# City of bronson michigan will ban animals including pigeons



## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

can't figure out how to copy and paste this. So hope this shows up enough where it can be read. Basically gonna have a fight on our hands to keep our animals. basically they want to ban all large livestock, and small animals including chickens, rabbits, ducks, geese, and all small fowl


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Good grief! It is getting where no body has any rights any more. Thanks for posting the article. Next it'll be cats and dogs. Sad world we live in.


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

My opinion
If I can't keep Racing Pigeons--No one else --in my town--can keep "ANY" pet that needs feed and water.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

good point Sky... I would move outside the city limits....


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

spirit wings said:


> good point Sky... I would move outside the city limits....


Where I live doesn't even have "city limits"....because we're not a city, I'm in a "town" with no "downtown", and its all "rural" or "rural residential", which allows pretty much any pets or livestock  If it didn't, I wouldn't live here!


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

This World is changing too fast for me.
When I moved to Sachse Texas 31 years ago we used the {SAME} the One & Only post for Both signs-Entering/Leaving Sachse. I was in the Middle of a Wheat Field--
I still have 1 & 5/8 acreas --NOW 2 story houses around me And my house was builded in 1941--It looks out-of-place with these new up-to-date Homes. But Hey--I was here First. I paid about $40,000 for my place--the house next door sold last week for $190,000-on less than 1 acre-I almost fainted when I heard that.


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## Garye (Feb 20, 2005)

You should see what the houses cost up here in Massachusetts. A house built in the 1960s cost 15,000. Two houses were built on either side of this house recently, with the same size lot as the one built in the 1960s. Price? One was $400,000 and the other $500,000. And they're not fancy houses either.


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## Nictorious Ali (Jul 1, 2010)

This so wack! I live in MI I just got my subdivision to approve my birds now all i need is animals control to give me a permit and even they are being difficult.


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## i_love_Calina (Sep 6, 2010)

Michigan as a whole seems to be falling to pieces. I never hear anything good about the place! 

I would personally count this as a blessing and leave if I were living there. I mean they sell Rabbits at Petsmart and they are banning them...o__o


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## ptras (Jun 29, 2010)

sky tx said:


> This World is changing too fast for me.
> When I moved to Sachse Texas 31 years ago we used the {SAME} the One & Only post for Both signs-Entering/Leaving Sachse. I was in the Middle of a Wheat Field--
> I still have 1 & 5/8 acreas --NOW 2 story houses around me And my house was builded in 1941--It looks out-of-place with these new up-to-date Homes. But Hey--I was here First. *I paid about $40,000 for my place--the house next door sold last week for $190,000-on less than 1 acre-I almost fainted when I heard that.*


I paid $187K for my house eleven years ago. Houses in my neighborhood are now selling for 3/4 of a million or more. I try to always remember what my Dad used to say...a house is a place to live. It must give you shelter, keep you warm and dry, and give you a place to sleep. Funny thing, is I'm thinking of "downsizing" to a house that is on the market for $395K.


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## NYBOY (Sep 15, 2009)

In Westchester county Land is so expensive it is sold by the foot.


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

They took rabbit sout of the ordinance. But added a nice little breeding law where you have to pay a license, and they regulate you. They didn't add payment, or anything like to this law. Just said if you have three or more animals, and are breeding you are running a kennel. Sorry. I am not paying for it. 

Chicken people were grandfathered in under stirct circumstances that if their birds die, oh well, too bad you don't get any more. And if they get one complaint they will make them get rid of all of them.

Come to find out they are violating the state racing pigeon law. Which basically says no town can prohibit ownership of racing pigeons. technically they can't touch me on that one. though I plan to pick up some cheap homers, and possibly work on getting licensed with the state to be covered. When the law was mentioned to them they argued about it, said they would talk to their lawyer about it, and oh well we are passing the ordinance anyhow. 

In order to get more birds, I have to cut back on rabbits. Might be fun flying them in town next year, and they won't be able to do anything about it.

National pigeon association is dealing with them now.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

chinbunny said:


> They took rabbit sout of the ordinance. But added a nice little breeding law where you have to pay a license, and they regulate you. They didn't add payment, or anything like to this law. Just said if you have three or more animals, and are breeding you are running a kennel. Sorry. I am not paying for it.
> 
> Chicken people were grandfathered in under stirct circumstances that if their birds die, oh well, too bad you don't get any more. And if they get one complaint they will make them get rid of all of them.
> 
> ...





