# Amount of food for adult pigeon?



## Guest (Nov 25, 2003)

I'm working with a feral pigeon who's got some sort of neurological problems, either a head injury or a virus (most likely PMV) and I'm having to tube feed him. I'm having trouble evaluating his crop for fullness to know how much to feed him.

Could someone tell me a good ballpark measure in cc's or whatever to kind of go by? He's about 245 grams, but he's full grown, so he's pretty emaciated actually.

He's trying awefully hard, bless his heart, to eat seed on his own, but I think he expends about as much energy trying as he takes in in food. He's all over the place trying to peck in the dish. So I don't think I want to feed him all day, as though he were a baby. The vet indicated that keeping his desire to eat high is good to keep him trying and getting better at it, but he needs some good basic nutrition in him that he can't provide for himself. What would be a good gauge to go by with that as well? One good feeding a day, two? He gets a dose of antibiotics twice a day, should I plan on doing a hearty feeding at both of those times or just one or what do you think?

Any help appreciated,
Stacey


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hi Stacey,

I think the bird should have at least two feedings, and make sure there is pro-biotics in the formula since he is on antibiotics.Since the bird is so emaciated, maybe it needs more, smaller feedings per day?

I have never had a bird with PMV, but my birds get at least two meals a day. Hopefully someone who has used the formula on a PMV bird will come along and have more information for you. Treesa


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

An adult pigeon should eat about 30 gms of seed a day.

Even the most badly affected of my PMV pigeons was managing to get some food down on her own although she must have tossed 90% over her shoulder.

Leave seed with him in a deep dish so that he can't miss individal grains. Also make sure that there are different shapes and sizes, some might be easier to pick up than others. He might pick up more that you expect. Weigh him daily at the same time, that will help you know how you are doing.

If you hand feed do it twice a day, feed until his crop is cushiony but not hard. There should be movement there. I found that it was easier to feed adult pigeons a paste of egg food rolled into little pellets. I would dip each pellet in water before feeding.

Make sure that the pigeon is drinking on his own. Water is very important!

Cynthia


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## kayzee123 (Nov 15, 2003)

Hi Stacey,

Your pigeon is definitely anoretic and will need food that is easily digestible with a high percentage of kcal/ml. According to my Avian Medicine book, you may need to feed the bird up to four times a day, giving approx 1 to 2 ml/feeding of a high kcal liquid diet. The chart doesn't talk about pigeons, but I'm quoting a dosage that lands between a parakeet and a cockatiel.

The book also recommended giving something like Ensure Plus--which provides the highest kcal/ml. Injured/sick bird needs a much higher caloric intake than normal. I've also given birds something called Nutri-cal which is a gooey supplement given to cats and dogs in need of a boost. A 10th of a teaspoon of that mixed with the Ensure Plus might help.

As for the amount the crop will take at this time, you will need to watch the bird's reaction. Start with small amounts to see how the bird responds. If you find fluid reguritating, release the bird and let it swallow/spit out the excess. Don't turn the bird upside down for that could stress the bird and cause it to aspirate the fluid. 

Try Ensure Plus in small quantities at first. The first day or so, you may need to observe the bird closely. If you find it gains weight after a few days, then you know you're on the right track.

Also, a pigeon will normally drink about .6 mls of water each drinking cycle. Dehydration should be watched for. If the bird is drinking--good. In fact, if he can drink by himself, he may find the liquid diet to his liking and be able to adjust his own intake. Just make sure the liquid is deep enough so that he can suck it up in the usual manner.

Remember this too, imagine if you had a head injury or an illness that made you feel all wonky and unstable, you might feel a bit nauseous as a result. I wonder if a bit of sweetened, lukewarm tea might appeal to him as well.

Keep us posted and Good Luck!


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## Guest (Nov 25, 2003)

Does anyone have any luck/experience tube-feeding an adult pigeon by oneself? I'm having to always have a person here to hold him while I do it. For a sick pigeon, he thrashes around a lot! Any ideas how I might be able to do it solo?

Thanks,
Stacey


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## kayzee123 (Nov 15, 2003)

I read one account of how a person wrapped their bird in a towel, like a mummy, with the head poking out and then placed the wrapped bird in a container that held it all in place. Something like a coffee can was used. That left the person's hands free...one to open the mouth and hold the head and the other to guide the syringe in.

The fingers holding the head (from the back) can feel for the bump of the tube in the bird's right side of the throat to make sure the tube is down the esophagus, not down the trachea. By entering the syringe on the bird's left side of mouth, pushing it across the tongue, and aiming it into the right side of gullet, that should keep the bird's beak open.

The hand controlling the head can then reach fingers down to the crop area to feel it's fullness.

Sounds like it could work. Good luck!


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## Guest (Nov 26, 2003)

That actually sounds promising! I've wrapped him in a cloth at times when he's particularly fiesty but then my husband holds him. I don't mean to sound ungrateful to my husband for his help, but I'm not sure he's doing a whole lot more than the coffee can might do.







Especially at that early morning feeding before work, or last night after he'd gone to bed forgetting we still had to feed Fred.

Especially the smaller coffee can, would be a nice tight fit and keep him upright, which is helpful for seeing into his throat and making sure the tip of the tube is going where it needs to. We're having to kind of stretch his neck up also, because he tends to want to scrunch his head down and this makes the distance between his crop and the top of his throat not that great and the formula becomes visible shortly after I begin injecting it into him. And I have to stop and let go to let him swallow.

Thanks, I'll try this this evening after Mark gets home and have him just standing by in case I need him this first solo time.

I'll report back tomorrow!
Stacey


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## Guest (Nov 27, 2003)

Well, that was a really good suggestion. I had a material that holds to itself when wrapped around him like that, almost like velcro. I stuck him up right into a plastic square kleenex box cover. It looks like a regular square kleenex box, oval hole in top and it's open on the bottom because it actually sits over a kleenex box, to jazz it up for the living room or whatever. Anyway, it's what I found handy and the the oval hole accommodated Fred's long tail! I put some batting inside the box, because I wanted Fred to be completely stable in there and he was.

I was still not able to keep his mouth open and get the syringe in there, although with a less fiesty pigeon that would be possible. This guy, for not being able to eat on his own, sure can put up a fuss about being force fed! My husband was more able to help hold his mouth open for me though with the pigeon stablized like this. He wasn't going no where!

I'm asking for directions in another post, on how to put up the pictures I took of the set up, in case it would be useful to anyone else.

Thanks again,
Stacey


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

When you tube feed a pigeon you have to stretch the neck out a bit. I am forwarding a photo of how Helen uses her thighs to secure a pigeon while giving it medicines by syringe into the crop. The same principle applies to tube feeding. But always remember that a pigeon doesn't have a diaphragm so if you hold it too tightly it can suffocate.

Cynthia


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

BTW, the amount of poops are a good way to tell whether a pigeon is eating or not!

Cynthia


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