# How to tame a pigeon



## Drdolittle

Hi Im a vet student from Wisconsin. 
We got a notice about a group of pigeons that need to be adopted out after an avian handling lab. 
I know that pigeons can be great pets, so Im trying to spread the word.
These pigeons are young but not tame (you can scoop them up, but they dont want to stay with you) I want to help teach people how to tame them. 

Also if anyone is from Wisconsin or Illinois and is looking for a pigeon please me know. We have had a good response so far of people wanting to adopt them, so I may not need any outside rescuers. 

I would keep one or two myself but I already live in an apartment with 7 animals, so Im at maximum capacity. 

Thanks for any insight you can provide!


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## goga82

r they ferals? can they be released instead of putting them down?
who has these pigeons? why they have to be adopted or put down? how did they end up in that situation


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## Drdolittle

They are not feral, they were research pigeons. 
They are all healthy, they were donated by the research facility to the school for an avian handling lab. UW vet school is very progressive in that they allow us to try to adopt them out rather than having them go back to the facility.


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## Lefty07

Pigeons and doves will usually become tamer faster, the less they are "man-handled". They generally don't like being grabbed, held, or petted - that is a "mammal thing" - birds don't do that and they can see it as a predatory action. So getting them to perch on your finger, the back of your hand, or your arm is the way to go. Practice this with them inside the cage. Gently put your hand under them, when they are perched, and push up gently so they sit on your hand. Repeat this over and over, until they get it and aren't afriad to step up. Also, try feeding them from your hand. And even after they learn to step up, *avoid* grabbing them - this un-does the taming. Admittedly, you may have to grab them to move them to a new cage etc - but I am saying just "phase it out", as quickly as you can, because it is not good for taming.

Another thing is, pigeons and doves will tame down faster if you do something quiet and calm, in their presence. So sitting in a chair next to them, while you watch TV, work on the computer, or read is a good way to behave around them, especially as they get to know you. They will also respond to being talked to softly - and greeted by you, when you enter a room. Pay attention to them but don't stare at them - that's a predator thing. Just do something quiet - like you don't care they are there - but say hello ocasionally.

Once they act calm or respond to you, try leaving the cage door open and letting them come out on their own (and of course first make sure the room is quiet and safe - no loud music, no cats, dogs, or little kids). Then continue doing something calm, when they are loose. They may come over to you and check you out. Then try hand-feeding them again. If you have them already hand-tame before you do this, just get them to perch on your hand and bring them back to the cage when ready.

A cage with a big door makes it easier to take them in and out. And they will usually learn to go back in their cage on their own. No need to ever wing-clip pigeons or doves. They are completely defenseless without being able to fly so let them keep their ability to fly. The trick is to get them tame before you release them and start releasing them in a small room. And letting them out at night is good so you have the option of turning out the lights to bring them back to their cage, if they don't want to go in. And again, even in the dark, avoid grabbing them - get them to perch on your hand, if at all possible, when you bring them back to their cage.

A great "treat" food for taming them is hemp seeds. Hemp is technically marijuana but it is legal as bird food (they sterilize it). You can find it for sale as bird food in big bird (parrot) stores, on the internet, or even on eBay. I reserve my hemp for hand-feeding my doves so it's a special treat. They always fly over to me when I put some in my hand. It is a "heavy" food - a fatty oily seed - so it's OK as a treat but should not be their regular food because they will get fat from too much. They DO love it though - they can't get enough of it!

These are some of my Ringneck Doves and their babies. They are all very tame and enjoy free flight time in my sunroom. And they will all return to their own cages, on their own!


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## almondman

goga82 said:


> r they ferals? can they be released instead of putting them down?
> who has these pigeons? why they have to be adopted or put down? how did they end up in that situation


More and more research facility's and labs are trying to adopt healthy lab animals/birds, etc. to keep from having to euthanize them. Many of these are not always true ferals so releasing them would not be the best. Also, some ferals are kept long enough to"tame" them where they are not able to survive in the wild again. This is a lot better than in the past when almost all research animals/ birds were put down. These birds can be ferals, but there are breeders that will sell birds for research studies.


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## goga82

almondman said:


> More and more research facility's and labs are trying to adopt healthy lab animals/birds, etc. to keep from having to euthanize them. Many of these are not always true ferals so releasing them would not be the best. Also, some ferals are kept long enough to"tame" them where they are not able to survive in the wild again. This is a lot better than in the past when almost all research animals/ birds were put down. These birds can be ferals, but there are breeders that will sell birds for research studies.


wow this is crazy.. they let them adopt them out, but what if they dont get adopted?? they are put to sleep.. those poor birds must be tramatized..
how many birds are we talking about?
any chance for a picture?


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## Lefty07

*Adopting lab animals*

That's nice that labs are giving adoption a chance for these pigeons and other animals. Human-raised pigeons obviously have been released in the past and feral populations exist today - but the survival rate of individual birds born in captivity must be very low. So it is more humane to adopt them out as pets. Hopefully these pigeons can all be saved.

I once similarly adopted a baby hooded rat as a pet, while at college - that would otherwise have been put down or fed to a snake. She was a nice little pet. Tame rats are like little monkeys!


