# Pigeon with injured foot



## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

This pigeon comes to my fire escape daily and I feed him, but he has a badly infected right foot, which he cannot put weight on, and it is swollen. I have not tried to catch him, don't even know if I can. Please advise!!!


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Can you see whether there is string or thread on the foot?

Can you let us know where you are?

A friend of mine had a sick pigeon in his garden, I can't remember off hand what was wrong with him but he was a wood pigeon that wouldn't be caught. My friend got round the problem by making a small hole in a peanut and packing the hole with the appropriate dose of the appropriate antibiotics, the pigeon loved peanuts and got better.

Depending on which country you are in, maybe one of us could provide you with the antibiotics that the pigeon needs.

Cynthia


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## Jaye (Mar 13, 2008)

That isn't a bad idea, feeding medicated food. 

The other option being...if there is any way you think you can lead the bird inside by leaving the window open and putting food inside the window, along a path so he can gradually slip inside, then close the window when he is inside. He will not be hard to catch from that point.

or maybe do the old Rabbit trap....box with stick propping it up attached to a string which you pull when the pidge is under the box...but, the box itself might make him leery of coming to feed (?)

Barring that, I do something similar to what cyro mentioned. I just wet safflower seeds with medication....antibiotic AND painkiller...and feed the bird that. 

It's not as optimal a solution because it doesn't get a look at what is causing the problem, and the dosages may be a bit off...BUT it certainly would improve the foot situation and prevent further deterioration. If he comes regularly and can be dosed daily or at least every other day if that is how often he comes, it would have a positive effect and certainly help him along....

The thing about trying to catch him OUTSIDE is tricky because if you miss (and even hobbled, they are slippery) he probably won't be back for a while...


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

I don't know if I posted the reply correctly. I live in Manhattan. I'm reluctant to catch him because I don't want to traumatize him. He is usually nearby most of the day. I don't have any antibiotics, and no clue as to what dosage would help.
Thank you very much for your responses!!


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I will have to leave it to the US members to provide the antibiotics as I am in the UK. I would aim for 1/2 of a 50 mg tablet of Clavamox twice a day for 10 days. Catching the pigeon won't traumatise it, but once caught it would have to be kept inside for the complete course as it would not allow itself to be caught over and over again.

Cynthia


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

I would suggest catching the pigeon and taking it to the Wild Bird Fund clinic. The WBF is a tremendous resource for those of you living in NYC. You may need to take the bird back home after treatement and care for it until it is well and can be released OR the WBF may be able to help you find someone to care for the bird. Just leaving the bird to suffer with an infected foot is not the right thing to do, IMO. Here's a link: http://www.wildbirdfund.com/

Terry


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> Just leaving the bird to suffer with an infected foot is not the right thing to do, IMO.


 

Please clarify, Terry! 

It is great that you are able to come up with an alternative suggestion , but have I missed something? Has a post been deleted that would add sense to your criticism if it had remained? ? I have re-read this thread and I can't find any post that suggests the pigeon be " left to suffer". Lisa posted because she *didn't want to leave it to suffer *but she didn't know 

a) How to catch it or if she would be able to do this, and

b) How to treat it if she was either able or unable to catch it.

At this time of year there is also the very real possibility that it has chicks in the nest which could be left to die of starvation, that is a factor that I, peronally, am unable to ignore.

Cynthia


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

> At this time of year there is also the very real possibility that it has chicks in the nest which could be left to die of starvation, that is a factor that I, peronally, am unable to ignore.


That's something I also take into consideration when trying to decide whether to intervene or not. If it's a life-threatening injury/illness, then I certainly would because a parent can't care for his/her young anyway if he's dead, but string injuries are more a gray area for me.

Because I know so many of the birds in my flocks personally, I have been able to observe signs that individual birds/couples are currently nesting. But most people wouldn't necessarily be in a position to know whether they are nesting, so it's just a guess--but I think Cynthia's right that at this time of year, it's a very good possibility.