Sure hope that law works for you.


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## Nictorious Ali (Jul 1, 2010)

So let me get this straight? Theres a state law for racing pigeons in Michigan?! Where can I find this? Animal control sent me a letter denying me a permit for pigeons because my neighbor complained which is odd because my neighborhood took a vote and approved my birds. So I got the approval letter from the associations President and now I gotta appeal this junk.


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## Kailey lane (Jun 8, 2009)

wow ,im in MI and i have 2 indoor pigeons but this scares me.i hope to get a loft in the next year but not in the city of troy were im at now...ill have to move further out for that i guess
does the rules apply to indoor pets?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

How would they know if you have a couple of indoor birds?


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## Nictorious Ali (Jul 1, 2010)

Kailey lane said:


> wow ,im in MI and i have 2 indoor pigeons but this scares me.i hope to get a loft in the next year but not in the city of troy were im at now...ill have to move further out for that i guess
> does the rules apply to indoor pets?


I live in Troy also. Do you have a neighborhood association? I would first ask them if its ok to build a structure outside for them. Don't tell them you already have the birds! Its illegal to keep pigeons within Troy and it can be a pretty big fine. If they approve the idea of you keeping birds outside I would say your home free BUT if you wanna get real technical. Then you gotta go to the City of Troy and ask for a building permit in which they will tell you to get a permit for the pigeons first. But you cant get a permit for the pigeons without a proper housing for the birds. So you tell the the City that you need to build the cage first. The City will ask for building plans you can pm me questions about that. After you build the cage you then gotta ask the animal control for a permit which still has a win or loose chance to it. I took the technical route because I live right up against some apartments and if they complain then im screwed. If you live in a private area with about an acre I would just mention it to your neighbors that you want to have pigeons and if they are cool then dont worry about the rest. If you do tell you neighbors bring pictures and educate them on why they are special lol when you say pigeon they think rats with wings.


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## Miss-Sassypants (Sep 25, 2010)

...and I thought Singapore pigeon laws were ridiculous!!


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## Crazy Pete (Nov 13, 2008)

Nebraska the good life. When I brought in my loft didn't need a permit all they wanted was to make sure it was 17 ft from the ally in case a fire truck needed to get through.
Dave


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## Kailey lane (Jun 8, 2009)

Nictorious Ali said:


> I live in Troy also. Do you have a neighborhood association? I would first ask them if its ok to build a structure outside for them. Don't tell them you already have the birds! Its illegal to keep pigeons within Troy and it can be a pretty big fine. If they approve the idea of you keeping birds outside I would say your home free BUT if you wanna get real technical. Then you gotta go to the City of Troy and ask for a building permit in which they will tell you to get a permit for the pigeons first. But you cant get a permit for the pigeons without a proper housing for the birds. So you tell the the City that you need to build the cage first. The City will ask for building plans you can pm me questions about that. After you build the cage you then gotta ask the animal control for a permit which still has a win or loose chance to it. I took the technical route because I live right up against some apartments and if they complain then im screwed. If you live in a private area with about an acre I would just mention it to your neighbors that you want to have pigeons and if they are cool then dont worry about the rest. If you do tell you neighbors bring pictures and educate them on why they are special lol when you say pigeon they think rats with wings.


wow! i had NO CLUE that it was illegal in troy ,even to have them in my home.i guess i just thought since they are indoors they would fall under the rules of any other indoor bird but i guess i was way wrong.i cannot thank you enough for telling me this,we are renting right now and only interact with the properties management companies(we never see anyone!) we will never meet the owner,so im safe on that but i cannot build a loft while renting,we do not have a neighborhood association as far as i know.
we are moving much farther north in about a year to buy our on house,so i just gotta keep them indoors till i can build my own loft on my own land.im making sure before i move that the new city allows the loft building for sure.thanks so much for the info!


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## Mader631 (Sep 7, 2008)

Wow..........That's &^%$#@ up!!!!


