# Help me!



## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I found a baby dove or pigeon today - I'm not sure how old it is - it can get itself airborne, and flap or glide for about 6-10 feet. It's tail feathers are JUST starting to come in, and it's still got some pinfeathers. If I'd seen it in a garden I'd have just left it, but leaving it on a sidewalk in Lima, Peru next to a busy street just wasnt' really an option. :/

I'm reading everything I can find on this site to take care of the little guy, but I need some quick information and don't have time to read through everything, if you don't mind bearing with me. 

He's shedding a lot of what looks like almost dandruff - I seem to remember my parrot having this too, though not in such large quantity - is it normal?

I've had trouble getting it to take food, but seeing the 'nipple technique' in another thread, I may have found a way around that. 

Guesstimates on age? And how much time between feedings at this age? And can it go all night without food? I have a completely closed in Patio Garden (10 foot walls, not a fence!) Would leaving him loose out there in the daytime be ok, provided its not too cold? How cold is too cold? 

I have some 'chicken mash' - looks kind of like 'GrapeNuts' cereal, you mix with warm water to make food for baby chickens - is this ok to give the pidge? He didn't seem to be dehydrated at all when I got him, quite lively and healthy looking - but now that he's gone most of the day without anything but a few drops of water, I'm quite concerned. I wish I'd found this site earlier in the day!! Now that I've seen the nipple, and read about 'burrito birds', i have a feeling I'll do much better. Anyway, I'd appreciate any help I can get. 

Kelly


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

More than likely, he's never drank water the normal way yet. And, he's never seen food. All he knows is that when he sticks his beak in his parents' beaks, there's food there. When you get them like this, the often take awhile to get thirsty and hungry enough to really how to self-feed and eat seeds. You can hold water in a cup in front of him and guide his beak down into water, often by gently pushing the back of his head so that it barely dips his beak in the water. If he's really thirsty, he'll figure it out and drink like he's been doing it for years. That doesn't mean that he'll recognize the water the next time you put it in front of him, though.

Is there any way you can post a picture?

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Yes, I'll take a pic right now. I've got a 5cc syringe, I've been using that to put a few drops on the edge of his beak - I'll switch over to the sugar/salt water to be on the safe side.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

To give you an idea of how much they drink, they usually consume from 5 to 8% of their weight in water per day. If you've got a kitchen scale, you might be able to weigh the bird and get an idea of how much water he should be getting in.

In order to post a picture on the forum, it needs to be less than 100 KB in memory size. Also, you have to use the "Go Advanced" button below the text-entry window and then scroll down to the "Manage Attachments" button to upload.

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Here are some pics... He looks much more pathetic in the pictures than he does in real life.  He actually flew about 10 feet across the kitchen before banging into the cupboard and dropping into the trash bin. I've got his box sitting a top the lit oven at the moment, not sure what else I can do to keep him warm. We've got no incandescent bulbs or lamps, and no heating pad. I could use the 'rice in the micro' trick, but don't think it'd last through the night. 

And we did get a few cc's of chicken mash - very thin - into him.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Does he feel cold?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Looks more like a dove and he also looks like he's wilting a bit. You're going to need to get enough rehydrating solution to bring him back to the land of the living. Has he made any poops?

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Yes, actually, I'm pretty sure it's a dove. He's pooped several times - mostly whitish liquid with a bit of greenish-brown stool - fairly normal looking, if I'm not mistaken. 

Should I continue with giving solution through out the night, or is it best to let him rest? I hate to keep disturbing him while he sleeps. 

He doesn't feel cool, I've got him in a cardboard box sitting on the lit oven, it's quite warm.


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## Anton (Apr 4, 2007)

*It's a Dove, I Think.*

I think this is a dove. They're able to fly for few feet at this age. To keep it warm, fill a couple of bottles with hot water, wrap them with towels and place the bottles around the bird in a box.
I hand fed a dove that I obtained when it was about the same age as yours. Here is a video clip of me feeding it. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0znqWNoN4rY
Good luck.

Anton


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Having mostly whitish liquid is actually bad--it's indicative of dehydration and that's the biggest reason that he's sleepy. That said, keep working on it.

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Pidgey said:


> Having mostly whitish liquid is actually bad--it's indicative of dehydration and that's the biggest reason that he's sleepy. That said, keep working on it.
> 
> Pidgey


Ah.. well, then, I'll start pushing more then. Thanks for that information.

