# It was worth a try



## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

So my saxon monks suddenly decided to abandon nest ,so I though "hey ,maybe if I put a chicken egg on the nest ,they will go back on" Now I have seramas ,a very tiny breed of chicken that lays very small cream colored eggs ,so I put an egg on the nest. I check back on the nest about an hour later ,and the male saxon is sitting tight on the egg !!

I'm hoping the female saxon will lay another egg tomarrow ,and if she does I will take out the serama egg and let her lay 2 nice little pigeon eggs.

Should I do this ?? should she lay another egg ??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Don't see why you are doing that. Why not let them nest and lay eggs when they are ready. Why do people feel that they have to control everything? Let them do things as feels right to them and leave them alone. Take the egg out and don't rush things. They'll do fine on their own without interferance.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

O.k ,thanks.

I will take the egg out


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Don't worry. They will nest and have eggs before you know it. But they need to do it in their time, and in their way. And they will. Please let us know when you get eggs. Good luck!


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Thanks ,and lol ,then dont expect any eggs any time soon. This pair will make a nice nest ,set for a few days then leave it. I have had this happen 5 times.
I was really hoping this time would be different ,they would stay on the nest and lay and all would be happy...but I was wrong ,and I guess I got a bit frustrated...so I put the egg on...perhaps doing that will have re-awakend the instinct to nest ,and they will lay without any nudges or bumps at all !! 

Also if it helps the guy I bought the pair from said they where nest stealers ,and would steal eggs..so im not sure if that has to do with anything.


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## Guest (Feb 28, 2010)

how long have you had these birds ?? I thought you just got them ?? when they are ready they will lay eggs and hopefully hatch them no encouragement needed 
how old are these birds anyways ??


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

The birds are atlest a year old. I talked to the guy I bought them from ,and I guess that the female was a really bad nester/nest theif. She would always skip from nest to nest ,and go to whatever nest had the most eggs and lay in that nest. So it makes me wonder...

That wonder is if she is a nest stealer ,will she ever nest by her self ?? Does she need to feel like its someone elses nest to lay ?? So many questions...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Is that why he got rid of her?


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

No ,its because of these reasons

1.He wanted to focus only on homers
2.He knew I wanted saxon monks
3.There happened to be a convinient pigeon for him to give them to me.

lol ,acctually I waited 6 months to get these birds from him ,but I could never meet up with him until a pigeon show at the start of this month


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## Guest (Feb 28, 2010)

has this bird ever layed any eggs yet?


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

LokotaLoft said:


> has this bird ever layed any eggs yet?


That was my next question.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Yes ,she has layed before.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Always in anothers nest? Sure she's not a brown headed cowbird? LOL. They do that.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

lol ,Thats what I was thinking...Pehaps shes a new species....the white headed cow bird ,lol.

I have her with a little hen ,and she goes all broody whenever she lays an egg...I almost thing that just having the egg there is what triggers her instinct to nest.


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## Msfreebird (Sep 23, 2007)

Startail Fan said:


> lol ,Thats what I was thinking...Pehaps shes a new species....the white headed cow bird ,lol.
> 
> I have her with a little hen ,and she goes all broody whenever she lays an egg...I almost thing that just having the egg there is what triggers her instinct to nest.


OK, I'm confused now 
How many other birds is she in with?
When and Where did she lay the egg? And, are you sure *she* layed the egg, or the *other* hen?


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

you said there was only one egg and you were expecting another, they do not always sit the first egg, they sit when the second is layed and hover or totally ignore the first egg , which is what you want as you would like the eggs to hatch closer together. some will sit the first egg and then the second is layed and the first squab is bigger than the second becauses they sat the first right away...so you just needed to wait in out and see what the pair did when the second was laid, if they are bad sitters they may be bad parents as well.. you can foster the eggs if need be if you have another good pair that lay around the same time. you can keep the monks eggs for about a week in a cool place and turn everday untill another pair has laid and then put the monk eggs under the foster pair after they lay their second egg, or if you have another pair that has laid within three days of the monks you can swap the eggs that way as well.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

I don't believe they have layed at all. They build a nest then abandon it. The hen has a habit of going into anothers nest that does have eggs, and laying her eggs there. At least that is what he said they did at the other place they were kept. But I don't think he has had any eggs from her yet. He really hasn't had them all that long. That is why he put the chicken egg in the nest. To encourage her to take over the nest and lay eggs. But I don't believe she has laid any yet. It will take time for them to get used to their new place anyway, before they lay eggs. Maybe they need to be kept in a large nestbox for a while, where they won't be able to keep moving to another nest. But it would have to be large enough to give them room.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Jay3 said:


> I don't believe they have layed at all. They build a nest then abandon it. The hen has a habit of going into anothers nest that does have eggs, and laying her eggs there. At least that is what he said they did at the other place they were kept. But I don't think he has had any eggs from her yet. He really hasn't had them all that long. That is why he put the chicken egg in the nest. To encourage her to take over the nest and lay eggs. But I don't believe she has laid any yet. It will take time for them to get used to their new place anyway, before they lay eggs. Maybe they need to be kept in a large nestbox for a while, where they won't be able to keep moving to another nest. But it would have to be large enough to give them room.


