# How many pigeons?



## i_like_birdz (May 25, 2010)

Hello all how many pigeons will I be able to hold in my loft? It's 12'(length) 9'(width) and 5'(high). It's 2sq ft per per pigeon??


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

And you are wondering how many birds? --With 6 different Breeds?--
How many Pairs of each Breed?
Are you going to have 6 different sections?


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## i_like_birdz (May 25, 2010)

sky tx said:


> And you are wondering how many birds? --With 6 different Breeds?--
> How many Pairs of each Breed?
> Are you going to have 6 different sections?


No this is my homer loft. I'm wondering how many homers I can have in this loft.


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Sorry Folks--Wrong Again.
I can only answer the questions as I read them??????
Let him get a pencil & paper and decide how many birds.
How many pairs he is going to have??
Room for that many nest boxes? Room for 1 & 1/2 perch for each bird?
"AND " the numbers increase--DOUBLE very fast.
O K flyers--set me straight.


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## jeff houghton (Jul 17, 2010)

One of my lofts is12ft in length,10ft in depth and about 10ft in height.It is 2 sections and i have 36 wall perches in one side and i have12 box perches in the other side.I have just added a 12ft by 3ft aviary to it so my birds can lord it in the daytime when im not around.

Although i could keep more in there i only keep in total 32 birds in that loft.I like to give them space, its no good for the birds to be overcrowded.I also have a 7ft by 5ft loft next to this one forming a L shape where i keep my young birds ,18 in total again plenty of room.

You have a decent size loft there but be careful not to overcrowd, it can be stressful for your pigeons.How many you got in mind?


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## i_like_birdz (May 25, 2010)

jeff houghton said:


> One of my lofts is12ft in length,10ft in depth and about 10ft in height.It is 2 sections and i have 36 wall perches in one side and i have12 box perches in the other side.I have just added a 12ft by 3ft aviary to it so my birds can lord it in the daytime when im not around.
> 
> Although i could keep more in there i only keep in total 32 birds in that loft.I like to give them space, its no good for the birds to be overcrowded.I also have a 7ft by 5ft loft next to this one forming a L shape where i keep my young birds ,18 in total again plenty of room.
> 
> You have a decent size loft there but be careful not to overcrowd, it can be stressful for your pigeons.How many you got in mind?


Ah ok thanks! I only have 11 in there so they sure have plenty plenty of room!! Well 12 right now have a baby in the nest. So I still have enough room to double at least the amount. Well I haven't really had a good hatch this year so that's keeping my numbers down sadly.


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## jeff houghton (Jul 17, 2010)

Yes you could easily get another 12 in there and still have room.It was a bad year for me breeding this year too.I paired up early last year on christmas eve and didnt see an egg until march/april.I believe the cold weather was to blame as it was the same in most lofts around.
Im sure you will soon have enough squeakers to worry about before you know it.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

i_like_birdz said:


> Hello all how many pigeons will I be able to hold in my loft? It's 12'(length) 9'(width) and 5'(high). It's 2sq ft per per pigeon??


9 x 12 = 108 divided by 2 = 54...54 pigeons.


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

Yup...54! 
Goes by "floor space"


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2010)

Msfreebird said:


> Yup...54!
> Goes by "floor space"


floor space is where its at for the most part ,landlords come second


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## ccccrnr (Jun 15, 2010)

*loft space / area*

So it makes no difference if a loft is 1ft high or 8ft high for volume per pigeon kept racing / breeding?

if 2ft^2/pigeon will work
Can I stack lofts on top of each other, such as a 3 story house style?

5ft Wide 8 ft Long by 6ft high divided every 2 feet with a screen floor
could this hold 120 racing homer pigeons = 2ft^2/pigeon (floor space) = 4ft^3/pigeon(cubic volume)??


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

ccccrnr said:


> So it makes no difference if a loft is 1ft high or 8ft high for volume per pigeon kept racing / breeding?
> 
> if 2ft^2/pigeon will work
> Can I stack lofts on top of each other, such as a 3 story house style?
> ...


Im not sure what your trying to say... but the loft would have to be high enough for roosts and tall enough for a person to walk in (if that is what one wants), 6 ft high is usually the highest it should be, because if higher it is hard to catch birds.. some do keep pigeons in rabbit hutch type things.. floor space is what is used as a rule of thumb..anything that can add more room for the birds the better..so unless your going with smaller calculations, then just have your own method if you don't like this one, all that matters is not to over crowd the birds.


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

ccccrnr said:


> So it makes no difference if a loft is 1ft high or 8ft high for volume per pigeon kept racing / breeding?
> 
> if 2ft^2/pigeon will work
> Can I stack lofts on top of each other, such as a 3 story house style?
> ...


5' x 8' = 40' divided x 2' = 20 pigeons no matter how you divide it it will still only hold 20 pigeons 24' x 10' = 240' divided x 2' = 120' you need a 10' x 24' loft to hold 120 racing pigeons


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## ccccrnr (Jun 15, 2010)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> 5' x 8' = 40' divided x 2' = 20 pigeons no matter how you divide it it will still only hold 20 pigeons 24' x 10' = 240' divided x 2' = 120' you need a 10' x 24' loft to hold 120 racing pigeons


sorry about the bad math.

