# new born pigeons



## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

I have some pigeon eggs in my incubator and they are hatching today and I was wondering if it's possible for me to take care of them because I don't have any pigeons caring for them except me


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

PhaLee said:


> I have some pigeon eggs in my incubator and they are hatching today and I was wondering if it's possible for me to take care of them because I don't have any pigeons caring for them except me


It is possible to hand-rear baby pigeons, but it isn't easy. Here is a link with instructions. http://www.pigeonrescue.co.uk/caringforababypigeon.htm

This link is to a hand-rearing thread on this forum. http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f6/teaching-baby-to-eat-and-drink-45862.html?highlight=feeding+babies

Good luck.


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

ptras so the hand rearing food can be used to feed them even when they are a day old ad so on? thanks!

~Pha


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

PhaLee said:


> ptras so the hand rearing food can be used to feed them even when they are a day old ad so on? thanks!
> 
> ~Pha


Hand rearing formula can be used from day one.


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## blongboy (Nov 10, 2009)

it going to be hard but if you have alot of time your'll be fine


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

yea blong I know but i dont know if i have the time lol


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

PhaLee said:


> yea blong I know but i dont know if i have the time lol


Should have thought of that before you put the eggs in the incubator.


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

ptras, when the babies hatch how long should I wait to feed them?


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

PhaLee said:


> ptras, when the babies hatch how long should I wait to feed them?


I would start feeding asap, but you might want to request advice from someone with actual experience at hand-rearing. I just know what I have read.

Anyone with advice???


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

Okay thanks I'll try to get some advice on when to feed the babies


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## blongboy (Nov 10, 2009)

feed them this
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753607&lmdn=Bird

sometime just add a little bit more water. always keep them warm and keep their sack full ....the hard part is the first week. 

good luck keep us updated


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

PhaLee said:


> yea blong I know but i dont know if i have the time lol


Why would anybody purposely hatch living babies into the world, when they don't know anything about their care, and are not sure if they even have the time. How selfish and uncaring is that? These are lives that are now dependent on you for their survival, and you take it so lightly.


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

Well everything should go alright I got people to help me out too. I will have some time but when I dont have time I have others to care for them and this is why im on pigeon talk getting advice on how to care for them


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

blong thanks for showing me some food I can feed them and I'll go buy some









blongboy said:


> feed them this
> http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753607&lmdn=Bird
> 
> sometime just add a little bit more water. always keep them warm and keep their sack full ....the hard part is the first week.
> ...


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

PhaLee said:


> Well everything should go alright I got people to help me out too. I will have some time but when I dont have time I have others to care for them and this is why im on pigeon talk getting advice on how to care for them


Thats terrible, you should have known how to take care of them before you put them in the incubator not wait till they hatch and ask for help. I'm honestly sick and tired of people that just go get animals and then go on forums and ask for help without no research on the animal itself or how to take care of it.


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

First To Hatch said:


> Thats terrible, you should have known how to take care of them before you put them in the incubator not wait till they hatch and ask for help. I'm honestly sick and tired of people that just go get animals and then go on forums and ask for help without no research on the animal itself or how to take care of it.


I have been researching and been getting help on this site and they hatch in 2 more days but i put today so i can get help faster because i've been busy and also i just finished building a new loft, then i just realize that need to get info fast


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## tipllers rule (Aug 2, 2010)

Jay3 said:


> Why would anybody purposely hatch living babies into the world, when they don't know anything about their care, and are not sure if they even have the time. How selfish and uncaring is that? These are lives that are now dependent on you for their survival, and you take it so lightly.


chill its not selffish it just well nothing he just wants to get some real peoples addvice not what he reads on articles


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

tipllers rule said:


> chill its not selffish it just well nothing he just wants to get some real peoples addvice not what he reads on articles


It is selfish. Baby pigeons are not easy to raise from day one. He didn't learn and wasn't prepared ahead of time. Then he said that he may not have all that much time. And added LOL. Don't think it's funny. Where did the eggs come from anyway? Raising babies is not a job for someone who has not had experience with it.


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## First To Hatch (Jul 19, 2009)

PhaLee said:


> I have been researching and been getting help on this site and they hatch in 2 more days but i put today so i can get help faster because i've been busy and also i just finished building a new loft, then i just realize that need to get info fast


Well I sincerely apologize for my statement, but I think you should edit your post because others might get upset as well. 

