# Brick Red Poop



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Hi! First of all - I hope all you guys are keeping well - I'm so busy that I don't have the time or luxury these days for any of my fav forums.

I have a question, I've already pestered Tania (she is an angel and she must wish me into outer space sometimes)  One (or more?) of my flock (yes they are still around despite the constant warnings I get) poops is coloured brick red! I asked Tania what she thought this could mean, and she said it could be blood. Now I can't get to the pigeon(s) because they were up high roosting, but I just wondered, would poison cause this?

I ask because I am pretty sure that someone is throwing powdered poison around like it is going out of fashion. I think this is to get rid of the mice, but I've a sneaking suspicion that the pigeons may have been pecking around the area and may have consumed some.

I'm really quite concerned now for the safety of the rest of my flock ... I know until I catch which ever bird(s) is ill and hand him over to the caring hands of Tania, this is just a shot in the dark, but if anyone may have an idea of why this birds poop is this colour - it would help me stop worrying. Poops are not watery.

Tania - once again thank you - and sorry for being a bloomin pest!!

Michelle x


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Dark bricks or light colored bricks? I've seen pigeons eat enough red mineral grit to have lighter-colored brick poop. I've also seen poops with birds that were hemorrhaging to various degrees. If it's a darker red, then it's likely blood. You can smear some on a white piece of paper and take a better look.

A lot of rodent poisons are based on blood thinners (Warfarin) and the antidote is usually vitamin K.

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Thanks for the reply. I'll try and take a better look tomorrow - it was dark when I saw the poop - but it was on a black rubbish bag and was clearly red. It does appear to be quite dark. I'll try and get some onto paper tomorrow, and see if I can work out how to take a picture from my phone and put it onto the net. I really hope it isn't poison ... and even more hope that the bird isn't sick.  

In the words or Arnie .... I'll be back  

Michelle


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Might also be worth tracking down the source of the substance that you are
seeing there. I would think that there would be guidelines in the UK regarding
the indescriminate placement of poison, as a protected species could ingest
it or even children at play getting it on their hands and putting hands in mouth
or whatever. Just another angle to look at, I know it's all very difficult and
time consuming. Thanks for keeping an eye out for the ferals...

fp


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, if it's a bird that you can possibly get a hold of or might find down on the ground sometime in the near future due to this, you might want to get some vitamin K to have around in case. It's better if they get it by a shot, but if you're stuck then you have to rely on oral vitamins for that.

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Thanks fp and Pidgey. I'll try and get hold of some Vit K tomorrow, and as I said to Tania, if I see a pidg lurking around the ground, I'll try and grab hold of it. 

fp - already on the case of trying to find out what the white stuff is and who is smothering the ground with it. I really hope it isn't poison, but I really have a feeling it is.  Some people are so irresponsbile.

Michelle


----------



## pigeonmama (Jan 9, 2005)

michelle,
you can also take a bit of the red stool and just wet it down. If it's due to bloody stools, you may get a ring of obvious blood around the sample. Thing about internal bleeding, the stools usually are tarry and black rather than red.
Daryl


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Even though we have laws governing the placing of poison here, I noticed that
in San Francisco, I believe it was Western Exterminators was placing some white powdery substance heavily on the sidewalk below where a large group of
pigeons hung out. I swept it up as best I could and reported them, but ever
since Gavin Newsomb has been Mayor in SF, there has been a nod and wink 
routine going on where the poisoning of pigeons is concerned. It is frustrating
and heartbreaking to find a flock being treated this way, and I really hope you
are able to find out who is responsible andb put a stop to this.

fp


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

pigeonmama said:


> michelle,
> you can also take a bit of the red stool and just wet it down. If it's due to bloody stools, you may get a ring of obvious blood around the sample. Thing about internal bleeding, the stools usually are tarry and black rather than red.
> Daryl


Yes, this is what I understood about internal bleeding as well. I have
seen brick red droppings from time to time that do resemble a bird that
has eaten too much grit, but these are ferals and I just don't have a way
of determining who is passing said droppings. Pretty much have to wait
until I have the opportunity so to speak to pick them up and bring them home
for a bit...

fp


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

The darker it is, the further up it's from, right? I've occasionally seen much brighter red blood from hemorrhages further down. I think we've even seen a picture or two on here with frank blood in the stools.

Pidgey


----------



## pdpbison (Mar 15, 2005)

Wayferin, thinning the Blood, changes the normal surface tension, can cause bleeding in various mucous membranes or internal Organs...so, it could do it, it could make the Intestines start oozing Blood...

Dangerous...

Vitamine "K" is the antidote, as already mentioned...