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## goga82

i would rather release them .. plenty of "feral" pigeons are fed on daily basis downtown.. around the whole city.. there is no way that they wouldnt survive.. plenty of pigeons in downtown chicago have bands on them.. means raised by humans.. so yeah they are surviving.. rather than euthanizing them..


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## almondman

goga82 said:


> i would rather release them .. plenty of "feral" pigeons are fed on daily basis downtown.. around the whole city.. there is no way that they wouldnt survive.. plenty of pigeons in downtown chicago have bands on them.. means raised by humans.. so yeah they are surviving.. rather than euthanizing them..


I didn't mean to upset you. The truth is that many more research animals/birds get put down than are either released, or adopted out. I think this is a great way to save as many of these birds as possible, considering the alternative. I don't know what will be done to those that are not adopted, but at least people are trying to save as many as possible. We need to be thankful for that. I agree with you that releasing them at least gives the birds a chance at survival, as compared to being euthanized, but the people trying to adopt as many as they can, don't always have the say in what is done to the rest. Please give Drdolittle credit for doing what she can.


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## Drdolittle

Thank you for the great information Ron! That is very helpful and your pictures are great!
And thank you Almondman for the support. I was very hesitant to even put this post up as I realized the reaction it could generate. I didnt meant to start a debate on animal research. 

Volunteering with wildlife rehab, I have seen the horrors of well intentioned people releasing pets into the wild. Yes its true, some make it. But for every one out flying many more have met a horrible death because of predation or because they were not able to acclimate to the wild. That being said, I obviously am not ok with them being euthanized, hence why I'm trying to help them. The larger situation is beyond my control, Im just doing what I can to help on a small scale. Im acting in the best interest of the pigeons. I have made it my personal mission to ensure these birds are adopted out. 

My goal of this post was to learn how to tame them and teach people how to properly take care of them to ensure they will be well loved feathered members of the family. My own personal experience is with parrots and wildlife rehab, Im not familiar with the care of tame passerines.


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## almondman

Lefty07 - great advice, great pictures, great looking birds.


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## Jay3

Sadly many pigeons that have been raised by humans and then released do not make it in the wild. Just because there are flocks around is no guarantee that they will be able to join a flock and learn how to survive. They don't know anything about predators, and many will never learn to find food. 

Goga, some of those birds you see may be wearing snap on bands. Sometimes people who rescue injured ferals will band them before letting them go. If that were the case then those birds would, of course, already know how to survive. But unfortunately not all human raised birds will.


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## Jay3

Yes, Lefty07 those are great pictures and pretty birds you've got there.


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## goga82

u know what, seems a lot of people have "sense" on this site.. here they love the birds.. and on the other hand nobody is actually adopting any of them. at least not on this site.
All my babies are a living proof that yes they do make it in the wild. None of the birds i raised have crumbled and died.. they are inteligent and follow others.. 
i can sit here and argue all night if necessary but i am for release
lets face it.. lots of these vet students.. and vet tech students care less about pigeons.. i been to school with those.. out of 4000 people i was the only one that loved pigeons.. and everybody else was like ewwww nasty.. to think those people love animals.. lets face it they all in it for the dogs.. and maybe a cow or two.
sad thing is they will be put down.. without ever bein given a chance to fly...
And jay how are u so sure that many pigeons dont make it?? i really dont know where u get these facts.. in my case i seen many many many that do make it..
and like i said downtown birds that wear bands have been raised by other people.. and they are thriving.. every flock gets fed at least 4 times a day. more than some homers locked up in the loft.
maybe few have the snap on bands.. those with crooked feet im sure they are snap on.
many people that raise pigeons and rescue them and what not, despite all the experience they still underestimate these birds.. 

lady in pittsburgh got a whole bunch of healthy birds that she kept in cages till she just created a little loft.. so she can put them out of her house.. imagine 50 birdfs locked in the cage from day one?? reason she never released she scared hawk gonna get them. i would rather any of my birds live 2 years free than 20 in the cage.. 

many of the ones i released are still kickin it.. avoiding predators on daily basis.. i aint teach them. its a natural instinct.. i remember 3 of my babies that i let out just to spread their wings.. got chased by a crow the first day i let them out.. funny they didnt just sit there .. they flew away and got back on my balcony after the crow left.. they been chased by hawks as well before i really really released them.. they outfly the hawk.. i didnt teach them.
Truth is everybody on this site thinks they know better.. and wanna sit and argue blah blah they not gonna survive. Like i said all my birds are the living proof that they do survive  

let the birds go man! instead of humanely putting them down.. nothing humane about that if u ask me.. they are not sick. they are not handicaped..see how they prepare people early on in the school to eythanize healthy animals.. humane sociey's are all about that  some tech i worked with they love putting animals to sleep .. what a f up world we live in
just give me the birds.. and i'll set them free


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## Drdolittle

goga82 said:


> lets face it.. lots of these vet students.. and vet tech students care less about pigeons.. i been to school with those.. out of 4000 people i was the only one that loved pigeons.. and everybody else was like ewwww nasty.. to think those people love animals.. lets face it they all in it for the dogs.. and maybe a cow or two.


you can defend your beliefs without making it personal. 
The thousands .... yes THOUSANDS, of veterinarians registered as avian specialists through the American Association of Avian Veterinarians prove that hurtful comment as inaccurate. 