"I'm hoping the female saxon will lay another egg tomarrow"


another egg...? so I dunno...lol.. perhaps he can enlighten us if he comes back on... ..lol..  sometimes people think they sit like chickens when they lay the first egg.. he is only 14 I think, so I think he is new to the whole thing....


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> "I'm hoping the female saxon will lay another egg tomarrow"
> 
> 
> another egg...? so I dunno...lol.. perhaps he can enlighten us if he comes back on... ..lol..  sometimes people think they sit like chickens when they lay the first egg.. he is only 14 I think, so I think he is new to the whole thing....


I don't know either, but I think that he was referring to the chicken egg as being the first one, and that it might make her lay another one alongside it. At least that is the way I understood it. Not sure. Wish he'd come back on. You're right in that many expect them to sit on the first egg right away, before they have the second egg. Lots of people get worried that they are ignoring the first egg.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Jay3 said:


> I don't know either, but I think that he was referring to the chicken egg as being the first one, and that it might make her lay another one alongside it. At least that is the way I understood it. Not sure. Wish he'd come back on. You're right in that many expect them to sit on the first egg right away, before they have the second egg. Lots of people get worried that they are ignoring the first egg.


oh yeah, he then said hope she will lay TWO, nice little eggs, I get it now.....lol.....


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> oh yeah, he then said hope she will lay TWO, nice little eggs, I get it now.....lol.....


I know. This ones a little confusing. LOL. I had to go back and read it a few times to be sure.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

O.k ,soort for the confusion ,so this is whats in the cage

1 malle fantail pigeon
a pair of saxon monks
1 Serama hen

Whenever the serama hen lays the pigeon will take over the egg ,so I figured that the pigeon would acctually lay if she thought that she was using someone elses nest ,so that is why I put he serama egg in the nest.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That's the way I understood it. Thank you. How long have you had the Saxons?


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Alomst 2 weeks

Also I need to post this

I found an egg in their nest ,it was the same size as a Serama egg ,but it wasnt cream colored ,it was bone white. It was in the pigeons nest ,with mama pigeon sitting on it. I am posting a pic of the serama egg ,because the two eggs are are the same size. Did the Serama lay and the pigeons move it ,or is it a pigeon egg ??


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

How could they get it up into their nest? I do hope that their nests aren't on the floor.They should be up higher where it would be impossible to bring an egg to.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Well they sorta nest on the floor. I have a nest cup on their ledge ,but they refuse to nest on the ledge ,or in the cup. Instead they made their nest in a dog crate. While they where out flying around in my basement they found the dog crate ,and the pair went in and made nesting call ,so I put the crate in their cage and BANG ,half an hour later the male and female where making a nest. Nothing goes in or out of that dog crate excpet for mr and mrs saxon. The other thing is there is a two inch lip on the enterance to the dog crate ,so I dont really think they could roll an egg into the crate. The other thing is the Serama with them only lays 2 or 3 times a moth ,and she last layed a few days ago. The other thing is Serama eggs are _always_ cream colored ,and this egg is white. Keep in mind this serama hen is the same size as the pigeons ,so that could explain for the same sized eggs if the pigeon layed it.


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## george simon (Feb 28, 2006)

*Rooster Needed*

*Let them sit the chicken egg it will not hatch as a rooster is needed to get a fertile egg. So no harm is done by letting they sit the egg.*GEORGE


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Pigeons won't normally nest on a ledge. They should have a nest box to nest in. But it should also be raised up off the floor where the chicken cannot get any where near it. If they did have babies, it might hurt them. It's probably their egg. You'll know if they lay another in a day or so.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Ya ,and o.k ,I will raise it up on some bricks. However trust me ,nothing is getting in that nest. Those saxons wont let _anything_ near their nest ,or on their ledge. putting the nest up wouldnt make much of a difference ,Seramas are very light ,and can fly 20 feet strait up and get a good 15 feet forwards...they have big wings and a light ,small body.

I will be sure to post pics.

Edit :

Once they finish nesting this time ,I will build a nest box under their ledge ,so they will have a nice dark raised nest box to nest in.

Only the best for my birds


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

That would be great ! And we'll be waiting to see pictures. Let us know when they have another egg.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Yup ,I will be sure to post updates !!

They are the best parents ,very protective.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

there are a few worries Im reading here... one is the chicken with the pigeons and the pigeon nest on the floor in a crate..not ideal... even if the chicken (serama) is small, it can harm baby pigeons in the nest, and a pigeon is not a match for a chicken no matter how small the chicken is...another is housing these two poulty together...not a good idea as chickens can carry diesease that can make pigeons sick. I think it would be wise to have the chicken seperate, she needs another chicken/s to keep her company. I have seramas and they are lovely chickens..but they are chickens all the same and can harm small babies....


