# New pij....canker??? Fell???



## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Got in a little guy late yesterday found at the mall by a friend. I don't know if he fell from his nest (there was no nest around) or what. He was "walking on his wings", though feisty, but she was able to grab him and put him in a box for me. He has a few yellow hairs left (very few), peeps just a bit once in awhile, and when he tries to walk, he stumbles forward and spreads his wings out and just lays there. His legs seem fine, strong and no breaks, and didn't seem to cause him pain when I checked them. His breastbone is pretty prominent and he drank for a long time when I held him up to the water. I checked his throat as much as he would let me last night (very feisty little guy) and it looked clean and pink. 

I put him in a carrier with some seeds and water for the night and he was pecking at the seeds, more out of curiosity than anything else, it seemed. A couple made their way down his throat and I was encouraged, but this morning his crop was still half-empty; he got some seeds down but not enough. I am going to mix him up some Kaytee as soon as I post and see how that goes down, he must be hungry. I checked his throat again and there are two tiny smears of a white fluid, not yellow, and I thought canker is yellow, so I don't know what they could be. His eyes are bright and he is very alert, but breathing a bit heavily (could be stress from being in a house). 

Of course it's a holiday so no vets or feed stores are open, but I have on hand a few things:

Tricogo Spray for pigeon (which someone gave me), which "prevents and eliminates the formation of glairs in the throat". The website says _"It prevents and eliminates mucus from the throat. It also prevents and eliminates the formation of glairs (egg white) from the throat. Liquid for flock treatment. DOSAGE: 2 Tablespoons to a !/2 Gallon of water before and after race._" 

I also have, amazingly enough, Cephalexin on hand, for our dog. They are caplets of 500mg each, the plastic kind you can break open for the good stuff inside.  

I have amoxicillin left over from the cat, but it has been in the fridge for longer than ten days (more like two months) and says it's not good after ten days. 
*
Miraculously, I just found MedPet 4 in 1 powder*!!!!!!!! I knew I had some but thought it had been thrown out. It is for Canker, E. Coli, Paratyphoid, and Coccidiosis. Probably this would be best? I will wait to hear before I give him some.

I have Pro-Bios powder.

I also have vaccinations and worming tablets.

His poops are a bright green/watery substance with a little white, not solid at all. 

SO......now I need advice from our resident pigeon "doctors" on board, what should I do next? I am going to feed him a bit now. He is laying in the carrier with his head down, not pigeon-like at all.  I'll check back in a few minutes with you guys. Thanks!! I hope he can make it.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Maryjane, 


Best if you use an actual electrolyte solution instead of plain Water for any possibly dehydrated Pigeon.

You can buy 'Pedalite' at any grocery store, or, make your own useing a pinch of Salt and one of Sugar into a small Glass of Water. Adding POtassium would be great, if you or anyone you know has 'Salt Substitute'. Serve body temperatre...always for any younger Pigeon.


Are there any poops/urates since you got him?


Dehydration/starvation can make them very unstable.


If you are going to feed 'K-T', make sure it is 'soupy'...


Good luck..!


Phil
l v


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Thanks Phil....I did add salt and sugar to the water he drank, and some raw AVC, forgot to mention that.  I just mixed up some soupy Kaytee and got 2.0 ccs down him, which he fought pretty well. What amount should he be eating, do you know? He is not drinking water on his own right now (since this morning) when I dip his head in, though last night he did. I gave him 1.0 cc of water which he took well. Should I give him more? He is warm and resting now after all the hubbub.  I see more white stuff in his mouth than there was two hours ago (before I fed him the Kaytee), now on his tongue, inside beak, and in throat. Two hours ago there were only two small smears of it. Could he be vomiting up something white?? His poops are bright green and pretty much liquid, at least two hours ago. No new poops. Should I mix up some of the MedPet 4 in 1? Or just wait and see?


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Hi Maryjane, glad this little one landed in your care. After stabilizing w/IRS
and heat, I'd proceed w/small meals of Kaytee Exact and see how well it's
tolerated. Not seeing canker is good, but not the last word per se. It can
be festering in places your eye can't get to. Are there any out of ordinary
odors to the droppings or if you open the beak and smell the inside of the
mouth?

Perhaps the legs are a case of sprain/strain from falling out of the nest,
but so frequently they are pushed after the parent has determined that
they just won't make it as they are sick. I had quite a spat of birds this spring/summer who couldn't walk that was Paratyphoid related. After getting some nutrition into the baby, seems like the 4-in-1 is probably going to be your best bet....I'd go ahead and toss the Amoxicillin at this point. 

Good luck w/this baby and look forward to your up dates.

fp


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

maryjane said:


> Thanks Phil....I did add salt and sugar to the water he drank, and some raw AVC, forgot to mention that.  I just mixed up some soupy Kaytee and got 2.0 ccs down him, which he fought pretty well. What amount should he be eating, do you know? He is not drinking water on his own right now (since this morning) when I dip his head in, though last night he did. I gave him 1.0 cc of water which he took well. Should I give him more? He is warm and resting now after all the hubbub.  I see more white stuff in his mouth than there was two hours ago (before I fed him the Kaytee), now on his tongue, inside beak, and in throat. Two hours ago there were only two small smears of it. Could he be vomiting up something white?? His poops are bright green and pretty much liquid, at least two hours ago. No new poops. Should I mix up some of the MedPet 4 in 1? Or just wait and see?



Hi Maryjane, 



I myself have never seen 'white stuff' to have any experience with it.


If it is Candida, comeing 'up' that high, then possibly no food will even get through from his Crop on down.


Sounds like he is pooping Bile merely...


Hmmmm...how are you getting the KT into him?



If you have raw ACV...maybe mix up some with Water to the proportion of four Tablespoons of ACV to the Gallon, or, one Tablespoon to a Quart...and start getting that down into his Crop.

Keep him decidely 'warm' too...

If this is Candida, the ACV will help, but it may take two or three days or so...and meanwhile, too...it may be a day or two before anything you have fed him will start coming through...so, the conflict and problem then of feeding small very 'thin' meals ( mix the KT with the ACV-Water) while not overfilling a possibly slow to static Crop...


Thats about all I can think of...


No matter what it is, if he had starved, it may be a day or two or three before any poops start comeing through...and meanwhile the ACV will help act against undesrieable bacteria of a slow system...whether he has Candida or not.



Phil
l v


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

I'm very sorry to say this poor little guy did not make it. I did everything I could, with the ACV and Kaytee and he seemed to take it well, but when I checked on him again he had passed on.  Thanks for your help, I wish there was a happier ending for him.


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Sorry to hear the little guy didn't make it Maryjane, thanks for trying
to help.

fp


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Ohhhhhhhhhhh...sorry MJ...


Good try...


Phil
l v


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Darn it...I'm really sorry, MJ. We know you did all you could!

Love and Hugs to you!

Shi


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

So sorry, MJ! Thank you for trying with this little one.

Terry


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Maryjane, I am sorry. When you posted about him laying with his head down I felt things were pretty bad for this baby. If he fell from high up, there may have been internal injuries that he couldn't recover from.

Just curious, but were the white spots solid or liquid? Somewhere in my ancient memory, I remember someone, Terry maybe, posting about a disease that caused white areas in the mouth but I don't remember what it was.


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Thanks everyone....sometimes it just works out this way, I suppose, though it sucks.  The white spots seemed to be kind of a thickish liquid, if that makes sense; nothing solid-looking about them. Still don't know what they could have been, I think possibly he was vomiting up something, but I don't know what.


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