# New baby pigeon gasping for air. Please help.



## WanderingLoner (May 4, 2008)

Hello there,
A couple of weeks ago two baby pigeons hatched from their eggs. They have been doing just fine until 2 days ago. One of them is gasping for air and is doing it constantly just like a hiccup. It opens its mouth pulls its head back gasping for air and then closes it. It has been repeating this constantly. I am not sure what the problem is. I have 8 other birds and they are all healthy. The second chick is fine too. I dont know if this is some disease or if there is something stuck in its throat. We feed all the other birds with mixed grains ( dont know the name of each of them) Some of them are quite large and only the 5 adult birds eat them. I was thinking maybe the mother of the chicks ate the big ones and then fed it to the chick. I also feed the birds cooked rice(it seems to be their favorite) Could that be the problem. Is that possible or is it a disease? Please help and reply as soon as possible.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Can you see anything in the area of the trachea? Sometimes a bit of feather can cause a little "whoop".

I don't have enough experience of squabs to advise you but would separate him from the othere and put him on a heat pad for the time being.


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## WanderingLoner (May 4, 2008)

i will check its throat. anyways, i live in the United Arab Emirates. Its a small country in he middle east and the climate is usually very hot here. at this time in august/september it is hot enough for the birds already. should i still put the bird on the heat pad or is it alright outside in the open?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Sometimes they need direct heat, but if he isn't ill that mightbe uncomfortable for him. Are his feet warm?


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

Please check if is not maybe swallowing movement. Looks like gasping for air but head is moving forward and then backward (neck stretching and retracting). Check for canker and inflamed tonsils.


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

I wouldn't put it on a heating pad, it's already hot for it where it lives. Is there any abnormal breathing sound? Feel its throat and crop, anything strange?

At this time of the year many respiratory problems are common where you live. mainly canker (trichomoniasis), CRD, PMV and somtimes fungal infection.

If I were you i would medicate with anti-canker then baytril and would use ACV (5~10ml/L) after that in drinking water a week every month, and vaccinate for PMV when ever possible.​


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

We use heating pad with sick babies/birds because they can't regulate their own heat. It doesn't mater how warm it is outside if they are sick. That's why Cynthia asked if the baby has cold feet. It's like us humans...when we have the flu and we can be very cold even when it's scorching hot outside.


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

Charis, of course. but heat here reaches up to 46°C (115 °F) in shade easily.. 
the materials underneath the bird already absorbed enough heat to reach ~ 40°C (104 °F). 
when you get flu here, you only need to turn off the air-condition to get warm!​


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

alhowiriny said:


> Charis, of course. but heat here reaches up to 46°C (115 °F) in shade easily..
> the materials underneath the bird already absorbed enough heat to reach ~ 40°C (104 °F).
> when you get flu here, you only need to turn off the air-condition to get warm!​



What can I tell you, Al. Cynthia is an experienced rehabber and so am I. She shared common protocol for sick birds that works over and over again and I agree with her. Please...feel free to do what ever you want in a similar situation.


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

No one questioned your nor cynthia's experience!

You may have common protocol where you live (with a 23°C/73°F temperature) but you must agree that doesn't mean its a universal protocol. 

I have other birds here, for example Cochin & Brahma chickens and without an air-condition they will die (they go into coma/fatigue then they will die), and its common practice to provide that for them here.. i doubt its common practice where you live.

Also, you may know a 1 day old chicken chicks can't regulate their temperature, you're adviced by experts (as a common practice) to install heating source (ex. light bulb). You do this here (at this time of the year) and you'll get a barbecued chicks! instead we install an air-condition.

Unless the original poster installed an air-condition, or we are in winter.. then i don't see any reason for a heating source *where he lives.* (that's may own opinion).

And apparently you take things personally.​


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

Guys your argument about using heating pad on Arabian Peninsula sounds like old joke:
Why are Eskimos buying fridges? – To keep them warm!
In any case baby should be observed and treated for canker. 
Other treatment like cocci, respiratory, parasites, may be required depending if additional symptoms are present. Loosing or not gaining weight, diarrhea, wheezing sounds or high breathing rate (higher than 40 p/min). Dehydration because of high temperatures is also possible.