Here I am trying to help and all you can do is insult me and my colleagues. We DO care ALOT about ALL animals. 
I came on this post to get help which I did from several wonderful members.


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## thepigeonkey

yea I agree with goga82. If I were a pigeon I would like to be given the chance to survive. I hope all the pigeons are adopted and none are killed.
I like seeing domestic colours and patterns surviving and multiplying in the wild. 
The thing I love most about pigeons is all the mutations from wild type.
If wild pigeons were all colours maybe people would like them more. Like everyone loves white garden doves (funnel tails) but not ferals.


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## thepigeonkey

sorry I don't mean to take sides Drdolittle your doing a good deed too. I can see it from both sides.


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## thepigeonkey

The best advice I can give for tameing pigeons is keep em hungry and then hand feed. don't pick up your pigeon, let it step onto your hand.


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## almondman

Drdolittle said:


> Hi Im a vet student from Wisconsin.
> We got a notice about a group of pigeons that need to be adopted out after an avian handling lab.
> I know that pigeons can be great pets, so Im trying to spread the word.
> These pigeons are young but not tame (you can scoop them up, but they dont want to stay with you) I want to help teach people how to tame them.
> Also if anyone is from Wisconsin or Illinois and is looking for a pigeon please me know. We have had a good response so far of people wanting to adopt them, so I may not need any outside rescuers.
> 
> I would keep one or two myself but I already live in an apartment with 7 animals, so Im at maximum capacity.
> 
> Thanks for any insight you can provide!


Goga82 -
I see nothing in this original post about euthanizing any of them. I don't know where you got the idea that Drdolittle was going to do that. What I got out of the post is an attempt to find caring people for some birds that need to be re-homed. You have the right to an opinion, but you DO NOT have the right to criticize someone who is trying to save these birds. And you do not have the right to degrade others who obviously have more training, experience and knowledge. (vet tech, Vets, other posters on this thread) Have you worked in a vet clinic, or in a rehab center to see the birds that don't make the transition. Or talked to the people on this forum that take in the birds and do their best to save them. I personally think your rant was totally un-necessary.


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## Jay3

goga82 said:


> u know what, seems a lot of people have "sense" on this site.. here they love the birds.. and on the other hand nobody is actually adopting any of them. at least not on this site.
> All my babies are a living proof that yes they do make it in the wild. None of the birds i raised have crumbled and died.. they are inteligent and follow others..
> i can sit here and argue all night if necessary but i am for release
> lets face it.. lots of these vet students.. and vet tech students care less about pigeons.. i been to school with those.. out of 4000 people i was the only one that loved pigeons.. and everybody else was like ewwww nasty.. to think those people love animals.. lets face it they all in it for the dogs.. and maybe a cow or two.
> sad thing is they will be put down.. without ever bein given a chance to fly...
> *And jay how are u so sure that many pigeons dont make it?? i really dont know where u get these facts.. *in my case i seen many many many that do make it..
> and like i said downtown birds that wear bands have been raised by other people.. and they are thriving.. every flock gets fed at least 4 times a day. more than some homers locked up in the loft.
> maybe few have the snap on bands.. those with crooked feet im sure they are snap on.
> *many people that raise pigeons and rescue them and what not, despite all the experience they still underestimate these birds..
> *
> lady in pittsburgh got a whole bunch of healthy birds that she kept in cages till she just created a little loft.. so she can put them out of her house.. imagine 50 birdfs locked in the cage from day one?? reason she never released she scared hawk gonna get them. i would rather any of my birds live 2 years free than 20 in the cage..
> 
> Truth is everybody on this site thinks they know better.. and wanna sit and argue blah blah they not gonna survive. Like i said all my birds are the living proof that they do survive




goga, I have a whole loft of rescues, many were birds that had escaped or some way got out, or were let out. By the time they are caught, they are half starved, or have been caught by a predator. They didn't know how to find food on their own, and they didn't know to avoid predators. Now I'm not saying that no birds can survive and learn, but many do not. So when you ask how I am so sure that many birds don't make it, I just have to look at my flock, and remember the condition that many were in when they got here. Some were nothing but bones and feathers. Now they are safe and healthy.

You say that everybody on this site thinks they know better. Isn't that what you are doing? Some make it.............some do not.


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## goga82

almondman said:


> Goga82 -
> I see nothing in this original post about euthanizing any of them. I don't know where you got the idea that Drdolittle was going to do that. What I got out of the post is an attempt to find caring people for some birds that need to be re-homed. You have the right to an opinion, but you DO NOT have the right to criticize someone who is trying to save these birds. And you do not have the right to degrade others who obviously have more training, experience and knowledge. (vet tech, Vets, other posters on this thread) Have you worked in a vet clinic, or in a rehab center to see the birds that don't make the transition. Or talked to the people on this forum that take in the birds and do their best to save them. I personally think your rant was totally un-necessary.