Thanks to everyone - Hopefully I can pull this little guy through.


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Where abouts are you located, maybe there is someone close by to you.

fp


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

They are in, LIma Peru


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Do you happen to have a down vest, or a jacket that you could unbutton the
hood from? Down articles of clothing really keep them warm and is pretty
good at keeping them warm also. Think I'd worry more about the hydration
than feeding. 

fp


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## TAWhatley (Mar 6, 2001)

feralpigeon said:


> Where abouts are you located, maybe there is someone close by to you.
> 
> fp


Lima, Peru .. I don't think we have any resources there. 

Terry


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

Ahhh, maybe they won't have down....perhaps wool??

fp


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

It's not terribly cold there right now, 61.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Yes, it's not too cold here, but very humid, makes it feel colder than it is. 

I'm keeping him on the oven, like I said - oven on low, door open, box sitting on the door - he's quite snug at the moment. And he just took quite a bit of the sugar/salt water, drank like a champ from the end of the syringe - 5 cc syringe, hard to say exactly how much got into him, but he was definitely doing a lot of swallowing. How often should I do that? Once an hour? every 2 hours? 

Luckily my kids are on break from school, so I don't have to worry about getting up in the morning.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I am concerned about you leaving him on the oven door unattended and then him getting too hot. Do you have a down vest you can put underneath him with a towel on top so it doesn't get mucked up? If not that, then something he can snuggle into for comfort and warmth?
Since you gave him the 5cc, have there been any more poops?


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Oh, i'm not leaving him - I'm right here beside him - my computer is in my kitchen. And I won't be leaving him there when I go to bed... I've got a soda bottle to fill with warm water, wrap in a towel and put in beside him. 

He did a poop whilst I was giving him water - he's actually done quite a few - say 8? - since I found him this afternoon. It's got the white liquid part, with greenish-brown stool. Maybe I'll try to get a picture of that, so you can let me know if it's normal looking. 

I really don't think he was long from the nest when I found him - quite alert and active. There are a lot of loose dogs here, and I think if he'd been there for very long, one of them would have found him first, and this story would have a much sadder ending.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

YA know, a poop picture would be fabulous.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I just took him up to try a little more water, and he was kind enough to poop on my hand for the camera. I tried rubbing his beak a little, and he did some finger nuzzling, too. Seemed quite eager for some more water. 

So, here's the poop.


And if anyone had ever told me that one day I'd be posting pictures of bird poop on the internet, i'd have thought they were insane.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

How much more water did he take?. 
Sounds like he's pretty alert now, right?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

The way the poop came across to me, it looks bright green, lime color. Is that correct? Have all the poops been similar color and size?


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

The poops are actually a bit more brown than showing up in the picture, probably due to the proximity of the flash. And he just did another, so that's 2 in about 20 minutes. Earlier there was more white liquid. 

He took 2 cc's of water eagerly, then made it very clear he wanted no more, actively fighting against the syringe, and turning his head away from it, where before he kept his beak right next to it.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Ok. Personally I would let him sleep for a bit and you sleep for a bit as well. 
If he were here, I would set my alarm for three hours and check him again and offer him some of that chicken mix formula you gave him earlier. I don't think he is as dehydrated as we thought at first.
Lets reconvene in the morning and talk about what else you might feed him. I don't think that after this first night, you will need to worry about getting up in the night any more.
If you run into any trouble during the night, there will likely be someone on line that can help you. 
Regardless, keep us posted because I for one will worry about how you're doing.
I'll leave my light on for a little while longer and check this thread again in about 15 minutes time just in case you have any more concerns or questions.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Thanks for your concern and help. I've been checking about a bit, and now have a much better idea on how to feed him - God bless people posting their feeding videos on Youtube - I'm feeling much more confident in being able to do good for him.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

So you'll check in with us in the morning, right?


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## richardtheman (Jul 24, 2007)

Dude it is definitely a dove! As a kid in grade school i raised some bald babies younger than that.

1.) get a box with hole like show box. puncture holes for air
2.) hand feed him rice into his mouth(or birdseed), he will soon do it himself 2 or 3 times a day
3.) unlike pigeons they lightning fast! give him water with drop or open his mouth and.....