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

WanderingLoner, how is the baby now? Have you checked its mouth? Is it clean and pink? Are its feet warm?



> Guys your argument about using heating pad on Arabian Peninsula sounds like old joke


Have you ever wondered why pigeons brood their chicks continuously for the first 6 - 7 days, presumably even on the Arab Peninsula? And have you ever tested the heat beneath a brooding pigeon?

When artificial heat sources are used for squabs instead of the parent birds they regulate their body temperature by moving to or from the heat lamp (Kelly 1987)...we put sick birds on heat pads that give them the option of moving away from the source of heat if they get uncomfortable and we do not leave them unattended.


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

> Have you ever wondered why pigeons brood their chicks continuously for the first 6 - 7 days, presumably even on the Arab Peninsula? And have you ever tested the heat beneath a brooding pigeon?


Yes I did. I like checking things myself. 



> A couple of weeks ago two baby pigeons hatched from their eggs. They have been doing just fine until 2 days ago.


Baby is not fully feathered, but almost.

Presently temperature in the room where I keep my sick pigeons is 36.12 degree Celsius. No heating sources except sun.
Mind this is South Africa. Recomended temperature of hospital cage is 27~30 degree Celsius.
Instead of everybody feeling hurt about this argument, maybe simple instruction as "baby should be kept at temperature no lower than 30 degree Celsius (86 Farenheit)" will sufice?

P.S. Feefo - Using part of my wording changes the whole meaning!


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

Feefo, You won't have chicks at this time of the year.. the eggs would become rotten instead (obviously at 46°C).. heating waves strike most at the beginning of September here reaching up to 49-50°C (rarely) then they start to alternate at the end of the month, in October you get a hot day/cool night and the temperature would fall down as you continue till you get to winter.

If the chicks hatched at the beginning of September, chances are that they will die from dehydration within the first week. (it happened to me untill i've installed an air-condition).

BTW, i've installed a multi-thermometer where i keep my birds, the temperature outside today registered 46.7°C, inside (with an air-condition) 35.1°C, inside (without an air condition) 44.3°C.

I would suggest reading a book titled "Poultry production in hot climates / edited by N.J.Daghir" And "Poultry - Climatic factores" by the same editor.

Bottom line is, its a mini-hell here.
​


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

WanderingLoner said:


> i will check its throat. anyways, i live in the United Arab Emirates. Its a small country in he middle east and the climate is usually very hot here. at this time in august/september it is hot enough for the birds already.


Could you PLEASE update us on how the baby is doing?

Thank you.


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## WanderingLoner (May 4, 2008)

the baby vomited today and i took it to the vet. the doctor said that the bird has a bacterial infection or something like that. it has respiratory problems. the sad news is that the doctor said the pigeon has a 25% survival chance. however, if the pigeon can make it for 2 more days, till sunday,then its chances will improve and i also have an appointment for sunday. the doctor gave an injection of baytril 5% (100ml) and suggested that i feed the bird a syringe full of cerelac (baby food) every 2 hours. She also suggested that i keep the bird in a cool place as the humidity outside isn't good for it. ok now i have a few questions that i forgot to ask the vet.
1. a syringe full of food every 2 hours? can the bird digest food that fast or should i feed it afer longer intervals?
2. temperatures here are very hig and exceed 35c easily. on very hot days the can go above 40c+. inside i have set the a/c temperature to 24c. should i keep the bird in doors with mebut i fear that will be too cold for the bird or should i keep it outside but in a shade?
ny and every suggestion ill be appreciated


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

This baby is big enough to take 15~20ml food at the time. Do not feed every 2 hours as crop will not empty and you are facing serious problem. Before feeding, check the crop if empty. It is also possible bird to have "sour crop" if womiting. Be extra careful to give food warmed to 40 degree Celsius (slightly more than your body temperature).
Three times a day feeding wil sufice, but again check crop before feeding. Rather feed less then overfeeding.


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

Did doctor give you tubing with syringe? Did he show you how to feed? Sorry for asking these questions but if you don’t have experience, it is easy to choke baby.


