# pmv?



## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

well i live in seattle, and we have many common street pigeons here. today my dad found one out in our street, and he originally thought the little guy had a broken wing because he want flying. howver, i can find no signs of injury, and on a few occasions he has expanded his wings. but, the little guy was twisting his neck in ways i didnt think a pigeon could. after some research on this site, i think he has pmv but im not sure what my next step should be. i placed him in an old cage from a hedgehog, in a warm dark room. i gave him food (oats, flax seed) and water (with a shotglass as a dish so he doesnt drown) but he doesnt seem to be eating or drinking. is there anything else i can do?
thanks.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

Here's a link to some wildlife care centers in Washington.

http://c3seattle.com/wild.html

When you call, do ask if they treat Pigeons because most do not. If they say they don't, ask for a referral to a care center that does.

In the meantime, defrost some frozen corn and peas, open the bird's beak and put the pieces individually at the back of the throat. The bird will swallow. You should feed 20-30 pieces per feeding and feed again once the bird's crop has emptied. The crop is below the neck and balloons out when there is food in it. 
Keep the bird warm, with a heating pad underneath set no higher than low.


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

well it may be hard to get to those wildlife centers, as they are all very far away to someone with no car. if he does have PMV, will nurturing him with warmth, food, and water help him enough to where he can be released?

*edit: went to check on him, fresh poop that was a green pellet surrounded by thick white goo. is this a good or bad sign?


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## feralpigeon (Feb 14, 2005)

The white goo is the urates and is perfectly normal. The virus needs to run
it's course and the bird evaluated for release after the virus is gone. Frankly,
I don't think releasing a PMV bird is a good idea because of the possibility of
relapse. Maybe a Washington state member from the forum could help you
with this bird?

fp


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## jameswaller (Nov 4, 2008)

*sick bird*



memsiej said:


> well i live in seattle, and we have many common street pigeons here. today my dad found one out in our street, and he originally thought the little guy had a broken wing because he want flying. howver, i can find no signs of injury, and on a few occasions he has expanded his wings. but, the little guy was twisting his neck in ways i didnt think a pigeon could. after some research on this site, i think he has pmv but im not sure what my next step should be. i placed him in an old cage from a hedgehog, in a warm dark room. i gave him food (oats, flax seed) and water (with a shotglass as a dish so he doesnt drown) but he doesnt seem to be eating or drinking. is there anything else i can do?
> thanks.


this is james, i live in kent,i raise exotics-(lagamorphs and homers)-,daily i feed ferrils(stray pigeons),last week--i found one confused and going in circle,s-i easily-captured and isolated him i feared a disease/virus--when he eats his head thrashed about to swallow,..these are symtoms of canker?pmv? he has been treated with penicillinvk for a few days and reacting favorably,-it has been too cold still so he has a heating pad under his bedding-to stay warm-,..i saw another doing the circle thing but he regained his wits and flew off,..i am afraid of an epidemic and i have been researching/studying up,..hope this helps,..sincerely james waller [email protected]


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

thanks for the responses. because he didnt seem to be eating, i tried at least giving him some water with an eye dropper. he did the same thing james described- thrashing his head, struggling to swallow. he seemed releived whenever he could get water down, but couldnt get much. im still not sure wat i should be doing with this little guy... continue to nurture? release? take him to a wildlife center?


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## jameswaller (Nov 4, 2008)

*illness and poops*



memsiej said:


> well it may be hard to get to those wildlife centers, as they are all very far away to someone with no car. if he does have PMV, will nurturing him with warmth, food, and water help him enough to where he can be released?
> 
> *edit: went to check on him, fresh poop that was a green pellet surrounded by thick white goo. is this a good or bad sign?


you can also try http://www.pigeoncote.com/vet/recovery/recovery.htm#illness ,for canker illness,:-and googleigeon poops101 ,keep him in a warm quiet place,quarantine,with water./.feed normal bird/pigeon food,bread crumbs,soft foods and watch closely,.. sincerely james waller