So making separate levels or 'story's' to the loft doesn't count as new "floor space"??


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

A thumb rule which I have heard for caged birds is that the cage height should be at the least 3 times the height of the bird. It applies for finches, love birds, parrots, etc so should apply for pigeons also. If you are planning a loft in which pigeons are not let out for flying, roaming and exercising, I would not settle on a height and structure into which the care taker cannot enter.


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## rfboyer (Jun 18, 2009)

sreeshs said:


> If you are planning a loft in which pigeons are not let out for flying, roaming and exercising, I would not settle on a height and structure into which the care taker cannot enter.


I agree. It's hard enough work to keep a loft reasonably clean when it _is_ high enough to stand up in, especially if it's narrow and there's not a lot of room to turn around. 
And if the birds don't fly free they also need enough space between the loft and flypen to take some exercise, even if all they do is "helicopter."


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

I think we are back to the cubic foot vs square foot argument. In my _opinion_, which seems to be counter many folks, cubic feet is a better capacity measure. Based the design of lofts most "square feet per bird" statements seem to come from you are looking 6-12 cubic feet per birds (6 for birds with lots of fly time like race training or open loft; 12 feet for prisoners). Most folks exclude aviary space from the calculation which seems odd to me since the aviary is still part of the loft and judging from my birds, the most occupied space. 

Based on what is winning _in my area_ the norm seems to be closer to 8 cuft/bird. These are very open loft designs providing little more than a wind screen for the birds. I am not fond of them, but they are getting results. You may want to look at the local racing results and visit the winning lofts. That should help you decide how you want to measure space. 

For the record, I am running my prisoner loft (8x4 for cocks, 4x4 for hens, both sections open durning breeding, all with 6' ceiling) at 9 pair max. That comes out to 2.7 sqft/bird, but turns into 16.2 cuft/bird less aviary space (one in each section). If I was willing to go one box higher and raise my ceiling to 7' (which would work for me) I could easily add 6 nest boxes (would involve lowering existing nest boxes) and will have more than enough cubic capacity even though the square foot capacity would be a bit tight. 

It is all a matter of how you want to look at capacity.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

cubic or not.... this 2ft per square..is just a rule of thumb.. not an exact science.... my head hurts too much if I have to think "cubicly"... (I don't even think that is a word..lol..)


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

Cubic? What's that!  lol
My brain doesn't do cubic


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

Isn't it true that if you go by floor space and you have a 8' high loft then 2 square foot of floor space is 16 cubic feet of space which is twice what you say is needed.


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## Shadybug Lofts (Mar 13, 2010)

Msfreebird said:


> Cubic? What's that!  lol
> My brain doesn't do cubic



cubic is 1'x1'x1' a 1 foot square cube


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## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Shadybug Lofts said:


> cubic is 1'x1'x1' a 1 foot square cube


floor space is where it counts not air space lol cuz birds cant fly forever and perch space can only go so far... now its at feeding time thats where the floor space really comes into play thou


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## sreeshs (Aug 16, 2009)

LokotaLoft said:


> floor space is where it counts not air space lol cuz birds cant fly forever and perch space can only go so far... now its at feeding time thats where the floor space really comes into play thou


I agree, the count of birds is calculated based on floor space. Not only for pigeons but also for other species like finches, love birds, etc. Might have noted that aviary sites offer bird calculators based on the floor space not the volume.


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## ccccrnr (Jun 15, 2010)

Jaysen said:


> I think we are back to the cubic foot vs square foot argument. In my _opinion_, which seems to be counter many folks, cubic feet is a better capacity measure. Based the design of lofts most "square feet per bird" statements seem to come from you are looking 6-12 cubic feet per birds (6 for birds with lots of fly time like race training or open loft; 12 feet for prisoners). Most folks exclude aviary space from the calculation which seems odd to me since the aviary is still part of the loft and judging from my birds, the most occupied space.
> 
> Based on what is winning _in my area_ the norm seems to be closer to 8 cuft/bird. These are very open loft designs providing little more than a wind screen for the birds. I am not fond of them, but they are getting results. You may want to look at the local racing results and visit the winning lofts. That should help you decide how you want to measure space.


I just can't build some of those lofts. but i think is more the flyier than the loft.
i trying to build a larger Economy loft




> birds cant fly forever and perch space can only go so far... now its at feeding time thats where the floor space really comes into play thou


good point I'll keep food and water and space/area to access it in mind.


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## Jaysen (Jun 21, 2010)

In re-reading this thread something dawned on me. For breeder and "widowed" birds the feed is not really communal (this is racing) but is provided in the nest box. Since the birds spend most of their time "in the nest" this might account for some of the difference in view over cuft vs sqft. 

Just a thought.


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## ccccrnr (Jun 15, 2010)

what is the necessary area/space for each breed boxes?

does it matter if they are prisoners or loft flown?
also used in widow-hood vs breed&race?


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