Thanks
Shokri


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## blongboy (Nov 10, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> It is selfish. Baby pigeons are not easy to raise from day one. He didn't learn and wasn't prepared ahead of time. Then he said that he may not have all that much time. And added LOL. Don't think it's funny. Where did the eggs come from anyway? Raising babies is not a job for someone who has not had experience with it.


jay i understand what you mean ... raising baby is not easy at all... but it happen ..baby is here already ..so all we can do is guide and push him the right direction.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

The best advice I can give you Blong is locate some pumper pigeons FAST. What I am saying is find someone with pigeons on eggs that are going to hatch soon and see if you can slip these babies in there with them. Besides the constant feeding the parents do they keep the babies warm and nurture them. They "know" how to feed their babies without harming them and their "crop milk" has beneficial bacteria that will boost the squabs immune system. I wish you luck...so don't give up because the next 3 weeks you are going to be seriously busy playing "mommy" to those squeekers.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

jAxTecH said:


> The best advice I can give you Blong is locate some pumper pigeons FAST. What I am saying is find someone with pigeons on eggs that are going to hatch soon and see if you can slip these babies in there with them. Besides the constant feeding the parents do they keep the babies warm and nurture them. They "know" how to feed their babies without harming them and *their "crop milk" has beneficial bacteria that will boost the squabs immune system.* I wish you luck...so don't give up because the next 3 weeks you are going to be seriously busy playing "mommy" to those squeekers.



It isn't Blong with the babies. It's PhaLee. That's another good point. These babies will not get crop milk, so will not get as good a start as they would have with parents. That is an excellent idea though, about slipping these babies under other birds. That is the best suggestion that he/she is going to get.


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## blongboy (Nov 10, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> It isn't Blong with the babies. It's PhaLee. That's another good point. These babies will not get crop milk, so will not get as good a start as they would have with parents. That is an excellent idea though, about slipping these babies under other birds. That is the best suggestion that he/she is going to get.


true that would be a great idea. i tried hat before ..only work for me when slipped the baby in the night time tho.


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## rackerman (Jul 29, 2009)

*If you don't have time, why would you incubate them.......*


PhaLee said:


> yea blong I know but i dont know if i have the time lol


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## rackerman (Jul 29, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> It is selfish. Baby pigeons are not easy to raise from day one. He didn't learn and wasn't prepared ahead of time. Then he said that he may not have all that much time. And added LOL. Don't think it's funny. Where did the eggs come from anyway? Raising babies is not a job for someone who has not had experience with it.


I agree with Jay3 150%, it is selfish!!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

They may not even hatch..but if they do I would find a rehabber that can do it.. or reliquish them to a vet if someone there has experience in hand feeding dove/pigeons, they are unique in the way they eat and the pigeon milk they get so it is about the hardest baby to hand feed from hatchling..it gets a bit easier if one gets them when they are older.. it has been done, but it does not sound like your up for the job so yes it is confusing why you would bring two babies into the world only to put them in harms way because of your lack of experience and time.


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## JaxRacingLofts (Apr 11, 2010)

Jay3 said:


> It isn't Blong with the babies. It's PhaLee. .


My bad Blongboy..PhaLee if you can't find a club member with any late hatches or "oops" babies...try Craigslist..Post an ad "Urgent Pigeon on eggs Needed!!!" post it in the pet section and see if ya get any replies..otherwise your up shizz creek with these birds. But if your smart enough to incubate them then your probably smart enough to feed them. I doubt you'll repeat this again..but in the meantime you now have a "teachable moment" in Pigeons.
So what's your plan? What formula are going to feed your babies? who is going to feed them at 2 am and then again at 4 am? If you let them go more then 8 hrs without eating they could get sick from the stress..and if they get sick you have a whole new world of problems to overcome..I am not down on you I had some eggs I did not want to to toss either, but now you gotta man up and raise these "children" of yours. Because thats exactly what you have now..constantly going to be needing and wanting something. You can do it man. Stay strong and it will work out.


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## Marty29 (Aug 18, 2010)

Hello all

I'm a french fancier and just login on this forum.

About this subject the Dr Colin Walker ( http://www.auspigeonco.com.au/ ) have writen a nice thing. "Artificial Incubation and Hand Raising"

You can find a lot of nice articles on his site.