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## atvracinjason (Mar 4, 2010)

So Michigan is surpassing California in government intrusion...CRAZY
-My suggestion would be to look up local law exemptions for 4-h and FFA, I raised sheep in a city and was protected. I wonder if you were a volounteer for either organization if laws in place would protect you....oh yah and it would help grow the sport


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

No you won't. technically pigeons are protected by state law. If they say anything to you, get the the American racing pigeon club on it, and they will take care of it. 

yes there is a state law on racing pigeons. Contact the american racing pigeon association, and they can tell you all about it. 
here it is.

http://law.onecle.com/michigan/433-animals-running-at-large/mcl-433-19.html

Tonights paper says they may alter the ordinance in the future, because they must have figured out they really are in violation of the state law. And if you have issues with your city on birds, the american racing pigeon association will help you out.


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Kailey lane said:


> wow! i had NO CLUE that it was illegal in troy ,even to have them in my home.i guess i just thought since they are indoors they would fall under the rules of any other indoor bird but i guess i was way wrong.i cannot thank you enough for telling me this,we are renting right now and only interact with the properties management companies(we never see anyone!) we will never meet the owner,so im safe on that but i cannot build a loft while renting,we do not have a neighborhood association as far as i know.
> we are moving much farther north in about a year to buy our on house,so i just gotta keep them indoors till i can build my own loft on my own land.im making sure before i move that the new city allows the loft building for sure.thanks so much for the info!



Troy michigan? You need to contact the american racing pigeon association about this, because they are breaking the law.


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Nictorious Ali said:


> So let me get this straight? Theres a state law for racing pigeons in Michigan?! Where can I find this? Animal control sent me a letter denying me a permit for pigeons because my neighbor complained which is odd because my neighborhood took a vote and approved my birds. So I got the approval letter from the associations President and now I gotta appeal this junk.


According the NRPA you don't need permit for them. They can't touch you. They can't prohibit you from exercising your birds either.


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## sky tx (Mar 1, 2005)

Google
michigan racing pigeon laws

number 433.19 maybe?


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## jeff houghton (Jul 17, 2010)

mAKES MY BLOOD BOIL READING THIS AND I DONT LIVE IN YOUR COUNTRY.
HOW ANNOYING TO HAVE THESE JOBSWORTHS PUSHING YOU AROUND AND TRYING TO TAKE YOUR HOBBY AND PASSION FOR PIGEONS AND OTHER ANIMALS AWAY FROM YOU.wHO DO THEY THINK THEY ARE.?
AND WHAT OF YOUNG PEOPLE WHO WISH TO TAKE UP THE HOBBY,GIVING THEM SOMETHING TO FOCUS ON ,KEEPING THEM BUSY AND INTERESTED IN THINGS THAT WILL KEEP THEM OUT OF TROUBLE.WOULD THEY RATHER A PROPORTION OF THEM TURNED TO DRUGS AND CRIME.?


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## Nictorious Ali (Jul 1, 2010)

I dont have racing pigeons but I think this is a good reason to switch from high flyers to racers!


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## Kailey lane (Jun 8, 2009)

ok well,i dont have racing pigeons.i have one owl pigeon hen and homer male that live indoors.am i still safe with the NRPA even if i dont race them? thank you chinbunny and sky tx! you guys helped me not start to panic lol,i love my pij's and will go to the ends of the earth for them.


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## Guest (Oct 14, 2010)

Kailey lane said:


> ok well,i dont have racing pigeons.i have one owl pigeon hen and homer male that live indoors.am i still safe with the NRPA even if i dont race them? thank you chinbunny and sky tx! you guys helped me not start to panic lol,i love my pij's and will go to the ends of the earth for them.


I too have a bunch of birds and thank god all my neighbors love them too cuz I honestly dont know what I would do if I had to give them up .. good luck to you and hope everything works out for you.. the saying "the less they know the better" always is a philosophy of mine


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

I was told it doesn't matter if you have racing pigeons or not. they can't tell the difference, and the city is still violating the law if they don't allow pigeons in town.

A homer is a racing pigeon. Yep you are still safe.


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## Kailey lane (Jun 8, 2009)

oh that is great news to hear,thank you so much chinbunny,you've taken a huge weight off my shoulders


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## JRNY (Nov 17, 2009)

In paper it says you own the house but you dont. Thats How I feel as a homeowner also. Make sure you pay your taxes that go up up every year. Or the town has to make a road through your house doesnt matter. But when you want something you could forget about it.


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## Nictorious Ali (Jul 1, 2010)

So I had my town meeting today and they denied it on the ordinance that i need 3/4 of an acre lot to keep pigeons. Which is odd because I didn't know pigeons need that room to run. Oh well...looks like im gonna have to contact the american racing pigeon association and see whats up.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Yes, they often make rules about how large a lot you must have. That way they can say, set back so far from the property line, so as not to be too close to your neighbor. With a smaller lot, you can't do that, so it cuts out a lot of people. I'm really sorry. Hope the association can help.