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## jameswaller (Nov 4, 2008)

*sick pigeon/canker*



memsiej said:


> thanks for the responses. because he didnt seem to be eating, i tried at least giving him some water with an eye dropper. he did the same thing james described- thrashing his head, struggling to swallow. he seemed releived whenever he could get water down, but couldnt get much. im still not sure wat i should be doing with this little guy... continue to nurture? release? take him to a wildlife center?


i do not know of a good avarian dvm dr.,all they are going to tell you is bring him in,..$$$$$$$$$,yea,this is why most people turn away,or you take him somewhere like an animal shelter where they thump him on the head and chuck him in a barrel,-no joke)....if you are willing to stay by his side 24/7,.do you have any penicillin,ampicillin.amoxicillin,baytril???..use it,.here is how,..ie 250 mg tab of penicillinvk/crush it up/real fine/mix with a little sugar/to one ounce of warm water/shake vigorously,..use your eye dropper/about half full/pry open his mouth,just enough to get the dropper in/be sure to NOT restrict tongue movement/let him take it in slowly as you squeeze...,or call the 24 hour vet-:-animal critical care and emergency services on lakecity way n.e./ in lake city,11536 -seattle wa.98125--(206-364-1660) criticalcarevets.com -god bless you for trying,..sincerely james waller [email protected]


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## Feefo (Feb 8, 2002)

Be very careful about handing a pigeon with suspected PMV over to a wildlife centre, many of them will euthanase as they don't have the facilities for isolation.

We have had 32 PMV survivors, so I wrote this thread about PMV based on what we have experienced and researched, I hope that it will help you.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/showthread.php?t=12250&referrerid=560

Cynthia


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

i tried to feed the little guy again but its very difficult to pry open his beak, and when i can get it open, his head thrashing makes it almost impossible to actually get food into his mouth. from the looks of his kennel this morning, he tried to eat last night because his food was scattered about, but it doesnt seem like much is missing from his dish so im worried about his food/water intake. also, lost of vibrant green poop, good or bad sign? still unsure what to do with this guy, i cant keep him for long as i have dogs, but i dont want to just take him to the vet to get killed.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

memsiej said:


> i tried to feed the little guy again but its very difficult to pry open his beak, and when i can get it open, his head thrashing makes it almost impossible to actually get food into his mouth. from the looks of his kennel this morning, he tried to eat last night because his food was scattered about, but it doesnt seem like much is missing from his dish so im worried about his food/water intake. also, lost of vibrant green poop, good or bad sign? still unsure what to do with this guy, i cant keep him for long as i have dogs, but i dont want to just take him to the vet to get killed.



Well, when I raised my 6 baby pigeon rescues, all at once, I had two dogs. Still do. That really shouldn't be a problem if you just keep the cage elevated where they cannot get at the bird, or maybe even in another room. 
Also, if you are right handed, take your left hand, come up behind his head. With your thumb on one side of his head, and your index finger on the other side, place them on either side of his beak. Now, with your right hand, gently pry open his beak, and kind of get in there just a little, with the thumb and finger of your left hand. Use these two fingers to stop him from closing his mouth. Take some thawed out frozen peas or corn, and place it in his mouth, one piece at a time. Then push it to the back of his throat. He should swallow. You have to get it way back in his throat. Then give him another one. You can do the same thing with hard dog food that has been soaked to make it soft. You can do this with seed too. It probably sounds hard, but it really isn't, and with practice gets fairly easy. You've got to get food into the poor little thing or he'll starve to death. Please try this. It really isn't difficult. Let us know how you do.


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## teebo (Jul 7, 2006)

i hope he makes it.My Little PMV Pigeon is doing 100% better no more thrashing around.Good Luck With The Pigeon.And i can thank everyone on here for helping me out..Such Nice People.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

teebo said:


> i hope he makes it.My Little PMV Pigeon is doing 100% better no more thrashing around.Good Luck With The Pigeon.And i can thank everyone on here for helping me out..Such Nice People.


I'm glad your little pigeon is doing better.