*ARTIFICIAL INCUBATION AND HAND-RAISING*

By Dr Colin Walker BSc, BVSc, MRCVS, MACVSc (Avian health)

With breeding about to start, we all know that sometimes things don’t proceed as smoothly as we might like. An abandoned egg or youngster can be a particularly frustrating experience for a fancier, particularly if it is from one of the more important pairs. For many of us, the only available option to try and save the youngster is to foster it under another pair. To have any real chance of success, however, there should be no more than 48 hours, and preferably 24 hours, difference in the reproductive cycle between the foster pair and donor egg or youngster. Of course, such a pair is not always available. This situation need not necessarily mean that the youngster will be lost.

In the past, if a foster pair was not available for an incubated egg or a young nestling, it was not considered practical to raise the chick independently. However, with the availability of relatively inexpensive incubators and nutritious artificial hand-raising diets, it really becomes the fancier’s choice as to whether or not he wants to save the youngster by taking over the role of egg incubation or rearing of the chick.

The situation is eased somewhat if the egg has not been incubated. If development has not started, the egg does not need to be kept warm to remain viable. Eggs can be stored for several days waiting for a foster pair to lay. Eggs should be stored in a cool, dry place with the pointed end up at approximately a 45?�q angle and turned at least twice daily (alternating left and right). Once the foster pair lays, the stored egg can be placed under them and development will commence.

If no foster pair is available, artificial incubation should be considered. A number of ‘hobby’ incubators are available (with readily available brands being Brinsea, Novital, Multiquip and Masalles) through a number of outlets. Prices vary depending on the amount of automation but it is possible for between AUD$500 and AUD$1000 to buy one that not only maintains the correct temperature and humidity but also turns the egg. The temperature and humidity parameters used for chickens work well in pigeons (and indeed most bird species). Temperatures of 37.2 – 37.5?�qC and humidity levels of 55 – 60% are suggested. Automatic turning devices will turn the egg up to 25 times per day. Incubation procedures for the bulk of the incubation period are relatively straightforward and rely only on regular turning and the maintenance of adequate temperature and humidity levels. This routine only changes 2 – 3 days before hatching when the egg should no longer be turned and the humidity is raised to 70 – 75% (either by increasing the exposed surface of water or by decreasing the ventilation in the incubator). Humidity is usually measured with a hygrometer. Incubators can sometimes be used as a useful stop-gap measure until a foster pair has been organized or alternatively their use can continue until hatching.

Once successful hatching has been achieved, if no foster is available to raise the chick, then both warmth and food must be provided artificially.

Heat can be provided by a converted incubator, a pet heating pad or a container (even a cardboard box is fine) with an incandescent bulb. If using a bulb, the heat can be altered by changing the height of the bulb above the chick, the wattage (strength) of the globe or using a thermostat. A temperature between 32?�qC and 37?�qC should be maintained. Newly hatched chicks do better at the higher end of the scale. Humidity is best supplied by providing a source of water near the heat source such as a small jar of water. Chicks that are too cold will become poorly responsive and feel cold to the touch, and when very cold start to display a reflex involving repeated opening of the beak. Hot youngsters also become poorly responsive and become a bright pink colour. Youngsters older than 7 days will also pant.

To feed the chick, an artificial beak needs to be created. This can easily be done by cutting off the needle attachment on the end of a syringe. Different syringe sizes are used as the chick grows. The regurgitation of the parents is mimicked by depressing the syringe plunger as the chick eats, as shown in the diagram. The diameter of the opening should be such that the chick’s beak is able to fit inside the tube opening and open up inside the tube body. The chick will then drink the hand-rearing formula in which its beak is submerged.

INSERT DIAGRAM HERE

For purposes of feeding, the growth period in the nest can be divided into four stages. Initially the hand-rearing formula must mimic ‘pigeon milk’. Pigeon milk is high in protein and fat, with a high water content. Carbohydrates are virtually absent. As the chick grows, the diet becomes progressively more similar to the adult diet. Gradually, the level of protein and fat decreases while carbohydrate and solid matter levels increase. A number of diets are commercially available. A commonly used brand is Roudybush (Dr Roudybush is an American vet who established and runs a bird food manufacturing company). Two suitable formulas are Roudybush Squab Handfeeding Formula (which is essentially a pigeon milk substitute) and Roudybush Formula 3. These and other similar diets can be purchased from specialist bird outlets.

