# Dortmund show



## dimerro (Nov 23, 2008)

If you want to see photos with some interesting colors from Dortmund show (~18600 birds) look at:

http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_1
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_2
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_3
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_4
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_5
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_6
http://dinamergeani.sunphoto.ro/15e_partea_7


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*Wow*

That's some beautiful collection of birds. Quite a show. Thanks.

I did see one on the first page, top right, that looked like Brians bird. Would that be an ice red bar?

Bill


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## BCBrian (Nov 23, 2008)

It does look quite similar doesn't it? The next photo shows a red check that looks like most of my red checks too.

I'd bet it's the same factor.


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*At least the closest that I've seen*

Any idea where your bloodline came from? To me, it looked similar enough right down to the sort of off colored bars that just don't look like normal ash red. Your bird looks to me like what the ice factor would do but I'm really only guessing.

I definately would not rule out Frank's thought about recessive opal. I've tried to find those pics but have not been able to. They don't seem to be on Ron Huntley's site. Somebody had a very large number of them with some very different and beautiful looks. I just don't remember where I saw them. I'll keep trying, it was pretty impressive.

Bill


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## BCBrian (Nov 23, 2008)

Hi Bill,

My birds are "generic" BC show homers - of really good breeding. They come from 5 different fanciers. All the BC ash red birds seem to carry this factor to some degree. In fact - there is a complete and total absence of "normal" deep (racing homer) reds in the show homers up here. All of the reds are pale looking and faded out. It is a stunningly beautiful colour though.

No one seems to have blue opals though. 

It's the reason I asked my original question - no one seems to know why we have so many "normal looking" blues - and have all these pale faded out reds.


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## jbangelfish (Mar 22, 2008)

*I was wondering if they came from Europe*



BCBrian said:


> Hi Bill,
> 
> My birds are "generic" BC show homers - of really good breeding. They come from 5 different fanciers. All the BC ash red birds seem to carry this factor to some degree. In fact - there is a complete and total absence of "normal" deep (racing homer) reds in the show homers up here. All of the reds are pale looking and faded out. It is a stunningly beautiful colour though.
> 
> ...


If the original stock came from Europe, it might be more likely that you had the ice gene. I'd sure breed them to blue to see what happens. Ice, according to the Quinn book is a partial dominant autosomal gene. Some in between colored birds should be produced. It does state that ice has a tendency to darken the areas of feathers that are not visible without spreading a wing or looking underneath. This could be a clue to what you have but it only talks about ice with blue. I know that some really great looking birds have been made since with ash red and brown. Frank spoke of brown ice pigeons and said they were quite striking. At the writing of Quinn's book, Ice was not yet fully understood. I'm sure it's been figured out by now.

The fact that the blues are all normal really (maybe?) points more to what Frank has said and that this is an ash red mimic from recessive opal. This would mean that the birds are really blue and should easily be proven out by breeding. The ash red cock with no flecks should make 100% ash red young, mated to blue. Further, if this is recessive opal, it should prove itself right away, bred to blue or normal ash red, all young should be non opals unless the hen is split recessive opal. You should still see some non opals. If this was a separate form of recessive opal and only made blues look ash red instead of making them look like blue opals, it would make sense. I don't know if this is how it works but maybe. Frank probably knows the answer to that one.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

dimerro said:


> If you want to see photos with some interesting colors from Dortmund show (~18600 birds) look at:


Thank you for the links, Dina! Some really gorgeous birds there!

Terry


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