like he has an impacted crop. You can try giving him a little warm water and massaging the crop to try to break up the food stuck there. What happens is the food begins to sour and then the baby sickens. You can also try a drop of extra virgin olive oil down the throat or mixed with a little warm water. This can help the food break up as you massage it. Keep him warm as I'm sure you are. The warmth greatly aids in digesting, especially for babies. More people will be on with more advice so keep checking back. I wish you much luck and I hope the little guy pulls through. I know how very hard it is to watch him struggle.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

maryjane said:


> I'm sorry you and the baby are having troubles. It is fairly difficult to hand-raise a baby, even for those of us that are experience, so please try not to feel too badly. You've done all you could so far. It sounds like he has an impacted crop. You can try giving him a little warm water and massaging the crop to try to break up the food stuck there. What happens is the food begins to sour and then the baby sickens. You can also try a drop of extra virgin olive oil down the throat or mixed with a little warm water. This can help the food break up as you massage it. Keep him warm as I'm sure you are. The warmth greatly aids in digesting, especially for babies. More people will be on with more advice so keep checking back. I wish you much luck and I hope the little guy pulls through. I know how very hard it is to watch him struggle.



do as above, wait for the crop to go down, now you have his baby formula so when and if the crop goes down do the tube feeding as it seems you feel fine doing it that way.if he is pooping that is a good sign. keep him warm. the warm water for the crop to go down works like the apple sauce would, same principle, but I think apple sauce helps move things through, but if he has a big crop. best to do what your doing. massage and keep warm and wait for it to go down. wish I could be more help here, but you just have to wait for it to pass.


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

I have everything again, extra virgin olice oil, baby apple sauce, vinegar, and lots of determination.....
I will try a little of each....Thank you,
D


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Don't try to force the food out of the crop. That can be very dangerous for him. We do gentle massages to keep the food broken up. I do think it is a good sign that he is pooping. I wouldn't feed him anything more today but give him the applesauce and a bit of water. I know many members have had success with apple cider vinegar so you might try searching some of the threads to see what everyone says.

On the feeding - I am attaching a link to the Kaytee site where they have a video on hand feeding and some really good general information. For tomorrow's feeding, make the formula a little watery and just give it about 3 cc about every 2 hours. Keep check on the crop at all times to make sure it is going down after it feeds. http://kaytee.com/pet-birds/general-care/hand-feeding.htm

I hate to keep having you buy things  but, we have had really good success with adding plain yogurt (about 1/4 tsp) to the formula and also a product called Benebac which is a powder with beneficial bacteria. We use the yogurt at every feeding and then Benebac for the last feeding of the day.

We use a 5 cc syringe for little babies because it is easier to handle but most any size works well. Observe how they feed the baby cockatiels on the Kaytee site and that should help. We use a nipple at the end of our syringes that is about 1 1/2 inches in length but they have to be ordered so I would just do it the way they show. I'm also attaching a link to a video that our member Lovebirds did which is a very easy way to feed, plus instructions from our member Cyro. Also, some very good instructions from our member Maryjane.

This is Lovebirds (Renee): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJe6y8EYQRg

This is Cyro (Cynthia): http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/165797594SYYRWL

This is Maryjane's: http://picasaweb.google.com/awrats3333/BabyFeeding#

The very best of luck to you.


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## debsart4941 (Feb 15, 2009)

Baby died..... he/she gave it a heck of a fight... but hopefully she's flying with flocks now.
It is tuff watching them when they're so sick.... but I've learned a great deal from her.... if this happens again... I'll both be prepared and will know more of what to do, how, and when.

THis website is worth its weight in gold. I can't tell you how much I appreciate everyone helping me. I am not one to fret over things.. though I value life, be it large or small.

I've been enjoying these birds now for about two years... at present I have about two dozen adult birds and they're very nice, healthy birds.
I will allow them to fly in front of my bird dogs.... while I train the dog to stand perfectly still.... the pigeons are great because once used, they fly home. We neither kill these birds nor do we allow injury to come to them.

I enjoy watching them swoop over the barn and fly around... then come back to thier happy little home.
I would imagine, compared to some... their home is pretty nice.... thier bird house is about 12 X 24 X 8 feet tall on the short sides.... 12 feet in the center..... half the building is enclosed with one wall covered with boxes for nesting and shelter.... the other half has hardware cloth over each wall... a metal roof... many perches inside with a nice plat form at thier entrance. The only problem I have is some times rather than returning inside... they'll sit on top.... then after dark I am forced to climp a ladder atop the building.... pick each bird up one at a time and return it into thier flight door.

If you have any suggestions regarding... how to get the birds to come back inside... that too would be very helpful. Perhaps I should go elsewhere in the discussion site to ask this question.... rather than tie up space here in the "sick" bird area.... suggestions welcomed.
Again, my sincere thanks,
D


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

oh gee so sorry, you gave it a go, I don't look forward to having to raise one myself again, it is not easy. as far as the birds coming into the "barn?" usually they have a place to roost for thee night and will do that automatically. so are these feral birds or your birds?


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

I am so very sorry.


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## Tadlac_ASI (Feb 16, 2009)

*hope this post will help*

I will be sharing this hand feeding technique, which we can use in emergency cases, just like I said that my breeder didn’t feed their young. I also want to say to everyone that nothing will replace the natural way, and this is only an alternative that could help our feathered friends. 

On the day that the eggs are hatched, we should observe if the parents feed their babies properly. If after 8 hours and the baby pigeons’ crop is still empty, this is the time that we should hand feed them. 

The materials that we need are: 
1. 1 cc syringe 
2. butterfly needle 



















The alternative replacement for the crop milk from the parent pigeons is any baby food for human consumption; like Gerber or Cerelac. In some of the blogs that I have read, they use the formula for feeding baby parrots, but I think that food will be hard to find here in the Philippines. 

You just have to attach the butterfly needle to the syringe, and cut the needle part because only the tubing will be needed.










In my case, I used Cerelac. Prepare only a little amount of Cerelac that will be fed. Using the syringe with the tube attached, suck the prepared meal to 1 cc. Hold the baby pigeon in the head and open the beak, then gently insert the tube until it reaches the crop and push the plunger of the syringe gently. On the first day of feeding, I gave only 1.5cc of the prepared meal to each baby pigeon and gradually increase it day after day. On the eighth day, they are ready for pigeon pellets grounded in water to be fed to them. The 1 cc syringes can be replaced by a larger size that you prefer, and also change for larger rubber tubing to be attached again to the syringe. The rubber tubing used in dextrose in the I.V. lines of patients in the hospitals can be used. This is available in the medical suppliers as Blood Set. 










Please be reminded that the baby pigeons should always have a full crop, and this hand feeding procedure will be very hard for a working fancier since he has to check the babies from time to time. Since I am also working, what I did is I fed them early in the morning before I go to work, when I arrived at home at afternoon and in the evening. Roughly, they have to be fed approximately every 8 hours to avoid growth retardation. 

If you have other procedures about hand feeding techniques, please feel free to share so that we can improve this method.


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