# Pigeon Pairing, Runt with single egg issue, Fantail with imaginary eggs



## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Hello All, 
I am trying to pair up a cock trumpeter with a fantail hen, hoping I can get a trumpeter with fantail. Any genetic gurus in d house to explain if tht can be possible or it is d other way round. I once pair a white trumpeter hen wit a blue homing n I got pair of blue trumpeters.
And Hey what it is with Giant Runts!! It's my first time dealing with them. They keep laying single giant egg for me. That's frustration waiting 3weeks for a single egg to hatch. Anyone had this experience with Runts?
And one of my Fantail hen is always in the her slot for like a week now like she's laying on an egg, she n d cock make a nest like 10days ago. She only come out to rush food and water n go back quickly. What seems to be the problem. Lol, Is she hatching an egg inside her or what, or She have an imaginary eggs or what?
Sorry, for the whole 3 questions at once. Just choose d one u can answer if u can't answer all. Thank u.


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

The offsprings of fantail+trumpeter won't fan their tails like their mother but will do the neck shaking(I don't know what subbreed ur fantail is). They could have feather socks(feathers at feet) but not as impressive as their father.

The hen after laying first egg don't incubate it usually but sit on it to protect it from other pigeons to trample it. Your hen going back immediately is natural,don't worry.


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Okay, So how do u think I can pair to produce Trumpeter/Fantail?. And I guess u mixed up d second question with d third. The issue of single egg hen is different from d imaginary egg hen. The single egg is a Runt hen, while d imaginary egg hen is Fantail. The imaginary case don't have any egg in d nest she just look n feel like she have eggs.


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Members here always ask about Cross breeding and what would the hybrid look like I was one of them someday but Now I am convinced that If I have 2 homers and 2 fantails I will pair the homers to produce two pure homers and the same thing for the Fantails, I Think this is the point of those who "created" the different breeds I see no point of Cross breeding two pigeons Except If it's the only choice and/or a reasonable reason ...
about your GR that lay only one Egg I would suggest gathering the two Eggs of different pairs in one clutch this way you'll have 2 eggs!


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Thank u Adulbaki. For d Runts: The dates didn't match up, about a week apart, can't have d two under one hen. For d Pairing: I am only trying to see a way I can have a breed with fan-tail and leg feathers, something like indian fantails. We don't have them here. Any suggestion?.


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Hi Fantails, IMO when you are interested/want a specific breed you buy It not invent it, So even if you cross them up the offspring will not have the same pure features of their parents so what's the point? you can ask someone there If he knows where to find an Indian fantail.
*good luck*


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

*Fantail*



brocky bieber said:


> The offsprings of fantail+trumpeter won't fan their tails like their mother but will do the neck shaking(I don't know what subbreed ur fantail is). They could have feather socks(feathers at feet) but not as impressive as their father.
> 
> The hen after laying first egg don't incubate it usually but sit on it to protect it from other pigeons to trample it. Your hen going back immediately is natural,don't worry.


This ar d kind of breeds we have, African Fantails. They zitter, have fantails, S shape neck not like British fantail n don't have leg feathers like indian fantails. I am trying to put a picture of one here but dnt know how.


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Believe me I tried, I even asked one of my indian friend working with a construction company to help buy for me but he said, It's not possible importing birds from India. I finally met a guy online, he have a site called Pigeon Farm, he's from Kuwait. He said he can import for me from anywhere in d world, but is price n charges are way morethan I can handle. He's asking for $450 dollars per fair and he can only import 10pairs for me, that's a total of $4500 dollars, that's lot of money.i


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

*Pigeon Pairing*



Abdulbaki said:


> Hi Fantails, IMO when you are interested/want a specific breed you buy It not invent it, So even if you cross them up the offspring will not have the same pure features of their parents so what's the point? you can ask someone there If he knows where to find an Indian fantail.
> *good luck*


So, that's d story n why I decided to just pair up, since I can't seems to get it anywhere and I can't afford what this Kuwaity guy is offering. I also could have love to have a pure breed of Indian fantail but it aint possible.
My best bet to get them was during my Masters study at Egypt, Cairo. A collegueuse to have them. But I was reluctant thinking that Cairo is like second home, I can always get them when I need them. But situations changes n we all knw what's going on in Egypt at d moment, unless u r not watching News,


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

I have seen many offsprings of fantails with homers or with highflyer etc. But I don't like them. As Abdulbaki said what's the point of croSsbreeding. But I see ur problem.