Lisa,

I would say it's pretty likely your bird has string somewhere on his foot. Is the entire foot swollen, up to where the "ankle" would be? Can you get a photo and post it here?

Jennifer


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

cyro51 said:


> Please clarify, Terry!
> 
> It is great that you are able to come up with an alternative suggestion , but have I missed something? Has a post been deleted that would add sense to your criticism if it had remained? ? I have re-read this thread and I can't find any post that suggests the pigeon be " left to suffer". Lisa posted because she *didn't want to leave it to suffer *but she didn't know
> 
> ...


Lisa also stated


> I'm reluctant to catch him because I don't want to traumatize him


 thus my comment about not leaving it to suffer. Better to be a bit traumatized than to die of a systemic infection, IMO.

Yes, the point about babies is a very valid one. However, it is possible this bird could be back with any mate and/or babies very quickly if caught, examined, and treated. It's a difficult decision to make. I know what I would do, but I'm not the person there.

Jaye made a couple of suggestions about catching/trapping the bird. It is also possible that a member of the New York City Pigeon Rescue Central group could provide help in that regard: http://nycprc.org/

At the very least, I think Lisa should contact the WBF and the NYCPRC and see what kind of assistance is available. If capture is not an option then the WBF may be able to provide an appropriate drug and the dosage for administering in food.

My reply was NOT meant as criticism but rather as an attempt to help since it appeared that members who should know about the WBF as well as NYCPRC failed to mention either as a possible resource.

My apologies to any and all who took my post as criticism.

Terry


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

> it appeared that *members who should know *about the WBF as well as NYCPRC failed to mention either as a possible resource.


  Curioser and curiouser....*as mine was the only response between the time the rescuer revealed that she was in Manhattan and your post. * Until that point I thought she might be in the UK where I am, which is why I said _*Depending on which country you are in, maybe one of us could provide you with the antibiotics that the pigeon needs.*_ and on finding she was in the US I virtually left the field to the US members as I couldn't help. Although I think I know a lot about pigeons my knowledge of NYC and the resources there is sketchy.

Maybe you just didn't read the thread before leaping to conclusions....

Cynthia


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

> Curioser and curiouser


I want to add that I read this thread at the time I posted to it. As far as the fact that I "should know" about WBF, see below.



> Better to be a bit traumatized than to die of a systemic infection, IMO.


I think it's kind of a big leap here to assume this bird has a systemic infection when none of us has seen the bird or even photos of the injury. Lots of string injuries look horrible, but the foot isn't necessarily infected. And even there were, it's another assumption that a localized infection will become systemic.



> However, it is possible this bird could be back with any mate and/or babies very quickly if caught, examined, and treated.


Yes, but it could also go the other way where the bird needs to kept for a few days or weeks. If we were to take "badly infected" at face value, there's very little chance that that bird would be back on the street the same day, is there?

Yes, WBF will examine and treat the bird for her if he's caught and brought there, but that doesn't address her question of "trauma" (and I think being separated from a mate/babies while in the process of raising young constitutes trauma). Once the bird is there, they are going to do what they are there to do and treat him, not tell the rescuer to put him back because babies might be depending on him. Seeing photos would help us determine what's going on with the foot and what treatment might entail.

Jennifer


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

*Update on Pigeon*

Hi, I didn't post yesterday because the bird didn't come around, but today he's back! I hope these pictures can help confirm what's wrong. I agree that it's string around his toes. It seems difficult to catch him, he will come in quite close to my window (more than any other bird ever does) but he still bolts if I move closer toward him. I called the Wild Bird Foundation, and they told me how to try to catch him, which I will continue to do, and then bring him in. Thank you all for your help, I will let you know how he's doing.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

The string is very obvious in the first picture. Poor thing. If the string isn't removed he will loose his foot.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

It looks like there's string around two toes? (I can't see the third; the back toe looks clear in the second photo.) Those two toes will eventually fall off if the string isn't removed. They can still do well without toes, but it's good to remove the string whenever you can. It doesn't look so bad to me that he can't be treated and released, probably even the same day.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Thank you for the photos, Lisa. They are very helpful. I'm glad you got in touch with the Wild Bird Fund.

