# Why is it that way?



## birdlover000 (Aug 17, 2003)

Why when I say the word pigeon people say "FLYING RATS" ???? That make sme so mad. I mean there just like a bird. They think there dirty and stuff and can get you sick. Why do people have this point of view?


Thanks

David


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Hi David,

The saddest thing is that every person that says that thinks they are saying something that is both true and original. Perhaps on this site we could come up with an answer to them, like "symbol of peace" to shut them up!

Cynthia


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## birdlover000 (Aug 17, 2003)

Yes, I meane ther wrong!!!!

we should


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## DaveD (Jul 9, 2001)

It is sad. As the one story on this site states, for most of history, pigeons were considered noble animals, they provided great services to the military, and countless other good deeds. Now, they're considered a pest. I think a lot of people feel that way either because that's what they hear about them, or because thier parents consider them that way. Many folks on this site have had battles with neighbors over thier birds, I myself have a new neighbor who seems convinced they're going to catch some horrible disease from my birds. 

Part of the blame also falls on pest control companies. They've run out of things to exterminate, and so they've pushed the ideas the pigeons are diseased animals that are so dangerous, you need to call them to have them removed right away!!!

Even my friends were baffled when they learned I raised pigeons. Until I explained things, corrected wrong infromation, and showed pictures of some of the various breeds. One is considering starting a loft of her own now!!!

I guess all we can do is educate people about them. 

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David and Kellie Dittmaier

[This message has been edited by DaveD (edited April 13, 2004).]


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## brotherstwoloft (Jan 25, 2004)

hi everybody, it's said to say people are mislead by others. they don't think with an open mind. if our birds carry deadly diseases this is my ghost typing this reply. i try not to get made when people say somthing about nothing they really know about. in the city neighbors would tell us that having the birds on our roof would make our and their roofs leak. we would politly tell them that when our loft falls through the roof from the dropping then they have to worry about their roofs leaking. it's just a shame that they don't understand. that's why we have to respect our neighbors request because we really don't have any laws to protect use. do not argue with them just try to educate and hopefully they will learn about the joys of being a fancier.


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## dano7 (Feb 10, 2004)

Woody Allen called pigeons flying rats in a movie--cute maybe but stupid. I find most people will take a fresh look if they take the time to learn (IF!%&). The inner city pigeons can get so stressed and dirty that downtowners think that is pigeons.


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## birdlover000 (Aug 17, 2003)

People think that they are dirty can stuff. Any old bird can be like that. I think people have this "idea" beacuse in most cities pigeons are there and there are alot of them. Sense there are alot, there every where and they of course like any liveing thing, poops. And sense there are alot their poop is in large amounts. When people see this in the city they think they are nasty. I guess this is where my quote comes in.....

"People are people you can't change them"

Thanks,

David


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## JGregg (Jul 28, 2003)

If you look at our track record it's people who are the pests. They multiply unchecked, crapping everywhere, commit unspeakable acts against one another, use up this planet's resources at a extrodinary rate, to top it all off they're filthy and disease ridden. EWwwwww.

What can I say I'm a misanthropist.

[This message has been edited by JGregg (edited April 13, 2004).]


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## dano7 (Feb 10, 2004)

The story of the passenger pigeon tells you almost all you need to know about people.


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## DaveD (Jul 9, 2001)

Dano, 

100% correct. Heartbreaking. 

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David and Kellie Dittmaier


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## DPyra (Jan 22, 2004)

Birdlover000,

What can I say? Education. Educate yourself, then educate others. The more who listen mean the more who know. And the best form of education is example. How do you think the bad information caught on in the first place? By the way, all the creatures involved in spreading disease got sick in human filth before making humans sick. The detailed history of the plague tells us that. Does it not?


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## Birdmom4ever (Jan 14, 2003)

I agree that the attitude of the general public towards pigeons is maddening. Pest control companies have definitely made this worse. I read some pest control company literature, and it just about made my blood boil. They had a long list of diseases people can supposedly get from pigeons, though I've yet to hear of a documented case of anyone getting sick from contact with a feral pigeon.

I use my passion for pigeons to educate people wherever I can. When I take a fancy pigeon to the vet and other clients ask, "What kind of a bird is that?" it's an opportunity to educate. I tell all my friends about my pigeons. I share stories about them at church. People can be changed one heart at a time, and that's what we bird lovers can do. And of course I'm raising my children to absolutely love pigeons. They have already made me promise to give them each a pair when they have their own homes!


