# drinking to much water not eating



## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

Dear Sir,
I Have A Very Young Pigeon Just About 7 Days Left The Nest ,at The Start It Was Eating With Other Young Pigeons The Same Age On The Ground Together--i Notice That His Chest Was Looking Full This Morning And I Decided To Check It And Found It Was Only Water ,i Gave It A Sulphur Tablet This Morning And This Afternoon I Notice That It Was Doing The Same Drinking Water,i Place Fresh Feed But It Would Not Go Near It.
Please Advise Me What I Should Give It Or Should Do As I Do Not Want To Lose It.
Await,
Albert.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

This can be a sign of Cocci, but being a toung bird it may not be eating the best for other reasons

Does it have a constant supply of food close to it?

Are its poops highlighter or bright green?


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## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

*Drinking Lots Of Water And Not Eating*

Dear Sir,
Thanks for your reply,the pigeons has feed given twice a day,the feed is clean and many small seeds in between ,the feed is from Brown.
I did nOT look at the droppings I will check this tonight as it rest in on place.
If you have any other suggestions at this time will be help full.
Thanks,
Albert.


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## sdymacz (Aug 30, 2010)

*Sour Crop*

From what You are describing its a Trush also called Sour Crop, often found in young birds might include listlessness, loss of appetite, weight loss, a water-filled crop, and frequent vomiting. The vomit often has a very putrid odor.

Trush (Sour Crop) is a not a disease but a symptom of a adenovirus infection process which causes a severe inflammation/infection of the gastro-intestinal system.


To prevent Sour Crop star improving the environment by separating sick birds if You can, avoiding overcrowding, change water daily, clean drinker and add apple cider vinegar, garlic infused water once a week it helps keep the immune system in good shape, clean up left over food so it doesn't stay on floor over night, maintain a sanitary loft by having clean and well ventilated not drafty, and above all do not medicate indiscriminately, especially with *antibiotics*.

Treat with
Nystatin 
Medistatin
Aueromycin / Sulmet
Triple sulfa, You can buy this in a fish store petco, petsmart or similar store



Syringe and a crop needle helps to administer medication and drain fluid from crop, proper use of it should be read before use, there is some videos on youtube on proper use of crop needles on birds

Medication and Sanitizers from (*call to make sure its in stock so it doesn't get back ordered*)

http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/catalog/cleaners.html
http://www.siegelpigeons.com/catalog-sourcrop.html
http://www.jedds.com/StoreFront.bok
http://www.pigeonsuppliesplus.com
http://www.globalpigeon.com/index.php
http://www.nepigeonsupplies.com/index.htm
http://www.propigeonsupplies.com/servlet/StoreFront


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

Canker will also make them drink more, and can also block the crop from emptying. Have you looked in his mouth? Are there any cheesy looking growths down in his throat? How does his breath smell?


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Can you seperate it By putting it in a holding pen. And keep feed in front of it around the clock for a few days. Not just how old is this bird. Some birds do not theive at weaning as well. You might even hand feed it a few days. Just about a table sppon of grain 2 time a day. If it is sick you would notice its wait going down. thrush would show in the tonge and throat And canker Will show also. Look and and notice any problems No sighn No meds Needs feed.


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## sdymacz (Aug 30, 2010)

I noticed that You had couple posts asking advise on performance and health, ones that point to that Your birds have problem are rapid weight loss and infertile eggs. Have You worked on remedying these issues and what is the progress


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## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

Dear Repliers,I have made note of the recommendations and suggestions ,unfortunately the pigeon I found dead in the loft this morning-I did not think it will die so quick as it was not that weak,I am thinking what might have cause the premature death was i gave it by syringe a dose of canker medication not very much thinking because it is a bitter medication it will prevent the bird from drinking to much and if it was canker it will help,but i did another thing ,I place in the water for all the birds worm treatment that same day as i treated all my birds the same time with worm medication.Maybe I am a good fool as I did what I thought was best.
Any suggestions.
Albert


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

One thing is make sure you don't make "cocktails" of medication in future. 

It also sounds like there are some issues with the flock so identifying the problem could be a good start, Whats your cleaning regime and have you had any suggestions to what could be going on?

Hopefully the worm treatment will pick the birds up and you may find thats all it is.