How old is ur giant runt hen. Sometimes young hens lay a single hen.

Your third hen is about to lay an egg I think. Pigeons mate for 8-10 days before laying eggs. It about time for your hen to lay so she prefers to stay in her pen.
Hope she does not have any other problem. 
4500dollars are a whopping amount of money!


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## LisaNewTumbler (Jun 24, 2013)

Regarding finding an indian fantail...have you tried Europe?
It should not be so hard exporting from Europe, though far away. I don;t know about shipping, depends on who you contact.

I don;t see a problem with creating a mix yourself. Afterall, all the breeds we have today exist because someone created them. It is not like breeding a trumpeter/fantail will somehow damage the fantail or trumpeter bloodline stock in the rest of the world.

If it was a really rare and difficult to reproduce breed then I would definitely advise against it as you are 'tainting' a limited stock. Fantails are so common, what does it matter how you pair them?


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## Jass SamOplay (May 29, 2012)

One mix breed pigeon won't be able to fly desirably nor can showcase its tail feathers. He won't fly so he will have his mind set on one thing that is reproducing. We all know how good pigeons are at that. One mix breed will produce more mix breeds.

A new useful breed is not formed by mixing randomly rather breeding birds with definitive traits and taking forward the selective qualities and it takes generations.


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## LisaNewTumbler (Jun 24, 2013)

brocky bieber said:


> One mix breed pigeon won't be able to fly desirably nor can showcase its tail feathers. He won't fly so he will have his mind set on one thing that is reproducing. We all know how good pigeons are at that. One mix breed will produce more mix breeds.
> 
> A new useful breed is not formed by mixing randomly rather breeding birds with definitive traits and taking forward the selective qualities and it takes generations.


He's not talking about randomly mixing breeds no? From what I understood he wanted to add features to his fantails which the trumpeters have. In that case yes, there are going to be imperfect offspring until he gets what he wants, like in anything to do with genetics, but if he has the space and time to breed it in, why not?

This is like breeding colours into performing breeds. The first wave are not going to perform, but then you breed the performance back into the coloured birds.

So he'd have to breed good boots onto the fantail bloodline, and then breed a good fan back into the breed.


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Ha


brocky bieber said:


> I have seen many offsprings of fantails with homers or with highflyer etc. But I don't like them. As Abdulbaki said what's the point of croSsbreeding. But I see ur problem.
> 
> How old is ur giant runt hen. Sometimes young hens lay a single hen.
> 
> ...


Thank u brocky: U r right about crossbreeding, they sometime produce something u will not like. But I have one crossbreed of homer n fantail, they produce me amazing guy I named "SNOW". He's so white n his fail is fantasticalybeautiful like a mo-hawk he's a year 2months. Actually d fantail hen we ar talking about "Imaginary egg hen" is his mate. And I don't think she hv any problem, she's very active.
For d Runt as I said this is my first time dealing with them I bought two pair about 4months ago, I only have teenage runts, So I will never knw their age. Before them I only keep Fantail, Trumpeters n Homers.


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

LisaNewTumbler said:


> Regarding finding an indian fantail...have you tried Europe?
> It should not be so hard exporting from Europe, though far away. I don;t know about shipping, depends on who you contact.
> 
> I don;t see a problem with creating a mix yourself. Afterall, all the breeds we have today exist because someone created them. It is not like breeding a trumpeter/fantail will somehow damage the fantail or trumpeter bloodline stock in the rest of the world.
> ...


Thank u Lisa. U did understand what am trying to do. A guy from US pigeon federation or something like that, I contacted is trying to help find out d shipping rule n cost from US. I am still waiting to hear from him. So if u hv a EU contact will be appreciate it, If d cost is not as that of Kuwaity guy $4500dollars.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Why dont you find someone in Africa to buy fantails from. Then it will not cost so much. and yes there are some good fantails There. Far as crossing Just what are wanting from your cross


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

I


re lee said:


> What dont you find someone in Africa to buy fantails from. Then it will not cost so much. and yes there are some good fantails There. Far as crossing Just what are wanting from your cross[/QUOT
> 
> Iam still searching, If I find one in Africa I never could have go around d world looking for Fantail. Where in Africa, u tell me. People here in Africa don't care about Fancy pigeons, they mostly keep our local rock/homer. This I believe haveto do wit African economic situation. It's only of recent that people start rasing fancy breeds which is a good sign tht d economy is going up n well. And most of fancy breeds u will find across Africa "excluding North Africa" are RUNTs which thy normally keep for squab production and Fantail for d doing well families. If u knw any in Africa close by tht I can get, I will be morethan delighted. Thank u
> ia


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## LisaNewTumbler (Jun 24, 2013)

I have just been doing some searching of my own for Lahores. I basically googled the search and went through pages and pages of these alibaba and craigslist type websites with people's listings of their birds.