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## birdlover000 (Aug 17, 2003)

I know, to tell other that pigeons are fine is the best. Yes, the pest companies, are just looking for some inicent bird/animal to to meant! Why, we don't see pigeons getting their own pest companies, do we? (they can't really) Thanks god, I live in a farm area, and MOST people think good about pigeons, they are very rare here. 

thanks


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## Anwyn (Apr 4, 2004)

I think you should take it as a compliment when people call pigeons rats with wings. In India there is an entire temple dedicated to rats where they feed the rats on milk and honey. It is believed that the spirits of dead children are reborn into the rats. 

Also rats are very intelligent and social creatures. And like most people associate pigeons with the feral city birds, they also associate rats with spreading diseases (which, by the way, is only done by the european brown rat and I think by the common black rat but by none other of the various species). 

In addition it is not the rat that spreads disease but the flees that bite the rat then bite the person, thus spreading disease and killing half the population of europe in the middle ages.

Anwyn


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## Anwyn (Apr 4, 2004)

And as my grandmother has written on her kitchen wall; The more i know people 
The more I like my dog


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## dano7 (Feb 10, 2004)

Right, I live in the city which speaks to an interest in living with others and enjoying human companionship. However, the simple truth is that no matter how wonderful a certain percentage of the population is, no matter how beautiful the artistic accomplishmnets of man, no matter how marvelous the scientific achievements of man--man is the only species ready and willing to destroy this superb planet. There is absolutely no evidence suggesting man will ever make the fundamental change to get it right. I had a thought about what the world would be like if there were never was any humans; it's almost too gorgeous to imagine (and "nobody" would witness it).


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## birdlover000 (Aug 17, 2003)

*clap clap* Thats was good Arty, really, I think that is really good. I wish we had a flock here I could feed, guess I'll go to the city.


David


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## FeatherBrain (Apr 5, 2004)

One of the very reasons that feral pigeons inhabit certain city places (like in london) is cz ppl like feeding them etc...so "if" it is "wrong" then it is the ppls fault in the first place....they feed the pijjies..so they hang around....when it gets out of hand, they start calling them pests.
Atleast here in my countries..ppl havnt gotten around calling them pests...infact every day on my way to school I see four or 5 pigeon cages on house rooftops.Pigeons in flight are common here....Pigeons live on Tombs, mausoleums and mosques...and they have been living there since centuries.. 
And ppl here have contrary beliefs to the nowadays common "pijj-disease rumours"...My grandmother was telling me that in the subcontinent , the breeze/air from the flap of a pigeons wing was considered healthy...therefoe Pigeon keeping was and is a hobby here in the "sub-continent". Pigeons are let loose on weddings and u can often see them on music videos...!


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Hello Featherbrain,

You are right, man is the biggest enemy to pigeons, with the exception of everyone here.

When my birds fly around above me, I am at peace, and I am most happy! It is a celebration to hear them swishing their wings overhead, it is a song, it is poetry in motion....and now I guess I must be pretty healthy from the breeze of air from their wings.

Thank you so much for sharing that with us!

Treesa


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## alea (Jan 20, 2004)

Hello!
I must say that I feel your pain on this one,...
I am a military member, and a huge animal lover. I get flack constantly from my co-workers about my birds... I have even been banned from checking this site while at work! (Of course, my superiors and my peers are all looking at porn, stupid jokes, etc., but never mind..)
Recently, a co-worker sent me a link to a very cool story. It was about a pigeon that was awarded a medal for his work in WWII, I think. (For a Navy chick, I am bad with my history,... not to mention short-term memory!) Anyway, it was so neat!
This medal was awarded to the bird for valor and bravery, for delivering a message during a battle. The bird delivered the message just in the nick of time, under heavy fire, and saved thousands of lives. 
The point I am trying to make is this;
They might tease us, but our attitudes will influence some... and that is the best we can do. My co-worker at least took a moment to send me that story... 
For Anwyn, your G-ma is a wise woman. For many years I have said that the only people I truly trust, are not people. They're animals... (small children being the only exception.)
Alea


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## DaveD (Jul 9, 2001)

Was it Cher Ami? 

Link below tells his story. 
http://www.si.edu/resource/faq/nmah/cherami.htm 

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David and Kellie Dittmaier


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## raynjudy (Aug 22, 2000)

Cher Ami was WWI

GI Joe was WWII, and the one that Alea refers to. 

Joe is credited for saving over 1000 allied lives, for as our navy gal says, he arrived on the field, as the planes were warming up, just in the nick of time, with a message that their planned saturation bombing should be called off! Allied forces had taken the town during the night!









