# Very Very Urgent



## Pisciottano (Aug 20, 2005)

Hello everybody,
I'm in Montevideo. My great grand daughter Camila (8 years old) has just found a baby pigeon on the ground. Her grandmother, my daughter, has just 'phoned me and said she looked all over the place for a nest but could not find one. The baby has hardly any feathers, he is very lively and chirps all the time. We do n ot have aviary vets here. She did take him to and ordinary vet who told her to give him "polenta" mixed with water. Polenta is like corn crushed very fine. I doubt this is a good idea. I know there is plenty of information at the forum but we do not have here the products one can buy in the United States. For the time being the baby is kept warm but my daughter hasn´t dared give him even water. The vet said it would not live whatever we do. I'll be going over to her in a few minutes. Any idea what can one improvise when there are none of the adequate products. We have already told Camila that there is very little hope of saving him. Please help if you can. Gladys


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

I'm sure our rehabber members will be along soon to help!

I wonder if there is a cereal available there that could be given...

Just wanted to say that I hope the little one makes it! I am so sorry to hear this and Squeaks and I are sending all our best

LOVE along with HEALING and COMFORTING THOUGHTS!!

Shi & Squeaks


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## Lovebirds (Sep 6, 2002)

Pisciottano said:


> Hello everybody,
> I'm in Montevideo. My great grand daughter Camila (8 years old) has just found a baby pigeon on the ground. Her grandmother, my daughter, has just 'phoned me and said she looked all over the place for a nest but could not find one. The baby has hardly any feathers, he is very lively and chirps all the time. We do n ot have aviary vets here. She did take him to and ordinary vet who told her to give him "polenta" mixed with water. Polenta is like corn crushed very fine. I doubt this is a good idea. I know there is plenty of information at the forum but we do not have here the products one can buy in the United States. For the time being the baby is kept warm but my daughter hasn´t dared give him even water. The vet said it would not live whatever we do. I'll be going over to her in a few minutes. Any idea what can one improvise when there are none of the adequate products. We have already told Camila that there is very little hope of saving him. Please help if you can. Gladys



Gladys, as long as the baby isn't sick, there is no reason why this baby can't be saved. Everyone here does it ALL the time, so just get that notion out of your head and focus on saving this little guy.  I know you can do it!!
Call me dumb....... but I have no idea where Montevidoe is??? For right now, the polenta sounds like it would _ok_. Not the best diet long term, but it certainly won't hurt for a day or two. As far as giving the baby water, if the food is "wet" enough, you can get by without water to begin with. Any chance of posting a picture of this baby? I'm sure that others will be along shortly to help out. Let us know how it goes.......


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Can you get pelleted puppy chow there? That can be used as food, too, in a pinch. You would probably have to break it into smaller pieces and wet them before putting them in the beak one at a time. Surely you can get that in Uruguay.

Pidgey


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## Pisciottano (Aug 20, 2005)

Thanks Shi and Renee for your very prompt reply,
Montevideo is the capital of Uruguay in South America, situated between Argentine and Bresil. We will do our best for this little guy. Would be happy for any further advice. Thanks again,Gladys


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi Gladys,

Pigeon squabs are fed pigeon milk when they hatch and this is important because it contains the enzymes that help them digest the food and thrive. So it depends very much on how old it is. You might be able to get some digestive enzymes from a small animal vet. here we use Panzyme, which are pancreatic enzymes, I think they are derived from pigs.

It is important to keep it hydrated, even if initially it is only by giving it warm water with glucose or honey. And keep it warm!

Try to get some natural yoghurt...I know that it is available because we had it in Chile back in the sixties! If you give it 1 ml of that, then start feeding the polenta it could stand a chance.

Buena suerte!