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

At this time of the year birds start to consume less feed and more water to reduce their temperature through evaporative cooling and thats when they start to have respiratory problems. as a preventative measure either install a/c or use apple cider vinegar (5ml/L) or citric acid (250~500mg/L) in drinking water or both a/c and acid and use antibiotic/anti-canker for the 1st 5 days from aug/sep months.

plamenh already gave you much help, and for the 2nd question as plamenh said in his previous post "baby should be kept at temperature no lower than 30 degree Celsius (86 Farenheit)" will sufice?"

Here are Some feeding techniques (didn't use them myself) and don't know if they are practical or not.

"Syringe and Balloon Method":
http://www.urbanwildlifesociety.org/WLR/BabyPij&DuvFeedg.htm

"Bottle Feeding"
http://www.urbanwildlifesociety.org/WLR/BabyPijBotlFeedg.htm

If i were you i would put it inside the house in a room where there is no a/c turned on, but you want to turn on a fan to move the air.. i would not suggest putting it outside at all.​


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## plamenh (Aug 11, 2006)

First link dosn't work Alhowiriny!

Here is another one:
http://www.pigeoncote.com/vet/feedbaby/feedbaby.htm


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

Link Updated. 
I was trying to find an easier methods of feeding other than tube feeding.​


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## WanderingLoner (May 4, 2008)

i am not sure what crop is? can you help me out with that? and how do i check to see if it is full or not.
the doctor just gave me a syringe and no tube. i already fed the bird twice. dont worry about that i am careful. i open its beak and put a little bit of the paste it it and then let go. the bird automatically swallows it. then i give it some more and repeat until the syringe is empty. also i am not sure where to get citric acid. is it ok if i put freshly squeezed orange juice in their water since that has citric acid. since alhowiriny said that birds drink more water that eat feed should i give it some extra water after feeding it the baby food?


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

If you look at the second photograph on the bottle feeding link you will see the squab gaping in response to having his beak between the feeder's fingers. One of our members who runs a sanctuary has told me that while it is gaping you can use your other hand to put food into its beak with a syringe. The effect is very like the syringe and balloon method that alhowiriny found and which this alternative link leads to, but is probably a bit cleaner for the pigeon. The link also shows the crop before and after feeding:

http://www.pigeon-aid.org.uk/pa/html/syringe_method.html


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## alhowiriny (Jan 10, 2009)

I've updated the 1st link again, it keeps going down because theres strange characters in the URL.

Here its again:
http://www.urbanwildlifesociety.org/WLR/BabyPij&DuvFeedg.htm

Here are some videos showing how to feed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3GPWhHeG4s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVCw_slS6jI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGRunGrOrvI

If you decided to use citric acid insted of ACV then you can put freshly squeezed orange/lemon juice. Every 10 ml of the juice contains ~ 0.5g of citric acid. that means you prepare a 1 liter of water and add 10 ml of the juice then you can take from that 1 liter what ever the baby needs and feed it (or for every 100ml water you put 1ml juice). And a garlic with it would be helpful, i don't know how much you should use for a baby though.

if the bird is inside the house then you don't need to give extra water.

i've attached a photo showing what's a crop.
​


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## Bird enthusiast (Nov 4, 2020)

WanderingLoner said:


> Hello there,
> A couple of weeks ago two baby pigeons hatched from their eggs. They have been doing just fine until 2 days ago. One of them is gasping for air and is doing it constantly just like a hiccup. It opens its mouth pulls its head back gasping for air and then closes it. It has been repeating this constantly. I am not sure what the problem is. I have 8 other birds and they are all healthy. The second chick is fine too. I dont know if this is some disease or if there is something stuck in its throat. We feed all the other birds with mixed grains ( dont know the name of each of them) Some of them are quite large and only the 5 adult birds eat them. I was thinking maybe the mother of the chicks ate the big ones and then fed it to the chick. I also feed the birds cooked rice(it seems to be their favorite) Could that be the problem. Is that possible or is it a disease? Please help and reply as soon as possible.


 If that is the case you can try put it in a cardboard box in a cool and shady place , then your bird is likely to recover quickly......Or else you can spray some water on it using a syringe or a plastic spray can or bottle


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## Bird enthusiast (Nov 4, 2020)

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