I apologize for the somewhat vitriolic posts in your thread on behalf of myself, Cyro51 and Jenfer. We three ladies will resolve our "issues" privately and will not continue to cause problems here by sniping at each other in your thread. It's the bird that's important in the end, and it sounds like you are putting first things first as you should be.

Please do keep us posted about this bird. Best of luck with him/her and thank you again for your concern.

I'll be looking forward to a happy ending when all is over and done.

Terry


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

I don't see any vitriol here, Terry, nor do I see sniping. What I do see is members offering a differing point of view from each other not for the sake of arguing but in an attempt to address the question of *what's best for the bird at this moment in time*. It seems like you might be taking my responses personally, when they are not meant that way. 

To me, this is what a discussion forum is all about--getting different perspectives on a situation and collecting information from various sources so one can make decisions one feels comfortable with. Otherwise, we might as well just query individual users or just have one person responding to a thread, no? (I'm not saying this to be obnoxious--this is a serious question.)

Jennifer


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

Thanks again to all who responded (and no need to apologize, you are all very caring people, I take all comments as coming from concern). Today, after trying all day to catch her yesterday, I called the WBF again. That's how I found out the pigeon is female, the WBF person said the females sit on the nest during the night, and go out to eat between 9 AM and 4 PM, and that's when I see her. I will keep trying to catch her, I was told to try to lure her into the house, then toss a sweatshirt over her and put her in a box. One problem is that when I practice (using a rolled up towel) I have to use one hand to close the box. And though I can coax her to the window sill with food, and she very nearly comes in, she won't stay still once I moved to toss the sweatshirt. I think she's on to me. So, any suggestions at all are welcome!! And thanks again for all your help!


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Lisa Barnhart said:


> Thanks again to all who responded (and no need to apologize, you are all very caring people, I take all comments as coming from concern). Today, after trying all day to catch her yesterday, I called the WBF again. That's how I found out the pigeon is female, the WBF person said the females sit on the nest during the night, and go out to eat between 9 AM and 4 PM, and that's when I see her. I will keep trying to catch her, I was told to try to lure her into the house, then toss a sweatshirt over her and put her in a box. One problem is that when I practice (using a rolled up towel) I have to use one hand to close the box. And though I can coax her to the window sill with food, and she very nearly comes in, she won't stay still once I moved to toss the sweatshirt.
> 
> * *I think she's on to me. *
> 
> So, any suggestions at all are welcome!! And thanks again for all your help!


It doesn't take them long to figure that out.

I would suggest just keep feeding her and hope that she puts her guard down long enough for you to intervene. 
BUT as has been stated, a _first_ failed attempt may (I'm not saying it will) result in her not coming back.  
So do your best at making sure your first attempt is successful.

Thanks for the update and for looking after this sweet pij. 

Cindy


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I think that luring her into your apartment, with food and water is the best idea. That was, if you get her inside, you can close the window. To pick her up inside, you don't need to use a towel because that will make it easier for her to slip out and get away...just use your hands.
See if you have a neighbor or friend that has a small animal kennel you can put her in...the kind you take a cat to the vet in. That would be easier and more secure than a box.

It's also important to tell you to stay in touch with your gut feelings, on this capture. Stay calm and focused because if you go for her and your gut says ...don't...there will be failure.
I think you will get her.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

Lisa, what's your feeding situation like? Do you have a fire escape that they (pigeons) are eating on? Getting her to come into the house might work, but to prevent her from flying right out again, you'd need to be quick to close the window, and then once she's inside, you'd have to catch her, and unless you have a net, that is very hard to do in a big open space when it's still day.