Abrazos,

Cynthia


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## Dinky (Mar 18, 2007)

Hello Gladys,I hand reared a baby pigeon last year,from the age of around 5 days.Yours sounds older than that.I began by dropping slightly warm(room temperature)water with a small pinch of sugar and a very small pinch of salt disolved in it onto its beak with my finger.Next day I did the same thing with baby formula!From there I went on to something we have here called egg food,which is really meant as a food supplement for older birds I think. I,m sure the polenta would be OK.Probably best mixed with slightly warm water ,then put in a cup and rub the bird's beak in it until it feeds. Hope this is of some help- wish all the very best.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

The polenta will work. That's what I used 20 years ago before I knew about formula. You can also get some packages rice cereal for human babes and mix that in with it too.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Gladys, first off, thank your little granddaughter for saving this baby. Wow, you have pigeon stories now in both Paris and Montevideo!

I think the polenta will be fine but it needs to be thinned to a consistency of something like thin pancake batter. Like Cynthia said, try to get the plain yogurt and add that to the polenta. I know this sounds "icky" but if you don't have a syringe or nipple you can put some of the polenta mixture in your hand, form a fist and let the little one eat it from your hand. You can also sometimes take a plastic bag, cut a small slit in the bottom and let him eat from that. 

The soaked cat/dog food pellets will work great too.

Just remember not to feed the baby too much - just until its little crop is soft and plump. It will probably need to be fed about every 2 - 3 hours.

Good luck with the baby.


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## Pisciottano (Aug 20, 2005)

I have just written a long message to you all but for some reason I cannot understand I was told that I was nor logged in although I WAS logged in and my name appeared on the right top corner of the page as it should. grrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

I don't know how to tell you this. I have been to my daughter's but it is not a baby pigeon they found. It is an adorable teeny weeny little bird which fits on the first phalange of my thumb. It doesn' have a single feather but he is full of life, moving his legs and wings incessantly. We discovered he had a lump on one side of his neck so back we went to the Vet who said it was an abscess. We had a job to get him to treat him and he finally extracted some matter with a syringe and the lump disappeared. 

I cannot thank you enough for all your counsel and help and I suppose that most of it will fit the case, the warm water with a pinch of salt and sugar, the yogurt, the polenta, the baby cereals and later on perhaps (if there is a later on) the puppy chow pellets? I do hope I haven´t made you work for nothing. I left the little one with my daughter, Camila (her grandchild) lives close to her and OF COURSE it is HER pajarito (little bird), but I will go back there in the morning.We were able to get all that is needed and I'm hoping for the best although he is so tiny that it would seem to me a miracle if he lives.

It is now 11 pm over here, so I will call it a day. Mamy many thnaks again to all of you and a special abrazo for Cynthia. Gladys


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Pisciottano,



Different Bird Species' Babys will have quite differing feeding procedures, and, differing kinds of foods.


What is tolerable for a Baby Pigeon, will not be tolerable for a Baby Song Bird, Fructivore or Insectivore.


All Altritial ( born helpless and with no Feathers ) Bird-Babys do need to be kept definitely and constantly "Warm", and this means for their Body to be constantly at about your own Body Temperature and no less...this is very important for them to Live.


Can you post some images of this Baby for us to see him?


Best wishes!


Phil
Las Vegas


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Be real sure that the little lump on the neck wasn't/isn't food in the crop of a little song bird. Their "crops" are on the right side of their necks and you can actually see food in there for a few seconds to a minute or two as it passes through to the rest of the digestive system. A picture of the little one would be really helpful. Since we know that this is not a pigeon, a safe diet for right now is small pieces of high quality puppy or kitten kibble that has been soaked until soft and pieces of the yolk of a hard boiled egg. 

Please see this thread for some very helpful/useful information about nutrition for this little bird: http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=15237

Please keep us posted and good luck with this little one!

Terry


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## Pisciottano (Aug 20, 2005)

Hello to you all,

I am sorry to tell you that the little one died a few minutes ago. It is 10 am here and my daughter has just 'phoned to tell me he had survived the night and seemed allright early this morning but the place where the vet had pricked the supposed abscess was inflamed with what appeared to her to be a little vein pushing out. Obviously this Vet doesn´t know anything about birds and he took for an abscess what was probably his crop as it was placed on the right side of the neck. My daughter is upset and so is Camila (my great grandaughter) ans so am I since we realize now that there was no abscess and perhaps if we hadn't gone to the vet the second time the little one would still be with us. Well, at least he didn't die in the street risking to be trodden or worse. He died in my gaughter's hand.