Done this many times and 100% success! even as grade school kid
You will be fine, he is pretty old and will eat himself soon and will fear u


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## richardtheman (Jul 24, 2007)

richardtheman said:


> Dude it is definitely a dove! As a kid in grade school i raised some bald babies younger than that.
> 
> 1.) get a box with hole like show box. puncture holes for air
> 2.) hand feed him rice into his mouth(or birdseed), he will soon do it himself 2 or 3 times a day
> ...



also please do not put poop in your hands and take pics anymore  discusting


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## richardtheman (Jul 24, 2007)

Charis said:


> So you'll check in with us in the morning, right?


just open his mouth and insert the food,,, make sue u can feel it in his tommie


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Your new found friend is a White Winged Dove.  

Cindy


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

richardtheman said:


> also please do not put poop in your hands and take pics anymore  discusting


Dude. :/ I'm not the one that put it there! 

I'll definitely check in in the morning, let y'all know how he's doing. 

And thanks for the species identification. 

edit - actually, I looked around a bit, and I think what i've got is a Pacific Dove, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Dove


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Fnnkybutt said:


> *Dude. :/ I'm not the one that put it there!*
> 
> I'll definitely check in in the morning, let y'all know how he's doing.
> 
> *And thanks for the species identification*.


  

You're most welcome.  

Cindy


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

One other quick question. I read somewhere this evening about stress possibly causing an imbalance in the flora of the digestive system. I've got yogurt with live culture - would it be good to mix a bit in with his gruel in the morning to perhaps ward off any problems?




And one quick update before bed - I got him up to give him some more water, but he was nuzzling my fingers so frantically, I took some of the gruel onto my fingers and he ate it up. And then pooped in gratitude.  Tomorrow I'll get a nipple or syringe if I can find one, though I think, if what I've read about doves is correct, he'll be ready for self feeding before too much longer.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Hi, the yogurt will be excellent for your little dove. We use it all the time in our formula for baby pigeons and doves. 

While it is on formula its poop will be moist and basically look like the formula you use. Try leaving small seed in its box all the time and it will soon learn how to eat. As long as you're feeding him formula he should not need water in his box but as soon as he is eating seed well, add a small container of water for him. After it has learned to eat seed, its poop will firm up and look like little brown pellets.

We've found that a small plastic box with numerous holes drilled into the lid works beautifully for young doves. We put a towel in the bottom. I'm thinking you don't need to be concerned much longer about keeping him near a heat source because of his size/age and his feathers look pretty good.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Thanks for your comments, L. Tarheel. He seems to be doing well this morning, I gave him water at 6am, then managed to sleep a few hours, and now he's eating gruel from my hand again. 

I gave him the chicken mash, as that's what I've got. I'll mix a touch of yogurt with it for his next feeding, and go to the market and pick up some seed. We usually have some here, as we've a bird feeder on the back patio, but of course, we'd be all out now. 

When he starts eating seed, will I need to supplement with gravel? 

I'm keeping a warm water bottle in the box with him, just to be safe, I figure if i'm feeling chilly, he is too.

Does he seem to be of the age that he'd be leaving the nest? He really is trying to fly quite a bit, and not doing too badly. He flew a good 10 feet several times last night, clumsily, and not sure how to stop, but he doesn't seem to have trouble getting up in the air. I mentioned before, my back patio is very well enclosed - should I let him loose on the patio as long as it's not too cool out? I'm unsure about keeping him in a box if he should be learning to stretch his wings.


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## SkyofAngels (Jun 28, 2007)

Maybe I misread but did you say he is on a lit oven in a cardboard box? Is that safe? For most of my animals I use heat lamps,with my birds I use a warm water bottle. It seems to me that is alot safer for the bird and for you and your family. Maybe some of the more experienced members can weigh in. Since I became a Mom I have been overly paranoid so maybe thats kicking in now, and my nephew left something on a lit stove once and when they can home my sister found her house engulfed in flames so I am concerned about something like that happening to you.


