# Baby born @ 230am need help..



## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

*Frill Back Baby! New Pic 8/22/06 Plus new question!!*

Okay once again my crested frill backs have had a baby. This chick was born at 230am. The time now is 854am... I just went out to check up on it. I don't think they have fed him/her yet. I don't even think they have been sitting on him/her yet either. I'm not sure what to do... I starting to think they are not good parents. So if this baby does make it I might break the pair up and not let them breed anymore. Should I pull the baby and try to hand raise it. Or should I let nature take it course. Me, I'm for pulling chick but I know they need the first few feeding from there mom because they need that crops milks for the first week to even have a good chance of living. Should I give them more time or pull the baby. I know all it takes is a little cold to kill the little guy. And I really want him to make... I'm be signed on all day. To get feed back. So please HELP!


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, I suppose there are two very important questions: 1) do you know how and have the supplies to feed a chick from the egg; and 2) what's the temperature there?

Pidgey


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Well right now it is 72 degrees. And I have exact baby bird food forumal. I hand raise parakeets and cockatiel all the time.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, if you've done that from the egg, then you should be able to do this. If the parents still aren't sitting on the little one or feeding it then giving a little bit of food certainly isn't going to hurt. If the chick is cold though, it's a bad idea and you'd need to warm it up first before you do.

Pidgey


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Okay I have pulled him/her. I Have it sitting under a light right now. I know they have to be at least 100 degrees. All I have are basic lamps.. Should I put him under a 60watt, 75 watt, 100 watt buld...? And if so How many inches away should I keep the light...


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## karla (Jul 8, 2006)

I had a similar problem like you with the parents abandon the eggs, I took the eggs and I put them under a lamp for 2 more days until one hatched .
I kept the baby bird cover with a warm scarf and put him under a 60 watts lamp a few centimeter apart around 7 cm apart and cheching if he was warm because they get cold feet if the are not getting enough light. 
Housing :

Down-covered young birds should be kept in a cardboard box indoors away from pets and small children and out of direct sun or drafts. Keep the temperature in the box between 80ºand 90º F. A lamp with a 40 or 60 watt bulb should provide enough heat, but don't put the lamp directly over the bird. This won't be necessary if the bird is fully feathered.
For more information here is a good link 
http://www.csub.edu/fact/baby_bird_care.htm

Karla


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Oddly enough, you can put a feather duster over the chicks and that'll do pretty good about keeping them warm. You should use a thermometer to make sure that the actual energy reaching the bird is maintaining the warmth around the 90 degree mark, though. While their body temperature is around 107 deg. F., they're actually a bit too hot when you've got the temperature up there like that. The danger is that you'll dehydrate them.

Pidgey


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

So far so good..... I'll just cross my fingers and hope this little guy makes it. I tried hand raising a baby pigeon before and things looked great with that little guy and then one day all of a sudden just died. And I still never understood why. Because he was doing really well.... But we'll see what happens...


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

One of the biggest causes in sudden, unexplained death in baby birds is aspiration pneumonia. If you don't feed the baby properly, then the baby may aspirate formula. The only signs they show usually is a crackling sound when they breathe. That's how you diagnose aspiration pneumonia. Make sure to listen to the young one's breathing. Feed with the end of a baby bottle nipple or a syringe with the end cut off and a part of a ballon on the end, held on by an elastic band. Please look here: http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=16432


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Okay feeding are going great... But one thing... Pooing... I just had to force the little guy to poop. I notice when I just went to feed him about 5 mintues ago I have not change the piece of tolet paper it is sleeping not once today. And the baby had been eating all day long. SO I flip him/her over and looked at it's underside. And I could see all the poo that is just not passsing. I had to use a nipple syringe plus some warm water to fluss the little guy out... Is this something I should keep an eye on?


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Is it possible that the formula is too thick? The baby might also be dehydrated, or too cold.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Yes, you really need to watch this closely. Like Vasp said he may be too cool and dehydrated. You need to keep him on a heating pad in something like a margarine or cool whip container with lots of shredded paper towels in it with clean tissue on top of that to where he is about 2/3 high in the container. We usually put a tissue on top of our babies to help hold in the warmth.

Try diluting the formula a little and you can use either Benebac or plain yogurt added to the formula to help it digest food better.