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

hes still not able to really hold himself up or walk without falling over, but his head thrashing has lessened. i could hold his head long enough to give him plenty of water (with a little pediolite)through an eye dropper, and just now i checked on him and he was eating food on his own! something i have not seen him do yet. i guess that is good news... still very vibrant green poops, runnier than a few days ago digestive side effects of the pmv? i didnt know pigeon poop could be so bright green... 

by the way thanks so much to everyone who has helped. the little guy seems to be doing better and you all have been great to help us through his recovery


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Bright green poops can be a sign of starvation. Or it could mean that he needs an antibiotic. How many poops does he have in a day? Is there any way you could post a picture of it? He probably isn't going to be able to get enough food into himself on his own. Have you tried to hand feed him again? If he doesn't eat enough, he will starve. The frozen peas and corn, thawed to room temperature would be a good place to start. It would also put some moisture into him. Have you seen him drinking? How much do you think he has eaten?


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

i give him quite a bit of water multiple times a day by eye dropper which he is really enjoying, and he has been eating on his own for the last day or two. i gave him a shallower dish which seems to work better for him, and i have sat down a few times and watched him eat to make sure that he was getting down a good amount. yesterday his head thrashing has really declined, but today its starting back up again, which is discouraging...
as far a the poop i will try to post a picture later this evening, i would estimate that he is pooping about 10-15 times a day? im changing his lining twice a day due to poop mess.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If he is eating enough, I think he should be pooping at least 20 times a day. Have you tried holding his beak to the water in the dish? Just lower his head gently until his beak is in the water.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

He should be eating like an ounce to 1 1l2 ounces a day.


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

thanks for the info. i will keep better track of what/how much hes eating

**update, poop turned to brown, with liquid surroundings (white/yellow/clear). i hope this is a sign of improvement... he is still eating on his own, although i have also been giving him thawed peas by hand: 15-20 at a time. i think the eye dropper is still his only source of water, i see no signs that he is drinking on his own, so im giving him lots of fluids.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You're doing great. See, getting the food into him isn't so hard, once you've had some practice. How much does he eat on his own? The peas also have some moisture in them. Would it be possible to post a picture of the little guy? I know all this takes time. It's wonderful of you to care for this little pigeon. You're doing a good job.


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

any ideas as to why he seems to be declining? he eating quite a bit, and drinking a lot too. more everyday either on his own or hand-fed. he seems to be back at the state he was when we found him- maybe a little worse. also, this pmv disease, is the little guy in any pain? i hope not...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

If he has PMV, he is not going to get better quickly. It will take weeks. He will have better days and worse days.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

One of our members posted on PMV. You should read it. Here's the link.

http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f25/pigeon-paramyxovirus-aka-pmv-ppmv-pmv1-pigeon-12250.html


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## memsiej (Feb 2, 2009)

thank you jay for the reassurance and for all your help throughout this process of mine. you are helping me, but more importantly you are heping the pigeon by givingme direction/avice.
hes eating the same amount (reccomended 1-1.5 oz daily) but pooping 4 big diarrhea-like droppings rather than 20 raisin-sized droppings. all part of the disease? i just hope hes not in pain...


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

You really should have him checked by a vet or rehabber to make sue of the diagnosis. He could need antibiotics.


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## Charis (Feb 11, 2007)

I agree with Jay3. It could be something other than PMV or other things as well that are treatable with an antibiotic.
Be sure and let them know that you are willing to keep him during the treatment.
I gave you a link to Washington rehabbers at the beginning of this thread. I don't know if any of them are near by or even treat Pigeons.
If you send me your phone number and general location, I will try and find someone near you that can help you. 
[email protected]


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## bluebirdsnfur (Jan 20, 2009)

Jay3 said:


> One of our members posted on PMV. You should read it. Here's the link.
> 
> http://www.pigeons.biz/forums/f25/pigeon-paramyxovirus-aka-pmv-ppmv-pmv1-pigeon-12250.html



I read this and then printed it out. It is very good information . . . just in case.


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