Thanks to him we have now found out that there are vets in Montevideo who take care of birds even if they are not very numerous and we have also learned that one can take a sick bird to the Veterinary Faculty
for advice. We are now better "armed" to help should the occasion arose again.
I have printed the links you have given me for future reference. Many thanks for your help. Gladys


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

I am so sorry the little bird didn't make it.
Many thanks to your daugher and grandaughter for helping the little baby.

Reti


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

Gladys...I am so sorry!

Sending love, hugs and comforting thoughts at this sad time to you all...

We all know that everyone did the best they could!

Shi


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Gladys, the important thing is that your family tried to save him. At best, a new baby songbird is always "iffy" to raise. Songbirds do differ from pigeons in that their crops are on the side of their necks and can be seen really well until feathers begin to cover it. You might mention to this vet about the crop location and see what they say. It could very well have been an abscess.


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

You did all you could, and most of the time it is best to have a vet try their hand. Baby birds, especially songbirds, are very difficult to hand-raise sometimes, even for experienced hands. As you said, the baby was able to pass away while warm and safe, and not out on the cold street. Thanks for trying and doing all you could.


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi Gladys, 



Well, yes...good try...


Infant Altratious Birds, Song Birds or others, can also shut down internally some time prior to conspicuous appearances of decline, or they can rapidly get into troubles from their digestive system having slowed or stopped from chill, and prior foods then fermenting or spoiling in them for not being processed in a timely way...to where in effect, one has already lost them, even though they can coast on a ways still appearing more or less normal.


They are terribly suseptible to chill, dehydration, bacteria in wrong food, yeasts, wrong food itself, and other delicate matters...and all in all are a very delicate business in every way.


They are little more than embryos who have become exteriorised from their priot shelter...embroys who are in a phase of developement outside the 'Shell'..which of course means they are Neonates and not 'embroys' but they remain very embryo-like none the less.


So as Maggie mentions, it is all rather 'iffy' usually, especially if the infant has already suffered some troubles before we get them.


Song Bird and most other Babys 'gape' ( chirp and open their Beak for a moment ) in asking to be fed, and, this is the opposite of Pigeon/Dove Infants, who 'peep' with a closed Beak to announce interest, and feed by inserting their Beak into the Throat of their parents.


Anyway, there is a lot to it...


Chill ( if the infant has been any length of time much less than our own body temperature, or less than about 100 - 103 degrees, so even a 90 degree day they will die of chill if not re-warmed in time ) and dehydration often occur before we get them, and ammending these is critical...and ammending the dehydration aspect with most Species is very tricky since one can not give them Liquids safely...

...and the moisture they need or will get, has to come from tiny bites of moisture-containing foods placed into their Beaks/Throat for them to swallow...nor may one feed them until they are thoroughly warmed again for some time, warm through and through, so once they have got into these troubles, it can be especially delicate and urgent, to bring them back 'up' as soon as possible, otherwise their systems shut down, and a late start might not save them...


Best wishes..!


Phil
l v


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I am so sorry, Gladys! 

Cynthia


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

I'm so sorry this little one didn't make it, Gladys. I get literally dozens and dozens of little bitty birds like sparrows each baby season, and I can tell you that it is wickedly difficult to raise them to the point where they are eating on their own. Many thanks to your family for doing their best for this little one. As Maggie posted, the lump could have been an abscess, but I wanted to be sure you knew about the crop of these little birds.

Terry


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## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

...their little Crops do not hold much either...and some Species even less...

Who knows, thirty, fourty, sixty feedings-a-day is not improbable...

In Nature, mom and dad spend ALL their time getting food, fly back, feed the Babys, fly off, get more food, cone back, feed the Babys...that is it...

When feeding, after some bites, you see that last bite go down their neck and sort of hang there at the base, and, slowly it sort of continues down...and if it does, then, it is safe to say 'one' more bite, and call 'em "FULL" for now...


Anyway, if one wants to get 'Grey Hairs', raise some truely infant Song Bird Babys..! Oh! You will get nothing else done, there will be lots of pacing and checking and fussing, and worries...and that is when everything goes really well...


Love, 


Phil
l v


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