It might be easier to try on the ground near your apartment. If you want more details on how I catch pigeons this way, please send me an email, as I'm leery of posting too much information on a public forum.

As an aside, I don't think the 9 am - 4 pm is a hard-and-fast rule. In my flocks, I've sometimes observed the opposite (male out during day; female out in late afternoon/evening).

Jennifer


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

jenfer said:


> Lisa, what's your feeding situation like? Do you have a fire escape that they (pigeons) are eating on? Getting her to come into the house might work, but to prevent her from flying right out again, you'd need to be quick to close the window, and then once she's inside, you'd have to catch her, and unless you have a net, that is very hard to do in a big open space when it's still day.
> 
> It might be easier to try on the ground near your apartment. If you want more details on how I catch pigeons this way, please send me an email, as I'm leery of posting too much information on a public forum.
> 
> ...


it would be OK to get her inside and wait until after dark to catch her. That's waht I would do...have done in the past and it's much safer, less tramatic for all involved.

It may take several days of letting her come inside and building her trust brfore you can actually close the window.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

Charis said:


> it would be OK to get her inside and wait until after dark to catch her. That's waht I would do...have done in the past and it's much safer, less tramatic for all involved.


Yes, but in the meantime, isn't there a chance the bird would be panicking at not being able to get out? If the bird comes at four, and Lisa is able to get her inside, that would make four hours that the bird is potentially loose in her apartment.



> It may take several days of letting her come inside and building her trust brfore you can actually close the window.


That's part of why I think the ground method might be quicker and easier, but it depends on the bird and how many others are coming to eat, and it also depends on what Lisa feels comfortable with. 

One pigeon with her feet tied together who was coming to eat on my balcony I was able to catch on the ground very quickly; another two who are tied right now don't seem to eat on the ground, so I have to try to get them to come to the window instead, which is very, very difficult.

Jennifer


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

It's this Jennifer...outside you have one shot and if you miss it can take days to build trust again. Inside, windows can be covered. Could be the bird could even be caught during the day inside. It just hard to say for sure without knowing the inside of the apartment. 
Of course it depend upon Lisa's comfort level. I can tell you that I'm very good at catching injured/sick Pigeons. It mostly takes focus and patience waiting for the right moment and then going for it. I've been doing it a long time. It still is not beyond me to put a ladder up in the dark and grab one off a roof. Based upon my experience and what I've read about Lisa's situation, I still think it would be safest to lure the bird inside.
That being said, I don't care how she catches the bird as long as she's caught and receives treatment.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

> outside you have one shot and if you miss it can take days to build trust again.


Charis, I don't doubt you are good at catching pigeons. I think we all have different methods and there's no one right way to do it. I've only been rehabbing the last four years or so, but nearly every pigeon I've caught (must be in the hundreds by now), I've done so outside on the ground. In the last 1.5 years, I've also been feeding on my balcony/window sill, but it's the rare bird I've been able to lure inside or catch while they are eating on the sill. 

If Lisa only has a few eating on the sill, it might be easier to get the pigeon inside rather than try to catch her on the ground. Once the bird is inside, she could always throw a sheet over him. But if there are a lot of birds, it's going to be hard to lure that one particular bird inside vs. any of the others, so that's where it would be (from my standpoint) much easier to target her on the ground, where it's easier to distract them.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Well Jenifer...it isn't up to us to catch this bird all we can do is offer our best advise which we have both done.
I still stand by my method.


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

This is my situation: I live on the 5th floor, and the window is my back kitchen window/fire escape. The apartment is a railroad set up, long, with no doors between the rooms, just curtains between the kitchen and sitting room. Not many other birds come, (I guess word hasn't spread yet), so she's usually by herself when she comes in to the sill. In fact, that's how I met her, I was cleaning my windows and had left the room with them open, and she was just sitting on the sill when I came back in. At first, I started to shoo her, then I realized she was hurt, so I fed her. She's come back ever since. I'm still trying to coax her in further. But, once inside, she could go anywhere. Why would it be easier to catch her after dark? What happens? I thought I was supposed to toss a sheet and then picking her up sheet and all. Is it possible to just grab her barehanded? Which is better for her? About the box, I reinforced it and made a flip-top cover with a velcro latch, so that helps with closing. So - all I have to do is get her in it! Again, thanks for all your help.