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## Libis (Oct 8, 2010)

How did this all end up turning out for you guys? 

I wonder what my town's ordinances are on pigeons (so far I haven't looked it up because I only have indoor ringneck doves and diamond doves.)


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## KO Loft (Jul 1, 2007)

*Real Estate Attorney in Michigan ouch*

If you read the statute

433.19 Ordinance prohibiting keeping of racing pigeons.
Sec. 9.

A city, village, township, or county shall not enact an ordinance which prohibits the orderly keeping of racing pigeons.


Here is the word that gets you....ORDERLY...

The protection allows for keeping of birds but what attorneys hate is orderly ambiguity. All any township has to do is argue that they are enacting laws to not prohibit ownership of racing pigeons but rather attempting to keep them orderly. Thus you can keep your RACING pigeons but they can restrict loft size; bird population; loft location; could make you license birds; regular inspections at time of licensing much like proper vet papers for dogs; and the list goes on to infinity. If the township wants you to get rid of your birds they will do so by these reasons. If you have non racing pigeons they will attempt to qualify your birds as poultry much like chickens are classified. 

The reason and method they will attempt to do this in another portion of the statute:


433.13 Loss of, or damage to, property by animal running at large; demand for compensation.
Sec. 3.

(1) A person who sustains any loss of, or damage to, property by an animal running at large may demand reasonable compensation from the owner of the animal as reparation for the loss or damage or as ordered by the court.

(2) The demand for compensation shall be in writing and shall include:

(a) A statement of when, where, what, and how much damage was done.

(b) The identity or description of the animal and, if known, the identity of the owner of the animal.

(c) The amount of compensation demanded.

(3) The demand for compensation shall be verified by the claimant and submitted to the law enforcement agency which has the animal in its custody or possession.

The petitioner will say that the animal is not in custody but was seen returning to the loft. Possible methods of getting this complaint in to city officials is pigeon feces left on houses near loft; feathers that people will claim is an irritant to their respiratory health; and the rodent problem. They will take video of rats going from their yard to underneath the loft. Livonia has this problem of rat population explosion. I went to visit an old timer years ago before went to law school, and I saw rat holes near his loft. He said they leave the birds alone but go after the corn. There goes orderly. 

The key people is know the law and keep your fences with your neighbors in accord. An irritated neighbor is what will get you in trouble. Every time a house was sold near my grandfather he would panic because he was grandfathered in under the old laws of Nankin Township when the township became part of the City of Westland effective May 16, 1966. He would give them tours of the loft; train the birds never to land on others property; and maintain the loft an eradicate any rodents around loft. 

This issue has come up recently regarding chickens, pigeons, dogs, and cats because of the show HOARDERS. The sad thing is it will keep appearing. We are blessed with a law in Michigan that protects racing pigeons but only for loft owners that are following the law. A disorderly loft will equal no loft!! Thus the law is the shield for some and a sword of death for others. It is not a gold ticket people so be careful. 

Joseph F. Overaitis
Attorney
Pigeon Supporter


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## doveone52 (Aug 3, 2009)

Thanks for the input, KO Loft. Seems that the law can be a sticky wicket!


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

How do you find these statutes? I've tried, and I can't find anything for Maine, or my town. And I'm usually pretty good at that


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## KO Loft (Jul 1, 2007)

*finding info on your locality*

Go to your compiled laws for your state and search for pigeon. All the state statues should pop up. then go to your city website and search for the local ordinances. Again look for pigeons and all the applicable sections should pop up. If pigeon is defined as poultry for purposes of statute then you must search for all areas of the law that relate to poultry as a pigeon for legal purposes is now a chicken lol


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

KO Loft said:


> Go to your compiled laws for your state and search for pigeon. All the state statues should pop up. then go to your city website and search for the local ordinances. Again look for pigeons and all the applicable sections should pop up. If pigeon is defined as poultry for purposes of statute then you must search for all areas of the law that relate to poultry as a pigeon for legal purposes is now a chicken lol


I did all that and nothing came up, except one state ordinance that it is illegal to use live birds (pigeons, ducks, etc) as live bait for dog training.
So if nothing comes up, does that mean there is NO ordinance or law?