he made sure he edited that part.. this the reason why this thread got me fired up.. he said they will be humanely euthanized. why he edited that??? its not right covering up...
and yeah i am a certified vet tech.. i worked in plenty of shelters.. enough to know what goes on behind closed doors.. when u come thry they all smiles.. yeah we'll make sure we adopt your dogs out.. right.
please.
im not working as a tech right now, cause i cant bare to euthanize..
and when it comes to vets.. my experience with them, specially "avian" and "exotic" animals.. its just guessing.. they have no idea what they doing.. they torture animals in schools.. and for what? they still dont know what they doin..
vets in chicago.. omg. they should have "expert in wrong diagnosis" tattooed on their heads.. 
sure he seems like he is trying to save the birds, but lets face it at the end of the day he will be the one to euthanize them.. 
have u ever seen a bird gettin euthanized??? its a sad process.. very very sad.. specially a pigeon


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## goga82

Jay3 said:


> goga, I have a whole loft of rescues, many were birds that had escaped or some way got out, or were let out. By the time they are caught, they are half starved, or have been caught by a predator. They didn't know how to find food on their own, and they didn't know to avoid predators. Now I'm not saying that no birds can survive and learn, but many do not. So when you ask how I am so sure that many birds don't make it, I just have to look at my flock, and remember the condition that many were in when they got here. Some were nothing but bones and feathers. Now they are safe and healthy.
> 
> You say that everybody on this site thinks they know better. Isn't that what you are doing? Some make it.............some do not.


jay u said it yourself. some make it some dont.. i really do think.. that these pigeons we are talking about.. should be given a chance..some may make it some may not.. pigeons not raised by humans some make it some dont.. its a 50/50 chance ..
im exposed to a lot of danger, every time i walk out of my house.. but at least my mom didnt put me in the bubble to provent me from maybe making it or maybe not making it..
i should just take these bird.. and i guarantee they will be fine...
they will be free .. and yet they will be fed..
u wont believe how many flocks in chicago are being fed every day..
u need to study flocks where u release your birds...im still rescuing and im still releasing.. and with each pigeon that goes thry my house.. i found another place even better where to release.. and make sure he makes it..

some people caught a parakeet last year.. hwo they caught it god knows. how long he been out god knows..but he was managing to survive.. which means even a lil parakeet can do it.. why cant pigeon.
i swear if i lived in australia where my parakeets and cocktiels are native to, i would release them to.. because i really believe that instinct always kicks in.. easier with birds than mamals.
birds take of ..


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## goga82

Jay3 said:


> goga, I have a whole loft of rescues, many were birds that had escaped or some way got out, or were let out. By the time they are caught, they are half starved, or have been caught by a predator. They didn't know how to find food on their own, and they didn't know to avoid predators. Now I'm not saying that no birds can survive and learn, but many do not. So when you ask how I am so sure that many birds don't make it, I just have to look at my flock, and remember the condition that many were in when they got here. Some were nothing but bones and feathers. Now they are safe and healthy.
> 
> You say that everybody on this site thinks they know better. Isn't that what you are doing? Some make it.............some do not.


maybe im just lucky. with my birds.. but i never released a bird just right out of the cage and on the street. many of my babies.. i would take outside.. let them chill,, fly around.. when they fledge.. they walk around me foraging for food..every day i would spend hours with them outside..like a big mama bird.. untill its time to either take them some place else.. or leave them outside my house.. really depends where i live..
i put a lot into this birds.. they have to make it.. maybe Jay u need a different location.. try whatever u can do..
im sorry that u had lost a good share of rescues.. but birds have to be released.. what would i do if i didnt release them. i would have a whole house filled with about 100 birds by now.. non relasable are placed in good homes.. others have been set free

if he releases these birds they will make it.. maybe give me two or 3 i'll ake sure i take care of them the way they need to be taken care off


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## Quazar

@goga - Goga, what you are doing with your birds is predomanently correct.
They are ferals that for one reason or other, you have rescued, are used to the feral way of life, & will re-adapt to foraging for food, being aware for predators etc.
Even your young ones that have been born with you can be classed that way as their parents were/are feral & will teach them, presuming you are letting them have free roam & access to do so.
It is a totally different concept for a bird that has not been born feral, or has been brought up in a loft/lab situation where it is provided with food & never had to forage, or be aware of natural predators & dangers.
Dr doolitle stated in the first post that they wanted to give these birds a chance & posted here to find out positive possibilities rather than having to euthanise if alternatives could not be found.
This to me is a very positive path, and one which should be encouraged rather than attacked on a personal level.
As far as releasing goes, look at it this way, Assuming you have no formal survival training or skills, If someone abducted you from your current situation & placed you out in the middle of a jungle to fend for yourself, how long before illness through lack of proper food, or a predator caught you because you were not fit enough to evade them, how long would you survive ?
Training & education in these skills WILL give a better advantage, but you would still be in an unnatural situation and at more risk from your normal.
This is exactly the same situation any animal is in who is not prepared or has not learned. 
Yes, they may well survive, & obviously chances would be higher than straight euthanasia, but for human bonded (even the slightest bond) birds, the chances are less.
They may even go looking for other humans to help, but as you and everyone here knows, some humans can be a pigeons worst predator.