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## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

Hi,I like cocktails,but your advise make sound advise.I had suggestions that it could be sour crop,other cocci,and so on.
I wish I knew,I just want advise what I should prepare my youngsters with to prevent this from happening again.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

for one sour crop. Is just that SOUR crop. Baking soda helps it. And A person can drain the crop. If they know what they are doing. Turn the bird upside down Backwards to you Sqeez the crop Draining out the fluid This way the bird does not choke. BUT you can smell sour crop. This just happens every so often I think in my over 50 years of pigeon keeping I had a bird with sour crop only 2 times. It does sound like the bird did have a problem not that it is dead. But it may have had a reaction to the meds. No one will ever know. ! you want to clean your waters with BLEACH to kill any germs Rinse them out. Even treat with SULMET as it works on ecoli. cocsidi, and paratiphoid. And is easyly found 1 tablesppon per gallon of water. for 5 days. Then Go to acv 2 to 4 time per week. Keep feed clean. Meaning just give a feeding no left over feed And clean any scattered feed up So it can not be ate. As this causes sickness. Allways when you wean young birds Show them the water. by dipping there beak. Watch them eat so you know they are eating check them daily To see they are eating. Check there throat There feel wieght. Eyes for alertness. As young birds not eating well will begain to get a droppy Weak looking eye. And go off weight. Eyes say plenty on birds health Jusy like people There eyes says they look SICK. Now some people on young birds If they fail to thrive at first remove them fats. but some young birds doe not wean out as easy as most. They need that extra boost. I allways weaned at 30 days. But on fantails I would sometimes wean at 35 days Just had to know they were ready. close to weaning time say 5 days put a feed cup[ in the breeding compartment So the young birds could be seen trying to eat. And the parent birds will eat also but young learn from that. Just a few ideas.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

re lee;648405[B said:


> ]for one sour crop. Is just that SOUR crop.[/B] Baking soda helps it. And A person can drain the crop. If they know what they are doing. Turn the bird upside down Backwards to you Sqeez the crop Draining out the fluid This way the bird does not choke. BUT you can smell sour crop. This just happens every so often I think in my over 50 years of pigeon keeping I had a bird with sour crop only 2 times. It does sound like the bird did have a problem not that it is dead. But it may have had a reaction to the meds. No one will ever know. ! you want to clean your waters with BLEACH to kill any germs Rinse them out. Even treat with SULMET as it works on ecoli. cocsidi, and paratiphoid. And is easyly found 1 tablesppon per gallon of water. for 5 days. Then Go to acv 2 to 4 time per week. Keep feed clean. Meaning just give a feeding no left over feed And clean any scattered feed up So it can not be ate. As this causes sickness. Allways when you wean young birds Show them the water. by dipping there beak. Watch them eat so you know they are eating check them daily To see they are eating. Check there throat There feel wieght. Eyes for alertness. As young birds not eating well will begain to get a droppy Weak looking eye. And go off weight. Eyes say plenty on birds health Jusy like people There eyes says they look SICK. Now some people on young birds If they fail to thrive at first remove them fats. but some young birds doe not wean out as easy as most. They need that extra boost. I allways weaned at 30 days. But on fantails I would sometimes wean at 35 days Just had to know they were ready. close to weaning time say 5 days put a feed cup[ in the breeding compartment So the young birds could be seen trying to eat. And the parent birds will eat also but young learn from that. Just a few ideas.





Sour crop is not just sour crop. It can be caused by different things, one of them being canker. 
You must treat whatever it is that is causing it. 
In pigeons with sour crop, at least 90% have an internal canker nodule located at the base of the crop or within the glandular stomach (proventriculus). As the nodule increases in size, it squashes the windpipe making breathing difficult and blocking the crop outlet. This interferes with crop emptying, leading to bacterial infection of the crop and secondary starvation and dehydration due to the crop contents not being able to pass into the bird's system. 
http://www.auspigeonco.com.au/products/veterinary_medicines2.html


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## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

Hi Re Lee,Jay 3,
MANY THANKS FOR YOUR HELP AND TIME TO ADVISE ME ,I WILL BE LOOKING AND APPLYING WHAT YOU BOTH MENTION.I DO HOPE THAT YOUR BIRDS ARE DOING WELL AS WELL AS EXPECTED I GUESS,AGAIN MANY THANKS.
ALBERT.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Jay3 said:


> Sour crop is not just sour crop. It can be caused by different things, one of them being canker.
> You must treat whatever it is that is causing it.
> In pigeons with sour crop, at least 90% have an internal canker nodule located at the base of the crop or within the glandular stomach (proventriculus). As the nodule increases in size, it squashes the windpipe making breathing difficult and blocking the crop outlet. This interferes with crop emptying, leading to bacterial infection of the crop and secondary starvation and dehydration due to the crop contents not being able to pass into the bird's system.
> http://www.auspigeonco.com.au/products/veterinary_medicines2.html


That is ONLY if the canker led to the sour crop. But if it is just sour crop as it has been around since before You and I was even born That Is JUST SOUR CROP. You are talking about something that led to sour crop as a secondary probelm. And in late stage canker One In young birds Wil have lost the bird. Baking soda was used before I was born and through the years it was noted in many treatments for sour crop. It sweetens the crop. Un digested grain Does what in the crop GOES SOUR. Everything is not As you read It has to be looked at Smoking is said to cause cancer. But everybody who smokes does not have canker. So yes There is just sour crop as the problem some times. And canker is canker.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

re lee said:


> That is ONLY if the canker led to the sour crop. But if it is just sour crop as it has been around since before You and I was even born That Is JUST SOUR CROP. You are talking about something that led to sour crop as a secondary probelm. And in late stage canker One In young birds Wil have lost the bird. Baking soda was used before I was born and through the years it was noted in many treatments for sour crop. It sweetens the crop. Un digested grain Does what in the crop GOES SOUR. Everything is not As you read It has to be looked at Smoking is said to cause cancer. But everybody who smokes does not have canker. So yes There is just sour crop as the problem some times. And canker is canker.


It's just you had said sour crop is just sour crop. And I was just pointing out that it is not always the case. Sour crop can be caused by other things. Without dealing with those other things that may be causing it, then we aren't really doing much for the bird. Finding the cause of it is necessary, and treating for that.


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## re lee (Jan 4, 2003)

Jay3 said:


> It's just you had said sour crop is just sour crop. And I was just pointing out that it is not always the case. Sour crop can be caused by other things. Without dealing with those other things that may be causing it, then we aren't really doing much for the bird. Finding the cause of it is necessary, and treating for that.


That can be true. And I to would look At the bird. Now you read this info from The web and That can happen I read your link. . But like I said to I had birds for ever And only had sour crop 2 times And it was not linked to canker. And canker most often is easy to detect. PLUS now days treating for it before breeding season Helps all but do away with it during breeding And ACV seems to reduce canker risks. . But yes Both concepts deserve looking further. But that to comes with time as people must learn. Just like egg binding You see very little to none If you give your hens extra calcium before you start breeding them. Its like a booster. Plain grit sometimes just is not enough. But we learn as time goes on.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

re lee said:


> That can be true. And I to would look At the bird. Now you read this info from The web and That can happen I read your link. . But like I said to I had birds for ever And only had sour crop 2 times And it was not linked to canker. *And canker most often is easy to detect.* PLUS now days treating for it before breeding season Helps all but do away with it during breeding *And ACV seems to reduce canker risks.* . But yes Both concepts deserve looking further. But that to comes with time as people must learn. Just like egg binding You see very little to none If you give your hens extra calcium before you start breeding them. Its like a booster. Plain grit sometimes just is not enough. But we learn as time goes on.




Canker is not always easy to detect as you can not always see it. Also ACV doesn't help to prevent it. Other things can cause sour crop also. I'm not going to go back and forth with you. I simply added that other things can be the cause of it, and it is important to make sure that if it is, that the bird is treated for it also. There really is no argument there, so let's not keep this going.


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## NZ Pigeon (Nov 12, 2011)

Sour crop is a pretty general term really, I agree with R_lee that most often it is not related to anything else apart from it just has a " sour crop " In some cases I guess it could be a side effect of canker but I have never seen any relationship myself


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## ALBERT HERRERA (May 19, 2011)

Dear Sir,
Thanks for your reply,I have learnt from the very good suggestions given to me and one day I will pass what I have learnt together with what you all have said to someone else with similar problems,keep up this wonderful help to all.
Albert.


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## Jay3 (May 4, 2008)

NZ Pigeon said:


> Sour crop is a pretty general term really, I agree with R_lee that most often it is not related to anything else apart from it just has a " sour crop " In some cases I guess it could be a side effect of canker but I have never seen any relationship myself


I have seen it as caused from canker in the crop causing a blockage. Or from other things causing blockage. So by not looking for or treating for these things, you aren't going to get rid of the problem.


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