It helps if you do the search in the local languages, since just english will limit the results you get. Which is why at first i was only getting results from UK, holland and germany. Google translate works well enough.

There is one company I came across that actually finds the birds for you and exports them, Masterbirds. It is in holland. I didn't end up dealing with them because they stopped replying to my emails. I don't know if they thought I wasn't a serious buyer or something.

The other hits I got were local breeders, you'd have to ask them if they know anything about shipping. Myself, I ended up deciding to fly up to the international fair in Italy and bring the birds down with me on the return flight.

If you don;t go up for them, you can also arrange with a pet carrier company, but I don't have any contacts.


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

LisaNewTumbler said:


> I have just been doing some searching of my own for Lahores. I basically googled the search and went through pages and pages of these alibaba and craigslist type websites with people's listings of their birds.
> 
> It helps if you do the search in the local languages, since just english will limit the results you get. Which is why at first i was only getting results from UK, holland and germany. Google translate works well enough.
> 
> ...


Respect, appreciate it. I will keep on researching. But for now I will make use of what I have crossbreeding. Thank ui


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Fantails said:


> I
> 
> 
> re lee said:
> ...


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Appreciate it. It will b great 2 hv African pigeon lovers around tht I can share n reason with. I will try one day to create a forum or thread only for African just to see how many I can get so as to create a circle of friends.
There lot of issues tht arise but u will find it difficult to get a solution. Sometimes even to get a nice good vet can be an issue. Tnx


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Hi, Fantails I am African Too but I bring my needed pigeons from spain it's probably 70 miles from here, but still fantails are so common I find them in every pet store here and they are really "cheap" I am suprized that you didn't find a single Indian Fantail in whole Nigeria?? in the other hand as ree lee said did you try to contact any of your African Friends? Sudanese, Tunisians, Egyptiens? I think they have good breeds of Fantails!
I wouldn't suggest purchasing from that guy 450 bucks for a pair!!? that's alot of money
I hope you find what you want very soon


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

QUOTE=Abdulbaki;761028]Hi, Fantails I am African Too but I bring my needed pigeons from spain it's probably 70 miles from here, but still fantails are so common I find them in every pet store here and they are really "cheap" I am suprized that you didn't find a single Indian Fantail in whole Nigeria?? in the other hand as ree lee said did you try to contact any of your African Friends? Sudanese, Tunisians, Egyptiens? I think they have good breeds of Fantails!
I wouldn't suggest purchasing from that guy 450 bucks for a pair!!? that's alot of money
I hope you find what you want very soon[/QUOTE]

Lol, Ya ha, I can see that u r African. With all due respect I don't consider North Africa as real part of Africa. North Africa is more or less Asia or even suppose to be part of Europe. Lol, I use to buy my ticket from Nigeria to Egpyt $1200 n I ticket from Egypt to Germany at $550. Infact most Egyptians don't like u say Egypt Africa, rather they prefer u call them Arab Republic of Egypt, kinda like Arab is a continent. I consider anything from Sudan up African by map
Well, tht not d point anyway. All I can say is thank u n I will keep searching. And hey this discussion is not even about buying, importing or looking for Fantail, It's about me crossbreeding to create my own Fantail, but it finally ending up all about buying n importing fantails. 
I will crossbreed my things now, make use of what I have, after all we all r doing this for fun. I will post a thread " LOOKING FOR FANTAIL" I guess when I really feel importing is neccessary. I have more important issues thn looking for Fantail around d world for now. Thank u all for ur response n concern, I really appreciate it n I knw u all r here to help in one way or another. Peace


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## Fantails (Sep 20, 2013)

Imaginery Eggs.
Hello all. Just found out about my Fantail with imaginary eggs. I don't know if any have this kind of problem before. It turns out that she actually lay an egg but the egg is very very very tinny, like the size of my finger. I never seen egg this size in my life. Egg have a kinda thread like at one end.
Anybody have an idea, what's the issue here??
Thank u


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## Abdulbaki (Jul 31, 2013)

Your hen has a lake of calcium,that could be because of excessive laying I would ask if it get Grit and Minerals in her Diet ?


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