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## almondman

goga82 said:


> he made sure he edited that part.. this the reason why this thread got me fired up.. he said they will be humanely euthanized. why he edited that??? its not right covering up...
> and yeah i am a certified vet tech.. i worked in plenty of shelters.. enough to know what goes on behind closed doors.. when u come thry they all smiles.. yeah we'll make sure we adopt your dogs out.. right.
> please.
> im not working as a tech right now, cause i cant bare to euthanize..
> and when it comes to vets.. my experience with them, specially "avian" and "exotic" animals.. its just guessing.. they have no idea what they doing.. they torture animals in schools.. and for what? they still dont know what they doin..
> vets in chicago.. omg. they should have "expert in wrong diagnosis" tattooed on their heads..
> sure he seems like he is trying to save the birds, but lets face it at the end of the day he will be the one to euthanize them..
> have u ever seen a bird gettin euthanized??? its a sad process.. very very sad.. specially a pigeon


The fact that you care is very obvious and I am sorry that you have had such bad experiences with the shelters and Vets that you have worked with. But the majority of shelters, rehabs, and Vets are not as bad as the ones you describe. Most will do everything in their power to save the life of an animal. 
I think that in this case, Drdolittle is doing her best to save as many as she can. But the fact remains that these birds are still owned by the U.W. They will more than likely have the final say in what happens to any birds not rehomed. This is just a fact of life. At least some one tried. It is still better to find new homes for these birds where they WILL survive, than just release them where they might not. Even if it was deleted, the cold hard fact is that they more than likely would have gone back to the research lab, or have been put down. Quazar - great post!


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## Jay3

goga82 said:


> maybe im just lucky. with my birds.. but i never released a bird just right out of the cage and on the street. many of my babies.. i would take outside.. let them chill,, fly around.. when they fledge.. they walk around me foraging for food..every day i would spend hours with them outside..like a big mama bird.. untill its time to either take them some place else.. or leave them outside my house.. really depends where i live..
> i put a lot into this birds.. they have to make it.. maybe Jay u need a different location.. try whatever u can do..
> *im sorry that u had lost a good share of rescues..* but birds have to be released.. what would i do if i didnt release them. i would have a whole house filled with about 100 birds by now.. non relasable are placed in good homes.. others have been set free
> 
> if he releases these birds they will make it.. maybe give me two or 3 i'll ake sure i take care of them the way they need to be taken care off



No goga, I haven't lost rescues. What I was saying was that the reason I have them is that they were out there starving to death and getting caught by predators before I got them. This is because they had no survival knowledge. They didn't know how or where to find food. They didn't know how to avoid predators. They were not raised in the wild. When I take in a sick or injured feral who has been living a feral life, I can release them into the flock that comes to my yard. They make it just fine because they were not raised by humans. They were raised in a feral flock where they learned how to survive. Pigeons raised by humans in a protected environment are just not equipped to make it in the wild. It would be nice if it was just instinct, but it isn't. A lot of what they need to know to survive and live out there must be taught to them. Why do you think that even songbirds take their youngsters out and teach them where to find food, and how to hide when a predator shows up? With a human raised pigeon, what we have taught them is that food and water will be brought to them in a dish or feeder. That they are safe. We haven't taught them how or where to find food out there, or how to avoid predators. They think life is one safe place where they will be cared for. They would be sitting out there waiting for us to come with the feed, and shake the can to call them for dinner.

One of my rescues, beautiful big white 661 gram Bishop, was sitting on someones roof. A hawk came down and he just moved over. He didn't even take off. When it poured rain, he just lifted his wing and sat there trying to stay dry. All the ferals left to go home to what ever shelter they were using. He just sat there. all night in the rain. They don't know what they haven't been taught. Some of their survival is instinct, but much has to be learned.

Another one, who had gotten out of someones loft, just kept flying into a guys shed. Guess it was the closest thing she could find to a loft. He kept putting her out, and she kept coming back. She was bone thin and starving, but she had no idea of where to find food.

My birds have lots of stories like that. They would be dead if someone hadn't taken them in. They just do not know what they have not been taught.


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## almondman

Another great post Jay3.

Another thread to check out is Kicked Fantail Pigeon. It describes, in detail, what can happen to a bird. In this story, it's a human predator, but it could very well have been a cat, dog, bop. Luckily, that story had a happy ending.


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## Jay3

almondman said:


> Another great post Jay3.
> 
> Another thread to check out is Kicked Fantail Pigeon. It describes, in detail, what can happen to a bird. In this story, it's a human predator, but it could very well have been a cat, dog, bop. Luckily, that story had a happy ending.


Yes. A good example of what can easily happen to a bird hatched in a safe environment. They just don't have the kind of instincts that tell them to beware of everything and everybody. Because sadly, so many things can and will harm them. Even humans. And they just don't understand that.


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## Drdolittle

goga82 said:


> vets in chicago.. omg. they should have "expert in wrong diagnosis" tattooed on their heads..
> sure he seems like he is trying to save the birds, but lets face it at the end of the day he will be the one to euthanize them..


Ok now are you not only being nasty, your lying. 
I dont deserve to be attacked like this. I'm sorry for whatever bad experience you've had, but I am a good person who has dedicated HER life to help animals, ALL animals. I dont deserve to be the brunt of your frustrations. 
Before you type or speak I would challenge you to think "Is it kind? is it necessary?does it improve upon the silence?" 
your posts have not been productive, they have been hurtful. 
At least Im trying to help. All you have done is insult me. 
Even after you have attacked and insulted me, I'm not going to insult you because I am a classy and caring human being. I'm sorry for whatever you have been through in your life, clearly it has left you jaded and upset.
Rather than waste my time defending myself to you I am going to divert my attention to trying to help and save animals.