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## SkyofAngels (Jun 28, 2007)

Oops I didn't notice the second page til after I posted this 
I guess the oven thing was already addressed


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

What a good Dove mom you are.
I'm delighted you are feeding the little Dove and I agree with Maggie that you don't need to supply heat.
The baby does need to practice flying but my concern with putting him outside on your patio is that if he should get over the wall, he would be doomed. 
Any place inside where he can practice those skills safely?
I thank you for rescuing this little one when most people would have kept on walking. Thank you for staying up late into the night to make sure he was ok. You must be tired today. Tired and in my eye, a good soul.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

The kitchen is definitely out - It's got plenty of space, but it also has a large plate glass window that he seems to be trying to head for every time he takes off - I can try the living room - at least there windows are covered by blinds. I had originally put him on the patio yesterday, because I didn't know what else to do with him - and he hopped around some and hid under the geraniums. But yeah, I was concerned too with what might happen if he went over the wall - I don't think he could get that high, but I don't want to put it past him. 


I just woke up from 4 hours of sleep, and he seemed a little cool to the touch to me. So I'm warming him up in front of the oven again before I give him more food. We don't have heat in our house (fairly typical for Lima) and it stays about 60 degrees in here most of the time - it's actually warmer outside during the day.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

And an update - I got across to the market and bought a nipple and some bird seed. Mixed up a mushy batch of the chicken mash, a little yogurt and the seed - put it in the nipple, and he ate better than ever. I can actually see his little crop poking out a bit this time. I fed him until he started falling asleep, chirping and squeeking. 

I weighed him today - 80 grams. So, any idea how much food he should be eating daily? A roundish estimate?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Young pigeons usually eat from 10 to 15% of their weight per meal, three times per day. That would mean that you'd be looking at 8 to 12 milliliters of formula/mush/whatever of hydrated food per meal roughly. There is some leeway there because a bird can get a lot less and still manage. It might end up a bit stunted but it can survive.

Pidgey


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## richardtheman (Jul 24, 2007)

Pidgey said:


> Young pigeons usually eat from 10 to 15% of their weight per meal, three times per day. That would mean that you'd be looking at 8 to 12 milliliters of formula/mush/whatever of hydrated food per meal roughly. There is some leeway there because a bird can get a lot less and still manage. It might end up a bit stunted but it can survive.
> 
> Pidgey


Wow, great facts Pidgey... I always wondered that. I will make note and make sure my youngs eat based on those guidelines. Seems like the father does not want to feed my squabs anymore.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Thanks Pidgey - that's great information and makes me feel a lot more sure about what I'm doing - I'd say he ate about a teaspoon full, so that's 5cc, I'm sure as he and I get a little more practice with this, he'll eat even more. 

My thanks to everyone here, again - Yesterday afternoon, I was nearly resigned to seeing another little bird die - now I'm fairly certain we'll be flying in no time at all.


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## flitsnowzoom (Mar 20, 2007)

There is a member on PT Camila that is in Lima (or was a few months ago)
Here's her thread
http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=19847

You can always try email since she hasn't been on in quite some time. Good luck with this baby.


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

Eighty grams is a pretty nice weight for a young dove his size but I would try to get at least 10-12 cc in him at each feeding for a few days and then increase it to about 15 cc per feeding. Always check his crop though and it should be nice and plump but not tight feeling. Also, keep small seed in front of him all the time.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

My baby is not looking good this morning. He's slow and lethargic and puffed up. Last night he was chirping and eating well, though he seems to tire quickly. His poop doesn't look good either - lots of white, and it has dried up in a lump in the feathers around his cloaca. 

I'm thinking for the morning at least I should switch back to rehydrating fluid? Any advice?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I'm so sorry to hear the baby isn't doing well. Clean the poop from his bottom and make sure he isn't blocked. Keep him warm. 
Have you allowed his crop to empty each time before feeding? He could have a sour crop.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I've never been able to get enough into him at one time to fill his crop. He gets tired and starts going to sleep after about 4-5 cc's of food. I've gone about 5 hours between feeding, but it had been about 10 hours since his last feeding. Last night he was chirping for food, but this morning he just doesn't seem interested.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Maybe he's not getting enough food. 
OPen his mouth, look inside and tell us what it looks like. Any yellow cheesey looking spots?


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Have you still been feeding the chicken mash?


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Not that I can see. He does feel a little cool. The thermometer I have in his box said it was just under 80 degrees, but he feels cool to my touch. I've put him in front of heat again to see if I can't warm him up a little. Perhaps he'll be a bit more responsive. 

I've cleaned the poop off from underneath him - it looked like a little ball of white chalk - no other color to it, just white.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Charis said:


> Have you still been feeding the chicken mash?


Thin chicken mash mixed with a few drops of live culture yogurt and canary seed.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

No solids in the poop?
How does the crop feel?