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> there are a few worries Im reading here... one is the chicken with the pigeons and the pigeon nest on the floor in a crate..not ideal... even if the chicken (serama) is small, it can harm baby pigeons in the nest, and a pigeon is not a match for a chicken no matter how small the chicken is...another is housing these two poulty together...not a good idea as chickens can carry diesease that can make pigeons sick. I think it would be wise to have the chicken seperate, she needs another chicken/s to keep her company. I have seramas and they are lovely chickens..but they are chickens all the same and can harm small babies....


I know the chickens could harm the pigeons, and that it is a bad idea to house them together, but didn't know that they could make them sick. All the more reason to not keep them together.


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## Startail Fan (Oct 20, 2009)

Well I could take her out...however my Fantail who is in with the Monks and Spaz (serama) is really bonded to Spaz ,and I had Spaz get an impacted crop about two weeks ago so I took spaz upstairs to make sure she was good and the poor fantail seemded so depressed with out her ,and I hate to sound mean ,but I really have no-wear to put spaz and the fan-tail right now 

I will keep spaz in while the monks are incubating ,and in the 15 days untill the eggs hatch I will build her a cage ,and she and the fantail can chill in there untill the monks chicks have fledged.


I have had spaz and the fantail together for 2 years ,so Im sure if spaz had something ,it would have gotten the fanny by now.


And finally an update...

The mom layed the second egg ,and is setting tight. Only 15 or so more days !!


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

you need to see the problem is chickens eat bugs, worms, moving things made out of flesh and guts, have you ever seen a chicken go after a bug...I have seem then peck and eat a mouse and a frog.. (not mine), they will even peck and kill others baby chicken chicks... so you see your helpless squab babies would be sitting targets and very interesting to the chicken if she would to catch site of them in the nest. If the fan and the chicken do well togehter perhaps that will be ok, but I have my reservations about them being in a cage together...


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## Pawbla (Jan 6, 2009)

Apparently he's going to build another cage for the fantail and the chicken before the squabs are born, Spirit Wings.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

spirit wings said:


> you need to see the problem is chickens eat bugs, worms, moving things made out of flesh and guts, have you ever seen a chicken go after a bug...I have seem then peck and eat a mouse and a frog.. (not mine), they will even peck and kill others baby chicken chicks... so you see your helpless squab babies would be sitting targets and very interesting to the chicken if she would to catch site of them in the nest. If the fan and the chicken do well togehter perhaps that will be ok, but I have my reservations about them being in a cage together...


I have heard that chickens could easily kill a pigeon. I wouldn't put the two of them in a cage together where the pigeon can't get away if needed. No matter how friendly they seem toward each other. In a cage it could be a different matter. Not a good idea.


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## spirit wings (Mar 29, 2008)

Pawbla said:


> Apparently he's going to build another cage for the fantail and the chicken before the squabs are born, Spirit Wings.


I know, I did read that part. it does not change a thing I wanted to share, so I don't see your point. sorry.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Pawbla said:


> Apparently he's going to build another cage for the fantail and the chicken before the squabs are born, Spirit Wings.


Pawbla, I believe she felt as I did, that it isn't a great idea for ANY chicken to be caged with ANY pigeon. Chickens, no matter how nice, can and do hurt pigeons. Even pigeons will fight with pigeons, and chickens will fight with chickens. But if for some reason the chicken should become aggressive with this pigeon, the pigeon really wouldn't have much chance, and no where to go to get away. Just don't think they should be caged together, that's all.


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## Pawbla (Jan 6, 2009)

I was talking about what Spirit said on the Chicken/Squab thing:



spirit wings said:


> so you see your helpless squab babies would be sitting targets and very interesting to the chicken if she would to catch site of them in the nest.


I didn't say anything on a chicken and a pigeon housed together. I was just talking about that small part of the post. I thought Spirit may have skipped the post so she was still talking about the same issue.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Pawbla said:


> I was talking about what Spirit said on the Chicken/Squab thing:
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't say anything on a chicken and a pigeon housed together. I was just talking about that small part of the post. I thought Spirit may have skipped the post so she was still talking about the same issue.


Thanks for clarifying that.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Jay3 said:


> I have heard that chickens could easily kill a pigeon. I wouldn't put the two of them in a cage together where the pigeon can't get away if needed. No matter how friendly they seem toward each other. In a cage it could be a different matter. Not a good idea.



This is true from my experience with pigeons and chickens. Chickens really do have more of a pecking order and pigeons don't understand. Two pigeons that wintered over in my chicken coop where constantly chased off by the hen's and were forced to stay well out of their way to avoid getting pecked.


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## Pawbla (Jan 6, 2009)

No problem 
Chickens do seem pretty aggressive to me. Spirit Wings is right about the live things, chickens eat pretty much anything . One of my grandmothers had chickens. I wouldn't want to get inside their yard, lol.

If you still think they should be housed together, is there any way you could make a chickenproof cage area? So, if something bad happens, the fanny can hide from the chicken. Or make a really tall cage. I'm not sure how flight capable are those species of chickens.


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