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## goga82

if i had a big back yard and a loft i would take them all in.. all of them
try another mamber on pigeon talk.. i think his name is grimaldi.. he is from chicago.. he takes his birds to the daughters farm. im asuming they have a lot of space otherwise he wouldnt be rescuing so much.
i see this guy every day downtown.. walk by my flock .. and he always makes sure that they are all healthy before he leaves.. im sure he got a lot of birds in that flock that he raised.
and im sorry that u found urself hurt by my coments. but i really had a lot of bad experiences with vets, reason to it cause i have a lot of small and exotic animals, even tho i know everything about their care i still cant prescribe meds.. so whenever i had something that was sick.. i would have to go to the vet.. and to my suprise none of the vets knew whats wrong with them or what to do or what to prescribe if i havent said so..
just few months ago.. i found one of my released pigeons.. two and a half months after he been reelased i found him hurt.. 
i go to the vet, he said its pmv, lets euthanize him. And this guy had in chicago animal house had a lot of experience with wild rehabs and what not.. and he just looked at my pigeon and said lets euthanize him.. im lika nawwww just do an xray i wanna know is anything broken.. x ray showed nothing. and i fly out of that clinic with my "alive" pigeonn.. who recovered after 3 days, got back on his feet.. and im like wow...if i was a regular person who knew nothing about what they doing. im sure that person wouyld euthanize cause doc recomended it...
Just a honest advice.. u wanna be the best doc u can.. dont give up, dont be like the one's i encountered, try everything u can and always look pass the obvious.. 
Pittsburgh avian vets.. ohh god.. i had a parakeet that was having seizures.. i just really needed valium.. we get to the emergency.. she suggesting i put my parakeet down..
im like naww just give me the meds.. 4 days later my bird was almost back to normal, seizures messed up his lil brain a bit so he lost the sense of coordination, but other than that.. he was singin for me next 4 years untill he died 
and i have alot of examples 
i always say if only i had financial help when i was younger i would have been a vet. id look pass the euthanazia part just to get out of that school and be the best vet in the world..
to me everything stands a chance unless its missing a head
and i think u can get a lot of good advices on how to be the best from us the regular people..


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## goga82

and to answer how to tame a pigeon.. lay him down in palm of ur hand.. make sure he lays down..if necessary push him to lay down.. with ur tumb hold him down.. just be calm.. after few second u can move ur tumb and he will stay there laying.. 
every bird likes to feel free when being held.. so the more he feels free in your hand faster u will tame him..
soft voice.. and slow blinking. just like with the cats.. slower u bling.. more they think u friendly.. 
thats just from my experience.. 
offer in another hand favorite treat.. if he gets scared just pout your tumb over one wing... and then again let go


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## Quazar

Drdolittle, I'm not condoning Gogas comments, although I can see why she takes that general opinion, but as far as pigeons & vets go, while there are many that will help (or even try to), there are sadly more who wont, or will euthanise because they dont really know how to treat.
Even some good avian vets do not know enough about pigeons and their ailments to be able to treat comprehensively, or competently.
Sadly, a lot of this is due to the stigma given to pigeons by the pest control agencies which means that fewer people would even consider taking a bird to a vet, so the vets themselves get little experiance with them.
To be honest, a GOOD pigeon knowledgable vet is very hard to come by.


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## almondman

Bottom line is that Drdolittle is doing a righteous thing by trying to rehome these pigeons. I think that fact has gotten lost in all the rhetoric about euthanasia, bad experiences with Vets, vet techs, clinics, and rehab. Or the ability of birds to survive. And no one has yet volunteered to take any of the birds, except goga8. Unfortunately, I can not take any of them.


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## NewHopePoultry

If you can get some to Missouri, I would adopt some!

(Im a vet tech student and I love pigeons!)


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## Jay3

Don't know where Drdolittle is located. Maybe that would be helpful? There could be some close by.


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## Quazar

almondman said:


> *Bottom line is that Drdolittle is doing a righteous thing by trying to rehome these pigeons.* I think that fact has gotten lost in all the rhetoric about euthanasia, bad experiences with Vets, vet techs, clinics, and rehab. Or the ability of birds to survive. And no one has yet volunteered to take any of the birds, except goga8. Unfortunately, I can not take any of them.


Oh I agree 100%, I just wish there were more vets like DD.
Although its not good to tar all by the same brush, I do see why it happens all too often.
As far as the birds go, Sadly I am a bit too far away to take any of them also.


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## almondman

NewHopePoultry said:


> If you can get some to Missouri, I would adopt some!
> 
> (Im a vet tech student and I love pigeons!)


And so it begins! A vet tech student, and a Vet student, who both care about pigeons. Sounds to me like times, they are achanging!!!!


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## Drdolittle

Thank you everyone. This is very helpful. 
I am located in Madison Wi. 
We have had a good number of people interested and there are not that many birds, only 12. So I think we should be ok, if not then Ill rally the troops here. I also work with a local bird rescue. They mostly deal with parrots, but also rehome finches, quails, doves and pigeons too. So they could at least help me find homes too if needed. 