Reti


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

No solids in the poop that was stuck to his butt. some in the poop in the bottom of the cage. 

His crop feels empty.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Do you have a pet store in your area where you can pick up a hand feeding formula?
If they have EXACT by Kaytee that would be great.
Although I can't see the baby, it feelsto me, from your description, it just isn't getting enough to eat.
Reti is going to jump in to help you because I need to leave, although I will check in as I can.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Give him some fluids and follow with food.
As Charis mentioned, he might not be getting enough food.

Reti


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

That's my opinion too, that he hasn't been eating enough. There are pet stores around, but I'm in Peru - I've never seen specialized stuff in the pet stores. The only bird supplies I could find yesterday were seed cages and calcium blocks.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I've warmed him up some, and he seemed to perk up a little, but just a very little. I mixed chicken mash with rehydrating fluid and skimmed the thinnest part of the liquid off. When I stick his beak in it, he ate it eagerly for about 2 cc's worth, then I had to really fight to keep him awake and eat a little more. I'd say I got maybe 4 cc's in total. I'll try doing that once an hour and keeping his box at 85 degrees.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Remember, only add food if the crop is empty.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

It always seems to me that they get sleepy for a couple of reasons: cold and illness. Frankly, at that age, I wouldn't expect him to get cold with the weather being what you say, nor would I expect him to get cold with the feathers that he has. When they don't get enough food, they usually get louder and more insistent. That said, I expect the little fellows got an illness. Pigeons (and doves, most birds actually) don't usually get a fever when they're fighting infection like we do--their temperature tends to drop in most cases. There are very few illnesses that will cause their temperature to go up.

So, the question then becomes whether you want to wait it out and see what happens, all the while trying to keep him fed and a lot warmer (have you got a light fixture that you can get him near to?), or did you want to try and get some antibiotics to add to that?

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I'm keeping him in his box and am maintaining the temp in there between 80 and 85 degrees, is that warm enough? 

I can take a stab at getting some antibiotics - I can buy most stuff over the counter, it's just a matter of knowing what it's called in Spanish.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Things are not looking good - 

First, he had a poop that had a bit of solid in it, and I thought, hey, maybe he's turning around a little.

Now, he's had a very liquidy poop, and it looks like the liquid is green. 

I'm guessing thats a bad thing.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Sorry, the server went down at work.

Trimethoprim/Sulfa. The names of the ingredients don't change much in Spanish. Trade names vary and there are many like CoTrim, BacTrim and SulfaTrim. They are slightly different combinations of Trimethoprim and a Sulfa drug like Sulfamethoxasole or Sulfadiazine.

Pidgey


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## Whitefeather (Sep 2, 2002)

Fnnkybutt said:


> I've warmed him up some, and he seemed to perk up a little, but just a very little.


My apologies if this has already been suggested. 
You can place the box under a low wattage lamp. This will give direct, supplement heat to the little one, thus helping to maintain his normal body temp. 

Cindy


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I'm keeping him in front of the oven again, with a hot water bottle in the box - Unfortunately, we don't have any lamps like that - we use all CFL (fluorescent) bulbs, so there's very little heat generated.


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I'm pretty sure they gave me Bactrim here for one of my kid's - I'll go to the pharmacies, and see what I can talk someone into selling me.

I'm so distraught - he seemed so much better yesterday. I should have been more concerned about how he was tiring so quickly when eating.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

I don't know if the server will be back up at work when I get back there or not. So, if you get the Bactrim, you need to figure out from the label how many milligrams are in the pill that you get. It will probably be a 400/80 (400 milligrams of the one; 80 of the other) and you'd want to split the pill in half and then grind it up and get it in 24 milliliters of water. You'd shake it real well and get one full milliliter in the bird, twice daily. You're shooting for almost 10 milligrams of medication per dose.

Pidgey


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Maybe you can also get some baby bird formula or baby cereal. He will eventually need some food.

Reti


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

OK - I've got Bactrim, but they only had suspension. It's 40/5ml, so I need to give him 1.25 cc twice a day - is that correct?

I can get baby cereal - baby bird formula I'm not so sure about. I looked in the baby food section yesterday, they only had Gerber fruit and vegetable stuff. I'm still giving him chicken mash, seed and yogurt mixture, diluted with the rehydrating fluid. He's taken a little bit of it.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

40 milligrams of medicine in 5 milliliters of solution? If that's correct, then yes.