The four stages are:

Stage 1:
Hatching to 4 days
Roudybush Squab Handfeeding Formula.
Diluted 2.2 parts water : 1 part formula by volume
Feed five to six times daily
Note: Some hatched chicks can survive off the resorbing yolk sac for 24 hours. Some people prefer to give an initial feed of either saline or Hartmann’s solution (available from vets or a pharmacist), particularly if the chick appears dehydrated (deep red and poorly responsive, more likely to occur with a prolonged hatching).

Stage 2:
Early growth, 5 – 7 days
Roudybush Squab Handfeeding Formula.
Diluted 1.5 parts water : 1 part formula by volume
Feed four to five times daily

Stage 3:
Late growth, 8 – 14 days
Roudybush Squab Handfeeding Formula.
Dilute 1 part water : 1 part formula by volume
Feed three times daily

Stage 4:
Fledgling, 15 days – weaning (28 – 30 days)
Roudybush Formula 3
Initially dilute at the rate of 1.2 parts water : 1 part formula by volume and reduce the amount of water as the chick ages.
Feed from 3 times daily down to once daily and start to provide normal adult seed mix.

Through all stages, it is a good idea to add a probiotic (eg Probac) to the dilution water for at least one feed per day.

And so, is it all worthwhile? From personal experience, it is a lot of work and the youngsters at weaning do tend to be slightly less robust than those that are parent-reared. Once weaned, however, and eating independently, they do quickly compensate and catch up and are certainly quite raceable. This procedure is, however, best reserved for those special youngsters. I guess it all depends on the value placed on that particular youngster by the fancier. It is nice to know, however, that the options of incubating and hand-raising are now practical ones.

Special thanks to Dr Danny Brown for some of the technical information presented in this article.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

In days gone by, The use of just plain egg white was found to be near what pigeon milk is. Boiling an egg seperating the egg white adding just a small amount of water using a fork or another device smash the egg white to a milky state with the water added. And you have a useable pigeon milk. Then using say a 10 cc syringe you can feed the new hatch.. NOW I read this in a book I had years ago. And I decided to try it to see if if I could do it. AND it worked just fine I raised a young fantail that was 1 day old to weaning age and it deveolped just fine. So it can be done using egg whites. And then mix egg white with a percent of other formula after 5 days for 3 days just as parents go from milk to grain as the young grow. Not saying its an easy job and that a person can do it if they want. But it will work And beings this person has birds hatching and will need to feed them This is 1 way to do it.


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

re lee said:


> In days gone by, The use of just plain egg white was found to be near what pigeon milk is. Boiling an egg seperating the egg white adding just a small amount of water using a fork or another device smash the egg white to a milky state with the water added. And you have a useable pigeon milk. Then using say a 10 cc syringe you can feed the new hatch.. NOW I read this in a book I had years ago. And I decided to try it to see if if I could do it. AND it worked just fine I raised a young fantail that was 1 day old to weaning age and it deveolped just fine. So it can be done using egg whites. And then mix egg white with a percent of other formula after 5 days for 3 days just as parents go from milk to grain as the young grow. Not saying its an easy job and that a person can do it if they want. But it will work And beings this person has birds hatching and will need to feed them This is 1 way to do it.


thanks for the advice


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## PhaLee (Jul 3, 2010)

well everyone this morning 1 egg hatched at like 4 a.m. and ive been getting out of bed every hour just to check to see if any eggs have hatched yet and it seems like the rest of the eggs will be hatching tommarow and everything is going fine ive been feeding the baby and hes doing just fine


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

re lee said:


> In days gone by, The use of just plain egg white was found to be near what pigeon milk is. Boiling an egg seperating the egg white adding just a small amount of water using a fork or another device smash the egg white to a milky state with the water added. And you have a useable pigeon milk. Then using say a 10 cc syringe you can feed the new hatch.. NOW I read this in a book I had years ago. And I decided to try it to see if if I could do it. AND it worked just fine I raised a young fantail that was 1 day old to weaning age and it deveolped just fine. So it can be done using egg whites. And then mix egg white with a percent of other formula after 5 days for 3 days just as parents go from milk to grain as the young grow. Not saying its an easy job and that a person can do it if they want. But it will work And beings this person has birds hatching and will need to feed them This is 1 way to do it.


That is great, esp because you have done it and it worked.. some folks can't get a hold of the formula, so in that situation this could save a life... good info Thanks from me too.


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