There are a lot of students who would love to have a pet bird but dont have the time to commit to the emotional needs parrot. I know all animal are work, but at least a pigeon would be happy just to sit quietly near (or on) you rather than require constant stimulation the way a parrot does. They are also much quieter than a parrot so better suited for apartment living and dont bite the way parrots do. So I was recommending these pigeons to students who were interested in birds. I just want to be able to guide them so that they know what to expect and are great owners. There isnt much info out there in pigeon care, which is why I was thrilled to find this chat site. 
Any thought to people adopting them in pairs?


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## Jay3

Keeping a pair is better for the bird. They are flock birds, and like having company, or even better a mate. Two males together doesn't often work. Two females works fine, and of course, one of each would be great. If one is kept alone then it's nice to put a large mirror in his cage for company. Some even keep a small stuffed animal with their bird. Often the pigeon likes to play with it or beat it up, or just snuggle with it. If a female pigeon, and she lays eggs, then one should let her sit them for the few weeks that they normally would to hatch eggs. If they were to just take them away, she would just lay again right away. If this were to happen then she would eventually delete herself of calcium. By letting her sit the eggs, she gets a rest from laying. Any pet pigeon should get a couple hours a day out of the cage for exercise and company. They're very smart and would be very bored and unhappy without that.


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## AutumnRiver

Drdolittle said:


> Hi Im a vet student from Wisconsin.
> We got a notice about a group of pigeons that need to be adopted out after an avian handling lab.
> I know that pigeons can be great pets, so Im trying to spread the word.
> These pigeons are young but not tame (you can scoop them up, but they dont want to stay with you) I want to help teach people how to tame them.
> 
> Also if anyone is from Wisconsin or Illinois and is looking for a pigeon please me know. We have had a good response so far of people wanting to adopt them, so I may not need any outside rescuers.
> 
> I would keep one or two myself but I already live in an apartment with 7 animals, so Im at maximum capacity.
> 
> Thanks for any insight you can provide!


Oh hi! I am Jen -one of those people adopting (I said I can take 4 pigeons and am research as fast a possible!!) I'm excited.


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## almondman

AutumnRiver said:


> Oh hi! I am Jen Yates-one of those people adopting (I said I can take 4 pigeons and am research as fast a possible!!) I'm excited.


Thanks again Jen.


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## AutumnRiver

As someone who is planning on adopting some of the birds that original thread was about- I must say it has been really difficult sifting through all these opinions to find out how to actually TAME the birds, wow!! Thanks for the helpful advice I managed to gather though, everyone


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## spirit wings

AutumnRiver said:


> As someone who is planning on adopting some of the birds that original thread was about- I must say it has been really difficult sifting through all these opinions to find out how to actually TAME the birds, wow!! Thanks for the helpful advice I managed to gather though, everyone


Well just remember pigeons are not the most cuddly of creatures.. they are a pray animal so they always seem standoffish or on guard...human hands resemble predators claws and such..staring at them can make them feel hunted..so just be patient . it takes them time to adjust and when they learn from routine that you are the giver of food they get used to you as the keeper.. if you want more from them it will take time.. they usually do not like to be held at all..but perhaps perch on your shoulder to get a treat of some kind that is their favorite. I do not have a need to be "one' with mine or have them like me..I admire them just the way they are and like to watch them interact with each other and that is all I need. most humans feel the need to tame them but that is a human need and not a must for them.


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## AutumnRiver

I mostly want them to be comfortable and happy... it would only be a plus if my eight year old could be perched on once in a while she would be thrilled. I wish I could take more, I just figured 4 would be a good start and a loft and flight pen I could manage for 4. But dr doolittle. please let me know if there is a single straggler due to die and I will take him. I bought a 50 lb bag of pigeon food for the 4 of them. How long will that last? I guess if I take 6 it will not be too much of a difference...? My wife would not be thrilled


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## Jay3

Try to get even numbers sex wise. You don't want say 1 female and 3 males. They would be constantly fighting over her and her life would be not fun. You would then probably have to get more birds to pair them up. If you can't get an even ratio of males to females, you are better off getting more females as they will get along better. Still better to get even numbers. Buy wooden eggs ahead of time as you will need them. 
They are really enjoyable to watch as sw says. Don't try to force closeness on them. They are birds, and most don't like being picked up and snuggled. Let them learn to trust you by letting them come to you when they are ready, and hand feed them with treats, and they will easily learn to come to you and perch on your arm, head, lap for some chopped peanuts or safflower seed. Eventually, if you take your time, you won't be able to clean the loft without them landing on your back when you bend over. A lot does depend on their history and how they were handled or not. But yes, it is fun just to watch them interacting with each other, each with his/her own personality. I think your wife will learn to enjoy them too once she gets to know them. A 50 lb bag of pigeon food will last for months with 4 birds. My 50 lb. bag lasts for probably 5 or 6 weeks for 30 birds. But then I add a lot of extra stuff to it also, which is why it goes down slower. Just store it where it will stay dry and bugs and rodents can't get to it. You're great to take them, and I think your really going to love them. Thank you.