See, back then only very weak plane to plane transmitters could be used, and even then, only when absolutely necessary, because the Germans could triangulate on even low power signals, and locate our planes amd ground forces. There was no recalling those bombers once they took off! Again,









Joe was awarded the Dickin Medal, which is the animal equivalent of the Victoria Cross.

--Ray

P.S. Alea, check your e-mail...


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## Guest (Apr 22, 2004)

Because I have Lena, an all-white beautiful pigeon that is recovering from PMV and spends a lot of time wrapped in a towel sleeping or just hanging out with me, I have lots of opportunity for education of others. I take her everywhere with me, because she does well wrapped up and doesn't spin or twist her neck as much and because I just love having MyLena with me all the time.

I'll be in a store with her held closely to my chest or being held in the front of my vest I wear and people will see her and come over and talk to me about her. I take much care in explaining what her problem is. You say the word "virus" very carefully to people when discussing any animal but especially pigeons. I try to arouse the sympathy in people by discussing her neurological problem and what it makes her do and that I'm taking care of her until she can fly and be back to normal even though that may take over a year!

I have little kids come up and want to see Lena and I always hope that afterward those are kids I won't one day have to push in the pond for chasing ducks and geese! I live near a couple of elementary schools and I've wondered if it would be possible to maybe put together a presentation for the kids, especially when I've got a little baby like I have now, Ole, who would be a hoot for them to watch him eat.

I find that ignorance is the enemy! I see kids who don't know any better because they have parents who don't know any better or who have abdicated their responsibility and lowered their standards so far for behavior. They are running at ducks and geese getting them to fly because it makes them feel powerful. I watched a boy from across the pond doing that and by the time he came around to where I was, he spotted a duck with an injured wing. He was able to pick up the duck, which I tried to convince him not to do, but he said "my dad will know what to do". Well his dad made him put it back, but anyway, it was interesting to see him change from using his power to chase them to using it to try and help one. He was surprisingly gentle and careful with it as he walked over to his parents.

I later got a park ranger and caught the bird and he took it for proper care. But it's just like any other pre-judgement people make before they know something/someone personally, they judge themselves superior up against it/them and make decisions based on that judgement. Once they meet the different person or animal one on one, they can reassess their judgement and see themselves in more of a caretaker roll than a "giant in the patunias" kind of roll.

I encourage everyone also, to take every opportunity to instruct people, especially the young in the care and well being of animals. We and our ignorance are truly their worst enemy, as well as our own worst enemy.

Stacey


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## elvis_911 (Apr 26, 2004)

yeah every says they are "garbage birds" or their "diseased".

is it true people eat pigeons?!


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## FeatherBrain (Apr 5, 2004)

Yes Elvis...Sadly , I'm afraid ppl do eat pigeons..(although we are not supposed to be talking about "eating" pijjies on this forum)
Infact when I was searching for a pigeon related site...the first site i came across was for the same purpose..(culinary)...

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/\/\.$


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## ~pigeonlover~ (Jan 14, 2004)

pigeons are good for other wildlife i just saw starling taking feathers of my pijjies from my garden


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## JGregg (Jul 28, 2003)

Sorry to break it to you, but European Starlings and Rock Doves (pigeons) are not native to North America, so they're not "wildlife", they're feral.

I retract my statment if you hail from Eurasia or North Africa.

Before anyone gets on my case, yes I do love Rock Doves and Starlings.


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## dano7 (Feb 10, 2004)

Pigeons and starlings live in diverse settings, including those not frequented by people and they can live off the land with no human support. When you say they are not wildlife you are using a human classification system which any starling knows is whimsical and arbitrary. But I have found a several good avian uses for Science Diet puppy original, so thanks to you. lol


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## elvis_911 (Apr 26, 2004)

Thats discusting + cruel. ugghhh..

Elvis 

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  :S


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## KIPPY (Dec 18, 2003)

i did a search looking for herbs that pigeons could eat and i did find herbs to use when cooking pigeons.
i don't eat any meat! so that's definately not on the menu.
a friend of mine was joking about it so i jokingly told him "if i see you jumping over my fence your dog food."
end of conversation!


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## pward (Apr 28, 2004)

London's Mayor Ken Livingstone is always calling pigeons "rats with wings". In a newspaper column recently I pointed out the irony of such a comment coming from a rat on two legs.

Now I feel guilty for insulting rats - I'm a fan of them too, and they have done nothing to justify comparison with Livingstone!!

Peter


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