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## moonshadow13 (Dec 13, 2008)

I'm curious what is the set up around this window? Kitchen counter or table right below it? Is there a way you can leave a sort of trail of seed for her to follow in? Also how close will she allow you to get? 
I was just thinking if she doesn't mind you standing near her or the window while she is eating she could follow the seed trail allowing you to shut the window behind her. Yes once inside she could fly around the whole apartment but......If you stay calm and move VERY slowly chances are so will she. 
The reason you wait till it is dark is they can't see but I do think it has to be really dark, no light on in the other rooms or anything. Use a flashlight to find her and you should be able to walk right up to her and pick her up with your bare hands. Whenever I have to do anything to my birds I ALWAYS go in and grab them at night, I can walk up and grab them right off the perch and they don't move a muscle.


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

They don't see well at night. That's why the recommendation is made to try and catch them when it's dark. 

Yes, you can catch them with your hands. And at night it's pretty easy, especially if you can come up behind them. 
Have your hands postioned so that you can grab them in the midsection. Don't use too much pressure, but enough that they can't get away. Be prepared that they _will_ try to get away, so you won't be startled and let them go. 
Once I catch a bird I immediately put it against my stomach and that seems to calm them down long enough to get them into a carrier.

As far as which is better to catch them with, your hands or tossing a sheet/towel over them, that pretty much depends on the your situation. 

Does this bird seem to stick around after the sun goes down?

Cindy


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## moonshadow13 (Dec 13, 2008)

AZWhitefeather said:


> Once I catch a bird I immediately put it against my stomach and that seems to calm them down long enough to get them into a carrier.
> Cindy


And I thought I was the only one who did the Belly Squish Method


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

moonshadow13 said:


> *And I thought I was the only one who did the Belly Squish Method*


It works good doesn't it?  

Cindy


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

cyro51 said:


> Can you see whether there is string or thread on the foot?
> 
> Can you let us know where you are?
> 
> ...



That's pretty smart. Good to remember if there is no other way. Thanks.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I just finished reading the rest of this post, and I would try getting the bird to come in also. More experienced people may be able to catch a bird outside on the ground, but less experienced people would have a much harder time. And if you miss, you have pretty much blown it. Get it to come in, even if it takes a while, then get the window closed. Either wait til dark, or just cover the windows. No, it doesn't have to be pitch black. Just fairly dark. The bird won't fly, and you can just pick him/her up. At least, that's what I would do. Good luck. Let us know how it goes.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

Lisa, if she's been coming alone and is already used to eating on the sill, I would try to get her to come inside. You could also try to grab her on the sill, but this will be difficult unless she's very used to you. I think the trail of seeds leading indoors is a good idea, but it might take her a while to be brave enough to follow it all the way in.


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

I rarely have seen her once it starts getting around dusk. I don't know where she goes when she leaves. As far as the window situation, there's a shelf on one side with dishes on it, and on the other is the refridge. So, there's nothing in front of the sill, just the floor. And it never gets truly dark in my apartment, the kitchen windows are really big, and the shades prevent some light, but they don't totally block the light coming from the alley below. I could try, though. I think I'm just going to have to get her to come in during the day when she's around, and hope for the best. Who knows, it may be dark by the time I finally catch her if I ever do get her in the house! Many thanks for all your help, will keep updating...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Lisa Barnhart said:


> I rarely have seen her once it starts getting around dusk. I don't know where she goes when she leaves. As far as the window situation, there's a shelf on one side with dishes on it, and on the other is the refridge. So, there's nothing in front of the sill, just the floor. And it never gets truly dark in my apartment, the kitchen windows are really big, and the shades prevent some light, but they don't totally block the light coming from the alley below. I could try, though. I think I'm just going to have to get her to come in during the day when she's around, and hope for the best. Who knows, it may be dark by the time I finally catch her if I ever do get her in the house! Many thanks for all your help, will keep updating...