Maybe so on the baby cereal.

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

OK then, I got the first dose down him. Wasn't easy, he fought like the dickens. 

He had 8 poops in the last two hours - with a little more solid material, but still green. So green with lots of liquid indicates stomach problems, if what I read is correct? And hopefully the Bactrim will knock out the bad bugs from his stomach - In which case I made need to look around for probiotics to set his stomach straight later. Am I making the right assumptions here?


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

The yogurt should handle the probiotics but more couldn't hurt. It's always a difficult thing dealing with illness in a bird. You don't know why he's not with his parents in the first place, for instance. They may have detected something wrong and gotten rid of him. They will definitely do that if they think it's warranted.

Bactrim is part bacteristatic and part bactericidal. It's a pretty good drug in a lot of cases, especially when you don't know what's going on for sure. You can't stop feeding him, though--he needs food, water and heat more than ever now.

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

He's definitely toasty warm - I've got the whole kitchen closed up, so it's staying quite warm. 

I've given him more rehydrating fluid, and will give him more food at 6pm. I really wish I felt comfortable crop feeding and medicating. I've done it before with adult birds when i worked at the vets, but that's been 20 years ago, and I don't have help or any equipment here.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

If you can get electrical heat shrink tubing (1/8" diameter) and have syringes with more-or-less normal nozzles on the end, you can make them easy enough. Frankly, it's pretty tough helping folks in places where one is neither up on the most likely diseases (and their respective presentations) of the area nor familiar with the locally available resources. In such cases, success often comes by blind luck, I'm afraid. Anyhow, I'll fetch a link to a thread for tube feeding and post it in a follow-up.

Pidgey


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

You can review this thread and follow the links therein for various tube-feeding stuff, including a picture of the tube feeding stuff that I get from the local Home Depot, Lowe's or other hardware stores:

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=16235

Pidgey


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

I think anything I do is going to be too late for this little fella. He seemed to be rallying earlier, but now is so weak he's not even swallowing what I put in his beak. 


Edit - He's gone... he's laying on his side limp. 


I really appreciate all the help I received here. You are a fantastic lot, I just wish I could have done better for the little guy. I'm completely gutted.


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## Pidgey (May 20, 2005)

Well, when they start going downhill after you've rehydrated them and fed them a little bit, it's often one of those deals where you've only got one chance to get it right and you almost have to have whatever stuff you need right then and there. I'm sorry that he didn't make it but you certainly tried and went further than most, by the way. At least he didn't die on the street.

Pidgey


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I'm so sorry.
I know you put your heart and soul into saving this little one. Likely there was more going on than we suspected from the beginning. Truely, you couldn't have done a better job.


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

I am so sorry that you lost this little one, Fnnkybutt. 

We know you tried your best and are feeling sad, depressed and drained. Those, especially, who are our rehabbers know what you are going through. 

Hopefully, our words of condolences will help ease the pain. You did your very best and we were all beside you, more than you know. I know many of us were following along, hoping for the best. Those of us who do not advise medically, still do our best to send healing loving thoughts in spirit.

We rejoice when healing occurs and cry when death comes.

Know that we will always be here when you need us...

With love and sympathy,

Shi


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## Maggie-NC (Jun 22, 2005)

I have been pulling for this little guy and I'm so very sorry he died. You made a valiant effort. As a rehabber, I know how gut wrenching it is to lose one.


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## Reti (Jul 20, 2003)

Thank you for trying and doing everything you could to save this little one.
I am very sorry he didn't make it.

Reti


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## Fnnkybutt (Aug 1, 2007)

Thanks so much to all of you. Your encouragement and advice meant a lot, and I appreciate your kind words now. 

When we found him lying on his side, we (my 8 year old son and I) and sat and held him until he was gone. At the very least, he didn't die alone. 

My husband is going to be very sad when he gets home from work this evening - he is absolutely bird crazy. Since I found PT and showed it to him 2 days ago, he has made me promise that when we get to the US he can have pigeons - so hopefully within a year I'll be back here under happier circumstances.


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## mr squeaks (Apr 14, 2005)

I can guarantee there will be pigeons waiting for you and your family!! Until PT, I never knew there were so many KINDS of pigeons!

Meanwhile, please stay with us... 

Hugs

Shi & Squeaks


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