Phil
l v


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

The ones I'm referring to aren't really a case of "frank blood", but they are
clay red.

fp


----------



## pigeonmama (Jan 9, 2005)

Pidgey said:


> The darker it is, the further up it's from, right? I've occasionally seen much brighter red blood from hemorrhages further down. I think we've even seen a picture or two on here with frank blood in the stools.
> 
> Pidgey


This is correct, Pidgey.
Daryl


----------



## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

I have never seen brick red droppings, or clay red droppings, even from my own birds after they have feasted on the mineral brick that John supplies. However, I have seen the feral pigeons eating building bricks in town. And I have seen them regurgitate mineral brick when they have eaten too much.

There was also brick coloured residue from Blackie and Rosie's droppings, it was just a little smear. Rosie had a massive tumour.

Cynthia


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Thank you for all your advice/info

Okay, so no birds lurking around in any obvious distress.

Have managed to figure out how to upload images from my phone. Although not the best quality, here are two pictures of the poop, although one appears more black than red, but it is quite a dark red, and I have also taken one of the old red pillar that they roost on. Could be that the bird is busy munching on this brick ... but then again ....




























From these images, do I have a sick bird that I need to try and get hold of, somehow? I'm such a novice.

Michelle


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, it's certainly funny looking stuff. Blood often acts a little different on how it smears. Can you take this stuff, smear it around and see if it acts more like blood versus strawberry jam?

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

A little later today, when boss has gone home after a hard day in the office , I'll have a go at smearing this as best I can around the paper and then upload the results here. If nothing else, I'm learing how to use my camera and pc to work as one  

Michelle


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Do pigeonmama's test of wetting it a little on some paper to see if it makes a red ring, too.

Pidgey


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Michelle,

These are pretty differerent than the 'clay red' ones that I've seen at a couple
of different locations. They were clay red in the sense of really looking like
clay red, no transparent quality anywhere to the dropping.

The ones in your pictures seem to have areas of mucous tinged w/blood, at
least that's how it appears to me. You may well have a sick bird hanging
around, so good to keep an eye out as I'm sure you do anyway.

fp


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Well I did the couple of tests - certainly no difinitive red blood ring (as far as I can tell), and when smeared around it looks like this ...... [sorry forgot to resize) ....



















Do these images help at all? Up close it sort of looks gritty .... 

Now that it is getting dark, trying to keep an eye open for the returning birds, although that said, did see a dead pigeon early this afternoon, not far from where I work and where they roost .... just wonder if this was the one. If it was, was really quite young.  

Michelle


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Is the gooey part of that like snot or more like fruit preserves?

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

I would say more like gritty jam!

Michelle


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Strawberry jam....

fp


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

But don't go taste it to make sure... 

Pidgey


----------



## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Michelle, you could keep your eye out for any more fresh ones like these
that you are posting here....if you don't see any fresh ones, then perhaps 
it was indeed the jouvenile that you saw today. 

fp


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Were those poops in a single grouping or were they scattered around quite a bit? Maybe a better question would be what's the furthest apart that you've found them?

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

feralpigeon said:


> Strawberry jam....
> 
> fp





Pidgey said:


> But don't go taste it to make sure...
> 
> Pidgey


 LOL - you are funny - just as well I don't like Jam - otherwise who knows .....






Pidgey said:


> Were those poops in a single grouping or were they scattered around quite a bit? Maybe a better question would be what's the furthest apart that you've found them?
> 
> Pidgey


The poops were quite scattered, thing is, I was away from the office last Thurs through to Monday ... the poops were normal Wednesday night .... but there was just this huge round mess come yesterday. I scooped up some droopings which were on a black rubbish sack this morning .... but for the pictures just concentrated on smearing around one section of the poop.

FP - will certainly be keeping my eyes open - did struggle to see in the dark tonight if there were any birds roosting on top of that pillar - I didn't see anything so could well be the dead bird I saw (and eventually went back and scooped up into a bag to dispose off).

If I see any fresh poops maybe I'll try again with the experiments - practice makes perfect.  

Michelle


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Hi,

Pleased .... in one way .... to say that no fresh red looking droppings today. Just normal poops. I guess this is either because the bird concerned has recovered, or the dead bird I saw yesterday was the one that was sick.

Thanks again for the info.

Michelle


----------



## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

What I was wondering by asking how much the poops were scattered was whether it was a possibility that there were several birds involved as though they'd been eating some local berry or something that was causing it. We'll probably never know.

Pidgey


----------



## arnieismybaby (Jul 24, 2006)

Pidgey said:


> What I was wondering by asking how much the poops were scattered was whether it was a possibility that there were several birds involved as though they'd been eating some local berry or something that was causing it. We'll probably never know.
> 
> Pidgey



That is the question ... because its dark when I leave the office now ... and they sit to high up on that pillar ... and tucked close to the wall of the building ... it is hard to make out ... but I have a sneaking supiscion that there could be three up there. Then again, given the length of time for the poop to build up (I still clean the streets now and again when it looks heavy with poop) it could have all been down to just the one.

As you say .... we will never know now. 

Michelle


----------