Would it be possible to put a tray table or something in front of the window to sprinkle seed on? It doesn't have to be totally dark. When it gets like dusk, they don't see well, and don't like to fly. They're fairly easy to catch at that point. It may take a while for her to be brave enough to come in, but hopefully, she will. Just try to be patient. I'll bet you can do this. It would mean such a difference to the bird if you can help it. I'm praying for you. Good luck. Just don't rush her. Let her feel comfortable enough to come in. Then move slowly near her, or she'll startle and take off. Please let us know how it goes


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Appreciate the update Lisa. 

It dose sound like 'luring' her inside is the best option.
As has been said, it may take a while. But hang in there. 

Once she does get inside (I'm thinking positive ), let her fly around and get her bearings. 
I wouldn't try to catch her immediately.
She'll begin to settle down when he starts getting dusk. THEN she _should_ be an easy catch.

Cindy


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

*New Development*

I'm sunk now. My landlord just called and admonished me for feeding birds. The woman downstairs complained (strongly) and I am to stop or they will call the board of health. I feel like I'm 8 years old. Very upset. So, I've set up a tv tray about a foot from the sill with food, but so far, no luck. AND, I'm going away for the weekend on Friday. I'm so worried and sad...


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Maybe you can explain that you are just trying to catch this 1 terrible hurt bird to take to wildcare and once it's caught, you will stop.
I know how you feel but the landlord and neighbor are the one that should feel shamed.
All you can do is your best.


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

Thanks for responding. I doubt the neighbor would care, and the landlord just loves any reason to harass me. I'm going to continue just putting the food on the tv table close to the window, but far enough away that any seed flung around won't go outside, and pray that the bird will come in to eat. They can't disallow me feeding the bird from inside my home, can they??. I find it so sadly disappointing to encounter people with such nasty attitudes. So negative and combative. It makes me so, so upset. You are right, they should be ashamed. Thank goodness for the people online here, or I'd really begin losing faith in humans completely. Animals just have so much more integrity. I really want to help this bird. That's the most important thing.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I know you just want to help the bird. I'm sending positive thoughts because I want that too.


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## Lisa Barnhart (May 7, 2009)

*Good News!*

Thank you so much to all of you who supported me and the bird through all of this! I put a tray/table in front of the window the bird usually comes to, and put the food out, placed in a way that if the bird came and ate, the seed that gets flung around wouldn't land out the window. I sat quietly in the other room, and sure enough, the bird came and had breakfast. AND, I almost didn't recognize it, the foot swelling had lessened considerably! The bird can put much more weight on it, I can't see if the string is gone, but it looks so much better!! Problem solved, I can monitor the bird without the neighbor having any say, and should I need to, I can get the bird to the hospital since it's getting used to coming in.
Again, thank you all so very much for your thoughts. That makes such a difference. i appreciate your responses more than I can express!!!


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

That's wonderful news. I still think it would be the best to catch the bird and actually have a close hand look at the foot. A string embedded that much doesn't just go away on it's own. There is the possibility that some else actually caught the bird and removed the string. You've come so far with her, best to make sure.


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## jenfer (Jan 7, 2008)

She may still lose the affected toes (depending on how deeply embedded it is, this can happen whether you remove the thread or not). One way to get a closer look without startling her is to take a picture and zoom in on the foot. Toes that are starting to lose circulation start turning a dark blue, then black, usually starting from the tip inward.

It's very sweet that she's coming for breakfast, and I hope you can can continue to feed her as long as she's still coming around.


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