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## spirit wings

AutumnRiver said:


> I mostly want them to be comfortable and happy... it would only be a plus if my eight year old could be perched on once in a while she would be thrilled. I wish I could take more, I just figured 4 would be a good start and a loft and flight pen I could manage for 4. But dr doolittle. please let me know if there is a single straggler due to die and I will take him. I bought a 50 lb bag of pigeon food for the 4 of them. How long will that last? I guess if I take 6 it will not be too much of a difference...? My wife would not be thrilled


If they do not know the sex of the birds it will be hard to ask for even pairs.. and if you can help 4 one more won't break the bank..


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## Jay3

Yes, if they don't know the sex, it will be hard to get even pairs, but he may end up having to pick up a couple more if he gets too many males. Just letting him know.


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## almondman

Drdolittle - how are the adoptions going? I know it's only been a couple of days, but would appreciate an update. As you may have noticed, we have met AutumnRiver and she has been getting some advice about her new friends.


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## Drdolittle

I have somewhere for all the pigeons to go. All 16. 
There are 6 that are not spoken for as pets. Those are being adopted by a wildlife rehaber who has a heated indoor aviary for them to live the rest of their lives in. I am going to drive them down to Il next weekend. 
Thanks Jen for adopting pigeons! 

We do not know the sex of the birds. 
I am going to foster 3 of the 6 (my classmate is going to foster the other 3). Until I can drive them down. Im going to look up what to feed them on this site, but any suggestions? I have an extra parrot cage for them to live in. I know they like to perch on flat surfaces, and they need a nest. anything else Im missing for a temporary setup? 
Thanks!


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## almondman

Congrats Thanks for still caring enough to find these birds new homes. Good luck with your studies.


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## spirit wings

Drdolittle said:


> I have somewhere for all the pigeons to go. All 16.
> There are 6 that are not spoken for as pets. Those are being adopted by a wildlife rehaber who has a heated indoor aviary for them to live the rest of their lives in. I am going to drive them down to Il next weekend.
> Thanks Jen for adopting pigeons!
> 
> We do not know the sex of the birds.
> I am going to foster 3 of the 6 (my classmate is going to foster the other 3). Until I can drive them down. Im going to look up what to feed them on this site, but any suggestions? I have an extra parrot cage for them to live in. I know they like to perch on flat surfaces, and they need a nest. anything else Im missing for a temporary setup?
> Thanks!


find out what they are feeding them and try to use the same.. you can get pigeon grain at a feedstore usually.. purina has one and they do have pellets as well..if they have been fed pellets before then I would stay with that.. unless you would like to change them over to grains..which makes the droppings more firm unlike the pellet feed, their droppings tend to be a bit more soft. and of course grit and crushed oystershell esp for the hens.


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## AutumnRiver

Drdolittle said:


> I have somewhere for all the pigeons to go. All 16.
> There are 6 that are not spoken for as pets. Those are being adopted by a wildlife rehaber who has a heated indoor aviary for them to live the rest of their lives in. I am going to drive them down to Il next weekend.
> Thanks Jen for adopting pigeons!


Hey, It was really awesome watching the birds walk into their new home from the carrier. After seeing the sterile metal homes they came from, I felt really glad for them. They were checking out their new place, rooting around in the wood shavings and enjoying the sun.


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## almondman

I love it when everything works out for a happy ending! 😃😜


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## Jay3

AutumnRiver said:


> Hey, It was really awesome watching the birds walk into their new home from the carrier. After seeing the sterile metal homes they came from, I felt really glad for them. They were checking out their new place, rooting around in the wood shavings and enjoying the sun.



I'll bet they loved it. I love watching them when they first realize that they have come to a better place. I have rescues, and some have come from not very good conditions. Some, from horrible conditions. I love watching them also, when they are first let into the loft. They pick a perch and just watch the others for a while, then they start checking out all the nooks and crannies. I think it makes me feel even better then it does them. I'm glad you took them.
You can post pics at any time if you feel like it. We love seeing others birds. Enjoy them!


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## raptor8594

The worst you can do is make them feel traped. Dont hold them in a way that they cant move. I train my pigeons to fly like they do in falconry. In my opinion the best way is to get some anklets and jesses and a leash and hold them on your hand until they get used to it.


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## John_D

raptor8594 said:


> The worst you can do is make them feel traped. Dont hold them in a way that they cant move. I train my pigeons to fly like they do in falconry. In my opinion the best way is to get some anklets and jesses and a leash and hold them on your hand until they get used to it.


You don't need to train pigeons to fly - they do it naturally 

Why do you keep pigeons?


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## Lefty07

Dr. Dolittle,

Any chance of posting a few photos of these pigeons?


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## almondman

Lefty07 said:


> Dr. Dolittle,
> 
> Any chance of posting a few photos of these pigeons?


FYI- She posted earlier that all have found new homes. I'm not sure how often she is on, so it might be awhile before she answers you?


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## November-X-Scourge

Well! this was a nice ending! I too would like to see pics, but she might never be on again, as many people do  anyway, happy they found homes!!!!!


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## SmplySooz

I think as far as release goes, you should not just release a bird right from your front door. A bird needs a flock if he's going to survive. So release should be around a group of the same type bird. Hopefully, they'll let the "stranger" join the group. Otherwise, the bird will not survive. So glad to h hear you found homes for the lab birds.


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## spirit wings

just to mention this thread is from Feb 2012.


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