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

Cyn79 said:


> Okay feeding are going great... But one thing... Pooing... I just had to force the little guy to poop. I notice when I just went to feed him about 5 mintues ago I have not change the piece of tolet paper it is sleeping not once today. And the baby had been eating all day long. SO I flip him/her over and looked at it's underside. And I could see all the poo that is just not passsing. I had to use a nipple syringe plus some warm water to fluss the little guy out... Is this something I should keep an eye on?



A drop of olive oil will also help. I notice one of my hatchlings seemed to be a little stopped up, so I fed the parents extra safflower seeds (as they are oily) after that he became quite regular.

As Maggie has already mentioned don't forget the kefir/yogurt or Benebac, as it is EXTREMELY important for the survival of hatchlings.


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

I think the only time I had to assist a baby bird to poop was when the bird's digestive system was shutting down. The little robin was unhealthy from the time I found it, and had chilled too long. It's possibly from lack of food in the digestive system, lack of water, or lack of warmth. Lack of nutrients might also do this - like gut bacteria. That's why BeneBac is very useful.

Even so, I raised a baby pigeon simply on Kaytee Exact before. I would not recommend it, though, because they grow more slowly on just Kaytee. Add things to Kaytee, and at least add BeneBac.


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Well I have been feeding him the Kaytee, I'm trying to get some ROUDY BUSH SQUAB FORMULA. But the closes place is 1 1/2 hours a away and shipping will take days to get here. I was talking to man man here who raises pigoens and he was said I could try fostering him with another mother with one chick... Does that work?


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

Of course it works, so as long as the other squab is within 2 days of this one's age.


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Well the baby pigeon is still alive so far so good. I went to the man house who was offering to foster the bay with one of his pigeons. But I just didn't like the things I saw. The pigeon seemed pretty healthy But there were alot of sick birds too. Plus the place was flithy. And it smeel of dead animals big time. I was told by another guy I've been talking to on my AIM that is about two weeks I should start smashing up some seed with the peas and mix it with warm water & the exact hand feeding formula and start feedin the baby that. Is that something that should be done or should I just stick to the exact formula?


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## Pigeonpal2002 (Jul 27, 2002)

Cyn79 said:


> I was told by another guy I've been talking to on my AIM that is *about two weeks I should start smashing up some seed with the peas and mix it with warm water & the exact hand feeding formula and start feedin the baby that.* Is that something that should be done or should I just stick to the exact formula?



Hi Cyn, 

Yes, this is a good idea. It will give the pigeon more to "chew on" so to speak Pigeon pellets can be ground up as well, mixed with a bit of water into a paste and fed as well.


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## stephie (May 17, 2006)

Hi Cyn,
I know Brad is quite experienced at this stuff (and I'm certainly not!), but I just thought I'd offer a word of caution...
When Robbie was maybe a month old, I ground up a few seeds into a powder and mixed just a bit in with his formula. Maybe it was unrelated, but that was the first and only time he got a big hard crop and needed warm water & a massage to help it pass... I was scared so after that I just left it up to him to decide when he was ready to eat seeds.
Just thought I'd mention it since your little guy already had some digestion issues, you'll probably want to start out with a very tiny amount.


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

stephie said:


> Hi Cyn,
> I know Brad is quite experienced at this stuff (and I'm certainly not!), but I just thought I'd offer a word of caution...
> When Robbie was maybe a month old, I ground up a few seeds into a powder and mixed just a bit in with his formula. Maybe it was unrelated, but that was the first and only time he got a big hard crop and needed warm water & a massage to help it pass... I was scared so after that I just left it up to him to decide when he was ready to eat seeds.
> Just thought I'd mention it since your little guy already had some digestion issues, you'll probably want to start out with a very tiny amount.


It's very true that a change in diet can cause an upset stomach. I believe, however, it also may have been that the food you were offering was too thick, or that you offered too much, as hard crop can come from that.

I'm very glad you resolved the problem, however.


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Well so far the little guy is doing great. Growing really good and both eyes are open.. I'll post a picture really soon. 
I'm praying I don't have a repeat of what happen the last time I was hand raising a baby pigeon. He was almost three week and just died one day out of the blue. And it happened so fast it was wierd. Not even 5 mintues before he past awat he was active and bouncing around then a few minutes later he was dead....


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Pictures...


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## Skyeking (Jan 17, 2003)

How much is the baby weighing now? Are you keeping track of the growth?


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## Vasp (Jul 25, 2006)

My babies sort of look like that now.  Really silly. One of them is 4 days old and one is 3 days old. The 4 day-old has its eyes open pretty wide and most of the time, and the 3 day old baby often opens its eyes, but not all the time. The 3 day old is turning BLACK. I think it has the dirty factor and will be completely dark gray. The other is still pinkish, so it may be mottled, or more likely, blue bar. As for your baby, it's looking quite dark, however, not very dark. What breed of pigeon is this?