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## KO Loft (Jul 1, 2007)

*unfortunately....*

no you might have a local that believes that pigeons are defined more as fowl or poultry. Detroit and Michigan had a great history of belgium and european breeders who raced and had an influence on the laws here. Never knew it but when my grandfather told people who he bought his birds from in belgium and europe we had guys offering 400 for birds and my grandfather never raced them. He just showed his birds pedigree. Michigan had a history of protecting pigeon racers. Other states do not but........


If there are no laws that say you can have pigeons there also may be no laws that say you can not. THe glass is either half full or half empty lol


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

I'm really not _too_ concerned about it. I'm Rural Residential. People down the street have horses and cows, someone has chickens because I've seen them by the road  I don't know if their still there, but a house down behind me had a small duck pond with ducks, geese and a couple peacocks.
When I googled 'pigeons' in my town, the only thing I came up with was an *obituary* (dated 5 years ago). An oldtime racing loft keeper died (he was in his 90's).......the wake and funeral was held at his loft, and the pigeons were released during the service! He was like one of the towns 'forefathers'


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## GEMcC5150 (Oct 24, 2010)

Msfreebird said:


> I'm really not _too_ concerned about it. I'm Rural Residential. People down the street have horses and cows, someone has chickens because I've seen them by the road  I don't know if their still there, but a house down behind me had a small duck pond with ducks, geese and a couple peacocks.
> When I googled 'pigeons' in my town, the only thing I came up with was an *obituary* (dated 5 years ago). An oldtime racing loft keeper died (he was in his 90's).......the wake and funeral was held at his loft, and the pigeons were released during the service! He was like one of the towns 'forefathers'


The release of his birds was a nice act to him and his love. Thing like this make my heart sing.


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## monsoon (May 9, 2009)

If someone can find that link i'd love to have it.  I did a search and couldn't find it. I live in the city of Monroe and want to start a loft with racers for some fun. Plus i kind of like sticking it to the man whenever i can.


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## kcmodena (Feb 17, 2011)

I am sorry to see this broad brush passed in yet another town or city. There are a number of things we all must do BEFORE the new ordinance is passed or accepted in YOUR town/city. Attend the meeting! Speak up - in a calm & informed manner!!! point out the benefits of having &/ or showing birds - chickens - rabbits. About 5 years ago my dog warden contacted me because our town meeting was talking about passing just the same thing. I show rabbits nationally. I also live right beside the town hall. Scary huh?!?! You bet. I went to the meeting and spoke about the historic character of the town (agriculture) & the country flavor - and our youth. Our kids need valuable skill building hobbies and the powerful character building that comes from the interaction of caring for living things. Dogs - cats - pigeons - rabbits - cavies - chickens. These are all critters that are supported and encouraged thru the 4H and youth segments of the various organizations. Our youth need the support of the community - by not hindering their ability to have and house a reasonable number on their property. 

Join a group!! just as you would join a home owners assoc or a block watch - you need to join or support your local 4H - and - there is an EXCELLENT Yahoo group = PET LAW http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/pet-law/ 

I did attend & I was afraid. 
BUT I also pointed out - how will you make an elderly pet owner chose which one - of the 3 pets will you make them get rid of???
and will you take it home???


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## chinbunny (Mar 1, 2010)

Hi. I am not sure if they took them out or not. haven't seen anything in the news about it. I really don't care at this point. Let them try. My birds were here first. I'm on both pet law groups.

Yep we spoke up in a calm manner, pointed out all the benefits, etc. Didn't work. They had made up their minds they were dealing with animals that would dirty up the town, and wanted to make everyone get rid of them. They did take out rabbits, the only reason why they did was I had the rabbit orgs call them, and had the paper do an article on a rabbit I own that one best in show at a local county fair. They way they did the article, was great, and funny! The headline was put in the largest, big bold letters they could get on the page. Article and picture of the bunny was only a few sentences. It took up 2/3rds of the page. wish we could have gotten them to budge on the poultry like that. Rabbits are allowed in town, but they have to be kept as 'pets.' The main reason why they included rabbits was because a neighbor of mine decided to turn all of their loose. Which caused a lot of problems when they ate our gardens, and dug under the houses.


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## fireman (Apr 2, 2011)

I sure am glad that I live in the country!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

fireman said:


> I sure am glad that I live in the country!


AMEN brother!...


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