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

They are Crested Frill Backs... 

Mom








Dad


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Cyn79 said:


> Well the baby pigeon is still alive so far so good. I went to the man house who was offering to foster the bay with one of his pigeons. But I just didn't like the things I saw. The pigeon seemed pretty healthy But there were alot of sick birds too. Plus the place was flithy. And it smeel of dead animals big time. I was told by another guy I've been talking to on my AIM that is about two weeks I should start smashing up some seed with the peas and mix it with warm water & the exact hand feeding formula and start feedin the baby that. Is that something that should be done or should I just stick to the exact formula?


The pictures are adorable! I wondered about the house that you visited, where the birds were sick and filthy and it smelled of dead animals. Did you have a chance to report this to the animal authorities? Sounds like something that should be checked out immediately. It's a pain to do and nobody likes to get other people in trouble, but since animals can't speak up for themselves, sometimes we have to step in and do something for them


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

maryjane said:


> The pictures are adorable! I wondered about the house that you visited, where the birds were sick and filthy and it smelled of dead animals. Did you have a chance to report this to the animal authorities? Sounds like something that should be checked out immediately. It's a pain to do and nobody likes to get other people in trouble, but since animals can't speak up for themselves, sometimes we have to step in and do something for them


To me there were a lot of sick birds, Maybe about 25 that i seen. But all the sick birds were in lofts that were for sick birds. This guy has over 500 pigeons on his property. So I don't know if that # is high or low for people who work in pigeon circles. All the birds did have fresh food and water. And He does treat all his sick birds. I went there today to pick up some feed. And the dead animal smell I found out was from a nieghbors cat who had a litter of kittens under his porch. The kitten I guess died from the heat. So I was told... I was also told the MSPCA goes to his home randomly to make sure everything is in order. Neighbor call them a lot. The man is old and his sons who live in other towns come to clean up his place. It was really clean today. But I still wouldn't take a chance especially with this crazy weather we have been having. One of the sons told me they have built a house and plan to move his closer to were they live. So he is in the process of selling off all his birds with in the next years or so...


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## maryjane (Jul 15, 2006)

Well, that's good if he gets regular checks and the sick birds are isolated and treated. Fresh water and food is always good too lol. It just sounded bad I guess. 500 pigeons! Can't imagine what kind of upkeep that would take!  Thanks for letting me know


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## battler (Sep 4, 2005)

so, did the parents sit on the eggs or did you use some kind of incubator?


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

They sat on the egg. I think the promblem is the other pair that is with them. The loft I have is big enough for about 4 pairs. But I think I need to put the frills in there own loft...


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

Well The baby crested frill back is still alive and growing nicely... Kind of... My concern now is his leg, which stretches all most straight out behind him. I try doing little excersizes to see if that will help bring it forward but that is not working...


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Whoa! That's not good. Please search here for posts on splay leg or spraddle leg .. you'll find some methods for trying to correct this. Unless this is a congenital defect or a broken bone problem, I'd suspect splay leg. You really need to address this ASAP while the bird is still young enough to have a chance of at least a partial correction of the problem. Make very sure that you have something that gives good traction in the bottom of the nest container .. also get something narrower at the bottom that will help keep the leg in the proper position. Truly, don't delay in dealing with this. I'm sorry that I don't have the time this evening to search out the links to the posts for you, but they are here.

Terry


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## Lin Hansen (Jan 9, 2004)

Cyn,

This is a good previous post from Cynthia (Cyro) concerning correcting splay leg. There is a link within the post that you can click on to see the pictures of Cynthia's procedure for correcting splay leg. 

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showpost.php?p=65571&postcount=4

There are other posts you can look at as well....just utilize the "Search" at top of the page. Click on it and type "correcting splay legs" in the box....many previous thread will come up that you can look through for further information

Good luck,
Linda


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## Cyn79 (Apr 10, 2006)

I have a parakeet with a really bad case is splay legs... It was to late to do anything for him. But the pigeons leg is sticking straight out behind him.. It is not splitting to the side as if he was doing the splits.


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

Cyn,

It's good you are knowledgeable about splay leg. Still, you need to try and do something while this bird is young enough to have a good chance of improvement in the problem. If it's not splay leg, the bird needs to see a vet to determine for sure what the problem is. 

Terry


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